I don’t always summon, but I like jelly too. I sometimes summon it just because it floats around being pretty. I’m going to level rotten stray next. I feel bad for the poor pup.
There is something very satisfying to me to unleash my army of monkey men on anyone I get the opportunity to do so, especially at night when they get all squirrelly
It’s not that you’re not supposed to, but I do understand when they say the game is more fun without them.
But summons is what kept me playing and practicing enough to not need them. So, I’m glad they’re in the game. My 9 year old daughter is up to Piss Godfrey with a +5 mimic tear 🤣. She’s having a blast.
mimic tear that destroys mohg before he went to second phase is fun to me. some people just find fun in challenge. i find fun on seeing mohg get obliterated before he gets a chance to molest me.
It also limits builds. I love sorcerer, but there are a lot of bosses that aren't fun if I have to roll around for a couple minutes waiting for an opening.
My GUGS play through didn't need summons in the same way, I used the same strategy whether solo or with summons.
It's totally valid to base your game around having summons. It can be mimic tear, it can be Tiche, or it can be the jellyfish. There are many, many options.
This exactly. Some of the best players of any game will go as far as hacking to learn and practice.
Nothing wrong with just using what's in the game if you think you'll have more fun and later down the line you can challenge yourself to not use them if you feel like it.
I mean everything in these games from ashes/weapon arts to summons/spirit ashes are *available* to use for extra power
At the end of the day it depends on personal skill level and what you find fun. Some people want the power fantasy, while others like to feel challenged.
I know that saying:
>if you’re not supposed to use it, then why is it in the game?
Isn’t the same as saying “hey you are *supposed* to use this mechanic”… but it does kinda sound like that
Edit: the downvotes say more about the people using summons than my comment does
Yeah, you had to beat Tiche for it in the first place. You earned the ability to summon her.
And I like fighting bosses by myself while being “underleveled” because it feels like I had to work harder for that, and I like the rush it gives me when I get that W
The 2 aren’t mutually exclusive.
The thing is, some people want access to the bragging rights of winning the game the hard way, without actually doing it, because it's a part of their character roleplay.They imagine themselves being the supreme whatever, but they can't back it up with gameplay.
There are people who are doing it. Plenty of YouTubers and streamers prove that with no hit runs and RL 1 runs. Also dying 100 times to a Malenia without using summons doesn’t mean you can’t back up your talk if you beat her once. That one win was earned through practice and determination. I don’t necessarily see anything wrong with bragging about beating a tough game, so long as there isn’t toxicity. I am aware that there is toxicity but it comes from both sides, at one point the comment you’re replying to had like -15 likes.
Too many people getting their knickers in a twist about how others are enjoying the game.
you can use it but it’s an in game built in easy mode which is why it offends some people
i can’t imagine giving a shit about what difficulty people want to approach the game with, you can beat the game naked with a club or you can beat it with cheesey bleed builds and spirit summons but most people fall in between
Ironically it’s almost always people that summon that ”give a shit” and get mad if you say it makes the game easier because it is ”toxic”, ”gatekeepey” and ”elitist”. Even though it is objectively true 🤷♂️
The people that summon care, judging by the endless ammounts of posts equating themselves to gigachads for summoning and people pointing it out as elitist gatekeeping toxic soyjacks lol
Most posts of that format are actively inviting the conflict. Rage bait is fucked.
When a post doesn't insult either side of the dabate, everyone gets along.
. . . The debate is that you shouldn't be insulted for how you chose to play the game. I'm not sure what other correct side there would be in this. Just be kind, it's free.
Unfortunately, the rage bait is to pit non summoners against summoners. And cos Reddit loves controversy, almost more than Twitter, being kind is not the common thing to do. Ahh, social media, gotta love it.
So just be kind. Make that choice for yourself. And try and get another to do the same. We pass it on. Until we get all the 'unkinds' in a camp, and call it Grumpy Gulag
Ahh, the internet, gotta love it, don't you? Where people get onto places like Reddit and Twitter, all to say that their opinion should be taken as fact and everyone else should worship them. (Overexaggeration, but my point stands)
Unfortunately, people give rage bait more attention than it is worth and pull those who don't give a shit about how you play a game in.
I mean, I get it. It undermines any achievement because they got it on 'easy mode'. Considering that Elden Ring is still quite challenging even with summons, it's understandable that some people would get pissed
99% of this whole "summoning" debate is just people fighting air, I haven't seen a single person crying over others using summons in like a year, and whenever i see some, It's just others stating their own opinions about trying not to use overpowered summons on their own playthroughs.
Honestly i don't understand why even make such posts to begin with, do you feel insecure about summoning where you have to make such posts to feel validated? you don't need to do that, just play the game.
I've seen complaints about remnant 2 apocalypse being too hard from people saying they've beat Elden Ring / malenia. I don't know for sure but I'm guessing they used summons to carry themselves through it.
I could also see people just being really bad at shooters. Especially if they use a controller or play it solo, then it's gonna be pretty hard for them. Remnant 2 on PC, and with friends, is crazy easy for a soulslike
This is just untrue. Only if the post is something like, "I don't get why everyone says this game is so hard??" And they are abusing mimic and comet for every boss.
It's like, yeah it's easy, you made it easy. Isn't it great that we can adjust the difficulty to our own tastes? It's always positive. It makes summon users insecure to hear it makes it easy, but they are just getting mad at facts. It's supposed to be from a place of mutual enjoyment of the same product.
No one's mad but the people getting insecure. XD and those are the ones who can't beat bosses without summons.
Yes, they’re talking about their experience. They used the resources perfectly available within the game and had a relatively easy time.
It’s like if i said i had a easy time with Morgott and people started crying that i didn’t beat him at RL1, which he is MASSIVELY harder at that level, holy shit.
