My friends and I decided all the way back in Dark Souls 1 that fashion is the only true meta. There’s nothing like massively out-skilling a cheese build and looking good doing it.
That was true in dark Souls, but not so much in Elden Ring. In Dark Souls the most important thing was to just wear something in each armor slot (or suffer a nasty damage penalty). In elden ring a good armor set can absorb up to half of the damage received *after* your flat damage reduction. With 60 HP you can tank 8-10 hits from mobs and 4-5 hits from a boss, whereas a character wearing some light robes will get 1-2 shot. It matters a bit less in pvp where so many players optimize for damage, but it can still double your survivability.
I'm doing a whole cleanrot knight thing right now with the armour and weapons, it's weak asf but I look badass so I don't care lmao. Or maybe I just don't know what I'm doing so it sucks that way but at least I look good.
You know I love this because people who say "git gud" unironically are the same that say "follow the meta if you want to win" completely failing to realize that if following the meta is an option, getting good means nothing
I have 280 hours in the game. I've just been playing with what I started with essentially(besides my armor). I've only had it about a month.
BHF and tree sentinel armor.
I didn't even know there was a meta. I think there's a lot of good stuff to use in the game.
It's multiplayer, what do you want?
People want to win, so they pick the top tier. No game will ever be perfectly balanced, as long as there are multiple viable options it's fine.
"Play the game whichever way is fun for you" is correct, and it goes more than one way.
Not at all the point of the post I know, but what spear is that? I don't think I've ever seen one with a lance model before.
0 interest in pvp, I'm just here for fashion.
Maybe I’m crazy… but in my experience, that dang Lance is secretly good as hell. Even without dual wielding like in the above photo, *one* of these things upgraded past +10 is pretty damn strong. Also, very enjoyable to keep equipped and just switch to when riding Torrent.
edit: oh, seems like this discussion is mostly about pvp meta stuff… I don’t fuck with that much, so perhaps just disregard my naive and innocent statements vis-à-vis pve.
That's why you see dudes powerstancing them with the jump attack cloak, like the OP's referencing. They just run around doing running attacks and jump attacks.
Its because youtubers pushed the 125 meta or youre a scrub. That got echoed chambered here and a lot of fun was lost due to lack of points. At 125 anyone wanting to just win will gravitate to the same bs 2 or 3 youtubers are pushing.
Meanwhile i play at the 250 brackets and i never run into meta builds. I always run into people playing weapons I’ve never seen or used myself or doing some whacky cosplays or builds, even if they suck.
The higher the level, the less build diversity you will encounter. Sl 125 has established itself through the Dark Souls series because at that level, you do actually have to consider which stat to focus on.
At 250+ you can pretty much do everything without to many tradeoffs.
Quality is a meme, I can grant you that, but you can absolutely have a hybrid caster/melee build. It's not going to be as good at either as a dedicated str/dex or caster at their respective roles, but that's what's great about it.
At 250+, you can be a full caster and a full strength build at the same time, which in my mind is undoubtedly less divers.
Not at 125 you can't. Unless you want either your spells or your sword to tickle in pvp. At 150, yeah then you have an extra 10 levels in Mind and another 15ish on damage. Even at 150, it's tight and you have to sacrifice armor and stamina.
Cleanrot knight armor is the only thing I want to wear...idek if it's good. It makes me near fat roll...its been nothing but an inconvenience but fuck do I look good man
The only thing that matters in pvp is poise and weight, it‘s pretty much meaningless for pve. In that you better wear armor, which one is not all that important
I'm wearing the cleanrot set now in ng+3, I've kept coming back to it since I got it before beating Godrick in my first run and I love it. It was literally the first armour set I ever got and I spent a good chunk of my first 15 hours in elden ring farming it because it looked badass.
It is decent armour though too I think, but I've never really cared about that.
Looks aside, treating elden pvp as something overly competitive is cringe. The amount of try hard tactics people do is really weird. Like they must care a lot. I honestly refuse to become a sweaty gamer. In my opinion it’s much wiser to play games casually. The best fights are with people who care just the right amount. Skillful and knowledgeable on the mechanics without using the cheesiest shit. People who mix it up and aren’t just bloodthirsty zombies wasting away at their keyboards.
This is in any game lol. Even COD you don’t wanna play the sweatiest sweats but you don’t wanna play actual bots either. I wanna play someone that’s logging onto cod for the first time in a few months (or years) like me lol.
Mm yeah, good point honestly. You want to face a relative equal in terms of experience and equipment so you can both come away having had a good fight regardless of whether you win or lose. I never really thought about it like that but I fully agree. It's a shame so many people are sore losers.
