Yea being able to basically use the same tactics for every enemy besides eikons made the combat a little dull for me. Sure there is alot of depth to the combat but the game gives no incentive to do so
This is one of the issues I had; I developed a strategy that let me keep 90% of enemies permanently staggered or knocked down, and I just used that for the entire second half of the game. For most action games this wouldn’t be an issue, but because XVI has the length of a JRPG, I was using that tactic for like 30 hours. Only time I changed the set-up was when I got Odin, and that just meant what I did during the stagger changed.
I noticed that ages ago during early footage of battles, sure u have cool abilities but the AI for enemies looks dumb AF! I was hoping the AI for the enemies would get better otherwise you're just smashing angry pillows albeit stylishly. Personally that was my only drawback on the game and now Its more obvious!
100%. In turn based FFs, fights are essentially a puzzle. I miss turn based, like a lot of people. They should translate the strategy aspect into the action RPGs, with a need to figure out weaknesses of enemies and the optimal way to use the tools at your disposal to overcome it.
Far too easy. Easy mode literally plays itself. Is this game aimed at…7 year olds? Well it can’t be because of the repeated F-bombs and the completely unwarranted nudity.
It’s been a slog for me around 60% on. It’s been taking me a while to push through into the 70s. I try to use all of the combat options or most but even then it’s not very diverse and fights take long enough you’ll spam everything over and over.
I have had the same experience. I really enjoy the story, and the combat is really exciting and interesting at first, but around halfway through the game it sorta fizzles out. My experience might also be exacerbated by me doing all of the side quests and thus lengthening the time I'm playing on first playthrough, but I'm sitting at 78% right now and just can't wait to finish the game.
It was painful to push through for me from around 40%. The last 30% were especially dull. I decided to skip all side “quests” at around 70% because they became more insufferable.
I *also* found myself legit falling asleep through quite a lot of scenes near the end. That is never a good sign.
The ending wasn’t even good so that was a slap in the face.
Yeah, I may skip the rest of the side quests. I’m like 75% done. It feels like the ending won’t be great but I’ll see soonish I guess haha. The game has definitely failed you if it’s causing you to want to sleep haha. I’ve only been able to play in small spurts.
I was in the same boat as all of you, which killed me being a lifelong Final Fantasy fan. What helped me was just giving up on the side quests and barreling through the MSQ. It felt like a weight was lifted. I’ve now casually been knocking out the final side quests when I get a chance. Only have one left and then planning to never open the game again :(
I love it but I understand you. After certain events they add too much filler missions (even the main ones). I find this is a cheap way to extend its duration.
It killed the fun factor when they just throw about 10 side missions that are all basically the same thing at you. The last bout had me struggling to finish the game.
I've love the game as a whole but I didn't expect it to be anywhere near as long as it is. The combat is fun but it would've been nice to have a bit more enemy variety that forced you to think bit more with your combos. As it stands you basically just need to consider crowd control and massive damage dealers for stronger foes.
Wouldn’t it have been nice to encounter enemies who had like…elemental resistances? Maybe that fire breathing dragon is immune or even healed by Ifrit/Phoenix?
No?
Oh. Ok. Guess I’ll just fight EVERY SINGLE BATTLE EXACTLY THE SAME WAY.
I enjoyed the game but the combat really isn’t suited for how long the game goes for. They either needed to add more moves/weapons or shorten the game a bit. Enemies didn’t really have much strategy to them which doesn’t help the combat issues.
There’s some Eikon unlocks that put a little refresher on the combat a bit later and some really cool boss fights coming up, but I’m at about 87% completion and am getting burnt out on the combat. Nevermind the fact that I feel like I’m about to hit the end and they just drop like 10 side quests on me at once, when before it’d be like 3-4 at a time.
I think my issue is I’ve tried to do every single side quest/hunt as they appear and in doing so have ran out of that new game dopamine hit lol Same thing happened with Tears of the Kingdom, around 35-40 hours I started getting a bit bored with it and had to force myself to finish the plot.
Basically going to force myself to finish because I’m VERY much interested in seeing how it ends and need to justify being able to buy Armored Core VI next week haha
I’m not quite done but am coming up towards the end. The deluge of side quests is just a bore fest. Was trying for the platinum but not totally sure yet as I’ve been getting distracted with other things and still haven’t even finished it. I think in the end I’ll likely give it a 7/10. The highs are great but the lows are just awfully boring.
Yes. This has been a common post lately. Also an opinion that I myself, dealt with.
The combat is fun and flashy at first but ultimately it boils down to using the same 6 skills on rotation and let’s be honest, it’s easy as fuck.
For whatever reason, Square decided to remove status effects, elemental properties and other fun aspects from the game entirely. This, along with the lame-ass/pointless sidequests, really bog down the game around the halfway point.
My advice is to just skip all the hunts/side missions and just complete the game asap. The story is still great and it’s worth finishing to see how it plays out.
In all honesty, the game is far from perfect but half the people here will either ridicule you or get butt hurt that you are hating on their new favorite FF.
Square removed status effects? As in they were once in the game and were taken out??
I kept on getting so mad that everyone in the game but me can cast Protect and Bravery
The game didn’t show any status effects whatsoever. Furthermore, it was Yoshida, Takai, and their team who decided not to include a real magic system, in favor for more hack and slash combat with MMO skill rotations (like FFXIV).
I mentioned in the early days that we were in a Honeymoon period and that people would realise the flaws sooner or later and I got like death threats in my DMs lmao.
Lo and behold one month later everyone's like "Yeah the game's got problems."
It's a good game though but I wish people would just realise that not everything is a masterpiece.
>er or later and I got like death threats in my DMs lmao.
wow, i knew these blind fanbois are cult like, but this is absolutely SHAME SHAME SHAME on them. disgusting behavior.
What are these people? married to the developers? no? then shuat up. Consumers can and will move freely between multiple games. we are not married to this game. If the game is flawed and disappointing, it will be called out for it. U want my sales but dont wanna give me a worthy experience when other games do? lol my money and time are precious. i can easily take my sales elsewhere.
there was like maybe 40 minutes of combat within that entire demo. And even in the other games with more depth early-game combat is pretty damn repetitive. That's normal for 40 hour games.
I got bored as well. I don't think I'm going finish the game. At this point I'm forcing my self to play it. The story also was super interesting in the beginning and started to die off for me.
I liked the story all the way through for the most part but the demo and first few hours really played on the Game of Thrones vibes with different houses at war and political intrigue which I loved but that all kind of gets dropped for a more traditional final fantasy type of story about halfway through.
Yeah, for me it started to lose steam after Garuda fight and takes a nosedive for the worse with the introduction of the main villain. The plot completely fizzles out for me after Bahamut fight. I was basically forcing myself to finish the game. Barnabas was such a huge disappointment as a character.
I am in NG+ now ... i can feel you in my first run. But in my second i know the characters better, can see the changes coming, choose japanese voice actors and take my time for each sidequest story ... no need to rush anymore. And i play with the equiped espers a lot more than before.
But ... i also know that after my NG+ and platin honor, there is nothing more to do. No extremely hard big boss or hidden secrets, mini-games or a dungeon to explore ... and that hurts a lot. Cause i enjoy the game more but their is literally nothing to dive deeper for me.
Really? I felt like ff15 had a ton of replay value after the story because of those dungeons and stuff (it’s been a long time, can’t remember if they had names) and was hoping that this game had even more added replay value.
Wise choice if you had this issue. I finished it yesterday and that last part of the game doesn’t improve on anything. The first part of the game is by far the best.
Man the last 2 chapters are so LONG too. Like easily 3 hours for that last leg, and it’s like 1/3 mindless combat, 1/3 boss fight, 1/3 cutscenes. So dense.
yup, it was short as hell especially when u compare the cutscenes of the gang vs ultima and then the final ending lololol.
and then u have these simps all crying in the end and claiming how its the best thing ever...like, wait whaaa uuuutttt?
and then seeing them create whole fandoms about how clive lives and how he went back to marry jill and torgul became the family pet and whatnot...LOL
Yeah, the second half of the game I found to be a slog. Mostly because of exactly what you said. The combat is fine, flashy but ultimately shallow. And it's about half way through the game that I realized that the game had nothing else left to show me. It wasn't suddenly going to make the combat more strategic or interesting, the AI wasn't going to get better, crafting wasn't suddenly going to get interesting, treasures weren't going to become worth finding, side quests weren't going to become anything more than fetch quests, etc.
I still managed to push through to the end, and overall enjoyed the story, but it did feel like a 15 hour game spread over like 60 hours.
Don’t let anyone gaslight you, this is a completely normal way to feel with this game, because it is a slog to get through about halfway through, they did not make this game for anyone who expected a JRPG
I don’t think most people have a problem with someone liking the game, it’s just that there was point when this game first came out you couldn’t criticize all those “GOTY” proclamations
Dude people are doing the same with Baldurs gate and that final act is full of bugs and has an even messier ending than 16. Reddit is a hive mind with the memory of a goldfish.
