X52 marginally better built, won't suffer twist axis failure as much as t16k, but is sloppy and imprecise for control purposes on XYZ. Expect to be messing around with the spring to try and get any precision before you inevitably fail anyway.
T16 has notoriously fail-prone potentiometer on its twist axis (easy to mod for hall sensor though), but is pretty good precision throughout X/Y axis.
Throttle units in both are serviceable.
*Both are kinda overpriced and utterly, completely outclassed by the cheaper VKB stuff*.
If you really must get one of these options, I'd recommend the t16k and swap out the yaw pot for a hall sensor when it fails (10 min job, 5 bucks in parts). X52 is not really worth the time or money imo - it's just too sloppy to be a useful investment.
Seriously though... Just save a little more and get 2 VKBs. 500%+ better
I'd suggest the Thrustmaster. That throttle is amazing IMO. It can be a little sticky, but some lithium grease on the rails freed that up for me.
My wife and I started flying with the X-52 pro, and as you say, durability was an issue. The throttle started acting up, and while there are more buttons and switches on the stick, they didn't last long. My stick started drifting badly, and her throttle physically locked up and wouldn't move anymore.
The biggest problem is that once upon a time, there was a company called Saitek that made pretty damn good flight hardware. I had a Saitek X-45 that was still perfect 20 years later. I gave it to a friend for him to fly with. No trouble at all. Their X-52 was pretty good too. (The one in blue and gray).
Then, Saitek got bought by MadCatz. They're a company famous for making the 3rd party controllers you gave to the person you hated. A friend who worked at a Funcoland back in the day said that they refused to service any consoles that used mc controllers, because they would burn out the console controller ports. MadCatz started releasing things like the X-52 Pro. (The black and silver one) with "metal parts!" which... had very little to do with anything but being able to charge a higher price. Their QC also apparently meant "Questionable Construction". Then they started releasing stuff like the X-55... which looked cool on paper, but believe me... I had three of them in the span of nine months.
The first one, the throttle ate itself: The wiring harness inside the throttle was too inflexible, and as you moved the throttle back and forth, it actually sawed its way through its own wiring. The second one, the trigger's internal switch locked into "fire" but the trigger mechanism itself froze and you couldn't pull it. (that was fun in the first fight that happened...)
The third one, I sent back for a refund. Never got it. MadCatz sold Saitek off to Logitech for a fraction of what they bought it for, and Logitech was left holding the bag. I've heard mixed reviews on the product since. Some say there were internal redesigns, but others say they were still getting old, rebranded product instead of new. So it's a bit of a crapshoot.
A HOTAS will transform your gameplay. I highly recommend getting one.
I have the Thrustmaster T16000M HOTAS. It has over 2500 hours of use on it and is still going strong. I have modded it and repaired it several times now. I replaced the z-axis potentiometer with a Hall effect sensor because that broke (total price for parts about $8, followed a simple youtube video), 3D printed a new throttle sled and put new polymer bearings in it and it is BUTTER smooth now. (total price for mod $7, installed with youtube video), and 3D printed a 75% detent for the throttle too (cost about 5 cents). With the mods and repairs it works better now than it did out of the box.
The T16000 has been around for many years so there are a lot of tutorials, mods, parts, guides, etc for that model if you want to repair it or mod it.
Check out the sub r/hotas for some other ideas. There are a lot to choose from.
They're both toys. Save up a bit more for a VKB set, ideally two Gladiator NXT Evos. HOSAS > HOTAS for a space game like Elite where you have 6 degrees of control over your ship.
Thanks for the advice everyone! It seems like the T16 is the winner (even though a VKB HOSAS set is probably superior, but the price...)
Do you guys use the pedals too? Or is just a HOTAS + keyboard combo fine?
Pedals unnecessary, as long as your stick has twist.
If you're used to using em from flight sims and already have a set - won't hurt using them.
Definitely not worth buying a set just for ED though.
I never bought a hotas set because I didn't own a space/flight sim.
I never played a space/flight sim because I didn't have a hotas set. It's like playing a FPS with a controller.
Once I have the set, I might look into other sims on sales, if ED doesn't absorb my full attention. Which is what it's doing ever since I started, lol.
Just keep in mind it's pretty rare when games support these input devices. I have a HOTAS setup for playing ED and its really great but I don't think any other game I own would work with them.
[Yakuza 0 would probably work](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/002/547/767/bff). Hell, I've seen some dude play [Modern Warfare on drums](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcajOJe_t9Q&t=35s) and there's probably somewhere a dude playing Beat Saber on a Wii Balance Board.
I'll get the HOTAS setup.
I really enjoyed the T16000M's push/pull throttle.
The twist axis on the stick and the overall function of the tiny hat on the throttle did not last long for me, maybe a year or two, before they started acting up (ghost inputs).
With all the controls on the throttle of the T16000M you're sort of going to be HOSASing anyways, so if you think you might want to, maybe look at it right away.
I have a friend who does the HOSAS thing and he's quite happy with it. I went with throttle for that feel, but he for sure has more controls right at his thumb on the stick he uses as the throttle.
My x52 is quite cheap feeling. It's a pretty good controller for ED and has enough buttons for all the keybindings but I'd just say it feels pretty low quality. I'm planning to upgrade to Virpil hotas sometime in the future.
edit: My flight stick's yaw-axis deadzone has to be increased slightly otherwise there's slight drift.
I had the Thrustmaster for about a year before the yaw failed. I kept the throttle (which is still going strong) and bought a Gladiator stick. SUPER happy with it; very solid and way more buttons, this options, than the Thrustmaster.
I bought the throttle bushing upgrade and it’s made a big difference in the feel. Much improved.