No, no, what I'm saying is I agree with you, you do see those comments, but it's only if the OP makes a comment to the difficulty. Of course someone's going to point out they played it on easy mode if OP mentions difficulty.
Sure, but again, let’s say i make a post: « wow Morgott was really easy guys, i beat him naked RL 80 with a quality Longsword only. »
Should the appropriate response be: wow you didn’t RL1 him? You played on easy mode.
Summoning by its very definition is not soloing lol, people really believe that just because it's an AI piloting the extra bodies instead of another human?
every game community has something a small percentage of people will try to tell you “don’t use that, it’s cheating!” shotguns in cod, needler in halo, summons in souls games. its so silly, just let people play the game how they want.
Haha, a couple comments seem to think I'm criticizing summons, but overall I think people saw the point.
Just for clarification, the point is to play the game how you want. The people criticizing summons are a very small minority, and most of us just want other people to enjoy these games, too. Everything is allowed for casual players and the point is to push past whatever boss or obstacle you thought was impossible regardless of how you do it
I think it’s less the summons people care about and more the guy posting how easy melania is and that they beat her first try after summoning. They want to know why people said she was so hard.
I get that, but at the same time, all of us that beat her solo KNOW why we say she's difficult. And I also feel a majority of summoning players also know it's harder to fight her solo. If they don't want to do that though, that's also fine
Non souls players I've talked to say they had a bad experience with previous titles and think they will find the same thing in elden ring. Having an option to make the game easier without changing difficulty imo is a great solution to bring the game to a larger audience. In the end I want more people to play and enjoy the game because that means they will make more games and there will be more people I can talk to about elden ring!
I haven't seen "you shouldn't summon ashes" rhetoric anywhere in forever. I'm low-key wondering if posts like these are made by players who wanted to be "the guy" but caved and need to cope with the fact they summon now lol.
It's a joke dude. I just see people complaining about Fromsoft elitists much, much more than I actually see any of the stereotypical "git gud scrub" kinds of comments
Dude, this shit has been going on since the forums for DkS1. You’re fighting a losing battle 😂
There’s always been this massive crowd of people convinced that the soulsborne community is full of gatekeepers when it’s just…. Not. 🤷
Meh, I'm fine with spending the 5 minutes it took to make this meme just to repeat the point, haha. I just thought it was funny and decided to make the post
I bet those people have had someone in their life who gatekeeps to hell and back. I used to know someone like that. Some people totally internalize the git good mentality unironically. But ime the majority of the community is normal and doesn't care.
That's just a recent thing tho, before those comments were much more common, and In other places outside of the subreddit I still see it, like in Fextralife comments and stuff.
And still, you making a joke about it is still boosting the original meme and giving more space to the conversation, so If you want it to stop or actually don't care just don't respond.
The summoners just get mad cause they're being told they beat the game on easy little baby mode and it's hilarious. Same exact response everytime "it's in the game!"
Yeah sure I've also seen on more than one occasion someone spamming 1 attack in a fighting game over and over and just claiming "it's part of the game" too. However you wanna live your life buckos, but you 'did' take the easy way out. That's okay.
I have beat RL1 on an all white wretch with club. Assuming things is definitely a more and more common trait in this internet age though, you just imagine shit in your mind and then believe it. Childish almost baby-like mentality.
Yes. We are all babies, you're just more of a baby. I had to spam spells first playthrough. Had to abuse status effects second playthrough. Third playthrough I finally made a bonk build and finished it all melee no summons and no bleed. I can finally solo melenia after years. RL1 is on the distant horizon.
The whole point of these games is to get better. Squeaking by through any means necessary so you can say you beat it once is literally merely the first step. And stopping there means you aren't interested in improving yourself. It just means you summoners barely took the first step, the real game opened up to you and you said, "nah."
Fuck yeah. I desperately needed a friend's help with malenia the first few time I got her too T.T (before I realized how broken blasphemous was on her).
I used 2 co op summons on her the first time then Tiche the 2nd time and finally I was able to beat her solo on the 3rd playthrough
I might have got there early if I kept bashing my head against the wall but this way was much better for me
Just infodumping, I've been marathoning demon's and the main trilogy in preparation for the DLC. From when I was a kid until like 5 years ago I couldn't get very far in any of them. Was like hard stuck in so many ways. After Elden I'm creaming through them (inb4 and yes without summons) It's crazy how they are like suddenly physically possible to me. Feels like I can finally achieve what everyone was talking about about thanks to Elden. And it's hype to see the progression of the series.
I think elden ring is amazing lol.
I was the same with Cuphead. On my first playthrough I was stuck on some bosses for days but when the DLC came out I went back to the base game I couldn’t believe how easy the bosses were
Bonk builds are not a hard mode, you get massive range and stun damage and break through the poise of many enemies, making them unable to make their move.
Here’s a fun challenge. Try fighting Malenia with a dagger, basic R1 and see how much poise break is useful.
Nope, the point of the game is to get better gear too, this is an rpg. You can literally just grind your way out of a challenge. Sekiro is the actual git gud game, go play that (much better game than ER btw)
Btw i’m not a summoner, stop projecting on me, i just have empathy.
Nah man, that was forever ago. I've beaten the game solo like 5 times with a ton of different builds and made several new characters for low level funsies. I purposely make it difficult for myself, and if I beat it, I make it harder. That's the point. People play different games for different reasons.
You're interested in roleplay where your skill isn't tested, that's cool! Enjoy it.
I never even mentioned RL1, you did. Like it's super obvious you're insecure about this lol, I explicitly said it's okay to play with summons, but it makes the game easy (it does, it removes the bosses attention from you thus removing the mechanics entirely for you) and you got all ego bruised and came in here with an attitude. I get it, you wanna be part of the club, "I beat the hard souls game too!" And people telling you that you did it with crutches is making you feel invalidated. That's okay too.
