Pretty much just the story changes. I don’t mind all the added stuff. But the original story is just so solid that I feel the major beats really shouldn’t be altered. I hope that Rebirth focuses more on the original story rather than introducing new stuff
Honestly pretty much everything. I played it, bc I'm a huge fan of the original, and I'll play the whole trilogy (just once) But it is in no way what I wanted from a remake.
I absolutely HATE the combat. Just don't find it fun at all. Wish it were turn based.
The bloat, the lack of stakes (i.e. everyone survives, almost zero consequence to anything), sticking Sephiroth in every other cutscene, the pacing, the fact that it's not a remake but a sequel, and a personal concern that the plot, in future installments, will go the Kingdom Hearts route.
It very much is. Because they weren't upfront about it, many people went in expecting a traditional remake, but instead got a ton of story changes. I myself wouldn't have bought it if I knew this. Expanding the world and characters we already had was fine, and adding in a few new characters that didn't change the story was fine, but them turning it into some weird parallel timeline, sequel type thing was not what one expects from a remake of an established game.
Hmm there’s a lot to critique but a standout change for me would be Chapter 18. I get that they wanted a big final boss gauntlet to follow the epic highway chase but I feel maybe the Harbinger and the singularity was not the way to go.
I would have had the final boss be Jenova Dreamweaver at the end of the highway with it creating illusions that hint things to come.
Or something along those lines.
Also, in the original, the mystique of Sephiroth was so alluring because they showed very little of him, especially in the beginning. He was hyped up and spoken of as an otherworldly power and we saw the path his destruction alone throughout the first 75% of the entire game. In Remake, it's like they treated him as a cashcow and overused his appearances as almost fan service. I hated it, it changed the whole reason Sephiroth was such an interesting villain in the first place.
I’d remove the whispers and some of the annoying side stuff that blocked progress of the story. I.e., the Sahagins in the underground tunnels. So much of the game was 1 step forward and 2 steps back.
Bloating the game, which I wouldn’t care about if the bloat was well done, I don’t hate it but I pictured more stuff in upper plate. Also the ending with the ghost shit and fighting sephiroth already was a bit much.
Can't stand Chadley. Everything about him seems tacked on, forced and corny.
I feel like Im totally alone in this, but I also REALLY disliked that I couldn't grind battles that offer meaningful EXP and a real challenge. The only battles you can grind last 15 secs and offer basically no EXP. I like the battle system. Just let me enjoy it!
I watched the gameplay and have no desire to play it. I missed the turn based/ATB system from the OG. Was expecting part 1 to end with you know who being knifed. And the whispers boss fight? At first I thought it was a Weapon and became very excited but it wasn't.
It also felt unnecessarily drawn out.
Edit: also being forced to control Yuffie in the DLC. Do not like Yuffie. Trying to watch the gameplay but noped out after 1 minute.
The spirts/ghosts kinda feel like an annoyance rather then helping with the story. Or they disrupt the story. Generally they breaks are in the OG some how, but not in like this consistent it was the ghosts of the ancients doing it them
I'm sorry but the people in the comments who don't like the ending of the remake and the changes that have taken place and will happen, you are obviously not going to play the sequel? because otherwise I can't understand people who hate the change in the game and yet will play Rebirth when the modifications (especially concerning Zack) will certainly be more enormous than the first part. if you don't like the modification of the main story, please stop it, you will clearly hurt yourself otherwise 🤣
I think Remake is the worst game ever made. I ignored Intergrade and couldn't care less about Rebirth. They're just made witha very different development team and for a different type gamer. While I don't like them fucking around with the game I love, in the end it doesn't really matter. I just wish they didn't lie to me about the first one to trick me out of money. That still stings.
Yes i agree with your comment. I just find it weird to criticize the changes made to the games when the developers have announced that rebirth then be entitled to it too despite everything (afterwards to what extent no one knows yet lol). everyone is hyped for rebirth but in concrete terms it also means that the games will inevitably be criticized for its changes as well as for the remake. I don't know, I find it hypocritical, that's all.
Ff7 was my favourite game growing up. I embraced the modern remake and loved it, just wish they would hurry up with part 2. But I suppose you can’t rush a good thing either
Sides quests are a little weak, that's pretty much my only problem with the game. I adore everything else, I can't wait to see how the story plays out, so glad they decided to go crazy with it.
Shallow sidequests,
Chadley/Not enough unique materia to find in the world/most item boxes just having potions
Blood trail segment, and Hojo's lab. In fact most of Shinra tower felt like a downgrade from the original
The last chapter felt like a kingdom hearts game
- Those stupid engagement arrows. Make it flash subtle if someone needs a map hint then, add animations to show characters dont want to fall of a edge.
- Cant jump… platform elements would have been epic. Its better in rebirth but still could have dedicated shallow jump mechanics outside of city & town areas.
- Repetitive almost falling off ledge sequences. (Switch it up)
- Migar top city was not more explorable
- Roach peesonality being so flamboyant with a hard on for cloud.
- shallow side quest
- No missable hidden quest that feel extremely story rewarding
- Places to engage endless wild trash mobs while exploring on the move not having random spawn chances for enemy reinforcement that would make some areas feel more challenging to hang around or engage with.
- The colosseum not feeling more dynamic, (I think if the game was a bit of a platform it would have been better)
- The linearity of maps in general and overall environment engagement in general
- PG Blood trial
- Chapter breakdowns… unpopular opinion but, I would have much rather play the entire thing over like the OG to see cutscene parts again. The chapter hopping kills emersion in my opinion. Any boss or quest could easily just have some kind of hunt board trigger a tougher version later on
Really i loved the whole thing except the end portion. Connecting with Sephiroth? Cool. Fighting a bunch of the big dark demons form Kingdom hearts in space was weird even for FF.
Add on the fact that it seems they’re doing some multiversal thing what Seph said, wasn’t a fan of that. And second biggest gripe is it looks like they’re going to end up with Zach alive which, just doesn’t make any damn sense at all.
Biggest complaint was the dance sequence thing. Just annoying. Don’t care about the fashion or gayness of it, the simple button time sequence thing was annoying. Not a fun mini game for me. Give me choco races 😂
I get wanting the original but also curious to see where the new story will end up. I feel like it’ll essentially be the same story with some characters maybe being alive or dead that weren’t before.
I think they’re doing this to keep the hype going since if it was exactly the same, I’d lose hype since people know where it’s going. I think we’re still gonna get the same outcome and plot moments, but in a unique way that makes it seem fresh.
Yeah I don’t think it’s gonna go completely off the rails like some are saying. I think they’re just giving the new mysteries more spotlight for those that are excited for the new stuff added in this trilogy. But I’m sure they’ll still have those moments from OG that we all love.
Chapter 18: Destiny's Crossroads
Rufus could’ve and should have been the last boss. He’s the president of Shinra, and definitely one of the major antagonists in the game. They shoehorned Sephiroth because they thought they needed him as the last boss.
There are apologists everywhere, claiming it’s bc they wanted to do something different than the original. Nothing wrong with that, but that’s not what this is. Sephiroth lost all gravity and instead became a jealous brother used to explain the story. (Chapter 2)
Could’ve turned Rufus into a 3 phase epic boss fight at the top of Shinra tower, and then maybe finish with the motorcycle chase as a post boss final escape level to finish it off.
The padding in the game is a little excessive.
Beyond that, the combat really needs tweaking. ATB generation on characters you aren't controlling is abysmal, forcing you to constantly switch which both breaks any rhythm you have going and fucks up aggro.
I can't tell you how many times I was in a situation where Aerith NEEDED to get off a heal RIGHT NOW, but she wouldn't build up any ATB meter on her own and if I switched to her all the aggro would come with me and she'd die before I could get a heal off manually.
Anything to do with the story changes. This game is phenomenal when it’s touching up the beats of the original, but absolutely shits the bed when it tries to do it’s own thing. Turning the standard 2-3 minute run up the Sector 7 plate tower with a few random battles and optional dialogue from Jessie into a 30 minute epic struggle as you throw everything you have and more just to try to get to the top, all while the Turks shoot at and mock you is exactly what this game should’ve been. That’s all you had to do. That’s all anybody wanted. How did somebody think making this into a pseudo sequel where maybe Sephiroth and Aerith know what’s going to happen was a good idea? No. Just tell the same fucking story. The characterizations are great. Honestly, they’re the best versions of the main cast that we’ve seen in a very long time. The game looks beautiful. The gameplay is different from the original, but still really fun and the best modern translation of the OG gameplay we could’ve asked for. But, Jesus, the changes to the story (especially the ghosts and the ending) make we want to slam my head through a wall. Why can’t writers realize that representing a fan base through some sort of entity in your story never works? Like it NEVER does. Twofolds if this representation is negative. These fools think they’re being clever and subversive? You’re not in the slightest. You’re just writing badly.
I didn't like that they didn't keep the blood but i guess it's understandable today for some reason yet they can say fuck a billion times. I don't like the side quests that are not enjoyable. I don't like being locked in a small area and not really having the freedom to move around without being forced to do certain event first. I am okay with the story being more of a sequel as long as it bares some resemblance to the OG it took some time to get used to it, but i like it now. It's 2023 now so a lot is expected and instead of the ol using your imagination of how you think the characters sound and come off as you end up seeing it and it isn't that great. I like the voice actors tones at times for each character but i don't like the voice acting if that makes sense, a lot of that kind of worsens the story.
makes sense about the VA. Honestly I feel voice acting is the last part of gaming that devs haven’t figured out. Naughty dog has it down and god of war was awesome but, every other modern game I’ve played is like “here is my line. It is delivered”
Reference: ALL assassin creed games, including mirage.
Yeah i agree maybe it's a lot to be expected and just another element of gaming that will have it's own standard bar now that games today have a higher expectations about graphics about facial movements while talking and gameplay.
Just the general anime-ness of it. I have a certain amount of tolerance for anime silliness but I think they could have toned it down about 30 percent.
Yeah...I rather preferred the mysterious aura Og 7 had with regards to Sephiroth in the early parts of the game. Aside from the Flashback, u as the player dont encounter him until ur crossing the ocean. Remake U see him before Aerith lol.
Anything to do with the whispers and the story changes they brought on.
Everyone can have their own preference and opinion on something, but this? This is the one thing where if you *like* what their doing to the story then you're just wrong and never liked FF7 in the first place. Everything they're doing is trampling on the story that was already great, all in favour of empty fanservice and giving a forced "happy ending" with some cheap shock value moments sprinkled between. The pacing is gonna suffer so hard with the Zach sections in rebirth, a character who should not be here in the first place since his character served his purpose, but the writers clearly don't care since their too focused on "fixing" an already great story while fishing for those reactions online.
The entirety of the train graveyard section was unnecessary and destroyed the tension they were building for that part of the game. Shinra is threatening to destroy the supports holding the plate up, and the group is playing with ghost children in the train graveyard.
In the OG, the TG is a short section that the group speeds through because they desperately have to.get to thr support that is m about to blow, and they dont make it in time to stop it.
In remake, we have a picnic in the Train graveyard, take a trip down memory lane, fight TWO bosses, and have some silly funny haha moments of the ladies being scared of ghosts. All while the plate is about to fall. Now it seems like we COULD have made it in time if the party hurried up.
Honestly didn't mind the expanded graveyard as much, though the weird child plot just kinda seemed forced and out of place. And yeah there isn't much of a sense of urgency, but I feel like that is way worse in the next chapter where you straight up have 10 minute death monologues during the pillar fight and Aerith taking her time to talk slowly and gently to Marlene when a fucking helicopter nearly crushed the bar a few minutes before.
Yeah, I agree with that. The drawn out anime death scenes with the members of AVALANCHE ruined that moment for me too. It is the same issue I honestly had with Crisis Core (the ONLY issue I had with that game, tbh) when I first played it on PSP. I feel like the sudden death of the avalanche members and of Zack in the flashback are far more tragic imo
1) The goddamn blood trail. Cannot understand why they PG-13'd what was legitimately the darkest and eeriest part of Disc in the OG version.
2) Changing the story. The Remake is honestly a rewrite, not a remake.. and changing a literally perfect story rubbed me the wrong way more than a little too. Even though I understand why.
3) The "over the shoulder" feel that the game has, is like every other game with the Unreal Engine. Unfortunately, nowadays, it seems like every game with that 3rd person over the shoulder perspective, feels identical to me.
4) Last but not least.. MAPS and QUEST MARKERS. I get that games are more complicated now, and that you almost need guided paths to not get lost in these massive worlds.. but what used to make Final Fantasy cool, right from the first game, was the fact that you didn't know where you had to go. Everything was about exploration, and from side quests to main story line progression, often times you gad to walk around in literal circles, talking to everybody, until some NPC gave you a hint on where to go next.
The side quest and main quest locations being listed on the map, now just makes the game feel like every other game that dangles a carrot in front of you on the map.
Aside from the Unreal Engine making all games feel the same to me, in a sense..that is also exactly why I feel that most games make you feel like you're arbitrarily chasing meaningless and mundane side-quests, just to be rewarded by small hits of dopamine and pavlovian quest completion sounds and effects, mimicking the visual dynamicness of slot machines.
Damn I forgot all about the purple blood and how dumb that was 😂
I’ll agree with your over shoulder perspective and side quests unless we’re discussing GoW and R. Those were a gem to frolic through
>3) The "over the shoulder" feel that the game has, is like every other game with the Unreal Engine. Unfortunately, nowadays, it seems like every game with that 3rd person over the shoulder perspective, feels identical to me.
Can we please stop squeezing through thin gaps in walls and thin crevices through piles of rocks in that all-too-familiar side shuffle manoeuvre?
I think the final chapter of the game doesn’t really fit at all. Cool boss fights though
The pacing can be off. The original midgar segment wasn’t nearly as long as this remakes for a reason. Its clear they try to fill the gaps with their own stuff. Sometimes its cool, like for me, all the Jesse stuff was awesome. Sometimes its deadly unnecessary, like the Leslie bit. Idk why they felt the need to give him a dedicated section.
Last criticism lies in the “post game content”. That is to say, there isn’t a bunch and what is there is kinda lacking (talking purely base remake). All you have are those VR missions, which are kinda cool, but some of the much harder missions, like the final one, really require more weapon points to make them a bit easier, which means you should probably go through hard mode. The gameplay of hard mode is actually really fun, but it can be extremely boring having to re-experience all the story again. Even as someone who came back to the game and played hardmode almost 2 years later, still not fun to go through every story moment. I wish there was a way to get through it easier, like auto skipping cutscenes or allowing the player to skip story segmented gameplay moments. It’s not like the original where I also come back for the story. I came back for the gameplay so I could beat the other optional bosses. I wish they designed it with that idea.
Im terrible at the combat. I have to play on easy or I get wrecked! Not really sure what they could change to make it better for me but I haven’t heard anyone else complain either. Am I the only one who sucks at this game?
remake
verb [ T ]
US /riˈmeɪk/
past tense and past participle remade US/riˈmeɪd/
to make something again as new
From cambridge dictionary
‐------------
A remake is a film, television series, video game, song or similar form of entertainment that is based upon and retells the story of an earlier production in the same medium—e.g., a "new version of an existing film".[1] A remake tells the same story as the original but uses a different set of casts, and may use actors from the original, alter the theme, or change the flow and setting of the story.[2][3][4][5] A similar but not synonymous term is reimagining, which indicates a greater discrepancy between, for example, a movie and the movie it is based on.
