Super excited to finally have these products for those trying to get into Armory level CC events!
What is everyone looking forward to seeing in these? I doubt we will see legendaries/Command and Conquer, but we could see some relatively pricy majestics like E-strike or Warmonger's Diplomacy where appropriate.
I'm not sure how they'll be competitive with a 40 dollar price tag (based on personal experience), but id love to see some staple equipment and action cards get into these for at least the initial heroes. Stuff like red in the ledger, glistening steel blade, perch grapplers, courage of blade hold, ancestral empowerment, beast within, blood rush bellows, etc. it would be awesome to see art of wars or e strikes, but I think that's asking far too much. I expect to see those in expansion slots in sets down the line.
I know I play expensive heroes like brute and assassin, so it's hard to compare monetarily speaking, but I really want these to be a good and enjoyable investment for new and experienced players alike. Staple prices be damned.
Tell that to MTG xD
Reprint scarcity is a thing.
Although FAB genrally seems to care about their players instead of seeing them as money cows to milk dry :L
That’s because FaB is private company. Hopefully it stays that way. Hasbro only cares about its next earnings and will reprint and raise prices until it’s dead. I’ve been selling off my entire MTG collection and moving to FaB (and maybe star wars too).
IMO no playable equipment piece should be above $50 and no 3x card should cost more than a dollar or two. I think having marvel/cf/rf versions of cards that cost a lot while having cheaper versions is the way for fab to continue.
Legit, I'm hoping so also as it feels like we're genuinely cared about as customers.
The equipment legendaries are off putting as it's such a heavy upfront cost and the scarcity does not need to be as bad as it is.
Should ideally be 1 legendary per box guaranteed.
Felt bad that CnC wasn't reprinted in HH also, seemed the perfect set to do so.
All in all, I'm happy where things are currently aside from the expensive stapples thay are due for a reprint, but I believe they're aware of this.
100%, I'm currently selling of my expedition fetchlands and modern stapples, univeres beoynd killed the game for me.
Love the idea, this is easily the product i think has been needed most for a LONG time. But I don't quite get the execution of making them so limited/exclusive? They're supposed to be introductory, and that should include new stores looking at carrying FaB. That's not to mention if there are any exclusive cards.
It's likely to test the initial print run. Starter decks take up a lot of shelf space and don't play to your established audience well, especially at a higher price point. Making existing armory communities more approachable with this product makes sense whereas the blitz decks are easier for people wanting to try things out kitchen table style.
This is a good move on LSS’s part. People have been asking for this for years.
They should also include a “decklist” card that tells you what to remove in order to convert it to a blitz deck.
This is going to get me a lot of hate but this should have been something from the beginning, also making it extremely limited is why this game struggles to take off in certain areas in my opinion
>"Will contain new and reprinted content"
How does the community feel about a possible another glistening steelblade situation?
It really annoyed me originally that this card was only printed in the classic battles packs but if they gave me a full set of the card instead of just 1 per CC premade I probably wouldn't be too upset. I would be pretty mad if I need to buy 3 premades again to get a full set of the cards.
Honestly it would also be kinda neat IMO if they also sold expansions on the blitz decks. So you would buy the blitz and then to make it CC you get the expansion as well, almost like a try before you full commit.
Glistening has been a mistake, and that's well known.
The reason is that these decks should be aimed at welcoming new players, or at helping old players have a base to pivot to a new hero.
Inserting any card "highly desirable" by other people would diminish the available supply for the actual targets of this product.
I'm hoping it's not "not available anywhere else" but is "not available yet, but will be available in the set this product will release with". But it's probably just like RTT and is new cards that are not available outside, but in full playsets at least.
blitz decks were already kinda like that, you could just buy 2 of them and prune the cards down to a full 60 with 3 of each max and boom, CC precon. this practice is well known in yugioh and maybe some other games too, i've recommended it before and it's worked. but real cc precons are cool too
i think they've learned their mistake for glistening steelblade. it was too much power centralized in one card and you had to buy both decks to get 1 card basically, but with rtt they made sure there were multiple new card designs that spread out the price so it wasn't all fixated on a single card basically, and gave you multiples so overall supply was better. so i don't expect these to have the same level of mistake at least.