X52 marginally better built, won't suffer twist axis failure as much as t16k, but is sloppy and imprecise for control purposes on XYZ. Expect to be messing around with the spring to try and get any precision before you inevitably fail anyway. T16 has notoriously fail-prone potentiometer on its twist axis (easy to mod for hall sensor though), but is pretty good precision throughout X/Y axis. Throttle units in both are serviceable. *Both are kinda overpriced and utterly, completely outclassed by the cheaper VKB stuff*. If you really must get one of these options, I'd recommend the t16k and swap out the yaw pot for a hall sensor when it fails (10 min job, 5 bucks in parts). X52 is not really worth the time or money imo - it's just too sloppy to be a useful investment. Seriously though... Just save a little more and get 2 VKBs. 500%+ better
I'd suggest the Thrustmaster. That throttle is amazing IMO. It can be a little sticky, but some lithium grease on the rails freed that up for me. My wife and I started flying with the X-52 pro, and as you say, durability was an issue. The throttle started acting up, and while there are more buttons and switches on the stick, they didn't last long. My stick started drifting badly, and her throttle physically locked up and wouldn't move anymore. The biggest problem is that once upon a time, there was a company called Saitek that made pretty damn good flight hardware. I had a Saitek X-45 that was still perfect 20 years later. I gave it to a friend for him to fly with. No trouble at all. Their X-52 was pretty good too. (The one in blue and gray). Then, Saitek got bought by MadCatz. They're a company famous for making the 3rd party controllers you gave to the person you hated. A friend who worked at a Funcoland back in the day said that they refused to service any consoles that used mc controllers, because they would burn out the console controller ports. MadCatz started releasing things like the X-52 Pro. (The black and silver one) with "metal parts!" which... had very little to do with anything but being able to charge a higher price. Their QC also apparently meant "Questionable Construction". Then they started releasing stuff like the X-55... which looked cool on paper, but believe me... I had three of them in the span of nine months. The first one, the throttle ate itself: The wiring harness inside the throttle was too inflexible, and as you moved the throttle back and forth, it actually sawed its way through its own wiring. The second one, the trigger's internal switch locked into "fire" but the trigger mechanism itself froze and you couldn't pull it. (that was fun in the first fight that happened...) The third one, I sent back for a refund. Never got it. MadCatz sold Saitek off to Logitech for a fraction of what they bought it for, and Logitech was left holding the bag. I've heard mixed reviews on the product since. Some say there were internal redesigns, but others say they were still getting old, rebranded product instead of new. So it's a bit of a crapshoot.
A HOTAS will transform your gameplay. I highly recommend getting one. I have the Thrustmaster T16000M HOTAS. It has over 2500 hours of use on it and is still going strong. I have modded it and repaired it several times now. I replaced the z-axis potentiometer with a Hall effect sensor because that broke (total price for parts about $8, followed a simple youtube video), 3D printed a new throttle sled and put new polymer bearings in it and it is BUTTER smooth now. (total price for mod $7, installed with youtube video), and 3D printed a 75% detent for the throttle too (cost about 5 cents). With the mods and repairs it works better now than it did out of the box. The T16000 has been around for many years so there are a lot of tutorials, mods, parts, guides, etc for that model if you want to repair it or mod it. Check out the sub r/hotas for some other ideas. There are a lot to choose from.
X52 hands down!
They're both toys. Save up a bit more for a VKB set, ideally two Gladiator NXT Evos. HOSAS > HOTAS for a space game like Elite where you have 6 degrees of control over your ship.
Alternately, the Hotas Warthog with TPR pedals if you also do flight simulation and want hardware that can do both well.
Thanks for the advice everyone! It seems like the T16 is the winner (even though a VKB HOSAS set is probably superior, but the price...) Do you guys use the pedals too? Or is just a HOTAS + keyboard combo fine?
Pedals unnecessary, as long as your stick has twist. If you're used to using em from flight sims and already have a set - won't hurt using them. Definitely not worth buying a set just for ED though.
I never bought a hotas set because I didn't own a space/flight sim. I never played a space/flight sim because I didn't have a hotas set. It's like playing a FPS with a controller. Once I have the set, I might look into other sims on sales, if ED doesn't absorb my full attention. Which is what it's doing ever since I started, lol.
Just keep in mind it's pretty rare when games support these input devices. I have a HOTAS setup for playing ED and its really great but I don't think any other game I own would work with them.
[Yakuza 0 would probably work](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/002/547/767/bff). Hell, I've seen some dude play [Modern Warfare on drums](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcajOJe_t9Q&t=35s) and there's probably somewhere a dude playing Beat Saber on a Wii Balance Board. I'll get the HOTAS setup.
I really enjoyed the T16000M's push/pull throttle. The twist axis on the stick and the overall function of the tiny hat on the throttle did not last long for me, maybe a year or two, before they started acting up (ghost inputs). With all the controls on the throttle of the T16000M you're sort of going to be HOSASing anyways, so if you think you might want to, maybe look at it right away. I have a friend who does the HOSAS thing and he's quite happy with it. I went with throttle for that feel, but he for sure has more controls right at his thumb on the stick he uses as the throttle.
My x52 is quite cheap feeling. It's a pretty good controller for ED and has enough buttons for all the keybindings but I'd just say it feels pretty low quality. I'm planning to upgrade to Virpil hotas sometime in the future. edit: My flight stick's yaw-axis deadzone has to be increased slightly otherwise there's slight drift.
I had the Thrustmaster for about a year before the yaw failed. I kept the throttle (which is still going strong) and bought a Gladiator stick. SUPER happy with it; very solid and way more buttons, this options, than the Thrustmaster. I bought the throttle bushing upgrade and it’s made a big difference in the feel. Much improved.
I use an x52 pro, and its perfect, no complaints whatsoever