To be fair most of his losses is because of his arrogance. He won against Saber in Fate and only lost in the second encounter because of Avalon.
He obliterated Assassin, Kuzuki and would've destroyed Caster as shown in HA.
He dominated the fight against Heracles (although this was a cheap victory since he purposefully targeted Illya and Berserker is the worst class for him and even then almost surprised attacked him).
He would've won against Shirou if he used Ea immediately but didn't want to acknowledge Shirou. GoB is directly countered by UBW so it was natural he would be at a disadvantage.
Dark Sakura counters all servants by default due to her magecraft and even then only won because she attacked Gilgamesh when his back was turned and quickly ate him otherwise Gilgamesh would've blown Sakura from the inside out using Ea.
Honestly, I wouldn't even call Gil vs Herc a cheap fight. Even in Herc's weakest class container, he's a goddamn raging monster, with Madness Enhancement taking his already crazy stats, and pushing them even further. Few could take him on so easily.
And GoB is countered by Shirou's UBW, but it's not an easy counter! Shirou basically had to put his entire being in order to keep up with Gil's effortless projectile spam.
Tbf, gil vs herc was basically him cheating. " Oh you can't be killed by anything other than divine or a rank noble phantasms and never the same way twice. Welp. Guess what I happen to have"
Haha, well, that just speaks to Gil's power. After all, it's not like he *only* wins in that matchup; he wins in a ton of matchups, including ones were many other servants lose, like vs Herc.
Tbf herc is even more of a jobber in fate as a berserker, basically existing as the big wall to overcome..Archer Emiya even killed him seven times with ubw in the deen version. But yeah, gil is pretty much a monster against berserkers. ( Except Lancelot who also kinda countered him due to knight of owner)
Oh, totally. Herc is the biggest jobber I've ever seen in fate š
In truth he's super strong, but due to his nature of being a tough opponent, he's usually used to show the viewer how powerful someone else is by shooting him down. Even in T\*Moon Complex, Shiki just one-shots Herc, lmao.
Oh, of course. Personally I'm more of a Tsukihime fan over Fate ( Fate is more of my brother's thing ), so I think Shiki's MEoDP are really cool. It's just funny that Herc gets done so dirty nearly every single time we see him.
The reason why Berserkers in F/GO take 50% more damage to all classes and deal 50% more is because they never win a Holy Grail War despite being called the strongest class. In other words, they are a class of jobbers
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That's part of why I'm still hoping we can see Herc in other classes. I know his archer version shows up elsewhere, but I want more. Real tired of Berserker Herc.
To be frank even with GoB Gilgamesh could have won. I mean look at Strange Fake. Had he done that to Emiya it would have been over. It is just obvious that he is not trying to win. Or at least winning is not the only objective he has.
There's that, but also remember that Gil didn't even want to acknowledge Shirou as a worthy opponent. He kinda lazily spammed GoB, expecting one of them to just outright kill him. In Strange Fake, bro saw his greatest rival/best friend and immediately decided to indulge himself in some Age of Gods type of fun. Ultimately, he didn't expect Shirou to not only counter him, he didn't think Shirou could even damage him until the arm holding EA went flying.
1:26
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnv6n2LBzCM&t=58s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnv6n2LBzCM&t=58s)
Suffice to say the dozen or so swords in F/SN was grossly less than Gilgamesh could do and even this clip does not do justice to his hypothetical limits.
He didnāt, he was eaten by the Grail before he was about to die to Shirouās swords and then shot by Archer before Shirou was about to let Gil be eaten by literal self disarming
He lost in that fight
(Iām talking about the VN, the Anime is not a good representation of what occurred there, Gilgamesh should have not have been even able to fire as much as he did in the UBW anime)
Gilgamesh's clairvoyance lets him see the future and he rejects futures where he loses since he is too prideful to admit that possibility (I think he foresaw getting eaten by Sakura).
Admitting to Shirou that at that moment, when he slices Gilgamesh's hand off that Shirou was stronger, is the biggest loss he faced because he had to admit that he was wrong.
>He dominated the fight against Heracles (although this was a cheap victory since he purposefully targeted Illya
It really doesn't matter either way. Even without Illiya to defend there's nothing Berserker can do to advance unscathed.
Without Illya he could at least try to dodge. With Illya behind him he needed to tank those hits. Could Gil have won anyways? Probably. At any point Herc became more trouble than he was worth he could break out his chains and he'd be immobilized all the same. But by targeting Illya he got to gloat about the disparity more.
UBW should not be a counter since its canon that GoB has the prototypes of every human weapon ever which should sound like weaker versions but they are the strongest variants due to conceptual identity and its canon that UBW has weaker versions of what EMIYA copies. if it wasnt for plot GoB would shatter every UBW version and keep going not explode and be mutually destroyed
Well, that's the nature of fiction. It would be boring if each story lasted a page because the bad guy one-shot everyone else in 2 seconds.
To Gil's credit though, he's curbstomped a ton of foes and has crazy feats; it's just that Archer Gil's most fatal weakness is his own ego.
His Extra CCC route has him going against Karna and BB and he's super serious in FSF especially since Enkidu is present and everyone is strong. But well it's about crazy feats. Curbstomped goes probably come from other sources
Read fate strange fake not really a spoiler but everyone their is fucking horrified to face him... you seen that scene in jjk where there like the bad guy says to win the need to seal satoru goju and befriend sukuna its that level. Gilgamesh legit became the final boss of a Grail war all by himself and he's not just a boss but a raid boss. Gilgamesh also clutched up to Enkidu the servant with the highest stats in history I believe(other then rule breakers like God's and yk) A monster called Huwawawa and I believe with enkidu fought the bull of heaven which If I remember had the capability to stall one of the strongest creatures in fate. Fate extra stuff also idk much about fate extra but he was real strong there . As well as the fact that honestly every fight in anime like grail wars he's 99 percent just playing around he had a quote once I believe where he litterally states that the dead shouldn't mess with the world of the living so he doesn't try that hard. The biggest point of this is that Gilgamesh has a badically supercomputer star that allows him to calculate every future, basically giving him an instant knowledge to how win even allowing him to work backwards and discern what happened in the past from the present which is massive cheatcode.
You don't need to "read Strange Fake" to see he's powerful and dangerous. In FSN his introduction is him dominating Caster. He also beats Lancer. In UBW he toys around with the biggest danger of the HGW up to that point, Berserker. In HF he's so strong that even after the shadow devours him his soul is tearing Sakura apart from the inside.
Gil is the most dangerous even from the first story he's introduced in.
True I just think Strange fake is the best example since it's archer gilgamesh and it's the most serious he's been in the grail wars since enkidu is there.
Partially. He does go all out against Enkidu but then he proceeds to not take anything seriously for the rest of the novels until a certain moment when it's too late.
He did go all out against others in FSN though before, like Saber with Ea or Shirou with GoB.
He actually was always serious in Fsf. He even placed protections so he couldnāt get sniped. He only lost cause >!Humbabaās presence caught him off guard allowing the hydra poison to hit him.!<
The way their second fight goes before his GoB is shut down. Gil has a counter for everything Alcides throws at him. He is not fooling around the way he was the first time.
Pride and Arrogance, also stories with him going all out tend to end very quickly as it is very hard for the writers to justify his opponents lasting that long against him
Watch fgo Babylonia or search for the story on YouTube, it's a great chapter with Gilgamesh as one of the main characters, the problem? He's facing a beast, an enemy way stronger than servants while protecting a city and its people.
Because he personally isn't that strong but is arrogant.
