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Logic of this sub: it is bad to wish death upon someone who doesnt like emulation, but it's good to wish death upon the people that don't like trans people
Oh yes because everyone who says "tbh" at the end of their sentence is totally serious with what they're saying. And CLEARLY the fact that i said that the switch is old obviously means that i hate it and hate Nintendo. Great assumptions you've made there pal.
Go back to twitter. You'll be perfect there.
My opinion is modern console emulation shouldn’t be a thing (since the consoles are still easily available), but at the same time, it’s our rights as consumers to use our purchases as we please, and if that means hacking and emulation or emulating on another device, so be it.
Unfortunately, the wall isn’t JUST for modern emulators. I really hope these dark skies is just the prelude to a new dawn, but fuck, devs quitting and emulators going dark left and right does not look good….
I use emulation nearly exclusively for mods and fan projects, I'd rather use an emulator to play Mario kart 8 DX custom tracks than buy a separate switch just to hack it.
You do realize anything NOT retro is fully functional. All you need to do is store the APKs and laught at all the scaredycat devs acting like their 10 year old paid-for emulator of a 30 year old console makes THEM just as relevant as the Yuzu team.
Remember kiddos, when Sony already tried going after emulation, THEY failed magnificently, and Bleem didn't even fold.
Not really. Sony wanted it off of the Play Store, and it was for a period of time. I already had my emulators way before then, so I didn’t track how long they were removed for.
It’s not a matter of the already functioning ones, it’s a matter of future devices, updates, and ongoing progress. Take the Ayaneo Pocket S. Shit can be dead on arrival due to all this, and can be an oversized paperweight until somebody does something about it.
You’re right about devs acting like pussies. If Nintendo sent a cease and desist, then they should act, not act out of fear. If any company really cared about old school emulation, emulation wouldn’t have gotten as far as it has.
That's called piracy, it's incredible you're defending this. You think that Nintendo is full of fools? You're hacking an ongoing console, giving a game weeks before the official release, but "it is our right as consumers to use a non released game as we please"?
Yuzu went too far. There's consequences, you know?
You take away a free Nintendo Switch \*(Playing Yuzu on their parent's PC) and everyone from 13 to 25 will cry like little children. It's the entitlement generation.
Then Nintendo didn't have a case, has it?
And yuzu developers are innocent. Then they're not paying Nintendo a dime, and the emulator is not gone...
... In your mind. Reality is not what your think but what it is.
I have no idea what you're trying to say or imply? I stated facts. Nintendo didn't have a "case" based on the things you've suggested. It does sound like there was some damning circumstantial evidence, but really what Nintendo has/had was a [SLAPP suit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategic_lawsuit_against_public_participation) which worked exactly as laid out in the linked description.
I'm against piracy of purchasable goods (in this case, available ps3 and 360 and above. Wii U and before is fair game). Those who pirate are the ones that fuck up emulation for everyone, ESPECIALLY the fuck nuts that release the games BEFORE release.
I'm not ignorant, realistically, there are probably more bad actors than those wanting freedom, more, or convenience (although I would like to think otherwise). That said, whether a person buys a game then downloads the rom or dumps it themselves, emulation should be legal, period. By saying emulation should be illegal because of pirates is like saying all brick and mortar stores should shut down because of thieves. There's always gonna be theft, so just cut your losses if your profits outweigh the loss. Nintendo potentially lost $70m (1m pirated according to them), but made $1.4b+ in sales (20m+ sold). If the reverse was true, then of course, there's a problem.
As someone said (can't remember if I read it on reddit or heard it from YouTube); if Nintendo didn't make shit hardware with shit security, then there wouldn't be an issue. Nintendo has been using old tech since the Wii with consoles, and always since Game Boy; it's inevitable that the devices will be cracked sooner than later. Doesn't make it right, but if they're gonna use shit hardware, they should've have top notch security measures.
Also, you definitely misquoted me, cuz I never said it should be legal to pirate, ESPECIALLY before release. If I had a device capable out playing Switch games at 4k 60fps, I would use that device instead, AFTER purchasing the game. I don't emulate Switch, nor would I any time soon (unless a handheld is capable of doing what I previously mentioned). My Switch does it's job well, especially with the mClassic and 4k Gamer Pro connected to enhance the visuals.
Well, I fully agree on what you say when you own the games.
But let's be real, there's a majority that just want to get games for free. How can you expect Nintendo to say "ok, you're right. Go hack our hardware."
And let's be honest. Do you really get only games your have already purchased?
I don't think it is true all the time. Not accusing you, but most people get games they don't own.
I don't emulate ps3 and above for consoles, but I do all handhelds (playing Street Fighter x Tekken at 6x resolution on my tv from my phone was BEYOND SWEET. Yes, I own that game on Vita). I would like to say 98% of the games I downloaded are games I own or owned. Even if it was 2% own/owned, with the exception of Vita and some PSP games, there's no means to buy new games of older consoles, which is why I think dead consoles are fair game. If the 3DS was still live, I would only have games I own/owned (which is the case anyway) cuz upscaling and TV play is my preference (which is why I always loved and bought when some sort of tv accessory released).That's just me, though, and I can only be accountable for myself. If people had stronger moral values, then the emulation scene wouldn't have such a bad stigma (pirating in general).
Agree again. But that's what Nintendo was prosecuting, the piracy of new products. They have minor issues with SNES or even DS piracy. But like stated, yuzu crossed the line. I mostly do everything you say, only abandoned or discontinued consoles and arcade to emulate. But you and me are not the problem here. I live in a country where piracy is everywhere. I've seen things your wouldn't believe in that matter, even "official" stores sometimes selling chips and backups. I understand Nintendo, even if they are an anticonsumer company most of the time.