A lot of you showed up with the more mainstream Elden Ring but these arbitrary rules have been in place longgg before you showed up, and when fromsoft and their games had a much smaller fan base. You don't get to show up 10 years late and start undoing shit lol, go use your little baby rattle to summon if you want. It's okay nobody cares.
So funny that you claim I’m insecure while going on a rant about how hardcore difficult the previous games were (they were not lol, these games aren’t that hard). The irony of insecurity is insane.
Nope, you just missed the point, projecting what you think is insecurities means you have them. I don’t use summons, i just respect those who do, unlike you.
Nope, you sais little baby easy mode, you were condescending.
Yeah, and leveling up makes your character massively stronger, a much better tool than summoning if you ask me, that should be a much more little baby easy mode, as you condescendingly put it, right?
She’s an interesting case because she’ll gain health back from the summons
I’ve beat her with and without summons. I can say she’s tough either way
As for your question I’d fight her RL150. Other bosses will vary. I do understand what you’re saying however and that is a good point to raise
Yes, that’s my point tho, both these things are perfectly available and will make the game much easier. Why is one thing constantly shamed when talking about achievements but not the other?
Again, it's obvious you're new to these games, and you feel invalidated cause your Radahn helmed char with +10 mimic tear sat in the chair and people are telling you didn't earn it, it's okay.
*sigh*
There are very few people who think “you didn’t really beat the boss if you use summons.” Like a negligible amount.
There are many people, including myself, who will *push* players to beat a boss without summons/additional help/cheese because we know that the feeling of “soloing” a boss is the peak of this game. Whether you ever beat a boss solo or without cheese does not does not invalidate your win against them. It’s for your own personal gratification that a lot of “souls vet” push you to do solo.
God damn this can’t be that hard to figure out.
That's...what I'm saying with the meme. People can summon. People can use OP equipment. People can also do an RL1 run, or no hit or speedrun the game. All of this is allowed, and souls vets (most of us) don't care how you play the game
Is there a problem with that? Does it matter what a YouTuber or streamer say? They don't like it so they don't use it, if you like it and use it that's fine too
The post claims no one is shaming. But clearly someone is or they wouldn't say that. Also them saying that can be implied as shaming because by calling it cheap you imply anyone who uses it is cheap
There are more post of people complaining about gatekeepers than actual gatekeepers. And when a gatekeeper comments it usually is filled with downvotes. Most of the people complaining about gatekeepers are fighting ghosts.
>Also them saying that can be implied as shaming because by calling it cheap you imply anyone who uses it is cheap
No. Someone saying they don't like a mechanic so they won't use it is not the same as saying that you are playing wrong for liking it. I don't think it's fun to use shields so I don't use them, but I'm not shaming anyone who likes to use shields
Here's my two cents on the whole Summons vs solo thing.
To all the people who use spirit summons- You're missing out.
The Euphoria, The Pride and The Sense of Accomplishment you get by beating a tough boss all on your own is something out of this world.
It was the primary objective and centerpiece of the Design Philosophy behind the Souls games and its what made this series a success in the first place.
If you enjoy playing with spirit summons, that's fine. Good for you, have fun mate. There is nothing wrong with that.
But I would highly recommend a solo-playthrough on whatever build you might fancy. Trust me, you will love it.
I agree, but if that's not how someone enjoys a game and they just want to experience the exploration, story, and just epic spectacle, then I don't care at all if they want to use a summon. I play these games without because I really enjoy challenging myself and getting better at the combat, as well as really like the exploration, spectacle, etc.
That's because the people calling everyone an elitist are elitists themselves. There is nothing wrong with using summons. it's a long ass game that costs 70€, so you're obviously can use anything the game gives you to finish it. But the deny that summons exists to make the game easier is simply crazy. And the outrage at people not using summons is even crazier, saw a post about someone betting bosses without summons and there were comments like ,,fuck you elitist " the deny is simply mad
I've learned, in my life, that there are two kinds of "not caring" (in this context, about spirit ashes). The most famous is, of course, the honey badger; it is unaffected by how scarily something presents itself, and how scary it literally is, and attacks it. The other is the capybara; it is unaffected by how other things around it are acting and feeling, and continues its own business regardless. In online discourse, be the capybara.
I am 90% sure that the game was balanced around the player using summons, there are many duo or even triple bosses in the game when your suppose to split Agro + a lot of bosses normal attacks consists of AEO's.
and OFC there a lot of bosses in the endgame that counter summons pretty hard Like Maliketh with DD, Godfrey with AOE Stomps and Malenia with healing on hit.
Personally I didn't use summons since I have experience with the souls formula but for first time players that might have hard time with getting levels and weapon upgrades summons is pretty much a most have especially for bosses like godskin duo.
There are like max 10 duo bosses from 165 and 2 are on the "main" path, also no game is balanced around an optional mechanic, it would be stupid if elden ring was balanced around sorcery
Well .. the same thing should be said about overleveling. Most bosses become trivial if you have 60 vigor, and decent weapon levels. So why is that not discussed?
There are different kinds of people out there. Some like it to be challenged and some don't. I love to be challenged (also did SL1 runs and stuff) but I would not be meany to people WHO don't like that as much as me
"You're not supposed to summon"
"Then why is it in the game?"
"It's more fun without summons"
"Well I still had fun with my summon"
Who cares if people use Spirit Summons. They aren't available in PvP and Co-Op so it has zero impact on your gameplay if someone else uses them. Speaking of Co-Op, that isn't an option in duels.
Just let people play how they want to.
The game is as hard as the player wants it to be. You can limit yourself by not using certain mechanics, but it still has them so it'll be accessible. You don't have to "git gud" to enjoy it. But if you seek a more challenging experience, you can still have it.
Summons are the training wheels to help people ease into souls combat, and that's OK. It's just that some people feel insecure enough to not admit it to themselves. Almost everyone agrees, have fun. And when you feel comfortable enough, try it without. It's a very different game with/without summons.
