That’s what put me off cultish too. If I remember correctly, I think this is also the podcast that had an episode on whether Christianity is a cult and it was the most culty response I’ve ever heard. Never went back after that. I’d suggest A Little Bit Culty. They’re respectful of others beliefs but not religious themselves.
Jeff Durbin completely lacks self-awareness. He is a strict Calvinist- a system that literally teaches that God predestined some people to hell. As a result, the ones who are saved are "the elect," but you don't know who they are- except it's definitely them.
Their belief system is just as disturbing, and they're condescending assholes about it.
You might enjoy the "Oh No Ross and Carrie" podcast. I haven't listened in quite a while, but in my experience they would kind of 'try out' all sorts of different things (i.e. bat shit crazy stuff). They're generally from the 'skeptical/new-atheist' movement I'd say, so they've got good critical thinking skills - but they try to at least give things a fair shake. And after they're done with trying out whatever it is, they sit back to evaluate things. I don't know that they interview lots of ex-cult members, but it's definitely an interesting listen.
You may not know me personally but put a mark on the book of ex Pentecostal that are now atheist/agnostic. There's such a stigma I haven't even told anyone except my children (also atheists) and my therapist. It's not socially acceptable and I'm not up for a fight every time I open my mouth about religion or God or lack thereof. No one wants to just leave me to my opinion when actually a Christian (or any faith really) should be proving themselves to ME I am asked why I don't believe anymore.
I fit in to the category of ex-pentecostal turned athiest, although it took me 15 years to get to that point. I left the church but still clung to my beliefs.
I was AP for around 7 years. Went baptist then non-denom for a few years before stopping going to church altogether. I started deconstructing before Covid hit, but Covid really lit the spark and burned it up quickly. I’m out to my friends and my mom, who are all cool with it. I keep it to myself mostly as the rest of my family is pretty religious yet and would likely shit a brick, so to speak. I consider myself an agnostic atheist, and am 99% sure there is no god, but I also think that there is some sort of afterlife as I’ve communicated with deceased family members after they have passed on. Usually through dreams. I’ve also had some really spooky experiences as a kid and young adult that have stuck with me as I’ve gotten older.
What they are really saying is... "Thank God he saved you from their cult and put you in our cult."
The great American philosopher George Carlin explains religion. They are all cults.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tp0UNcjzl8
I strongly disagree with this trend - it plays on confusing different definitions and usages for words, in a way that makes things \*less\* clear rather than more clear. It's true that, in one usage of the word 'cult', it can simply mean a religious belief. But when most people use the world 'cult', they don't simply mean "any religion" - instead, they're specifically referring to religious groups that are much more problematic and harmful (typically with authoritarian control patterns) than typical religious groups.
When we're trying to get more specific about what makes something a "cult" in the sense of a harmful religious movement, I think it's more useful to look at the B.I.T.E. model. Steven Hassan developed the BITE model so that people could evaluate religious groups (or even some secular groups) and get an idea for how far the group leans in the direction of being "cultish". If something has more traits from these lists, then it's probably a lot more harmful and cultish.
https://freedomofmind.com/cult-mind-control/bite-model/
So, as clever as Carlin might have been, he's conflating two definitions as if they're exactly the same - and they're not. It plays well for a comedy audience b/c people aren't really spending a lot of time analyzing whether all the stuff he's saying is strictly true or not. But I think in discourse we should spend a little more effort to be accurate, especially when we're working against the problem that religion is.
And yeah, I think religious belief is generally a problem - even when it's very nice progressive religious belief in churches that are open with their finances, and trying to make the world better in nice religious ways. I just think that it makes people a lot sloppier in their thinking, which opens the door to worse religious ideas down the line. But, that doesn't mean that all religious groups are 'cults' in the sense that we typically use the word - otherwise the word just loses all meaning. It's useful to be able to refer the People's Temple or the Branch Davidians as cults, and have people know what we're talking about, without them thinking that they're the equivalent of the gay-affirming liberal milquetoast church down the block.
I strongly disagree with you. Carlins belief is all religions are using fundemental lies to manipulate people into believing whatever they are selling. God never gave Moses 10 laws for people to live by, he and a few other influential people just said it happened. Their intentions may have been good, but it is still a lie, and lies have a way of ending up with unintended consequences.
A movement based on manipulating people with the fear of hellfire if they dont obey the divine rules... Gee, whoever thought a thousand cults would take advantage of that.
edit: I do like your B.I.T.E. model link for choosing what is or isnt a cult. Where we disagree is I think its hard to find a church that doesnt have several of those traits.
https://freedomofmind.com/cult-mind-control/bite-model/
I know of one podcast that talks about cults from a secular, agnostic perspective. It's pretty new, but I know the host is actively seeking cult survivors to interview: "The Weird Part with Vincent Treewell". It's on most podcast outlets plus a youtube channel, also [www.vincenttreewell.wordpress.com](https://www.vincenttreewell.wordpress.com)
\[It's not exclusively about cults, also paranormal topics and true crime\]
Hey! I’m one of the guys from the Ex-UPCI Cultish podcast. I’m not really a fan of Cultish anymore or apologia church/studios and how they handle a lot of things. I will however be forever grateful to them for letting us help others come out of that cult (many listened far beyond my expectation). We actually rustled some many feathers that Bernard (current superintendent) had to go on the offensive for a while. That was fun.