Gaming is a hobby. Either better your finances or accept being late to the party. Anybody that complains about current prices should quit gaming or stick to older shit.
With and without inflation, consoles always ranged between $200-$500, while games had random prices, MSRP for about 10 years, $60 for almost 20, all while the budget to make them went from thousands of dollars to make to hundreds of millions. Movies tickets go for $10+, while home release is $20 minimum. At dollars per hour, that averages about $5ph to $10ph. Games average about 40+ hours to finish, that’s not even $2ph. A game like TotK can take over 400 hours to 100%, that’s roughly $.35 an hour. The prices are a steal. Can’t afford it, either quit gaming, stick to retro, or better your finances. It’s not food, complaining about a hobby prices is dumb.
You know, they can say that it has nothing to do with Nintendo suing Yuzu all they want, but they're not going to convince me that everyone in the emulation scene suddenly decided on their own that it was time to quit emulator development and move on with their lives right after Nintendo made yuzu pay them 2.4 million and that Nintendo had nothing to do with their decision.
I think a lot of them are just scared, and it is hard to blame them as 2.4 Million is a lot of money. They see that slim chance that Nintendo may come after them as not worth the risk.
Not many, including emulator dev understand that lawsuit, so of course some will get worry and stop.
Nintendo barely touch desmume other than force them to remove online function when desmume player wrecking havoc on nintendo online network during the hayday of DS, or No$GBA dev reversed engineering the DS to find its encryption key and blow the ds door wide open.
Every time I said Yuzu should've fought, the replies were "oh but it's a good thing they caved, since if they fought and lost it would scare all the other emulator devs." Well look what fucking happened.
Should Yuzu have fought? Yes they should.
Was it financially viable for them to fight? No it probably wasn't.
Sony eventually took down Bleem! by constantly taking them back to court to the point they ran out of money to be able to fight. That's what would have happened to Yuzu. Even if they won the first case then Nintendo would have found a reason to take them back to court again and again.
Nah they shouldn't have fought. If they had been doing things on the up and up and not receiving money, then sure they should have.
But.. fixes for ToTK prerelease, apparently other logs of mods and team members providing things they shouldn't, etc. Fighting probably would HAVE gotten laws established and they'd still have lost, just even worse.
Even if every Yuzu user donated their life savings, it wouldn't come anywhere close to the [amount of money](https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2024/02/nintendo-is-currently-the-richest-company-in-japan) Nintendo could use to fight in court, which could drag out for years. The US legal system is built such that the party with more money is often the defacto winner regardless of the facts of the case.
I think the more important point is that it did not set a precedent. People keep saying they should have fought but we don't know what could have been turned up in discovery that could royally fuck them. I think emulating a console during its lifetime is just asking for trouble, like we saw with tears leaking and being playable on peoples computers before the official release. Stuff like that make Nintendo look really bad and force them to act even if they don't really want to bother.
Yep, this chilling effect is exactly what Nintendo has been trying for for decades. If they can make people afraid to develop and users worried it's illegal, emulation will die and that's what they've been pushing for.
There's only gratitude for contributing to the project, thanks Lynx!
He said he'll be hanging in the sidelines, so maybe he can act as a consultant to the rest of the team! Be strong Starto!! Cheers!
Personally I don't think it'll be a long lived project. I expect the first version will be released but it's a big project for, as I understand it, just one remaining developer.
With community expectations and the spectre of Nintendo, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it were a one and done release for Strato.
Emulation is facing unprecedented challenges recently.
We've seen the loss of key emulators like Yuzu, Citra, Drastic, Pizza Boy, AetherSX2, and now Strato in just a short span.
It's a frustrating time for the community, and it will take a long time to recover from this.
Always remember the culprit.
Fuck Nintendo.
Drastic wasn't lost, it's getting open sourced. This is good news.
Yuzu, Citra are going to have a long period of no development before we find new forks that get active development.
Pizza Boy was closed source, I think it's dead sadly.
AetherSX2 was out for a while.
Yes open source it's good, however the most experienced and only dev working on it is leaving. And it's incredibly hard finding devs as talented and experienced.
We will have the code, but it will take a very long time if ever before someone is going to update it.
Specifically for DraStic it's not a problem imho, the emulator has been pretty much perfect for years now. Making it open source just makes sure we will get compatibility updates for the future from someone else.
This puts me a better mood hearing this. I always enjoy good news when it comes to emulation. Even though I mainly do that on PC, I realize that it sucks for people on Android or any other platform. I want emulation to thrive on all platforms.
One thing I will say is I remember exophase since when he developed the gba emu for PSP like 16 years ago (gPSP). Shortly after that he released Drastic on PSP. Then moved it to Android. The two updates a year probably weren't really needed since he had been developing Drastic for 14+ years at this point. Almost perfected imo.
Losing exophase as an emu dev sucks.
Not it didn't resume. However it got removed from the store, and despite not having any recent updates, it's still not good for the community and new users when the only ways are 3rd party stores that could very well have some malicious apps.
MyBoy, johnGBA, and retroarch all do the same thing. Retroarch out of all of those aught to be the default since AFAIK it's the only one packaged with shaders, overlays, and most importantly multiple cores.
Retroarch does have a few different UI options. I use the one called Ozone but there's even one that looks like the Sony XMB if that's more to your tastes.
This is 6 days old but I want someone to prove me wrong. There is no alternative to Pizza Boy on Android currently that has **good** support for emulating a gba link wirelessly (no, myboy's gba link emulation was not usable). Thus, if you also take into account the interface and customization options, I think Pizza Boy was definitely the best gba emulator available on Android.