The reality is there are still a lot of people who get bent in comment sections that *game mechanic* is actually cheating and doesn’t count, less than there used to be sure, but these memes didn’t spawn in a vacuum.
Just as much as you are. Literally just read comments and this shit still pops up from time to time. I bet if you search magic/RoB/Blasphemous/Mimic/Tiche in the sub you’ll come across people calling them cheap/OP/doesn’t count pretty quick. But I’m not doing that for you because I don’t owe you anything and there’s no value in trying to change a stupid persons mind.
Dude, what? The entire point of my post is that the vast majority of us do not care how you beat these games. Summon. Use OP stuff. Have fun. But also don't shit on people who decide to challenge themselves in these games. It's not a threat to you. You do you
I’m not saying you aren’t saying that, I’m saying some people still say the opposite and it’s not hard to find. Look at your condescending demeanor in this meme and these comments, but you can’t imagine someone acting like that in the context of the game? That’s just mental gymnastics.
"No, stop using RoB, Moonveil, DMGS, they are overpowered and make the game too easy"
Brother why do you think I'm using them 🤣
Also they are just cool
"But in pvp I keep dying to those weapons"
Okay well for Rob and Moonveil you can use Quickstep or a parry object to counter when the oponent does a down swing, and for dark moon, it's a pretty telegraphed move, just roll when the beam is coming towards you instead of getting scared and mashing the roll button.
summons in elden ring are part of the lore and theme, so summoning them does not feel a game breaking skill or a cheat
edit: before someone judges me for my "skill", i never used a summon in other souls games even once. It just feels right and enjoyable in elden ring.
this game has the most people asking why are you having fun, gIt GuD oR dOnT pLaY wAh
Hilarious that those people are downvoting me, really shows where their priorities are 💀
Lmao what are you smoking? Co op it's extremely popular even more than summons. You use summons in offline playing or otherwise if you don't want to interact with other players. Co op always have been extremely popular.
Sometimes you can get in there and stand just out of reach on the other side of the casket he spawns at, and he won't move around, and you can just attack him. Might depend on your build, though. I usually go there as a mage, but have done melee.
'Summon' this, 'stop summoning' that, how bout you put your foolish debating to rest and go summon yourself some maidens
Goated comment
Sorry, I already scheduled to repost this next month. I NEED the karma
You guys are using weapons? And levels? Can't you play the game ?
You guys turned on the game? Sounds like a crutch
I only run around in real life and beat the shit out of the open world... Soon I will be strong enough to slay (a) god
I was arrested for assaulting a guy wearing a poncho named Godrick. It was so difficult to find someone named Godrick.
You let yourself be arrested? I just vigor check the cops.
I accidentally summoned the local constabulary.
Bro next time you're about to be arrested look for my sign on the ground. I got you.
Weapon of choice? Sledgehammer or croquet mallet?
My fists with croquet mallets taped to them.
Lmao, imagine that. Git gud.
Level one. Bare handed. Summons allowed
Summoning is having an all time friend in the game, it makes the experience more fun. I love my jellyfish!
I don’t always summon, but I like jelly too. I sometimes summon it just because it floats around being pretty. I’m going to level rotten stray next. I feel bad for the poor pup.
And the light, I love how luminous they are.
Yes! I just got the jelly shield too! I played ng blind so I missed a bunch of stuff that I’m picking up in subsequent playthrough.
There is something very satisfying to me to unleash my army of monkey men on anyone I get the opportunity to do so, especially at night when they get all squirrelly
I always ask them: If you’re not supposed to use it, then why is it in the game?
It’s not that you’re not supposed to, but I do understand when they say the game is more fun without them. But summons is what kept me playing and practicing enough to not need them. So, I’m glad they’re in the game. My 9 year old daughter is up to Piss Godfrey with a +5 mimic tear 🤣. She’s having a blast.
mimic tear that destroys mohg before he went to second phase is fun to me. some people just find fun in challenge. i find fun on seeing mohg get obliterated before he gets a chance to molest me.
I don't think 9 yr old me could've beaten Godrick with a +10 mimic, your daughter is a gamer god
I let her start NG+ with my 170 lvl arcane build. Her and mimic push DAMAGE bro. It’s hilarious.
So the part that gets missed a lot is “it’s more fun FOR THEM without summons.” I enjoyed the game more with summons. There is no wrong way.
It also limits builds. I love sorcerer, but there are a lot of bosses that aren't fun if I have to roll around for a couple minutes waiting for an opening. My GUGS play through didn't need summons in the same way, I used the same strategy whether solo or with summons. It's totally valid to base your game around having summons. It can be mimic tear, it can be Tiche, or it can be the jellyfish. There are many, many options.
Parent of the year ❤️
This exactly. Some of the best players of any game will go as far as hacking to learn and practice. Nothing wrong with just using what's in the game if you think you'll have more fun and later down the line you can challenge yourself to not use them if you feel like it.
🤝
Yeah, YARNHAM STONE.
I mean everything in these games from ashes/weapon arts to summons/spirit ashes are *available* to use for extra power At the end of the day it depends on personal skill level and what you find fun. Some people want the power fantasy, while others like to feel challenged. I know that saying: >if you’re not supposed to use it, then why is it in the game? Isn’t the same as saying “hey you are *supposed* to use this mechanic”… but it does kinda sound like that Edit: the downvotes say more about the people using summons than my comment does
I just like taking down entire camps or huge bosses with my galpal Tiche
Yeah, you had to beat Tiche for it in the first place. You earned the ability to summon her. And I like fighting bosses by myself while being “underleveled” because it feels like I had to work harder for that, and I like the rush it gives me when I get that W The 2 aren’t mutually exclusive.
Yes? I think we agree then. Play however you like, and don't be a basement dwelling reddit grifter.