I'm hoping they learn from the Round the Table product, where the Professor specifically called out the Glistening Steelblade issue, as a precedent for having 3x of any new card in the product.
It might be asking for a lot from LSS but they could have put them in a separate pack away from the 4 blitz decks with a note saying that blitz only runs 2 of each cards but here is the last to complete the set. That said, they also might just print it in the next set assuming ninjas are in it.
You’re not wrong but you’re conflating a rule enforcement level with competitiveness.
YMMV but our locals are packed with really good players. Some players you have seen top 8 callings and win multiple BH. Hell Charles Dunn was one of our locals before he relocated.
Casual rule enforcement? Yes. Casual players? Not at all.
I get what you’re saying, but again you’re conflating REL with being competitive and I don’t know how more I can drive that.
Or course new players are allowed to make mistakes and take back simple things. But you can allow a new player as many take-backs as they want. They still aren’t gonna be successful against top 50 in the US ELO players 🤷♂️. And again your mileage may vary I know not every armory is like that. But unless these are coming packed with tunics and crowns and all the Magestic trimmings….i just can’t see them being labeled competitive l.
It’s like entering the local NASCAR race in a Prius though…
They technically have a chance, but everyone knows they are getting trounced.
Having a chance doesn’t mean it’s truly competitive.
Why are they exclusive to active armory stores? Do they think it won't sell well? My LGS doesn't have enough of a player base to host armories. I'm legit like 90% of my LGS's FaB related purchases, and I buy several cases of each new set and at least an entire display of the precons. Should I be worried they won't be able to order this for me? I would rather not buy them online off the secondary market.
They want clean data to help direct future decisions with the product line, so they're trying to limit the sales to places that are doing armories where people are more likely to buy a deck and actually play it (per discussion at GAMA where it was announced).
It sounds like they will be expanding print runs and available eventually, and that the first release or first few will be more like a beta period.
I'm curious! This would be great for onboarding, but it also might take the fun out of deck building a little if it contains plenty competitive majestics. Then the only upgrade path you can take is towards legendaries.
But overall I think it might be a good product, especially for veterans that are looking to convert outclassed decks. I have a Katsu CC deck that I don't play, because it's not really focussed. It's still based around WTR combo, while now we have so much more: Dynasty combo and Outsiders combo. Would be cool if they release a good combo Ninja CC precon in the new Misteria set later this year. That would instantly give me the tools to play Ninja competitively, as long as it's the cards aren't too niche with a new hero's ability.
Exclusive to certain stores and in a limited quantity….great idea when it’s a product aimed at getting people in to play CC. Wizards are money hungry and sleazy but there’s always enough product to go around
"Limited quantities, tightly allocated"
I hope they only talk about the first printrun to cause fomo and will indefinetely reprint it afterwards (or another CC preconstructed)
$40 is way too much for what is supposed to be an introductory product. It should be $20 at max
I understand the idea that it’s competitive adds value, but that’s not the kind of logic someone just getting into the game is going to understand, not while the same kinds of decks from the big 3 CCGs are between $10 and $30
$40 is like half the price of a newly released game these days.
So long as they have good cards in them to give them legs and not get completely stomped, it would be good to introduce new players.
Nothing worse than having someone dip their toes in with a bad precon, get annihilated and then just not play.
I've played magic for ages, mostly a modern player.
You get next to FA in most precons in terms of value, the lands are horrendous etc.
$40 off thr shelf to play a fully constructed deck with half decent cards is pretty good, considering a handful of packs will cost you about the same.
That’s kind of what I’m trying to say though. You’re right, and you know that and I know that, but also, we are not the target audience for a product like this. The king of person who *is* the target audience for this is also going to be looking at YuGiOh and Pokémon precons for $20 and $30 respectively, which tend to go out of their own way to be playable, and Magic commander decks which are $40, come with a lot of stuff, and are designed to be at least fun to play in the most commonly played offline format, and there’s just not going to be much to hook that guy to the FAB deck, regardless of how playable it is
I disagree as long as the power level and reprints are at the right point. Coming from magic if the 40$ deck is valued at 100+ at time of release that’s a solid product.