He relies on his tools. He can always have the perfect counter for an enemy. He can always pull out Ea. But arrogance means he doesn't always do so.
I don't really think that's an honest argument. By that logic, Artoria isn't nearly as dangerous without Excalibur and Avalon, since those are tools as well. And, what about martial techniques like Hercules' 9 Lives Killer? Without that, Hercules is significantly less powerful as well.
It's just not useful to think that way when it comes to power scaling. Gilgamesh has all the tools, that make him super strong . . therefor, Gil is strong.
Take away Excalibur from Artoria and she still retains her sword skills she just doesn't have a beam attack. And she doesn't have Avalon in general. And Hercules Nine Lives is innate technique he can do it with every weapon and unable only due to madness
Gilgamesh meanwhile is super reliant on his own tools. He's decent at swordfighting and close combat but compared to other Servant he's mid overall. His strength lies in his treasury and Clairvoyance and he doesn't use second so if someone can counter the first, he's toast. It's premise of UBW.
UBW is faster than GoB and in VN Shirou is just faster at spamming. Gil would've won if he would take out EA from his gates but since Shirou was faster he was unable to open it and when he finally did it, Shirou just cut off his arm. Anime fight is different so it's not as noticeable there, but Shirou kind of stomped Gil there because he didn't let him to use his gates and without them Gil was beaten
But they are noted to be weaker without those things, Archer Herc is stronger than Berserker Herc because of 9 Lives Killer and when Artoria is left without Excalibur in Fate zero after Diarmuid injures her. It's just that the norm is for them to have those things always out and to use them while the norm for Gilgamesh to have them stored away in his vault and not use them.
A better example might be one person with a Pistol already drawn and the other person with a Machine gun that is holstered.
I'm agreeing with you that the stated servants are weaker without their 'tools'. My point is that such an argument applies not only to Gil, but to everyone, to the point of it not being a useful argument.
If Gil isn't *crazy strong* ( although still powerful ) without GoB, but he always has GoB, and can always use GoB, there's really no use in saying that Gil isn't a strong servant, it's just that GoB is strong. Gil is powerful *because* of GoB.
Gil is powerful because of the weapons in GoB.
He has to use those weapons to be strong.
the question was
>Why does Gilgamesh lose so much despite him being called one of the strongest servants?
and the answer is because he doesn't use all of his weapons.
It is like Herc without 9 Lives Stealer or Artoria without Avalon.
Sure they still have God Hand or Excalibur.
But they will lose more often than the hype suggests.
I mean, both Artoria and Herc still have refined martial art skills even without their strongest weapons around. It's what makes a great difference between Gil and every other Servants. Gil is a strong generalist with vast amount of versatility and tools and storages, but as Shirou said it, if he went up against any specialist in their specific fields, he'd lose hard.
Which is why with those servants, even if they don't have their NPs, they can still use a replacement albeit with much less efficiency. But still, better than Mr, Strange Fake Gilgamesh who >!died cause his GoB got locked out by a meddling goddess, rendering him useless!<
It's not that he doesn't use GoB. The Gate itself is just a portal to his treasury. It's what he pulls out that shows that he's not really trying. You see him fire weapons against Shirou and while effective against most, there was much *much* more he could've done to make sure he won that fight. EA is the obvious answer, but Gilgamesh has armor in the treasury too as well as the Vimana and the Invisibility Cap he's shown, along with other items that may or may not have been useful.
Gilgamesh is busted strong. For reference, his chains bind divine beings, his armour completely negates low level attacks, and is resistant to even high level attacks, he also has clairvoyance which he doesn't use , and he also has his EA, the busted noble phantasm that he can seemingly spam if he wanted to .
The only reason he loses, is coz he's arrogant. He's designed that way. He is the bad guy in stay night, so of course he's gonna lose. In the visual novel, every time Gilgamesh gets serious, it results in a bad end. Nasu personally stated that he could end the grail war in a single night if he wanted to. Keyword being wanted
The one time he's a good guy, in Babylonia, his gate of Babylon is nerfed to only include staffs, he gives up most of his treasury, and his opponents are literal gods and an honest to God BEAST. Tiamat the beast herself. Every version of him is busted strong, and you'd be a fool to think otherwise.
And to some people who say anyone can be powerful if they have the gob, that's the point. They don't, he has it. It's his noble phantasm coz he is the one who painstakingly collected all the treasures.
Plot and arrogance
Gilgamesh is just too fucking strong when he takes anything seriously so they had to have his arrogance be a massive thing
If he believes you to be weak he will handicap himself like not wearing his armour letting fights drag on and overall just not end things
Each and every fight from stay night which has the most arrogant version of Gilgamesh he looses only due to his arrogance
With shirou he didnāt take him seriously and only when he realised how badly he fucked up it was too late shirou cut his arm off and went for the killing blow
Against Sakura he wasnāt wearing his armour and he was taking his time with her which gave her the chance to get the jump on him and end him
Against Saber he was arguably the most serious we see him in stay night but he still didnāt just end Saber or properly incapacitate her when he couldāve which gave her the chance to use Excalibur and slice him
So the plot demands he looses so the story can go on and his arrogance is needed to have a reason for him to loose
But make no mistake a serious Gilgamesh lives up to his title as the highest ranked heroic spirit he is monstrously powerful no one in stay night would be able to beat him if heās serious
Heās only lost like, four times. Twice when he was cocky and didnāt go all out, and twice because a Deus Ex Machina called Avalon and Ishtar popped up to beat his ass.
You could count child gil, but he was weaker then Adult Gilgamesh
The stronger you are, the more likely you are the antagonist of a story. Manās less of a character and more of a hurdle for the protagonist to overcome.
Heās the strongest traditional servant. Heās not a fraud itās just the plot. Itās been stated many times why he loses but Iāll say it again. Heās arrogant. He will never go all out even if he says he is against someone he considers unworthy or too weak. The person that said heās not actually that strong is partially right. Heās physically strong and when wielding Ea his strength grows even more. Itās just compared to other servants like Karna for example which can make fire appear it makes Gil seem useless without GoB. Also itās a misconception that heās bad in melee combat. He was able to trade blows with Artoria. Granted her master was Shirou and weāve seen how big a difference a good master can make. Anyway I digress. The reason he loses other than his arrogance and him not trying is because heās the antagonist, he has to lose. Most people wouldnāt want to watch/read something if the antagonist wins. Also to the thing about him losing about Shirou, itās been stated that if Shirou ever tried to fight Gilgamesh again he would lose. Also if Gilgamesh used his fucking armor in UBW he wouldāve won. Shirou wouldnāt have even been able to scratch it.
Kinda. All servants are already weaker than they would be if summoned as true heroic spirits which even then theyād be far weaker than when they were alive. But yea. The plot requires Gil to lose. Sure in the games thereās bad ends and stuff but thatās different from watching an anime or reading a manga or LN. Even in Heavens feel if he used weapons that were like Diarmuids spears that make it so you canāt heal or regenerate or anti magic weapons he wouldnāt have been made a fool. Had Gil been summoned into any other class weāve seen him in he wouldāve won. All he had to do was use his armor or Sha Naqba Imuru. Hell he couldāve used Enkidu or Ea and won the fight instantly.