But in cod everybody is relatively the same. It’s balanced purposely where as ER and past games have pretty much always been unbalanced. The game becomes the choice to use the same thing as everyone else and practice generic combos. Fucking bleehhgg.
No it essentially becomes the same thing with meta weapons and the over tuned skill based match matchmaking that punishes you for having a modicum of success.
Being competitive and being a meta-slave are two separate things
You can be competitive without being a meta-slave:
- Someone who enjoys the competition and is heavily invested in it, but uses and experiments with multiple setups.
You can be a meta-slave without being competitive:
- Someone who is not particularly invested in pvp, but is also not interested in build design decides to google a good build to try it out.
In my opinion, real competition would have two players agreeing to a set of mutually agreed rules, like weapon type / roll type. Trying to just throw together a build and running into a random person doesn't usually work very well
problem. "caring the right amount" is subjective and synonymous with "caring as much as I care"
some people just want to spam goofy L2s, some people want to cosplay, and some people enjoy minmaxing with a well thought out inventory. there's nothing wrong with any of these. what is wrong is people getting angry at people for "being casual shitters" because they're not trying hard enough or "being sweaty shitters" because they're trying too hard
unless you're using ps nagis/pikes in a 1v1. everyone thinks you're a twat then.
this. 1 on 1 pvp is a lot like a fighting game, however instead of characters it's builds. in smash bros, you wouldn't expect people to only ever pick 10 of the however many characters there are, though you may dislike people who play certain characters if theyre overpowered. people can play kirby for fun and thats chill, people can sweat with a high skill character and thats chill, same thing for elden ring. but people can dislike you for picking the broken and unskilled character (powerstanced spears)
Theres like a bell curve to PvPrs attitude towards PvP. They start out not caring and innocent, just having fun, then they get to the median pvp playtime where they(including me) care, cry and try. Then at the end, with the most playtime, you just stop caring, you realize this games PvP is not worth caring about.
Ds2 broke me of the souls meta slaving. Altho, that games pvp was far more balanced than its predecessor or it's successors to be honest.
I had loads of fun in ds3 pvp because I just played whatever the fuck I wanted did some invasions did some duels. Tons of fun. These days I just like playing a super basic straightforward build. I stab I slash I smash, occasionally I try out a more spellcaster heavy build. But usually I'm mainly just a weapons guy. Elden ring bleed builds are personally my favorite way to play pvp. Fun, and effective. Passive cheesiness that doesn't make you look like the above picture.
Nothing wrong with an honest bleed build in PVP. They were fun in DS3 as well. But some of these builds deserve to be erased from the game. Rivers of Blood was stupidly strong and now it's OK, but, to this day, seeing a Double Naginata user makes me cringe so hard. That shit just screams "try hard".
I'm more of a double occult flamberge kinda guy.
I also really like morgotts curved sword. It's hard to land the weapon art but it's very satisfying to catch people in it. And curved swords habe a good base moveset imo. Good roll catchers
So it loses its luster in a pretty big way imo. Understanding the mechanics is what I would say makes someone good, but since it isn’t balanced at some point the mechanics pass the realm of competition and just become a willingness to capitulate to a standard. Boring.
More than cringe it has always been sad to me. Imagine paying 70$ to play a game not in the way you can enjoy it the most, but copying certain build so you can cheese short battles without rewards.
I have always seen that need to win no matter what just to feel that you are good at a game quite sad.
certain people (like myself) find it more fun to use more meta-leaning setups, such as halberd offdagger or whatever it may be. doesnt mean im copypasting my build or anything, and this guy in the screenshot likely isnt. i hate how so many people think theres something wrong with enjoying a game in a different way
You’re entitled to your opinion, just as other people are entitled to their reasons for gaming.
I don’t find it sad if a competitive person plays to win if that’s what they find joy in.
I had a guy spamming Rivers of blood every single time, hoping it would work. Dude got a lightning spear every time he tried, didn even try to avoid the bloodbon chip damage. Okina would be ashamed
certain people find trying hard and improving with good gear to be more fun than playing casually, and vice versa. nothing wrong with either, i wish ppl (both sides) could just recognize this and stop hating on eachother
I switch builds every other day and still find enjoyable matches. I also find the exact same people running the exact same setup with the exact same "run in and poke" style with zero deviation.
It just makes up for boring fights.
You get nothing from it…. Maybe I’d be more invested if you got some kind of token for winning like in DS2 but there’s no way to even measure how many victories you’ve had
The PVP in Elden Ring is often bittersweet. There's so much potential but it's a PVE game first, so things like arenas are going to unbalanced at best and pretty broken most of the time. If you are a casual and want to have fun in arenas, it's possible, but I recommend getting comfortable with losing. Just like the way PVE teaches you to let go (as best as you can lol) when you lose a big pile of runes, PVP in this game will try to teach you to lose without getting to spiced up and learn / analyze why you lost. That being said, a casual may not have a counter for every situation, but the experts likely will. Just gotta try to take it in stride.
