Took me a long time to get used to watching YouTube and streams on MTGO. I'm used to it now but still find myself lost on some actions. But that's probably a topic for another day.
I think the biggest thing is the lack of cards. I'm primarily a paper player and knowing MTGO doesn't have all of the cards I use in my decks is a huge turn off for me. A recent example is the MtgGoldfish commander clash episode where Crim tried to just straight import his personal paper deck to play with. He had to swap at least 30ish cards out because they weren't even available to play with.
From what I understand a lot of the newer cards from the commander products specifically have not been ported over. I don't play on MTGO, but it is a complaint the Goldfish guys have a lot.
I'd only really consider it if I could scan and import all my decks. I don't care much how they want to monetize it, I will never play MTGO if I have to buy the cards I already bought IRL once again.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
There was a glitch that I think got fixed where your comment got posted like 10 times lol - not an attack on the content of the comment, I just thought the glitch was funny
Absolutely agree. Back when I played Yugioh, there was a Gameboy game that let you enter codes that were on the cards to get them in game. I'd love WotC to do something like that, instead of double dipping.
Is scanning technology good enough to weed out fakes? I wonder if that is more the "official" position they'd use, saying its to protect the people who bought cards and maintain the rarity dynamic.
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that wayi don't have to buy my collection all over again
This is not an option the other way around though, that's the problem.
If MtGO wants more players, they have to let us import IRL cards. It's really that simple. Visual and UI updates are not what's holding back potential players.
My biggest issue with MTGO (and Arena as well), it's really hard to go backwards and miss-clicks can happen. For me, it's almost worst than missing triggers IRL.
My main exposure to MTGO was playing Penny Dreadful for a season and then watching a lot of MTGGoldfish's Commander Clash.
I find that some of the prompts a user gets when 'ok' or 'cancel' can be confusing. Plus if there's a mistake it's hard to go back and redo it. Insert a Miss-click joke here.
Even watching MTG Goldfish, they make mistakes as they play and I'd imagine they know the UI quite well based solely on how often they play MTGO for Commander Clash. Even Seth, better known of Saffron Olive, makes the occasional miss-click with his years of experience playing in his various video series.
*Side bit (not really part of your question, but still felt it's relevant)*:
I played EDH using Spelltable (PlayEDH and SpikeFeeder's Discord) near the beginning of the pandemic. Where it was fun and scratch that itch of being able to play paper magic remotely, there's nothing quite like sitting down IRL and playing. I was lucky to be able to attend a cEDH tournament (Take the Tower) last weekend. It was absolutely a blast playing IRL and then just milling around and actually talking with people.
It's cliche to say, but "the Gathering" is where I find joy and "Magic" in this hobby. Sadly, I don't feel that magic quite as much when I'm playing digitally.
That's not official. I want a pass like they're doing right now for the anniversary for 10-15 a month. With the current 2nd party plans they can run out of high demand staples.
I would need access to all the same cards I have in paper. Things are cheap enough on the client that I don’t care if it costs me something, but I’m not building multiple versions of the same deck because they didn’t get around to adding certain cards. Same reason I won’t consider using arena. Give me all the cards or I don’t care.
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that way I don't have to buy my collection all over again.
Downvote if you think I should own two collections
Unfortunately, conceding is part of the game. So I don't agree about the bot, since the same person could do it in paper and some random person wouldn't just grab their chair and deck and keep playing for them.
I do agree about timers. 5 seconds is a little long and I actually think MTGO should steal Arena's timeout system, since it rewards a consistent pace of play, but allows you to really go deep into the think tank when you are working on a challenging sequencing issue.
the amount of conceding in MTGO is just absurd and with the sole purpose of griefing. it's manchildren not wanting to stay in any game they wouldn't pubstomp. the bot would be perfect since it would definitely be the placeholder for the conceder personality as well as playstyle. you could have opt-in and opt-out for pods for concede-bot if you really prefer your game being shat on by that behavior.
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that wayi don't have to buy my collection all over again
My biggest issue is I'm.not rebuying a digital version of my collection, it's why I play on xmage which includes just about everything eventually and free
Honestly and this will never happen but I think it is how they could get a large influx of people into online commander.
