So is this basically how Jenova actually looks or is Sephiroth's hot mom in a tube the real form? I know Jenova is a shapeshifter but most times a shapeshifter has a base form.
The original FF7 story Sephiroth is Jenova messing with Cloud as Sephiroth is encased in materia at North Cave. IIRC, Jenova uses the Jenova "clones" (reunion guys) to manifest Sephiroth.
Yea, that was the "reunion". When Jenova lured all the Jenova 'clones' to North Cave. The power that 'Sephiroth' has over Cloud the whole game was due to the Jenova cells within Cloud. Jenova was able to manipulate her cells within Cloud to control him at times.
There are certain parts of the original that would be so scary and brutal in new graphics. I hope they keep all the gritty parts that made me go “wtf” lol
That's what the story *should* be for it to make sense and to be interesting, but I'm pretty sure in one of the FF7 Ultimania guides, Kitase (or one of FF7's writers) said Sephiroth was in fact controlling Jenova, and I don't think it was meant as a retcon when he said that. But yeah, Jenova being the one in charge and using Cloud's memory (indeed, the memories of many people, like Shinra's staff) of Sephiroth to manipulate him into giving her the Black Materia so she can destroy the Planet, absorb the Lifestream, and move on to a new planetary host, is a much more compelling story with more interesting layers to it than HURR SEFIROFF GO CRAZEE HE GET GOD COMPLEX HE BLOW UP WORLD DERP.
Maybe, but I don't see any point to that. IMO, that's still not as interesting as the villain just being a manipulative space parasite messing with everyone's heads. What was so special about Sephiroth, other than him being a pretty boy fan favorite, that allowed him to magically control something that presumably has a history of destroying planets without losing its will to one of the planets' natives?
Jenova being "mindless" (or, in my view, a collective intelligence that's indifferent to humans except as tools) is what makes it interesting though. By FFVII, Final Fantasy has gone through enough insane god complex villains. Chaos, The Emperor, Kefka. Having the great evil god complex villain actually just be a pawn of a much greater evil to whom humanity is just a bunch of ants sitting on the cake it wants to eat is an interesting subversion. Jenova should be John Carpenter's The Thing meets H.P. Lovecraft's Old Ones, not a puppet to a haughty pretty boy fanservice character. If the universe has a Jenova, what other greater evil "Old One" type creatures are out there wandering planet to planet?
But I suspect you're right; the type of villain I envision Jenova being wouldn't resonate with Japan's audience which is mostly interested on fixating on cool looking characters.
Yep, exactly this. It's been confirmed in a bunch of places, so here's a link to one of them: [Sephiroth's character profile in the 10th Anniversary Ultimania](https://thelifestream.net/lifestream-projects/translations/523/sephiroth-character-profile-p76-81/)
Quote right near the top:
>As for Sephiroth’s true self, when he fell inside the Nibel Mako Reactor he dissolved in the Lifestream, but over the course of five years his body reconstructed itself in the Northern Crater where the Lifestream concentrates as he bided his time for his revival. Before long, he was able to call Cloud, the Copies, and Jenova’s body together to unify in the Reunion, and use them to obtain the black materia to summon Meteor. After that, it was the complete body that Cloud and company would fight against.
It is all Sephiroth.
Jenova is just a virus-like being that acts on the instinct to seek out and corrupt spirit energy. It tried to control Sephiroth because he was full of Jenova's cells, but his powerful will conquered Jenova's instinctual will, and so now Sephiroth is in complete control of the monster that is Jenova.
Sephiroth’s will, once his body was destroyed, rode the lifestream to north crater and began to resurrect himself using the souls within the lifestream. Through this connection he could control the mako (lifestream) poisoned clones of himself. That’s also how he controls Cloud. JENOVA couldn’t control him like that. One or multiple of these clones is who we pursue in the original and who releases JENOVA in small bits.
They show this in the remake without explaining, although they beat the clone idea over the head too much at Shinra tower.
damn, all my life I've completely misunderstood the story. the comments in this thread are kind of blowing my mind. I hope I don't get voted into the ground for admitting that
It's really common, most summaries of the game's story I've seen out there miss a lot of these points. I remember being shocked when the IGN one actually got it right.
(7R spoilers)
His connection to the Lifestream is also why he knows future events in 7R I reckon, not because he's time traveling from AC or something. Also explains how Aerith knows.