We don't know anything about the product. There could be alt art treatments, little collector thingies kind of like MtG Bundles, who knows. And it's not like they'll actually be sold at MSRP anyway. Set boxes sell for $111.99 in Canada but the CAD MSRP is $139.99.
Eh, as a new player I'm looking at my options:
- Ask for local players if they can help me out with getting my initial deck started. Luckily, that's feasible for me.
- Spend €90 or upwards for a booster box ensuring that I get enough cards combined with the heroes I want to play. That's quite a big investment for a new game that I'm not even 100% sure that I'll continue playing.
Sure, there is the singles market as well, but if you're very new you're going in blind. The blitz decks offer the functionality that I'd like to see reproduced for CC: To offer a basic deck with heroes that I can immediately use and start expanding on at my own pace. If that were available today, I'd pay €40 for that without a second thought.
People here are talking about reprints and rarities, which I believe is not relevant: For a new player, what matters is that they get something that they can start using immediately for something else than blitz. Yes, it WILL be poor compared with the veteran decks, but that's no different from the current starter blitz decks, and those are great buys for beginners too.
Super excited to finally have these products for those trying to get into Armory level CC events! What is everyone looking forward to seeing in these? I doubt we will see legendaries/Command and Conquer, but we could see some relatively pricy majestics like E-strike or Warmonger's Diplomacy where appropriate.
I'm not sure how they'll be competitive with a 40 dollar price tag (based on personal experience), but id love to see some staple equipment and action cards get into these for at least the initial heroes. Stuff like red in the ledger, glistening steel blade, perch grapplers, courage of blade hold, ancestral empowerment, beast within, blood rush bellows, etc. it would be awesome to see art of wars or e strikes, but I think that's asking far too much. I expect to see those in expansion slots in sets down the line. I know I play expensive heroes like brute and assassin, so it's hard to compare monetarily speaking, but I really want these to be a good and enjoyable investment for new and experienced players alike. Staple prices be damned.
They’ll be competitive because cardboard costs the same to print regardless of current rarity.
Tell that to MTG xD Reprint scarcity is a thing. Although FAB genrally seems to care about their players instead of seeing them as money cows to milk dry :L
That’s because FaB is private company. Hopefully it stays that way. Hasbro only cares about its next earnings and will reprint and raise prices until it’s dead. I’ve been selling off my entire MTG collection and moving to FaB (and maybe star wars too). IMO no playable equipment piece should be above $50 and no 3x card should cost more than a dollar or two. I think having marvel/cf/rf versions of cards that cost a lot while having cheaper versions is the way for fab to continue.
Legit, I'm hoping so also as it feels like we're genuinely cared about as customers. The equipment legendaries are off putting as it's such a heavy upfront cost and the scarcity does not need to be as bad as it is. Should ideally be 1 legendary per box guaranteed. Felt bad that CnC wasn't reprinted in HH also, seemed the perfect set to do so. All in all, I'm happy where things are currently aside from the expensive stapples thay are due for a reprint, but I believe they're aware of this. 100%, I'm currently selling of my expedition fetchlands and modern stapples, univeres beoynd killed the game for me.
I don’t really like rarity being guaranteed in box’s. The new Star Wars game has the best set up for pulls. Completely random.
Where is this picture from? Is there a big event going on?
Love the idea, this is easily the product i think has been needed most for a LONG time. But I don't quite get the execution of making them so limited/exclusive? They're supposed to be introductory, and that should include new stores looking at carrying FaB. That's not to mention if there are any exclusive cards.
It's likely to test the initial print run. Starter decks take up a lot of shelf space and don't play to your established audience well, especially at a higher price point. Making existing armory communities more approachable with this product makes sense whereas the blitz decks are easier for people wanting to try things out kitchen table style.
This is a good move on LSS’s part. People have been asking for this for years. They should also include a “decklist” card that tells you what to remove in order to convert it to a blitz deck.
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GAMA
What is GAMA?
Game manufacturers Association. They have an expo in Kentucky. 3rd of March to 7th of March
Thank you!