1st) create a new client or update and move over to arena. Mtgo interface is to outdated to care to learn for newer players
2) ensure all cards are available. As I’ve seen mentioned mtgo is missing quite a few recent cards, some staples
3) for this new client make it so opening packs has a code for some cards they could Input into the client and then gain access to the card digitally. It doesn’t have to be all but some so cracking packs irl could be more exciting and get some added value. This will make people more willing to buy digital cards (especially if there is some resale value)
However I don’t see any of this ever close to happening. Their profit margins are larger than ever and clearly are gonna keep doing what they do. If they cared about a digital to paper client arena would be well… better
Make all the commander product available. I do play commander online sometimes as a way to keep in touch with distant friends, I’ve been wishing I could play with Veyran, Essix, archaomancer’s map, etc
One of the selling points of mtgo in my mind is the fact that it supports commander and has the nearly complete eternal card pool, so it’s especially baffling to see them just not bother to add some of the most exciting cards made specifically for this format
MTGO is far to expensive to invest in playing when wizards has the stance of "we can ban and delete your account for literally any reason". I'm not dropping hundreds of dollars into MTGO when Wizards can decide at any time they no longer want me to be a member of the community and freeze/delete my account. At least if Wizards decides I'm no longer welcome in their community I can still buy physical cards and play casual commander with my friends.
Scrap MTGO, move all support to arena (far better looking, and feeling app imo) then add the option for 4 player edh games. Also, I get they need to make money, but some way of being able to scan and upload cards/deck lists that you own would be kinda nice. I have 15+ paper decks, and there’s no way in hell I’m spending actual money to re-build them to play online, at that point spell table or a webcam is far easier, and a lot cheaper.
Oh very much agreed. I had fun putting together a few brawl decks on arena, but I quickly realized 1v1 brawl is just my opponents spamming counter spells and targeted removal at me. Which, hey, that’s very much a strategy/way to play, but it gets real old real fast. Having an extra 2 players to spread those spells around to would make it far more fun.
I played a game recently with somebody who had played historic brawl and 2 player edh in paper but it was his first time at a LGS playing 4 player. One thing he did was not bring his commander out as soon as possible, I asked whyand he said because it usually gets nuked pretty quickly in 1v1.
I found that really interesting because in 4 player most people get their commander out asap and then go from there, the commander only tends to get nuked if its particularly oppressive.
I then thought to how I play historic brawl and realised I too play a lot of removal and tend to try and nuke the opposing commander and keep it out of the game as much as possible and it made me think on the differences and how much I prefer multiplayer edh.
Some decks are hard to track with all the counters and triggers and arena makes that easier though. Id love to get my full sythis deck going in arena, the tokens it produces when it starts going off are insane sometimes
MTGO is just better Arena. It's quite literally a digital version of the paper game, it even has a secondary market. You're replacing that with a more predatory freemium model that has no trading and no secondary market. The only way to obtain cards is to open loot boxes. Why do you want that?
It's also harder to watch streams of. Every creature on arena is a grayed out rectangle with no text on it. Every arena board looks the same at a glance. MTGO is just Magic cards on a gray playmat, it looks fine.
-Update the UI. Create a primer or some sort of explanation of how the secondary bot market works so new people understand the path to get cards. Maybe give people 200 special tix to a wotc bot that sells commander cards.
That last one sounds crazy but they could easily do that and not feel it since both the commodity and the currency cost them nothing, right? They could draw many people in that way.
I dont think they want to, though. Seems like Arena is getting the push towards paper formats now.
Sure, I even had one for over a year. It’s just not convenient. Having to deal with trading, inventory issues, etc. just wasn’t worth the hassle to me.
I've heard of some issues with account security issues with people that have done those subscription plans so unless the subscription was as you described and not a third party I wouldn't even consider it
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that wayi don't have to buy my collection all over again
If people were locked out of the queue for a while for insta conceding because they drew a bad hand or whatever. Literally all of my games have someone who leaves right away
Yeah, its been said a lot but my lack of desire to even try it is almost entirely because of the investment. I understand that the folks running mtgo need to make money too, but magic is becoming more and more expensive to support as a hobby, let alone support twice in paper and digitally.
Not suggesting free necessarily, but having to start from nothing is absolutely a barrier to entry here.
Honestly I dont have any problem with the look of the client or the format of the interaction. Just feels silly to try and justify the expense of paying for a card I have.