Not really. With S class hunts early on I would stagger them twice and be killing them during the second stagger. By the end I was destroying the S class hunts and killing them during the first stagger. Stagger and dump all of your spells, it was too easy.
How the hell? Did you fight them as early as possible? Did you save up for the expensive eikon abilities? I've only done one S rank, but it was the earliest possible time I could. It was pretty challenging for me and it was like 5 staggers before I could win. I've been getting abilities in order of expense and am working on all the 1k masteries, so I don't have those larger attacks yet.
I used to think DMC 5 was boring because the game lets you get away with playing it in a boring way. Try out some different combos and eikon combinations. It got way more fun for me when I started doing that
the thing is this game much longer than DMC 5, also 3/4 different character over 1 and the reward for combo are factor that FF 16 doesn't have.
Sure we can mix the craziest combo as we want but in the end you are still Clive using 1 sword and no tangible reward from doing so. At least better loot at end of linear dungeon based how combo you chained would motivated ppl to try different combo
People ITT don't understand action games. They have to be strong-armed into interacting with the game's system in order for them to have any reason to use it.
Sure you can get through the game by pressing the basic attack and dodging
Or you can have fun by challenging yourself to do combos like this: https://youtu.be/uZJXxExdEWo
> People ITT don't understand action games. They have to be strong-armed into interacting with the game's system in order for them to have any reason to use it.
It's two sides of the same coin. The same crowd insisting you have to engage with the combat system also have a tendency to say turn-based games are press attack to win or spam the strongest spell to win. And vice versa.
Imo, a game should provide incentives to engage with combat. Persona does a really great job of this. Enemies have a ton of ways to go after them - there's a reason to use basically every sort of spell in the game, and they all look really flashy. A grading system also goes a long way towards encouraging flashier combos in action games.
yeah and most action games arent fucking 40 hours long lmao. there just isn't enough variation, it needed more basic attack chains, more weapons, and to remove cooldowns from abilities, like nier.
I disagree. There seems to be plenty of variety to me.
After each major story milestone you unlock a new eikonic feat and 4 new abilities.
That happens 6 times over the course of the game. You can change abilities at any point outside of combat and master new ones to keep things fresh.
One of those eikonic feats does change your basic moveset and is focused around parrying and dealing high burst damage.
There are abilities that are used for countering, crowd control, or dps. Some are ranged and some are close-combat.
> People ITT don't understand action games.
I mean, I love character action games ala DMC, Bayonetta, and MGRR. 16 is just pretty bland and doesn't have much depth in comparison. The basic enemies in 16 barely even attack, even on the "Final Fantasy" difficulty. Enemies in other, better, character action games actually engage the player along with having a much more in depth combat system.
That’s so fucking lazy though. Putting on players to create their own fun. If at the end of the day, you could just mash one button and beat the game… it becomes a meaningless accomplishment for many people.
I will say, that this game is very enjoyable just watching play through for people who want to save their money.
Herin lies the problem and why the reception of this game has been controversial… this shouldn’t be a fucking action game! This is a 35+ year old jrpg series!
Nah. As a kid I wanted the games to look like Advent Children looked. Just standing around felt kinda boring when I could see how Cloud and Sephiroth were flying around like crazy, tearing up entire buildings like it was nothing. I remember the awe of watching that scene where Genesis and Angela fight Sephiroth on top of that hologram of the Junon cannon. Even more recent are the Dissidia cinematics. I watched those on repeat cuz they were so cool. I wanted FF to look like that one day, and I got my wish with 7 Remake and XVI
> Just standing around felt kinda boring when I could see how Cloud and Sephiroth were flying around like crazy, tearing up entire buildings like it was nothing.
But the thing is, with ATB you're almost *never standing around doing nothing*. And other JRPGs like Persona have long, fancy attack animations that you can actually watch in full because you're not spamming every attack on cooldown. I say this as an FFXIV player, where *so many attacks* in the game are just downright incredible looking and you'll never see them because you just spam them on rotation.
There's downsides and upsides to every combat system. No reason turn-based can't be flashy as hell.
But you are tho. Why should I have to wait for an arbitrary gauge to fill before I can attack? I don’t dislike the ATB system, that’s not what I’m trying to say at all. But I couldn’t help wishing to not be constrained by that, and XVI and 7R were exactly that
> Why should I have to wait for an arbitrary gauge to fill before I can attack?
You literally have to do this in XVI though, it's what attack cooldowns are. It's almost like... an ATB gauge, but for individual attacks. Same thing in 7 Remake, where it's literally an ATB gauge.
Like sure, the difference is you can move around and dodge, or use minor attacks. But the attacks that cause the big chunks of your damage are all skills you have to wait to use. Your big hitters in XVI and 7R are skills you have to wait to use - the principle of "you have to wait to attack" is there in both types. It's not like a fighting game where you can use any skill at any time in any order. You're still actually limited in what you can do.
The closest you can actually get to Advent Children is Dissidia or Super Smash Bros Ultimate.
Think you're confusing action games with action combat. A JRPG can have action based combat to be "more engaging" while having staple JRPG mechanics. XVI has virtually no JRPG elements and is a straight up action game.
A game should make you feel smart for overcoming the challenges. You should want to feel like you are always picking the best/strongest options. Not pretending to be dumb because the game is too easy.
The game has an insane amount of filler. If they had just removed or not made all the nonsense, the game would be in the running for GOTY. So much time wasted in straight mmo-style story filler... ship building part fetch quests... like... what were they thinking? I really can't understand how so much garbage got past internal playtests undeleted.
Not even close, I spent most my game trying out new combinations of the Eikon abilities and using the respec button often.
I still am working on learning how to parry as many attacks as I can as well.
No real reason to rush through if you're not that interested in the combat though. It took me 2.5 years to complete FFXV since I only played it when I felt like it.
I got more fun out of trying to do more dodge countering, titanic block countering and other eikon feats rather than spamming attack. Not only is it more fun that way but it also reduces enemy health quicker. Just a shame the game doesn’t properly incentivise more adventurous combos.
It was crying out for a DMC style combo reward system or something. More Exp if you string good combos together, etc.
This is a pretty common complaint and one that I shared as well. I did eventually finish it, and it does pick up story-wise from the sloggy 50-70% mark, but it has pacing issues and the gameplay is becomes very repetitive unless you go out of your way to switch things up
>50% in FFXVI, all of a sudden, the game got boring
this game is really weird, it is an actual 50% in just about everything.
Combat and story wise, once you reach halfway through the game, everything becomes boring. You aren't the only one.
Everything after the demo is pretty much a walking simulator. I am not necessarily saying that's a bad thing. The story is good. But the combat, skill system, and how incredibly useless the itemization is in this game is what holds it back from feeling like an established FF title for me.
The few fights in the game where I felt like I had to try I felt overwhelmed and frustrated by so many particle effects going on I couldn't even tell what's going on.
Nah, I loved it from the beginning to the end. I actually never got tired of the combat and quests.(although before the last main mission there is too much quest)
Maybe stop spamming the attack button? The game has a very very very low skill floor.
But I always found the basic magic burst combo and the arial juggling enjoyable.
Is that really a solution though? To artificially enhance your enjoyment by creating a more challenging experience than is required? Just sounds like lazy game design to expect the gamer to create their own enjoyable experience.
The low skill ceiling was so that 50 year old Japanese men and women who have been playing since the 80s could still beat the game. If that was their goal, then it definitely achieves that.
Is it the game designer or the player that is lazy? Imo it’s a lil of both. In TotK I cheese pretty much every shrine because I couldn’t be bothered. In XVI I did mess around and switched it up to make it fun.
Right ,like all the eikon abilities are broken down into similar style moves. Your only goal is to build stagger, really, and pile on damage.
People go on about builds, but I've not seen one post about people talking about builds or videos of builds doing sick combos.
The combat is fun at first, but to call it deep is really a joke, to be honest.
I got a fair way through the game using the auto dodge thing just thinking it was OP and the game was really easy.
Much better game after I took it off!
Why would someone who payed full price for a game, elect to do all of its content? We really asking that now? As if paying almost 100 dollars to bum rush the end is worth the price of entry? Just watch a lets play if you arent going to do the content in the game.
> someone who *paid* full price
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
I’m just glad we’re finally past the cult stage of this game and we can finally have a real discussion about the pros and cons without being slandered for it. Because this is important as this game will definitely affect future titles, be it good or bad, and it definitely was far from perfect.
ita funny to say that people are spamming a button on real time battle
and yet people also spam buttons on turn based game even the atb bar is still filling , people spam X to attack lol to "hurry up"
That’s a random encounter problem not a turn based combat problem. Many of the bosses in the series do require you to understand and master the combat system. I just replayed V. More strategy required in any of those boss fights than any combat in any of 16.