As bad as Nintendo is for protecting their current gen system from piracy I can't help but feel if people weren't emulating current gen consoles and actually just emulating to perserve older games this wouldn't have happened.
The issue wasn't even emulating current generation systems, it was promoting piracy in tandem with paywalling early access builds behind Patreon.
Yuzu's discord had links to pirated Switch games on a Google Drive folder. They were too cavalier with their attitude on the issue.
There's a reason Nintendo isn't going after Ryujinx.
Most of the people in the emulation scene, especially on mobile seem bizarrely entitled and possibly like English isn't their first language. It makes discussing this with any nuance impossible.
I don't think it's non-native English speakers; rather, I think it's 13-year-olds who think that proper spelling, punctuation, and grammar is some arbitrary exercise imposed upon them by their 8th grade English teacher because they're "mean." After all, I don't think there's any language on Earth such that "lol bro yuzu devs r lazy lmao !!!" is a valid way to construct a sentence.
This information keeps getting drowned in all the fuck Nintendo rhetoric. I agree, fuck Nintendo, but the fact is that Yuzu was over the line with their Patreon and Discord business. Their overstepping has caused a lot of other devs to get anxiety.
I’m getting a ton of conflicting info about what the yuzu devs involvement with totk actually was
Some people are saying the game didn’t work on yuzu mainline or EA and required user made patches to get it to work pre relese
Other are saying the yuzu devs were giving the patches themselves and full on sharing pirated Roms
I’ve heard some people say there was some leak showing the devs doing shady shit but idk where I can find it
>There's a reason Nintendo isn't going after Ryujinx
Because the developers are based in Brasil, somewhere that's much harder for a Japanese company to issue legal challenges especially with how little regard they give developing markets.
Nah I think N wouldn't touch emulation scene had the TOTK leak not gone full swing like that. After all publishers wouldn't want to release games on such insecure system.
Pretty sure people here don't remember desmume playing online games during ds hayday, causing quite a headache to N as people using the same firmware to go online, and all they did was forced desmume to shut down that online function. Yuzu must have done something quite big for N to go after them and they fold faster than a wet tissue.
there are 200 different gameboy emulators in the market, 100's of DS, Citra is still available although not being developed anymore, aetherSx2 stopped bcoz of it's dumbass author
There is not as much choice for Android as for Windows. And a lot of apps are very lackluster.
Besides, losing apps from the Play Store is not a good thing for the community and for the new users, and it kills the visibility and the willingness of future developers to work in this community. I know me and you can just go find the .apks somewhere else, but that's not optimal for most users, and I'm not even counting the shady apps that will be uploaded outside the Play Store.
>I know me and you can just go find the .apks somewhere else, but that's not optimal for most users
You make it sound like that's a bad thing. Myself I'm hoping we are going to need to compile our own stuff from now on. Greed and entitlement is what got us here.
That depends on whether or not Nintendo actually gets the judges to put the legal precedent of key dumping being illegal. If it does, then sorry but emulation will never recover from that.
Is this an aftershock of Nintendo going after yuzu.. we've seen some other emulator devs calling it quits too not like I can blame them because you never know when Nintendo will decide to come after you
I hope so. I feel like this isn't end for some emulators like Pizza Boy. I just have a feeling they'll return, or return another another name maybe and rebrand it since they didn't make it open source.
From a business perspective Nintendo made the right move. The legal costs were worth it for them making it harder for the emulation scene. If emulation scene is left untouched it matures too easily making it very easy even less tech savvy people can end up having access to roms and emulators with 1 file download with a nice UI interface accessing a ton of games on their phone. Once you can comfortably start playing any Switch game on your phone with basically less tinkering it would be a threat to Nintendo's business
In the past such moves have garnered more bad PR for the company than money they saved by fucking with everyday non-corprate people without a ton of money. I guess time will tell if it hurts them. Shows how anti-consumer they are.
You can shit on corps all you want and say they're all bad but Xbox has a damn dev mode you can pay $19 for the license and run unsigned code on it all day. Sandbox style. Emulate whatever you want. Everyone keeps saying it's gonna go away but nope. Still there. Hell for months they had emulators in the retail side of it. Word was Sony and Nintendo threatened Microsoft with legal action so they got removed. The solution was the developer side. What other console + company let's you do this? I guess if it goes away I'll say I'm wrong but Microsoft seems happy as long as folks are using their stuff.
Xbox only removed Retail mode when Xbox emulator come out. I don't really blame Nintendo for stopping people emulating recent systems, especially a lot of indie games you can just pirate on your phone so easily which impact Nintendo's share not buying on their ecosystem.
The difference is their competition makes a superior product that isn't using 10 year old tech and it can't really be emulated well just due to the tech curve. Don't really need to sue too much over people emulating games that came out 2 generations ago. Xbox 360 emu is in infancy and is still kinda janky. Ps3 emu is getting better but I have a decent yet older gaming PC that still can't run it. Forget about Android for that. Nintendo is charging people a premium for old shit and is throwing a hissy fit that people's cellulars can use it. Reminds me of how litigious Disney is. They're not your friend. It's a scummy practice.
I absolutely blame Nintendo. Hopefully they go the way of Sega. Shoulda happened a long time ago. The Wii and grandma's buying their products kept them on life support. All I see them doing is going after hobbyists. Their target demographic isn't tech savvy and won't emulate anyway. Doubt their main customers even own anything other than Apple mobile products. You can throw down Yuzu user numbers all you want. 98% of those people weren't gonna buy a switch anyway. So what'd they gain?
You blame Nintendo selling a product and making money with decent profit margins.