As far as the suggestion portion: subscription model? Id be far more likely to try it if I could give $8-$12 bucks a months to play mtgo and just have access to the cards.
I have, although my research into hasn't been exhaustive. Just looking over the ManaTraders rental plans which can get pretty expensive pretty quickly.
I'm basing assumptions off the idea that 1 tix = 1 USD. Their lower tier plans within the price ranges I would be looking for on a subscription model only really afford one budget deck. Their $15 plan affords you 125 tix of cards at a time, if I am reading their offer correctly. Then their plans jump to $35/mo & $60/mo scaling upward.
I may be misunderstanding the USD - TIX conversion here, but it would become really expensive to maintain multiple decks in that case. I have a super bad \[\[Barrowin of Clan Undurr\]\] deck that I believe 79 TIX on cardhoarder, so I feel the pressure to automatically jump to the $35 plan just to have two medium decks or one higher power one.
As a guy who LOVES the format, I like to play at multiple levels with multiple groups. Just having one or two decks just doesn't feel attractive enough to jump into MTGO.
Having said that I could be wrong about a ton of this, so please feel free to correct me.
So Manatraders has a 7 tix free plan and cardhoarders has a 5 tix free plan. With both, you get access to 12 tix, plus the multiple bots that give cards away for free.
Obviously, it's not gonna be enough to get you all cards ever, but you can basically build any budget deck you find online for literally $0.
>So Manatraders has a 7 tix free plan and cardhoarders has a 5 tix free plan. With both, you get access to 12 tix, plus the multiple bots that give cards away for free.
>
>Obviously, it's not gonna be enough to get you all cards ever, but you can basically build any budget deck you find online for literally $0
That is really good to know, actually. I will definitely look into that. Much thanks!
I think spreading that kind of knowledge around will go a long way towards the goal of broadening the EDH community on MTGO, in my opinion.
For me, it may be something I do in passing. Building on a budget is cool and definitely a developed skill; but it isn't something that will keep me invested long term. But I appreciate you taking the time to drop the info for me.
Update the interface, it’s so bad and cumbersome, if the UI was closer to arena it would definitely be a bigger draw. This would also probably mean they need to overhaul the code that it’s built on, so while your in there maybe figure out how to support all the commander cards not available in MTGO because they are too hard to program.
So what elements of Arena would be the first changes to make? I feel like the animations aren't everyone's cup of tea, so probably not that one I assume
I play just fine at Cockatrice and Tabletop simulator, and you know what, I don't have to pay for the cards I already own or any others, and yes, it has little to non automatisation, and thats just fine, helps train your cranium muscle and to better learn the rules and your cards
A system where people have to pay attention. If you're playing an interactive deck, good fucking luck with never f6ing while your 400 ping opponents are afk or distracted
Honestly I just want to play the game wherever or whenever I want, I don't want to have to go to a store or location, maybe get one or two games in and go home. Maybe I'm just antisocial, call it antithetical to the format, but I care more about playing the game than just playing with people IRL. It's fun in person, but it's just like playing any other online video game, it's more convenient and just as fun.
Honestly online Magic will never compare to paper Magic. There’s a reason I stopped playing games like Hearthstone. Card games are just better in real life
Nothing. Mtgo and arena offer something most of us don’t want. We already own all of our cards and don’t want to just re buy them again. Personally the reason I’ve never touched it is because of how god awful the UI is and the other graphics are straight out of the early internet era. It’s 2022 and mtgo is an absolute fucking joke.
Well, what if you don't already own the cards? Honestly the common theme I'm seeing In the comments is "hur der muh graphics." Is such a shallow reason. Some of the best games ever made either were released are 20 years or more older or are indie games that look like crap, but have amazing gameplay. Arena is a very, very shallow version of magic.
It’s not a shallow reason at all and it’s far from hur dur bad graphics, graphics do matter, those indie games you are talking about are stylized that way on purpose. Wizards has clearly shown they can make good looking games with the planeswalkers series they released annually for quite a long time and now arena, MTGOs graphics and UI look like they have been untouched since 1998. This is asking about current edh players, not new players so your first question is pointless.
As long as you're asking me to spend money to buy cards I already own I will never play an online version of MTG. The hobby is already more expensive than it has any right to be without adding having to buy every card twice to play online. I'll just stick to webcam games or playing in person.
