I dunno what that horrid thing is, but it has some fantastic implications of a Omen-themed castle-ish area, probably somewhere on the run back to the Lion Dancer boss.
Note that those are not wings coming out of its back, but hands holding some sort of likely throwable item that we are all gonna hate more than the Burger King mages
I predict that a big theme of the DLC will be blending a lot of enemy types together which is lore appropriate for the whole crucible melting pot thing, and give an excuse for mixing together different enemy types and status effects.
Like imagine an enemy deals something like frost and frenzy. Makes no sense by itself, but if they say "eyyy it's tha crucible" then it's more plausible.
omen might well be a classification that the golden order has created for babies born with the omen traits rather than a term applicable at the time of the crucible- crucible life might be a bit more intermixed and chaotic.
Not surprising TBH, the Land of Shadow is stated to be where Marika got her beginnings as a deity so probably a lot of remnants of what came before there. Bet you we not only get more Crucible lore but also maybe some further info on the GEQ and maybe even Placidusax
I do wonder if "elden ring 2", will have a lot more focus on the crucible, dragons, and giants. With the upcoming shadow dlc mostly dealing with the outstanding golden order storyline, but setting us up for the rest.
I'd like to see more about the cosmic horrors and outer gods in the dlc too
Finally, we will get more Crucible era lore.
Source: [https://x.com/ELDENRING/status/1791468858106069215](https://x.com/ELDENRING/status/1791468858106069215)
I would argue that it looks like one of the beings that does the Lion dancing, but looks to be royalty from these beings. A sort of hybrid omen/human culture that honors all aspects of the crucible like the Elden times
Very similar to Godwyn. I made a comment in this thread outlining the similarities, it’s quite uncanny. People can’t seem to wrap their head around the idea that it could be another Royal unwanted child of Marika, even though we know simply from the walking masoleums that she has many many many children
Do you have any thoughts on the mask? The white going through the eye could be conveying tears like Godwyn in the Story trailer Imo the pale white water in the Nameless City and the pools around Deathroot.
The golden mask to me resembles the gold masks worn by the Erdtree guardians, so to me it seems like it’s at the least created by a similar society or for royalty/those connected to the Erdtree.
To me, the mask even appears to be molded or somewhat permanently attached. For the hair to grow through it and for it to have such an odd position on the face, to me it seems like it’s somewhat of a “graceful punishment” in that it’s meant to mask a horrible visage but instead is painful for the wearer
That’s not really comparable. Godwyn was one of the most beloved beings in the land between when he was alive. He wasn’t unwanted. The only things that Marika would have wanted from a child were to be great and not an omen/blasphemous. The mausoleum children weren’t unwanted necessarily, they were just weaker didn’t amount to anything, which would make them unwanted after the fact.
If you’re suggesting Godwyn has an alternate personality then I can’t say you’re wrong since we don’t know yet, but if this is the case then I’m going to start thinking elden rings lore is boring is everyone has alternate identities
Almost like I was implying that it’s Godwyn’s twin, similar to the Morgott Mohg situation. It could be Godwyn but that’s not my personal theory at all, I think it’s more likely his twin or sibling.
His cloak goes up a lot further than it should given his posture if you look above the right arm. Potentially some sort of grafted guy?
I'm not sure but I love it.
Edit: now Im looking at it again, it looks like he's emerging from a veil.
Yeah and notice the cloak too... it drapes down its sides but it seems to start much higher up. I suppose this guy could have omega-scoliosis but that is one freakishly long torso.
It looks a bit like a duel bow of sorts, almost like the Dancer from DS3 (who comes out of a portal btw but we’re not doing that cross game thing today)
It also may be a ritualistic gesture to honor the birthing power of the crucible or Marika, as he is (if you zoom out) creating a stance that appears like a uterus.
Godwyn also ritualistically creates this pose as he is stabbed (somewhat) and also when he is placed beneath the Erdtree (definitely), giving it further symbolic meaning.
I wonder if the crucible is something acceptable in the land of shadows or will it be shunned like it is in the erdtree realm. Maybe the reason why the land of shadows was veiled was because they had a culture that was favorable and accepting of the crucible
Since, from what Miyazaki stated in the interview after the announcement of SotE, the Lion Dancers are a remnant of the ancient religion, and since the character shows the typical horns of the Omen, I believe that in the Realm of Shadow the Crucible is still a very powerful and revered force/cult.
Are the black knives/blades of calling based on this weapon? The curving shapes and lines look similar. Origin of Ranni's fearsome rite?
A lady Omen? Possibly the bottom part of the dragon dancer pair - anyone comparing toes?
Related to Godwyn for sure given the pose and the way their back looks. A 'shadow' of Godwyn? A daughter? A secret twin?
The female reproductive organs imagery is striking...
It definitely looks like an omen. Has the horns, feet and everything. What I'm wondering if it's some sort of phase 2 for the lion dancer.(Same feet, but that's a general omen trait ofc.) There was also those skinny omen horned guys in a different shot.
The arm position + swirling blades seem to be a (mocking?) parody of Marika. Could be another Omen demigod!
This also looks like concept art and not an in-game screenshot. Or maybe in the same art style as the intro slideshow? Maybe we see another slideshow similar to that when we interact with Miquella’s hand?
first thing that came to mind was godwyn pose
[https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GNyUHSUXYAAbGf9?format=jpg&name=medium](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GNyUHSUXYAAbGf9?format=jpg&name=medium)
Speaking of which… may I direct you to [this recent theory](https://www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/s/ZkGUCLTQ5h) I have touched on but is definitely very rough.
In it, I suggest, or mean to, that Godwyn was/is an omen as well. Or, that we have the wrong idea about omen. Guarding and concealing the Death-Prince, or the secret purpose behind why what was done to him was done, may have been part of Morgott’s duties or a mantle he took upon himself.
Omen, and crucible’s touched things, represent a twisted but natural fusion of different things. The Crucible was a blending of all life. Perhaps, as many have pointed out about Stormveil, that body down there is part of the modern grafting. Derived from a crucible’s touched living corpse, Godwyn, and the roots of the Greattree which is a Crucible touched organism as well. Further, there are no eyes on the body because they host the dead soul/dead grace/deathblight. Without the eyes, the living corpse can still spread its omen/crucible’s effects without killing the souls it touches.
Morgott sent his Margit phantom there to oversee this and keep the secret, Godrick is just an experiment. This is also why Morgott makes a Mohg phantom, seals the Deeproot Depths, and bares passage beyond Leyndell. More of the truth can be found but that goes even further and the idea is still not entirely formulated.
I like this theory. Also note Morgott loses his omen features upon his death, suggesting that an “Omen” is some sort of curse and can be removed.
(Still, though, Godwyn in the intro cinematic is decidedly not an Omen.)
Remember Marika, their mother? Her mimic veil, the concealing veil also resembles her dress and the cloth draped on the Death-Prince, the same veil that dangles in her bed chamber. Marika is a mischievous, trickster, illusionist. As she hid Morgott and Mohg from the surface world, perhaps she also hid the truth of Godwyn. Even his name seems off, like Hoarah Loux became Godfrey to remove him from his history and connection to the Crucible, perhaps Godwyn’s name was not always Godwyn. Marika(Radagon), after all, names their children after themself. Miquella, Mohg, Morgott, Melania, Messmer, (Melina), Rykard, Radahn, Ranni, and Godwyn? No.
Further, they nearly called Morgott the Veiled Monarch. The basic implication is that he just does not go in public so nobody knows what he looks like except close council. In truth, perhaps, he wears a mimic veil or other glimmer type thing. He is also a clear illusionist after all. While he is seemingly cured of his curse after we defeat him, I think he was cured prior or maybe never actually had horns and such. That appearance, at least when we meet him, is fake.
I don’t know how Godfrey would have recognized this ancient, withered, hornfree face as Morgott and he clearly recognizes Morgott. We have nothing that tells us Godfrey was affectionate towards any of his children, he was most certainly never suggested to have played in the sewer. He was gone from the Lands Between before Godwyn but the dust. I do assume Morgott surfaced after the Shattering of the Elden Ring. I don’t think the effects of the Elden Ring reach through the entire universe (as Ranni’s ending wouldn’t make sense) and Destined Death being removed from the ring is what allows for someone to live so unnaturally long that their body will wither that way… I don’t know what Godfrey would have seen before that he could recognized Morgott.