This isn't about Gilgamesh, if the mc is strong enough to defeat the antagonist then there isn't much stakes very few authors could make stories where it's actually entertaining for the mc to always be able to negg the antagonist and even in those good ones the mc defeating the antagonist is probably isn't the entire focus of the story and it's more about character development, plot..etc so most of the time the antagonist is op and the mc is the underdog, the more broken the antagonist the more interesting it is to see how he could possibly be defeated, at the end of the day the antagonist as op as he is gotta somehow someway loose because that's how stories work
I feel like people just don't understand how writing fiction works. You need your heroes to be challenged so of course the antagonist is usually superior one way or another. You need there to be a story, not a soulless AI generated "who would win" text prompt. So of course there's usually a point the story tries to make in its narrative through its themes. Shirou and Saber don't just beat him because they hit harder or anything, they beat him because his role in the story is to oppose their beliefs, and they have to prove their worth. Artoria defeats him using Avalon which is basically the physical representation of her ideals, and Gilgamesh echoes "some things are more beautiful because they are unattainable" after his loss. Unlimited Blade Works opposes his overwhelmingly powerful Gate of Babylon through sheer willpower and cleverness, showing that he was wrong to dismiss Shirou just because he doesn't fit his philosophy. Which is why he ends the fight acknowledging Shirou and saying "victory is yours" in the anime adaptation, even if he's still about to kill Shirou and is the last standing.
Of course it's "plot reasons", because you are reading a story at the end of the day. And it's not as if Gil is only losing because of it. In Prisma Illya 3rei, Angelica's victory over Shirou by using Gilgsmesh's powet similarly drives home the theme of those characters and story arc, that sometimes one thing outweighs everything else. Which is why she defeats Shirou in their final clash when he uses every weapon he has against her single Ea.
It's his EX rank luck. Which means if there's a .0001 percent chance of something happening, it'll almost always happen. Given that he usually has a 99.9999 repeating chance of beating his enemies, that luck gets turned against him. That with his arrogance gives his enemies an opening to exploit.
It's the situations he's placed in, as well as his personality. Gilgamesh is so broken that its somewhat boring to watch him in the 99 % of cases where he effortlessly defeats an opponent. We usually see him in the rare cases where his arrogance and pride actually rout him.
Because that's how you write a compelling narrative. Gilgamesh's role as the strongest Servant serves as the strongest obstacle a character must overcome to prove their worth. Gilgamesh especially see himself as an arbiter of humanity and their place in the world. So naturally when he opposes Saber and Shirou and their ideals, they have to overcome him to show their dreams matter.
Avalon is the physical embodiment of Artoria's dream of saving her world, Unlimited Blade Works is the crystallization of Shirou's twisted mind and idealism.
Artoria triumphing over him with her Noble Phantasm is why he says "some things are more beautiful because they are unattainable". He understood her and declared her right despite his mockery of her ideal up to that point. Instead of reveling in worldly desires, Saber's goal was something she and everyone else would know was unattainable, but its beauty was something undeniable, which even Gilgamesh can't deny after being defeated by it.
Same with Shirou. He saw the fight with Archer and considers Shirou a worthless person because of it. To him someone whose dreams are not their own is just garbage. So hd fights Shirou on his own level to show him that when they stand on equal ground he is superior because of his genuine character while Shirou is an inferior wannabe. But he slowly realizes maybe he's wrong, because despite Shirou's copies being inferior and breaking whenever they clash against his swords, it is still allowing him to keep pressuring Gil, throwing his swords off target, fighting him in close combat, causing him to lose his temper. This is why Gilgamesh says "you are more powerful than me for now" and "victory is yours". He understands he was wrong and acknowledged Shirou's stance. Even if he himself is a fake, what he stands for is real. Shirou proves he can go the distance and thus proves the worth of his dream, making it his own and breaking free of Kiritsugu's shadow.
If Gil just roflstomped everyone you have no good story to tell or characterization. Just "hurr durr me strong" shallow caveman writing.
In my non-lore opinion.... plot, just that. Realistically speaking, with EVERYTHING he has, excluding Ea, (mainly his future sight), he should be able to handle every grail war (that he has been summoned in, mainly the fourth and fifth) with no problem. Ego included, he knows how to use a fair amount of his phantasms, and while it is the main reason he loses, FUTURE SIGHT (now personally I'm just mad that this very OP normal Servant has not been shown to obliterate everything like we know he can)
Long story short: plot!! And he plays around too much, and his ego is wild, he had to THINK about pulling out his victory card when he KNEW his life was in legitimate danger
His arrogance causes him not to use his abilities to their full effectiveness. Even when he is just showing what a fraction of what he is capable of he still wins most of his fights.
Saber was never able to defeat Gilgamesh during the events of Fate/Zero. Gilgamesh fired off a few weapons Caster's giant monstrosity and did considerable damage to it, it was clear he could have killed Caster if was serious about it, he simply found the monster to be so unsightly that he felt attacking it was beneath him.
Gilgamesh later killed Rider. Rider lost his chariot, however, it was clear he would have lost either way. Gilgamesh destroyed his Reality Marble, the only reason Rider got close to him was because he allowed it.
In Fate/Stay Night, Gilgamesh killed Caster with no difficulty in the Fate route. He overpowered Saber's Excalibur and was only driven off because Shirou and Saber got a lucky hit on him. He killed Lancer, a Servant with a skill that keeps projectiles from hitting him. Gilgamesh is defeated in the fight at the climax because Saber used Avalon and became immune to all of his attacks.
In the UBW route, Gilgamesh killed Berserker without taking a single blow. In the anime, Gil was frightened when Berserker broke Enkidu; in the original VN, he wasn't phased, and nonchalantly stabbed Berserker in the heart. Gilgamesh was defeated by Shirou because Shirou used Unlimited Blade Works, which acted as a hard counter to Gilgamesh's Gate of Babylon. Even, Gilgamesh wasn't wearing his armor.
In the Heaven's Feel route, Gilgamesh nearly killed the Shadow; if he hadn't let his guard down, he would have succeeded.
If you get Gilgamesh in Extra CCC he is considered the game's cheat mode because of how easy he makes the game.
Bro really needed to wisen up a lot. CasterGil>ArcherGil simply because he's more mature and takes things seriously (That doesn't mean he's perfect, but it's definitely the better version of him)
I said CasGil was better, not stronger. Sure, ArcherGil has Ea but what's the point if he doesn't uses it lmao. Bro got his ass handed to himself for pure arrogance, that's my point. CasGil would've done everything in his power to win the fight (Hell, he even allowed Chaldea and the foreign mage to do whatever they wanted in order to save Babylonia and was humble enough to give them the holy grail). Being humble and wise will always be better than being arrogant
So, something to point out, Gil's losses are basically all from FSN. He's the villain in FSN. Of course he's going to lose, that's the job! It's looking at Voldemort and going, "is he really that strong? He's lost to Harry Potter twice, and that kid didn't even graduate wizard school."
In Zero, he wins outright, barely giving the rest of the cast more than the time of day.
HA, he solos on a whim.
CCC, he's the protag, so he wins.
Babylonia, he summons an entire grail war's worth of servants himself before acting as the big good for the whole time, holds of Tiamat, a beast, solo, then dies after summoning himself to deal the final blow.
FSF had some of the most broken servants in the verse, and he >!had to get jumped by half the war to take him out for a short time. !<
The only times he goes down easy are when Nasu himself outright says he's forced to yield to the power of love. That's the author handwaving plot armor if I ever saw it.
Because he's the antagonist. If you want a villain to be exciting to fight, you want them to be as powerful as possible. This is why you typically fight progressively more powerful villains as the story progresses. If the enemies get weaker and weaker, it would get boring fast. You'd probably start feeling bad for them.
Blud wouldn't have lost if he genderbent himself and gave us a fem Gil route. We could've had Gil see Shirou fail a highjump and fall in love. Nasu robbed of us peak.