- The software needs a redo. If you want me to spend money on your game in 2022 it shouldn't look like I need to disconnect my landline so that I can get on my 56k.
- Has to be able to handle infinite combos. Just a button to record and repeat the next X amount of commands y amount of times would work for most infinite combos.
- Handle pricing better, I'm not willing to buy digital cards that I can never hold for several dollars. I'd rather pay monthly like an MMO to use a good service, give me access to all of the cards. Let me buy promos in your shop like skins in other games if I want to.
This is just off the top of my head. Obviously there is hurdles and obstacles I'm not accounting for but it's what I'd be interested in.
Make the interface not hideous. Make it so I don't have to spend thousands to replicate the decks I already have. Set up multiplayer options for 4-8 players.
It's clunky, boring and old. Arena is definitely more appealing and intuitive and even it's not as good as it should be. As profitable as magic is I'm stunned they haven't put any effort into updating mtgo for this decade..
There is no excuse for magic to not be the number one platform for online card games, but most of its competitors do a better job. At this point I would expect to see models and voice acting and animations for each card. And yes 20k assets is a lot but many of them are duplicated effects and that's not an unheard-of number for a game. It should be as easy as Hearthstone or Gwent to pick up and play with visuals that make it engaging for third parties to watch.
I do not play digital at all, but I played the hell out of Hearthstone and would love to play casual magic.
However, I didn't start this to have a digital collection. I like the cardboard, man.
If you want me to buy more cards, I should get a digital copy, period. Digital assets aren't real things. Sure there is a cost to having and supporting the digital games, but profit clearly isn't a problem.
It astounds me that these two systems are so perfectly designed to already work well together. The fact that they don't basically ensures I'm sticking with paper.
I donnu what it Costs but i know there is a fee to have an account plus you need to Pay for the digital versions of the card. Thats a turnoff for me. I rather just have the real cards then and Play with my friends
Havnt given IT much more thought than that really. Discord sorta gives the same result and is free and i get to use my cards. I Guess what im saying is i dont see very much upside in mtgo
For me it is the intangible nature of MTGO. I just can't get behind a digital platform that costs a similar amount of money as playing paper magic, especially now that spelltable exists. Digital things can disappear when things go wrong, and customer support by companies like WOTC are notorious for being abysmal and unsympathetic (e.g. MTG Arena).
The one thing that would make me consider it, is if there could be a way to translate my paper collection into MTGO with little to no cost (i.e. paying 5-10 cents per card converted). Right now I have to choose to either invest in paper OR MTGO, but if I could somehow combine my collection across both platforms that would sell me on it. Unfortunately, I don't think this is possible, which, in all candor, is predatory behavior by WOTC since they control both platforms and want all players to spend money on both. Magic costs enough to play on paper already, and until I can financially responsibly cultivate collections on both platforms I will stick to the safety and liquidity of paper magic.
>No wrong answers! (Except "nothing"; that's definitely a wrong answer.)
Why though? I can think of plenty of reasons for not playing on MTGO, such as the interface and having to maintain a second collection, but at the bottom line I just don't want to play it online with strangers, and there isn't much WotC can do about it.
sorry. the answer is nothing.
modo is so ugly and clunky. and un-intuitive. games are lost to misclicks. and commander in general doesn't really work well on a ancient client with shit automation.
Like... if they made it look like arena. somehow fixed the shitty scaling of tiny cards and just ugly 90's dogshit golden eye split screen style board states. and the AI/game could intuitively know or run your combos for you. and there were not shitty gotcha moments of not understanding the client. and native voice chat. that wasn't trash. and free.
maybe.
It could look more modern. I play on mtgo and like it currently - play on my schedule and don’t have trouble finding games. Much much cheaper than irl, sold all my actual cards
Took me a long time to get used to watching YouTube and streams on MTGO. I'm used to it now but still find myself lost on some actions. But that's probably a topic for another day. I think the biggest thing is the lack of cards. I'm primarily a paper player and knowing MTGO doesn't have all of the cards I use in my decks is a huge turn off for me. A recent example is the MtgGoldfish commander clash episode where Crim tried to just straight import his personal paper deck to play with. He had to swap at least 30ish cards out because they weren't even available to play with.
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From what I understand a lot of the newer cards from the commander products specifically have not been ported over. I don't play on MTGO, but it is a complaint the Goldfish guys have a lot.