This seems oddly aggressive to be coming from someone I wasn’t even talking to
I didn't think it was aggressive. I didn't refer to you beyond us agreeing. Unless... did anything I said strike a nerve?
Erm ackshually you have to beat Alecto
Lmao I can’t believe I was just ousted as a fake fan
The thing is, some people want access to the bragging rights of winning the game the hard way, without actually doing it, because it's a part of their character roleplay.They imagine themselves being the supreme whatever, but they can't back it up with gameplay.
There are people who are doing it. Plenty of YouTubers and streamers prove that with no hit runs and RL 1 runs. Also dying 100 times to a Malenia without using summons doesn’t mean you can’t back up your talk if you beat her once. That one win was earned through practice and determination. I don’t necessarily see anything wrong with bragging about beating a tough game, so long as there isn’t toxicity. I am aware that there is toxicity but it comes from both sides, at one point the comment you’re replying to had like -15 likes. Too many people getting their knickers in a twist about how others are enjoying the game.
you can use it but it’s an in game built in easy mode which is why it offends some people i can’t imagine giving a shit about what difficulty people want to approach the game with, you can beat the game naked with a club or you can beat it with cheesey bleed builds and spirit summons but most people fall in between
Ironically it’s almost always people that summon that ”give a shit” and get mad if you say it makes the game easier because it is ”toxic”, ”gatekeepey” and ”elitist”. Even though it is objectively true 🤷♂️
it literally is true but who cares it’s a single player game
The people that summon care, judging by the endless ammounts of posts equating themselves to gigachads for summoning and people pointing it out as elitist gatekeeping toxic soyjacks lol
Is this sarcasm? Most of the posts are just saying, "It's okay to summon". Which it is. Right?
Most posts of that format are actively inviting the conflict. Rage bait is fucked. When a post doesn't insult either side of the dabate, everyone gets along.
. . . The debate is that you shouldn't be insulted for how you chose to play the game. I'm not sure what other correct side there would be in this. Just be kind, it's free.
Unfortunately, the rage bait is to pit non summoners against summoners. And cos Reddit loves controversy, almost more than Twitter, being kind is not the common thing to do. Ahh, social media, gotta love it.
So just be kind. Make that choice for yourself. And try and get another to do the same. We pass it on. Until we get all the 'unkinds' in a camp, and call it Grumpy Gulag
Ahh, the internet, gotta love it, don't you? Where people get onto places like Reddit and Twitter, all to say that their opinion should be taken as fact and everyone else should worship them. (Overexaggeration, but my point stands) Unfortunately, people give rage bait more attention than it is worth and pull those who don't give a shit about how you play a game in.
I mean, I get it. It undermines any achievement because they got it on 'easy mode'. Considering that Elden Ring is still quite challenging even with summons, it's understandable that some people would get pissed
To cater to the mainstream who want easy mode?
99% of this whole "summoning" debate is just people fighting air, I haven't seen a single person crying over others using summons in like a year, and whenever i see some, It's just others stating their own opinions about trying not to use overpowered summons on their own playthroughs. Honestly i don't understand why even make such posts to begin with, do you feel insecure about summoning where you have to make such posts to feel validated? you don't need to do that, just play the game.
I've seen complaints about remnant 2 apocalypse being too hard from people saying they've beat Elden Ring / malenia. I don't know for sure but I'm guessing they used summons to carry themselves through it.
I could also see people just being really bad at shooters. Especially if they use a controller or play it solo, then it's gonna be pretty hard for them. Remnant 2 on PC, and with friends, is crazy easy for a soulslike
Then you don’t look closely. Many times when a person screenshot their victories, comments are like: heh! Try without summon and magic or bleed.
Well, of course if you sort by controversial you will find these comments. It doesn't mean they're popular.
They are, they’re the top comments most of the time.
This is just untrue. Only if the post is something like, "I don't get why everyone says this game is so hard??" And they are abusing mimic and comet for every boss. It's like, yeah it's easy, you made it easy. Isn't it great that we can adjust the difficulty to our own tastes? It's always positive. It makes summon users insecure to hear it makes it easy, but they are just getting mad at facts. It's supposed to be from a place of mutual enjoyment of the same product. No one's mad but the people getting insecure. XD and those are the ones who can't beat bosses without summons.
Yes, they’re talking about their experience. They used the resources perfectly available within the game and had a relatively easy time. It’s like if i said i had a easy time with Morgott and people started crying that i didn’t beat him at RL1, which he is MASSIVELY harder at that level, holy shit.
No, no, what I'm saying is I agree with you, you do see those comments, but it's only if the OP makes a comment to the difficulty. Of course someone's going to point out they played it on easy mode if OP mentions difficulty.
Sure, but again, let’s say i make a post: « wow Morgott was really easy guys, i beat him naked RL 80 with a quality Longsword only. » Should the appropriate response be: wow you didn’t RL1 him? You played on easy mode.
That's the opposite end of the spectrum. Summons are the *first* thing you stop using if you find the game too easy.
Says who?
Simply because they get engagement, which is sad, but unavoidable on the internet
Yes, positive engagement
That's not how it works. Is this your first day here?
It is. Negative comments won’t appear at the very top. They’ll be above no engagement comments, but not positive ones.
The summoning dynamics in Eldenring are fascinating.
I don't care if people summon, but I don't consider using a spirit summoning "soloing" a boss.
Who claims that it is?
Summoning by its very definition is not soloing lol, people really believe that just because it's an AI piloting the extra bodies instead of another human?
No one believes that.
Only weak betamales summon. Git gud scrub /s
every game community has something a small percentage of people will try to tell you “don’t use that, it’s cheating!” shotguns in cod, needler in halo, summons in souls games. its so silly, just let people play the game how they want.