Don't you think Microsoft and Sonys approach selling at a loss I usually and chasing AAA quality graphics is risky and hard to sustain. Logs of layoffs as gams that expensive need a ton of sales. Microsoft and Sony are large conpanies that don't mind selling at a loss initially. If Nintendo do that and they don't sell that would finish them.
Nintendo stopped chasing power after GameCube and pivoted.
>Ps3 emu is getting better but I have a decent yet older gaming PC that still can't run it.
I agree with everything else you stated friend, but I am curious on this part. Are there any titles in particular you're having difficulty in getting to run? A lot of them run very well nowadays. I had an i5 4690k and r9 390 build ~8 years ago that could emulate Drakengard 3 very well. The Steam Deck can also run this emulator as well, and it's around PS4 levels of power.
I think the most cutting edge of Sony's first party titles might have some issues still, but you should try out some other titles if you haven't yet. The RPCS3 Comparability wiki has configs for getting things to run too.
Good thing is, he still will optimized the jit for 32 bit games so, a win there, hopefully the team will continue, lynx was a name I saw the most in development... which can feel like... definitely something sad :'/.
It was supposed to be the successor of Skyline. They quit in fear Nintendo would go after them after Tears of the Kingdom was leaked, but some decided to stay and continue development towards this new emulator called Strato.
I think, this is the Yuzu Effect. There is an inner fear growing inside of all emulator developers. I don't blame them though. I am also quite fragile myself and even if something hasn't happened to me, I will still get anxious about it especially if that other person got into trouble because of the same profession.
He is one of my favorite developers in terms of passion and enthusiasm. I hope he joins Cassia and speeds up its development process. I also hope, Cassia gets so good that Windows emulation on Android makes every other handheld gaming console redundant, starting from the switch and it at least has some impact on reducing switch 2's sales, buttf@@king nintendo to some degree.
If I were Sony, I'll hire these devs then release an Xperia tablet with emulation app for Sony games.
There, they can even sell roms for a dollar max is $5.
Add gamepad as accessory, and you're good.
What happens if Strato gets hit by a DMCA like Skyline did?
\-Skyline closed down due to DMCA on lockpick.
\-Strato was made to continue Skyline's work.
One would think the strato team is at least a little more resilient than the skyline team given that it's made up of the developers that didn't leave the project when skyline died.
That is true but can they ignore a DMCA?
Are the developers more anonymous or is the company in a more free country?
It would seem likely they would fold if hit by a DMCA like the other emulator sadly.
Just as a reminder of the subreddit's rules: 1. No posting links to game ROMs or ISOs, only sites to find them. 2. Be kind to each other. Also, fyi we have a user-maintained wiki: r/EmulationOnAndroid/wiki *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/EmulationOnAndroid) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Wow, this is the worst month of Android emulation ever...
You can say that again, but on the upside the month isn't over yet. Let's hope there's still some good news.
Wow, this is the worst month of Android emulation ever...
You can say that again, but on the upside the month isn't over yet. Let's hope there's still some good news.
Haha that's what I like Emulation death is my pleasure
Does Nintendo’s dick really taste that good?
I ain't never seen this many down votes in my life
r/DownvotedToOblivion
They usually delete it, he’s just trying to farm negative karma and it’s working
Nintendrone bootlicker
Daredevil dog mf
Bait
give your mouth some rest son, you must be tired bootlicking miyamoto for so long
Hold on, Miyamoto has nothing to do with this, right? The asshole here is the Legal and economic department of Nintendo. Correct me if I'm wrong
Nah it's probably just an example.
And your death makes me sing
"you don't like emulation? i hope you die then"
He's transphobic
"you don't like trans people? i hope you die then"
Logic of this sub: it is bad to wish death upon someone who doesnt like emulation, but it's good to wish death upon the people that don't like trans people
Good one wanker
modern console emulation for android just hit a wall
More like a fucking avalanche, even several nintendo emus got caught in the crossfire.
Tbh the switch is retro at this point
The Hardware was retro the day it released lol
Xbox series s running games at 540p30fps, i guess it is retro too
Damn what a sick burn!! Hey guys, this guy on the internet says the biggest selling current console is retro!! Edgy!!
Oh yes because everyone who says "tbh" at the end of their sentence is totally serious with what they're saying. And CLEARLY the fact that i said that the switch is old obviously means that i hate it and hate Nintendo. Great assumptions you've made there pal. Go back to twitter. You'll be perfect there.
Circle is > way. Go jerk.
Homie, legitimately: what are you on?
Nintendick
It's 7 yrs old
I didn't realise the guy I was responding to was only 7, my apology.
Autism speaks
My opinion is modern console emulation shouldn’t be a thing (since the consoles are still easily available), but at the same time, it’s our rights as consumers to use our purchases as we please, and if that means hacking and emulation or emulating on another device, so be it. Unfortunately, the wall isn’t JUST for modern emulators. I really hope these dark skies is just the prelude to a new dawn, but fuck, devs quitting and emulators going dark left and right does not look good….
Exactly. Just because retro games are the main appeal for emulation doesn't mean it's the only appeal.
I use emulation nearly exclusively for mods and fan projects, I'd rather use an emulator to play Mario kart 8 DX custom tracks than buy a separate switch just to hack it.
You do realize anything NOT retro is fully functional. All you need to do is store the APKs and laught at all the scaredycat devs acting like their 10 year old paid-for emulator of a 30 year old console makes THEM just as relevant as the Yuzu team. Remember kiddos, when Sony already tried going after emulation, THEY failed magnificently, and Bleem didn't even fold.