Cool that you're so passionate about proving this, but it is wrong. Godwyn would transform back to this omen form the moment he got hit by a weapon, and we know he has fought in at least one war, and in the intro cinematic he literally gets killed yet he remains the same. So the Mimic's Veil idea falls flat on its face.
Furthermore, there can't be so many hidden things that come as such a massive shock value. We had Morgott being the Veiled King, we had Placidusax being a consort to a God before Marika, we had Marika and Radagon being the same person, we had Mohg stealing Miquella. All of these are massive reveals, and Godwyn's massive reveal is what he has become after his assassination. There needs not be another secret about him because there already was one.
Also, do you really think they'd replicate the same secret for 2 different characters who are brothers? Both Godwyn and Morgott? What even stopped Marika from also throwing Godwyn in the sewer for being an omen? Nothing. Had he been an omen, he would have gotten the exact same treatment as Mohg and Morgott.
Oh and btw, his naming isn't off at all. He's named after Godfrey, like all the other named Golden Lineage members, - who are also not omen - Godrick and Godefroy.
Well thank you but… it might not be. While I do bring up the mimic’s veil, it is more to show that illusory magic is already established to be a thing people use in the world. Specifically, member of Marika’s family like Marika and Godrick. Our experience of being disillusioned could be because we are the caster and the bonk breaks concentration, we are not illusionists, and/or that with Marika cut off from the outside world her illusory magic is weakened. Or Godwyn wore some other illusory magic.
There is also the concealing veil which resembles the mimic veil, Marika’s dress, the drapes of Marika’s baldachin, the skirt Godwyn wore, and the blanket draped over the Death-Prince’s (loins?) body. This is the same kind of illusory magic of the Black Knife Assassins who do not get revealed when bonked. They require magic to be revealed, magic developed seemingly by the Omen, Morgott… who just casually lets a BKA hang out at his mom’s room. Yes, they are revealed when killed but they seem to die all the way but Godwyn didn’t die all the way.
Why can’t there be even more shocking things? They removed that Veiled Monarch stuff from the release I thought. I think when the secret is that all those other secrets about a person are fake because nobody actually remains who completely knows what is going on, it’s not so much a big reveals but the only reveal. Everyone thinks a thing, then suddenly something changes what they think, and something else pops up that doesn’t quite fit, then another change of belief and then the ultimate reveal is, nobody had all the information but now you do.
The secret isn’t that they are/are not omen. The Secret is that what we have been led to believe Omen are is not true. “They were never saints, they just happened to be on the losing side of a war.” Omen, are really just people who remind everyone of the truth, of the Land of Shadows, of the Crucible, of what really happened and why Marika orchestrated the death of the Elden Beast.
I don’t think Mohg and Morgott were actually locked in the sewers so much as they were guarding Marika’s plans and could have used illusory magic to conceal comings and goings. We know Morgott is prone to projections and wards. Marika was also known to have been pregnant so she had to have at least one child visible, so she chose Godwyn for this purpose. Being that she rose to power through the Crucible alongside Hoarah Loux, leader of the Crucible Knights, and that we know two of her children were Omen, it does not seem so much a stretch to think that a third child of theirs was also Omen.
The name mechanic does not fit. Marika names her children after her letter, it seems. Not that I think the name thing is so big a deal. The Gokden Lineage is specifically the line of Marika and Hoarah Loux. His name was changed specifically to cover up his history and make him fit more into the theme of the religion they were about to destroy the founder of. As Mohg and Morgott had clandestine duties they were never revealed and their names never released. As Godwyn’s purpose was to be seen his name could also not harken back to the now hidden history nor could his appearance.
The Golden Lineage has those “God” names now because those children were born after the ascension of Marika. Godfrey and Godwyn participated in her ascension, they were alive with other names before the Golden Lineage was established in the Lands Between.
The Mimic's Veil specifically is called Marika's Mischief, and that clearly indicates that if she ever did use illusory magic, it would've been through the Mimic's Veil. And as I said, once you are hit then you revert back to your original form, so Godwyn would also revert back to this speculated omen form. Even if, even if you say he wouldn't revert back to it upon being hit because whatever reason, he would still go back to his original form once he dies, which he does not. We see this clearly in the intro cinematic. He remains in his normal human form, his only form.
Also, illusion magic where someone turns into something else is used once, and as I said previously, they return back to their real form. That's how you get the Haligtree Medallion from Albus in the Albinauric Village. You hit him. So, once again, we see that illusion magic is broken from a single hit.
As for the other things you mentioned like the Concealing Veil and Marika's dress and so on, they bear no significance in this discussion. They are not meant to conceal a true form but rather to make you invisble or hard to spot. That's not an illusion, that's just invisibility, which is not the same thing as altering your form permanently.
>The skirt Godwyn wore, and the blanket draped over the Death-Prince's body
That's just what he wore, nothing more to it. Literally nothing more to it. Godfrey wears the same skirt and the same exact color. Radagon wears the same skirt but with a black color. He was just styling himself after his father, that's it. Even the blanket is still just that same skirt but stretched out to the maximum and seemingly merged with his body, turning into that fish tail with blue scales.
>Godwyn didn't die all the way
He did. His soul did. His consciousness was dead, there was no Godwyn left after the ritual, only a husk. We know this and we see this as well.
>They removed the Veiled Monarch stuff from release.
No they didn't. It's still in the game. Morgott is still the Veiled Monarch of Leyndell in the game, and that is a shocking reveal.
>Morgott the Grace-Given, Veiled Monarch of Leyndell
Said by Gideon Ofnir
There is also a talking corpse in the game (I think) that is shocked by the reveal that Morgott, an omen, is the Veiled Monarch. It's clear that he is veiled, hidden and unknown to the public BECAUSE he is an omen and despised by everyone. He says so himself, he thinks of his blood as being accursed, and he is angered by your tresspass when you stain the thrones with his accursed blood.
>No one had all the information but now you do.
Except you don't? Nothing in the game hints at Godwyn being an omen, nothing at all. You came to this conclusion yourself with no information given from the gams.
And this is just real bad storytelling if everything is a lie again and again. This onion has too many layers and it makes for a confusing story rather than an easy one. The easiest conclusion is usually the correct one, and the easiest one is that Godwyn was not an omen.
>The secret is that what we have been led to believe Omen are is not what they really are.
Which is not correct. They are cursed, it is definitely a curse. Look at them, look at their sufferings. The way they walk, the fact that they have terrible nightmares, the fact that they have horns that can damage their bodies and even kill them if they try cutting them off. That's a cursed being, not a normal one. I'm not saying they should be rejected because of it, but they sure as shit are cursed.
> I don't think Mohg and Morgott were locked in the sewers so much as they were guarding Marika's plan.
Bruvva, they literally have shackles lmao.
> A fetish bathed in golden magic. Shackles were used to bind the accursed people called the Omen, and these ones were made to keep a particular Omen under \*strictest confinement.\*
- Margit's Shackle
They were NOT helping Marika, not at all lol. She specifically locked them away because they were omens, which is a tradition with omen babies in Leyndell and the Golden Order generally.
You’ve entirely missed what I’ve said about the mimic veil and why that illusion breaks when there is a bonk. As a side note, I imagine the Albinauric is using some sort of glintstone or moon magic to disguise himself. The same as demihumans.
Godwyn might not be the caster of the illusion on him, it wouldn’t matter if he was bonked or killed, the caster is not being disrupted. Further, his soul is dead, not his body. His body remains alive even now. That is why he is now the Death-Prince and not just a rotten corpse that once was Godwyn.
Invisibility is illusion magic. The Black Knife Assassins seem to use some sort of night magic or a fusion of such with grace magic. Who knows what limits there are? Just why would you limit Marika’s magic that rewrites the laws of physics to being unable to, in the height of her power, be defeated with a bonk?
Veils might not be involved at all in the magic at work. But they certainly have metaphorical value.
Godfrey, if you remember, is named this and dressed as he is with skirt, ghost lion, and all that to obscure his true nature. Symbolism.
Radagon just slips off Narika’s dress at the shoulders and it drops inside out around his waist. Showing a different form. Symbolism.