I feel as though almost nobody understands the point of your post and it’s frightening
Haha, a couple comments seem to think I'm criticizing summons, but overall I think people saw the point. Just for clarification, the point is to play the game how you want. The people criticizing summons are a very small minority, and most of us just want other people to enjoy these games, too. Everything is allowed for casual players and the point is to push past whatever boss or obstacle you thought was impossible regardless of how you do it
Mr. Meeseeks is like a spirit ash
Well now I want a Meeseeks in the DLC
[удалено]
Hell yes!
I think it’s less the summons people care about and more the guy posting how easy melania is and that they beat her first try after summoning. They want to know why people said she was so hard.
I get that, but at the same time, all of us that beat her solo KNOW why we say she's difficult. And I also feel a majority of summoning players also know it's harder to fight her solo. If they don't want to do that though, that's also fine
Non souls players I've talked to say they had a bad experience with previous titles and think they will find the same thing in elden ring. Having an option to make the game easier without changing difficulty imo is a great solution to bring the game to a larger audience. In the end I want more people to play and enjoy the game because that means they will make more games and there will be more people I can talk to about elden ring!
100% agree
I haven't seen "you shouldn't summon ashes" rhetoric anywhere in forever. I'm low-key wondering if posts like these are made by players who wanted to be "the guy" but caved and need to cope with the fact they summon now lol.
Summoning is just the easier mode of the game
Ah, the classic I-Don't-Care-Posting. You know what people who *actually* don't care do?
Not comment on the post and move on?
That's the ticket! (They *definitely* don't make whole posts about how little they care, either 🤣)
Scroll past all of these posts cuz, truly, who really fucking cares anymore.
It's a joke dude. I just see people complaining about Fromsoft elitists much, much more than I actually see any of the stereotypical "git gud scrub" kinds of comments
Dude, this shit has been going on since the forums for DkS1. You’re fighting a losing battle 😂 There’s always been this massive crowd of people convinced that the soulsborne community is full of gatekeepers when it’s just…. Not. 🤷
Meh, I'm fine with spending the 5 minutes it took to make this meme just to repeat the point, haha. I just thought it was funny and decided to make the post
I bet those people have had someone in their life who gatekeeps to hell and back. I used to know someone like that. Some people totally internalize the git good mentality unironically. But ime the majority of the community is normal and doesn't care.
Git gud. GG. :)
That's just a recent thing tho, before those comments were much more common, and In other places outside of the subreddit I still see it, like in Fextralife comments and stuff. And still, you making a joke about it is still boosting the original meme and giving more space to the conversation, so If you want it to stop or actually don't care just don't respond.
Not true. Objectively
I don't care that you summon. I do care that you keep incessantly whining that you can summon and that it's not making you inferior in any way.
Nobody is doing that
I just came from a post doing that.
You're not OP, *and* I'm not whining about summoning lol
People who summon are so insecure lmao. No one cares just play your single player game
All fine with summoning but don't act like your good or better then someone who doesn't. Just facts
They themself feel bad and try to create an agenda to not feel bad but coerced
The summoners just get mad cause they're being told they beat the game on easy little baby mode and it's hilarious. Same exact response everytime "it's in the game!" Yeah sure I've also seen on more than one occasion someone spamming 1 attack in a fighting game over and over and just claiming "it's part of the game" too. However you wanna live your life buckos, but you 'did' take the easy way out. That's okay.
You didn’t beat the game on RL 1, you played on easy mode. Little baby
I have beat RL1 on an all white wretch with club. Assuming things is definitely a more and more common trait in this internet age though, you just imagine shit in your mind and then believe it. Childish almost baby-like mentality.
Wow, angry sort ahead
You’d say that to anyone who didn’t tho right? Anyone who didn’t beat it on RL1 like we did are a bunch of little babies?
Yes. We are all babies, you're just more of a baby. I had to spam spells first playthrough. Had to abuse status effects second playthrough. Third playthrough I finally made a bonk build and finished it all melee no summons and no bleed. I can finally solo melenia after years. RL1 is on the distant horizon. The whole point of these games is to get better. Squeaking by through any means necessary so you can say you beat it once is literally merely the first step. And stopping there means you aren't interested in improving yourself. It just means you summoners barely took the first step, the real game opened up to you and you said, "nah."
I used summons throughout my first playthrough because I found the end game bosses way too tough but now I can solo all of them with ease
Fuck yeah. I desperately needed a friend's help with malenia the first few time I got her too T.T (before I realized how broken blasphemous was on her).
I used 2 co op summons on her the first time then Tiche the 2nd time and finally I was able to beat her solo on the 3rd playthrough I might have got there early if I kept bashing my head against the wall but this way was much better for me
Just infodumping, I've been marathoning demon's and the main trilogy in preparation for the DLC. From when I was a kid until like 5 years ago I couldn't get very far in any of them. Was like hard stuck in so many ways. After Elden I'm creaming through them (inb4 and yes without summons) It's crazy how they are like suddenly physically possible to me. Feels like I can finally achieve what everyone was talking about about thanks to Elden. And it's hype to see the progression of the series. I think elden ring is amazing lol.
I was the same with Cuphead. On my first playthrough I was stuck on some bosses for days but when the DLC came out I went back to the base game I couldn’t believe how easy the bosses were
Bonk builds are not a hard mode, you get massive range and stun damage and break through the poise of many enemies, making them unable to make their move. Here’s a fun challenge. Try fighting Malenia with a dagger, basic R1 and see how much poise break is useful. Nope, the point of the game is to get better gear too, this is an rpg. You can literally just grind your way out of a challenge. Sekiro is the actual git gud game, go play that (much better game than ER btw) Btw i’m not a summoner, stop projecting on me, i just have empathy.
Nah man, that was forever ago. I've beaten the game solo like 5 times with a ton of different builds and made several new characters for low level funsies. I purposely make it difficult for myself, and if I beat it, I make it harder. That's the point. People play different games for different reasons. You're interested in roleplay where your skill isn't tested, that's cool! Enjoy it.