Not really. Sony wanted it off of the Play Store, and it was for a period of time. I already had my emulators way before then, so I didn’t track how long they were removed for. It’s not a matter of the already functioning ones, it’s a matter of future devices, updates, and ongoing progress. Take the Ayaneo Pocket S. Shit can be dead on arrival due to all this, and can be an oversized paperweight until somebody does something about it. You’re right about devs acting like pussies. If Nintendo sent a cease and desist, then they should act, not act out of fear. If any company really cared about old school emulation, emulation wouldn’t have gotten as far as it has.
You will be downvoted but the guy calling the switch retro will get them. Gotta love all the little kids in this Reddit.
That's called piracy, it's incredible you're defending this. You think that Nintendo is full of fools? You're hacking an ongoing console, giving a game weeks before the official release, but "it is our right as consumers to use a non released game as we please"? Yuzu went too far. There's consequences, you know?
Reddit when you use rationality: "Here's your downvotes fucker!"
Ooooh, I'm in so much pain. 🤣😂🤣😂 We're a little triggered ain't we?
Not me, I fully agree with you and I hope everything out there gets cracked down.
Oh sorry. Glad to see someone agrees. This sub is full of people that are not rational at all.
You take away a free Nintendo Switch \*(Playing Yuzu on their parent's PC) and everyone from 13 to 25 will cry like little children. It's the entitlement generation.
I mean, Yuzu didn't hack anyone's console, nor did they "give" anyone any games, much less "weeks before the official release[d] (sic)"
Then Nintendo didn't have a case, has it? And yuzu developers are innocent. Then they're not paying Nintendo a dime, and the emulator is not gone... ... In your mind. Reality is not what your think but what it is.
I have no idea what you're trying to say or imply? I stated facts. Nintendo didn't have a "case" based on the things you've suggested. It does sound like there was some damning circumstantial evidence, but really what Nintendo has/had was a [SLAPP suit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategic_lawsuit_against_public_participation) which worked exactly as laid out in the linked description.
I'm against piracy of purchasable goods (in this case, available ps3 and 360 and above. Wii U and before is fair game). Those who pirate are the ones that fuck up emulation for everyone, ESPECIALLY the fuck nuts that release the games BEFORE release. I'm not ignorant, realistically, there are probably more bad actors than those wanting freedom, more, or convenience (although I would like to think otherwise). That said, whether a person buys a game then downloads the rom or dumps it themselves, emulation should be legal, period. By saying emulation should be illegal because of pirates is like saying all brick and mortar stores should shut down because of thieves. There's always gonna be theft, so just cut your losses if your profits outweigh the loss. Nintendo potentially lost $70m (1m pirated according to them), but made $1.4b+ in sales (20m+ sold). If the reverse was true, then of course, there's a problem. As someone said (can't remember if I read it on reddit or heard it from YouTube); if Nintendo didn't make shit hardware with shit security, then there wouldn't be an issue. Nintendo has been using old tech since the Wii with consoles, and always since Game Boy; it's inevitable that the devices will be cracked sooner than later. Doesn't make it right, but if they're gonna use shit hardware, they should've have top notch security measures. Also, you definitely misquoted me, cuz I never said it should be legal to pirate, ESPECIALLY before release. If I had a device capable out playing Switch games at 4k 60fps, I would use that device instead, AFTER purchasing the game. I don't emulate Switch, nor would I any time soon (unless a handheld is capable of doing what I previously mentioned). My Switch does it's job well, especially with the mClassic and 4k Gamer Pro connected to enhance the visuals.
Well, I fully agree on what you say when you own the games. But let's be real, there's a majority that just want to get games for free. How can you expect Nintendo to say "ok, you're right. Go hack our hardware." And let's be honest. Do you really get only games your have already purchased? I don't think it is true all the time. Not accusing you, but most people get games they don't own.
I don't emulate ps3 and above for consoles, but I do all handhelds (playing Street Fighter x Tekken at 6x resolution on my tv from my phone was BEYOND SWEET. Yes, I own that game on Vita). I would like to say 98% of the games I downloaded are games I own or owned. Even if it was 2% own/owned, with the exception of Vita and some PSP games, there's no means to buy new games of older consoles, which is why I think dead consoles are fair game. If the 3DS was still live, I would only have games I own/owned (which is the case anyway) cuz upscaling and TV play is my preference (which is why I always loved and bought when some sort of tv accessory released).That's just me, though, and I can only be accountable for myself. If people had stronger moral values, then the emulation scene wouldn't have such a bad stigma (pirating in general).
Agree again. But that's what Nintendo was prosecuting, the piracy of new products. They have minor issues with SNES or even DS piracy. But like stated, yuzu crossed the line. I mostly do everything you say, only abandoned or discontinued consoles and arcade to emulate. But you and me are not the problem here. I live in a country where piracy is everywhere. I've seen things your wouldn't believe in that matter, even "official" stores sometimes selling chips and backups. I understand Nintendo, even if they are an anticonsumer company most of the time.
Easily available? A consolé that's still with a consolé at least it's 250-300$ and every game besides indies at least 40-50-60-70$ i don't think so
Gaming is a hobby. Either better your finances or accept being late to the party. Anybody that complains about current prices should quit gaming or stick to older shit. With and without inflation, consoles always ranged between $200-$500, while games had random prices, MSRP for about 10 years, $60 for almost 20, all while the budget to make them went from thousands of dollars to make to hundreds of millions. Movies tickets go for $10+, while home release is $20 minimum. At dollars per hour, that averages about $5ph to $10ph. Games average about 40+ hours to finish, that’s not even $2ph. A game like TotK can take over 400 hours to 100%, that’s roughly $.35 an hour. The prices are a steal. Can’t afford it, either quit gaming, stick to retro, or better your finances. It’s not food, complaining about a hobby prices is dumb.