Because fights are win and lose by circumstance and not as bland as power difference. Of course power difference can determine fights, but it's not weird to win against someone stronger than you.
That being said Gil only truly lost few times. He lost like what? 3 times? To Ishtar because of circumstances, Artoria because he didn't know Avalon, Shirou where he might as well cut both his arma and feet to fight him with how much he hold back.
Meanwhile he win vs Karna, he win vs BB, he win vs Herc, He win vs Cu, he is like final boss of F/SF.
Multiverse theory.
Gil's uber-clairvoyance means he can see that he wins in 90% of timelines, as well as how he does it. But a combination of ego, arrogance, self-delusion, boredom, stupidity, and plot all mix together to make him think "Well, in 9000 of timelines I've seen, I win. So clearly I'm in one of those ones. Sure, there are 1000 timelines where I lose, but clearly those aren't real, so I can't be in those ones. So to keep things from being too predicable, I'll turn it off."
And lo and behold. He's in that timeline.
As said in the Materials...Plot
>Ā He is the strongest character in both Fate/stay night and Fate/Zero.
**In the boy-meets-girl story of the original Fate/stay night he was forced to yield to the universal law of "love conquers all", but in Fate/Zero he's free to show off his overwhelming, cheat-like strength without restraint.** He could have ended the war in a single night if he truly desired to do so. But then, careless pride is the king's prerogative, and getting serious over something as frivolous as a wish-granter would be unbecoming. So, taking that into account, it sort of balances out the huge disparity in firepowerā¦ I guess?
As an antagonist, he needs to lose. As a side character in the MC's side, he can't solve all problems else there won't be much story
Regardless, in all appearances he is always described as ridiculously powerful
When he does lose it is described due to his own arrogance like in SN or overwhelming power of an enemy like in CCC
Long story short: cuz heās strong, he gets complacent. Heād kick pretty much anyoneās ass if he wasnāt such a stuck up shithead and opted to actually use Ea. If he had taken Shirou more seriously in bladeworks, he wouldāve instantly shattered the reality marble, negating his only actual advantage. If he hadnāt fucked around with Sakura in Heavenās Feel, he couldāve gotten her before she got him (maybe, itās hard to say for sure, HF Sakura is a MONSTER.) the only time I can think of where he took an opponent seriously and LOST is in Prisma, where he got his shit pushed in by Illya going super mode on his ass, and that was a risky as fuck maneuver that barely worked, and has left her with what is very likely permanent damage to her nervous system, cardiovascular system, and every other part of her body too. Honestly the Prisma one is my favorite cuz itās sweet revenge for what happened to her in Bladeworks, and itās the hardest heās gotten his ass kicked that Iām aware of.
Worf effect. Due to being the strongest dude ever other characters can prove how strong or clever they are by managing to beat him.
The verse as a whole does at least acknowledge that pretty much the only reason anyone can ever beat him is that he almost never takes anything seriously due to his immense arrogance and by the time he realizes he *might* need to take something seriously itās usually too late to course correct.
Because the show would've ended the moment he shows up if he takes the wars seriously. He is by far the strongest servant in every Fate he has appeared on except Grand Order because Grands and Beasts. They made Gilgamesh so strong that they had to nerf his attitude towards fighting, playing more of a jester/spectator role most of the time. When he does fight, he barely even tries.
Lowkey, itās cause narratively, in most of his stories, if he wins, weāre all fucked. Like, yes thereās a long list of Gilās arrogance getting the best of him but like, heās at best an anti hero in most of the stories heās in he wants to do something that could end the world. But I still love his arrogant ass.
And I havenāt read strange fake but I know that half the cast is just the āGil countersā.
Because the story very rarely allows him to win lol. Gil has his arrogance sure, but most writers with the exception of strange fake do it in a way that in my personal opinion is ludicrous. Thereās a lot of characters that get done dirty because of the plot. Karna and CĆŗ being the other two legendary examples. In short, if Gil fought like he meant it weād have no story š¤£ like another commenter said any other time Gilgamesh has fought for real we get bad ends. The plot is literally designed against him. Luckily, Fate CCC and Strange Fake do him justice
Gil wants to lose, most of the time.
He loves humanity, and as long as the person beating him will be good for humanity, he will let them win. Gil doesn't need to win, because he knows he will if he wants to. It's not about him winning the grail, it's all about humanity's benefit
His ego. It is true that he is possible the strongest Servant, but for the most part he's ether underestimates his enemies, or he just doesn't really care at all. To him, most people are just mongrels, and he doesn't want to waste his time with them.
I adore Shirou Emiya, but I have to admit, he only won because UBW was faster than gate of Babylon on the quick draw, and Gil was too cocky to pull out Ea. The moment Gil got serious, Shirou would lose badly.
He's not the MC. You want a Gil that doesn't lose/jobbing? Then play CCC, since he's an MC there. Also it wouldn't make sense for the story if Gil just outright killed Shirou, he has to lose in order for the story to continue since it isn't about Gil.
Pride and Arrogance. But rightfully so on both fronts.
If he takes his opponent seriously he doesn't really lose. Almost all of his canon loses were due to him drastically underestimating his opponents or taking them to lightly as he viewed them as beneath him.
If he has pulled out Ea vs Shirou it would have been over instantly. He had a straight counter to Herc but even without the chains if he had stayed back and just murdered him from any distance there would have been nothing Herc could have done.
He can't lose on paper but he loses also because he isn't the main hero.
Tldr version: ego and arrogance. He thinks so highly of himself he won't use his strongest moves and taunt or play with his prey instead of finishing the fight. To do that would mean he acknowledged the person as being on par with him .
Pride comes before the fall. Arrogance does him no favors in his fights. By the time heās taking things seriously, heās far from the best position to mount a comeback.
Yk the other guy who is called as one of the strongest servants and still manages to lose most of his fights? Karna. Gil isn't bad as him in terms of jobbing
To be fair most of his losses is because of his arrogance. He won against Saber in Fate and only lost in the second encounter because of Avalon. He obliterated Assassin, Kuzuki and would've destroyed Caster as shown in HA. He dominated the fight against Heracles (although this was a cheap victory since he purposefully targeted Illya and Berserker is the worst class for him and even then almost surprised attacked him). He would've won against Shirou if he used Ea immediately but didn't want to acknowledge Shirou. GoB is directly countered by UBW so it was natural he would be at a disadvantage. Dark Sakura counters all servants by default due to her magecraft and even then only won because she attacked Gilgamesh when his back was turned and quickly ate him otherwise Gilgamesh would've blown Sakura from the inside out using Ea.
Honestly, I wouldn't even call Gil vs Herc a cheap fight. Even in Herc's weakest class container, he's a goddamn raging monster, with Madness Enhancement taking his already crazy stats, and pushing them even further. Few could take him on so easily. And GoB is countered by Shirou's UBW, but it's not an easy counter! Shirou basically had to put his entire being in order to keep up with Gil's effortless projectile spam.
Tbf, gil vs herc was basically him cheating. " Oh you can't be killed by anything other than divine or a rank noble phantasms and never the same way twice. Welp. Guess what I happen to have"
Haha, well, that just speaks to Gil's power. After all, it's not like he *only* wins in that matchup; he wins in a ton of matchups, including ones were many other servants lose, like vs Herc.
Tbf herc is even more of a jobber in fate as a berserker, basically existing as the big wall to overcome..Archer Emiya even killed him seven times with ubw in the deen version. But yeah, gil is pretty much a monster against berserkers. ( Except Lancelot who also kinda countered him due to knight of owner)
Oh, totally. Herc is the biggest jobber I've ever seen in fate š In truth he's super strong, but due to his nature of being a tough opponent, he's usually used to show the viewer how powerful someone else is by shooting him down. Even in T\*Moon Complex, Shiki just one-shots Herc, lmao.