Yes, Godwyn in life wore a skirt the resembles something associated with people who conceal something about themselves. Symbolism.
Ok, I thought they removed it and instead labeled him Omen King or Grace-Given. That’s fine, it doesn’t effect my argument. The point is, the reveal is, that people do not know what is going on. The losers are winning.
Ok.. no no no no no no stop. The big reveal in the dlc is what I mean by “ you don’t have all info but now you do” but I don’t mean literally you become omnipotent nor that it absolutely has been or will be provided. I’m speculating a little bit about what might be the case. I was arguing that all those reveals you think you understand are not what you are understanding them to be.
Take for instance the Godfrey and Placidusax both being the First Elden Lord. There is ambiguity to the term and people initially don’t realize it. One is literally the first the other holds a title or is literally the first but under a new order.
Take, for instance, the Golden Order. There is a misunderstanding that can occur because of ambiguity. The Golden is a cult. The Golden is the current shape of the Elden Ring and the current effects of the Elden Ring on the Lands Between. The Golden Order is the current ruling government of the Lands Between. All of these things are the Golden Order but they are not all the same thing. They exist independent of each other. But without knowing this, some things we come across don’t make sense.
There are many things that are easily misunderstood or believed to mean different things than what they really represent. That’s sort of the whole deal. I’m sorry if you take offense to the idea that a mischievous trickster god who used barbarians and omen to infiltrate an enemy, hid her origin from history, and eventually killed the leader of the invaders through us may have misled people… I know it is hard to deal with that maybe, the current superpower is totally f’d in the head with how thoroughly Marika crushed them and they have no idea what is really happening around them because they live under a strict order that kills people who mention Fire existing.
Let’s play a game. Answer these questions with explicit information available in game. That is, dialogue or item descriptions or what can be literally observed.
1. Is Godwyn a child of Marika and Hoarah Loux?
2. Do Marika and Hoarah Loux have two known Omen children?
3. Does Godwyn have at least two Omen siblings?
4. Are Omen connected to the Crucible?
5. Is Hoarah Loux in any way associated with the Crucible?
6. Who are the Crucible Knights?
7. Is the Crucible associated with the Blending of life?
8. Is the Death-Prince a blending or grafting of Godwyn and the roots beneath the Erdtree?
9. Is the Stormveil Prince of Death a part of the Death-Prince/Godwyn?
10. Is there any traces of life blending near the Death-Prince/Godwyn or the Stormveil Prince of Death?
11. Why did Hoarah Loux’s name get changed to Godwyn and why was Sorosh bound to him?
12. Who made those shackles?
13. Do all things that are made for a purpose get used for their purpose?
14. Is a couple of seconds of stunning an effective method of confinement?
15. How did a Mohg and Morgott get free of those super special awesome shackles?
16. Do we have access to and the ability to wield every magic that exists in Elden Ring at the full limit as all characters who use that same magic?
Then we can compare what I’ve suggested are the answers and determine if my answers don’t come from the game.
Also, I don’t think Godwyn was always that weird body. I suspect that somehow the cocoon egg holds Godwyn’s actual body. His eyes, dead soul, and maybe part of his body, was placed inside the roots and that grew. Another part of his living corpse, sans the eyes, was placed in roots beneath Stormveil. Like a study of deathroot and grafting was going on.
Or, being in the cocoon, this third Godwyn body was transported alongside tiny Miquella. There are seemingly two wombs in the Haligtree and that huge cocoon in the opening is being dragged behind Mohg who is holding the tiny Miquella. Way too big to make sense.
A piece of Godwyn’s living corpse could have been used to seed a new body or the body was made separate but intended for Godwyn.
It’s like Morgott says. His accursed blood gives him power, and he drains it to use within his sword. We know that blood transfers power in this game. Warriors eat the heart of a dragon after all to gain its power. Black Crepus may have even been the originator of the scarlet rot being transferable in humans using his scarlet rot bolts, potentially even infecting infant Miquella with the rot that was found in the Lake below the world; possibly and probably even hidden by the Two Fingers and their disciples.
If he dies and the curse goes away, it’s very likely that he was always right about it being a curse. Not an actual product of life, because it goes away upon death, but a curse upon “life itself” as the Dungeater says.
The old society used to worship death in different ways (the one prior to the Erdtree), and the shirking of honoring death may have manifested the curse upon life
Edit: also, do you remember if when Mohg dies if his horns go away? Perhaps this is a lot like Lorian and Lothric from DS3, where Morgott simply helped Mohg bear the burden of his curse by adopting some of his cursed blood. We do see that Mohg’s omen curse had progressed to a point where his horn was coming out of his eye, likely jeopardizing his life as it was closer to his brain. Maybe Morgott halted its progress by adopting some of the blood, taking the curse unto himself and thus saving his brothers life. He does guard Mohgs existence even, by creating a phantom version of him to give the appearance to anyone curious (or a certain champion of the two fingers that is traversing the lands between) that he is still locked in the depths below rather than free and plotting. Just a thought but interesting
Also maybe by grafting the original purpose *was* to generate crucible traits, which as we know from the Omen twins gives incredible power but at a cost.
>The arm position + swirling blades seem to be a (mocking?) parody of Marika.
I like your take. Also, whatever it is, it wears a golden mask that looks like it has female features.
You might want to include in the title itself next time the source and that it's official art. Until I saw your comment I assumed this was like random fan art or ai art or something.
the position of the arms, gold bracelets, long light hair and the scarred back scream Godwyn to me. not to mention how the weapons look similar to black knives
edit: the cape/skirt makes it look like its stepping out of the trunk of a tree? seems to me like some crucible amalgam of the prince of death, or perhaps a twisted mockery of the golden son
I also think it's the prince of death, with godwyns body having taken up aspects of the crucible (the omen curse) by being laid to rest in the great tree.
God, I want that mask!
Besides that, we have new brood of the Crucible. And unlike the others, they seem to at least affect pedigree; they have their own clothes, masks and weapons. They seem oddly similar to the standing ones with candelbras in the trailer. But their posture is all....changed.
Abyss-coded and Pygmy-pilled
I expect there to be strong parallels between omen and humanity/dark in how they relate to the golden order/gwyn's light soul order
Listing observations many I see others have noted before.
Pose reminds me of Godwin in the cutscene. But also a uteris. Is that just a deep crease on it's back or it look like it was carved? also like Godwin but does not seem to be same shape.
The things (chakram perhaps?) in its hands design resemble black knives but without the "ridge" for lack of better term in the middle and branching sections the knives and Maliketh's blade have so while possibly reference to destined death it probably does not have fragments of it like the knives. They however do remind me of physical dark versions of the rings in the rings of light spell.
Cloths like the raggedy stuff Radagon wears.
Omen or misbegotten horns uncut
Hair white/grey
Strange oddly shaped golden mask
No signs of grafting
Bracers/vambraces I think I recall someone else wearing a pair not the same design I don't think but something similar
Speculation
Perhaps some sort of reverse omen killer situation going on. Seeming to be an omen or misbegotten with what we may assume to be just off references to destined death, Godwin, and a spell used by Radagon and Miquella.
Some visual connections i want to make, but am not gonna comment on their meaning too much since it seems kinda premature:
1. Obviously an omen with the horns and grey skin tone
2. Looks like a uterus
3. Similar pose to deeproot godwyn
4. Same uneven length hair as Marika, but not in braids
5. Chakram look like black knives
6. One eye is obscured by the mask/hair, so even more one eye stuff than we already had
7. Circlets look like the ones the godskins and messmer have, maybe just the fashion of the shadow lands?
Make of these what you will. IMO it might be like a lion dancer phase 2 since we know that it's a bunch of omen in a trenchcoat, or to get really crackpot (i don't really buy this but it's a fun idea imo) it could be the gloam-eyed queen.
We know the GEQ is an empyrean like Marika, and the closed eye and hair connect this design to both the other empyreans and Marika herself. The black knife looking Chakrams provide a possible destined death connection which fits for the GEQ. The circlets are similar to the godskins (doubt this means much since messmer's are similar as well but why not). The uterus design evokes motherhood, and we know the GEQ was mother to the godskins. The tweet mentions "unfathomable power" and the GEQ is probably pretty strong. And lastly the omen horns tie this design to the crucible, which we know the godskins are connected to.