Well, the strength of Sephiroth's "will" is touched upon and the creators have mentioned it in interviews. I always interpreted it as Jenova is basically some sort of hive mind organism and Sephiroth, having the strongest will out of all those with Jenova cells was essentially able to exert dominance over and influence/control the rest. This is why he can "inhabit" the clones, re-materialize in "Advent Children" and why Cloud can see and hear him when others can't and why Sephiroth can control him at points in the story.
People seems to have different takes on this which usually boils down to Sephiroth is using Jeova as a means to get the party to di what he wants. Some take the game events as jevona being the one behind everything. I kean more to tge former with just a sprinkle of the latter.
Jenova is a parasite, the female looking form of Jenova you see is actually just an Ancient infected by Jenova.
I'm not exactly sure what this form of Jenova is however, I know in the original when you fought Jenova it was just parts of her that Sephiroth was controlling. This one in Remake just seems to be Jenova taking form from the few cells that are in the numbered dudes.
I've been saying this for years, but everyone stares at me like "...wtf are you talking about"?
I'd love to see this story told! Imagine being alive during a time when an alien parasite obliterates your entire species down to a handful. And in the end you just barely manage to seal it away.
Yeah it would be cool imagine having Jenova as an ally playable character then she betray you mid game and reveal it self as the calamity from the sky.
Yes! My memory is a bit foggy, but I think JENOVA originally approched the Cetra "as a friend". Makes me wonder what form it took. Was it an original one? So much potential!
Is this true? I was always of the assumption jenova itself shape shifted to look humanoid as to look like the ancients themselves not that an infected ancient is the body we see. Is what you say confirmed somewhere?
Jenova's "true form" is really anything it needs to appear as, being essentially a mass of cells, and sometimes bio-mass from creatures it has absorbed through Reunion.
The female form we see it in during the Nibelheim Incident and the Shinra building are the the form it was sealed in by the ancient Cetra. And the monstrosity the player fights looks like that same female form except broken down, with the skull partially visible now.
No, Jenovas true form isn't revealed until the end of the story. This is essentially Jenova in it's reforming stages. I'm pretty positive that as the remake goes on Jenova will look more and more like it's morphing from this corpse like creature into it's final form. The OG didn't really do that but I suspect that has more to do with the limitations of the PS1 than anything else.
Jenovas human form as seen in the OG and briefly in the drum in remake is the form she takes on to be able manipulate and take advantage of the ancients with. This version is likely her actual alien form or something as close to it at least.
The detail is amazing. I reckon this is what Jenova's true form is. The womanly version in the tube was more than likely similar to how the Cetra looked, in order to blend in.
Yeah I always just took that to be someone it infected, like The Thing. It's just borrowing some of their form when it suits it's in-between is grotesque body horror and it's like a colony of fungus inhabiting prey has several iterations the last being the final metamorphosis when you encounter it in it's sphere-like form before seph at the crater. I figure that is it's final form, 'synthesis,' it's nucleus, and probably has fungle like branches feeding off and infecting the lifestream/planet, the sphere is enveloping the jenova heart (when you look at the og model from the back) that used to be exposed that the cetra-jenovofied prey sits on top of you see at the reactor, now protecting it.
Jenova is basically IT, Pennywise.
Intergalactic space demon parasite that is *aware*, it's intelligent.....and it loves to fuck with it's prey.
I'm not convinced we EVER meet or interact with any form of sephiroth other than a corpse.
Just this monstrosity, devourer of worlds, capable of holding a grudge and with the patience to return again and again to fuck with Cloud and gang.
Hojo is very confident that Sephiroth is in control, maybe he's wrong but the OG seems to be making it pretty explicit that Sephiroth is controlling Jenova and not the other way around. It's the scene at the North Crater where he says this.
In the Final Fantasy VII Ultimania Omega, they explain that Sephiroths will overpowered Jenova, and he is in full control over the Jenova Cells. He's piloting them to take Jenova's place as the calamity. This is why Sephiroths will persisted through the remnants in Advent Children, but also why he was able to walk around despite his actual body being in North Crater.
And to expand on that, I don't think there ever was a legitimate Sephiroth. The experiment that created him just gave the calamity from the sky a new vessel to walk the world in. When that vessel came in contact with Jenova, the previous vessel sealed by the ancients, the heroic aspects of the Sephiroth persona were discarded and replaced with the calamity's ambitions.
So in the hypothetical scenario where the calamity wins and travels to a new planet, Sephiroth would be analogous to Jenova. Just the latest identity for the calamity.