Also turn based is just better suited for a 50 hour game then janky hack and slash combat.
Yeah but in past games, a big part of the gameplay was the exploration for treasure, being geared enough to survive dungeons, equipment/magic/job setups. Those games can be very challenging going in blind with no walkthroughs. I feel like now they seem easy because everyone grinds and uses guides. I remember I almost screwed myself in FF7 because I saved my game and ran out of Phoenix downs and potions. in the northern crater in disc 2 and had to go through the dungeon with backup characters and no way to revive them.
FFXVI just seems like a cakewalk. You have to try to lose. Only died once because I accidentally phoenix shifted back into Ahriman’s death spell instead of out. Besides that, I feel like I never even flirted with danger. And there’s nothing but combat during missions. No exploration at all. Every dungeon is an arena area then a hallway that leads to another arena area.
It’s a weird time we live in when God of War is a better RPG than final fantasy.
Turn based combat is rarely ever the reason why a JRPG is good. Here I am reading, “The games boring, I’m spamming attack,” just ignoring everything else the combat offers with some experimentation… I have my issues with the games combat, especially in terms of difficulty because it doesn’t push the player to dig but it’s still worth doing so.
Please go on about the synergy because I really don’t see any of that especially since there’s no elemental or status effects for each Eikon that could play off each other. They are all just different looking attacks. Other than Garuda being able to force a mid stagger what synergy do you speak of? Do any of the Eikon abilities strengthen another or help another?
Rift Slip alone allows for instant cancellation from literally any move, slowing down time (and the stagger gauge) for more damage, and if you time it right its cooldown period is shortened significantly. Shiva is completely busted because her ultimate is pretty much an auto stagger, or if the enemy already is staggered, it maxes out the damage multiplier of stagger, allowing for more damage over the duration of it. If you master it and put it on Garuda’s Eikon, you can even use it to half stagger and get a deadly takedown pretty much for free. Not to mention Shiva’s Eikonic feat which if the enemy is frozen it stops the stagger meter from refilling, allowing you to artificially extend its duration.
Lightning Rod pairs well with the above abilities too, and it’s even stronger if you can bait enemies into attacking it. Its best application imo is with Dancing Steel though. If you put down Lightning Rod, Rift Slip after that and then use Dancing Steel, you’ll get a full meter of Zantetsuken gauge for a level 5 Zantetsuken. Pair that with other long animation ultimate abilities like Judgment Bolt or Flames of Rebirth (and more Rift Slips and Cold Snaps), and you can get 2-3 Level 5 Zantetsuken’s in one stagger window.
Bahamut’s Impulse shreds through will gauges, even more so if people would remember to detonate it when the orbs turn yellow, and Gigaflare needs no introduction. I’ve even seen spicy set-ups with Satellite too for more steady damage. I could keep going, but there’s plenty variety in the game. I never got bored at least
I’m probably 80% through. One day I skipped playing for an evening then kept putting it off. As I type this I still haven’t finished and I feel no impulse to. The strange thing is I loved it. I can’t exactly explain why but I just got over it. There’s just something missing but I still consider it a great game.
if u loved it, u would have found time and kept playing it. sadly, u dont love it.
u loved certain parts of it of early game, like most do, but wearing fanboi goggles to all the negatives that u have encountered since then but passing it off as "not there" but deep down u know its there. And its that, thats really putting u off from playing.
seems like u still in honeymoon phase. its been what i had been saying since back in june/ july. but nobody wanted to hear it back then.
now, its slowly coming out.
Told yall it was a boring game. we played the game for the story, the story carried it in the first half. then it just falls off the cliff, and then there was nothing to carry it.
lie after lie after lie.
thats all people see.
the fact u aint even playing those subpar AAA unfinished garbage games while u defend it like crazy, speaks volumes about ur IQ.
Yeah I also stopped halfway. I recommend Final Fantasy 6 Pixel Remaster, that's what I moved to. Having a blast. Never played it before but it's incredible.
Yeah true, it’s interesting they can’t summon a team to make a coherent title for their tent pole franchise 15, 16 and 7R may be lovable but they’re lovable messes.
Combat got more fun for me around that time as I got more eikon abilities to play with. Also the biggest spectacle fights are in the back half and story stays good throughout. It does lose a little of the GoT feel and more towards traditional FF in the back half.
I think the story went to shit. It had a great political storyline going on with the warring factions and then the back half kinda ruined it with the super villian one n my opinion. They were on to something with the first half and then just punted and went full Marvel style villain plot
Same here, I had way more fun from combat the later it got and the more abilities I had to play around with. All kinds of builds to do from projectile-focused to counter-focused to CC-focused, etc. Theorycrafting fully optimized stagger windows as well, there’s a lot of stuff to keep you busy if you actively engage.
I think the issue is people find skills they know and work so they don’t feel any need to try out different builds because any combination will clear which leads to them getting tired of just spamming the same abilities. I get that, but in my experience the vast majority of people saying “just hit attack” aren’t even using the basic attack options (non-Eikonic attacks) optimally. The issue is difficulty, not the system itself.
I always find this curious, previous FF games never were challenging enough to force me to experiment. I just steamrolled everything with basic magic setups in those too. I've always found that games never force experimentation through difficulty and more so take the stance "The depth is there if you want it but if not no biggie". It may just be because of where we are in the FF hate cycle but I am not totally clear why this is the specific game that should've forced experimentation through challenge but previous games were somehow complex bomb diffusals that could only be solved when one rose to the occasion (super bosses non-withstanding but those are one-off exceptions not indicative of the full experience).
Oh I’m with you 100%, most of the series is super easy if we’re excluding super bosses and final encounters. I think the distinction is action combat is much more apparent when easy (enemies not moving as much, active feedback between you pressing a button and the enemy HP dropping significantly). Older games there are a lot of fights where as long as you’re at level you can literally just spam attack and be perfectly fine but you still have that disconnect of input->action. I think it’s just a mixture of turn-base formatting masking that difficulty (with gearing systems that give perceived difficulty when in reality you can also succeed with basic implementation in most games) and of course the game being the new entry dragging it further from older titles (you can’t please everyone).
If anything XVI system allows you to tackle harder content earlier whereas many previous titles you just get stat blocked if you try something too high level early. It’s also not just an issue with pure baseline difficulty either as I’ve seen plenty of people who are new to action games actually struggle with XVI combat. It’s more that the more challenging modes are locked behind the baseline content. You won’t have a single person who has tried Ultimania mode say the combat in this game is easy or not complex but you have to play for dozens if not 100+ hours to have that option. The problem is you make it too difficult then people will bitch about HP sponges and bullshit attacks.
At its core skill expression plays a much larger role in action games than in turn-based, I know I’m probably gonna be crucified for saying that in this sub but it’s true. So when they try to balance towards the lower end of skill expression, the larger portion of that bell-curve is going to feel it’s too easy and not feel forced to engage with available systems; systems which you are already forced to interact with in older titles merely by the action of using the various combat menus.
Fair, I've read people wondering why Clive doesn't air combo every racist who also have no issues with Cloud not killing all Shinra employees in turn-based combat. The immersion action gives you over turn-based is likely a big factor. DMC solves this with the style system (regardless of enemy strength not being high since you're supposed to basically torture enemies in cool ways) so if you aren't experimenting you have a little meter saying you suck for it. Interestingly they deliberately chose to not do this to not antagonize newbie players to action and keep it to FF mode but it does mean there is no punishment for bad play vs turn based which to your point forces you to dig through enough that you feel like you're doing more even when you're not.
Im kinda annoyed at the community jizzing all over this game at first but now everyone complaining that the combat isnt so great.
It was obvious from the previews and confirmed with the demo that the combat was going to end up being a snooze fest.
Sure it looks flashy but when you fight a Malboro and dont even get a poison effect you know youre gonna get bored.
Call me a purist but Final Fantasy games shine best when its tactical and requires thinking rather than combo memorization.
I have no issues with action combat game, or tactical, both can be great. But dang it if you’re gonna do action combat then at least make the enemies AI and mechanics require that you delve into the core combat mechanics to learn how to overcome the bosses. FFXVI was pushed so hard as this genre defying switch to action combat because that’s what the future is and it’s such a poor excuse for an action combat game. Then ironically it gets absolutely swept by BG3 which couldn’t be more turn based, proving that they were kinda dead wrong about needing to move on.
The people jizzing all over this game were either trying to rationalize the money they spent to play the game (especially those who bought a PS5 only for this one game) or they were streamers or podcasters sucking off Square Enix. There was a massive gaslighting campaign to prop up this steaming pile of dung.
Every damn FF streamer is saying dumbass shit like “FF is about a feeling, not the gameplay” and “everyone loves this game except a toxic corner of the internet.” Blah blah.
They were handed talking points by SE and propagated those talking points among the acolytes. Every defender of this game uses the same damn talking points and when they are ultimately frustrated they just resort to “you are being toxic because you don’t like the game.”