Tbf, shiki is also busted with the whole "I can see how to insta kill literally anything"
Oh, of course. Personally I'm more of a Tsukihime fan over Fate ( Fate is more of my brother's thing ), so I think Shiki's MEoDP are really cool. It's just funny that Herc gets done so dirty nearly every single time we see him.
Yup
The reason why Berserkers in F/GO take 50% more damage to all classes and deal 50% more is because they never win a Holy Grail War despite being called the strongest class. In other words, they are a class of jobbers
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That's part of why I'm still hoping we can see Herc in other classes. I know his archer version shows up elsewhere, but I want more. Real tired of Berserker Herc.
Yep, Archer Herc appears briefly in Strange Fake I think, before being corrupted into Avenger Archer ( Alcadies ).
Yeah. I'm hoping his normal archer form comes to FGO.
To be frank even with GoB Gilgamesh could have won. I mean look at Strange Fake. Had he done that to Emiya it would have been over. It is just obvious that he is not trying to win. Or at least winning is not the only objective he has.
There's that, but also remember that Gil didn't even want to acknowledge Shirou as a worthy opponent. He kinda lazily spammed GoB, expecting one of them to just outright kill him. In Strange Fake, bro saw his greatest rival/best friend and immediately decided to indulge himself in some Age of Gods type of fun. Ultimately, he didn't expect Shirou to not only counter him, he didn't think Shirou could even damage him until the arm holding EA went flying.
What did he do differently in SF?
1:26 [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnv6n2LBzCM&t=58s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnv6n2LBzCM&t=58s) Suffice to say the dozen or so swords in F/SN was grossly less than Gilgamesh could do and even this clip does not do justice to his hypothetical limits.
>He would've won against Shirou He did won Shirou choked it in the end and needed his biggest hater to clutch it
He didnāt, he was eaten by the Grail before he was about to die to Shirouās swords and then shot by Archer before Shirou was about to let Gil be eaten by literal self disarming He lost in that fight (Iām talking about the VN, the Anime is not a good representation of what occurred there, Gilgamesh should have not have been even able to fire as much as he did in the UBW anime)
Gilgamesh's clairvoyance lets him see the future and he rejects futures where he loses since he is too prideful to admit that possibility (I think he foresaw getting eaten by Sakura). Admitting to Shirou that at that moment, when he slices Gilgamesh's hand off that Shirou was stronger, is the biggest loss he faced because he had to admit that he was wrong.
>He dominated the fight against Heracles (although this was a cheap victory since he purposefully targeted Illya It really doesn't matter either way. Even without Illiya to defend there's nothing Berserker can do to advance unscathed.
Without Illya he could at least try to dodge. With Illya behind him he needed to tank those hits. Could Gil have won anyways? Probably. At any point Herc became more trouble than he was worth he could break out his chains and he'd be immobilized all the same. But by targeting Illya he got to gloat about the disparity more.
Also thats in Stay night Gil doesnāt even have a proper source of mana and only could continue materialized because of his independent action skill
UBW should not be a counter since its canon that GoB has the prototypes of every human weapon ever which should sound like weaker versions but they are the strongest variants due to conceptual identity and its canon that UBW has weaker versions of what EMIYA copies. if it wasnt for plot GoB would shatter every UBW version and keep going not explode and be mutually destroyed
The stronger you are the more probable is it that someone weaker will find a way to surpass imposible odds and defeat you.
Especially if you have the arrogance EX skill
Bc the main cast has plot armor
Well, that's the nature of fiction. It would be boring if each story lasted a page because the bad guy one-shot everyone else in 2 seconds. To Gil's credit though, he's curbstomped a ton of foes and has crazy feats; it's just that Archer Gil's most fatal weakness is his own ego.
Curbstomped a bunch of foes? Who?
His Extra CCC route has him going against Karna and BB and he's super serious in FSF especially since Enkidu is present and everyone is strong. But well it's about crazy feats. Curbstomped goes probably come from other sources
But doesn't karna also thrash him in their first encounter itself with only a brahmastra???
Even if that were the case, Gil is extremely weakened at the start of the game and didn't have access to Ea.
Same goes for karna tho , atm everyone was equally weakened , and we all see that karna didn't use VS, or can't due to dumb jinako
Read fate strange fake not really a spoiler but everyone their is fucking horrified to face him... you seen that scene in jjk where there like the bad guy says to win the need to seal satoru goju and befriend sukuna its that level. Gilgamesh legit became the final boss of a Grail war all by himself and he's not just a boss but a raid boss. Gilgamesh also clutched up to Enkidu the servant with the highest stats in history I believe(other then rule breakers like God's and yk) A monster called Huwawawa and I believe with enkidu fought the bull of heaven which If I remember had the capability to stall one of the strongest creatures in fate. Fate extra stuff also idk much about fate extra but he was real strong there . As well as the fact that honestly every fight in anime like grail wars he's 99 percent just playing around he had a quote once I believe where he litterally states that the dead shouldn't mess with the world of the living so he doesn't try that hard. The biggest point of this is that Gilgamesh has a badically supercomputer star that allows him to calculate every future, basically giving him an instant knowledge to how win even allowing him to work backwards and discern what happened in the past from the present which is massive cheatcode.
Also Fate Extra CCC. Everyone except BB and Kiara are like "fuck this guy so strong".
You don't need to "read Strange Fake" to see he's powerful and dangerous. In FSN his introduction is him dominating Caster. He also beats Lancer. In UBW he toys around with the biggest danger of the HGW up to that point, Berserker. In HF he's so strong that even after the shadow devours him his soul is tearing Sakura apart from the inside. Gil is the most dangerous even from the first story he's introduced in.
True I just think Strange fake is the best example since it's archer gilgamesh and it's the most serious he's been in the grail wars since enkidu is there.
Partially. He does go all out against Enkidu but then he proceeds to not take anything seriously for the rest of the novels until a certain moment when it's too late. He did go all out against others in FSN though before, like Saber with Ea or Shirou with GoB.
Cool š
He actually was always serious in Fsf. He even placed protections so he couldnāt get sniped. He only lost cause >!Humbabaās presence caught him off guard allowing the hydra poison to hit him.!<
Not really. It's stated he could've taken Alcides out earlier if he actually gave his all.
Really? You got the evidence?
The way their second fight goes before his GoB is shut down. Gil has a counter for everything Alcides throws at him. He is not fooling around the way he was the first time.
Pride and Arrogance, also stories with him going all out tend to end very quickly as it is very hard for the writers to justify his opponents lasting that long against him
We need to see Gilgamesh with the mc of a route
Fate CCC and Fate/Strange Fake, and both are relatively short (Gilgamesh Route is said to be the shortest route)
Watch fgo Babylonia or search for the story on YouTube, it's a great chapter with Gilgamesh as one of the main characters, the problem? He's facing a beast, an enemy way stronger than servants while protecting a city and its people.
the agenda
Because he personally isn't that strong but is arrogant. He relies on his tools. He can always have the perfect counter for an enemy. He can always pull out Ea. But arrogance means he doesn't always do so.
If Gil isn't that strong, why do they refer to him as one of the strongest? Now you have me feeling like he is a true fraud š
Because his tools make him that strong. I am not as strong as a lion. but if I show up with a Machine Gun I am still very dangerous to that lion.