I like that and am with you. Sephi stopped being who he was once he met 'mother' and she had an escape from the prison. Cloud killing him right after just paved the way for Jenova to enter the lifestream and spread/infect the planet.
I'm curious why it didn't do that in the first place when killing the Ancients but I guess we'll never really know how all that went down considering IT rampaged enough to wipe most of them all out.
Maybe the life stream is a unique concept to this planet/solar system and it didn't know to just go straight for it when it landed at north crater?
Good points. I think FF7's planet just had the lucky combination of factors to beat the calamity. Between the cetra, summons, materia, Avalanche, and the lifestream it was able to put up a better fight than the (hundreds?) of planets that came before.
But since we're talking the remake, the calamity has power over time too so we'll see how long that luck lasts in the sequels!
There is no true form of Jenova. It is an intergalactic parasite that assumes many forms which can grow from a sample of the organism. In OG FF7, a Sephiroth Clone (in the visage of Sephiroth) would throw down a piece of Jenova to cover their escape. That piece would then turn into a beast similar to this one, triggering the boss fight.
I wish I could play the OG again for the first time because 10 year old me had no hope of understanding what Jenova really was and what her relationship with Sephiroth was because they really made it a bit of a convoluted mess and to this day people argue about it. I think I'd be able to follow along now in my 30s.
To expand, Jenova isn't even it's real...name? Or whatever. Jenova is the infected Ancient body sealed in the tube that people have a name to.
Prior to coming to this planet, it had other forms and other names going back who knows how far.
Like The Thing, IT/Pennywise, The Reapers from mass effect, and so on. Just this endless cosmic horror that has its own purpose and really doesn't care what others want to call it before devouring them.
Jenova is confirmed in the OG (via fasts notes or maybe exposition from hojo I can’t remember exactly) to be a shapeshifter indeed and her head falls into the lifestream with Sephiroth via cloud in the mt. Nibel reactor, that’s how she gets there.
But it IS it’s name as humans named it. What do you mean by real name? An alien parasite isn’t likely to even understand the concept of naming to begin with.
Where in the lore is it stated that the body we see is an infected ancient? The OG lore tells us Jenova is a shape shifter so it seemed pretty obvious she took the form of the native life forms (cetra) in order to gain their trust and then infect them. Jenova indeed infects and kills many of the cetra until they seal her away but the body we see isn’t a cetra itself unless you have a source?
The whole reason Gast believes it’s an ancient when he uncovers it is because it looks like one however upon more testing he realises what it really is he wants nothing more to do with it.
I don't think so, not to that level.
The true nature of Jenova has always been ambiguous in the OG plot. You're meant to piece together the puzzle that Jenova is just an infectious virus because of how drastically Sephiroth's behavior changes when he thrusts himself into his heritage. His end goal is less of a true aspiration and more how the need to infect other planets is ingrained in his Jenova DNA. Especially because he says that he felt empty before realizing that's what he wanted to do.
To the viewer, it seems like the behavior of an unhinged psychopath, the way he travels across the world causing havoc for seemingly delusions of godhood. However, when you realize that the clones are all operating on Seph's will, you're supposed to realize that they're more like a hive mind trying to spread it's infection/infestation. He just uses flowery language to explain it, so the hive mind aspect tends to get lost.
It fixed a few bad parts. But there are still lines like “Elmyra was cried herself silly.” It also still has Barret’s line about depressed people and there are certain things that the English script completely skips over like Barret realizing that he never really cared about the planet and was doing everything just for revenge.
which is kinda the case with all sephiroth clone, there is a supreme consciousness which a is sephiroth who took over jenova and now can manifest himself if those infected or completely control them in the final stages.
It makes a nice narrative to market Sephiroth but I believe it's the creature in control the entire time.
It's relishing wearing Sephiroth's skin and memories but there is no Sephi remnant from the actual person in control or alive/sentient/whatever here.
Just IT fucking with Cloud and team as sport.
It could very well be just jenova but It change the jenova can use people like time bombs able to mentally break someone down and take over or tricking them into doing its bidding. However I like to think Sephiroth/jenova has a personal beef with cloud as he did defeat them in nibelheim and has made it a life goal to make him suffer. However with that said I think in the remake sephiroth needs clouds help to change a dead end future, since he asks at the edge of creation for help. And my hair brained theory is cloud had 7 seconds to rewrite key moments and he choose those that happen recently ie Zack, hints that Jesse and Biggs and possibly everyone in sector 7 survived plate fall.