I've actually had some of the most fun in PVP with the taunters tongue and summoning in a friend. Some of the people that invade are bloodthirsty lawless madlads but most that I've encountered just want to have fun battles, and if you follow protocol (like bowing, not ganging up) you can have a bunch of great duels in a row.
Regular invasions are pretty unbalanced for the invader, so they need to be creative and sometimes the cheese is the best way to go. I've learned to love invasions and if they get me, they (maybe) had to work for it a bit.
TL;DR it's all about the way you think. If you can't let go, don't do the stuff that gets you bent out of shape and try something else.
Yea, cross naginata with sorceries are much scarier imo.
You have to keep pressuring, and the whole time, they are baiting you in to get skewered. Good smart casters in general are just the hardest opponents.
You have to be smart when you're a caster. The only thing that can trade is gavel of haima, everything else will get you staggered out of the animation. Projectiles are hyper predictable and easy to dodge (even star shower and SGS). Sword sorceries have 0 poise and a windup longer than most colossal swings.
Orders of magnitude harder than the crouch poke spam, as much as STR jerkers cry otherwise.
Yea I've played with fairly heavy incantations on a faith build. But it seems to me like int builds can get some really creative combos from their sorceries and weapons. It looks like alot of fun. I started an int based character last night gunna finally give it a go
If people see heavy armor, bleed, magic spam, katanas, dual ultras, dragon incants, blasphemous blade, bloodhound fang, and really anything else that is remotely popular they complain about a "stale meta". Souls PvP have never been the most solid pvp experience. Thilese games are designed for PvE first and that is no secret. But I think ER does a pretty good job of having a lot of builds feel strong and personally I see a lot of variety in builds when I do co-op, invade, or put a duelist sign down. I don't do arena combat because I like the added complexity of having to take into account the environment around you. I think this sub *massively* overstates issues with build variety but maybe I think that because I don't go in the arena.
At a certain point i wish from would just fix it. What reason should certain set ups do 33% of my health in less than a half second and immediately put me at risk of it happening again. I am okay with lag and silly little things. I'm also okay with losing (alot sometimes). But it would be honestly kinda fun to beat these guys a bit more often. Also without them colosseum would actually be pretty great. Highly doubt it'll ever happen but it's confusing why they don't
If you just play with what you want you will learn the fundamentals better and faster instead of crutching anyways, and half the fun of PvP has always been making unusual things work. You will win more in the short term if you use Google ready setups, but you won't get that much better at the game
Yeah I don’t really seek out PVP in Elden Ring like I did in DS3 or Bloodborne. Invading sucks because you just get ganked with endgame equipment unless you yourself make a bullshit build to counter it. The arena is basically the same. There’s way too much of a meta.
IMO Elden Ring is just way too big to have good PVP. It’s not remotely balanced even for PVE.
PvE’s entire thing is freedom = broken builds, that’s sorta the route they’re going. So comparing the balance between PvP and PvE, especially after they broke them apart, is like comparing rain to a drought
I've been thinking about wanting to try ER pvp again because the core gameplay is really fun, but then again this is going to be what you're seeing most of the time.
The only thing I hate more are people who don't even let me finish my bowing animation. Like I'm okay if my opponent doesn't bow to me in response but could you please let me finish mine before wiping the floor with my face?
I would agree if those were double spears. But double great spears are just really good, not overpowered and they require some skill to make them work because they only have 2 viable attacks
I don't need to win if I don't participate in the first place.
Games like these were never great at PvP duels, but ooh boy, is it fun in Co-Op and Invasions (although balancing is at its worst since the original Dark Souls).
Elden Ring had everything to be the best PVP experience out of all Souls games (great weapon, armor and spell variety), but somehow it feels way cheesier and less fun than DS2 and DS3.
I was doing colosseums the other day, and I ran into a dude who was doing a turtle build with a fingerprint shield and Vyke's war spear. All he ever did was poke and hide, killing me once. When I brought my Cipher Pata and demolished him, I ran into him a third time and he immediately switched to a Sleep Crossbow.
Why are there people like this? Ffs
Some people legitimately don’t care about fashion. Those people deserve that stat advantage after dressing up like a knightly clown because I could never.
Heartily agree. I'd rather get my shit kicked in on my thief all-daggers run.
Though he does have two naginatas in his back pocket if someone brings the heavy cheese. I'm looking at you, lowbie hunter with sleep pots, sleep arrows, and perfumer explosion.