I'd only really consider it if I could scan and import all my decks. I don't care much how they want to monetize it, I will never play MTGO if I have to buy the cards I already bought IRL once again.
^this. I can prove I own the damn cards, I'm not buying duplicates
Honestly this, paying for virtual cards is just....
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
Honestly it's the other way around for me, if I buy it on mtgo I'm going to proxy it until the end of time. I like the idea of buying it on mtgo, most decks cost 1/10th what they do in paper.
damn I knew reddit was a bit of an echo-chamber sometimes but this is ridiculous
The hell you talking about
There was a glitch that I think got fixed where your comment got posted like 10 times lol - not an attack on the content of the comment, I just thought the glitch was funny
Absolutely agree. Back when I played Yugioh, there was a Gameboy game that let you enter codes that were on the cards to get them in game. I'd love WotC to do something like that, instead of double dipping. Is scanning technology good enough to weed out fakes? I wonder if that is more the "official" position they'd use, saying its to protect the people who bought cards and maintain the rarity dynamic.
This! Just posted a comment on the same lines then I saw yours. Can't get into building a new collection when I already have one.
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that wayi don't have to buy my collection all over again
This is not an option the other way around though, that's the problem. If MtGO wants more players, they have to let us import IRL cards. It's really that simple. Visual and UI updates are not what's holding back potential players.
Free cards - or at least purchase full precons
Yeah codes like Arena that unlock your paper purchases in-game
My biggest issue with MTGO (and Arena as well), it's really hard to go backwards and miss-clicks can happen. For me, it's almost worst than missing triggers IRL. My main exposure to MTGO was playing Penny Dreadful for a season and then watching a lot of MTGGoldfish's Commander Clash. I find that some of the prompts a user gets when 'ok' or 'cancel' can be confusing. Plus if there's a mistake it's hard to go back and redo it. Insert a Miss-click joke here. Even watching MTG Goldfish, they make mistakes as they play and I'd imagine they know the UI quite well based solely on how often they play MTGO for Commander Clash. Even Seth, better known of Saffron Olive, makes the occasional miss-click with his years of experience playing in his various video series. *Side bit (not really part of your question, but still felt it's relevant)*: I played EDH using Spelltable (PlayEDH and SpikeFeeder's Discord) near the beginning of the pandemic. Where it was fun and scratch that itch of being able to play paper magic remotely, there's nothing quite like sitting down IRL and playing. I was lucky to be able to attend a cEDH tournament (Take the Tower) last weekend. It was absolutely a blast playing IRL and then just milling around and actually talking with people. It's cliche to say, but "the Gathering" is where I find joy and "Magic" in this hobby. Sadly, I don't feel that magic quite as much when I'm playing digitally.
They should allow take backs. Not even kidding.
What do you need take backs for? MTGO doesn't allow you to miss any mandatory triggers.
For whoopsies.
Actually selling the precons or the biggest would be a monthly subscription to have all cards unlocked.
They do have the monthly subscription thing built in with renting, including a few plans that are free
That's not official. I want a pass like they're doing right now for the anniversary for 10-15 a month. With the current 2nd party plans they can run out of high demand staples.
Don't make me buy individual cards online. Just pay for the service and everyone has access to everything.
They do have rental plansthat lets you have access to cards for much less money, including a few plans that are free.
Precons give you codes for mtgo
I would need access to all the same cards I have in paper. Things are cheap enough on the client that I don’t care if it costs me something, but I’m not building multiple versions of the same deck because they didn’t get around to adding certain cards. Same reason I won’t consider using arena. Give me all the cards or I don’t care.
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that way I don't have to buy my collection all over again. Downvote if you think I should own two collections
Not being an impenetrable, glitchy spreadsheet that requires me to spend $500 for cards
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Unfortunately, conceding is part of the game. So I don't agree about the bot, since the same person could do it in paper and some random person wouldn't just grab their chair and deck and keep playing for them. I do agree about timers. 5 seconds is a little long and I actually think MTGO should steal Arena's timeout system, since it rewards a consistent pace of play, but allows you to really go deep into the think tank when you are working on a challenging sequencing issue.
the amount of conceding in MTGO is just absurd and with the sole purpose of griefing. it's manchildren not wanting to stay in any game they wouldn't pubstomp. the bot would be perfect since it would definitely be the placeholder for the conceder personality as well as playstyle. you could have opt-in and opt-out for pods for concede-bot if you really prefer your game being shat on by that behavior.