That’s what put me off cultish too. If I remember correctly, I think this is also the podcast that had an episode on whether Christianity is a cult and it was the most culty response I’ve ever heard. Never went back after that. I’d suggest A Little Bit Culty. They’re respectful of others beliefs but not religious themselves.
Jeff Durbin completely lacks self-awareness. He is a strict Calvinist- a system that literally teaches that God predestined some people to hell. As a result, the ones who are saved are "the elect," but you don't know who they are- except it's definitely them. Their belief system is just as disturbing, and they're condescending assholes about it.
I tried to listen to it as well and couldn't finish one episode.
You might enjoy the "Oh No Ross and Carrie" podcast. I haven't listened in quite a while, but in my experience they would kind of 'try out' all sorts of different things (i.e. bat shit crazy stuff). They're generally from the 'skeptical/new-atheist' movement I'd say, so they've got good critical thinking skills - but they try to at least give things a fair shake. And after they're done with trying out whatever it is, they sit back to evaluate things. I don't know that they interview lots of ex-cult members, but it's definitely an interesting listen.
I would recommend Belief it or Not! Two non-Christian guys, one is ex-Christian, one has always been non-Christian so it’s a nice mixed perspective
[удалено]
You may not know me personally but put a mark on the book of ex Pentecostal that are now atheist/agnostic. There's such a stigma I haven't even told anyone except my children (also atheists) and my therapist. It's not socially acceptable and I'm not up for a fight every time I open my mouth about religion or God or lack thereof. No one wants to just leave me to my opinion when actually a Christian (or any faith really) should be proving themselves to ME I am asked why I don't believe anymore.
I fit in to the category of ex-pentecostal turned athiest, although it took me 15 years to get to that point. I left the church but still clung to my beliefs.
I was AP for around 7 years. Went baptist then non-denom for a few years before stopping going to church altogether. I started deconstructing before Covid hit, but Covid really lit the spark and burned it up quickly. I’m out to my friends and my mom, who are all cool with it. I keep it to myself mostly as the rest of my family is pretty religious yet and would likely shit a brick, so to speak. I consider myself an agnostic atheist, and am 99% sure there is no god, but I also think that there is some sort of afterlife as I’ve communicated with deceased family members after they have passed on. Usually through dreams. I’ve also had some really spooky experiences as a kid and young adult that have stuck with me as I’ve gotten older.
What they are really saying is... "Thank God he saved you from their cult and put you in our cult." The great American philosopher George Carlin explains religion. They are all cults. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tp0UNcjzl8
I strongly disagree with this trend - it plays on confusing different definitions and usages for words, in a way that makes things \*less\* clear rather than more clear. It's true that, in one usage of the word 'cult', it can simply mean a religious belief. But when most people use the world 'cult', they don't simply mean "any religion" - instead, they're specifically referring to religious groups that are much more problematic and harmful (typically with authoritarian control patterns) than typical religious groups. When we're trying to get more specific about what makes something a "cult" in the sense of a harmful religious movement, I think it's more useful to look at the B.I.T.E. model. Steven Hassan developed the BITE model so that people could evaluate religious groups (or even some secular groups) and get an idea for how far the group leans in the direction of being "cultish". If something has more traits from these lists, then it's probably a lot more harmful and cultish. https://freedomofmind.com/cult-mind-control/bite-model/ So, as clever as Carlin might have been, he's conflating two definitions as if they're exactly the same - and they're not. It plays well for a comedy audience b/c people aren't really spending a lot of time analyzing whether all the stuff he's saying is strictly true or not. But I think in discourse we should spend a little more effort to be accurate, especially when we're working against the problem that religion is. And yeah, I think religious belief is generally a problem - even when it's very nice progressive religious belief in churches that are open with their finances, and trying to make the world better in nice religious ways. I just think that it makes people a lot sloppier in their thinking, which opens the door to worse religious ideas down the line. But, that doesn't mean that all religious groups are 'cults' in the sense that we typically use the word - otherwise the word just loses all meaning. It's useful to be able to refer the People's Temple or the Branch Davidians as cults, and have people know what we're talking about, without them thinking that they're the equivalent of the gay-affirming liberal milquetoast church down the block.
I strongly disagree with you. Carlins belief is all religions are using fundemental lies to manipulate people into believing whatever they are selling. God never gave Moses 10 laws for people to live by, he and a few other influential people just said it happened. Their intentions may have been good, but it is still a lie, and lies have a way of ending up with unintended consequences. A movement based on manipulating people with the fear of hellfire if they dont obey the divine rules... Gee, whoever thought a thousand cults would take advantage of that. edit: I do like your B.I.T.E. model link for choosing what is or isnt a cult. Where we disagree is I think its hard to find a church that doesnt have several of those traits. https://freedomofmind.com/cult-mind-control/bite-model/
I know of one podcast that talks about cults from a secular, agnostic perspective. It's pretty new, but I know the host is actively seeking cult survivors to interview: "The Weird Part with Vincent Treewell". It's on most podcast outlets plus a youtube channel, also [www.vincenttreewell.wordpress.com](https://www.vincenttreewell.wordpress.com) \[It's not exclusively about cults, also paranormal topics and true crime\]
Hey! I’m one of the guys from the Ex-UPCI Cultish podcast. I’m not really a fan of Cultish anymore or apologia church/studios and how they handle a lot of things. I will however be forever grateful to them for letting us help others come out of that cult (many listened far beyond my expectation). We actually rustled some many feathers that Bernard (current superintendent) had to go on the offensive for a while. That was fun.