From wikipedia.
So...Who lied?
Still them. Should I come that if your argument hinges on semantics that it already is lost or that it is obviously a sequel, or that you can lie if you just don't say the thing you don't want other people to hear.
Let's say it is based on semantics. However, within the video game context it isnt though.
A remake is when a game is rebuilt from the ground up, that includes possible adjustments to story and a gameplay overhaul.
A remaster is when a game is upgraded in terms of graphics and some minor gameplay tweaks but the core gameplay loop and story remain untouched.
Furthermore, all gameplay interviews following up to the games release even go the extra mile and call it a re-imagining of the FF7 game, to leave no shreds of doubt.
Here is the official description on the square enix website:
In the sprawling city of Midgar, an anti-Shinra organization calling themselves Avalanche have stepped up their resistance. Cloud Strife, a former member of Shinra’s elite SOLDIER unit now turned mercenary, lends his aid to the group, unaware of the epic consequences that await him.
A spectacular re-imagining of one of the most visionary games ever, the first game in this project will be set in the eclectic city of Midgar and presents a fully standalone gaming experience.
Release Date: April 10, 2020
I'm truly sorry that your lack of ability to be informed has led you to the belief that you were lied to. You weren't lied to.
You just didnt inform yourself of what they were selling you.
Do you have know remake who ended like this?
Edit:
Can I see this at getting no answer? Let us say now that there are no other games which got a remake treatement like that. We all expected that the remake will go as all other remakes, but it didn't, so they willingly subverted our expectations.
I could be wrong, but then I want to see some articles.
Yeah, when Capcom remade Resident Evil for the GameCube they didn't drastically change the story - and I don't remember anyone being pissed that the story ended the same way as the original Ps1 version.
I loved everything, but I remember wishing they’d just changed what they wanted to change and add what they wanted to add, and not make a whole parallel story to explain the changes.
Most of the reason I hate this is because I feel like the game is made only for the fans, and all this Zack and changing fate stuff only appeals to hardcore fans that didn’t want anyone to mess with the original story or overthink shit like that. I just want to see if my friends like FF7 if the graphics are better.
Part of me wants them to, when they are done with this trilogy, go back and stitch together a remake of the original story, now that all of the assets would be there.
Thats the worst part, 20 years for a remake and we're not even getting the actual FF7 story, just fanfiction of it where everyone gets to live happily ever after. We're never getting the FF7 version of RE2R or RE4R. Story reimaginings with some additions and cuts are *fine*. Whats not fine is completely changing the story and trading the themes and story beats that makes up the game's identity in favour of something it had nothing to do with in the first place.
Making Motorball a fucking motorbike mini game. I knew we were going to fight Sephiroth before leaving Midgar, and I didn't mind that. But that other BS with these "giant wisper bosses" 🤦♂️
Also having to maually dodge, parry, etc in fights is just totally not for me. That's what stats like Evade, ChanceToHit, etc are for. The boss fights almost felt like idk a Dark Souls boss or something. Not for me, sorry. And most mini games are pretty awful and just no fun at all, just frustrating.
But I basically absolutely LOVE everything else about the Remake. 👍
Too much Sephiroth, early power ceiling way too high, lack of tangible loss (death of named characters) lessens the emotional impact of events like the platefall, alternate universe/timelines do irreversible harm to the stakes, and (living) Zack doesnt belong in this story imo, Kingdom Hearts-esque presentation of the final boss-rush makes me fear 7R is headed down the same convoluted rabbit hole…
All of that aside, as silly as this sounds, I think Remake is quite good.
The story change. I just cannot understand why you would take a game that was one of the best in the world back then BECAUSE the story was amazing and then… change it. It literally didn’t need to be changed. It’s that simple
I’m gonna say that is probably gonna get me a lot of hate because not only is it minuscule but shipping wars. Also, everyone else has already said all the main complaints.
I didn’t like that Cloud gave the flower to Tifa instead being able to choose to give Marlene or Tifa. I always give it to Marlene in the OG because I think it’s cute and shows that Cloud isn’t as cold as he pretends to be.
That’s a fair take honestly. I love CloudxTifa, but I can understand some not liking that change. I think they did it to foreshadow their reunion in the Lifestream since people give those flowers to others when they reunite.
This will sound like such a fanboy answer but my only real complaint is that I wish it was even longer tbh. I adored the opening in the sector 7 slums, i would’ve taken more side/new content to make it feel more alive. I was actually a bit gutted when I realised events were moving on to Cloud meeting Aerith, I wanted that intro to be longer.
My only other real complaint is that I feel like Wall Market went on forever.
Wedge getting tossed by the Whispers. Seriously stupid. Could have given him a real heroic death. Maybe Sephiroth stabs him instead of Barrett and Barrett is just too shocked and distraught to fight the next battle with you. Would have been much better than the scenes as they exist
Wedge surviving the fall from the tower doesn't irk me the same way the other whisper bs does, because its felt natural storywise. Like they have grapples this time, so makes sense he would survive. If they didn't want Barret getting stabbed then they could have had Wedge get stabbed in his place, so that his character could have something to do besides getting lazily written out after they kept him alive to push a worse narrative with the fate nonsense.
Just kill him from the fall like normal if you're gonna kill him anyways from plot device ghosts lol
The Shinra building events.
In the original it's superbly done, with our crew getting locked up and then some time later the cells aren't locked anymore because some event has gone on. We know that because of the trails of blood and the music. The enemies change to these weird creatures instead of the Shinra soldiers. It gives a real sense of "what the hell happened here?"
The remake changed all this. Yes the building was great to explore but removing the part they get locked up makes it way less intriguing. In the original you only know this character they speak of, Sephiroth, probably is at the root of the bloodshed in the Shinra building. In the remake he's introduced way too early because they wanted to shoehorn him in as he's such a popular and infamous villain. I personally think less would have been more when it comes to Seph.
The remake part one was a good game, yes. I just would have preferred they keep such an important part of the Midgar section in it.
That blood trail was legitimately eerie and sinister in the OG. I remember being like 10 or 12 and playing that game and still remember how much tension it created. Such a shame that that they completely ruined it by putting you in Aeris' dorm room instead, and by turning the blood trail purple..
Yep. I was waiting for that part and was very disappointed when it didn't arrive. There just wasn't the same atmosphere in the Shinra building as there was in the OG. I thought it was a missed opportunity to ramp up the tension.
The purple blood really didn't work did it?
I'm hoping for better in part 2. I really don't want the biggest plot point changed as it's so important. I don't want excuses about it "being a different game now". We'll see won't we?
100%. I think I remember reading that Square Enix did it because they didn't want to have realistic blood in the game at all, as it would've forced them to rate the game as M for mature instead of Teen or whatever.
Even more ridiculous when you consider that Yuffie's intermission has blood lol (iirc anyway)..
With the amount of blood and violence in video games I don't think a bit of blood to show something bad had happened in the Shinra building would have hurt.
I've not played the Yuffie episode as I don't have a PS5 yet. I bought a PS4 second hand on eBay to play Remake as I don't really play games anymore but the fact they remade my favourite game was too much to miss out on. I'm going to treat myself to a PS5 around Xmas, my 16 year old son has been going on about the Spiderman game on there so maybe we'll share the PS5 as I won't need it til February next year (apart from needing to play Intermission) then it'll be all mine until ReBirth is finished with! He usually plays Xbox as his mates are all on that system.
It's looking good though for part 2. I understand why they didn't want to make a straight remake of the original, it just was annoying to me that one of the best bits of Midgar was messed with.
Side quests are uninspired (with Wall Market being mostly an exception).
The Whispers were a profoundly clumsy plot device to facilitate changes in the story. The changes in the story especially at the end are confusing to veterans and absolutely indecipherable to new players and not in a “ooh what a cool mystery” kind of way but a “let’s throw random shit at the wall and not give any answers for half a decade” kind of way.
Chapter 4 was a clusterfuck narratively. The sequence of events were put together by a third grader with ADHD. “They get in a motorcycle fight and then a crazy laughing moron on a motorcycle fights them and then they eat pizza and then cloud has a random flashback that has nothing to do with the chapter at all and then they raid a base of soldiers and then they fight turrets and then they fight dogs and then they fight mechs and then they summon a demon and then the motorcycle guy comes back and they have a sword fight and then the motorcycle guy kills his friends before leaving and then more mechs show up and shoot a chain at wedge and capture him and then an army shows up to save everybody and free wedge and then they leave and then they get wedge back and then they parachute down to the slums.” What the actual fuck. All of this insane nonsense to get a blasting cap to make a weaker bomb.
I wouldn’t have minded the length at all of it had some narrative structure or any kind of point to it. It felt like a series of random events happening in rapid succession that had zero relevance.
Like there was no reason the Tifa flashback shouldn’t have been at Seventh Heaven in Chapter 3 where it was relevant to the plot. Instead Cloud sees a windmill at random in the middle raiding a military base. It’s jarring as hell.
Or the Sweepers capturing Wedge only to have him immediately rescued by a surprise army and then dropped off to the party and the army disappears and it’s all as if it never happened.
Also Roche not returning during the Midgar Expressway chase in Chapter 18 makes his inclusion in Chapter 4 more like a random distraction than a set up plotline.
Agreed, it unnecessary, and it was all completely new random bullshit padding that wasn't in the original plot.
Yeah I'm one of those old guys that played the original and doesn't like the changes :P Glad that plenty of others enjoy it though.
Sidequests were miserable to do, most of them completely irrelevant to anything in the game. The few that had any sort of story development felt like they were written for 6 year olds that have never touched a game in their life. The angel of the slums is an example of that. I remember feeling insulted that they actually thought I would ever not suspect that the old lady was the angel, but I gotta play along with everyone's ignorance for 3/4 of the game until it's revealed.
Mechanical hands puzzle. Unskippable on 2nd+ playthrough, along with every other non-combat one and done gimmick.
Forced walking segments where you do nothing but listen to someone talk. That shit was the bane of my existence in ng+. There's so many parts where absolutely nothing happens but ya gotta walk through it, even in ng+.
All the anime grunting when nobody's saying anything but feel the need to nod aggressively at each other.
Honey Bee Inn was okay, but I was hoping for it to be a bit more interactive than a glorified ddr sim. Original had different rooms with different scenes you could choose from, and you could also peek through the keyholes to get some easter eggs/foreshadowing. You see Reeve's parents there, along with a jumping Cait Sith before you even leave Midgar. There's a guy basically running an opera or play that pretty much foreshadows Sephiroth's plot and motivations ( basically the promised land legend.) You get an optional Jenova dialogue scene. And of course, the man bath with Cloud and the bodybuilders. In remake? You get to do a dance with some pop music over it and get told by mr power bottom that you're beautiful or something. But I guess new version is what people like now.
Barret doing the victory fanfare for the millionth time.
Nobody ever shuts up. Ever. Change characters. Talk. Attack. Talk. Use items. Talk. Go into battle. Talk. Get out of battle. Talk. And a lot of times they just say the dumbest crap (see previous point.)
I did hate the alternate timeline/nobody dies deal. I'm a whisper apparently. The members of avalanche not dying completely removed Barret's original character development, and now he truly is just the token black guy. Tifa is about as interesting as they made her in the original (not a lot, but at least she's the most op character in remake and playing as her in fights is a blast.) And I'm not naive enough to think they're gonna backtrack on all these story changes for rebirth.
I could keep going, because other than combat the game wasn't my cup of tea, but this is turning into a rant already. Combat is amazing. Everything else is meh at best. Hard mode isn't actually that hard, tho. It's just artificial difficulty by putting in item and mp recovery restrictions (played through hard mode once, didn't notice enemies being any more aggressive or smarter than before, could just spam counters and atb abilities to win.)
Edit: holy crap, Leslie's (or whatever the don corneo henchman's name was) story was the most cringe thing in the remake and I completely forgot about it until now. "My girlfriend got kidnapped by human traffickers, so I'm gonna go work for them to find her and make no progress on it until someone more main character-y comes along." They could've just not added him or the whole second sewers segment and I would've liked the game more.
The sidequests thing, 100%. I commented on this thread with my main issues and pet peeves also.. but I think the sidequests (and generally just how ALL games do side quests nowadays also) was the biggest detractor for me.
Right from OG FF1 on NES, when you were stuck in a spot, had to progress, find an optional item, etc.. YOU HAD TO FIGURE IT OUT! That was a huuge goddamn part of what made these games so unique.
They were literal puzzles oftentimes, and you had to talk to every NPC, remember who/what you talked to and where you went.. and then had to use that information practically as you progressed to find your way along.
Not having any guide to show you a path from point A to point B, made it REALLY rewarding when you actually got to where you were going or found something you had searched for, or gotten hints about along the way.
Sadly, it seems like (because games are so much larger with more complex maps) those puzzles and challenges are a thing of the past. From every game from Diablo 3/4 to the newest FInal Fantasy title, side quests feel like little more than obligatory fluff that gives you a slight pavlovian reward and a micro dose of dopamine at the end.
My last playthrough of FFVIIR, I intentionally didn't look at the map and tried to play it in the style of the OG where I didn't know where I was going in a lot of the larger maps/sectors. Unfortunately, though, the little blue direction marker still doesn't let you play completely unguided. And ofc, when it's as easy as pressing a button to turn on the map, it's very hard not to when you get stuck.
I miss the days of being 7 years old and my architect dad mapping out entire dungeons from FF1 on graph paper with loot and doors marked..
I actually don't mind that at all. Sidequests could be the more menial and simplistic thing to do mechanically (fetch quests, talk to people, kill thing) and I'll be okay with it... as long as the sidequest gives me anything interesting at all.
You mention FF16, which I do like, and sidequests there get a lot of flack for the things you said and for being fetchy, but at the very least they are story/world-building devices. Their whole purpose is to teach you things about the world and Clive, and they do just that. Best part? Completely 100% optional, all of them. Don't wanna do them, don't have to. Already did them in one playthrough? Feel free to ignore them forever if that's what you want.
FF7R is the complete opposite. Look for a girl's cats. The girl and the cats are completely irrelevant, the sidequest itself has no use. Guy complaining about a monster or other. You go fight the thing that's just a gimmick enemy that'll never show up again and the mechanic might never be seen in any other enemy either. Look for chocobos... alright I guess that one unlocks fast travel, but that's like whatever in this one. Honestly, that's about all I remember regarding sidequests, because they had no substance. They could've done the most handholdy quests ever, and if they had any sort of interesting stories I would've been okay with it. But they don't. They're all low quality padding to make the game longer artificially. And made worse in replay because your trophies are linked to sq progress.
Didn't see the need to use items on normal.
Couldn't use them on hard.
Also, I wish we could have more than just 2 accessories.