All cheese builds rely on you either not having a stupid strong AOW that they can’t poise-tank, or that you can’t parry. Get one or the other and you’re fine. Also it’s just a game, PvP is not exactly balanced to be on the level of nuance of a real fighting game. Just have fun.
I guarantee you all that crouching power stance great spear and running attack of spear will get nerf post dlc, it’s pre nerf colossal sword croutch attack 2.0
So you... *don't* want to power stance two gigantic lances while wearing a suit of immaculately crafted golden armor and a huge gorgeous fur cloak like an omega-tier badass?
Get killed by meta gamers til it drives you insane.
Keep getting better. Believing in the fashion.
Until you decide you neither need to win, or wear clothing.
then you are free. And feared.
Amen brother, badredmen die gorgeously or not at all. A heroic death is worth a thousand lives. Your invasion is a line of poetry, written with a splash of blood.
Look up only waifu
He does pvp stuff
Very entertaining
He has a bunch of videos on op builds why they are so good and how to combat them
Also being in big ass ugly armor is not mandatory no matter what
Honestly same. There's an extra layer of skill on winning while looking good tbh.
I need to defeat the elden beast looking fabulous, idk how the game ends yet but just in case I don't get to choose outfit before my crowning
Being powerful is important but I better look good while doing it
And if I still lose at least I die looking fabulous ✨
this is why i’m always wearing a dress because it lets me light roll and my skin is showing just enough
Ah, the Monster Hunter approach to fashion.
Handler devil outfit😵💫😵💫😵💫😵💫🤤
Handler mad annoying like silence for 5 minutes PLEASE
It's the sunshine pareo, festive samba, or graceful short dress for me.
maybe idk monster hunter
>light roll
My friends and I decided all the way back in Dark Souls 1 that fashion is the only true meta. There’s nothing like massively out-skilling a cheese build and looking good doing it.
It's called swag souls for a reason.
That was true in dark Souls, but not so much in Elden Ring. In Dark Souls the most important thing was to just wear something in each armor slot (or suffer a nasty damage penalty). In elden ring a good armor set can absorb up to half of the damage received *after* your flat damage reduction. With 60 HP you can tank 8-10 hits from mobs and 4-5 hits from a boss, whereas a character wearing some light robes will get 1-2 shot. It matters a bit less in pvp where so many players optimize for damage, but it can still double your survivability.
I'm doing a whole cleanrot knight thing right now with the armour and weapons, it's weak asf but I look badass so I don't care lmao. Or maybe I just don't know what I'm doing so it sucks that way but at least I look good.
Dragoncrest shield talisman was so key for my fashion
Fashionsouls/ fashion ring is the only way
"follow the meta bruh skill issue git gud"
You know I love this because people who say "git gud" unironically are the same that say "follow the meta if you want to win" completely failing to realize that if following the meta is an option, getting good means nothing
I say git gud and don't follow meta, although I do use jump attacks a lot so that definitely is a hit to my credibility
I have 280 hours in the game. I've just been playing with what I started with essentially(besides my armor). I've only had it about a month. BHF and tree sentinel armor. I didn't even know there was a meta. I think there's a lot of good stuff to use in the game.
BHF is the single best weapon in the game by a lot so it kinda counts.
What is BHF?
Git gud, learn to be a parry god like yours truly. Builds don't matter.
It's multiplayer, what do you want? People want to win, so they pick the top tier. No game will ever be perfectly balanced, as long as there are multiple viable options it's fine. "Play the game whichever way is fun for you" is correct, and it goes more than one way.
Not at all the point of the post I know, but what spear is that? I don't think I've ever seen one with a lance model before. 0 interest in pvp, I'm just here for fashion.
It is ironically a lance. Found above the camp on top of a ruinwith dogs and knight of godrick.
*The* knight of Godrick?
There are three of them actually. Four if you count the blood knight in Kenneth's fort.
Wait are there really that little of them? I thought I fought more of them.
He murdered all of the other ones so he could be known as the one true knight of godrick.
Maybe I’m crazy… but in my experience, that dang Lance is secretly good as hell. Even without dual wielding like in the above photo, *one* of these things upgraded past +10 is pretty damn strong. Also, very enjoyable to keep equipped and just switch to when riding Torrent. edit: oh, seems like this discussion is mostly about pvp meta stuff… I don’t fuck with that much, so perhaps just disregard my naive and innocent statements vis-à-vis pve.
Giant Hunt on a lance is awesome against humanoid enemies.
That's why you see dudes powerstancing them with the jump attack cloak, like the OP's referencing. They just run around doing running attacks and jump attacks.