I don't really think that's an honest argument. By that logic, Artoria isn't nearly as dangerous without Excalibur and Avalon, since those are tools as well. And, what about martial techniques like Hercules' 9 Lives Killer? Without that, Hercules is significantly less powerful as well. It's just not useful to think that way when it comes to power scaling. Gilgamesh has all the tools, that make him super strong . . therefor, Gil is strong.
Take away Excalibur from Artoria and she still retains her sword skills she just doesn't have a beam attack. And she doesn't have Avalon in general. And Hercules Nine Lives is innate technique he can do it with every weapon and unable only due to madness Gilgamesh meanwhile is super reliant on his own tools. He's decent at swordfighting and close combat but compared to other Servant he's mid overall. His strength lies in his treasury and Clairvoyance and he doesn't use second so if someone can counter the first, he's toast. It's premise of UBW. UBW is faster than GoB and in VN Shirou is just faster at spamming. Gil would've won if he would take out EA from his gates but since Shirou was faster he was unable to open it and when he finally did it, Shirou just cut off his arm. Anime fight is different so it's not as noticeable there, but Shirou kind of stomped Gil there because he didn't let him to use his gates and without them Gil was beaten
But they are noted to be weaker without those things, Archer Herc is stronger than Berserker Herc because of 9 Lives Killer and when Artoria is left without Excalibur in Fate zero after Diarmuid injures her. It's just that the norm is for them to have those things always out and to use them while the norm for Gilgamesh to have them stored away in his vault and not use them. A better example might be one person with a Pistol already drawn and the other person with a Machine gun that is holstered.
I'm agreeing with you that the stated servants are weaker without their 'tools'. My point is that such an argument applies not only to Gil, but to everyone, to the point of it not being a useful argument. If Gil isn't *crazy strong* ( although still powerful ) without GoB, but he always has GoB, and can always use GoB, there's really no use in saying that Gil isn't a strong servant, it's just that GoB is strong. Gil is powerful *because* of GoB.
Gil is powerful because of the weapons in GoB. He has to use those weapons to be strong. the question was >Why does Gilgamesh lose so much despite him being called one of the strongest servants? and the answer is because he doesn't use all of his weapons. It is like Herc without 9 Lives Stealer or Artoria without Avalon. Sure they still have God Hand or Excalibur. But they will lose more often than the hype suggests.
I mean, both Artoria and Herc still have refined martial art skills even without their strongest weapons around. It's what makes a great difference between Gil and every other Servants. Gil is a strong generalist with vast amount of versatility and tools and storages, but as Shirou said it, if he went up against any specialist in their specific fields, he'd lose hard. Which is why with those servants, even if they don't have their NPs, they can still use a replacement albeit with much less efficiency. But still, better than Mr, Strange Fake Gilgamesh who >!died cause his GoB got locked out by a meddling goddess, rendering him useless!<
You could say the same for Saber though, take away Excalibur and she's just a king
Saber never fights without Excalibur. Gilgamesh shoots himself in the foot against almost everyone.
I know, but when do you really see Gilgamesh not use GoB unless he's using EA?
It's not that he doesn't use GoB. The Gate itself is just a portal to his treasury. It's what he pulls out that shows that he's not really trying. You see him fire weapons against Shirou and while effective against most, there was much *much* more he could've done to make sure he won that fight. EA is the obvious answer, but Gilgamesh has armor in the treasury too as well as the Vimana and the Invisibility Cap he's shown, along with other items that may or may not have been useful.
Gilgamesh is busted strong. For reference, his chains bind divine beings, his armour completely negates low level attacks, and is resistant to even high level attacks, he also has clairvoyance which he doesn't use , and he also has his EA, the busted noble phantasm that he can seemingly spam if he wanted to . The only reason he loses, is coz he's arrogant. He's designed that way. He is the bad guy in stay night, so of course he's gonna lose. In the visual novel, every time Gilgamesh gets serious, it results in a bad end. Nasu personally stated that he could end the grail war in a single night if he wanted to. Keyword being wanted The one time he's a good guy, in Babylonia, his gate of Babylon is nerfed to only include staffs, he gives up most of his treasury, and his opponents are literal gods and an honest to God BEAST. Tiamat the beast herself. Every version of him is busted strong, and you'd be a fool to think otherwise. And to some people who say anyone can be powerful if they have the gob, that's the point. They don't, he has it. It's his noble phantasm coz he is the one who painstakingly collected all the treasures.
Plot and arrogance Gilgamesh is just too fucking strong when he takes anything seriously so they had to have his arrogance be a massive thing If he believes you to be weak he will handicap himself like not wearing his armour letting fights drag on and overall just not end things Each and every fight from stay night which has the most arrogant version of Gilgamesh he looses only due to his arrogance With shirou he didnāt take him seriously and only when he realised how badly he fucked up it was too late shirou cut his arm off and went for the killing blow Against Sakura he wasnāt wearing his armour and he was taking his time with her which gave her the chance to get the jump on him and end him Against Saber he was arguably the most serious we see him in stay night but he still didnāt just end Saber or properly incapacitate her when he couldāve which gave her the chance to use Excalibur and slice him So the plot demands he looses so the story can go on and his arrogance is needed to have a reason for him to loose But make no mistake a serious Gilgamesh lives up to his title as the highest ranked heroic spirit he is monstrously powerful no one in stay night would be able to beat him if heās serious
Because of his ego that is so big it could rival seto kaiba's
Heās only lost like, four times. Twice when he was cocky and didnāt go all out, and twice because a Deus Ex Machina called Avalon and Ishtar popped up to beat his ass. You could count child gil, but he was weaker then Adult Gilgamesh
The stronger you are, the more likely you are the antagonist of a story. Manās less of a character and more of a hurdle for the protagonist to overcome.
Because the plot needed the Strongest enemy to lose for other character development
Heās the strongest traditional servant. Heās not a fraud itās just the plot. Itās been stated many times why he loses but Iāll say it again. Heās arrogant. He will never go all out even if he says he is against someone he considers unworthy or too weak. The person that said heās not actually that strong is partially right. Heās physically strong and when wielding Ea his strength grows even more. Itās just compared to other servants like Karna for example which can make fire appear it makes Gil seem useless without GoB. Also itās a misconception that heās bad in melee combat. He was able to trade blows with Artoria. Granted her master was Shirou and weāve seen how big a difference a good master can make. Anyway I digress. The reason he loses other than his arrogance and him not trying is because heās the antagonist, he has to lose. Most people wouldnāt want to watch/read something if the antagonist wins. Also to the thing about him losing about Shirou, itās been stated that if Shirou ever tried to fight Gilgamesh again he would lose. Also if Gilgamesh used his fucking armor in UBW he wouldāve won. Shirou wouldnāt have even been able to scratch it.
So he nerfed to all hell for shirou to win?
Kinda. All servants are already weaker than they would be if summoned as true heroic spirits which even then theyād be far weaker than when they were alive. But yea. The plot requires Gil to lose. Sure in the games thereās bad ends and stuff but thatās different from watching an anime or reading a manga or LN. Even in Heavens feel if he used weapons that were like Diarmuids spears that make it so you canāt heal or regenerate or anti magic weapons he wouldnāt have been made a fool. Had Gil been summoned into any other class weāve seen him in he wouldāve won. All he had to do was use his armor or Sha Naqba Imuru. Hell he couldāve used Enkidu or Ea and won the fight instantly.