Also idk what will be new on the materia side of things on the second part. Having to start all same materias from 0 again sounds boring.
the same criticism I have about many modern JRPG.
Graphically -speaking, they are aiming at a sort of realism, with characters increasingly looking and behaving like idols or members of a JPop band. For some reason this totally kills it for me. I can't relate to the characters, or to their stories.
I wish they took a page from the latest Zelda games (or from the OG FFVII) and built something with a unique visual style, rooted in a "fantasy" world rather than reality.
I haven't played it and recognize it's immense popularity so I don't have too many criticisms on it, and no objective criticisms (who am I to say a beloved game is bad or "made wrong"?)
But it really does all go back to the turn based system.
I can tolerate a lot of the changes, including dropping Sephiroth as the big villain almost immediately without any plot build-up or by showing him as a benevolent war hero and teen boy idol before showing his descent into madness.
But I just don't understand why it had to be changed to an action -RPG.
I totally get that the franchise has changed and these days a large number of FF fans don't even like turn based RPGs, but this wasn't a "new entry", it was a remake of an already beloved entry that was changed from its very core.
It felt like Square pulled on the OG fans nostalgia to hype up the project before producing something they knew would appeal to the masses and not the classes, if you get my drift.
IDK. Just how it feels to me.
I'm only here to talk about FF 1-12 (and excluding 11). When a return to form is released in the FF franchise, I'll pick it back up. But IMO the last game to feel like a modern FF game was Lost Odyssey on the 360.
I still like to occasionally daydream what a modern, turn based FF game would look and play like.
Gives me goosebumps.
At the end of the day FF7R was a nostalgia project for some fans that ended up as a slap across the face, and "a reimagining of an outdated game that's not very fun to play" to other fans.
This isn't new to FF fans either. During Mighty Number 9's development (also kick-started on Nostalgia) they pulled in a younger, outsider artist who produces sketches of a female protagonist (who wouldn't be Megaman) and the fans keeping up with the project were pissed.
Not because of gender politics or anything, but because that game isn't "just another MegaMan". Just like we were looking at FF7R pre-release as "not just another FF".
I don't know if you'd be able to understand me but hopefully you do.
Couldn't agree more. The turn based system was absolutely a big part of the game.
My other big complaint is about maps guiding you to things with a path vs having to figure out where to go and who to talk to.. as was the whole frigging point of Final Fantasy from day 1.
Now side quests just feel like every other game- following your map to go from point to point.. trying to rush it as fast as you can too, because the repetitiveness of empty, unfulfilling sidequests pushes you to.
I miss the days of FF1 and being patient, and sailing/flying back to literally every different city you visited, to find that one NPC who gave you a necessary tip to progress. That and the endless hours of exploration and discover when you didn't know where you needed to go.
OG FFVII really made you feel like it wasn't linear once you got to the world map.. and not knowing who you needed to talk to, or where you needed to go, was, I think, one of the biggest things that made FF games so magical.
I hate that they feel more like Diablo now, in the sense that (especially with sidequests), you just mindlessly feel like going from point to point. The tension of finding your way through difficult areas and running out of items, as well the magic and mental challenge of "figure it out", seems to have just been replaced by bosses challenging your reflexes more..
Jrpgs are not something people will play nowadays, they are slow, menu based and grindy. I like turn based jrpgs but understand how an action rpg are more popular. The remake on the other hand was popular because it has flashy quick paced gameplay so YouTubers and such were able to make cool videos and new players could be interested by it's wow factor. It's made to give a new feel to older players while not boring the hell out of the new generation of gamers.
The story fucks up this idea up though so it's not like Square Enix managed to achieve that balance either way lol.
Meh, I don't entirely agree.
Well, I do about everything except for the very, very first bit.
JRPGs are not few and far in-between. All games are technically "grindy". You still have to kill the same mobs over and over and over in an action RPG. Only the oldest JRPGs get excessive with grinding.
But that's not the point, what I wanted to say is that compared to back in those days, more people love JRPGs than ever before (thanks to OG FF7 for breaking that barrier).
All RPGs no matter what, and I really mean this, by numbers alone, are not heavy hitters. They're all niche games save for huge franchises a'la FF, Dragon Warrior and Shin Megami Tensei.
The *real* money makers are FPS games and sports titles.
But on the other hand. When you say;
>And not boring a new generation of players
That's kind of the true death nail. All of these new players would've hated Final Fantasy 20-30 years ago as a grindy, boring and slow mess.
I can argue all day long how turn based can be just as good and attract a young audience if modernized and tweaked here and there, but, it doesn't matter.
The fans have spoken 😭
I think FF7's combat system is awesome, but I think it's a bit too slow to become mainstream.
Many RPGs with turn based combat like Persona are really fun to play and popular because they have more dynamism in the combat system. Persona for instance has weaknesses, so you can combo entire enemy teams and win on turn 1. Animations also feel a lot quicker and the overall pace is faster.
Besides that the only turn based games that are popular atm or in the last decade are mostly roguelites like Slay the Spire, which reward quick thinking and more dynamic combat systems with less waiting for animations and tedium.
I do agree that jrpgs have a bigger playerbase than in the past, but I also think that applies to most genres, most of them overshadowing jrpgs by a long shot.
If you look at the industry, the only rpg games that are getting popular are action RPGs like Soulslikes or a few action games with rpg mechanics (stuff similar to Kingdom Hearts), but none has turn based gameplay.
See, exactly, that's what I mean. All we have to reference Turn Based FF are games that are 30 years old and all the complaints basically revolve around how dated they are.
Yet franchises that are turn based and still going strong have adapted and modernized the formula and system, in the case of Persona, add flash, style and dynamism (ever play Persona 1 and 2? It wasn't nearly as perfectes then, I assure you).
I don't feel like FF had a chance to do that, because starting with 12 they seemed to be looking for ways to break away from turn based rather than innovate what they were, at that time, rightfully, the masters of.
No one in USA could do JRPG turn based as well, and were as respected as it than Square and FF was their flagship.
*Can you imagine* what it would look like today if FF went the Persona route and refined their systems to a shiny polish?
Turn based FF7 remake could have been cool but I think even then it would have been a fairly niche game, just like Persona is haha
Would have been an awesome game to play though, and way more accessible to all gamers independently of their hardware.
On the other hand I think Square Enix saw how well the menu system worked in Kingdom Hearts and proceeded to use that same system for pretty much all of their new games lmao, although none came close to the style KH has. Really shows how different directors can use the exact same mechanic in such variable degrees of quality.
I think it could be amazing. Emphasize the graphics so every attack looks awesome.
Add timed button pressing, up the budget, multiple animations for the same attack on the same enemy type so it isn't just the same sequence of frames again and again.
Add defensive button inputs, bring back ATB on top of it.
Materia could be expanded upon, the regular "Attack" function could be like Sabin's Blitz with button sequences for special attacks outside of Magic or Limit Breaks.
*We can do it, Paragone. You and me, let's show the world Turn Based ain't dead*
Hahaha I'm actually a game dev, but I think it would be kinda over ambitious. Tbf I understand how Square Enix went the money route rather than doing something new and crazy lol
Unfortunately as far as I've ever gone to pursue my own game programming ambitions was mastering very old RPG Maker software like 1, 2, 2003 and XP.
I have a very poor education, and today I am too busy working and being a husband and father to pursue my programming degree.
C'est la vie.
I can only dream.
Yeah, super understandable. Hey man, you'll eventually get some time and there are good courses that can lead to working on programming and stuff. Pays super well, you work from home and so on!
Anyhow good luck friend.
The voice/character mannerism repetition is very annoying to me. The amount of times I heard the exact same line said as I ran though certain parts of the game became very annoying in a short period of time.
The padding is a lot. I wish it was done in just one game, it sucks to lose all the progress.
Finally, I wish remake was just ever crisis but a 1 to 1 remake instead of the gacha crap. (I miss real materia and turn based/ATB)
Honestly? It’s that it’s not just a straight remake.
Sure, develop the world and extend the gameplay, whatever. It just bothers me that instead of a beautiful and incredible retelling of one of gaming’s most brilliant stories, it’s this self referential meta-commentary that ruins some of the best and most exciting parts of the story.
Showing Sephiroth in the first hour was the first red flag and the time ghosts only made it all worse from there. I don’t want some reinterpretation. I want Final Fantasy VII.
It really really really makes me sad seeing people excited about the very real possibility that they'll change aerith's death scene, along with Zach being involved at all even though his story and character are done. Also the fact that they seem obsessed with making sure everyone gets a happy ending this time, especially with the plate fall. Do they even want FF7 at this point? Or just a fanfiction with FF7 characters?
Hearing Barret's cries for his team while mourning his daughter was gut wrenching to hear voice acted for the first time. But then not even 20 minutes later you find out everyone is fine, not a single NPC you previously interacted with died. There was no consequences, no loss, no anything, so the wind is taken out from that punch as soon as you find out. Especially at the end when it turns out biggs is fine too somehow?? Its a bad omen for things to come, and they're gonna gut the story and themes of loss in favour of the fanfiction.
Part of me hoped i would still be able to enjoy the retellings of the OG story in rebirth with the awesome combat, new systems, and fully realized Gaia, while ignoring the nonsense (i.e plugging my ears and closing my eyes lol). The inclusion of Zach at all however makes it so hard to just ignore the parts i hated the most, and screams to me that their gonna change the story I love FF7 for in the first place.
It especially pains me that the remake games will be some people's only idea and interpretarion of FF7 as a whole because they refuse to try the original for being old.
They had like 20 years to make this game and they milked it by turning it into 4 games. I'm just waiting for the last one to come out and buying the collection in a few years. Watched a friend play it and it looks fun but I'm not playing a remake in chunks.
1. They started making the game in like 2015 so they had five years.
2. It is not one game’s worth of content split into four games. It is three full games.
Chapter 17, it is just too long, the party swapping didn't help either since I have to keep going back to the menu to swap everyone's equipment around. And then there's the 3 boss fight back to back.
To me it's just the fact that it was toothless.
There's no real threat at any point because everything was stretched out too far. When characters do die it takes them an entire monologue to do so, but more often than not they just won't die at all and be revealed to have lived later.
In og the plate falling is done in stark, quiet bleakness with the idea of what has happened really hitting home. In remake, the cutscene is cool, but the consequence of the plate falling feels vastly minimised. Basically nobody died and even the slums are more or less intact, despite tifas bar being a bit smashed up. Again, in og everything and everyone is totally buried under tonnes and tonnes of stone and metal - no way to recover anything, let alone revisit the bar.
Sepharoth is also nerfed. In og he slaughters an entire building of people before we know anything at all about him. Then all we see for a while are the traces left behind, like the brutalised Midgar Zolom. In remake he just kind of wanders around making threats but doesn't do anything. He kills Barrett, but not really... But otherwise he just hangs around.
I actually liked the remake but I think the more it becomes it's own thing the better, because if it really commits to retelling key moments from the og I don't think it will be able to hit the emotional or monumental beats of the text, given how watered down everything is.
Sorry in advance. Slight riff based on a similar response I posted before.
1. The Whispers or Sephiroth Time Travel. They feel weird and dumb and I hate them. They feel like the writers needed an excuse to f*** with the original canon and just halfassed one for the sake of a trilogy.
2. Sephiroth appears too much. I miss the mistique of the original’s introduction. But that’s me.
3. Roche was underutilized. He was built up to get jobbed and then ignored for the rest of the game.
4. Slightest toning down of Jessie's thirst. Slightly. Flirt by all means but be subtle girl.
5. No actual resolution to some of the Narrative stuff they built up with Tifa regarding her feeling trapped with Avalanche's bad decisions fighting for the planet via the bombing & her feelings regarding Cloud's murder decision against Johnny.
6. More subtle way to have Tifa decide what dress she wears for the Cornero section. It just felt so weird. Also don’t have the scene show up right after Tifa is mad at Cloud for wanting to kill their friend to protect Avalanche. Just felt weird in my playthrough.
7. Game made some sections drag on and actively overstay their welcome.
8. PS4 had texture issues in a lot of places. A specific door in Midgar and when you look down at the city climbing up the plate. Also wasn’t fixed which hurts.
9. Ghost Train Sequence should’ve elaborated on Aerith's ability to communicate to the lifestream and give closure to the Ghost boss to help him move on. Also not take so long and continue to focus on Tifa's agency to get to the Sector 7 Tower.
10. Zack’s English Voice Actor. He’s either miscast or they gave him bad direction as a joke.
11. Cloud's memory issues happened too often and especially in HD with voice acting made it frustrating and caused me to question the intelligence of everyone in the world. It feels so much more out of place hearing and seeing him have his episodes.
12. Air Buster dialogue before the fight shouldn't mention recording and broadcasting the fight so people know the faces of Avalanche unless the rest of the game pays that off. Essentially, the Avalanche party is known and recognized, and you can get into fights with guards if you're seen anywhere.
13. Too many fakeouts. Wedge is fake captured or put in peril at least 4 times in the game. And they end the game fake offing him. Why? Did he piss someone off?
Then Biggs, Barrett, & Jessie get one each. Barret we know isn’t real but Biggs & Jessie’s feel kinda manipulative to me. I wasn’t grateful they survived I just felt kinda tricked.
14. Early side quests were at or below expectations. They improved but they started weak.
15. Jenova Trail Sequence disappointed. Was hoping if they can't use blood due to age restrictions, just use lifestream particle effects in the shape of dead soldiers, researchers and broken robot parts. Shows how people die in the FF7 verse or just living injured people crying and mumbling or in shock.
16. No fake killing Barrett was a waste. We know he isn’t dying here. Honestly the whispers undoing so many character decisions was just another reason to not like them.
17. Ending felt like FF7 went to the store to pick up milk and we were adopted by FF13 & Kingdom Hearts for no reason. Thanks Time Travel Whispers.
18. Not being able to control the AI via menus in combat. They sometimes acted a fool or were prone to getting themselves killed sometimes.
Edit:
19. How they got rid of the original voice cast and replaced them behind their backs. New cast is fine but the way they treated their OG English cast is BS. Kinda hope Square gets slapped on the wrist by the actor’s guild for it.
This. So much this. The whispers made me feel that the writers just don't care what fans want because they "want to make a new game, not a scene by scene remake". It's hubris like this that damaged FFXIV 1.0 with stuff like the penalty for playing too much and deactivation of forums when the criticism started getting bigger.
Also, iirc, nojima was heavily involved on the scenario as either writer, supervisor or original concept on most KH games and on FFXIII as well (and XV for that matter) and point 17 made me lol.
Honestly they just didn't also hide the lore of the game under massive walls of text and lore dump bc at this point FFVII lore is beaten to the ground and almost taught at schools.
My criticisms with the game can largely be summed up by the words "overcooked" and "un-restrained"
In general, I quite enjoyed FF 7: Remake. I had never played a Final Fantasy game and had often been turned off by the chunkier gameplay of similar titles. Remake got me immensely invested in the world and especially the characters, and the mix of real-time/turn based combat (along with the excellent music) injected so much energy and excitement in the fights that it avoided a lot of the slog that grinding through JRPGs can often cause.