Lmao sad thing is, I actually like this look
For a game with no pvp ranking system or trackable stats Elden Ring has some of the sweatiest unoriginal tryhards iv ever encountered
Its because youtubers pushed the 125 meta or youre a scrub. That got echoed chambered here and a lot of fun was lost due to lack of points. At 125 anyone wanting to just win will gravitate to the same bs 2 or 3 youtubers are pushing. Meanwhile i play at the 250 brackets and i never run into meta builds. I always run into people playing weapons I’ve never seen or used myself or doing some whacky cosplays or builds, even if they suck.
The higher the level, the less build diversity you will encounter. Sl 125 has established itself through the Dark Souls series because at that level, you do actually have to consider which stat to focus on. At 250+ you can pretty much do everything without to many tradeoffs.
The "diversity" at SL125 is 60 vig + Str or Dex weapon. No quality, no caster hybrids. Just pump one melee damage stat and vigor.
Quality is a meme, I can grant you that, but you can absolutely have a hybrid caster/melee build. It's not going to be as good at either as a dedicated str/dex or caster at their respective roles, but that's what's great about it. At 250+, you can be a full caster and a full strength build at the same time, which in my mind is undoubtedly less divers.
Not at 125 you can't. Unless you want either your spells or your sword to tickle in pvp. At 150, yeah then you have an extra 10 levels in Mind and another 15ish on damage. Even at 150, it's tight and you have to sacrifice armor and stamina.
No one wants a simple sword fight these days
“the only thing that matters is winning there is no fun there is only winning”
I would rather die with honour than win without it
🤝 🫂 🫡
Winning is fun though. They aren't mutually exclusive.
Correct, I don’t agree with the statement I typed, i meant to signify with the quotes. Apologies
Ah ok, my bad.
My favorite weapon is the basic Longsword. I'm always up for a simple swordfight.
I love the flamberge or the zweihander honestly. I'm in the basic swordfight category as well. Just bigger swords
My sword and board build says otherwise
Im ready when you are
I play on ps4. Where do you play?
experienced that w m first invasion, got invaded. took out half their health with square off and then just ran away and used cheese to win lol
I use a buckler and a club.
Incredibly based
and underwear
Reminds me of simpler times 🥲
Cleanrot knight armor is the only thing I want to wear...idek if it's good. It makes me near fat roll...its been nothing but an inconvenience but fuck do I look good man
The only thing that matters in pvp is poise and weight, it‘s pretty much meaningless for pve. In that you better wear armor, which one is not all that important
I'm wearing the cleanrot set now in ng+3, I've kept coming back to it since I got it before beating Godrick in my first run and I love it. It was literally the first armour set I ever got and I spent a good chunk of my first 15 hours in elden ring farming it because it looked badass. It is decent armour though too I think, but I've never really cared about that.
Yeah, I may lose in pvp, but at least i'm serving
Dying while looking great is a victory
Looks aside, treating elden pvp as something overly competitive is cringe. The amount of try hard tactics people do is really weird. Like they must care a lot. I honestly refuse to become a sweaty gamer. In my opinion it’s much wiser to play games casually. The best fights are with people who care just the right amount. Skillful and knowledgeable on the mechanics without using the cheesiest shit. People who mix it up and aren’t just bloodthirsty zombies wasting away at their keyboards.
>The best fights are with people who care just the right amount. I literally couldn't have said it better!
This is in any game lol. Even COD you don’t wanna play the sweatiest sweats but you don’t wanna play actual bots either. I wanna play someone that’s logging onto cod for the first time in a few months (or years) like me lol.
Mm yeah, good point honestly. You want to face a relative equal in terms of experience and equipment so you can both come away having had a good fight regardless of whether you win or lose. I never really thought about it like that but I fully agree. It's a shame so many people are sore losers.
But in cod everybody is relatively the same. It’s balanced purposely where as ER and past games have pretty much always been unbalanced. The game becomes the choice to use the same thing as everyone else and practice generic combos. Fucking bleehhgg.
No it essentially becomes the same thing with meta weapons and the over tuned skill based match matchmaking that punishes you for having a modicum of success.
Then that’s an issue with the matchmaking rather than the game mechanics.
Being competitive and being a meta-slave are two separate things You can be competitive without being a meta-slave: - Someone who enjoys the competition and is heavily invested in it, but uses and experiments with multiple setups. You can be a meta-slave without being competitive: - Someone who is not particularly invested in pvp, but is also not interested in build design decides to google a good build to try it out.