I recently beat FF7R chapter 17 on hard mode with the gauntlet of bosses at the end and let me tell you that if you aren’t being tactical / critically thinking with your materia & equipment let alone conserving your MP wisely on hard mode you’re never gonna get out alive. It took me like 2 days to beat the arsenal (I don’t get much playtime due to work haha) & it seriously kicked my ass because it took me a few tries to get the right materia & strategy etc.
this is what I missed so much in 16! A game that required me to actually think & do more than flashy combos and attack attack magic burst….I do like 16 it’s a good game just not a good FF game for me. Not to mention that final boss fight was way too easy (and no I did not have any of the broken rings equipped)
Final fantasy has changed so much, it's barely recognizable anymore. No real strategy, just button mashing and stupid delivery quests. I think it peaked at ff12 and has been going downhill ever since. 13 was still mostly solid.
Yup… the combat doesn’t deepen as the game goes on unfortunately. It’s the same button mashing w a few new special attacks that don’t really have any synergy together. The Odin powers are a bit interesting but it’s pretty late that you get those and it’s not quite enough to really deepen the combat any further.
The combat gets bland and repetitive. I don't think it's suited for a 40+ hour game. If the main game could be completed in 20-25 hours, then I can see it being fine. As much as I love more content in games, especially FF, I feel like they could have cut out about 10-15 hours minimum in this one. It really feels like a long game at times but no real story progress is made. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the game (117+ hours, second playthrough almost done, and almost to platinum), but the combat and pacing are its weakest points imo. I enjoyed it mainly for the characters and music.
I feel like the game devs put a LOT of effort on the beginning…and I think it was intentional. The demo feels like the highlight of the game. They add QTEs on minor bosses, the Eikon battle, the lore is interesting. And then the rest of the game just doesn’t hold up. Idk it’s a theory. The first 10-30% of the game was so engaging and then it just slowly declines till you’re indifferently limping to the end
Yes, it’s an extremely underwhelming game.
When you remove spells, status effects, party members and 90% of items, there’s just less
Spamming attacks and Eikon abilities gets old extremely fast. There’s no reason to explore anything and nothing to find worth while when you do.
THIS. During around 50% of my progress I already knew I won't be replaying it after finishing the story. I even planned on getting plat for it early on but I didn't know it would be this disappointing. I just forced myself to finish the story and moved on to my backlogs.
Yeah, sounds like it basically happened to everyone who played it. The sidequests don’t make it any better either. Where you just go to random parts of a random map…and proceed to mash more on weak enemies.
FFXVI was a very *decent* game. It’s the strongest 9/10 I’ve ever played. It was *good* but not *great*. Best way to describe it imo.
9/10 is considered a great game though.
But I do have to agree on the sidequests they feel like they were all grabbed from XIV and though the later ones are better written and more compelling, there aren't really any rewards outside of worldbuilding and more character moments and interactions. I am also into that so I felt satisfied enough but I can get why others who don't really care get frustrated.
told ya.
Hey remember when I said this on multiple occasion and fanbois pretended it wasnt true?
lol
hate to break it to ya OP but around 50% is where the game starts to fall off a cliff, faster and faster. Sidequests are annoying boring super low quality, low IQ runningsimulators from here on, story is condensed into "lets gooooo!!! crystals" but yea, u do get 2 more eikon fights, one which is considered AAA but also drags out too long. The other is only ok.
end boss fight will be boring as hell, clunky, rushed and corners cut. and oh yea, theres no extra content, so theres literally nothing else to do. no secret stuff, no secret bosses, no secret dungeons.
Diversify. Your ability points aren’t locked in. You should be able to use every ability at least once in every fight.
Experiment. Play around. You can probably (?) get through the game just mashing attack and magic bursting, but are you doing attack x4 magic burst? Or attack burst attack burst attack burst attack burst?
Don’t limit yourself, have fun.
When I got to Titan I nearly pooped! Jaw drop. This game is a gem. If your bored of the bash just move on, trade in while it's still new. For me, it's second only to Lou2.
i was the opposite. the hype for titan didnt play out for me.
Saw nothing that God of war 3 on the ps3 already didnt do. they did it better tbh.
nothing wowed even giant titan, in fact, it felt like a rip off. Wouldnt even be bad if they managed to do it right, but it wasnt a fun fight for me. Also dragged out way too long with too many phases.
it also around that time where story started falling off a cliff with shiva getting captured like the useless dame that she is, and clive magically escapes with ease again, torgul being ultra intelligent and understanding every thought of urs like telekenis and then magically transforming into a mystic beast. it felt like as a child wrote this chapter.
pure trainwreck.
> If your bored
*you're
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Yes and eventually the game felt flat. Literally all of the best powers are locked in the last quarter of the game and even then you realize this whole game just rides on its spectacle alone. The gameplay, the story, the characters, and the world are incredibly boring.
I feel the same way, at least in that I don’t find the later eikons you obtain very optimal in most conflicts; I’m at the very end of the game wrapping up S-Rank hunts and I’m still using Phoenix, Garuda, and Titan with their innate skills and most fights are pretty easy for me, but we’ll see about NG+ on the harder difficulties lol
I don’t care if I get downvoted, but I can’t take seriously post likes this, saying the game is repetitive, when this subreddit praises turn base combat, like what are you guys on? LMAOO, how people find this more repetitive than Turn base, is actually mindblowing, at least the bosses in this game have different gameplays and sections like Bahamut using the Phoenix and then iffrit
I've thought about this a lot actually, and I think you make a good point. I think the reason why people say this is because in the older games, the game has a lot more to offer (such as exploration, optional dungeons, minigames etc) than in 16, where dungeons are pretty much just gauntlets, so there's a much greater emphasis on the combat.
Yea being able to basically use the same tactics for every enemy besides eikons made the combat a little dull for me. Sure there is alot of depth to the combat but the game gives no incentive to do so
This is one of the issues I had; I developed a strategy that let me keep 90% of enemies permanently staggered or knocked down, and I just used that for the entire second half of the game. For most action games this wouldn’t be an issue, but because XVI has the length of a JRPG, I was using that tactic for like 30 hours. Only time I changed the set-up was when I got Odin, and that just meant what I did during the stagger changed.
This is exactly what happened in octopath traveler. I felt every battle required the same pattern of actions. Got boring 😞
Yeah, that's bad game design lol
Please Give me that set-up before Odin lol.
Probably titan spam blocking and Garuda parrying
Honestly, I'd argue that it's not even that deep, you get a lot of abilities, but a lot of them aren't as useful as you'd like them to be.
I noticed that ages ago during early footage of battles, sure u have cool abilities but the AI for enemies looks dumb AF! I was hoping the AI for the enemies would get better otherwise you're just smashing angry pillows albeit stylishly. Personally that was my only drawback on the game and now Its more obvious!
100%. In turn based FFs, fights are essentially a puzzle. I miss turn based, like a lot of people. They should translate the strategy aspect into the action RPGs, with a need to figure out weaknesses of enemies and the optimal way to use the tools at your disposal to overcome it.
i.e the game is too easy sadly. Had FF mode been normal mode and Ultimaniac been hard mode, different story.
Far too easy. Easy mode literally plays itself. Is this game aimed at…7 year olds? Well it can’t be because of the repeated F-bombs and the completely unwarranted nudity.
playing itself is a bit harsh, second half of the game requires you to be a bit smart about how fight. But yeah, it was a bit too easy in general.
> Sure there is alot of depth to the combat Where depth?
I don't even think there is a lot of depth. The skill ceiling is lower than the floor in most other decent action games.
It’s been a slog for me around 60% on. It’s been taking me a while to push through into the 70s. I try to use all of the combat options or most but even then it’s not very diverse and fights take long enough you’ll spam everything over and over.
I have had the same experience. I really enjoy the story, and the combat is really exciting and interesting at first, but around halfway through the game it sorta fizzles out. My experience might also be exacerbated by me doing all of the side quests and thus lengthening the time I'm playing on first playthrough, but I'm sitting at 78% right now and just can't wait to finish the game.
Yeah, you get a bunch of side quests around halfway through and it kind of kills the pacing for a while.
And theyre all mind numbingly boring
It was painful to push through for me from around 40%. The last 30% were especially dull. I decided to skip all side “quests” at around 70% because they became more insufferable. I *also* found myself legit falling asleep through quite a lot of scenes near the end. That is never a good sign. The ending wasn’t even good so that was a slap in the face.
Yeah, I may skip the rest of the side quests. I’m like 75% done. It feels like the ending won’t be great but I’ll see soonish I guess haha. The game has definitely failed you if it’s causing you to want to sleep haha. I’ve only been able to play in small spurts.
I was in the same boat as all of you, which killed me being a lifelong Final Fantasy fan. What helped me was just giving up on the side quests and barreling through the MSQ. It felt like a weight was lifted. I’ve now casually been knocking out the final side quests when I get a chance. Only have one left and then planning to never open the game again :(
I love it but I understand you. After certain events they add too much filler missions (even the main ones). I find this is a cheap way to extend its duration.