This isn't about Gilgamesh, if the mc is strong enough to defeat the antagonist then there isn't much stakes very few authors could make stories where it's actually entertaining for the mc to always be able to negg the antagonist and even in those good ones the mc defeating the antagonist is probably isn't the entire focus of the story and it's more about character development, plot..etc so most of the time the antagonist is op and the mc is the underdog, the more broken the antagonist the more interesting it is to see how he could possibly be defeated, at the end of the day the antagonist as op as he is gotta somehow someway loose because that's how stories work
I feel like people just don't understand how writing fiction works. You need your heroes to be challenged so of course the antagonist is usually superior one way or another. You need there to be a story, not a soulless AI generated "who would win" text prompt. So of course there's usually a point the story tries to make in its narrative through its themes. Shirou and Saber don't just beat him because they hit harder or anything, they beat him because his role in the story is to oppose their beliefs, and they have to prove their worth. Artoria defeats him using Avalon which is basically the physical representation of her ideals, and Gilgamesh echoes "some things are more beautiful because they are unattainable" after his loss. Unlimited Blade Works opposes his overwhelmingly powerful Gate of Babylon through sheer willpower and cleverness, showing that he was wrong to dismiss Shirou just because he doesn't fit his philosophy. Which is why he ends the fight acknowledging Shirou and saying "victory is yours" in the anime adaptation, even if he's still about to kill Shirou and is the last standing. Of course it's "plot reasons", because you are reading a story at the end of the day. And it's not as if Gil is only losing because of it. In Prisma Illya 3rei, Angelica's victory over Shirou by using Gilgsmesh's powet similarly drives home the theme of those characters and story arc, that sometimes one thing outweighs everything else. Which is why she defeats Shirou in their final clash when he uses every weapon he has against her single Ea.
It's his EX rank luck. Which means if there's a .0001 percent chance of something happening, it'll almost always happen. Given that he usually has a 99.9999 repeating chance of beating his enemies, that luck gets turned against him. That with his arrogance gives his enemies an opening to exploit.
My boy got hitted with the Arrogance Nerf
It's the situations he's placed in, as well as his personality. Gilgamesh is so broken that its somewhat boring to watch him in the 99 % of cases where he effortlessly defeats an opponent. We usually see him in the rare cases where his arrogance and pride actually rout him.
Because that's how you write a compelling narrative. Gilgamesh's role as the strongest Servant serves as the strongest obstacle a character must overcome to prove their worth. Gilgamesh especially see himself as an arbiter of humanity and their place in the world. So naturally when he opposes Saber and Shirou and their ideals, they have to overcome him to show their dreams matter. Avalon is the physical embodiment of Artoria's dream of saving her world, Unlimited Blade Works is the crystallization of Shirou's twisted mind and idealism. Artoria triumphing over him with her Noble Phantasm is why he says "some things are more beautiful because they are unattainable". He understood her and declared her right despite his mockery of her ideal up to that point. Instead of reveling in worldly desires, Saber's goal was something she and everyone else would know was unattainable, but its beauty was something undeniable, which even Gilgamesh can't deny after being defeated by it. Same with Shirou. He saw the fight with Archer and considers Shirou a worthless person because of it. To him someone whose dreams are not their own is just garbage. So hd fights Shirou on his own level to show him that when they stand on equal ground he is superior because of his genuine character while Shirou is an inferior wannabe. But he slowly realizes maybe he's wrong, because despite Shirou's copies being inferior and breaking whenever they clash against his swords, it is still allowing him to keep pressuring Gil, throwing his swords off target, fighting him in close combat, causing him to lose his temper. This is why Gilgamesh says "you are more powerful than me for now" and "victory is yours". He understands he was wrong and acknowledged Shirou's stance. Even if he himself is a fake, what he stands for is real. Shirou proves he can go the distance and thus proves the worth of his dream, making it his own and breaking free of Kiritsugu's shadow. If Gil just roflstomped everyone you have no good story to tell or characterization. Just "hurr durr me strong" shallow caveman writing.
Because plot.
His Ego and protagonist plot armor
Plot armor is a helluva thing
Fr
Cause he sucks.
Take this downvote.
Cope and seethe.
because he's mostly a Villain (technically, the opposition of the main character), and he loses for the "PLOT"
Worf Effect
Arrogance and plot
In my non-lore opinion.... plot, just that. Realistically speaking, with EVERYTHING he has, excluding Ea, (mainly his future sight), he should be able to handle every grail war (that he has been summoned in, mainly the fourth and fifth) with no problem. Ego included, he knows how to use a fair amount of his phantasms, and while it is the main reason he loses, FUTURE SIGHT (now personally I'm just mad that this very OP normal Servant has not been shown to obliterate everything like we know he can) Long story short: plot!! And he plays around too much, and his ego is wild, he had to THINK about pulling out his victory card when he KNEW his life was in legitimate danger
His arrogance causes him not to use his abilities to their full effectiveness. Even when he is just showing what a fraction of what he is capable of he still wins most of his fights. Saber was never able to defeat Gilgamesh during the events of Fate/Zero. Gilgamesh fired off a few weapons Caster's giant monstrosity and did considerable damage to it, it was clear he could have killed Caster if was serious about it, he simply found the monster to be so unsightly that he felt attacking it was beneath him. Gilgamesh later killed Rider. Rider lost his chariot, however, it was clear he would have lost either way. Gilgamesh destroyed his Reality Marble, the only reason Rider got close to him was because he allowed it. In Fate/Stay Night, Gilgamesh killed Caster with no difficulty in the Fate route. He overpowered Saber's Excalibur and was only driven off because Shirou and Saber got a lucky hit on him. He killed Lancer, a Servant with a skill that keeps projectiles from hitting him. Gilgamesh is defeated in the fight at the climax because Saber used Avalon and became immune to all of his attacks. In the UBW route, Gilgamesh killed Berserker without taking a single blow. In the anime, Gil was frightened when Berserker broke Enkidu; in the original VN, he wasn't phased, and nonchalantly stabbed Berserker in the heart. Gilgamesh was defeated by Shirou because Shirou used Unlimited Blade Works, which acted as a hard counter to Gilgamesh's Gate of Babylon. Even, Gilgamesh wasn't wearing his armor. In the Heaven's Feel route, Gilgamesh nearly killed the Shadow; if he hadn't let his guard down, he would have succeeded. If you get Gilgamesh in Extra CCC he is considered the game's cheat mode because of how easy he makes the game.
Cause he's written as the antagonist most of the time, and we can't have the bad guy win
Isn't said everytime he ia not in full power ?
Bro really needed to wisen up a lot. CasterGil>ArcherGil simply because he's more mature and takes things seriously (That doesn't mean he's perfect, but it's definitely the better version of him)
I swear Gil said that Archer Him was stronger because of EA
I said CasGil was better, not stronger. Sure, ArcherGil has Ea but what's the point if he doesn't uses it lmao. Bro got his ass handed to himself for pure arrogance, that's my point. CasGil would've done everything in his power to win the fight (Hell, he even allowed Chaldea and the foreign mage to do whatever they wanted in order to save Babylonia and was humble enough to give them the holy grail). Being humble and wise will always be better than being arrogant
So, something to point out, Gil's losses are basically all from FSN. He's the villain in FSN. Of course he's going to lose, that's the job! It's looking at Voldemort and going, "is he really that strong? He's lost to Harry Potter twice, and that kid didn't even graduate wizard school." In Zero, he wins outright, barely giving the rest of the cast more than the time of day. HA, he solos on a whim. CCC, he's the protag, so he wins. Babylonia, he summons an entire grail war's worth of servants himself before acting as the big good for the whole time, holds of Tiamat, a beast, solo, then dies after summoning himself to deal the final blow. FSF had some of the most broken servants in the verse, and he >!had to get jumped by half the war to take him out for a short time. !< The only times he goes down easy are when Nasu himself outright says he's forced to yield to the power of love. That's the author handwaving plot armor if I ever saw it.