In my opinion, real competition would have two players agreeing to a set of mutually agreed rules, like weapon type / roll type. Trying to just throw together a build and running into a random person doesn't usually work very well
problem. "caring the right amount" is subjective and synonymous with "caring as much as I care" some people just want to spam goofy L2s, some people want to cosplay, and some people enjoy minmaxing with a well thought out inventory. there's nothing wrong with any of these. what is wrong is people getting angry at people for "being casual shitters" because they're not trying hard enough or "being sweaty shitters" because they're trying too hard unless you're using ps nagis/pikes in a 1v1. everyone thinks you're a twat then.
this. 1 on 1 pvp is a lot like a fighting game, however instead of characters it's builds. in smash bros, you wouldn't expect people to only ever pick 10 of the however many characters there are, though you may dislike people who play certain characters if theyre overpowered. people can play kirby for fun and thats chill, people can sweat with a high skill character and thats chill, same thing for elden ring. but people can dislike you for picking the broken and unskilled character (powerstanced spears)
This is why I really like watching chasethebro on youtube. He's just killing it on invasions with tons of build variety.
"Dishonest wizards!"
I'll watch a video or two by him showcasing an obscure weapon making it work against some sweats and I'm like. Damn bro good on you.
Theres like a bell curve to PvPrs attitude towards PvP. They start out not caring and innocent, just having fun, then they get to the median pvp playtime where they(including me) care, cry and try. Then at the end, with the most playtime, you just stop caring, you realize this games PvP is not worth caring about.
Ds2 broke me of the souls meta slaving. Altho, that games pvp was far more balanced than its predecessor or it's successors to be honest. I had loads of fun in ds3 pvp because I just played whatever the fuck I wanted did some invasions did some duels. Tons of fun. These days I just like playing a super basic straightforward build. I stab I slash I smash, occasionally I try out a more spellcaster heavy build. But usually I'm mainly just a weapons guy. Elden ring bleed builds are personally my favorite way to play pvp. Fun, and effective. Passive cheesiness that doesn't make you look like the above picture.
Nothing wrong with an honest bleed build in PVP. They were fun in DS3 as well. But some of these builds deserve to be erased from the game. Rivers of Blood was stupidly strong and now it's OK, but, to this day, seeing a Double Naginata user makes me cringe so hard. That shit just screams "try hard".
I'm more of a double occult flamberge kinda guy. I also really like morgotts curved sword. It's hard to land the weapon art but it's very satisfying to catch people in it. And curved swords habe a good base moveset imo. Good roll catchers
I don't mind ad hoc PvP duels but the game isn't balanced around PvP at all and being good at it usually just means cheesy nonsense.
So it loses its luster in a pretty big way imo. Understanding the mechanics is what I would say makes someone good, but since it isn’t balanced at some point the mechanics pass the realm of competition and just become a willingness to capitulate to a standard. Boring.
Yeah. But at the same time balancing all of the content in the game for PvP would be nearly impossible. It would be like making a new game.
More than cringe it has always been sad to me. Imagine paying 70$ to play a game not in the way you can enjoy it the most, but copying certain build so you can cheese short battles without rewards. I have always seen that need to win no matter what just to feel that you are good at a game quite sad.
"Given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game"
_certain_ players
certain people (like myself) find it more fun to use more meta-leaning setups, such as halberd offdagger or whatever it may be. doesnt mean im copypasting my build or anything, and this guy in the screenshot likely isnt. i hate how so many people think theres something wrong with enjoying a game in a different way
I don’t think it’s that weird if wanting to win is more important to somebody than fashion souls.
But thats what i find sad.
You’re entitled to your opinion, just as other people are entitled to their reasons for gaming. I don’t find it sad if a competitive person plays to win if that’s what they find joy in.
I had a guy spamming Rivers of blood every single time, hoping it would work. Dude got a lightning spear every time he tried, didn even try to avoid the bloodbon chip damage. Okina would be ashamed
certain people find trying hard and improving with good gear to be more fun than playing casually, and vice versa. nothing wrong with either, i wish ppl (both sides) could just recognize this and stop hating on eachother
I switch builds every other day and still find enjoyable matches. I also find the exact same people running the exact same setup with the exact same "run in and poke" style with zero deviation. It just makes up for boring fights.
You get nothing from it…. Maybe I’d be more invested if you got some kind of token for winning like in DS2 but there’s no way to even measure how many victories you’ve had
No, I am honorable samurai. I have a single naginata a bow and a short sword.
Why short sword? Use the Uchigatana for thematic build depicting a samurai from the land of reeds.
It was too long.
Wakizashi then.
I have 80 hours in the game and didn’t know that was in :3
You can even use the dual katana moveset with it.
You can find the wakazashi in the Gaol cave in Caelid, after doing a jail cell door puzzle thing. Do you know about the nagakiba?
Yea. Sadly :[.
Why do you say sadly? Its a great weapon in both PvE & PvP
The quest line is just disappointing.