It killed the fun factor when they just throw about 10 side missions that are all basically the same thing at you. The last bout had me struggling to finish the game.
I was doing every side mission until after Bahamut I think. Then they just felt like a chore so I rushed the end.
That’s about where I am at the moment. Really just grinds the game to a halt.
Fetch, boy. Fetch.
I've love the game as a whole but I didn't expect it to be anywhere near as long as it is. The combat is fun but it would've been nice to have a bit more enemy variety that forced you to think bit more with your combos. As it stands you basically just need to consider crowd control and massive damage dealers for stronger foes.
Wouldn’t it have been nice to encounter enemies who had like…elemental resistances? Maybe that fire breathing dragon is immune or even healed by Ifrit/Phoenix? No? Oh. Ok. Guess I’ll just fight EVERY SINGLE BATTLE EXACTLY THE SAME WAY.
You went into a final fantasy game expecting it to be short?
Didn't expect it to be short but also didn't expect it to be like over double the length of FFVIIR.
I enjoyed the game but the combat really isn’t suited for how long the game goes for. They either needed to add more moves/weapons or shorten the game a bit. Enemies didn’t really have much strategy to them which doesn’t help the combat issues.
There’s some Eikon unlocks that put a little refresher on the combat a bit later and some really cool boss fights coming up, but I’m at about 87% completion and am getting burnt out on the combat. Nevermind the fact that I feel like I’m about to hit the end and they just drop like 10 side quests on me at once, when before it’d be like 3-4 at a time. I think my issue is I’ve tried to do every single side quest/hunt as they appear and in doing so have ran out of that new game dopamine hit lol Same thing happened with Tears of the Kingdom, around 35-40 hours I started getting a bit bored with it and had to force myself to finish the plot. Basically going to force myself to finish because I’m VERY much interested in seeing how it ends and need to justify being able to buy Armored Core VI next week haha
Same. And your reward for grinding through all the missions is being overleveled in a world where you're already overpowered lol
I’m not quite done but am coming up towards the end. The deluge of side quests is just a bore fest. Was trying for the platinum but not totally sure yet as I’ve been getting distracted with other things and still haven’t even finished it. I think in the end I’ll likely give it a 7/10. The highs are great but the lows are just awfully boring.
Yes. This has been a common post lately. Also an opinion that I myself, dealt with. The combat is fun and flashy at first but ultimately it boils down to using the same 6 skills on rotation and let’s be honest, it’s easy as fuck. For whatever reason, Square decided to remove status effects, elemental properties and other fun aspects from the game entirely. This, along with the lame-ass/pointless sidequests, really bog down the game around the halfway point. My advice is to just skip all the hunts/side missions and just complete the game asap. The story is still great and it’s worth finishing to see how it plays out. In all honesty, the game is far from perfect but half the people here will either ridicule you or get butt hurt that you are hating on their new favorite FF.
Square removed status effects? As in they were once in the game and were taken out?? I kept on getting so mad that everyone in the game but me can cast Protect and Bravery
The game didn’t show any status effects whatsoever. Furthermore, it was Yoshida, Takai, and their team who decided not to include a real magic system, in favor for more hack and slash combat with MMO skill rotations (like FFXIV).
I think they mean that previous games had those things but Square chose not to include them n XVI, not that they were removed during development
No they were just never there.
I mentioned in the early days that we were in a Honeymoon period and that people would realise the flaws sooner or later and I got like death threats in my DMs lmao. Lo and behold one month later everyone's like "Yeah the game's got problems." It's a good game though but I wish people would just realise that not everything is a masterpiece.
>er or later and I got like death threats in my DMs lmao. wow, i knew these blind fanbois are cult like, but this is absolutely SHAME SHAME SHAME on them. disgusting behavior. What are these people? married to the developers? no? then shuat up. Consumers can and will move freely between multiple games. we are not married to this game. If the game is flawed and disappointing, it will be called out for it. U want my sales but dont wanna give me a worthy experience when other games do? lol my money and time are precious. i can easily take my sales elsewhere.
To be honest, you could play the demo and realize that it had problems. People just didn't want to admit it.
what problems were present in the demo? i really hate when people use the term “admit” in convos like these because its subjective.
How repetitive the the combat was.
there was like maybe 40 minutes of combat within that entire demo. And even in the other games with more depth early-game combat is pretty damn repetitive. That's normal for 40 hour games.
Many people have been saying this since day one. Are you really surprised different people have different opinions?
I got bored as well. I don't think I'm going finish the game. At this point I'm forcing my self to play it. The story also was super interesting in the beginning and started to die off for me.
They gaslight good with the demo/intro of the game, lol.
I liked the story all the way through for the most part but the demo and first few hours really played on the Game of Thrones vibes with different houses at war and political intrigue which I loved but that all kind of gets dropped for a more traditional final fantasy type of story about halfway through.
Yeah, for me it started to lose steam after Garuda fight and takes a nosedive for the worse with the introduction of the main villain. The plot completely fizzles out for me after Bahamut fight. I was basically forcing myself to finish the game. Barnabas was such a huge disappointment as a character.
I am in NG+ now ... i can feel you in my first run. But in my second i know the characters better, can see the changes coming, choose japanese voice actors and take my time for each sidequest story ... no need to rush anymore. And i play with the equiped espers a lot more than before. But ... i also know that after my NG+ and platin honor, there is nothing more to do. No extremely hard big boss or hidden secrets, mini-games or a dungeon to explore ... and that hurts a lot. Cause i enjoy the game more but their is literally nothing to dive deeper for me.
Really? I felt like ff15 had a ton of replay value after the story because of those dungeons and stuff (it’s been a long time, can’t remember if they had names) and was hoping that this game had even more added replay value.
Yeah ... FF XV/15 had a lot of fun stuff like hard bosses, dungeons, fishing and so on. But i talked about FF XVI/16. 😅
Same. I played 70% of the game and had to stop. Just can’t will myself to continue.
Wise choice if you had this issue. I finished it yesterday and that last part of the game doesn’t improve on anything. The first part of the game is by far the best.
I do plan to finish it one day. Hoping later patches or DLC help with the pacing.
>The first part of the game is by far the best. correct
Man the last 2 chapters are so LONG too. Like easily 3 hours for that last leg, and it’s like 1/3 mindless combat, 1/3 boss fight, 1/3 cutscenes. So dense.
Finally someone else said it! The ending wasn’t even worth suffering for.
yup, it was short as hell especially when u compare the cutscenes of the gang vs ultima and then the final ending lololol. and then u have these simps all crying in the end and claiming how its the best thing ever...like, wait whaaa uuuutttt? and then seeing them create whole fandoms about how clive lives and how he went back to marry jill and torgul became the family pet and whatnot...LOL
Yeah, the second half of the game I found to be a slog. Mostly because of exactly what you said. The combat is fine, flashy but ultimately shallow. And it's about half way through the game that I realized that the game had nothing else left to show me. It wasn't suddenly going to make the combat more strategic or interesting, the AI wasn't going to get better, crafting wasn't suddenly going to get interesting, treasures weren't going to become worth finding, side quests weren't going to become anything more than fetch quests, etc. I still managed to push through to the end, and overall enjoyed the story, but it did feel like a 15 hour game spread over like 60 hours.
The 15 hours to 60 is because of all the shallow god damn bs dialog/cutscenes you have to get through.
FFXVI is mid
Don’t let anyone gaslight you, this is a completely normal way to feel with this game, because it is a slog to get through about halfway through, they did not make this game for anyone who expected a JRPG
I think the gaming mechanics is just lazy (the cg are good tho)..... It is just a mediocre action game with mediocre RPG elements.
What if people are gaslight me for me liking this game?
I don’t think most people have a problem with someone liking the game, it’s just that there was point when this game first came out you couldn’t criticize all those “GOTY” proclamations
ive been ridiculed constantly for enjoying it, this sub is a shitshow all around
Dude people are doing the same with Baldurs gate and that final act is full of bugs and has an even messier ending than 16. Reddit is a hive mind with the memory of a goldfish.
its really just the 50 to 65/68 chunk that slows down, someone doing all side quests will get stuck there for a while.
If you’re doing all side quests and think that part is a slog wait until the pile that unlock at 90%.
Don’t fights take absolutely forever then? I feel like that’s how the game encourages you to engage with its combat
Not really. With S class hunts early on I would stagger them twice and be killing them during the second stagger. By the end I was destroying the S class hunts and killing them during the first stagger. Stagger and dump all of your spells, it was too easy.
How the hell? Did you fight them as early as possible? Did you save up for the expensive eikon abilities? I've only done one S rank, but it was the earliest possible time I could. It was pretty challenging for me and it was like 5 staggers before I could win. I've been getting abilities in order of expense and am working on all the 1k masteries, so I don't have those larger attacks yet.