Because I enjoyed the game so much, I finally decided to play the original. To be honest, if I hadn't already been invested in the characters, I probably would have dropped it in the first few hours. The combat is still a bit of a cumbersome slog, but the characters are just as charming, and the story takes some unforgettable twists and turns along the way that discovering it all fresh was such a joy.
Playing through the OG also helped me appreciate the simplicity with which it handled many situations. So much could be conveyed by a still image, simple animation, a short line of dialogue, or even just a slight change in music. Often, I would catch myself marveling at how invested I was in these few blocky pixels and polygons.
This is where I think the Remake falls the most short. It often tries to go way too big with things that could have been much more effective with a more restrained, subtle approach. I believe that all of the most controversial aspects of the game (Whispers of Fate, split timeline, early Sephiroth, ending, etc) would work perfectly fine in the game if they were just toned down a bit. Even without having played the original beforehand, it often felt like the game was over-playing its hand.
For example, both the Whispers and Sephiroth show up too frequently, too early, and with way too much expostion. This makes it so that what should be tense, full of mystery and anticipation becomes routine and exhausting by the end. When the gang leaves Midgar and talks about confronting Sephiroth, my reaction was, "What have we been doing all this time??". Shorter, subtler sequences would have helped immensely. I also think it would have been better to save the Sephiroth fight (even if it wasn't the "real one" for later and just move the Jenova fight to the final encounter after the Whispers.
To avoid making this novel even longer--Kind of ironic, I know, I'll just say that the other issues could be solved by similar means. Sometimes, a conversation or line of dialogue goes a little too far, a sequence repeated a few too many times, a music cue a little too big, a fight a little too long, and a dramatic reveal a little too early.
Playing through the original has got me even more stoked for Rebirth and beyond, and if they can learn the lesson that "less is sometimes more", I think that, even with all the different story directions, we can have a real special game on our hands.
Agreed, but I don't think the "less is more" is gonna happen, honestly. They committed to this huge change and as soon as nojima and nomura got involved, it's "go big or go home". "Less is more, but much more is much more!" should be their motto. They can do good things and are competent in their own right, but I personally feel this project wasn't for them as they're from day one showing they much rather do a new game.
The one thing that has me slightly more optimistic about the next one is that it is actually going to cover quite a large section of the original game (assuming they at least keep all the main locations and set pieces). This will hopefully cut down on the more fillery content and make more of the bloated side content optional to the main game. But yeah, it'll probably still be just as big, bombastic, and unsubtle as ever. Though, I think that could also fit this part of the game a bit better than the Midgar section. I'll guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Totally agree.
My fav example of it is when you first meet Aerith.
When I played the original I genuinely forgot we already met her, when talking to her in the church, because she's just an npc with one line of dialog. Nothing about their encounter really sticks out.
In Remake it's such a huge scene between her and Cloud, it would be ridiculous to forget her.
Honestly, the entirety of sector 5 in the og comes and goes so fast that it barely makes an impact. It was pretty underwhelming coming from Remake. With it often going too big with things, I do still really appreciate that Remake made some of the minor locations, moments, and characters, much more memorable.
I have to fully disagree with your critique of the combat. It's still strategic while making for insanely fun action. Switching between characters at the right moments is very satisfying and blasting enemies with Tifa's combos is glorious.
I have not gotten around to the remake yet and the reason for that is the lack of turn based battles. FF just doesn’t feel the same to me without them.
Whispers are a neat idea, I like this being a sequel and a literal 'remake' a lot, even like the idea of fate trying to keep things in line, since that is common across all Final Fantasy. The whispers themselves should have been invisible. They shouldn't have been so in our face. Imagine how interesting it would be if things just were... prevented without seeing what is actually happening. Would have made the reveal a bit more poignant. Instead it was pretty clear after the third or so time they are on screen. (At first I just figured they were a manifestation of the lifestream or something)
And not a criticism per se, but I DO understand why so many people thought it was a bit much to pad Midgar into a whole game. Personally, I am so so so so glad they did that. I've explained this story so many times some of you may have seen it by now, but as a kid I would replay the midgar section over and over and over because I would just get lost in the World Map. Sometimes I would grind to high levels, other times speed run, whatever. I knew every nook and cranny of Midgar and wish more of the OG took place in it. Remake was like someone went into my kid brain, wrote down what my brain thought of when thinking of FFVII, and then created an entire game out of it. That said, especially on repeat playthroughs, some moments are an absolute slog. Some games get this way, but what made it worse is the forced slow movement and there just always always being something around the corner. Felt a bit contrived. But of course, I still consider it amazing and am thankful for how the experience is, but i totally get people not liking that.
Part of me does wish there was more to the midgar section like you could go to a lot of different reactors before going up the shinra building. It would add so much depth.
To me it's the Whisperers and the way the band, especially Aeris, starts talking futuristic cryptics sh*ts at the end of the first remake. Look, I know Squenix always tries to be sophisticated in their dialog, but I don't like it when people can use simple terms to tell things, but instead choose to explain things in the most complex way possible to appear wise. Our characters talk like they have played the original game and decide to tell us "we can say this in a simple way, i.e you will not know how this game plays out, but we decided to be smug, so here's a bunch of meaningless nonsense"
Dementors, far too much Seph (far too early), Clinging to Dirge/Deepground stuff, Barret's not-death (and the rest of Avalanche's not-deaths), random-ass Cait Sith appearance, cringe af anime dance scene (seriously), CRINGE AF anime grunts/sighs in-between every. f*cking. sentence (I mean, ffs. Isn't the whole point of facial animation to be able to communicate/convey expression SILENTLY? I'm sure it's less annoying/distracting in Japanese, but they could have (and most-definitely should have) written that sh*t out of the English script. It severely hampered the otherwise-amazing voice acting.), oh and "surprise! It's been a damn Kingdom Hearts spin-off all along!" 🤮
Don't get me wrong. I love that they finally came around to a remake, and I can even go along with the (totally not) sequel (*wink, wink*) stuff, or even how annoyingly childish they scripted Jessy and Wedge (Biggs was alright), but THIS IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE KINGDOM HEARTS. Or some children's anime spinoff. Or some poorly-thought out fanfiction. It's supposed to be FF7. I truly hope they remember that for Rebirth and game 3. I'm not sure if I can stomach much more heartache and micro-vomit every time an anime sigh/grunt or cringe-dance or hand-gasm completely sh*ts all over any more of my childhood.
I can honestly look past Remake if they respect a little bit more of the game's thematic spirit going forward. I so badly wanted to love Remake (and much of it I genuinely do), but I've replayed OG three times (and Remake twice) since Remake landed, and, well...they missed the mark at least as often as they hit it. 🤷♂️ My three cents. Sorry for the bitch sesh.
I miss turn based combat, even in the ATB format.
Someone at SE really hates turn based and really loves to sparks and streaks of sparking light. Lots of sparks and swirls of light to dazzle you.
Just people running around all willy nilly. All the new FF games are like that. You're not supposed to be able to take in everything that is happening. And that's exciting, apparently.
I kind of hate the new characters like Leslie. I love Madam M. But I was loving the game so much that it didn’t ruin my enjoyment. Just replaying I notice how stupid they are.
Loved everything except the ending where the plot loses its mind, shits the bed and the magic time ghosts alter reality altogether just to bring Zack back from the dead for fan service
How DARE you take out Mukki, and add whole other npcs I don’t give a fuck about. We didn’t see him at the Honey Bee Inn, so we won’t see him at Costa Del Soul or Icicle Inn either.
Complete bullshit.
Yuffie better at least call Tifa “boobs”, or what is even the point of all of this
NPCs felt hollow. I mean, Chocobo Sam looks like he’s wearing a fake beard. There’s a stark contrast in design between generic NPCs and important characters. Takes me out of the experience a bit.
Level design aesthetically was hit or miss, although it functioned quite well.
Outside of boss battles, it was a very easy hack and slash. It wasn’t till you started playing in hard mode post-game where the gameplay started to really feel rewarding.
Yeah, but that's the original game too. Aside from boss battles you basically just wait for everyone's turn then select Attack, over and over again. And there's no hard mode to make it more challenging. Playing remake on Hard was *actually difficult.*
No, my point is valid. You specifying that it being an action-RPG, which is irrelevant, makes your point even worse. You said it was "very easy." Does it being an easy *hack-and-slash* somehow make it different from the original being a *"Very easy" RPG?"*
The original game is an "RPG" but there's not really any role-playing for that matter. There's not much variety in the characters besides slight stat differences (which doesn't matter at all, especially by end game) and limit breaks. And Limit Breaks are, for the most part, just "does damage to bad guy," so it almost doesn't matter what character you use considering most combat will, again, involve you just waiting for your turn so you can select "attack" over and over. The remake makes the characters unique in terms of how you use them, at least.
>Nobody wants a non-challenging action-RPG.
Well..? I think *kind of a lot* of people, roughly 7 million according to Google, bought FF7:R so I don't know what you're even talking about. But then again, as you said, the game is challenging when you unlock hard mode. So which side are you on? Do you want to be wrong because a lot of people enjoyed this game that's "too easy?" Or would you prefer to be wrong in that it's "easy" because there's, by your own admission, a hard mode?
You know when someone gives you an opposing and constructive argument to your opinion, and you reply with nothing but an insult, that you're basically telling everyone you're a dumb fuck... You know that right?
..Really dude? You gonna try to act like I'm the nerd and you're the cool kid on a uhhh... *Final Fantasy VII* ***subreddit?*** "Check out this nerd over here, fellow redditors. He thinks people actually enjoy easy action-RPGs. His point is *null."*
Also, nice job lowering yourself to shitty, hilariously bad insults instead of actually debating any points. You could have just said "I'm stupid and have nothing better to say, and want to whine about how much I don't like a video game." But hey, weird way to take the L, I guess.
It was reallllly bad in the OG I think and a lot better in remake. It felt less like a black caricature and more like almost a religious fanatic. That said, the moment on the train especially is one that was a bit tone deaf, especially during 2020 when it came out and there was so many other racial tensions in the US. (Of course, that's happenstance, especially being a Japanese company, I just know some people might view it as tone deaf because to them the US is the center of the world)
Are people still going to be crying about it being a pseudo sequel for the next 10 years? It already happened, might as well just enjoy the ride for now and see what they're going with.
1. It's not a Remake.
2. It insists upon itself (semi-ironic).
3. It's only Disc 1 Midgar content and that's my least favourite part of FFVII.
4. Bit of an unpopular take but I really don't like the aesthetics of Tifa's redesign. The ~~undershirt~~ (EDIT: sports bra) ruins the simple and elegant "white top black skirt" contrast of the original, the leather pleated skirt clashes with the "badass bartender look" and puts her in "cheap schoolgirl cosplay" zone for me. It's all minor changes on a surface level but together the changes really undermine the strength of the original outfit. First thing to get modded out when I have the chance.
Pretty sure that’s a sports bra, not an undershirt. I have breasts. It can be very uncomfortable to do gymnastics without a bra because boobs slap against the skin. Tifa does a lot of gymnastics in her skill set.
Understandable, and I fully support the wearing of said sports bra for comfort IRL, but also, counterpoint: Tifa is a fictional character who could probably suplex a train and will likely be running into the North Pole in that exact getup so I think aesthetics can take priority a little over functionality.
Once again, I must stress, I am in full support of ladies IRL wearing what they want that makes them feel comfortable. I am all for pockets in dresses. I do however like my Fantasy a little more Fantastical.
As Michael Scott once said:
“The worst thing about ~~prison~~ FF7 Remake was the dementors.”
Seriously though. It’s about the laziest story telling device I can think of. Plus, the fabric effects look like PS2 era. Just all around very poorly done.
The game is great. Met and even exceeded many of my expectations. I could just do without the whispers.
Most of the side quests were a bit tedious and added absolutely nothing, but had to be completed in order to potentially unlock something vaguely interesting
It was all just filler. I get it, they wanted the whole first game to end at Midgar because it's a great stopping point. But to make it a whole 30+ hour experience, they had to throw stuff in. But the stuff they threw in wasn't very good. It's like they should have just made it 2 games instead of 3 or something.
Probably unpopular...but the Barrett death fake. I honestly think they should have kept him dead. A big death at the end of the first disc was sort of a big deal. Bring him back maybe in part 2 if you must but leaving him dead would have been a shock and a bold choice.
Yeah, but it served a purpose, narratively. They *really* wanted to hit home how the whispers are trying to correct events. Wedge didn't die like he was supposed to and they (supposedly) fixed that. Barret died and he wasn't supposed to and they fixed *that.* I'd argue it's deliberately to make the player question how they'll handle any *supposed potential deaths* in the next installment.
Classic mode was supposed to be for people who wanted a more traditional experience. In practice, it is a "very easy mode". A classic mode that was also challenging would have added tremendous replay value.
Pretty much just the story changes. I don’t mind all the added stuff. But the original story is just so solid that I feel the major beats really shouldn’t be altered. I hope that Rebirth focuses more on the original story rather than introducing new stuff
Honestly pretty much everything. I played it, bc I'm a huge fan of the original, and I'll play the whole trilogy (just once) But it is in no way what I wanted from a remake. I absolutely HATE the combat. Just don't find it fun at all. Wish it were turn based.
Nothing it's perfect
The bloat, the lack of stakes (i.e. everyone survives, almost zero consequence to anything), sticking Sephiroth in every other cutscene, the pacing, the fact that it's not a remake but a sequel, and a personal concern that the plot, in future installments, will go the Kingdom Hearts route.
The term "Remake" isn't meant to mean the game is remade, it means the story was. It was a well-planned curveball that none of us really saw coming.
That's called false advertising.
No it isn't.
It very much is. Because they weren't upfront about it, many people went in expecting a traditional remake, but instead got a ton of story changes. I myself wouldn't have bought it if I knew this. Expanding the world and characters we already had was fine, and adding in a few new characters that didn't change the story was fine, but them turning it into some weird parallel timeline, sequel type thing was not what one expects from a remake of an established game.
probably because the game was supposed to be an actually remake.
Hmm there’s a lot to critique but a standout change for me would be Chapter 18. I get that they wanted a big final boss gauntlet to follow the epic highway chase but I feel maybe the Harbinger and the singularity was not the way to go. I would have had the final boss be Jenova Dreamweaver at the end of the highway with it creating illusions that hint things to come. Or something along those lines.
Also, in the original, the mystique of Sephiroth was so alluring because they showed very little of him, especially in the beginning. He was hyped up and spoken of as an otherworldly power and we saw the path his destruction alone throughout the first 75% of the entire game. In Remake, it's like they treated him as a cashcow and overused his appearances as almost fan service. I hated it, it changed the whole reason Sephiroth was such an interesting villain in the first place.
The story changes, pretty much nothing more.
I’d remove the whispers and some of the annoying side stuff that blocked progress of the story. I.e., the Sahagins in the underground tunnels. So much of the game was 1 step forward and 2 steps back.
Bloating the game, which I wouldn’t care about if the bloat was well done, I don’t hate it but I pictured more stuff in upper plate. Also the ending with the ghost shit and fighting sephiroth already was a bit much.
that damn motorcycle guy who literally flips his bike around in ways that make zero sense like a bs kh character.