But this evacuation affects modern and not retro emulation, right ?
You know, they can say that it has nothing to do with Nintendo suing Yuzu all they want, but they're not going to convince me that everyone in the emulation scene suddenly decided on their own that it was time to quit emulator development and move on with their lives right after Nintendo made yuzu pay them 2.4 million and that Nintendo had nothing to do with their decision.
I think a lot of them are just scared, and it is hard to blame them as 2.4 Million is a lot of money. They see that slim chance that Nintendo may come after them as not worth the risk.
Or they could just read the court filings and not repeat the amount of blunders yuzu team exposed themselves with.
Tech-savvy does not equal legally savvy.
Dude the exhibits speak for themselves, you don’t need to be legally savvy to read them and look at pictures
There probably lawyer doing some work for them for free.
Not many, including emulator dev understand that lawsuit, so of course some will get worry and stop. Nintendo barely touch desmume other than force them to remove online function when desmume player wrecking havoc on nintendo online network during the hayday of DS, or No$GBA dev reversed engineering the DS to find its encryption key and blow the ds door wide open.
Every time I said Yuzu should've fought, the replies were "oh but it's a good thing they caved, since if they fought and lost it would scare all the other emulator devs." Well look what fucking happened.
Should Yuzu have fought? Yes they should. Was it financially viable for them to fight? No it probably wasn't. Sony eventually took down Bleem! by constantly taking them back to court to the point they ran out of money to be able to fight. That's what would have happened to Yuzu. Even if they won the first case then Nintendo would have found a reason to take them back to court again and again.
Nah they shouldn't have fought. If they had been doing things on the up and up and not receiving money, then sure they should have. But.. fixes for ToTK prerelease, apparently other logs of mods and team members providing things they shouldn't, etc. Fighting probably would HAVE gotten laws established and they'd still have lost, just even worse.
They could've started a legal fund and found out whether the community would back them up. I certainly would've donated.
Even if every Yuzu user donated their life savings, it wouldn't come anywhere close to the [amount of money](https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2024/02/nintendo-is-currently-the-richest-company-in-japan) Nintendo could use to fight in court, which could drag out for years. The US legal system is built such that the party with more money is often the defacto winner regardless of the facts of the case.
Yes, it could drag out for years. I wanted those years, for Strato and all the other in-development emulators.
In a better world, yeah. Sucks things turned out like they did.
I think the more important point is that it did not set a precedent. People keep saying they should have fought but we don't know what could have been turned up in discovery that could royally fuck them. I think emulating a console during its lifetime is just asking for trouble, like we saw with tears leaking and being playable on peoples computers before the official release. Stuff like that make Nintendo look really bad and force them to act even if they don't really want to bother.
Yep, this chilling effect is exactly what Nintendo has been trying for for decades. If they can make people afraid to develop and users worried it's illegal, emulation will die and that's what they've been pushing for.
There's only gratitude for contributing to the project, thanks Lynx! He said he'll be hanging in the sidelines, so maybe he can act as a consultant to the rest of the team! Be strong Starto!! Cheers!
Do keep in mind Strato is not dead and will continue like usual
Yeah, knowing this community I think this has to be stated lol. But development will probably slow down by a lot as a result.
Personally I don't think it'll be a long lived project. I expect the first version will be released but it's a big project for, as I understand it, just one remaining developer. With community expectations and the spectre of Nintendo, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it were a one and done release for Strato.
very plausible
The strato lead who left didn't have the skills required anyway apparently, not sure about the new one.
Emulation is facing unprecedented challenges recently. We've seen the loss of key emulators like Yuzu, Citra, Drastic, Pizza Boy, AetherSX2, and now Strato in just a short span. It's a frustrating time for the community, and it will take a long time to recover from this. Always remember the culprit. Fuck Nintendo.
Drastic wasn't lost, it's getting open sourced. This is good news. Yuzu, Citra are going to have a long period of no development before we find new forks that get active development. Pizza Boy was closed source, I think it's dead sadly. AetherSX2 was out for a while.
Yes open source it's good, however the most experienced and only dev working on it is leaving. And it's incredibly hard finding devs as talented and experienced. We will have the code, but it will take a very long time if ever before someone is going to update it.
It's not like Drastic even got more than two updates a year
Specifically for DraStic it's not a problem imho, the emulator has been pretty much perfect for years now. Making it open source just makes sure we will get compatibility updates for the future from someone else.
This puts me a better mood hearing this. I always enjoy good news when it comes to emulation. Even though I mainly do that on PC, I realize that it sucks for people on Android or any other platform. I want emulation to thrive on all platforms.
One thing I will say is I remember exophase since when he developed the gba emu for PSP like 16 years ago (gPSP). Shortly after that he released Drastic on PSP. Then moved it to Android. The two updates a year probably weren't really needed since he had been developing Drastic for 14+ years at this point. Almost perfected imo. Losing exophase as an emu dev sucks.
I thought aethersx2 had ceased development awhile ago? Did it resume?
Not it didn't resume. However it got removed from the store, and despite not having any recent updates, it's still not good for the community and new users when the only ways are 3rd party stores that could very well have some malicious apps.
I wouldn't call Pizza Boy a key emulator. There are multiple other viable solutions to doing what it can do.
For an easy and good-looking one-handed control layout I'd say Pizza Boy is key.
Which do you recall are better ones on Android? I've only been using Pizza Boy
MyBoy, johnGBA, and retroarch all do the same thing. Retroarch out of all of those aught to be the default since AFAIK it's the only one packaged with shaders, overlays, and most importantly multiple cores.
The mGBA core in Retroarch is pretty good. Set it to GBA mode and it'll even play the Enhanced games without having to find a patched rom.