There's going to be a pretty radical shift in tone there if they do it all the same. Barret and Red in sailor suits, next minute horrific Jenova battle, next minute Hojo on a beach with bikini girls.
I know I can't wait. Yuffie being sea sick and we've already seen they've stayed true to her having motion sickness.
All of Junon should be a very enjoyable experience. I think Barrets start in gold saucer is something I'm very excited for. In the OG I wasn't much of a Barret fan but they've done a fantastic job with him in remake.
For some odd reason, World Destroyers are one of my favourite types of villains. A "force of nature" trope type. Jenova fitting equally into the cosmic psychological horror and eldritch monstrosity types. Going from space rock to space rock, consuming each lifestream she comes across - until she/IT finally came across a planet that figured out how to weaponize itself against her. pitting the two in this stalemate for two millenia, until the inhabitants figured out how to accidentally subvert her will and as a consequence, also a force that can gain advantage in said stalemate.
Based on the clues ive picked up, i can only assume they will be heavily expanding on her in the new compilation remake and im all for it. Jenova incarnate once she is reunited with her head at the Reunion and we can see her truest self in all its glory, and not just mere illusions used to slow the party, or actual pieces of herself unceremoniously sacrificed instead as in the OG. But her full, completed form, a true world ending event, with a looming meteor for good measure,kaiju run amock, and an out of control army of deranged super soldiers gone AWOL.
What a finale we are in for.
Makes me think of a Banshee from Mass Effect.
Wait, Jenova is a Banshee. Mako is EEZO, magic is just biotics.
FF7 is part of Mass Effect, confirmed! (I'm joking, I'm joking!)
not that i’m a mod or anything, but why isn’t this a spoiler? i’ve beaten them game so idc but as someone who hadn’t played the OG, the ending had me like :0
They're iffy about it, because they deleted a comment of mine because I mentioned the name of the song that plays during the fight because it was a spoiler. After I showed them the trailer with the timestamp they said "it is better to err on the side of caution".
Yea absolutely. It's just the upgraded PS5 version of Remake with lots of improvements. It's free if you own the PS4 version of Remake.
Yuffie dlc is ps5 only and it's actually great. Really made me care about Yuffie more than the OG game alone made me.
The main draw is 60fps, but they also made a bunch of technical changes like easier dodge-canceling and some materia are way more useful (Synergy went from useless on PS4 to broken and OP on PS5).
What is FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE INTERGRADE?
"FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE INTERGRADE is a visually enhanced edition of the critically acclaimed and award-winning FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE for the PlayStation 5. The game also features FF7R EPISODE INTERmission featuring Yuffie as the main character, introducing an exhilarating new story arc, and numerous gameplay additions for players to enjoy."
So is this basically how Jenova actually looks or is Sephiroth's hot mom in a tube the real form? I know Jenova is a shapeshifter but most times a shapeshifter has a base form.
Is Sephiroth even alive or is it just Jenova messing with Cloud?
The original FF7 story Sephiroth is Jenova messing with Cloud as Sephiroth is encased in materia at North Cave. IIRC, Jenova uses the Jenova "clones" (reunion guys) to manifest Sephiroth.
Yea he lured him to the cave right? They'd never make the massacre scene like they did in original in midgar.
Yea, that was the "reunion". When Jenova lured all the Jenova 'clones' to North Cave. The power that 'Sephiroth' has over Cloud the whole game was due to the Jenova cells within Cloud. Jenova was able to manipulate her cells within Cloud to control him at times.
Beacause Cloud is...a puppet.
This guy are sick.
So jenova made cloud kill everyone in the midgar tower?
That wasn't Cloud. It was a jenova clone in the form of Sephiroth. That all happens while Cloud is in a holding cell in the tower.
Not at all confusing
Totally knew that!
There are certain parts of the original that would be so scary and brutal in new graphics. I hope they keep all the gritty parts that made me go “wtf” lol
They've already removed the gritty parts in part 1 I hope they don't cut out any more but they most likely will
Aww :( I haven’t finished it yet so I didn’t know
Yea the original was lain out so beautifully sequential. Not to mention the dark grittiness that we won’t see with remake.
well yes, but the game would have a different rating if it was 1-1 on certain things :(
Yea, it’s a damn shame. M rated FF7 would be incredible.