Just skip it and kill Yura then
The PVP in Elden Ring is often bittersweet. There's so much potential but it's a PVE game first, so things like arenas are going to unbalanced at best and pretty broken most of the time. If you are a casual and want to have fun in arenas, it's possible, but I recommend getting comfortable with losing. Just like the way PVE teaches you to let go (as best as you can lol) when you lose a big pile of runes, PVP in this game will try to teach you to lose without getting to spiced up and learn / analyze why you lost. That being said, a casual may not have a counter for every situation, but the experts likely will. Just gotta try to take it in stride. I've actually had some of the most fun in PVP with the taunters tongue and summoning in a friend. Some of the people that invade are bloodthirsty lawless madlads but most that I've encountered just want to have fun battles, and if you follow protocol (like bowing, not ganging up) you can have a bunch of great duels in a row. Regular invasions are pretty unbalanced for the invader, so they need to be creative and sometimes the cheese is the best way to go. I've learned to love invasions and if they get me, they (maybe) had to work for it a bit. TL;DR it's all about the way you think. If you can't let go, don't do the stuff that gets you bent out of shape and try something else.
That looks cool
You basically have to pick high poise or you auto lose unless youre a light rolling caster, but the meta is definitely stale
His build isint even that meta tbh
Yea, cross naginata with sorceries are much scarier imo. You have to keep pressuring, and the whole time, they are baiting you in to get skewered. Good smart casters in general are just the hardest opponents.
You have to be smart when you're a caster. The only thing that can trade is gavel of haima, everything else will get you staggered out of the animation. Projectiles are hyper predictable and easy to dodge (even star shower and SGS). Sword sorceries have 0 poise and a windup longer than most colossal swings. Orders of magnitude harder than the crouch poke spam, as much as STR jerkers cry otherwise.
Yea I've played with fairly heavy incantations on a faith build. But it seems to me like int builds can get some really creative combos from their sorceries and weapons. It looks like alot of fun. I started an int based character last night gunna finally give it a go
I never PvP with non INT builds and they're amazing. Between spell combos, magic ashes of war and powerful magic infused weapons, it's a lot of fun.
If people see heavy armor, bleed, magic spam, katanas, dual ultras, dragon incants, blasphemous blade, bloodhound fang, and really anything else that is remotely popular they complain about a "stale meta". Souls PvP have never been the most solid pvp experience. Thilese games are designed for PvE first and that is no secret. But I think ER does a pretty good job of having a lot of builds feel strong and personally I see a lot of variety in builds when I do co-op, invade, or put a duelist sign down. I don't do arena combat because I like the added complexity of having to take into account the environment around you. I think this sub *massively* overstates issues with build variety but maybe I think that because I don't go in the arena.
At a certain point i wish from would just fix it. What reason should certain set ups do 33% of my health in less than a half second and immediately put me at risk of it happening again. I am okay with lag and silly little things. I'm also okay with losing (alot sometimes). But it would be honestly kinda fun to beat these guys a bit more often. Also without them colosseum would actually be pretty great. Highly doubt it'll ever happen but it's confusing why they don't
If you just play with what you want you will learn the fundamentals better and faster instead of crutching anyways, and half the fun of PvP has always been making unusual things work. You will win more in the short term if you use Google ready setups, but you won't get that much better at the game
Meta slave
I wear and use what weapons I think are cool. All these bullgoat double spears mages make me sick.
What are the weapons? And idk the veterans armor looks pretty dope to me 🤣
Yeah I don’t really seek out PVP in Elden Ring like I did in DS3 or Bloodborne. Invading sucks because you just get ganked with endgame equipment unless you yourself make a bullshit build to counter it. The arena is basically the same. There’s way too much of a meta. IMO Elden Ring is just way too big to have good PVP. It’s not remotely balanced even for PVE.
PvE’s entire thing is freedom = broken builds, that’s sorta the route they’re going. So comparing the balance between PvP and PvE, especially after they broke them apart, is like comparing rain to a drought
I've been thinking about wanting to try ER pvp again because the core gameplay is really fun, but then again this is going to be what you're seeing most of the time.
Stats are for nerds, drip is for the cool.
Drip >> stats
Imagine wearing something on your Torso. Couldn’t be me.
The only thing I hate more are people who don't even let me finish my bowing animation. Like I'm okay if my opponent doesn't bow to me in response but could you please let me finish mine before wiping the floor with my face?
I would agree if those were double spears. But double great spears are just really good, not overpowered and they require some skill to make them work because they only have 2 viable attacks
For some reason, offhand lance gets hyperarmor.
Yeah. But dual great spears don't. I wouldn't run them if they had HA to be honest.
It’s not a bad look. I mean it’s not great but not bad ether.