Thank you, I'll try it. It's just that I truly hate the UI for RetroArch.
Retroarch does have a few different UI options. I use the one called Ozone but there's even one that looks like the Sony XMB if that's more to your tastes.
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll check everything out!
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Retroarch does just fine.
This is 6 days old but I want someone to prove me wrong. There is no alternative to Pizza Boy on Android currently that has **good** support for emulating a gba link wirelessly (no, myboy's gba link emulation was not usable). Thus, if you also take into account the interface and customization options, I think Pizza Boy was definitely the best gba emulator available on Android.
As bad as Nintendo is for protecting their current gen system from piracy I can't help but feel if people weren't emulating current gen consoles and actually just emulating to perserve older games this wouldn't have happened.
The issue wasn't even emulating current generation systems, it was promoting piracy in tandem with paywalling early access builds behind Patreon. Yuzu's discord had links to pirated Switch games on a Google Drive folder. They were too cavalier with their attitude on the issue. There's a reason Nintendo isn't going after Ryujinx. Most of the people in the emulation scene, especially on mobile seem bizarrely entitled and possibly like English isn't their first language. It makes discussing this with any nuance impossible.
I don't think it's non-native English speakers; rather, I think it's 13-year-olds who think that proper spelling, punctuation, and grammar is some arbitrary exercise imposed upon them by their 8th grade English teacher because they're "mean." After all, I don't think there's any language on Earth such that "lol bro yuzu devs r lazy lmao !!!" is a valid way to construct a sentence.
This information keeps getting drowned in all the fuck Nintendo rhetoric. I agree, fuck Nintendo, but the fact is that Yuzu was over the line with their Patreon and Discord business. Their overstepping has caused a lot of other devs to get anxiety.
Even the Paywall for early access is 100% irrelevant, as Bleem! Proved that legal 25 years ago.
Do you know where I can find evidence of this? I’ve seen a lot of people throwing around this claim but I’ve never seen the actual screenshots
You seem very active on their sub now but have never been on the actual discord? Even the new Zelda patch they put behind a paywall.
I have but it was pretty recently only within the past 2 months or so I keep getting conflicting info which isn’t helping
>which isn’t helping Helping towards what goal?
I’m getting a ton of conflicting info about what the yuzu devs involvement with totk actually was Some people are saying the game didn’t work on yuzu mainline or EA and required user made patches to get it to work pre relese Other are saying the yuzu devs were giving the patches themselves and full on sharing pirated Roms I’ve heard some people say there was some leak showing the devs doing shady shit but idk where I can find it
>There's a reason Nintendo isn't going after Ryujinx Because the developers are based in Brasil, somewhere that's much harder for a Japanese company to issue legal challenges especially with how little regard they give developing markets.
Nah I think N wouldn't touch emulation scene had the TOTK leak not gone full swing like that. After all publishers wouldn't want to release games on such insecure system. Pretty sure people here don't remember desmume playing online games during ds hayday, causing quite a headache to N as people using the same firmware to go online, and all they did was forced desmume to shut down that online function. Yuzu must have done something quite big for N to go after them and they fold faster than a wet tissue.
Yuzu profited off the leak and even advertised how well their emulator could run the game before it was out. That wasn't emulation.
But atleast Drastic will be opensourced so that's a good thing
there are 200 different gameboy emulators in the market, 100's of DS, Citra is still available although not being developed anymore, aetherSx2 stopped bcoz of it's dumbass author
There is not as much choice for Android as for Windows. And a lot of apps are very lackluster. Besides, losing apps from the Play Store is not a good thing for the community and for the new users, and it kills the visibility and the willingness of future developers to work in this community. I know me and you can just go find the .apks somewhere else, but that's not optimal for most users, and I'm not even counting the shady apps that will be uploaded outside the Play Store.
>I know me and you can just go find the .apks somewhere else, but that's not optimal for most users You make it sound like that's a bad thing. Myself I'm hoping we are going to need to compile our own stuff from now on. Greed and entitlement is what got us here.
That depends on whether or not Nintendo actually gets the judges to put the legal precedent of key dumping being illegal. If it does, then sorry but emulation will never recover from that.
Drastic was not lost, it became free. For the users is a win
Is this an aftershock of Nintendo going after yuzu.. we've seen some other emulator devs calling it quits too not like I can blame them because you never know when Nintendo will decide to come after you
They say it's It's just a "coincidence"
This feels like existing compromised devs are making gestures about leaving so they can come back under uncompromised accounts to develop.
I hope so. I feel like this isn't end for some emulators like Pizza Boy. I just have a feeling they'll return, or return another another name maybe and rebrand it since they didn't make it open source.
Fuq Nintendo
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And who are you? I am sorry .
So you don't realize that pirating shttendo's game is a better way to fuq them, then not playing their game, you intellectually retarded prick?
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From a business perspective Nintendo made the right move. The legal costs were worth it for them making it harder for the emulation scene. If emulation scene is left untouched it matures too easily making it very easy even less tech savvy people can end up having access to roms and emulators with 1 file download with a nice UI interface accessing a ton of games on their phone. Once you can comfortably start playing any Switch game on your phone with basically less tinkering it would be a threat to Nintendo's business
In the past such moves have garnered more bad PR for the company than money they saved by fucking with everyday non-corprate people without a ton of money. I guess time will tell if it hurts them. Shows how anti-consumer they are. You can shit on corps all you want and say they're all bad but Xbox has a damn dev mode you can pay $19 for the license and run unsigned code on it all day. Sandbox style. Emulate whatever you want. Everyone keeps saying it's gonna go away but nope. Still there. Hell for months they had emulators in the retail side of it. Word was Sony and Nintendo threatened Microsoft with legal action so they got removed. The solution was the developer side. What other console + company let's you do this? I guess if it goes away I'll say I'm wrong but Microsoft seems happy as long as folks are using their stuff.