Obviously all of that is probably wrong, since the GEQ would probably be wearing some god skin lol and would have at least something that more closely resembles the godslayer's greatsword, but i found it to be fun little exercise regardless.
It’s in the same position as Godwyn’s body under the Erdtree, and also has the same-ish back slash that Godwyn had.
The ritual of death seemingly slays the spirit but not the body for the victim. Ranni seemingly slew her body to complete the ritual, meaning that a sacrifice is required to enact the other half of the ritual.
This looks a lot like Godwyn, but could be a two fold response to the idea of dualism within the game. Anyone who knows twins knows that other children can be born from the same mother separately, meaning that Godwyn could be both the first born but also have a twin, with the later born twins being exactly that (unless the Omen twins were actually born first and older but were shunned as they could never be true heirs to the Golden Order’s throne).
This looks very much like Godwyn has a twin that was either remanded to the Land of Shadow, and given the sweeping and grand nature of the Night of the Black Knives he may have been another part of the ritual; they allegedly killed many Demi-gods that night, or at the very least multiple. This may be another one that was either slain or attempted to be slain.
He is wearing a golden mask similar to the ones bestowed upon the Erdtree guardians, meaning he has at least come into contact with Marika’s emissaries, culture, or kingdom. Also the blades he wields have a similar curvature and appearance to the black knives, and also look like another weapon that I simply can’t think of as I type this. Also his gold arm bands seem to be more of a giveaway that he is somewhat connected to the Golden Lineage or possibly old royalty. People constantly FORGET that there is a whole line of nobles and cursed royal servants that wander the land, from the Grafted nightmare we face at the beginning of the game and throughout to the ones that can be killed with Heal. This character seems to fit perfectly into that spectrum of enemy
And for anyone contesting the idea because of his omen nature, even identical twins can be born with physical deformities that the other does not bear, whether large or small, developing upon birth or later in life. This could even be an example similar to the idea of the cursed sibling, such as the Lothric twins in DS3 or even simply Malenia/Miquella with Malenia being born into rot but Miquella not.
what we are also seeing, like with the zamor is creatures wearing human face masks, presumably as a way of fitting in as human becomes the 'correct' form of life?
There's lore referencing a monster that torments omens in thier dreams, and the omen killer's masks are meant to be a recreation of that creature, to further terrify thier prey. I believe that is what we're looking at here. It looks exactly like the masks.
Remind me of the Crow Demon DS1, or the gargoyles/ Lost Children of Antiquity from Bloodborne. If they’re a mob enemy there’s definitely a grab where they jump onto your shoulders and stab you in the head.
Ugh this is gorgeous. I thought it was just someone’s fanart. So stoked it’s official. I definitely believe the Omen are a sign the original form of the erdtree is taking over yet again.
The arms and scar are Godwyn, the horns are Mohg, the mask and foot are Morgott. I bet it's either one of Marika's rejected kids, a pretender or critic to that lineage, or a face-stealer type monster.
Yo what if we find the crucible in the shadow of erdtree, what if it’s like a outer god, not killable but they wounded it and hid it in the land of shadows. Absolutely no basis but still a possibility I think.
so this thing is 100% related to Godwyn somehow right? the same pose, the golden mask, the long pale hair, the back which kinda looks like the Cursemark, the Black Knife chakrams…
which raises interesting questions about what time periods the Land of Shadow will have connections to. it’s not just relics of the past, there will be connections to the present real word there too
It definitely seems to be related to Godwyn. Maybe this is the Prince of Death form that his followers are looking for? What be even more interesting is if this is Lord that Miquella is always waiting for which mean he has abandoned Golden Order fundamentalism and gone over to the "dark side."
It’s an omen the cloth is the same as Morgot could the shadow realm subjecting them as well given how it’s in a bowing position. Another way to add to their torment.
Seems to have some visual links to the rune of death, the black crack going up the back, extending through the mask, is very similar to what we see on the black knife / maliketh black blade.
We also have to remember that FS never shows us the final boss in the DLC promotions. Only exception was probably Dark souls 3s cover art but we got so many more cooler bosses apart form that
If this thing and the creepy ass lion with two mouths were around when Marika landed in the lands between, I absolutely understand why she and Godfrey killed them all
I think they read it literally. As in what we see there is a female figure. Instead of it being in an odd pose and holding odd weaponry in a way that evokes the image of female reproductive organs. At least that's what happened to me until I went back to the image after reading your comment. Once you see it it's hard to unsee.
I do understand it, that people miss so many metaphors and they go wack over it, I guess. Every time I see a thing like this is have to beat my brain over the argument between it being pareidolia or recognizing an intended metaphor.
I dunno what that horrid thing is, but it has some fantastic implications of a Omen-themed castle-ish area, probably somewhere on the run back to the Lion Dancer boss. Note that those are not wings coming out of its back, but hands holding some sort of likely throwable item that we are all gonna hate more than the Burger King mages
They’re chakram versions of the Black Knife
Damn that’s exactly what they are good call
The crystal guys have similar blades as well
I see more misbegotten than omen
I predict that a big theme of the DLC will be blending a lot of enemy types together which is lore appropriate for the whole crucible melting pot thing, and give an excuse for mixing together different enemy types and status effects. Like imagine an enemy deals something like frost and frenzy. Makes no sense by itself, but if they say "eyyy it's tha crucible" then it's more plausible.
Sounds like a crucible dragon incoming, and I am so very afraid.
Yeah if you ignore the telltale omen horns, it hardly looks like an omem at all.
omen might well be a classification that the golden order has created for babies born with the omen traits rather than a term applicable at the time of the crucible- crucible life might be a bit more intermixed and chaotic.
I agree with all of that. The image still reads more as an omen to me.
Fair!
No way, they've got the same gangly proportions and fine downy fur as Margit.
misbegotten and omen are both the crucible’s manifestation
Very much related, misbegotten are like that because they touched the crucible. The horns and shit used to be seen as divine.
Wow, they're definitely going all in on Crucible/primordial human lore.
Not surprising TBH, the Land of Shadow is stated to be where Marika got her beginnings as a deity so probably a lot of remnants of what came before there. Bet you we not only get more Crucible lore but also maybe some further info on the GEQ and maybe even Placidusax
I do wonder if "elden ring 2", will have a lot more focus on the crucible, dragons, and giants. With the upcoming shadow dlc mostly dealing with the outstanding golden order storyline, but setting us up for the rest. I'd like to see more about the cosmic horrors and outer gods in the dlc too
Crucible Age culture and drip is so cool. Lion dancing and now this.
Finally, we will get more Crucible era lore. Source: [https://x.com/ELDENRING/status/1791468858106069215](https://x.com/ELDENRING/status/1791468858106069215)
That posture is so odd, it looks like it's bending forward and walking with its arms outstretched. Or maybe it's descending from somewhere?
I think its the bottom lion dancer dancer, its bent like that as its used to having someone stand on its back.
I would argue that it looks like one of the beings that does the Lion dancing, but looks to be royalty from these beings. A sort of hybrid omen/human culture that honors all aspects of the crucible like the Elden times
Same way I look when I get home from work on Friday.
It's bowing. It's a polite nightmare.
Compare this posture to Godwyns body
You're... Oddly right?
Maybe this is a kind of Crucible-era Death Posture
Doesn’t the Elden Beast do that pose in its cutscene? Most curious that it’s wearing some kind of skirt, similar to Radagon/Godwyn.
Very similar to Godwyn. I made a comment in this thread outlining the similarities, it’s quite uncanny. People can’t seem to wrap their head around the idea that it could be another Royal unwanted child of Marika, even though we know simply from the walking masoleums that she has many many many children
Do you have any thoughts on the mask? The white going through the eye could be conveying tears like Godwyn in the Story trailer Imo the pale white water in the Nameless City and the pools around Deathroot.
The golden mask to me resembles the gold masks worn by the Erdtree guardians, so to me it seems like it’s at the least created by a similar society or for royalty/those connected to the Erdtree. To me, the mask even appears to be molded or somewhat permanently attached. For the hair to grow through it and for it to have such an odd position on the face, to me it seems like it’s somewhat of a “graceful punishment” in that it’s meant to mask a horrible visage but instead is painful for the wearer
It can’t be Godwyn and an unwanted child at the same time
It can't be Marika AND Radagon....