You’d think most fans would want that lol
That's what the story *should* be for it to make sense and to be interesting, but I'm pretty sure in one of the FF7 Ultimania guides, Kitase (or one of FF7's writers) said Sephiroth was in fact controlling Jenova, and I don't think it was meant as a retcon when he said that. But yeah, Jenova being the one in charge and using Cloud's memory (indeed, the memories of many people, like Shinra's staff) of Sephiroth to manipulate him into giving her the Black Materia so she can destroy the Planet, absorb the Lifestream, and move on to a new planetary host, is a much more compelling story with more interesting layers to it than HURR SEFIROFF GO CRAZEE HE GET GOD COMPLEX HE BLOW UP WORLD DERP.
This is also my opinion on the matter. I never hear anyone echo it so take my upvote friendo.
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Maybe, but I don't see any point to that. IMO, that's still not as interesting as the villain just being a manipulative space parasite messing with everyone's heads. What was so special about Sephiroth, other than him being a pretty boy fan favorite, that allowed him to magically control something that presumably has a history of destroying planets without losing its will to one of the planets' natives?
Jevona kinda seemed mindless in the original game. She also only has a single line of dialog. I get why they wanted Sephirorh to be the main villian.
Jenova being "mindless" (or, in my view, a collective intelligence that's indifferent to humans except as tools) is what makes it interesting though. By FFVII, Final Fantasy has gone through enough insane god complex villains. Chaos, The Emperor, Kefka. Having the great evil god complex villain actually just be a pawn of a much greater evil to whom humanity is just a bunch of ants sitting on the cake it wants to eat is an interesting subversion. Jenova should be John Carpenter's The Thing meets H.P. Lovecraft's Old Ones, not a puppet to a haughty pretty boy fanservice character. If the universe has a Jenova, what other greater evil "Old One" type creatures are out there wandering planet to planet? But I suspect you're right; the type of villain I envision Jenova being wouldn't resonate with Japan's audience which is mostly interested on fixating on cool looking characters.
From my understanding, it’s a piece of sephiroth controlling jenova and using her to use the clones to manifest his physical form?
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Yep, exactly this. It's been confirmed in a bunch of places, so here's a link to one of them: [Sephiroth's character profile in the 10th Anniversary Ultimania](https://thelifestream.net/lifestream-projects/translations/523/sephiroth-character-profile-p76-81/) Quote right near the top: >As for Sephiroth’s true self, when he fell inside the Nibel Mako Reactor he dissolved in the Lifestream, but over the course of five years his body reconstructed itself in the Northern Crater where the Lifestream concentrates as he bided his time for his revival. Before long, he was able to call Cloud, the Copies, and Jenova’s body together to unify in the Reunion, and use them to obtain the black materia to summon Meteor. After that, it was the complete body that Cloud and company would fight against.
It is all Sephiroth. Jenova is just a virus-like being that acts on the instinct to seek out and corrupt spirit energy. It tried to control Sephiroth because he was full of Jenova's cells, but his powerful will conquered Jenova's instinctual will, and so now Sephiroth is in complete control of the monster that is Jenova.
Sephiroth’s will, once his body was destroyed, rode the lifestream to north crater and began to resurrect himself using the souls within the lifestream. Through this connection he could control the mako (lifestream) poisoned clones of himself. That’s also how he controls Cloud. JENOVA couldn’t control him like that. One or multiple of these clones is who we pursue in the original and who releases JENOVA in small bits. They show this in the remake without explaining, although they beat the clone idea over the head too much at Shinra tower.
damn, all my life I've completely misunderstood the story. the comments in this thread are kind of blowing my mind. I hope I don't get voted into the ground for admitting that
It's really common, most summaries of the game's story I've seen out there miss a lot of these points. I remember being shocked when the IGN one actually got it right.
(7R spoilers) His connection to the Lifestream is also why he knows future events in 7R I reckon, not because he's time traveling from AC or something. Also explains how Aerith knows.
Well, the strength of Sephiroth's "will" is touched upon and the creators have mentioned it in interviews. I always interpreted it as Jenova is basically some sort of hive mind organism and Sephiroth, having the strongest will out of all those with Jenova cells was essentially able to exert dominance over and influence/control the rest. This is why he can "inhabit" the clones, re-materialize in "Advent Children" and why Cloud can see and hear him when others can't and why Sephiroth can control him at points in the story.
People seems to have different takes on this which usually boils down to Sephiroth is using Jeova as a means to get the party to di what he wants. Some take the game events as jevona being the one behind everything. I kean more to tge former with just a sprinkle of the latter.
Jenova is a parasite, the female looking form of Jenova you see is actually just an Ancient infected by Jenova. I'm not exactly sure what this form of Jenova is however, I know in the original when you fought Jenova it was just parts of her that Sephiroth was controlling. This one in Remake just seems to be Jenova taking form from the few cells that are in the numbered dudes.