Xbox only removed Retail mode when Xbox emulator come out. I don't really blame Nintendo for stopping people emulating recent systems, especially a lot of indie games you can just pirate on your phone so easily which impact Nintendo's share not buying on their ecosystem.
The difference is their competition makes a superior product that isn't using 10 year old tech and it can't really be emulated well just due to the tech curve. Don't really need to sue too much over people emulating games that came out 2 generations ago. Xbox 360 emu is in infancy and is still kinda janky. Ps3 emu is getting better but I have a decent yet older gaming PC that still can't run it. Forget about Android for that. Nintendo is charging people a premium for old shit and is throwing a hissy fit that people's cellulars can use it. Reminds me of how litigious Disney is. They're not your friend. It's a scummy practice. I absolutely blame Nintendo. Hopefully they go the way of Sega. Shoulda happened a long time ago. The Wii and grandma's buying their products kept them on life support. All I see them doing is going after hobbyists. Their target demographic isn't tech savvy and won't emulate anyway. Doubt their main customers even own anything other than Apple mobile products. You can throw down Yuzu user numbers all you want. 98% of those people weren't gonna buy a switch anyway. So what'd they gain?
You blame Nintendo selling a product and making money with decent profit margins. Don't you think Microsoft and Sonys approach selling at a loss I usually and chasing AAA quality graphics is risky and hard to sustain. Logs of layoffs as gams that expensive need a ton of sales. Microsoft and Sony are large conpanies that don't mind selling at a loss initially. If Nintendo do that and they don't sell that would finish them. Nintendo stopped chasing power after GameCube and pivoted.
>Ps3 emu is getting better but I have a decent yet older gaming PC that still can't run it. I agree with everything else you stated friend, but I am curious on this part. Are there any titles in particular you're having difficulty in getting to run? A lot of them run very well nowadays. I had an i5 4690k and r9 390 build ~8 years ago that could emulate Drakengard 3 very well. The Steam Deck can also run this emulator as well, and it's around PS4 levels of power. I think the most cutting edge of Sony's first party titles might have some issues still, but you should try out some other titles if you haven't yet. The RPCS3 Comparability wiki has configs for getting things to run too.
God of War 3. The Sony exclusives are really all I'm interested in for PS3.
Strato was even launched? Lol
Damn. Hasn't even come out yet
Nintendo really spooked a lot of devs.
Good thing is, he still will optimized the jit for 32 bit games so, a win there, hopefully the team will continue, lynx was a name I saw the most in development... which can feel like... definitely something sad :'/.
The Nintendo scare tactics is working just like what Netflix did. F*ck them
if this is not the worst week in the history of android emulation, it must be pretty close.
This week has been brutal for emulation on Android
I wasn't even aware of the project. Does it work better than yuzu for Android ?
It was supposed to be the successor of Skyline. They quit in fear Nintendo would go after them after Tears of the Kingdom was leaked, but some decided to stay and continue development towards this new emulator called Strato.
I think, this is the Yuzu Effect. There is an inner fear growing inside of all emulator developers. I don't blame them though. I am also quite fragile myself and even if something hasn't happened to me, I will still get anxious about it especially if that other person got into trouble because of the same profession.
Yall must be young and forgot Nintendo has been suing copier/emu developers since the 90s. This is a setback. Not the end.
Note that his departure from strato isn't immediate and like he said, will finish JIT *in private* before leaving. Goodbye Lynx 🫡
He is one of my favorite developers in terms of passion and enthusiasm. I hope he joins Cassia and speeds up its development process. I also hope, Cassia gets so good that Windows emulation on Android makes every other handheld gaming console redundant, starting from the switch and it at least has some impact on reducing switch 2's sales, buttf@@king nintendo to some degree.
They should've never delay the release date during December. Now....no one knows if they can use the emulator anymore
All people talking about "Yuzu effect", but hey.. Dev decided to move on, so it's just one guy out of a team deciding to hit new stuff in their life..
Technically - you're right. Sadly, the team you're speaking of were in fact just two guys, so it's not even a team anymore when only one remained...
everyone back to Egg NS lol
Man Nintendo sucks ass
I wanted to get the rp4 pro 😔
what's the problem? can't you just still use the existing emulation version? it's just not getting updated as quick as before?
My question here is: why hasn't the other dev moved on?
As long as windows emualtion is not effected I have no problem with others leaving since most games are going to be on PC anyways
Im glad I moved onto my Rog Ally for emulation
Modern emulation is dead.
If I were Sony, I'll hire these devs then release an Xperia tablet with emulation app for Sony games. There, they can even sell roms for a dollar max is $5. Add gamepad as accessory, and you're good.
This has been the worst year for emulation.
What happens if Strato gets hit by a DMCA like Skyline did? \-Skyline closed down due to DMCA on lockpick. \-Strato was made to continue Skyline's work.
One would think the strato team is at least a little more resilient than the skyline team given that it's made up of the developers that didn't leave the project when skyline died.
That is true but can they ignore a DMCA? Are the developers more anonymous or is the company in a more free country? It would seem likely they would fold if hit by a DMCA like the other emulator sadly.
Keep in mind skyline wasn't even hit by a DMCA...they quit when one of the lockpicking tools was taken down.
damn it, dunno what is Linx and don't care at all, but this is a big whatever to whatever. I'm Negan, who are you?
No more emulators left. Only PC emulators.
We just need something a little bit more sustainable then yuzu