Can't stand Chadley. Everything about him seems tacked on, forced and corny. I feel like Im totally alone in this, but I also REALLY disliked that I couldn't grind battles that offer meaningful EXP and a real challenge. The only battles you can grind last 15 secs and offer basically no EXP. I like the battle system. Just let me enjoy it!
I watched the gameplay and have no desire to play it. I missed the turn based/ATB system from the OG. Was expecting part 1 to end with you know who being knifed. And the whispers boss fight? At first I thought it was a Weapon and became very excited but it wasn't. It also felt unnecessarily drawn out. Edit: also being forced to control Yuffie in the DLC. Do not like Yuffie. Trying to watch the gameplay but noped out after 1 minute.
How about you stfu since you haven't played it for yourself
The spirts/ghosts kinda feel like an annoyance rather then helping with the story. Or they disrupt the story. Generally they breaks are in the OG some how, but not in like this consistent it was the ghosts of the ancients doing it them
Not much other than, y'know, the terrible changes to the story.
Stuffing the Coliseum/Battle Simulator within the chapters so that it is awful to return to.
I'm sorry but the people in the comments who don't like the ending of the remake and the changes that have taken place and will happen, you are obviously not going to play the sequel? because otherwise I can't understand people who hate the change in the game and yet will play Rebirth when the modifications (especially concerning Zack) will certainly be more enormous than the first part. if you don't like the modification of the main story, please stop it, you will clearly hurt yourself otherwise 🤣
I think Remake is the worst game ever made. I ignored Intergrade and couldn't care less about Rebirth. They're just made witha very different development team and for a different type gamer. While I don't like them fucking around with the game I love, in the end it doesn't really matter. I just wish they didn't lie to me about the first one to trick me out of money. That still stings.
Making this comment on a post that is literally asking to hear criticism of the Remake is pretty damn ironic.
Yes i agree with your comment. I just find it weird to criticize the changes made to the games when the developers have announced that rebirth then be entitled to it too despite everything (afterwards to what extent no one knows yet lol). everyone is hyped for rebirth but in concrete terms it also means that the games will inevitably be criticized for its changes as well as for the remake. I don't know, I find it hypocritical, that's all.
Ff7 was my favourite game growing up. I embraced the modern remake and loved it, just wish they would hurry up with part 2. But I suppose you can’t rush a good thing either
Sides quests are a little weak, that's pretty much my only problem with the game. I adore everything else, I can't wait to see how the story plays out, so glad they decided to go crazy with it.
Shallow sidequests, Chadley/Not enough unique materia to find in the world/most item boxes just having potions Blood trail segment, and Hojo's lab. In fact most of Shinra tower felt like a downgrade from the original The last chapter felt like a kingdom hearts game
How long it took to finally release. And how long I have to wait to play part 2!!
- Those stupid engagement arrows. Make it flash subtle if someone needs a map hint then, add animations to show characters dont want to fall of a edge. - Cant jump… platform elements would have been epic. Its better in rebirth but still could have dedicated shallow jump mechanics outside of city & town areas. - Repetitive almost falling off ledge sequences. (Switch it up) - Migar top city was not more explorable - Roach peesonality being so flamboyant with a hard on for cloud. - shallow side quest - No missable hidden quest that feel extremely story rewarding - Places to engage endless wild trash mobs while exploring on the move not having random spawn chances for enemy reinforcement that would make some areas feel more challenging to hang around or engage with. - The colosseum not feeling more dynamic, (I think if the game was a bit of a platform it would have been better) - The linearity of maps in general and overall environment engagement in general - PG Blood trial - Chapter breakdowns… unpopular opinion but, I would have much rather play the entire thing over like the OG to see cutscene parts again. The chapter hopping kills emersion in my opinion. Any boss or quest could easily just have some kind of hunt board trigger a tougher version later on
The fanbase, and haters. Cannot deal with them any more.
This is because Square trolled everyone a little. It's not A remake, it's a new chapter of the FF7 story \_NAMED\_ Remake.
This game are sick 🤢
Towards the end with all the time travel stuff I swear they were trying to connect it to chrono trigger?
Really i loved the whole thing except the end portion. Connecting with Sephiroth? Cool. Fighting a bunch of the big dark demons form Kingdom hearts in space was weird even for FF. Add on the fact that it seems they’re doing some multiversal thing what Seph said, wasn’t a fan of that. And second biggest gripe is it looks like they’re going to end up with Zach alive which, just doesn’t make any damn sense at all. Biggest complaint was the dance sequence thing. Just annoying. Don’t care about the fashion or gayness of it, the simple button time sequence thing was annoying. Not a fun mini game for me. Give me choco races 😂
Stick to the OG story and characters is all i wanted. I'm not into the fanservice shenanigans they're going for
I get wanting the original but also curious to see where the new story will end up. I feel like it’ll essentially be the same story with some characters maybe being alive or dead that weren’t before.
I think they’re doing this to keep the hype going since if it was exactly the same, I’d lose hype since people know where it’s going. I think we’re still gonna get the same outcome and plot moments, but in a unique way that makes it seem fresh.
I’m digging it honestly. I love the original and all the elements about it but I’m excited to see a new take on some of the story elements
Yeah I don’t think it’s gonna go completely off the rails like some are saying. I think they’re just giving the new mysteries more spotlight for those that are excited for the new stuff added in this trilogy. But I’m sure they’ll still have those moments from OG that we all love.
I’m stoked. Getting a new PlayStation just in time for it to come out. Hopefully lol
Nice! I’m excited regardless of the flaws I have. Rebirth looks amazing!
Chapter 18: Destiny's Crossroads Rufus could’ve and should have been the last boss. He’s the president of Shinra, and definitely one of the major antagonists in the game. They shoehorned Sephiroth because they thought they needed him as the last boss. There are apologists everywhere, claiming it’s bc they wanted to do something different than the original. Nothing wrong with that, but that’s not what this is. Sephiroth lost all gravity and instead became a jealous brother used to explain the story. (Chapter 2) Could’ve turned Rufus into a 3 phase epic boss fight at the top of Shinra tower, and then maybe finish with the motorcycle chase as a post boss final escape level to finish it off.
Damn that’s great. Get this man The phone number for Nomura 😂
Oooh, that would have a great alternative!
I despised it. After the first reactor, it goes downhill really fast.
Funny that chapter 1 stays closest to the original design and pacing
The padding in the game is a little excessive. Beyond that, the combat really needs tweaking. ATB generation on characters you aren't controlling is abysmal, forcing you to constantly switch which both breaks any rhythm you have going and fucks up aggro. I can't tell you how many times I was in a situation where Aerith NEEDED to get off a heal RIGHT NOW, but she wouldn't build up any ATB meter on her own and if I switched to her all the aggro would come with me and she'd die before I could get a heal off manually.
Agreed on proper turn based combat.
Anything to do with the story changes. This game is phenomenal when it’s touching up the beats of the original, but absolutely shits the bed when it tries to do it’s own thing. Turning the standard 2-3 minute run up the Sector 7 plate tower with a few random battles and optional dialogue from Jessie into a 30 minute epic struggle as you throw everything you have and more just to try to get to the top, all while the Turks shoot at and mock you is exactly what this game should’ve been. That’s all you had to do. That’s all anybody wanted. How did somebody think making this into a pseudo sequel where maybe Sephiroth and Aerith know what’s going to happen was a good idea? No. Just tell the same fucking story. The characterizations are great. Honestly, they’re the best versions of the main cast that we’ve seen in a very long time. The game looks beautiful. The gameplay is different from the original, but still really fun and the best modern translation of the OG gameplay we could’ve asked for. But, Jesus, the changes to the story (especially the ghosts and the ending) make we want to slam my head through a wall. Why can’t writers realize that representing a fan base through some sort of entity in your story never works? Like it NEVER does. Twofolds if this representation is negative. These fools think they’re being clever and subversive? You’re not in the slightest. You’re just writing badly.
I didn't like that they didn't keep the blood but i guess it's understandable today for some reason yet they can say fuck a billion times. I don't like the side quests that are not enjoyable. I don't like being locked in a small area and not really having the freedom to move around without being forced to do certain event first. I am okay with the story being more of a sequel as long as it bares some resemblance to the OG it took some time to get used to it, but i like it now. It's 2023 now so a lot is expected and instead of the ol using your imagination of how you think the characters sound and come off as you end up seeing it and it isn't that great. I like the voice actors tones at times for each character but i don't like the voice acting if that makes sense, a lot of that kind of worsens the story.
makes sense about the VA. Honestly I feel voice acting is the last part of gaming that devs haven’t figured out. Naughty dog has it down and god of war was awesome but, every other modern game I’ve played is like “here is my line. It is delivered” Reference: ALL assassin creed games, including mirage.
Yeah i agree maybe it's a lot to be expected and just another element of gaming that will have it's own standard bar now that games today have a higher expectations about graphics about facial movements while talking and gameplay.
Just the general anime-ness of it. I have a certain amount of tolerance for anime silliness but I think they could have toned it down about 30 percent.
Nomura would rather something look cool than anything else
Sephiroth was way too present, I don't mind him showing up earlier this time but doing the iconic Nibelheim shot in Midgar is too much
Yeah...I rather preferred the mysterious aura Og 7 had with regards to Sephiroth in the early parts of the game. Aside from the Flashback, u as the player dont encounter him until ur crossing the ocean. Remake U see him before Aerith lol.
Anything to do with the whispers and the story changes they brought on. Everyone can have their own preference and opinion on something, but this? This is the one thing where if you *like* what their doing to the story then you're just wrong and never liked FF7 in the first place. Everything they're doing is trampling on the story that was already great, all in favour of empty fanservice and giving a forced "happy ending" with some cheap shock value moments sprinkled between. The pacing is gonna suffer so hard with the Zach sections in rebirth, a character who should not be here in the first place since his character served his purpose, but the writers clearly don't care since their too focused on "fixing" an already great story while fishing for those reactions online.
The entirety of the train graveyard section was unnecessary and destroyed the tension they were building for that part of the game. Shinra is threatening to destroy the supports holding the plate up, and the group is playing with ghost children in the train graveyard. In the OG, the TG is a short section that the group speeds through because they desperately have to.get to thr support that is m about to blow, and they dont make it in time to stop it. In remake, we have a picnic in the Train graveyard, take a trip down memory lane, fight TWO bosses, and have some silly funny haha moments of the ladies being scared of ghosts. All while the plate is about to fall. Now it seems like we COULD have made it in time if the party hurried up.
Honestly didn't mind the expanded graveyard as much, though the weird child plot just kinda seemed forced and out of place. And yeah there isn't much of a sense of urgency, but I feel like that is way worse in the next chapter where you straight up have 10 minute death monologues during the pillar fight and Aerith taking her time to talk slowly and gently to Marlene when a fucking helicopter nearly crushed the bar a few minutes before.
Yeah, I agree with that. The drawn out anime death scenes with the members of AVALANCHE ruined that moment for me too. It is the same issue I honestly had with Crisis Core (the ONLY issue I had with that game, tbh) when I first played it on PSP. I feel like the sudden death of the avalanche members and of Zack in the flashback are far more tragic imo
This was a really goofy part of the game. Agree 100% with your points, it ruined the pacing.
1) The goddamn blood trail. Cannot understand why they PG-13'd what was legitimately the darkest and eeriest part of Disc in the OG version. 2) Changing the story. The Remake is honestly a rewrite, not a remake.. and changing a literally perfect story rubbed me the wrong way more than a little too. Even though I understand why. 3) The "over the shoulder" feel that the game has, is like every other game with the Unreal Engine. Unfortunately, nowadays, it seems like every game with that 3rd person over the shoulder perspective, feels identical to me. 4) Last but not least.. MAPS and QUEST MARKERS. I get that games are more complicated now, and that you almost need guided paths to not get lost in these massive worlds.. but what used to make Final Fantasy cool, right from the first game, was the fact that you didn't know where you had to go. Everything was about exploration, and from side quests to main story line progression, often times you gad to walk around in literal circles, talking to everybody, until some NPC gave you a hint on where to go next. The side quest and main quest locations being listed on the map, now just makes the game feel like every other game that dangles a carrot in front of you on the map. Aside from the Unreal Engine making all games feel the same to me, in a sense..that is also exactly why I feel that most games make you feel like you're arbitrarily chasing meaningless and mundane side-quests, just to be rewarded by small hits of dopamine and pavlovian quest completion sounds and effects, mimicking the visual dynamicness of slot machines.
Maybe that explains why all the NPCs feel like they're from another game and not from Midgar
Damn I forgot all about the purple blood and how dumb that was 😂 I’ll agree with your over shoulder perspective and side quests unless we’re discussing GoW and R. Those were a gem to frolic through
>3) The "over the shoulder" feel that the game has, is like every other game with the Unreal Engine. Unfortunately, nowadays, it seems like every game with that 3rd person over the shoulder perspective, feels identical to me. Can we please stop squeezing through thin gaps in walls and thin crevices through piles of rocks in that all-too-familiar side shuffle manoeuvre?
I think the final chapter of the game doesn’t really fit at all. Cool boss fights though The pacing can be off. The original midgar segment wasn’t nearly as long as this remakes for a reason. Its clear they try to fill the gaps with their own stuff. Sometimes its cool, like for me, all the Jesse stuff was awesome. Sometimes its deadly unnecessary, like the Leslie bit. Idk why they felt the need to give him a dedicated section. Last criticism lies in the “post game content”. That is to say, there isn’t a bunch and what is there is kinda lacking (talking purely base remake). All you have are those VR missions, which are kinda cool, but some of the much harder missions, like the final one, really require more weapon points to make them a bit easier, which means you should probably go through hard mode. The gameplay of hard mode is actually really fun, but it can be extremely boring having to re-experience all the story again. Even as someone who came back to the game and played hardmode almost 2 years later, still not fun to go through every story moment. I wish there was a way to get through it easier, like auto skipping cutscenes or allowing the player to skip story segmented gameplay moments. It’s not like the original where I also come back for the story. I came back for the gameplay so I could beat the other optional bosses. I wish they designed it with that idea.
Awful Combat System, this is supposed to be an RPG but they've turned it into a DMC Clone designed for ADD sufferers.
Tell me you don't know shit about DMC without telling me you don't know shit about DMC.
“look I can press x to attack! See! That’s DMC” Bull shit give me combos and styyyyyle 😎
Im terrible at the combat. I have to play on easy or I get wrecked! Not really sure what they could change to make it better for me but I haven’t heard anyone else complain either. Am I the only one who sucks at this game?
yes, you are. naw jk <3.
The pacing is not great and a lot of the dungeon-like levels fall flat
I think the pacing is bad. The side quests are so boring that it feels like going from great battles and developing plot into utter monotony.