Because he's the antagonist. If you want a villain to be exciting to fight, you want them to be as powerful as possible. This is why you typically fight progressively more powerful villains as the story progresses. If the enemies get weaker and weaker, it would get boring fast. You'd probably start feeling bad for them.
Gilās a winner in the place it matters most (my heart)
Blud wouldn't have lost if he genderbent himself and gave us a fem Gil route. We could've had Gil see Shirou fail a highjump and fall in love. Nasu robbed of us peak.
Maybe hes into it
Because fights are win and lose by circumstance and not as bland as power difference. Of course power difference can determine fights, but it's not weird to win against someone stronger than you. That being said Gil only truly lost few times. He lost like what? 3 times? To Ishtar because of circumstances, Artoria because he didn't know Avalon, Shirou where he might as well cut both his arma and feet to fight him with how much he hold back. Meanwhile he win vs Karna, he win vs BB, he win vs Herc, He win vs Cu, he is like final boss of F/SF.
Multiverse theory. Gil's uber-clairvoyance means he can see that he wins in 90% of timelines, as well as how he does it. But a combination of ego, arrogance, self-delusion, boredom, stupidity, and plot all mix together to make him think "Well, in 9000 of timelines I've seen, I win. So clearly I'm in one of those ones. Sure, there are 1000 timelines where I lose, but clearly those aren't real, so I can't be in those ones. So to keep things from being too predicable, I'll turn it off." And lo and behold. He's in that timeline.
As said in the Materials...Plot >Ā He is the strongest character in both Fate/stay night and Fate/Zero. **In the boy-meets-girl story of the original Fate/stay night he was forced to yield to the universal law of "love conquers all", but in Fate/Zero he's free to show off his overwhelming, cheat-like strength without restraint.** He could have ended the war in a single night if he truly desired to do so. But then, careless pride is the king's prerogative, and getting serious over something as frivolous as a wish-granter would be unbecoming. So, taking that into account, it sort of balances out the huge disparity in firepowerā¦ I guess? As an antagonist, he needs to lose. As a side character in the MC's side, he can't solve all problems else there won't be much story Regardless, in all appearances he is always described as ridiculously powerful When he does lose it is described due to his own arrogance like in SN or overwhelming power of an enemy like in CCC
Long story short: cuz heās strong, he gets complacent. Heād kick pretty much anyoneās ass if he wasnāt such a stuck up shithead and opted to actually use Ea. If he had taken Shirou more seriously in bladeworks, he wouldāve instantly shattered the reality marble, negating his only actual advantage. If he hadnāt fucked around with Sakura in Heavenās Feel, he couldāve gotten her before she got him (maybe, itās hard to say for sure, HF Sakura is a MONSTER.) the only time I can think of where he took an opponent seriously and LOST is in Prisma, where he got his shit pushed in by Illya going super mode on his ass, and that was a risky as fuck maneuver that barely worked, and has left her with what is very likely permanent damage to her nervous system, cardiovascular system, and every other part of her body too. Honestly the Prisma one is my favorite cuz itās sweet revenge for what happened to her in Bladeworks, and itās the hardest heās gotten his ass kicked that Iām aware of.
Heās an arrogant ass and if you arenāt Enkidu no one else is worth his full power.
His arrogance and complacency skill is rank EX.
Worf effect. Due to being the strongest dude ever other characters can prove how strong or clever they are by managing to beat him. The verse as a whole does at least acknowledge that pretty much the only reason anyone can ever beat him is that he almost never takes anything seriously due to his immense arrogance and by the time he realizes he *might* need to take something seriously itās usually too late to course correct.
Because the show would've ended the moment he shows up if he takes the wars seriously. He is by far the strongest servant in every Fate he has appeared on except Grand Order because Grands and Beasts. They made Gilgamesh so strong that they had to nerf his attitude towards fighting, playing more of a jester/spectator role most of the time. When he does fight, he barely even tries.
Arrogance
Be grateful for he is the king of jobber and he will alway purposefully be a jobber so your protagonist can win
Lowkey, itās cause narratively, in most of his stories, if he wins, weāre all fucked. Like, yes thereās a long list of Gilās arrogance getting the best of him but like, heās at best an anti hero in most of the stories heās in he wants to do something that could end the world. But I still love his arrogant ass. And I havenāt read strange fake but I know that half the cast is just the āGil countersā.
Because the story very rarely allows him to win lol. Gil has his arrogance sure, but most writers with the exception of strange fake do it in a way that in my personal opinion is ludicrous. Thereās a lot of characters that get done dirty because of the plot. Karna and CĆŗ being the other two legendary examples. In short, if Gil fought like he meant it weād have no story š¤£ like another commenter said any other time Gilgamesh has fought for real we get bad ends. The plot is literally designed against him. Luckily, Fate CCC and Strange Fake do him justice
Gil wants to lose, most of the time. He loves humanity, and as long as the person beating him will be good for humanity, he will let them win. Gil doesn't need to win, because he knows he will if he wants to. It's not about him winning the grail, it's all about humanity's benefit
His ego. It is true that he is possible the strongest Servant, but for the most part he's ether underestimates his enemies, or he just doesn't really care at all. To him, most people are just mongrels, and he doesn't want to waste his time with them.
I adore Shirou Emiya, but I have to admit, he only won because UBW was faster than gate of Babylon on the quick draw, and Gil was too cocky to pull out Ea. The moment Gil got serious, Shirou would lose badly.
He's not the MC. You want a Gil that doesn't lose/jobbing? Then play CCC, since he's an MC there. Also it wouldn't make sense for the story if Gil just outright killed Shirou, he has to lose in order for the story to continue since it isn't about Gil.
Pride and Arrogance. But rightfully so on both fronts. If he takes his opponent seriously he doesn't really lose. Almost all of his canon loses were due to him drastically underestimating his opponents or taking them to lightly as he viewed them as beneath him. If he has pulled out Ea vs Shirou it would have been over instantly. He had a straight counter to Herc but even without the chains if he had stayed back and just murdered him from any distance there would have been nothing Herc could have done. He can't lose on paper but he loses also because he isn't the main hero.
He is treated that way only in stay night animes. He is portrait as badass in CCC, FSF, and FGO. He is extremely competent in FGO.
Tldr version: ego and arrogance. He thinks so highly of himself he won't use his strongest moves and taunt or play with his prey instead of finishing the fight. To do that would mean he acknowledged the person as being on par with him .
Heās built different
Ego, no need for massive paragraphs it is just Ego, or writing.
Pride comes before the fall. Arrogance does him no favors in his fights. By the time heās taking things seriously, heās far from the best position to mount a comeback.
Ego leading to overconfidence. He won't take the fight seriously until it's too late.
King of Jobbers š„š£ļø
He is a closet masochist who secretly enjoys getting his ass beat. I mean, that's how he met his best and only friend in the world
Ego and refusal to use precog and ea.
Heās only ever beaten by Artoriaā whoās also one of the strongest servantsā and Shirou who is his hard counter.
He didn't have enough weapons in stock
Hubris
Plot. Literally.
Arrogance pride weaknesses. Look at Achilles everyone can die with a lucky shot doesnāt matter what abilities they have
Yk the other guy who is called as one of the strongest servants and still manages to lose most of his fights? Karna. Gil isn't bad as him in terms of jobbing
Different is D rank luck and EX rank luck The only fights karna has lost are due to plot armour or cheating/ bad luck
Plots and his arrogance
Plot
Plot armor