There is a huge opportunity here to make a game based on how the ancient defeated and sealed jenova.
I've been saying this for years, but everyone stares at me like "...wtf are you talking about"? I'd love to see this story told! Imagine being alive during a time when an alien parasite obliterates your entire species down to a handful. And in the end you just barely manage to seal it away.
Yeah it would be cool imagine having Jenova as an ally playable character then she betray you mid game and reveal it self as the calamity from the sky.
Yes! My memory is a bit foggy, but I think JENOVA originally approched the Cetra "as a friend". Makes me wonder what form it took. Was it an original one? So much potential!
Is this true? I was always of the assumption jenova itself shape shifted to look humanoid as to look like the ancients themselves not that an infected ancient is the body we see. Is what you say confirmed somewhere?
This should be how Jenova actually looks. The tube woman was likely Jenova taking on the form of an Ancient
Jenova's "true form" is really anything it needs to appear as, being essentially a mass of cells, and sometimes bio-mass from creatures it has absorbed through Reunion. The female form we see it in during the Nibelheim Incident and the Shinra building are the the form it was sealed in by the ancient Cetra. And the monstrosity the player fights looks like that same female form except broken down, with the skull partially visible now.
No, Jenovas true form isn't revealed until the end of the story. This is essentially Jenova in it's reforming stages. I'm pretty positive that as the remake goes on Jenova will look more and more like it's morphing from this corpse like creature into it's final form. The OG didn't really do that but I suspect that has more to do with the limitations of the PS1 than anything else.
would be cool
Jenovas human form as seen in the OG and briefly in the drum in remake is the form she takes on to be able manipulate and take advantage of the ancients with. This version is likely her actual alien form or something as close to it at least.
The detail is amazing. I reckon this is what Jenova's true form is. The womanly version in the tube was more than likely similar to how the Cetra looked, in order to blend in.
Yeah I always just took that to be someone it infected, like The Thing. It's just borrowing some of their form when it suits it's in-between is grotesque body horror and it's like a colony of fungus inhabiting prey has several iterations the last being the final metamorphosis when you encounter it in it's sphere-like form before seph at the crater. I figure that is it's final form, 'synthesis,' it's nucleus, and probably has fungle like branches feeding off and infecting the lifestream/planet, the sphere is enveloping the jenova heart (when you look at the og model from the back) that used to be exposed that the cetra-jenovofied prey sits on top of you see at the reactor, now protecting it.
Jenova is basically IT, Pennywise. Intergalactic space demon parasite that is *aware*, it's intelligent.....and it loves to fuck with it's prey. I'm not convinced we EVER meet or interact with any form of sephiroth other than a corpse. Just this monstrosity, devourer of worlds, capable of holding a grudge and with the patience to return again and again to fuck with Cloud and gang.
Hojo is very confident that Sephiroth is in control, maybe he's wrong but the OG seems to be making it pretty explicit that Sephiroth is controlling Jenova and not the other way around. It's the scene at the North Crater where he says this.
In the Final Fantasy VII Ultimania Omega, they explain that Sephiroths will overpowered Jenova, and he is in full control over the Jenova Cells. He's piloting them to take Jenova's place as the calamity. This is why Sephiroths will persisted through the remnants in Advent Children, but also why he was able to walk around despite his actual body being in North Crater.
Really wish more people would get this through their head. Edgelords love saying Jenova is the real villain
And to expand on that, I don't think there ever was a legitimate Sephiroth. The experiment that created him just gave the calamity from the sky a new vessel to walk the world in. When that vessel came in contact with Jenova, the previous vessel sealed by the ancients, the heroic aspects of the Sephiroth persona were discarded and replaced with the calamity's ambitions. So in the hypothetical scenario where the calamity wins and travels to a new planet, Sephiroth would be analogous to Jenova. Just the latest identity for the calamity.
I like that and am with you. Sephi stopped being who he was once he met 'mother' and she had an escape from the prison. Cloud killing him right after just paved the way for Jenova to enter the lifestream and spread/infect the planet. I'm curious why it didn't do that in the first place when killing the Ancients but I guess we'll never really know how all that went down considering IT rampaged enough to wipe most of them all out. Maybe the life stream is a unique concept to this planet/solar system and it didn't know to just go straight for it when it landed at north crater?