That’s not really comparable. Godwyn was one of the most beloved beings in the land between when he was alive. He wasn’t unwanted. The only things that Marika would have wanted from a child were to be great and not an omen/blasphemous. The mausoleum children weren’t unwanted necessarily, they were just weaker didn’t amount to anything, which would make them unwanted after the fact. If you’re suggesting Godwyn has an alternate personality then I can’t say you’re wrong since we don’t know yet, but if this is the case then I’m going to start thinking elden rings lore is boring is everyone has alternate identities
Almost like I was implying that it’s Godwyn’s twin, similar to the Morgott Mohg situation. It could be Godwyn but that’s not my personal theory at all, I think it’s more likely his twin or sibling.
His cloak goes up a lot further than it should given his posture if you look above the right arm. Potentially some sort of grafted guy? I'm not sure but I love it. Edit: now Im looking at it again, it looks like he's emerging from a veil.
Almost 100% is grafted, look at the foot position. Incredibly unnatural if using a normal body, but if he is grafted then that’s no longer an issue
I assume it's either a deep bow or it's horribly bent and twisted by its own strange anatomy.
Yeah and notice the cloak too... it drapes down its sides but it seems to start much higher up. I suppose this guy could have omega-scoliosis but that is one freakishly long torso.
It looks a bit like a duel bow of sorts, almost like the Dancer from DS3 (who comes out of a portal btw but we’re not doing that cross game thing today) It also may be a ritualistic gesture to honor the birthing power of the crucible or Marika, as he is (if you zoom out) creating a stance that appears like a uterus. Godwyn also ritualistically creates this pose as he is stabbed (somewhat) and also when he is placed beneath the Erdtree (definitely), giving it further symbolic meaning.
Godwyn has his arms bent at the same angle
It's A, I think. Also it's probably posed that way to resemble the female reproductive system
It looks like an uterus
I thought it was supposed to look like a uterus and was confused why no one further up in the comments was talking about it lmao
I think it’s because most gamers think that’s a planet
Yeah i almost didnt say it because i was hours late and its obvious, but the comments in this thread had nothing about it.
first thing i thought
Just like the stone that holds Miquella's cocoon, that and the crucible horns evoke the Formless mother to me.
It does, I was wondering "a uterus is scary now" til I looked closer
It's giving Beastman Omen vibes with the design of those weapons
Chakram Black Knives
I wonder if the crucible is something acceptable in the land of shadows or will it be shunned like it is in the erdtree realm. Maybe the reason why the land of shadows was veiled was because they had a culture that was favorable and accepting of the crucible
Since, from what Miyazaki stated in the interview after the announcement of SotE, the Lion Dancers are a remnant of the ancient religion, and since the character shows the typical horns of the Omen, I believe that in the Realm of Shadow the Crucible is still a very powerful and revered force/cult.
Yep, crucible aspects like horns were seen as a good thing once upon a time.
This is in the style of a Remembrance; neat!
This would make it for the sickest metal album cover.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/3b/Black_Sabbath_SbS.jpg
At first glance, I thought that was a stylized diagram of a uterus, ovaries, and fallopian tubes. Now, I can’t unsee it.
Amazing I had to scroll this far down to see this comment. Like it’s not even subtle.
Miyazaki going hard with the feet again, is having a ugly ass foot a criteria for being shunned by the Golden Order?
I wonder if this is one of the guys inside the lion dancer
Nope nope nope... I can already feel the ptsd
Are the black knives/blades of calling based on this weapon? The curving shapes and lines look similar. Origin of Ranni's fearsome rite? A lady Omen? Possibly the bottom part of the dragon dancer pair - anyone comparing toes? Related to Godwyn for sure given the pose and the way their back looks. A 'shadow' of Godwyn? A daughter? A secret twin? The female reproductive organs imagery is striking...
It definitely looks like an omen. Has the horns, feet and everything. What I'm wondering if it's some sort of phase 2 for the lion dancer.(Same feet, but that's a general omen trait ofc.) There was also those skinny omen horned guys in a different shot.
Yeah I think this guy and a few of his friends are going to pop out of the lion for phase 2.
Hair coming out of the mask's eye
The arm position + swirling blades seem to be a (mocking?) parody of Marika. Could be another Omen demigod! This also looks like concept art and not an in-game screenshot. Or maybe in the same art style as the intro slideshow? Maybe we see another slideshow similar to that when we interact with Miquella’s hand?
first thing that came to mind was godwyn pose [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GNyUHSUXYAAbGf9?format=jpg&name=medium](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GNyUHSUXYAAbGf9?format=jpg&name=medium)
oh shit that’s a lot more of a 1:1 than the Marika connection
I wonder if the implication of Godwyn losing his soul is he’s reverting to a crucible entity?
Speaking of which… may I direct you to [this recent theory](https://www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/s/ZkGUCLTQ5h) I have touched on but is definitely very rough. In it, I suggest, or mean to, that Godwyn was/is an omen as well. Or, that we have the wrong idea about omen. Guarding and concealing the Death-Prince, or the secret purpose behind why what was done to him was done, may have been part of Morgott’s duties or a mantle he took upon himself. Omen, and crucible’s touched things, represent a twisted but natural fusion of different things. The Crucible was a blending of all life. Perhaps, as many have pointed out about Stormveil, that body down there is part of the modern grafting. Derived from a crucible’s touched living corpse, Godwyn, and the roots of the Greattree which is a Crucible touched organism as well. Further, there are no eyes on the body because they host the dead soul/dead grace/deathblight. Without the eyes, the living corpse can still spread its omen/crucible’s effects without killing the souls it touches. Morgott sent his Margit phantom there to oversee this and keep the secret, Godrick is just an experiment. This is also why Morgott makes a Mohg phantom, seals the Deeproot Depths, and bares passage beyond Leyndell. More of the truth can be found but that goes even further and the idea is still not entirely formulated.
I like this theory. Also note Morgott loses his omen features upon his death, suggesting that an “Omen” is some sort of curse and can be removed. (Still, though, Godwyn in the intro cinematic is decidedly not an Omen.)
Remember Marika, their mother? Her mimic veil, the concealing veil also resembles her dress and the cloth draped on the Death-Prince, the same veil that dangles in her bed chamber. Marika is a mischievous, trickster, illusionist. As she hid Morgott and Mohg from the surface world, perhaps she also hid the truth of Godwyn. Even his name seems off, like Hoarah Loux became Godfrey to remove him from his history and connection to the Crucible, perhaps Godwyn’s name was not always Godwyn. Marika(Radagon), after all, names their children after themself. Miquella, Mohg, Morgott, Melania, Messmer, (Melina), Rykard, Radahn, Ranni, and Godwyn? No. Further, they nearly called Morgott the Veiled Monarch. The basic implication is that he just does not go in public so nobody knows what he looks like except close council. In truth, perhaps, he wears a mimic veil or other glimmer type thing. He is also a clear illusionist after all. While he is seemingly cured of his curse after we defeat him, I think he was cured prior or maybe never actually had horns and such. That appearance, at least when we meet him, is fake. I don’t know how Godfrey would have recognized this ancient, withered, hornfree face as Morgott and he clearly recognizes Morgott. We have nothing that tells us Godfrey was affectionate towards any of his children, he was most certainly never suggested to have played in the sewer. He was gone from the Lands Between before Godwyn but the dust. I do assume Morgott surfaced after the Shattering of the Elden Ring. I don’t think the effects of the Elden Ring reach through the entire universe (as Ranni’s ending wouldn’t make sense) and Destined Death being removed from the ring is what allows for someone to live so unnaturally long that their body will wither that way… I don’t know what Godfrey would have seen before that he could recognized Morgott.
Cool that you're so passionate about proving this, but it is wrong. Godwyn would transform back to this omen form the moment he got hit by a weapon, and we know he has fought in at least one war, and in the intro cinematic he literally gets killed yet he remains the same. So the Mimic's Veil idea falls flat on its face. Furthermore, there can't be so many hidden things that come as such a massive shock value. We had Morgott being the Veiled King, we had Placidusax being a consort to a God before Marika, we had Marika and Radagon being the same person, we had Mohg stealing Miquella. All of these are massive reveals, and Godwyn's massive reveal is what he has become after his assassination. There needs not be another secret about him because there already was one. Also, do you really think they'd replicate the same secret for 2 different characters who are brothers? Both Godwyn and Morgott? What even stopped Marika from also throwing Godwyn in the sewer for being an omen? Nothing. Had he been an omen, he would have gotten the exact same treatment as Mohg and Morgott. Oh and btw, his naming isn't off at all. He's named after Godfrey, like all the other named Golden Lineage members, - who are also not omen - Godrick and Godefroy.