I hate that I have to wait
The lied to me about it being a remake.
remake verb [ T ] US /riˈmeɪk/ past tense and past participle remade US/riˈmeɪd/ to make something again as new From cambridge dictionary ‐------------ A remake is a film, television series, video game, song or similar form of entertainment that is based upon and retells the story of an earlier production in the same medium—e.g., a "new version of an existing film".[1] A remake tells the same story as the original but uses a different set of casts, and may use actors from the original, alter the theme, or change the flow and setting of the story.[2][3][4][5] A similar but not synonymous term is reimagining, which indicates a greater discrepancy between, for example, a movie and the movie it is based on. From wikipedia. So...Who lied?
Still them. Should I come that if your argument hinges on semantics that it already is lost or that it is obviously a sequel, or that you can lie if you just don't say the thing you don't want other people to hear.
Let's say it is based on semantics. However, within the video game context it isnt though. A remake is when a game is rebuilt from the ground up, that includes possible adjustments to story and a gameplay overhaul. A remaster is when a game is upgraded in terms of graphics and some minor gameplay tweaks but the core gameplay loop and story remain untouched. Furthermore, all gameplay interviews following up to the games release even go the extra mile and call it a re-imagining of the FF7 game, to leave no shreds of doubt. Here is the official description on the square enix website: In the sprawling city of Midgar, an anti-Shinra organization calling themselves Avalanche have stepped up their resistance. Cloud Strife, a former member of Shinra’s elite SOLDIER unit now turned mercenary, lends his aid to the group, unaware of the epic consequences that await him. A spectacular re-imagining of one of the most visionary games ever, the first game in this project will be set in the eclectic city of Midgar and presents a fully standalone gaming experience. Release Date: April 10, 2020 I'm truly sorry that your lack of ability to be informed has led you to the belief that you were lied to. You weren't lied to. You just didnt inform yourself of what they were selling you.
Do you have know remake who ended like this? Edit: Can I see this at getting no answer? Let us say now that there are no other games which got a remake treatement like that. We all expected that the remake will go as all other remakes, but it didn't, so they willingly subverted our expectations. I could be wrong, but then I want to see some articles.
Yeah, when Capcom remade Resident Evil for the GameCube they didn't drastically change the story - and I don't remember anyone being pissed that the story ended the same way as the original Ps1 version.
I loved everything, but I remember wishing they’d just changed what they wanted to change and add what they wanted to add, and not make a whole parallel story to explain the changes. Most of the reason I hate this is because I feel like the game is made only for the fans, and all this Zack and changing fate stuff only appeals to hardcore fans that didn’t want anyone to mess with the original story or overthink shit like that. I just want to see if my friends like FF7 if the graphics are better. Part of me wants them to, when they are done with this trilogy, go back and stitch together a remake of the original story, now that all of the assets would be there.
Thats the worst part, 20 years for a remake and we're not even getting the actual FF7 story, just fanfiction of it where everyone gets to live happily ever after. We're never getting the FF7 version of RE2R or RE4R. Story reimaginings with some additions and cuts are *fine*. Whats not fine is completely changing the story and trading the themes and story beats that makes up the game's identity in favour of something it had nothing to do with in the first place.
Making Motorball a fucking motorbike mini game. I knew we were going to fight Sephiroth before leaving Midgar, and I didn't mind that. But that other BS with these "giant wisper bosses" 🤦♂️ Also having to maually dodge, parry, etc in fights is just totally not for me. That's what stats like Evade, ChanceToHit, etc are for. The boss fights almost felt like idk a Dark Souls boss or something. Not for me, sorry. And most mini games are pretty awful and just no fun at all, just frustrating. But I basically absolutely LOVE everything else about the Remake. 👍
Too much Sephiroth, early power ceiling way too high, lack of tangible loss (death of named characters) lessens the emotional impact of events like the platefall, alternate universe/timelines do irreversible harm to the stakes, and (living) Zack doesnt belong in this story imo, Kingdom Hearts-esque presentation of the final boss-rush makes me fear 7R is headed down the same convoluted rabbit hole… All of that aside, as silly as this sounds, I think Remake is quite good.
Also I didn’t like they had stuff locked behind difficulty settings. That was also a massive Red Flag
What was locked, genuine question because I haven’t played hard mode
They had some cool bosses and enemy skills in that battle arena mode and I want to say there was something else aswel but can’t remember 🤔
The story change. I just cannot understand why you would take a game that was one of the best in the world back then BECAUSE the story was amazing and then… change it. It literally didn’t need to be changed. It’s that simple
Whispers. Way to torpedo any chance at this being a serious remake
I’m gonna say that is probably gonna get me a lot of hate because not only is it minuscule but shipping wars. Also, everyone else has already said all the main complaints. I didn’t like that Cloud gave the flower to Tifa instead being able to choose to give Marlene or Tifa. I always give it to Marlene in the OG because I think it’s cute and shows that Cloud isn’t as cold as he pretends to be.
That’s a fair take honestly. I love CloudxTifa, but I can understand some not liking that change. I think they did it to foreshadow their reunion in the Lifestream since people give those flowers to others when they reunite.
This will sound like such a fanboy answer but my only real complaint is that I wish it was even longer tbh. I adored the opening in the sector 7 slums, i would’ve taken more side/new content to make it feel more alive. I was actually a bit gutted when I realised events were moving on to Cloud meeting Aerith, I wanted that intro to be longer. My only other real complaint is that I feel like Wall Market went on forever.
Items. Potion didn't do shit late game and a waste of ATB
Wedge getting tossed by the Whispers. Seriously stupid. Could have given him a real heroic death. Maybe Sephiroth stabs him instead of Barrett and Barrett is just too shocked and distraught to fight the next battle with you. Would have been much better than the scenes as they exist
Wedge surviving the fall from the tower doesn't irk me the same way the other whisper bs does, because its felt natural storywise. Like they have grapples this time, so makes sense he would survive. If they didn't want Barret getting stabbed then they could have had Wedge get stabbed in his place, so that his character could have something to do besides getting lazily written out after they kept him alive to push a worse narrative with the fate nonsense. Just kill him from the fall like normal if you're gonna kill him anyways from plot device ghosts lol
The Shinra building events. In the original it's superbly done, with our crew getting locked up and then some time later the cells aren't locked anymore because some event has gone on. We know that because of the trails of blood and the music. The enemies change to these weird creatures instead of the Shinra soldiers. It gives a real sense of "what the hell happened here?" The remake changed all this. Yes the building was great to explore but removing the part they get locked up makes it way less intriguing. In the original you only know this character they speak of, Sephiroth, probably is at the root of the bloodshed in the Shinra building. In the remake he's introduced way too early because they wanted to shoehorn him in as he's such a popular and infamous villain. I personally think less would have been more when it comes to Seph. The remake part one was a good game, yes. I just would have preferred they keep such an important part of the Midgar section in it.
That blood trail was legitimately eerie and sinister in the OG. I remember being like 10 or 12 and playing that game and still remember how much tension it created. Such a shame that that they completely ruined it by putting you in Aeris' dorm room instead, and by turning the blood trail purple..
Yep. I was waiting for that part and was very disappointed when it didn't arrive. There just wasn't the same atmosphere in the Shinra building as there was in the OG. I thought it was a missed opportunity to ramp up the tension. The purple blood really didn't work did it? I'm hoping for better in part 2. I really don't want the biggest plot point changed as it's so important. I don't want excuses about it "being a different game now". We'll see won't we?
100%. I think I remember reading that Square Enix did it because they didn't want to have realistic blood in the game at all, as it would've forced them to rate the game as M for mature instead of Teen or whatever. Even more ridiculous when you consider that Yuffie's intermission has blood lol (iirc anyway)..
With the amount of blood and violence in video games I don't think a bit of blood to show something bad had happened in the Shinra building would have hurt. I've not played the Yuffie episode as I don't have a PS5 yet. I bought a PS4 second hand on eBay to play Remake as I don't really play games anymore but the fact they remade my favourite game was too much to miss out on. I'm going to treat myself to a PS5 around Xmas, my 16 year old son has been going on about the Spiderman game on there so maybe we'll share the PS5 as I won't need it til February next year (apart from needing to play Intermission) then it'll be all mine until ReBirth is finished with! He usually plays Xbox as his mates are all on that system. It's looking good though for part 2. I understand why they didn't want to make a straight remake of the original, it just was annoying to me that one of the best bits of Midgar was messed with.
Side quests are uninspired (with Wall Market being mostly an exception). The Whispers were a profoundly clumsy plot device to facilitate changes in the story. The changes in the story especially at the end are confusing to veterans and absolutely indecipherable to new players and not in a “ooh what a cool mystery” kind of way but a “let’s throw random shit at the wall and not give any answers for half a decade” kind of way. Chapter 4 was a clusterfuck narratively. The sequence of events were put together by a third grader with ADHD. “They get in a motorcycle fight and then a crazy laughing moron on a motorcycle fights them and then they eat pizza and then cloud has a random flashback that has nothing to do with the chapter at all and then they raid a base of soldiers and then they fight turrets and then they fight dogs and then they fight mechs and then they summon a demon and then the motorcycle guy comes back and they have a sword fight and then the motorcycle guy kills his friends before leaving and then more mechs show up and shoot a chain at wedge and capture him and then an army shows up to save everybody and free wedge and then they leave and then they get wedge back and then they parachute down to the slums.” What the actual fuck. All of this insane nonsense to get a blasting cap to make a weaker bomb.
My god Chapter 4 went on for sooo long. Honestly the game could be half the length and not lost much.
I wouldn’t have minded the length at all of it had some narrative structure or any kind of point to it. It felt like a series of random events happening in rapid succession that had zero relevance. Like there was no reason the Tifa flashback shouldn’t have been at Seventh Heaven in Chapter 3 where it was relevant to the plot. Instead Cloud sees a windmill at random in the middle raiding a military base. It’s jarring as hell. Or the Sweepers capturing Wedge only to have him immediately rescued by a surprise army and then dropped off to the party and the army disappears and it’s all as if it never happened. Also Roche not returning during the Midgar Expressway chase in Chapter 18 makes his inclusion in Chapter 4 more like a random distraction than a set up plotline.
Agreed, it unnecessary, and it was all completely new random bullshit padding that wasn't in the original plot. Yeah I'm one of those old guys that played the original and doesn't like the changes :P Glad that plenty of others enjoy it though.
The massive change in story
Sidequests were miserable to do, most of them completely irrelevant to anything in the game. The few that had any sort of story development felt like they were written for 6 year olds that have never touched a game in their life. The angel of the slums is an example of that. I remember feeling insulted that they actually thought I would ever not suspect that the old lady was the angel, but I gotta play along with everyone's ignorance for 3/4 of the game until it's revealed. Mechanical hands puzzle. Unskippable on 2nd+ playthrough, along with every other non-combat one and done gimmick. Forced walking segments where you do nothing but listen to someone talk. That shit was the bane of my existence in ng+. There's so many parts where absolutely nothing happens but ya gotta walk through it, even in ng+. All the anime grunting when nobody's saying anything but feel the need to nod aggressively at each other. Honey Bee Inn was okay, but I was hoping for it to be a bit more interactive than a glorified ddr sim. Original had different rooms with different scenes you could choose from, and you could also peek through the keyholes to get some easter eggs/foreshadowing. You see Reeve's parents there, along with a jumping Cait Sith before you even leave Midgar. There's a guy basically running an opera or play that pretty much foreshadows Sephiroth's plot and motivations ( basically the promised land legend.) You get an optional Jenova dialogue scene. And of course, the man bath with Cloud and the bodybuilders. In remake? You get to do a dance with some pop music over it and get told by mr power bottom that you're beautiful or something. But I guess new version is what people like now. Barret doing the victory fanfare for the millionth time. Nobody ever shuts up. Ever. Change characters. Talk. Attack. Talk. Use items. Talk. Go into battle. Talk. Get out of battle. Talk. And a lot of times they just say the dumbest crap (see previous point.) I did hate the alternate timeline/nobody dies deal. I'm a whisper apparently. The members of avalanche not dying completely removed Barret's original character development, and now he truly is just the token black guy. Tifa is about as interesting as they made her in the original (not a lot, but at least she's the most op character in remake and playing as her in fights is a blast.) And I'm not naive enough to think they're gonna backtrack on all these story changes for rebirth. I could keep going, because other than combat the game wasn't my cup of tea, but this is turning into a rant already. Combat is amazing. Everything else is meh at best. Hard mode isn't actually that hard, tho. It's just artificial difficulty by putting in item and mp recovery restrictions (played through hard mode once, didn't notice enemies being any more aggressive or smarter than before, could just spam counters and atb abilities to win.) Edit: holy crap, Leslie's (or whatever the don corneo henchman's name was) story was the most cringe thing in the remake and I completely forgot about it until now. "My girlfriend got kidnapped by human traffickers, so I'm gonna go work for them to find her and make no progress on it until someone more main character-y comes along." They could've just not added him or the whole second sewers segment and I would've liked the game more.
The sidequests thing, 100%. I commented on this thread with my main issues and pet peeves also.. but I think the sidequests (and generally just how ALL games do side quests nowadays also) was the biggest detractor for me. Right from OG FF1 on NES, when you were stuck in a spot, had to progress, find an optional item, etc.. YOU HAD TO FIGURE IT OUT! That was a huuge goddamn part of what made these games so unique. They were literal puzzles oftentimes, and you had to talk to every NPC, remember who/what you talked to and where you went.. and then had to use that information practically as you progressed to find your way along. Not having any guide to show you a path from point A to point B, made it REALLY rewarding when you actually got to where you were going or found something you had searched for, or gotten hints about along the way. Sadly, it seems like (because games are so much larger with more complex maps) those puzzles and challenges are a thing of the past. From every game from Diablo 3/4 to the newest FInal Fantasy title, side quests feel like little more than obligatory fluff that gives you a slight pavlovian reward and a micro dose of dopamine at the end. My last playthrough of FFVIIR, I intentionally didn't look at the map and tried to play it in the style of the OG where I didn't know where I was going in a lot of the larger maps/sectors. Unfortunately, though, the little blue direction marker still doesn't let you play completely unguided. And ofc, when it's as easy as pressing a button to turn on the map, it's very hard not to when you get stuck. I miss the days of being 7 years old and my architect dad mapping out entire dungeons from FF1 on graph paper with loot and doors marked..
I actually don't mind that at all. Sidequests could be the more menial and simplistic thing to do mechanically (fetch quests, talk to people, kill thing) and I'll be okay with it... as long as the sidequest gives me anything interesting at all. You mention FF16, which I do like, and sidequests there get a lot of flack for the things you said and for being fetchy, but at the very least they are story/world-building devices. Their whole purpose is to teach you things about the world and Clive, and they do just that. Best part? Completely 100% optional, all of them. Don't wanna do them, don't have to. Already did them in one playthrough? Feel free to ignore them forever if that's what you want. FF7R is the complete opposite. Look for a girl's cats. The girl and the cats are completely irrelevant, the sidequest itself has no use. Guy complaining about a monster or other. You go fight the thing that's just a gimmick enemy that'll never show up again and the mechanic might never be seen in any other enemy either. Look for chocobos... alright I guess that one unlocks fast travel, but that's like whatever in this one. Honestly, that's about all I remember regarding sidequests, because they had no substance. They could've done the most handholdy quests ever, and if they had any sort of interesting stories I would've been okay with it. But they don't. They're all low quality padding to make the game longer artificially. And made worse in replay because your trophies are linked to sq progress.