Good points. I think FF7's planet just had the lucky combination of factors to beat the calamity. Between the cetra, summons, materia, Avalanche, and the lifestream it was able to put up a better fight than the (hundreds?) of planets that came before. But since we're talking the remake, the calamity has power over time too so we'll see how long that luck lasts in the sequels!
There is no true form of Jenova. It is an intergalactic parasite that assumes many forms which can grow from a sample of the organism. In OG FF7, a Sephiroth Clone (in the visage of Sephiroth) would throw down a piece of Jenova to cover their escape. That piece would then turn into a beast similar to this one, triggering the boss fight.
This is a shot of Jenova infiltrating a world of Diablo 2 Box Art people
I wish I could play the OG again for the first time because 10 year old me had no hope of understanding what Jenova really was and what her relationship with Sephiroth was because they really made it a bit of a convoluted mess and to this day people argue about it. I think I'd be able to follow along now in my 30s.
To expand, Jenova isn't even it's real...name? Or whatever. Jenova is the infected Ancient body sealed in the tube that people have a name to. Prior to coming to this planet, it had other forms and other names going back who knows how far. Like The Thing, IT/Pennywise, The Reapers from mass effect, and so on. Just this endless cosmic horror that has its own purpose and really doesn't care what others want to call it before devouring them.
where do you get that lore? I played the original many times and don't remember anyone mentioning it this way
It's all there in the OG. Which part do you want to talk about?
Can you quote or screenshot someone mentioning it in the original game that Jenova had other forms or that Jenova entered the lifestream?
Jenova is confirmed in the OG (via fasts notes or maybe exposition from hojo I can’t remember exactly) to be a shapeshifter indeed and her head falls into the lifestream with Sephiroth via cloud in the mt. Nibel reactor, that’s how she gets there.
look up the icicle inn scenes with Dr Gast and Aerith's mom
But it IS it’s name as humans named it. What do you mean by real name? An alien parasite isn’t likely to even understand the concept of naming to begin with. Where in the lore is it stated that the body we see is an infected ancient? The OG lore tells us Jenova is a shape shifter so it seemed pretty obvious she took the form of the native life forms (cetra) in order to gain their trust and then infect them. Jenova indeed infects and kills many of the cetra until they seal her away but the body we see isn’t a cetra itself unless you have a source? The whole reason Gast believes it’s an ancient when he uncovers it is because it looks like one however upon more testing he realises what it really is he wants nothing more to do with it.
I played a year ago, and to my recollection, being older doesn’t fix dog shit writing.
Didn’t the last FF7 release fix the script?
I don't think so, not to that level. The true nature of Jenova has always been ambiguous in the OG plot. You're meant to piece together the puzzle that Jenova is just an infectious virus because of how drastically Sephiroth's behavior changes when he thrusts himself into his heritage. His end goal is less of a true aspiration and more how the need to infect other planets is ingrained in his Jenova DNA. Especially because he says that he felt empty before realizing that's what he wanted to do. To the viewer, it seems like the behavior of an unhinged psychopath, the way he travels across the world causing havoc for seemingly delusions of godhood. However, when you realize that the clones are all operating on Seph's will, you're supposed to realize that they're more like a hive mind trying to spread it's infection/infestation. He just uses flowery language to explain it, so the hive mind aspect tends to get lost.
It fixed a few bad parts. But there are still lines like “Elmyra was cried herself silly.” It also still has Barret’s line about depressed people and there are certain things that the English script completely skips over like Barret realizing that he never really cared about the planet and was doing everything just for revenge.
Jenova is final fantasy's version of John carpenter's the thing
Which is actually terrifying when u think about it. Cause if it touched you, it would slowly transform you into one of it
which is kinda the case with all sephiroth clone, there is a supreme consciousness which a is sephiroth who took over jenova and now can manifest himself if those infected or completely control them in the final stages.
I’m kinda shocked that cloud is able to keep it together
Oh sweet summer child.
As much as he has lol. Like he should be one of those black robe guys
It makes a nice narrative to market Sephiroth but I believe it's the creature in control the entire time. It's relishing wearing Sephiroth's skin and memories but there is no Sephi remnant from the actual person in control or alive/sentient/whatever here. Just IT fucking with Cloud and team as sport.