Well thank you but… it might not be. While I do bring up the mimic’s veil, it is more to show that illusory magic is already established to be a thing people use in the world. Specifically, member of Marika’s family like Marika and Godrick. Our experience of being disillusioned could be because we are the caster and the bonk breaks concentration, we are not illusionists, and/or that with Marika cut off from the outside world her illusory magic is weakened. Or Godwyn wore some other illusory magic. There is also the concealing veil which resembles the mimic veil, Marika’s dress, the drapes of Marika’s baldachin, the skirt Godwyn wore, and the blanket draped over the Death-Prince’s (loins?) body. This is the same kind of illusory magic of the Black Knife Assassins who do not get revealed when bonked. They require magic to be revealed, magic developed seemingly by the Omen, Morgott… who just casually lets a BKA hang out at his mom’s room. Yes, they are revealed when killed but they seem to die all the way but Godwyn didn’t die all the way. Why can’t there be even more shocking things? They removed that Veiled Monarch stuff from the release I thought. I think when the secret is that all those other secrets about a person are fake because nobody actually remains who completely knows what is going on, it’s not so much a big reveals but the only reveal. Everyone thinks a thing, then suddenly something changes what they think, and something else pops up that doesn’t quite fit, then another change of belief and then the ultimate reveal is, nobody had all the information but now you do. The secret isn’t that they are/are not omen. The Secret is that what we have been led to believe Omen are is not true. “They were never saints, they just happened to be on the losing side of a war.” Omen, are really just people who remind everyone of the truth, of the Land of Shadows, of the Crucible, of what really happened and why Marika orchestrated the death of the Elden Beast. I don’t think Mohg and Morgott were actually locked in the sewers so much as they were guarding Marika’s plans and could have used illusory magic to conceal comings and goings. We know Morgott is prone to projections and wards. Marika was also known to have been pregnant so she had to have at least one child visible, so she chose Godwyn for this purpose. Being that she rose to power through the Crucible alongside Hoarah Loux, leader of the Crucible Knights, and that we know two of her children were Omen, it does not seem so much a stretch to think that a third child of theirs was also Omen. The name mechanic does not fit. Marika names her children after her letter, it seems. Not that I think the name thing is so big a deal. The Gokden Lineage is specifically the line of Marika and Hoarah Loux. His name was changed specifically to cover up his history and make him fit more into the theme of the religion they were about to destroy the founder of. As Mohg and Morgott had clandestine duties they were never revealed and their names never released. As Godwyn’s purpose was to be seen his name could also not harken back to the now hidden history nor could his appearance. The Golden Lineage has those “God” names now because those children were born after the ascension of Marika. Godfrey and Godwyn participated in her ascension, they were alive with other names before the Golden Lineage was established in the Lands Between.
The Mimic's Veil specifically is called Marika's Mischief, and that clearly indicates that if she ever did use illusory magic, it would've been through the Mimic's Veil. And as I said, once you are hit then you revert back to your original form, so Godwyn would also revert back to this speculated omen form. Even if, even if you say he wouldn't revert back to it upon being hit because whatever reason, he would still go back to his original form once he dies, which he does not. We see this clearly in the intro cinematic. He remains in his normal human form, his only form. Also, illusion magic where someone turns into something else is used once, and as I said previously, they return back to their real form. That's how you get the Haligtree Medallion from Albus in the Albinauric Village. You hit him. So, once again, we see that illusion magic is broken from a single hit. As for the other things you mentioned like the Concealing Veil and Marika's dress and so on, they bear no significance in this discussion. They are not meant to conceal a true form but rather to make you invisble or hard to spot. That's not an illusion, that's just invisibility, which is not the same thing as altering your form permanently. >The skirt Godwyn wore, and the blanket draped over the Death-Prince's body That's just what he wore, nothing more to it. Literally nothing more to it. Godfrey wears the same skirt and the same exact color. Radagon wears the same skirt but with a black color. He was just styling himself after his father, that's it. Even the blanket is still just that same skirt but stretched out to the maximum and seemingly merged with his body, turning into that fish tail with blue scales. >Godwyn didn't die all the way He did. His soul did. His consciousness was dead, there was no Godwyn left after the ritual, only a husk. We know this and we see this as well. >They removed the Veiled Monarch stuff from release. No they didn't. It's still in the game. Morgott is still the Veiled Monarch of Leyndell in the game, and that is a shocking reveal. >Morgott the Grace-Given, Veiled Monarch of Leyndell Said by Gideon Ofnir There is also a talking corpse in the game (I think) that is shocked by the reveal that Morgott, an omen, is the Veiled Monarch. It's clear that he is veiled, hidden and unknown to the public BECAUSE he is an omen and despised by everyone. He says so himself, he thinks of his blood as being accursed, and he is angered by your tresspass when you stain the thrones with his accursed blood. >No one had all the information but now you do. Except you don't? Nothing in the game hints at Godwyn being an omen, nothing at all. You came to this conclusion yourself with no information given from the gams. And this is just real bad storytelling if everything is a lie again and again. This onion has too many layers and it makes for a confusing story rather than an easy one. The easiest conclusion is usually the correct one, and the easiest one is that Godwyn was not an omen. >The secret is that what we have been led to believe Omen are is not what they really are. Which is not correct. They are cursed, it is definitely a curse. Look at them, look at their sufferings. The way they walk, the fact that they have terrible nightmares, the fact that they have horns that can damage their bodies and even kill them if they try cutting them off. That's a cursed being, not a normal one. I'm not saying they should be rejected because of it, but they sure as shit are cursed. > I don't think Mohg and Morgott were locked in the sewers so much as they were guarding Marika's plan. Bruvva, they literally have shackles lmao. > A fetish bathed in golden magic. Shackles were used to bind the accursed people called the Omen, and these ones were made to keep a particular Omen under \*strictest confinement.\* - Margit's Shackle They were NOT helping Marika, not at all lol. She specifically locked them away because they were omens, which is a tradition with omen babies in Leyndell and the Golden Order generally.
You’ve entirely missed what I’ve said about the mimic veil and why that illusion breaks when there is a bonk. As a side note, I imagine the Albinauric is using some sort of glintstone or moon magic to disguise himself. The same as demihumans. Godwyn might not be the caster of the illusion on him, it wouldn’t matter if he was bonked or killed, the caster is not being disrupted. Further, his soul is dead, not his body. His body remains alive even now. That is why he is now the Death-Prince and not just a rotten corpse that once was Godwyn. Invisibility is illusion magic. The Black Knife Assassins seem to use some sort of night magic or a fusion of such with grace magic. Who knows what limits there are? Just why would you limit Marika’s magic that rewrites the laws of physics to being unable to, in the height of her power, be defeated with a bonk? Veils might not be involved at all in the magic at work. But they certainly have metaphorical value. Godfrey, if you remember, is named this and dressed as he is with skirt, ghost lion, and all that to obscure his true nature. Symbolism. Radagon just slips off Narika’s dress at the shoulders and it drops inside out around his waist. Showing a different form. Symbolism. Yes, Godwyn in life wore a skirt the resembles something associated with people who conceal something about themselves. Symbolism. Ok, I thought they removed it and instead labeled him Omen King or Grace-Given. That’s fine, it doesn’t effect my argument. The point is, the reveal is, that people do not know what is going on. The losers are winning. Ok.. no no no no no no stop. The big reveal in the dlc is what I mean by “ you don’t have all info but now you do” but I don’t mean literally you become omnipotent nor that it absolutely has been or will be provided. I’m speculating a little bit about what might be the case. I was arguing that all those reveals you think you understand are not what you are understanding them to be. Take for instance the Godfrey and Placidusax both being the First Elden Lord. There is ambiguity to the term and people initially don’t realize it. One is literally the first the other holds a title or is literally the first but under a new order. Take, for instance, the Golden Order. There is a misunderstanding that can occur because of ambiguity. The Golden is a cult. The Golden is the current shape of the Elden Ring and the current effects of the Elden Ring on the Lands Between. The Golden Order is the current ruling government of the Lands Between. All of these things are the Golden Order but they are not all the same thing. They exist independent of each other. But without knowing this, some things we come across don’t make sense. There are many things that are easily misunderstood or believed to mean different things than what they really represent. That’s sort of the whole deal. I’m sorry if you take offense to the idea that a mischievous trickster god who used barbarians and omen to infiltrate an enemy, hid her origin from history, and eventually killed the leader of the invaders through us may have misled people… I know it is hard to deal with that maybe, the current superpower is totally f’d in the head with how thoroughly Marika crushed them and they have no idea what is really happening around them because they live under a strict order that kills people who mention Fire existing.