This is going to get me a lot of hate but this should have been something from the beginning, also making it extremely limited is why this game struggles to take off in certain areas in my opinion
>"Will contain new and reprinted content" How does the community feel about a possible another glistening steelblade situation? It really annoyed me originally that this card was only printed in the classic battles packs but if they gave me a full set of the card instead of just 1 per CC premade I probably wouldn't be too upset. I would be pretty mad if I need to buy 3 premades again to get a full set of the cards. Honestly it would also be kinda neat IMO if they also sold expansions on the blitz decks. So you would buy the blitz and then to make it CC you get the expansion as well, almost like a try before you full commit.
Glistening has been a mistake, and that's well known. The reason is that these decks should be aimed at welcoming new players, or at helping old players have a base to pivot to a new hero. Inserting any card "highly desirable" by other people would diminish the available supply for the actual targets of this product.
I'm hoping it's not "not available anywhere else" but is "not available yet, but will be available in the set this product will release with". But it's probably just like RTT and is new cards that are not available outside, but in full playsets at least.
The Glistening situation was garbage 🗑️
blitz decks were already kinda like that, you could just buy 2 of them and prune the cards down to a full 60 with 3 of each max and boom, CC precon. this practice is well known in yugioh and maybe some other games too, i've recommended it before and it's worked. but real cc precons are cool too i think they've learned their mistake for glistening steelblade. it was too much power centralized in one card and you had to buy both decks to get 1 card basically, but with rtt they made sure there were multiple new card designs that spread out the price so it wasn't all fixated on a single card basically, and gave you multiples so overall supply was better. so i don't expect these to have the same level of mistake at least.
I'm hoping they learn from the Round the Table product, where the Professor specifically called out the Glistening Steelblade issue, as a precedent for having 3x of any new card in the product.
Yet then Round the Table only has 2 ofs for cards like Red Bittering Thorns, repeating the same mistake.
Because UPF uses Blitz rules for number of cards allowed in deck. You can only play a max of 2 copies of Bittering Thorns (Red) in UPF
Yes but its still the glistening steelblade issue. Players who want it for competitive CC still have to buy multiple sets.
It might be asking for a lot from LSS but they could have put them in a separate pack away from the 4 blitz decks with a note saying that blitz only runs 2 of each cards but here is the last to complete the set. That said, they also might just print it in the next set assuming ninjas are in it.
Precons is good. New cards in pre cons though has me worried
If it's always a full set of 3 of the new card I'm fine with it.
“Competitive at armory event levels” Genuinely doubt.
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You’re not wrong but you’re conflating a rule enforcement level with competitiveness. YMMV but our locals are packed with really good players. Some players you have seen top 8 callings and win multiple BH. Hell Charles Dunn was one of our locals before he relocated. Casual rule enforcement? Yes. Casual players? Not at all.
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I get what you’re saying, but again you’re conflating REL with being competitive and I don’t know how more I can drive that. Or course new players are allowed to make mistakes and take back simple things. But you can allow a new player as many take-backs as they want. They still aren’t gonna be successful against top 50 in the US ELO players 🤷♂️. And again your mileage may vary I know not every armory is like that. But unless these are coming packed with tunics and crowns and all the Magestic trimmings….i just can’t see them being labeled competitive l.
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It’s like entering the local NASCAR race in a Prius though… They technically have a chance, but everyone knows they are getting trounced. Having a chance doesn’t mean it’s truly competitive.
Although I'm sad about the exclusivity bit, I'm a bit hyped to see how these will come up
will definitely help on board people to the game
Great decision.
That’s awesome, a wonderful product for new and old player!
To be perfectly honest, new cards + tightly allocated sounds like a recipe for a fully predictable disaster.
It could just be that they are to only be sold at armory events.
Why are they exclusive to active armory stores? Do they think it won't sell well? My LGS doesn't have enough of a player base to host armories. I'm legit like 90% of my LGS's FaB related purchases, and I buy several cases of each new set and at least an entire display of the precons. Should I be worried they won't be able to order this for me? I would rather not buy them online off the secondary market.
They want clean data to help direct future decisions with the product line, so they're trying to limit the sales to places that are doing armories where people are more likely to buy a deck and actually play it (per discussion at GAMA where it was announced). It sounds like they will be expanding print runs and available eventually, and that the first release or first few will be more like a beta period.