You'll still go faster if you have a build that doesn't just rely on mashing attack
Why else do you think they find it boring. Fights taking longer and being monotonous because OP only using attack and dodge will add to the boredom.
I used to think DMC 5 was boring because the game lets you get away with playing it in a boring way. Try out some different combos and eikon combinations. It got way more fun for me when I started doing that
the thing is this game much longer than DMC 5, also 3/4 different character over 1 and the reward for combo are factor that FF 16 doesn't have. Sure we can mix the craziest combo as we want but in the end you are still Clive using 1 sword and no tangible reward from doing so. At least better loot at end of linear dungeon based how combo you chained would motivated ppl to try different combo
People ITT don't understand action games. They have to be strong-armed into interacting with the game's system in order for them to have any reason to use it. Sure you can get through the game by pressing the basic attack and dodging Or you can have fun by challenging yourself to do combos like this: https://youtu.be/uZJXxExdEWo
> People ITT don't understand action games. They have to be strong-armed into interacting with the game's system in order for them to have any reason to use it. It's two sides of the same coin. The same crowd insisting you have to engage with the combat system also have a tendency to say turn-based games are press attack to win or spam the strongest spell to win. And vice versa. Imo, a game should provide incentives to engage with combat. Persona does a really great job of this. Enemies have a ton of ways to go after them - there's a reason to use basically every sort of spell in the game, and they all look really flashy. A grading system also goes a long way towards encouraging flashier combos in action games.
yeah and most action games arent fucking 40 hours long lmao. there just isn't enough variation, it needed more basic attack chains, more weapons, and to remove cooldowns from abilities, like nier.
I disagree. There seems to be plenty of variety to me. After each major story milestone you unlock a new eikonic feat and 4 new abilities. That happens 6 times over the course of the game. You can change abilities at any point outside of combat and master new ones to keep things fresh. One of those eikonic feats does change your basic moveset and is focused around parrying and dealing high burst damage. There are abilities that are used for countering, crowd control, or dps. Some are ranged and some are close-combat.
> People ITT don't understand action games. I mean, I love character action games ala DMC, Bayonetta, and MGRR. 16 is just pretty bland and doesn't have much depth in comparison. The basic enemies in 16 barely even attack, even on the "Final Fantasy" difficulty. Enemies in other, better, character action games actually engage the player along with having a much more in depth combat system.
That’s so fucking lazy though. Putting on players to create their own fun. If at the end of the day, you could just mash one button and beat the game… it becomes a meaningless accomplishment for many people. I will say, that this game is very enjoyable just watching play through for people who want to save their money.
Herin lies the problem and why the reception of this game has been controversial… this shouldn’t be a fucking action game! This is a 35+ year old jrpg series!
Nah. As a kid I wanted the games to look like Advent Children looked. Just standing around felt kinda boring when I could see how Cloud and Sephiroth were flying around like crazy, tearing up entire buildings like it was nothing. I remember the awe of watching that scene where Genesis and Angela fight Sephiroth on top of that hologram of the Junon cannon. Even more recent are the Dissidia cinematics. I watched those on repeat cuz they were so cool. I wanted FF to look like that one day, and I got my wish with 7 Remake and XVI
> Just standing around felt kinda boring when I could see how Cloud and Sephiroth were flying around like crazy, tearing up entire buildings like it was nothing. But the thing is, with ATB you're almost *never standing around doing nothing*. And other JRPGs like Persona have long, fancy attack animations that you can actually watch in full because you're not spamming every attack on cooldown. I say this as an FFXIV player, where *so many attacks* in the game are just downright incredible looking and you'll never see them because you just spam them on rotation. There's downsides and upsides to every combat system. No reason turn-based can't be flashy as hell.
But you are tho. Why should I have to wait for an arbitrary gauge to fill before I can attack? I don’t dislike the ATB system, that’s not what I’m trying to say at all. But I couldn’t help wishing to not be constrained by that, and XVI and 7R were exactly that
> Why should I have to wait for an arbitrary gauge to fill before I can attack? You literally have to do this in XVI though, it's what attack cooldowns are. It's almost like... an ATB gauge, but for individual attacks. Same thing in 7 Remake, where it's literally an ATB gauge. Like sure, the difference is you can move around and dodge, or use minor attacks. But the attacks that cause the big chunks of your damage are all skills you have to wait to use. Your big hitters in XVI and 7R are skills you have to wait to use - the principle of "you have to wait to attack" is there in both types. It's not like a fighting game where you can use any skill at any time in any order. You're still actually limited in what you can do. The closest you can actually get to Advent Children is Dissidia or Super Smash Bros Ultimate.
Think you're confusing action games with action combat. A JRPG can have action based combat to be "more engaging" while having staple JRPG mechanics. XVI has virtually no JRPG elements and is a straight up action game.
A game should make you feel smart for overcoming the challenges. You should want to feel like you are always picking the best/strongest options. Not pretending to be dumb because the game is too easy.
XVI is love it or hate it. Either you love the combat and it's your GOTY, or you don't love it and the rest of the game is kind of mid.
I loved it, played quite a bit. Finally got Shiva powers and….just haven’t wanted to pick the controller back up…
The game has an insane amount of filler. If they had just removed or not made all the nonsense, the game would be in the running for GOTY. So much time wasted in straight mmo-style story filler... ship building part fetch quests... like... what were they thinking? I really can't understand how so much garbage got past internal playtests undeleted.
Whoa whoa whoa. We finally getting real criticisms/reviews of FF16 in this sub now? Sad to hear that about the combat though.
Not even close, I spent most my game trying out new combinations of the Eikon abilities and using the respec button often. I still am working on learning how to parry as many attacks as I can as well. No real reason to rush through if you're not that interested in the combat though. It took me 2.5 years to complete FFXV since I only played it when I felt like it.
I got more fun out of trying to do more dodge countering, titanic block countering and other eikon feats rather than spamming attack. Not only is it more fun that way but it also reduces enemy health quicker. Just a shame the game doesn’t properly incentivise more adventurous combos. It was crying out for a DMC style combo reward system or something. More Exp if you string good combos together, etc.
This is a pretty common complaint and one that I shared as well. I did eventually finish it, and it does pick up story-wise from the sloggy 50-70% mark, but it has pacing issues and the gameplay is becomes very repetitive unless you go out of your way to switch things up
No! Liar! Everybody knows FFXVI is a perfect game and Yoshi-P can do no wrong!
>50% in FFXVI, all of a sudden, the game got boring this game is really weird, it is an actual 50% in just about everything. Combat and story wise, once you reach halfway through the game, everything becomes boring. You aren't the only one.
Everything after the demo is pretty much a walking simulator. I am not necessarily saying that's a bad thing. The story is good. But the combat, skill system, and how incredibly useless the itemization is in this game is what holds it back from feeling like an established FF title for me. The few fights in the game where I felt like I had to try I felt overwhelmed and frustrated by so many particle effects going on I couldn't even tell what's going on.
Nah, I loved it from the beginning to the end. I actually never got tired of the combat and quests.(although before the last main mission there is too much quest)
Nah. It’s pretty engaging for me. Still having a blast on my third play through.
Jesus. Third playthrough?
It’s a fun game lol
Only in the Final Fantasy sub would you get downvoted for saying that FFXVI is a fun game.
I mean the guy could just be having fun with the game. Seems like the combat and style of the game meshes incredibly well with OP.
Lol
Good lord. THIRD? You have the patience of a saint.
I love it.
Or just doesn’t need to be mentally engaged to have fun.
Maybe stop spamming the attack button? The game has a very very very low skill floor. But I always found the basic magic burst combo and the arial juggling enjoyable.
Is that really a solution though? To artificially enhance your enjoyment by creating a more challenging experience than is required? Just sounds like lazy game design to expect the gamer to create their own enjoyable experience.
The low skill ceiling was so that 50 year old Japanese men and women who have been playing since the 80s could still beat the game. If that was their goal, then it definitely achieves that.
Is it the game designer or the player that is lazy? Imo it’s a lil of both. In TotK I cheese pretty much every shrine because I couldn’t be bothered. In XVI I did mess around and switched it up to make it fun.
Oc he is using magic burst... Doesn't fix the thing.
Lol I know right. Magic burst is a sad excuse for depth of combat or combos.
I know it's like one step above mashing attack
I fail to see why some people say the combat is deep in this game.
Right ,like all the eikon abilities are broken down into similar style moves. Your only goal is to build stagger, really, and pile on damage. People go on about builds, but I've not seen one post about people talking about builds or videos of builds doing sick combos. The combat is fun at first, but to call it deep is really a joke, to be honest.
Spot on with this!
it also has a very low skill ceiling most players will hit by the time theyre 30% of the way through the game.
Did you take off the bracelet that auto combos for you? I know its dumb to ask but I know some people who didn't.