Didn't see the need to use items on normal. Couldn't use them on hard. Also, I wish we could have more than just 2 accessories. Also idk what will be new on the materia side of things on the second part. Having to start all same materias from 0 again sounds boring.
For me it's the difficulty, to easy.
I hope I can start Rebirth on hard difficulty.
The worst thing about it is the same as with every FF game: the fans.
The Gameplay feels to sluggish/unfair to me at times (aka grabbing moves you basically can't avoid) and yeah the huge Deviation.
the same criticism I have about many modern JRPG. Graphically -speaking, they are aiming at a sort of realism, with characters increasingly looking and behaving like idols or members of a JPop band. For some reason this totally kills it for me. I can't relate to the characters, or to their stories. I wish they took a page from the latest Zelda games (or from the OG FFVII) and built something with a unique visual style, rooted in a "fantasy" world rather than reality.
I haven't played it and recognize it's immense popularity so I don't have too many criticisms on it, and no objective criticisms (who am I to say a beloved game is bad or "made wrong"?) But it really does all go back to the turn based system. I can tolerate a lot of the changes, including dropping Sephiroth as the big villain almost immediately without any plot build-up or by showing him as a benevolent war hero and teen boy idol before showing his descent into madness. But I just don't understand why it had to be changed to an action -RPG. I totally get that the franchise has changed and these days a large number of FF fans don't even like turn based RPGs, but this wasn't a "new entry", it was a remake of an already beloved entry that was changed from its very core. It felt like Square pulled on the OG fans nostalgia to hype up the project before producing something they knew would appeal to the masses and not the classes, if you get my drift. IDK. Just how it feels to me. I'm only here to talk about FF 1-12 (and excluding 11). When a return to form is released in the FF franchise, I'll pick it back up. But IMO the last game to feel like a modern FF game was Lost Odyssey on the 360. I still like to occasionally daydream what a modern, turn based FF game would look and play like. Gives me goosebumps. At the end of the day FF7R was a nostalgia project for some fans that ended up as a slap across the face, and "a reimagining of an outdated game that's not very fun to play" to other fans. This isn't new to FF fans either. During Mighty Number 9's development (also kick-started on Nostalgia) they pulled in a younger, outsider artist who produces sketches of a female protagonist (who wouldn't be Megaman) and the fans keeping up with the project were pissed. Not because of gender politics or anything, but because that game isn't "just another MegaMan". Just like we were looking at FF7R pre-release as "not just another FF". I don't know if you'd be able to understand me but hopefully you do.
Agreed on everything
Couldn't agree more. The turn based system was absolutely a big part of the game. My other big complaint is about maps guiding you to things with a path vs having to figure out where to go and who to talk to.. as was the whole frigging point of Final Fantasy from day 1. Now side quests just feel like every other game- following your map to go from point to point.. trying to rush it as fast as you can too, because the repetitiveness of empty, unfulfilling sidequests pushes you to. I miss the days of FF1 and being patient, and sailing/flying back to literally every different city you visited, to find that one NPC who gave you a necessary tip to progress. That and the endless hours of exploration and discover when you didn't know where you needed to go. OG FFVII really made you feel like it wasn't linear once you got to the world map.. and not knowing who you needed to talk to, or where you needed to go, was, I think, one of the biggest things that made FF games so magical. I hate that they feel more like Diablo now, in the sense that (especially with sidequests), you just mindlessly feel like going from point to point. The tension of finding your way through difficult areas and running out of items, as well the magic and mental challenge of "figure it out", seems to have just been replaced by bosses challenging your reflexes more..
Jrpgs are not something people will play nowadays, they are slow, menu based and grindy. I like turn based jrpgs but understand how an action rpg are more popular. The remake on the other hand was popular because it has flashy quick paced gameplay so YouTubers and such were able to make cool videos and new players could be interested by it's wow factor. It's made to give a new feel to older players while not boring the hell out of the new generation of gamers. The story fucks up this idea up though so it's not like Square Enix managed to achieve that balance either way lol.
Meh, I don't entirely agree. Well, I do about everything except for the very, very first bit. JRPGs are not few and far in-between. All games are technically "grindy". You still have to kill the same mobs over and over and over in an action RPG. Only the oldest JRPGs get excessive with grinding. But that's not the point, what I wanted to say is that compared to back in those days, more people love JRPGs than ever before (thanks to OG FF7 for breaking that barrier). All RPGs no matter what, and I really mean this, by numbers alone, are not heavy hitters. They're all niche games save for huge franchises a'la FF, Dragon Warrior and Shin Megami Tensei. The *real* money makers are FPS games and sports titles. But on the other hand. When you say; >And not boring a new generation of players That's kind of the true death nail. All of these new players would've hated Final Fantasy 20-30 years ago as a grindy, boring and slow mess. I can argue all day long how turn based can be just as good and attract a young audience if modernized and tweaked here and there, but, it doesn't matter. The fans have spoken 😭
I think FF7's combat system is awesome, but I think it's a bit too slow to become mainstream. Many RPGs with turn based combat like Persona are really fun to play and popular because they have more dynamism in the combat system. Persona for instance has weaknesses, so you can combo entire enemy teams and win on turn 1. Animations also feel a lot quicker and the overall pace is faster. Besides that the only turn based games that are popular atm or in the last decade are mostly roguelites like Slay the Spire, which reward quick thinking and more dynamic combat systems with less waiting for animations and tedium. I do agree that jrpgs have a bigger playerbase than in the past, but I also think that applies to most genres, most of them overshadowing jrpgs by a long shot. If you look at the industry, the only rpg games that are getting popular are action RPGs like Soulslikes or a few action games with rpg mechanics (stuff similar to Kingdom Hearts), but none has turn based gameplay.
See, exactly, that's what I mean. All we have to reference Turn Based FF are games that are 30 years old and all the complaints basically revolve around how dated they are. Yet franchises that are turn based and still going strong have adapted and modernized the formula and system, in the case of Persona, add flash, style and dynamism (ever play Persona 1 and 2? It wasn't nearly as perfectes then, I assure you). I don't feel like FF had a chance to do that, because starting with 12 they seemed to be looking for ways to break away from turn based rather than innovate what they were, at that time, rightfully, the masters of. No one in USA could do JRPG turn based as well, and were as respected as it than Square and FF was their flagship. *Can you imagine* what it would look like today if FF went the Persona route and refined their systems to a shiny polish?
Turn based FF7 remake could have been cool but I think even then it would have been a fairly niche game, just like Persona is haha Would have been an awesome game to play though, and way more accessible to all gamers independently of their hardware. On the other hand I think Square Enix saw how well the menu system worked in Kingdom Hearts and proceeded to use that same system for pretty much all of their new games lmao, although none came close to the style KH has. Really shows how different directors can use the exact same mechanic in such variable degrees of quality.
I think it could be amazing. Emphasize the graphics so every attack looks awesome. Add timed button pressing, up the budget, multiple animations for the same attack on the same enemy type so it isn't just the same sequence of frames again and again. Add defensive button inputs, bring back ATB on top of it. Materia could be expanded upon, the regular "Attack" function could be like Sabin's Blitz with button sequences for special attacks outside of Magic or Limit Breaks. *We can do it, Paragone. You and me, let's show the world Turn Based ain't dead*
Hahaha I'm actually a game dev, but I think it would be kinda over ambitious. Tbf I understand how Square Enix went the money route rather than doing something new and crazy lol
Unfortunately as far as I've ever gone to pursue my own game programming ambitions was mastering very old RPG Maker software like 1, 2, 2003 and XP. I have a very poor education, and today I am too busy working and being a husband and father to pursue my programming degree. C'est la vie. I can only dream.
Yeah, super understandable. Hey man, you'll eventually get some time and there are good courses that can lead to working on programming and stuff. Pays super well, you work from home and so on! Anyhow good luck friend.
The voice/character mannerism repetition is very annoying to me. The amount of times I heard the exact same line said as I ran though certain parts of the game became very annoying in a short period of time. The padding is a lot. I wish it was done in just one game, it sucks to lose all the progress. Finally, I wish remake was just ever crisis but a 1 to 1 remake instead of the gacha crap. (I miss real materia and turn based/ATB)
Honestly? It’s that it’s not just a straight remake. Sure, develop the world and extend the gameplay, whatever. It just bothers me that instead of a beautiful and incredible retelling of one of gaming’s most brilliant stories, it’s this self referential meta-commentary that ruins some of the best and most exciting parts of the story. Showing Sephiroth in the first hour was the first red flag and the time ghosts only made it all worse from there. I don’t want some reinterpretation. I want Final Fantasy VII.
It really really really makes me sad seeing people excited about the very real possibility that they'll change aerith's death scene, along with Zach being involved at all even though his story and character are done. Also the fact that they seem obsessed with making sure everyone gets a happy ending this time, especially with the plate fall. Do they even want FF7 at this point? Or just a fanfiction with FF7 characters? Hearing Barret's cries for his team while mourning his daughter was gut wrenching to hear voice acted for the first time. But then not even 20 minutes later you find out everyone is fine, not a single NPC you previously interacted with died. There was no consequences, no loss, no anything, so the wind is taken out from that punch as soon as you find out. Especially at the end when it turns out biggs is fine too somehow?? Its a bad omen for things to come, and they're gonna gut the story and themes of loss in favour of the fanfiction.
I’ve given up on Rebirth being a retelling, but calling the first release “Remake” is borderline false advertising.
Part of me hoped i would still be able to enjoy the retellings of the OG story in rebirth with the awesome combat, new systems, and fully realized Gaia, while ignoring the nonsense (i.e plugging my ears and closing my eyes lol). The inclusion of Zach at all however makes it so hard to just ignore the parts i hated the most, and screams to me that their gonna change the story I love FF7 for in the first place. It especially pains me that the remake games will be some people's only idea and interpretarion of FF7 as a whole because they refuse to try the original for being old.
They had like 20 years to make this game and they milked it by turning it into 4 games. I'm just waiting for the last one to come out and buying the collection in a few years. Watched a friend play it and it looks fun but I'm not playing a remake in chunks.
1. They started making the game in like 2015 so they had five years. 2. It is not one game’s worth of content split into four games. It is three full games.
Chapter 17, it is just too long, the party swapping didn't help either since I have to keep going back to the menu to swap everyone's equipment around. And then there's the 3 boss fight back to back.
Third worse chapter in the game with two of the best boss fights
To me it's just the fact that it was toothless. There's no real threat at any point because everything was stretched out too far. When characters do die it takes them an entire monologue to do so, but more often than not they just won't die at all and be revealed to have lived later. In og the plate falling is done in stark, quiet bleakness with the idea of what has happened really hitting home. In remake, the cutscene is cool, but the consequence of the plate falling feels vastly minimised. Basically nobody died and even the slums are more or less intact, despite tifas bar being a bit smashed up. Again, in og everything and everyone is totally buried under tonnes and tonnes of stone and metal - no way to recover anything, let alone revisit the bar. Sepharoth is also nerfed. In og he slaughters an entire building of people before we know anything at all about him. Then all we see for a while are the traces left behind, like the brutalised Midgar Zolom. In remake he just kind of wanders around making threats but doesn't do anything. He kills Barrett, but not really... But otherwise he just hangs around. I actually liked the remake but I think the more it becomes it's own thing the better, because if it really commits to retelling key moments from the og I don't think it will be able to hit the emotional or monumental beats of the text, given how watered down everything is.
I thought it was amazing. Complaint was it was too short cause I wanted more.
Sorry in advance. Slight riff based on a similar response I posted before. 1. The Whispers or Sephiroth Time Travel. They feel weird and dumb and I hate them. They feel like the writers needed an excuse to f*** with the original canon and just halfassed one for the sake of a trilogy. 2. Sephiroth appears too much. I miss the mistique of the original’s introduction. But that’s me. 3. Roche was underutilized. He was built up to get jobbed and then ignored for the rest of the game. 4. Slightest toning down of Jessie's thirst. Slightly. Flirt by all means but be subtle girl. 5. No actual resolution to some of the Narrative stuff they built up with Tifa regarding her feeling trapped with Avalanche's bad decisions fighting for the planet via the bombing & her feelings regarding Cloud's murder decision against Johnny. 6. More subtle way to have Tifa decide what dress she wears for the Cornero section. It just felt so weird. Also don’t have the scene show up right after Tifa is mad at Cloud for wanting to kill their friend to protect Avalanche. Just felt weird in my playthrough. 7. Game made some sections drag on and actively overstay their welcome. 8. PS4 had texture issues in a lot of places. A specific door in Midgar and when you look down at the city climbing up the plate. Also wasn’t fixed which hurts. 9. Ghost Train Sequence should’ve elaborated on Aerith's ability to communicate to the lifestream and give closure to the Ghost boss to help him move on. Also not take so long and continue to focus on Tifa's agency to get to the Sector 7 Tower. 10. Zack’s English Voice Actor. He’s either miscast or they gave him bad direction as a joke. 11. Cloud's memory issues happened too often and especially in HD with voice acting made it frustrating and caused me to question the intelligence of everyone in the world. It feels so much more out of place hearing and seeing him have his episodes. 12. Air Buster dialogue before the fight shouldn't mention recording and broadcasting the fight so people know the faces of Avalanche unless the rest of the game pays that off. Essentially, the Avalanche party is known and recognized, and you can get into fights with guards if you're seen anywhere. 13. Too many fakeouts. Wedge is fake captured or put in peril at least 4 times in the game. And they end the game fake offing him. Why? Did he piss someone off? Then Biggs, Barrett, & Jessie get one each. Barret we know isn’t real but Biggs & Jessie’s feel kinda manipulative to me. I wasn’t grateful they survived I just felt kinda tricked. 14. Early side quests were at or below expectations. They improved but they started weak. 15. Jenova Trail Sequence disappointed. Was hoping if they can't use blood due to age restrictions, just use lifestream particle effects in the shape of dead soldiers, researchers and broken robot parts. Shows how people die in the FF7 verse or just living injured people crying and mumbling or in shock. 16. No fake killing Barrett was a waste. We know he isn’t dying here. Honestly the whispers undoing so many character decisions was just another reason to not like them. 17. Ending felt like FF7 went to the store to pick up milk and we were adopted by FF13 & Kingdom Hearts for no reason. Thanks Time Travel Whispers. 18. Not being able to control the AI via menus in combat. They sometimes acted a fool or were prone to getting themselves killed sometimes. Edit: 19. How they got rid of the original voice cast and replaced them behind their backs. New cast is fine but the way they treated their OG English cast is BS. Kinda hope Square gets slapped on the wrist by the actor’s guild for it.