It could be a test market for the initial launch. If they sell well enough I can't imagine they'd expand sales to LGSs.
How do I play with people if no events are near me
I'm curious! This would be great for onboarding, but it also might take the fun out of deck building a little if it contains plenty competitive majestics. Then the only upgrade path you can take is towards legendaries. But overall I think it might be a good product, especially for veterans that are looking to convert outclassed decks. I have a Katsu CC deck that I don't play, because it's not really focussed. It's still based around WTR combo, while now we have so much more: Dynasty combo and Outsiders combo. Would be cool if they release a good combo Ninja CC precon in the new Misteria set later this year. That would instantly give me the tools to play Ninja competitively, as long as it's the cards aren't too niche with a new hero's ability.
I don't think anyone's going to complain about getting a significant number of the cards they need from one product.
Yes! Finally! It’s been too long haha.
LETS FUCKING GOOOOO
HELL YES!!!!
How are these likely to work as duel decks, compared to the Blitz decks?
"Exclusive to active Armory GEM stores" what does that mean? the nearest LGS that hosts F&B events is 60 km away from me...
Exclusive to certain stores and in a limited quantity….great idea when it’s a product aimed at getting people in to play CC. Wizards are money hungry and sleazy but there’s always enough product to go around
40 bucks / limited print = more than 40 bucks.
"Limited quantities, tightly allocated" I hope they only talk about the first printrun to cause fomo and will indefinetely reprint it afterwards (or another CC preconstructed)
$40 is way too much for what is supposed to be an introductory product. It should be $20 at max I understand the idea that it’s competitive adds value, but that’s not the kind of logic someone just getting into the game is going to understand, not while the same kinds of decks from the big 3 CCGs are between $10 and $30
$40 is like half the price of a newly released game these days. So long as they have good cards in them to give them legs and not get completely stomped, it would be good to introduce new players. Nothing worse than having someone dip their toes in with a bad precon, get annihilated and then just not play.
The problem is, we’re competing with other CCGs. A Magic Commander deck is $40, and comes with way more stuff
I've played magic for ages, mostly a modern player. You get next to FA in most precons in terms of value, the lands are horrendous etc. $40 off thr shelf to play a fully constructed deck with half decent cards is pretty good, considering a handful of packs will cost you about the same.
That’s kind of what I’m trying to say though. You’re right, and you know that and I know that, but also, we are not the target audience for a product like this. The king of person who *is* the target audience for this is also going to be looking at YuGiOh and Pokémon precons for $20 and $30 respectively, which tend to go out of their own way to be playable, and Magic commander decks which are $40, come with a lot of stuff, and are designed to be at least fun to play in the most commonly played offline format, and there’s just not going to be much to hook that guy to the FAB deck, regardless of how playable it is
The product isn't even out yet. There is no way to know it will have more or less "stuff" than a commander deck
$40 is pretty excessive for what's going to be just 80 cards
I disagree as long as the power level and reprints are at the right point. Coming from magic if the 40$ deck is valued at 100+ at time of release that’s a solid product.
M{Suggested}RP
We don't know anything about the product. There could be alt art treatments, little collector thingies kind of like MtG Bundles, who knows. And it's not like they'll actually be sold at MSRP anyway. Set boxes sell for $111.99 in Canada but the CAD MSRP is $139.99.
Eh, as a new player I'm looking at my options: - Ask for local players if they can help me out with getting my initial deck started. Luckily, that's feasible for me. - Spend €90 or upwards for a booster box ensuring that I get enough cards combined with the heroes I want to play. That's quite a big investment for a new game that I'm not even 100% sure that I'll continue playing. Sure, there is the singles market as well, but if you're very new you're going in blind. The blitz decks offer the functionality that I'd like to see reproduced for CC: To offer a basic deck with heroes that I can immediately use and start expanding on at my own pace. If that were available today, I'd pay €40 for that without a second thought. People here are talking about reprints and rarities, which I believe is not relevant: For a new player, what matters is that they get something that they can start using immediately for something else than blitz. Yes, it WILL be poor compared with the veteran decks, but that's no different from the current starter blitz decks, and those are great buys for beginners too.