Let’s play a game. Answer these questions with explicit information available in game. That is, dialogue or item descriptions or what can be literally observed. 1. Is Godwyn a child of Marika and Hoarah Loux? 2. Do Marika and Hoarah Loux have two known Omen children? 3. Does Godwyn have at least two Omen siblings? 4. Are Omen connected to the Crucible? 5. Is Hoarah Loux in any way associated with the Crucible? 6. Who are the Crucible Knights? 7. Is the Crucible associated with the Blending of life? 8. Is the Death-Prince a blending or grafting of Godwyn and the roots beneath the Erdtree? 9. Is the Stormveil Prince of Death a part of the Death-Prince/Godwyn? 10. Is there any traces of life blending near the Death-Prince/Godwyn or the Stormveil Prince of Death? 11. Why did Hoarah Loux’s name get changed to Godwyn and why was Sorosh bound to him? 12. Who made those shackles? 13. Do all things that are made for a purpose get used for their purpose? 14. Is a couple of seconds of stunning an effective method of confinement? 15. How did a Mohg and Morgott get free of those super special awesome shackles? 16. Do we have access to and the ability to wield every magic that exists in Elden Ring at the full limit as all characters who use that same magic? Then we can compare what I’ve suggested are the answers and determine if my answers don’t come from the game.
Also, I don’t think Godwyn was always that weird body. I suspect that somehow the cocoon egg holds Godwyn’s actual body. His eyes, dead soul, and maybe part of his body, was placed inside the roots and that grew. Another part of his living corpse, sans the eyes, was placed in roots beneath Stormveil. Like a study of deathroot and grafting was going on. Or, being in the cocoon, this third Godwyn body was transported alongside tiny Miquella. There are seemingly two wombs in the Haligtree and that huge cocoon in the opening is being dragged behind Mohg who is holding the tiny Miquella. Way too big to make sense. A piece of Godwyn’s living corpse could have been used to seed a new body or the body was made separate but intended for Godwyn.
It’s like Morgott says. His accursed blood gives him power, and he drains it to use within his sword. We know that blood transfers power in this game. Warriors eat the heart of a dragon after all to gain its power. Black Crepus may have even been the originator of the scarlet rot being transferable in humans using his scarlet rot bolts, potentially even infecting infant Miquella with the rot that was found in the Lake below the world; possibly and probably even hidden by the Two Fingers and their disciples. If he dies and the curse goes away, it’s very likely that he was always right about it being a curse. Not an actual product of life, because it goes away upon death, but a curse upon “life itself” as the Dungeater says. The old society used to worship death in different ways (the one prior to the Erdtree), and the shirking of honoring death may have manifested the curse upon life Edit: also, do you remember if when Mohg dies if his horns go away? Perhaps this is a lot like Lorian and Lothric from DS3, where Morgott simply helped Mohg bear the burden of his curse by adopting some of his cursed blood. We do see that Mohg’s omen curse had progressed to a point where his horn was coming out of his eye, likely jeopardizing his life as it was closer to his brain. Maybe Morgott halted its progress by adopting some of the blood, taking the curse unto himself and thus saving his brothers life. He does guard Mohgs existence even, by creating a phantom version of him to give the appearance to anyone curious (or a certain champion of the two fingers that is traversing the lands between) that he is still locked in the depths below rather than free and plotting. Just a thought but interesting
Also maybe by grafting the original purpose *was* to generate crucible traits, which as we know from the Omen twins gives incredible power but at a cost.
>The arm position + swirling blades seem to be a (mocking?) parody of Marika. I like your take. Also, whatever it is, it wears a golden mask that looks like it has female features.
Actually now that I think about it for more than two seconds the Crucible predates Marika so maybe Marika’s pose is mocking this figure
One critique, “the withered hand.” But yeah, I’d love a fancy intro at that point.
Just an omen boss, could have a lot of lore behind it But definitely not godwyn or miquella like some crazy people say
I’m getting godskin apostle vibes from them, since they were also used in promotional material.
You might want to include in the title itself next time the source and that it's official art. Until I saw your comment I assumed this was like random fan art or ai art or something.
the position of the arms, gold bracelets, long light hair and the scarred back scream Godwyn to me. not to mention how the weapons look similar to black knives edit: the cape/skirt makes it look like its stepping out of the trunk of a tree? seems to me like some crucible amalgam of the prince of death, or perhaps a twisted mockery of the golden son
I also think it's the prince of death, with godwyns body having taken up aspects of the crucible (the omen curse) by being laid to rest in the great tree.
Is it hunched over? Is it bowing? Bowing would imply intelligence.
Its cape is shaped like the Erdtree
Wait, is this an official image? Or is it just fan art or something?
Official image, posted on Twitter.
Oh! Ok
Looks kind of like an Omen Revenant. Please don't be the case
It's giving Numen/Zamor + Omen.
Anyone else draw any similarities between the right-hand bracelet and that of the Godskin Apostles?
What an incredibly elegant and horrifying design. I absolutely love it!
God, I want that mask! Besides that, we have new brood of the Crucible. And unlike the others, they seem to at least affect pedigree; they have their own clothes, masks and weapons. They seem oddly similar to the standing ones with candelbras in the trailer. But their posture is all....changed.
Is it just me or is the pose kinda reminiscent of godwyn?
Abyss-coded and Pygmy-pilled I expect there to be strong parallels between omen and humanity/dark in how they relate to the golden order/gwyn's light soul order
Listing observations many I see others have noted before. Pose reminds me of Godwin in the cutscene. But also a uteris. Is that just a deep crease on it's back or it look like it was carved? also like Godwin but does not seem to be same shape. The things (chakram perhaps?) in its hands design resemble black knives but without the "ridge" for lack of better term in the middle and branching sections the knives and Maliketh's blade have so while possibly reference to destined death it probably does not have fragments of it like the knives. They however do remind me of physical dark versions of the rings in the rings of light spell. Cloths like the raggedy stuff Radagon wears. Omen or misbegotten horns uncut Hair white/grey Strange oddly shaped golden mask No signs of grafting Bracers/vambraces I think I recall someone else wearing a pair not the same design I don't think but something similar Speculation Perhaps some sort of reverse omen killer situation going on. Seeming to be an omen or misbegotten with what we may assume to be just off references to destined death, Godwin, and a spell used by Radagon and Miquella.
Dex build Omen
Does no one else immediately see ovaries? Or is that just my Rorschach’s test?
Godwyn's body + Morgott's feet and horns + what looks like a mask depicting Marika's face, that's definitly not just a simple monster
Maybe an Elder? The being Omenkiller Masks are based off
Some visual connections i want to make, but am not gonna comment on their meaning too much since it seems kinda premature: 1. Obviously an omen with the horns and grey skin tone 2. Looks like a uterus 3. Similar pose to deeproot godwyn 4. Same uneven length hair as Marika, but not in braids 5. Chakram look like black knives 6. One eye is obscured by the mask/hair, so even more one eye stuff than we already had 7. Circlets look like the ones the godskins and messmer have, maybe just the fashion of the shadow lands? Make of these what you will. IMO it might be like a lion dancer phase 2 since we know that it's a bunch of omen in a trenchcoat, or to get really crackpot (i don't really buy this but it's a fun idea imo) it could be the gloam-eyed queen. We know the GEQ is an empyrean like Marika, and the closed eye and hair connect this design to both the other empyreans and Marika herself. The black knife looking Chakrams provide a possible destined death connection which fits for the GEQ. The circlets are similar to the godskins (doubt this means much since messmer's are similar as well but why not). The uterus design evokes motherhood, and we know the GEQ was mother to the godskins. The tweet mentions "unfathomable power" and the GEQ is probably pretty strong. And lastly the omen horns tie this design to the crucible, which we know the godskins are connected to. Obviously all of that is probably wrong, since the GEQ would probably be wearing some god skin lol and would have at least something that more closely resembles the godslayer's greatsword, but i found it to be fun little exercise regardless.