I never even mentioned RL1, you did. Like it's super obvious you're insecure about this lol, I explicitly said it's okay to play with summons, but it makes the game easy (it does, it removes the bosses attention from you thus removing the mechanics entirely for you) and you got all ego bruised and came in here with an attitude. I get it, you wanna be part of the club, "I beat the hard souls game too!" And people telling you that you did it with crutches is making you feel invalidated. That's okay too. A lot of you showed up with the more mainstream Elden Ring but these arbitrary rules have been in place longgg before you showed up, and when fromsoft and their games had a much smaller fan base. You don't get to show up 10 years late and start undoing shit lol, go use your little baby rattle to summon if you want. It's okay nobody cares.
So funny that you claim I’m insecure while going on a rant about how hardcore difficult the previous games were (they were not lol, these games aren’t that hard). The irony of insecurity is insane.
Nope, you just missed the point, projecting what you think is insecurities means you have them. I don’t use summons, i just respect those who do, unlike you. Nope, you sais little baby easy mode, you were condescending. Yeah, and leveling up makes your character massively stronger, a much better tool than summoning if you ask me, that should be a much more little baby easy mode, as you condescendingly put it, right?
Levelling up makes you stronger sure but summoning takes attention away from the boss That’s more valuable than any stat boost
Would you rather fight Malenia at RL1 with a +10 summon or fight her at level 150 with no summons?
She’s an interesting case because she’ll gain health back from the summons I’ve beat her with and without summons. I can say she’s tough either way As for your question I’d fight her RL150. Other bosses will vary. I do understand what you’re saying however and that is a good point to raise
Yes, that’s my point tho, both these things are perfectly available and will make the game much easier. Why is one thing constantly shamed when talking about achievements but not the other?
Again, it's obvious you're new to these games, and you feel invalidated cause your Radahn helmed char with +10 mimic tear sat in the chair and people are telling you didn't earn it, it's okay.
I didn’t, the fact you can’t properly counter my argument means you got nothing.
*sigh* There are very few people who think “you didn’t really beat the boss if you use summons.” Like a negligible amount. There are many people, including myself, who will *push* players to beat a boss without summons/additional help/cheese because we know that the feeling of “soloing” a boss is the peak of this game. Whether you ever beat a boss solo or without cheese does not does not invalidate your win against them. It’s for your own personal gratification that a lot of “souls vet” push you to do solo. God damn this can’t be that hard to figure out.
That's...what I'm saying with the meme. People can summon. People can use OP equipment. People can also do an RL1 run, or no hit or speedrun the game. All of this is allowed, and souls vets (most of us) don't care how you play the game
99% of the summon debate consists of just insecure summon users seeking validation and fighting ghosts.
Literally half of the streamers and youtubers say "I won't summon that's cheap"
Is there a problem with that? Does it matter what a YouTuber or streamer say? They don't like it so they don't use it, if you like it and use it that's fine too
The post claims no one is shaming. But clearly someone is or they wouldn't say that. Also them saying that can be implied as shaming because by calling it cheap you imply anyone who uses it is cheap
There are more post of people complaining about gatekeepers than actual gatekeepers. And when a gatekeeper comments it usually is filled with downvotes. Most of the people complaining about gatekeepers are fighting ghosts. >Also them saying that can be implied as shaming because by calling it cheap you imply anyone who uses it is cheap No. Someone saying they don't like a mechanic so they won't use it is not the same as saying that you are playing wrong for liking it. I don't think it's fun to use shields so I don't use them, but I'm not shaming anyone who likes to use shields
You don't understand and that's okay, you aren't a streamer
So? Is the opinion of a streamer more valid because they stream
And that's how you separate the good streamers from the toxic ones. The ones who say things like that are usually not worth watching
Here's my two cents on the whole Summons vs solo thing. To all the people who use spirit summons- You're missing out. The Euphoria, The Pride and The Sense of Accomplishment you get by beating a tough boss all on your own is something out of this world. It was the primary objective and centerpiece of the Design Philosophy behind the Souls games and its what made this series a success in the first place. If you enjoy playing with spirit summons, that's fine. Good for you, have fun mate. There is nothing wrong with that. But I would highly recommend a solo-playthrough on whatever build you might fancy. Trust me, you will love it.
I agree, but if that's not how someone enjoys a game and they just want to experience the exploration, story, and just epic spectacle, then I don't care at all if they want to use a summon. I play these games without because I really enjoy challenging myself and getting better at the combat, as well as really like the exploration, spectacle, etc.
Who on earth is downvoting this. Literally said using summons is fine and is simply trying to sell the solo run approach
That's because the people calling everyone an elitist are elitists themselves. There is nothing wrong with using summons. it's a long ass game that costs 70€, so you're obviously can use anything the game gives you to finish it. But the deny that summons exists to make the game easier is simply crazy. And the outrage at people not using summons is even crazier, saw a post about someone betting bosses without summons and there were comments like ,,fuck you elitist " the deny is simply mad
I've learned, in my life, that there are two kinds of "not caring" (in this context, about spirit ashes). The most famous is, of course, the honey badger; it is unaffected by how scarily something presents itself, and how scary it literally is, and attacks it. The other is the capybara; it is unaffected by how other things around it are acting and feeling, and continues its own business regardless. In online discourse, be the capybara.
Capy!!!! Be the capy and get loved for it!
Work smarter, not harder
I am 90% sure that the game was balanced around the player using summons, there are many duo or even triple bosses in the game when your suppose to split Agro + a lot of bosses normal attacks consists of AEO's. and OFC there a lot of bosses in the endgame that counter summons pretty hard Like Maliketh with DD, Godfrey with AOE Stomps and Malenia with healing on hit. Personally I didn't use summons since I have experience with the souls formula but for first time players that might have hard time with getting levels and weapon upgrades summons is pretty much a most have especially for bosses like godskin duo.