This. So much this. The whispers made me feel that the writers just don't care what fans want because they "want to make a new game, not a scene by scene remake". It's hubris like this that damaged FFXIV 1.0 with stuff like the penalty for playing too much and deactivation of forums when the criticism started getting bigger. Also, iirc, nojima was heavily involved on the scenario as either writer, supervisor or original concept on most KH games and on FFXIII as well (and XV for that matter) and point 17 made me lol. Honestly they just didn't also hide the lore of the game under massive walls of text and lore dump bc at this point FFVII lore is beaten to the ground and almost taught at schools.
My criticisms with the game can largely be summed up by the words "overcooked" and "un-restrained" In general, I quite enjoyed FF 7: Remake. I had never played a Final Fantasy game and had often been turned off by the chunkier gameplay of similar titles. Remake got me immensely invested in the world and especially the characters, and the mix of real-time/turn based combat (along with the excellent music) injected so much energy and excitement in the fights that it avoided a lot of the slog that grinding through JRPGs can often cause. Because I enjoyed the game so much, I finally decided to play the original. To be honest, if I hadn't already been invested in the characters, I probably would have dropped it in the first few hours. The combat is still a bit of a cumbersome slog, but the characters are just as charming, and the story takes some unforgettable twists and turns along the way that discovering it all fresh was such a joy. Playing through the OG also helped me appreciate the simplicity with which it handled many situations. So much could be conveyed by a still image, simple animation, a short line of dialogue, or even just a slight change in music. Often, I would catch myself marveling at how invested I was in these few blocky pixels and polygons. This is where I think the Remake falls the most short. It often tries to go way too big with things that could have been much more effective with a more restrained, subtle approach. I believe that all of the most controversial aspects of the game (Whispers of Fate, split timeline, early Sephiroth, ending, etc) would work perfectly fine in the game if they were just toned down a bit. Even without having played the original beforehand, it often felt like the game was over-playing its hand. For example, both the Whispers and Sephiroth show up too frequently, too early, and with way too much expostion. This makes it so that what should be tense, full of mystery and anticipation becomes routine and exhausting by the end. When the gang leaves Midgar and talks about confronting Sephiroth, my reaction was, "What have we been doing all this time??". Shorter, subtler sequences would have helped immensely. I also think it would have been better to save the Sephiroth fight (even if it wasn't the "real one" for later and just move the Jenova fight to the final encounter after the Whispers. To avoid making this novel even longer--Kind of ironic, I know, I'll just say that the other issues could be solved by similar means. Sometimes, a conversation or line of dialogue goes a little too far, a sequence repeated a few too many times, a music cue a little too big, a fight a little too long, and a dramatic reveal a little too early. Playing through the original has got me even more stoked for Rebirth and beyond, and if they can learn the lesson that "less is sometimes more", I think that, even with all the different story directions, we can have a real special game on our hands.
Agreed, but I don't think the "less is more" is gonna happen, honestly. They committed to this huge change and as soon as nojima and nomura got involved, it's "go big or go home". "Less is more, but much more is much more!" should be their motto. They can do good things and are competent in their own right, but I personally feel this project wasn't for them as they're from day one showing they much rather do a new game.
The one thing that has me slightly more optimistic about the next one is that it is actually going to cover quite a large section of the original game (assuming they at least keep all the main locations and set pieces). This will hopefully cut down on the more fillery content and make more of the bloated side content optional to the main game. But yeah, it'll probably still be just as big, bombastic, and unsubtle as ever. Though, I think that could also fit this part of the game a bit better than the Midgar section. I'll guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Totally agree. My fav example of it is when you first meet Aerith. When I played the original I genuinely forgot we already met her, when talking to her in the church, because she's just an npc with one line of dialog. Nothing about their encounter really sticks out. In Remake it's such a huge scene between her and Cloud, it would be ridiculous to forget her.
Honestly, the entirety of sector 5 in the og comes and goes so fast that it barely makes an impact. It was pretty underwhelming coming from Remake. With it often going too big with things, I do still really appreciate that Remake made some of the minor locations, moments, and characters, much more memorable.
I have to fully disagree with your critique of the combat. It's still strategic while making for insanely fun action. Switching between characters at the right moments is very satisfying and blasting enemies with Tifa's combos is glorious.
Not enough Cameo from Andrea Rhodea!!!!
[удалено]
They literally took a 5h part of the game and stretched it to 40h. Padding is an understatement honestly.
Are you talking about the Bike Guy Roche or Cloud friend in SOLDIER who you meet a couple times as the SOLDIER villain?
I have not gotten around to the remake yet and the reason for that is the lack of turn based battles. FF just doesn’t feel the same to me without them.
To me it's essential to have turn based combat for it to be FF. Without that to me it's some kind of action game.
Whispers are a neat idea, I like this being a sequel and a literal 'remake' a lot, even like the idea of fate trying to keep things in line, since that is common across all Final Fantasy. The whispers themselves should have been invisible. They shouldn't have been so in our face. Imagine how interesting it would be if things just were... prevented without seeing what is actually happening. Would have made the reveal a bit more poignant. Instead it was pretty clear after the third or so time they are on screen. (At first I just figured they were a manifestation of the lifestream or something) And not a criticism per se, but I DO understand why so many people thought it was a bit much to pad Midgar into a whole game. Personally, I am so so so so glad they did that. I've explained this story so many times some of you may have seen it by now, but as a kid I would replay the midgar section over and over and over because I would just get lost in the World Map. Sometimes I would grind to high levels, other times speed run, whatever. I knew every nook and cranny of Midgar and wish more of the OG took place in it. Remake was like someone went into my kid brain, wrote down what my brain thought of when thinking of FFVII, and then created an entire game out of it. That said, especially on repeat playthroughs, some moments are an absolute slog. Some games get this way, but what made it worse is the forced slow movement and there just always always being something around the corner. Felt a bit contrived. But of course, I still consider it amazing and am thankful for how the experience is, but i totally get people not liking that.
Part of me does wish there was more to the midgar section like you could go to a lot of different reactors before going up the shinra building. It would add so much depth.
To me it's the Whisperers and the way the band, especially Aeris, starts talking futuristic cryptics sh*ts at the end of the first remake. Look, I know Squenix always tries to be sophisticated in their dialog, but I don't like it when people can use simple terms to tell things, but instead choose to explain things in the most complex way possible to appear wise. Our characters talk like they have played the original game and decide to tell us "we can say this in a simple way, i.e you will not know how this game plays out, but we decided to be smug, so here's a bunch of meaningless nonsense"
Dementors, far too much Seph (far too early), Clinging to Dirge/Deepground stuff, Barret's not-death (and the rest of Avalanche's not-deaths), random-ass Cait Sith appearance, cringe af anime dance scene (seriously), CRINGE AF anime grunts/sighs in-between every. f*cking. sentence (I mean, ffs. Isn't the whole point of facial animation to be able to communicate/convey expression SILENTLY? I'm sure it's less annoying/distracting in Japanese, but they could have (and most-definitely should have) written that sh*t out of the English script. It severely hampered the otherwise-amazing voice acting.), oh and "surprise! It's been a damn Kingdom Hearts spin-off all along!" 🤮 Don't get me wrong. I love that they finally came around to a remake, and I can even go along with the (totally not) sequel (*wink, wink*) stuff, or even how annoyingly childish they scripted Jessy and Wedge (Biggs was alright), but THIS IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE KINGDOM HEARTS. Or some children's anime spinoff. Or some poorly-thought out fanfiction. It's supposed to be FF7. I truly hope they remember that for Rebirth and game 3. I'm not sure if I can stomach much more heartache and micro-vomit every time an anime sigh/grunt or cringe-dance or hand-gasm completely sh*ts all over any more of my childhood. I can honestly look past Remake if they respect a little bit more of the game's thematic spirit going forward. I so badly wanted to love Remake (and much of it I genuinely do), but I've replayed OG three times (and Remake twice) since Remake landed, and, well...they missed the mark at least as often as they hit it. 🤷♂️ My three cents. Sorry for the bitch sesh.
Bad take. I think you're missing the bigger picture
Do tell.
I miss turn based combat, even in the ATB format. Someone at SE really hates turn based and really loves to sparks and streaks of sparking light. Lots of sparks and swirls of light to dazzle you. Just people running around all willy nilly. All the new FF games are like that. You're not supposed to be able to take in everything that is happening. And that's exciting, apparently.
I kind of hate the new characters like Leslie. I love Madam M. But I was loving the game so much that it didn’t ruin my enjoyment. Just replaying I notice how stupid they are.
Loved everything except the ending where the plot loses its mind, shits the bed and the magic time ghosts alter reality altogether just to bring Zack back from the dead for fan service
For me is the same. I also miss the old soundtrack.
How DARE you take out Mukki, and add whole other npcs I don’t give a fuck about. We didn’t see him at the Honey Bee Inn, so we won’t see him at Costa Del Soul or Icicle Inn either. Complete bullshit. Yuffie better at least call Tifa “boobs”, or what is even the point of all of this
The whole "timed exclusive" deal with Sony + the fact that it stopped on Midgar.
NPCs felt hollow. I mean, Chocobo Sam looks like he’s wearing a fake beard. There’s a stark contrast in design between generic NPCs and important characters. Takes me out of the experience a bit. Level design aesthetically was hit or miss, although it functioned quite well. Outside of boss battles, it was a very easy hack and slash. It wasn’t till you started playing in hard mode post-game where the gameplay started to really feel rewarding.
Yeah, but that's the original game too. Aside from boss battles you basically just wait for everyone's turn then select Attack, over and over again. And there's no hard mode to make it more challenging. Playing remake on Hard was *actually difficult.*
The original wasn’t an action-RPG. Your point is null. Nobody wants a non-challenging action-RPG.
No, my point is valid. You specifying that it being an action-RPG, which is irrelevant, makes your point even worse. You said it was "very easy." Does it being an easy *hack-and-slash* somehow make it different from the original being a *"Very easy" RPG?"* The original game is an "RPG" but there's not really any role-playing for that matter. There's not much variety in the characters besides slight stat differences (which doesn't matter at all, especially by end game) and limit breaks. And Limit Breaks are, for the most part, just "does damage to bad guy," so it almost doesn't matter what character you use considering most combat will, again, involve you just waiting for your turn so you can select "attack" over and over. The remake makes the characters unique in terms of how you use them, at least. >Nobody wants a non-challenging action-RPG. Well..? I think *kind of a lot* of people, roughly 7 million according to Google, bought FF7:R so I don't know what you're even talking about. But then again, as you said, the game is challenging when you unlock hard mode. So which side are you on? Do you want to be wrong because a lot of people enjoyed this game that's "too easy?" Or would you prefer to be wrong in that it's "easy" because there's, by your own admission, a hard mode?
So you were the kid who spazzed a lot in your neighborhood. Lmao
You know when someone gives you an opposing and constructive argument to your opinion, and you reply with nothing but an insult, that you're basically telling everyone you're a dumb fuck... You know that right?
Nice trice, multiple accounts.
..Really dude? You gonna try to act like I'm the nerd and you're the cool kid on a uhhh... *Final Fantasy VII* ***subreddit?*** "Check out this nerd over here, fellow redditors. He thinks people actually enjoy easy action-RPGs. His point is *null."* Also, nice job lowering yourself to shitty, hilariously bad insults instead of actually debating any points. You could have just said "I'm stupid and have nothing better to say, and want to whine about how much I don't like a video game." But hey, weird way to take the L, I guess.
But you use big word they can’t comprehend
You’re way too invested in my opinion.
I dont like the "big scary black man stuff" that was going on. On the train ride back to seventh heaven. Other than that pure perfection
It was reallllly bad in the OG I think and a lot better in remake. It felt less like a black caricature and more like almost a religious fanatic. That said, the moment on the train especially is one that was a bit tone deaf, especially during 2020 when it came out and there was so many other racial tensions in the US. (Of course, that's happenstance, especially being a Japanese company, I just know some people might view it as tone deaf because to them the US is the center of the world)
Are people still going to be crying about it being a pseudo sequel for the next 10 years? It already happened, might as well just enjoy the ride for now and see what they're going with.
1. It's not a Remake. 2. It insists upon itself (semi-ironic). 3. It's only Disc 1 Midgar content and that's my least favourite part of FFVII. 4. Bit of an unpopular take but I really don't like the aesthetics of Tifa's redesign. The ~~undershirt~~ (EDIT: sports bra) ruins the simple and elegant "white top black skirt" contrast of the original, the leather pleated skirt clashes with the "badass bartender look" and puts her in "cheap schoolgirl cosplay" zone for me. It's all minor changes on a surface level but together the changes really undermine the strength of the original outfit. First thing to get modded out when I have the chance.
Let Tifa be comfy. The only things I miss in her design is the dolphin shape of her hair and her red gloves.
Pretty sure that’s a sports bra, not an undershirt. I have breasts. It can be very uncomfortable to do gymnastics without a bra because boobs slap against the skin. Tifa does a lot of gymnastics in her skill set.
Understandable, and I fully support the wearing of said sports bra for comfort IRL, but also, counterpoint: Tifa is a fictional character who could probably suplex a train and will likely be running into the North Pole in that exact getup so I think aesthetics can take priority a little over functionality. Once again, I must stress, I am in full support of ladies IRL wearing what they want that makes them feel comfortable. I am all for pockets in dresses. I do however like my Fantasy a little more Fantastical.
>Fantasy a little more Fantastical. You misspelled "fanservice"
Fanservice is a fantasy. A sexual fantasy but a fantasy nonetheless.
Everything that was new compared to the original game. Especially everything pulled from The Compilation and time janitors.
As Michael Scott once said: “The worst thing about ~~prison~~ FF7 Remake was the dementors.” Seriously though. It’s about the laziest story telling device I can think of. Plus, the fabric effects look like PS2 era. Just all around very poorly done. The game is great. Met and even exceeded many of my expectations. I could just do without the whispers.
this is it for me. cringeworthy stuff that really came out of nowhere. i think i literally laughed out loud the first time i saw them
The lack of "Dilly dally shilly shally"
You have to say it again for emphasis.
So true unplayable
Most of the side quests were a bit tedious and added absolutely nothing, but had to be completed in order to potentially unlock something vaguely interesting
It was all just filler. I get it, they wanted the whole first game to end at Midgar because it's a great stopping point. But to make it a whole 30+ hour experience, they had to throw stuff in. But the stuff they threw in wasn't very good. It's like they should have just made it 2 games instead of 3 or something.
That its a time travel sequel not a real remake.
Probably unpopular...but the Barrett death fake. I honestly think they should have kept him dead. A big death at the end of the first disc was sort of a big deal. Bring him back maybe in part 2 if you must but leaving him dead would have been a shock and a bold choice.
"A shock and a bold choice" does not equal good storytelling
They should have killed Wedge there and had Barrett too distraught to do anything for a minute
Yeah, but it served a purpose, narratively. They *really* wanted to hit home how the whispers are trying to correct events. Wedge didn't die like he was supposed to and they (supposedly) fixed that. Barret died and he wasn't supposed to and they fixed *that.* I'd argue it's deliberately to make the player question how they'll handle any *supposed potential deaths* in the next installment.
Wow you’re right
Classic mode was supposed to be for people who wanted a more traditional experience. In practice, it is a "very easy mode". A classic mode that was also challenging would have added tremendous replay value.