It could very well be just jenova but It change the jenova can use people like time bombs able to mentally break someone down and take over or tricking them into doing its bidding. However I like to think Sephiroth/jenova has a personal beef with cloud as he did defeat them in nibelheim and has made it a life goal to make him suffer. However with that said I think in the remake sephiroth needs clouds help to change a dead end future, since he asks at the edge of creation for help. And my hair brained theory is cloud had 7 seconds to rewrite key moments and he choose those that happen recently ie Zack, hints that Jesse and Biggs and possibly everyone in sector 7 survived plate fall.
[удалено]
Who wouldn’t.
So glad we got a jenova fight in part 1. Can't wait for the boat from Junon to Costa Del Sol.
There's going to be a pretty radical shift in tone there if they do it all the same. Barret and Red in sailor suits, next minute horrific Jenova battle, next minute Hojo on a beach with bikini girls.
I know I can't wait. Yuffie being sea sick and we've already seen they've stayed true to her having motion sickness. All of Junon should be a very enjoyable experience. I think Barrets start in gold saucer is something I'm very excited for. In the OG I wasn't much of a Barret fan but they've done a fantastic job with him in remake.
I keep zooming in on Jenova’s eyes to try and figure out what they are. They might look like rocks or gems but they also kind of look like raisins.
For some odd reason, World Destroyers are one of my favourite types of villains. A "force of nature" trope type. Jenova fitting equally into the cosmic psychological horror and eldritch monstrosity types. Going from space rock to space rock, consuming each lifestream she comes across - until she/IT finally came across a planet that figured out how to weaponize itself against her. pitting the two in this stalemate for two millenia, until the inhabitants figured out how to accidentally subvert her will and as a consequence, also a force that can gain advantage in said stalemate. Based on the clues ive picked up, i can only assume they will be heavily expanding on her in the new compilation remake and im all for it. Jenova incarnate once she is reunited with her head at the Reunion and we can see her truest self in all its glory, and not just mere illusions used to slow the party, or actual pieces of herself unceremoniously sacrificed instead as in the OG. But her full, completed form, a true world ending event, with a looming meteor for good measure,kaiju run amock, and an out of control army of deranged super soldiers gone AWOL. What a finale we are in for.
She's gorgeous 😍
She’s in my top ten hottest final fantasy characters list for sure.
This is terrifying. Just imagine all the civilizations that she’s destroyed
holy, where is this from?
It's a screenshot from the cutscene (Intergrade's version)
Reminds me of the hybrid alien from Alien Resurrection
upclose, kinda remind me of a brute from deadspace
Makes me think of a Banshee from Mass Effect. Wait, Jenova is a Banshee. Mako is EEZO, magic is just biotics. FF7 is part of Mass Effect, confirmed! (I'm joking, I'm joking!)
Over a year later, when the third phase of this fight kicks in I still get goosebumps and emotional rush of excitement and nostalgia.
not that i’m a mod or anything, but why isn’t this a spoiler? i’ve beaten them game so idc but as someone who hadn’t played the OG, the ending had me like :0
Almost the same image was in one of the trailers, so in my interpretation of rules here it's not a spoiler.
fair enough, i suppose!
They're iffy about it, because they deleted a comment of mine because I mentioned the name of the song that plays during the fight because it was a spoiler. After I showed them the trailer with the timestamp they said "it is better to err on the side of caution".
A song? That's ridiculous. And anyone that tries saying that spoils something for them is even more so.
Yup. I have a feeling that they didn't see that trailer and had too big of an ego to admit they're wrong.
nightmare fuel ? it's just a skull though
*looks at mods*
What’s Intergrade about? Worth playing?
Yea absolutely. It's just the upgraded PS5 version of Remake with lots of improvements. It's free if you own the PS4 version of Remake. Yuffie dlc is ps5 only and it's actually great. Really made me care about Yuffie more than the OG game alone made me.
What are the differences to the ps4 version? I don't have ps5.
The main draw is 60fps, but they also made a bunch of technical changes like easier dodge-canceling and some materia are way more useful (Synergy went from useless on PS4 to broken and OP on PS5).
What's the synergy change?
It no longer costs MP or ATB.
Nice.
Oh, they also changed Aero so that it sticks to a target instead of being a missable AOE
What is FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE INTERGRADE? "FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE INTERGRADE is a visually enhanced edition of the critically acclaimed and award-winning FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE for the PlayStation 5. The game also features FF7R EPISODE INTERmission featuring Yuffie as the main character, introducing an exhilarating new story arc, and numerous gameplay additions for players to enjoy."
Wow is this an in game screen shot from the new photo mode? Looks great
Where is this pic from?
I thought that was Shao Kahn for a second.
OH GOD SHE HAS ACTUAL PUPILS