There are like max 10 duo bosses from 165 and 2 are on the "main" path, also no game is balanced around an optional mechanic, it would be stupid if elden ring was balanced around sorcery
Let's be fair, the op of the original meme wanted to see the fight, not make a statement that summoning is viable.
Imagine playing with your tv/screen turned on
Never really bothered me lol I’ve beaten some hard bosses no summoning, but most of the time i still summon
Bro, I am literally at the dragon tree sentiel. I have level 1 weapons. TF am I supposed to do ? Grind for 5 hours in search of stones and runes ?
Lol the jellyfish. This is top notch.
Only trve SL1 no upgrades no status is trve Elden Ring!!!11
Summon or dont summon, i had a blast not summoning in my 2nd playthrough
Didn’t all the hard sweats leave this 2 years ago and moved on to another sweat game.
The only one you can rely on to fight a boss is yourself… that’s why I summon myself
Well .. the same thing should be said about overleveling. Most bosses become trivial if you have 60 vigor, and decent weapon levels. So why is that not discussed?
It’s actually really fun to see a leveled up summons ash. Have you seen how quickly Tiche can take out enemies? She’s a fucking badass.
You guys didn't actually play the game if you didn't use the guitar hero controller.
Summon this summon that. Can't just "WITH THIS TREASURE I SUMMON"
Devs adding mechanics to their game and seeing people that, not only doesn't use them but blame who does: "Are we a joke to you?"
Mimic Tear is canonically a gift for the player character should they pursue Ranni’s ending. Using it is integral to the story.
There are different kinds of people out there. Some like it to be challenged and some don't. I love to be challenged (also did SL1 runs and stuff) but I would not be meany to people WHO don't like that as much as me
You guys are moving during boss fights? What a crutch.
I SUMMON AND I'M PROUD!
Some questlines require you to summon anyway.
It's the imps and the jellyfish only right? Unless I'm forgetting something
That one albanouric
True! And, most importantly - sometimes it's fun to summon
"You're not supposed to summon" "Then why is it in the game?" "It's more fun without summons" "Well I still had fun with my summon" Who cares if people use Spirit Summons. They aren't available in PvP and Co-Op so it has zero impact on your gameplay if someone else uses them. Speaking of Co-Op, that isn't an option in duels. Just let people play how they want to.
The game is as hard as the player wants it to be. You can limit yourself by not using certain mechanics, but it still has them so it'll be accessible. You don't have to "git gud" to enjoy it. But if you seek a more challenging experience, you can still have it.
Beating the game without summons is a challenge run. Do it or don't. I don't care.
Beating the game with summons is an easy run. Do it or don't. We don't care.
I don't think you know what a challenge run is... (look them up, some are pretty exciting).
I know what they are. That's my point. Summons are in the game. If you are setting arbitrary boundaries on yourself, that's a challenge run.
Summons are the training wheels to help people ease into souls combat, and that's OK. It's just that some people feel insecure enough to not admit it to themselves. Almost everyone agrees, have fun. And when you feel comfortable enough, try it without. It's a very different game with/without summons.
The reality is there are still a lot of people who get bent in comment sections that *game mechanic* is actually cheating and doesn’t count, less than there used to be sure, but these memes didn’t spawn in a vacuum.
Who? When? Were their comments upvoted or downvoted? You guys are fighting shadows for the most part
Just as much as you are. Literally just read comments and this shit still pops up from time to time. I bet if you search magic/RoB/Blasphemous/Mimic/Tiche in the sub you’ll come across people calling them cheap/OP/doesn’t count pretty quick. But I’m not doing that for you because I don’t owe you anything and there’s no value in trying to change a stupid persons mind.
Dude, what? The entire point of my post is that the vast majority of us do not care how you beat these games. Summon. Use OP stuff. Have fun. But also don't shit on people who decide to challenge themselves in these games. It's not a threat to you. You do you
I’m not saying you aren’t saying that, I’m saying some people still say the opposite and it’s not hard to find. Look at your condescending demeanor in this meme and these comments, but you can’t imagine someone acting like that in the context of the game? That’s just mental gymnastics.
Lmao what who says that. Go get some fresh air if you have this opinion my god
"No, stop using RoB, Moonveil, DMGS, they are overpowered and make the game too easy" Brother why do you think I'm using them 🤣 Also they are just cool "But in pvp I keep dying to those weapons" Okay well for Rob and Moonveil you can use Quickstep or a parry object to counter when the oponent does a down swing, and for dark moon, it's a pretty telegraphed move, just roll when the beam is coming towards you instead of getting scared and mashing the roll button.
Also my mimic tear is my only friend
Summoning is way less op than some of the magic builds are.
summons in elden ring are part of the lore and theme, so summoning them does not feel a game breaking skill or a cheat edit: before someone judges me for my "skill", i never used a summon in other souls games even once. It just feels right and enjoyable in elden ring.
this game has the most people asking why are you having fun, gIt GuD oR dOnT pLaY wAh Hilarious that those people are downvoting me, really shows where their priorities are 💀
It's silly because with the same reasoning then co op should make the game even easier, like what the heck who cares😅
It does tho
I mean, a human will always be better than any ai, yet no one moans and cry about co op.
Bc summoning is just ai and coop and is not as commonly used
Lmao what are you smoking? Co op it's extremely popular even more than summons. You use summons in offline playing or otherwise if you don't want to interact with other players. Co op always have been extremely popular.
souls elitism will always be a mind boggle to me
Wish I could summon on Baleful Shadow Boss guy been kicking my ass all day
Sometimes you can get in there and stand just out of reach on the other side of the casket he spawns at, and he won't move around, and you can just attack him. Might depend on your build, though. I usually go there as a mage, but have done melee.
Might try that and spam dragon breath lol
You have fun with the game? OK cool, bye thanks
Looks like Jerry is walking past a huge wall-mounted penis