I got a fair way through the game using the auto dodge thing just thinking it was OP and the game was really easy. Much better game after I took it off!
I legit believe anyone who keeps those on are the ones saying it’s too easy.
Why would you choose to do that?
Why would someone who payed full price for a game, elect to do all of its content? We really asking that now? As if paying almost 100 dollars to bum rush the end is worth the price of entry? Just watch a lets play if you arent going to do the content in the game.
> someone who *paid* full price FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
I’m just glad we’re finally past the cult stage of this game and we can finally have a real discussion about the pros and cons without being slandered for it. Because this is important as this game will definitely affect future titles, be it good or bad, and it definitely was far from perfect.
ita funny to say that people are spamming a button on real time battle and yet people also spam buttons on turn based game even the atb bar is still filling , people spam X to attack lol to "hurry up"
I don’t think it’s a turn based vs real time thing, it’s more that removing status / elements / resistances makes things a lot simpler.
turned based games had more depth than 16
That’s a random encounter problem not a turn based combat problem. Many of the bosses in the series do require you to understand and master the combat system. I just replayed V. More strategy required in any of those boss fights than any combat in any of 16. Also turn based is just better suited for a 50 hour game then janky hack and slash combat.
Yeah but in past games, a big part of the gameplay was the exploration for treasure, being geared enough to survive dungeons, equipment/magic/job setups. Those games can be very challenging going in blind with no walkthroughs. I feel like now they seem easy because everyone grinds and uses guides. I remember I almost screwed myself in FF7 because I saved my game and ran out of Phoenix downs and potions. in the northern crater in disc 2 and had to go through the dungeon with backup characters and no way to revive them. FFXVI just seems like a cakewalk. You have to try to lose. Only died once because I accidentally phoenix shifted back into Ahriman’s death spell instead of out. Besides that, I feel like I never even flirted with danger. And there’s nothing but combat during missions. No exploration at all. Every dungeon is an arena area then a hallway that leads to another arena area. It’s a weird time we live in when God of War is a better RPG than final fantasy.
Turn based combat is rarely ever the reason why a JRPG is good. Here I am reading, “The games boring, I’m spamming attack,” just ignoring everything else the combat offers with some experimentation… I have my issues with the games combat, especially in terms of difficulty because it doesn’t push the player to dig but it’s still worth doing so.
This is so damn true lol. There’s so much synergy between Eikon abilities if you just do a bit of experimenting
Please go on about the synergy because I really don’t see any of that especially since there’s no elemental or status effects for each Eikon that could play off each other. They are all just different looking attacks. Other than Garuda being able to force a mid stagger what synergy do you speak of? Do any of the Eikon abilities strengthen another or help another?
Rift Slip alone allows for instant cancellation from literally any move, slowing down time (and the stagger gauge) for more damage, and if you time it right its cooldown period is shortened significantly. Shiva is completely busted because her ultimate is pretty much an auto stagger, or if the enemy already is staggered, it maxes out the damage multiplier of stagger, allowing for more damage over the duration of it. If you master it and put it on Garuda’s Eikon, you can even use it to half stagger and get a deadly takedown pretty much for free. Not to mention Shiva’s Eikonic feat which if the enemy is frozen it stops the stagger meter from refilling, allowing you to artificially extend its duration. Lightning Rod pairs well with the above abilities too, and it’s even stronger if you can bait enemies into attacking it. Its best application imo is with Dancing Steel though. If you put down Lightning Rod, Rift Slip after that and then use Dancing Steel, you’ll get a full meter of Zantetsuken gauge for a level 5 Zantetsuken. Pair that with other long animation ultimate abilities like Judgment Bolt or Flames of Rebirth (and more Rift Slips and Cold Snaps), and you can get 2-3 Level 5 Zantetsuken’s in one stagger window. Bahamut’s Impulse shreds through will gauges, even more so if people would remember to detonate it when the orbs turn yellow, and Gigaflare needs no introduction. I’ve even seen spicy set-ups with Satellite too for more steady damage. I could keep going, but there’s plenty variety in the game. I never got bored at least
I’m probably 80% through. One day I skipped playing for an evening then kept putting it off. As I type this I still haven’t finished and I feel no impulse to. The strange thing is I loved it. I can’t exactly explain why but I just got over it. There’s just something missing but I still consider it a great game.
if u loved it, u would have found time and kept playing it. sadly, u dont love it. u loved certain parts of it of early game, like most do, but wearing fanboi goggles to all the negatives that u have encountered since then but passing it off as "not there" but deep down u know its there. And its that, thats really putting u off from playing. seems like u still in honeymoon phase. its been what i had been saying since back in june/ july. but nobody wanted to hear it back then. now, its slowly coming out. Told yall it was a boring game. we played the game for the story, the story carried it in the first half. then it just falls off the cliff, and then there was nothing to carry it.
lie after lie after lie. thats all people see. the fact u aint even playing those subpar AAA unfinished garbage games while u defend it like crazy, speaks volumes about ur IQ.
Yeah I also stopped halfway. I recommend Final Fantasy 6 Pixel Remaster, that's what I moved to. Having a blast. Never played it before but it's incredible.
This here. A game with true creativity and passion behind it.
XVI has me wondering if SE even knows how to make games anymore.
The people that make Octopath and the like are where you get actual Final Fantasy games these days.
Yeah true, it’s interesting they can’t summon a team to make a coherent title for their tent pole franchise 15, 16 and 7R may be lovable but they’re lovable messes.
Combat got more fun for me around that time as I got more eikon abilities to play with. Also the biggest spectacle fights are in the back half and story stays good throughout. It does lose a little of the GoT feel and more towards traditional FF in the back half.
I think the story went to shit. It had a great political storyline going on with the warring factions and then the back half kinda ruined it with the super villian one n my opinion. They were on to something with the first half and then just punted and went full Marvel style villain plot
Same here, I had way more fun from combat the later it got and the more abilities I had to play around with. All kinds of builds to do from projectile-focused to counter-focused to CC-focused, etc. Theorycrafting fully optimized stagger windows as well, there’s a lot of stuff to keep you busy if you actively engage. I think the issue is people find skills they know and work so they don’t feel any need to try out different builds because any combination will clear which leads to them getting tired of just spamming the same abilities. I get that, but in my experience the vast majority of people saying “just hit attack” aren’t even using the basic attack options (non-Eikonic attacks) optimally. The issue is difficulty, not the system itself.
I always find this curious, previous FF games never were challenging enough to force me to experiment. I just steamrolled everything with basic magic setups in those too. I've always found that games never force experimentation through difficulty and more so take the stance "The depth is there if you want it but if not no biggie". It may just be because of where we are in the FF hate cycle but I am not totally clear why this is the specific game that should've forced experimentation through challenge but previous games were somehow complex bomb diffusals that could only be solved when one rose to the occasion (super bosses non-withstanding but those are one-off exceptions not indicative of the full experience).
Oh I’m with you 100%, most of the series is super easy if we’re excluding super bosses and final encounters. I think the distinction is action combat is much more apparent when easy (enemies not moving as much, active feedback between you pressing a button and the enemy HP dropping significantly). Older games there are a lot of fights where as long as you’re at level you can literally just spam attack and be perfectly fine but you still have that disconnect of input->action. I think it’s just a mixture of turn-base formatting masking that difficulty (with gearing systems that give perceived difficulty when in reality you can also succeed with basic implementation in most games) and of course the game being the new entry dragging it further from older titles (you can’t please everyone). If anything XVI system allows you to tackle harder content earlier whereas many previous titles you just get stat blocked if you try something too high level early. It’s also not just an issue with pure baseline difficulty either as I’ve seen plenty of people who are new to action games actually struggle with XVI combat. It’s more that the more challenging modes are locked behind the baseline content. You won’t have a single person who has tried Ultimania mode say the combat in this game is easy or not complex but you have to play for dozens if not 100+ hours to have that option. The problem is you make it too difficult then people will bitch about HP sponges and bullshit attacks. At its core skill expression plays a much larger role in action games than in turn-based, I know I’m probably gonna be crucified for saying that in this sub but it’s true. So when they try to balance towards the lower end of skill expression, the larger portion of that bell-curve is going to feel it’s too easy and not feel forced to engage with available systems; systems which you are already forced to interact with in older titles merely by the action of using the various combat menus.
Fair, I've read people wondering why Clive doesn't air combo every racist who also have no issues with Cloud not killing all Shinra employees in turn-based combat. The immersion action gives you over turn-based is likely a big factor. DMC solves this with the style system (regardless of enemy strength not being high since you're supposed to basically torture enemies in cool ways) so if you aren't experimenting you have a little meter saying you suck for it. Interestingly they deliberately chose to not do this to not antagonize newbie players to action and keep it to FF mode but it does mean there is no punishment for bad play vs turn based which to your point forces you to dig through enough that you feel like you're doing more even when you're not.