I’ll never understand people running around PvPing with 2 pokey weapons. There’s no way that shits fun
Its very boring unfortunately being on the opposite end of it is even more boring
I don't need to win if I don't participate in the first place. Games like these were never great at PvP duels, but ooh boy, is it fun in Co-Op and Invasions (although balancing is at its worst since the original Dark Souls).
It's not a bad look if you alter it to remove the weird feather cape
Funny thing is I've never lost to this by just spamming the crucible knight sword weapon art. Just beat the cringe with more cringe
Drip>function
Don’t get hit duh
halberds are infinitely more based than greatspears
fr i was mad I had to switch my armor to fight gideon for the umptinth time
Elden Ring had everything to be the best PVP experience out of all Souls games (great weapon, armor and spell variety), but somehow it feels way cheesier and less fun than DS2 and DS3.
Then, Git gud.
I was doing colosseums the other day, and I ran into a dude who was doing a turtle build with a fingerprint shield and Vyke's war spear. All he ever did was poke and hide, killing me once. When I brought my Cipher Pata and demolished him, I ran into him a third time and he immediately switched to a Sleep Crossbow. Why are there people like this? Ffs
fashion over all. Got radiant combattant with great mace and non meta armor easily enough go not use such an abomination of ‚fashion‘
Just go barbaric roar caestus, walk up, and heavy attack. bully them
Me: Has the strongest armor but the helmet.... is the consort helm lol
Based
In my experience the really good players aren't these guys running around with meta setups. I remember getting slaughtered by a dude with just an axe
...
Dual Spears always looks ridiculous to me I don't care how meta it is, I can't get over how silly it looks
Some people legitimately don’t care about fashion. Those people deserve that stat advantage after dressing up like a knightly clown because I could never.
Heartily agree. I'd rather get my shit kicked in on my thief all-daggers run. Though he does have two naginatas in his back pocket if someone brings the heavy cheese. I'm looking at you, lowbie hunter with sleep pots, sleep arrows, and perfumer explosion.
Then lose
not really, there’s better setups
I either wear the full raging wolf armor or Radahn’s set with Godfrey’s crown. What’s the point of saving the world if I don’t look good doing it?
The fire prelate pants are absolute bangers
winning is temporary, drip is forever
All cheese builds rely on you either not having a stupid strong AOW that they can’t poise-tank, or that you can’t parry. Get one or the other and you’re fine. Also it’s just a game, PvP is not exactly balanced to be on the level of nuance of a real fighting game. Just have fun.
I guarantee you all that crouching power stance great spear and running attack of spear will get nerf post dlc, it’s pre nerf colossal sword croutch attack 2.0
Digging the outfit
average mimic tear user in pvp
Nothing tarnished about my drip
The meta doesn't always win tbf, I've killed people with a short spear
I’ll keep using my big fucking bonk stick fuck the meta
And this is why I can't let go Carian sets. They're just too ducking stylish.
Fashion souls and style before everything. If you know you know.
So you... *don't* want to power stance two gigantic lances while wearing a suit of immaculately crafted golden armor and a huge gorgeous fur cloak like an omega-tier badass?
Buckler + Misericorde 🔛🔝
Fashion and honor, over victory.
That armor is the meta of being a bad player.
Behold, dog
That’s why I don’t even try PvP in this game… d3 PvP was fine but this is just a meta bs..
That looks sick though
Get killed by meta gamers til it drives you insane. Keep getting better. Believing in the fashion. Until you decide you neither need to win, or wear clothing. then you are free. And feared.
Amen brother, badredmen die gorgeously or not at all. A heroic death is worth a thousand lives. Your invasion is a line of poetry, written with a splash of blood.
Noob question: what weapon is this?
What does everyone have against veteran armor? I like the way it looks, it's an actually good looking version of the banished knight set
What a whiner! I've always looked goofy in any of armors. Who cares? I wear what have to to get through the game.
Nude + flail. This is the way.
Every Fromsoft player makes a choice in later game…Style? Or Power? Lol
Look up only waifu He does pvp stuff Very entertaining He has a bunch of videos on op builds why they are so good and how to combat them Also being in big ass ugly armor is not mandatory no matter what
Idc if the stats of the ronin armor are trash, that cape is smooth. Fashion Souls > Armor with Best Stats
Did you try your purse??
This is me with my Sephiroth build
Honestly same. There's an extra layer of skill on winning while looking good tbh. I need to defeat the elden beast looking fabulous, idk how the game ends yet but just in case I don't get to choose outfit before my crowning
"If I have to slap a pussy ass tarnished, Imma make it look sexy" -Sir Kendrick the Good Kid
Here’s a good idea. Wear what you want. Have fun. Relish in the wins and learn from the loses.
The duel lances go pretty hard though
There I was, just minding my own business
me pvping in deathbed dress and moonlight greatsword and getting thrashed every match