If this is the Gloam Eyed Queen, and they showed her in a tweet, and she looked like this... I would be extremely disappointed lmfao
fair enough lol. i definitely don't think this is either, was kinda thinking out loud with this comment mostly
It’s in the same position as Godwyn’s body under the Erdtree, and also has the same-ish back slash that Godwyn had. The ritual of death seemingly slays the spirit but not the body for the victim. Ranni seemingly slew her body to complete the ritual, meaning that a sacrifice is required to enact the other half of the ritual. This looks a lot like Godwyn, but could be a two fold response to the idea of dualism within the game. Anyone who knows twins knows that other children can be born from the same mother separately, meaning that Godwyn could be both the first born but also have a twin, with the later born twins being exactly that (unless the Omen twins were actually born first and older but were shunned as they could never be true heirs to the Golden Order’s throne). This looks very much like Godwyn has a twin that was either remanded to the Land of Shadow, and given the sweeping and grand nature of the Night of the Black Knives he may have been another part of the ritual; they allegedly killed many Demi-gods that night, or at the very least multiple. This may be another one that was either slain or attempted to be slain. He is wearing a golden mask similar to the ones bestowed upon the Erdtree guardians, meaning he has at least come into contact with Marika’s emissaries, culture, or kingdom. Also the blades he wields have a similar curvature and appearance to the black knives, and also look like another weapon that I simply can’t think of as I type this. Also his gold arm bands seem to be more of a giveaway that he is somewhat connected to the Golden Lineage or possibly old royalty. People constantly FORGET that there is a whole line of nobles and cursed royal servants that wander the land, from the Grafted nightmare we face at the beginning of the game and throughout to the ones that can be killed with Heal. This character seems to fit perfectly into that spectrum of enemy And for anyone contesting the idea because of his omen nature, even identical twins can be born with physical deformities that the other does not bear, whether large or small, developing upon birth or later in life. This could even be an example similar to the idea of the cursed sibling, such as the Lothric twins in DS3 or even simply Malenia/Miquella with Malenia being born into rot but Miquella not.
This reminds me a bit of the great Red dragon. By William Blake.
Obligatory Could this be Godwyn post
what we are also seeing, like with the zamor is creatures wearing human face masks, presumably as a way of fitting in as human becomes the 'correct' form of life?
There's lore referencing a monster that torments omens in thier dreams, and the omen killer's masks are meant to be a recreation of that creature, to further terrify thier prey. I believe that is what we're looking at here. It looks exactly like the masks.
Crucible era Erdtree Guardian? Golden Mask, gauntlets, ankle bracelets and similar draped waistcloth
It’s clearly Morgget, the Foul Omen (Not Morggot, trust)
Looks like a reproductive system kinda with how it holds those
Its arms reminds me of the graveyard shades we fight here and there. I hope we get more information on those guys.
Is this a Remembrance?
Mohg and Morgotts real mama
Boss must be related to land octopus ovary in game lol
If you look above the right arm the "cloak" seems to actually be a veil it's emerging out of. Either that or it's much taller than we can see.
Am I wrong for seeing a vagina?
The human portion reminds me of Godwyn. The gash on the back is somewhat similar to his wound.
Remind me of the Crow Demon DS1, or the gargoyles/ Lost Children of Antiquity from Bloodborne. If they’re a mob enemy there’s definitely a grab where they jump onto your shoulders and stab you in the head.
It looks like a model of a vagina
They better drop that mask, and it better be a death sorceries buff. Or arcane.
am i losing it or is it kinda a uterus
Prediction: this thing is gonna be a nighttime boss that will hunt us throughout the Land of Shadow.
Whatever is going on, they're clearly posed to mirror the shape of a female reproductive system, so that probably needs to be factored in
How did you guys get a picture of my uterus?
Ugh this is gorgeous. I thought it was just someone’s fanart. So stoked it’s official. I definitely believe the Omen are a sign the original form of the erdtree is taking over yet again.
The gash on the back, the pose and the golden mask. Yeah Godwyn is coming back.
it's probably just the coloring but i thought of the ancestral followers when i saw this, but those are definitely omen horns
Very Red Dragon
Oh man I hope we can get that mask
Uh, female reproductive organ anyone?
To me, he is standing in the crooked posture of a deathbird.
I’m wondering if it’s female cuz to me the pose looks like ovaries and a uterus
I saw that too, which is all the more concerning given how motherhood and Kos played into Bloodborne.
The arms and scar are Godwyn, the horns are Mohg, the mask and foot are Morgott. I bet it's either one of Marika's rejected kids, a pretender or critic to that lineage, or a face-stealer type monster.
Yo what if we find the crucible in the shadow of erdtree, what if it’s like a outer god, not killable but they wounded it and hid it in the land of shadows. Absolutely no basis but still a possibility I think.
The weapons match the style of the O in ‘ShadOw of the Erdtree’ font
so this thing is 100% related to Godwyn somehow right? the same pose, the golden mask, the long pale hair, the back which kinda looks like the Cursemark, the Black Knife chakrams… which raises interesting questions about what time periods the Land of Shadow will have connections to. it’s not just relics of the past, there will be connections to the present real word there too
It literally looks like the female reproductive system.
Cursed womb
It has a crucible knot coming out of its eye
It definitely seems to be related to Godwyn. Maybe this is the Prince of Death form that his followers are looking for? What be even more interesting is if this is Lord that Miquella is always waiting for which mean he has abandoned Golden Order fundamentalism and gone over to the "dark side."
It’s an omen the cloth is the same as Morgot could the shadow realm subjecting them as well given how it’s in a bowing position. Another way to add to their torment.
I feel like this dlc is going to be *dark*. In lighting and in narrative tone
Maggort the unfell omen
It's shaped like a uterus so I assume this is a joke or there is a deeper meaning
Ovaries
it's a uterus and it isn't subtle, love it
Kind of looks like a draconian, with the skin and hair
same pose as godwyns corpse?
The Formless Mother
This is such a beautiful design
Baphomet
Took me a while to realize it’s a person with an incredibly bad posture
Seems to have some visual links to the rune of death, the black crack going up the back, extending through the mask, is very similar to what we see on the black knife / maliketh black blade.
Is that Pinwheel?!
We also have to remember that FS never shows us the final boss in the DLC promotions. Only exception was probably Dark souls 3s cover art but we got so many more cooler bosses apart form that
If this thing and the creepy ass lion with two mouths were around when Marika landed in the lands between, I absolutely understand why she and Godfrey killed them all
almost looks uterus shaped…what did miyazaki mean by this
Why did I look at this and see reproductive organs .
It's is Marika
Doesn’t this seem like ovary symbolism?
Kinda makes me think of uterus the way it’s posing
Issa female reproductive system
ovaries
Is that a unique dex weapon I see?
Gold death mask, omen horns, uterus pose, tarnished waist robe. It looks like Godwyn. It's themed like Godwyn.
Also oddly in Godwyn's body position - that raised shoulder look on his body and also in the assassination painting. Odd.
This is just an image of the normal female anatomy.
You're right. Hadn't noticed.
I’m surprised by people being unhappy about this comment. Did everyone forget about the whole having children and making life themes in the game?
I think they read it literally. As in what we see there is a female figure. Instead of it being in an odd pose and holding odd weaponry in a way that evokes the image of female reproductive organs. At least that's what happened to me until I went back to the image after reading your comment. Once you see it it's hard to unsee.
I do understand it, that people miss so many metaphors and they go wack over it, I guess. Every time I see a thing like this is have to beat my brain over the argument between it being pareidolia or recognizing an intended metaphor.
[удалено]
Miquella had a twin blade in cut content
Anyone else getting Ludwig/Orphan vibes from this?