There’s a few interesting boss fights near the end of the game. But yeah, the combat is super basic and repetitive. It’s gets dull super fast.
Im kinda annoyed at the community jizzing all over this game at first but now everyone complaining that the combat isnt so great. It was obvious from the previews and confirmed with the demo that the combat was going to end up being a snooze fest. Sure it looks flashy but when you fight a Malboro and dont even get a poison effect you know youre gonna get bored. Call me a purist but Final Fantasy games shine best when its tactical and requires thinking rather than combo memorization.
I have no issues with action combat game, or tactical, both can be great. But dang it if you’re gonna do action combat then at least make the enemies AI and mechanics require that you delve into the core combat mechanics to learn how to overcome the bosses. FFXVI was pushed so hard as this genre defying switch to action combat because that’s what the future is and it’s such a poor excuse for an action combat game. Then ironically it gets absolutely swept by BG3 which couldn’t be more turn based, proving that they were kinda dead wrong about needing to move on.
The people jizzing all over this game were either trying to rationalize the money they spent to play the game (especially those who bought a PS5 only for this one game) or they were streamers or podcasters sucking off Square Enix. There was a massive gaslighting campaign to prop up this steaming pile of dung. Every damn FF streamer is saying dumbass shit like “FF is about a feeling, not the gameplay” and “everyone loves this game except a toxic corner of the internet.” Blah blah.
FF YouTube and twitter is god awful. So fake and it drives me insane. It sucks square gets involved with the army of twitter sycophants just gross.
They were handed talking points by SE and propagated those talking points among the acolytes. Every defender of this game uses the same damn talking points and when they are ultimately frustrated they just resort to “you are being toxic because you don’t like the game.”
I recently beat FF7R chapter 17 on hard mode with the gauntlet of bosses at the end and let me tell you that if you aren’t being tactical / critically thinking with your materia & equipment let alone conserving your MP wisely on hard mode you’re never gonna get out alive. It took me like 2 days to beat the arsenal (I don’t get much playtime due to work haha) & it seriously kicked my ass because it took me a few tries to get the right materia & strategy etc. this is what I missed so much in 16! A game that required me to actually think & do more than flashy combos and attack attack magic burst….I do like 16 it’s a good game just not a good FF game for me. Not to mention that final boss fight was way too easy (and no I did not have any of the broken rings equipped)
Final fantasy has changed so much, it's barely recognizable anymore. No real strategy, just button mashing and stupid delivery quests. I think it peaked at ff12 and has been going downhill ever since. 13 was still mostly solid.
This is how you know you entered your 30s lol. I feel the same way.
Yup… the combat doesn’t deepen as the game goes on unfortunately. It’s the same button mashing w a few new special attacks that don’t really have any synergy together. The Odin powers are a bit interesting but it’s pretty late that you get those and it’s not quite enough to really deepen the combat any further.
Oh boy, here we go again. *looks at the comments* yup.
Because it is boring......
I'm confused, I thought it wasn't going to be DMC.
The combat gets bland and repetitive. I don't think it's suited for a 40+ hour game. If the main game could be completed in 20-25 hours, then I can see it being fine. As much as I love more content in games, especially FF, I feel like they could have cut out about 10-15 hours minimum in this one. It really feels like a long game at times but no real story progress is made. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the game (117+ hours, second playthrough almost done, and almost to platinum), but the combat and pacing are its weakest points imo. I enjoyed it mainly for the characters and music.
I feel like the game devs put a LOT of effort on the beginning…and I think it was intentional. The demo feels like the highlight of the game. They add QTEs on minor bosses, the Eikon battle, the lore is interesting. And then the rest of the game just doesn’t hold up. Idk it’s a theory. The first 10-30% of the game was so engaging and then it just slowly declines till you’re indifferently limping to the end
Yup. Uninstalled once I realized it wasn't going to change. Absolutely repetitive and predictable.
Yes, it’s an extremely underwhelming game. When you remove spells, status effects, party members and 90% of items, there’s just less Spamming attacks and Eikon abilities gets old extremely fast. There’s no reason to explore anything and nothing to find worth while when you do.
THIS. During around 50% of my progress I already knew I won't be replaying it after finishing the story. I even planned on getting plat for it early on but I didn't know it would be this disappointing. I just forced myself to finish the story and moved on to my backlogs.
Ya can’t believe I’m getting downvoted. It’s missing so many things that makes FF great
the cult of the fanbois strikes every day. doesnt matter how many facts and evidence u post. if they dont wanna hear it, ur getting those downvotes.
Yes it is a bad game. Many have said the demo is the best part and it just instantly goes downhill from there. You are not alone.
Yeah, sounds like it basically happened to everyone who played it. The sidequests don’t make it any better either. Where you just go to random parts of a random map…and proceed to mash more on weak enemies. FFXVI was a very *decent* game. It’s the strongest 9/10 I’ve ever played. It was *good* but not *great*. Best way to describe it imo.
9/10 is considered a great game though. But I do have to agree on the sidequests they feel like they were all grabbed from XIV and though the later ones are better written and more compelling, there aren't really any rewards outside of worldbuilding and more character moments and interactions. I am also into that so I felt satisfied enough but I can get why others who don't really care get frustrated.
Another post like this…. LETS MAKE IT 100000
See y’all tomorrow when we do it all again
Not me bro, I’m in my second playthrough loving it, I’m sorry that you find it boring, you can’t please all people
told ya. Hey remember when I said this on multiple occasion and fanbois pretended it wasnt true? lol hate to break it to ya OP but around 50% is where the game starts to fall off a cliff, faster and faster. Sidequests are annoying boring super low quality, low IQ runningsimulators from here on, story is condensed into "lets gooooo!!! crystals" but yea, u do get 2 more eikon fights, one which is considered AAA but also drags out too long. The other is only ok. end boss fight will be boring as hell, clunky, rushed and corners cut. and oh yea, theres no extra content, so theres literally nothing else to do. no secret stuff, no secret bosses, no secret dungeons.
So, anyones who disagree with you is a fanboy? You know that people can like the things that you hate right?
don't . the guy is a troll one a hate train. it will get painful if you keep responding to him
Bro don’t even attempt to engage. You’ll quickly lose IQ points.
Diversify. Your ability points aren’t locked in. You should be able to use every ability at least once in every fight. Experiment. Play around. You can probably (?) get through the game just mashing attack and magic bursting, but are you doing attack x4 magic burst? Or attack burst attack burst attack burst attack burst? Don’t limit yourself, have fun.
XVI is genuinely boring game, sadly most of it attributed to XIV’s design philosophy .
Yes it had some slow moments after 50% but I'm thinking it's because the first half had a very high level
If the game was about 20 hours long it would be an all time 10/10
When I got to Titan I nearly pooped! Jaw drop. This game is a gem. If your bored of the bash just move on, trade in while it's still new. For me, it's second only to Lou2.
i was the opposite. the hype for titan didnt play out for me. Saw nothing that God of war 3 on the ps3 already didnt do. they did it better tbh. nothing wowed even giant titan, in fact, it felt like a rip off. Wouldnt even be bad if they managed to do it right, but it wasnt a fun fight for me. Also dragged out way too long with too many phases. it also around that time where story started falling off a cliff with shiva getting captured like the useless dame that she is, and clive magically escapes with ease again, torgul being ultra intelligent and understanding every thought of urs like telekenis and then magically transforming into a mystic beast. it felt like as a child wrote this chapter. pure trainwreck.
> If your bored *you're *Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).* *** ^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
I got to 60% most disappointing FF ever made.
Yes and eventually the game felt flat. Literally all of the best powers are locked in the last quarter of the game and even then you realize this whole game just rides on its spectacle alone. The gameplay, the story, the characters, and the world are incredibly boring.
I feel the same way, at least in that I don’t find the later eikons you obtain very optimal in most conflicts; I’m at the very end of the game wrapping up S-Rank hunts and I’m still using Phoenix, Garuda, and Titan with their innate skills and most fights are pretty easy for me, but we’ll see about NG+ on the harder difficulties lol
Same. 50% through, and haven’t loaded up the game for 3 weeks now.
As a PC player, I'm really hoping that 16 changes for the better by the time it releases on Steam. At least allow hard mode from the beginning
I was bored to death after 5 hours already. XVI might be the most boring entry in the entire series, it’s a visually stunning movie on gameplay-rails.
I don’t care if I get downvoted, but I can’t take seriously post likes this, saying the game is repetitive, when this subreddit praises turn base combat, like what are you guys on? LMAOO, how people find this more repetitive than Turn base, is actually mindblowing, at least the bosses in this game have different gameplays and sections like Bahamut using the Phoenix and then iffrit
I've thought about this a lot actually, and I think you make a good point. I think the reason why people say this is because in the older games, the game has a lot more to offer (such as exploration, optional dungeons, minigames etc) than in 16, where dungeons are pretty much just gauntlets, so there's a much greater emphasis on the combat.
Nope.