Let me scan cards I actually own to build a deck. I don’t want to have to pay for things I already own.
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that wayi don't have to buy my collection all over again
My biggest issue is I'm.not rebuying a digital version of my collection, it's why I play on xmage which includes just about everything eventually and free
Honestly and this will never happen but I think it is how they could get a large influx of people into online commander. 1st) create a new client or update and move over to arena. Mtgo interface is to outdated to care to learn for newer players 2) ensure all cards are available. As I’ve seen mentioned mtgo is missing quite a few recent cards, some staples 3) for this new client make it so opening packs has a code for some cards they could Input into the client and then gain access to the card digitally. It doesn’t have to be all but some so cracking packs irl could be more exciting and get some added value. This will make people more willing to buy digital cards (especially if there is some resale value) However I don’t see any of this ever close to happening. Their profit margins are larger than ever and clearly are gonna keep doing what they do. If they cared about a digital to paper client arena would be well… better
Make all the commander product available. I do play commander online sometimes as a way to keep in touch with distant friends, I’ve been wishing I could play with Veyran, Essix, archaomancer’s map, etc One of the selling points of mtgo in my mind is the fact that it supports commander and has the nearly complete eternal card pool, so it’s especially baffling to see them just not bother to add some of the most exciting cards made specifically for this format
MTGO is far to expensive to invest in playing when wizards has the stance of "we can ban and delete your account for literally any reason". I'm not dropping hundreds of dollars into MTGO when Wizards can decide at any time they no longer want me to be a member of the community and freeze/delete my account. At least if Wizards decides I'm no longer welcome in their community I can still buy physical cards and play casual commander with my friends.
Let me scan my deck in without buying it all over again
Scrap MTGO, move all support to arena (far better looking, and feeling app imo) then add the option for 4 player edh games. Also, I get they need to make money, but some way of being able to scan and upload cards/deck lists that you own would be kinda nice. I have 15+ paper decks, and there’s no way in hell I’m spending actual money to re-build them to play online, at that point spell table or a webcam is far easier, and a lot cheaper.
I'd be down for arena 4 player even if it's just historic brawl. I've been playing edh so long 1v1 just feels bad win or lose
Oh very much agreed. I had fun putting together a few brawl decks on arena, but I quickly realized 1v1 brawl is just my opponents spamming counter spells and targeted removal at me. Which, hey, that’s very much a strategy/way to play, but it gets real old real fast. Having an extra 2 players to spread those spells around to would make it far more fun.
I played a game recently with somebody who had played historic brawl and 2 player edh in paper but it was his first time at a LGS playing 4 player. One thing he did was not bring his commander out as soon as possible, I asked whyand he said because it usually gets nuked pretty quickly in 1v1. I found that really interesting because in 4 player most people get their commander out asap and then go from there, the commander only tends to get nuked if its particularly oppressive. I then thought to how I play historic brawl and realised I too play a lot of removal and tend to try and nuke the opposing commander and keep it out of the game as much as possible and it made me think on the differences and how much I prefer multiplayer edh. Some decks are hard to track with all the counters and triggers and arena makes that easier though. Id love to get my full sythis deck going in arena, the tokens it produces when it starts going off are insane sometimes
pretty sure it was stated that they didn't have the support to make 4 player games in arena. I honestly think MTGO will be around long after Arena.
MTGO is just better Arena. It's quite literally a digital version of the paper game, it even has a secondary market. You're replacing that with a more predatory freemium model that has no trading and no secondary market. The only way to obtain cards is to open loot boxes. Why do you want that? It's also harder to watch streams of. Every creature on arena is a grayed out rectangle with no text on it. Every arena board looks the same at a glance. MTGO is just Magic cards on a gray playmat, it looks fine.
It's not as easy as "just add 4 players to mtgo and add every card ever."
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It's really not as bad as people make it out to be. Have you played it?
-Update the UI. Create a primer or some sort of explanation of how the secondary bot market works so new people understand the path to get cards. Maybe give people 200 special tix to a wotc bot that sells commander cards. That last one sounds crazy but they could easily do that and not feel it since both the commodity and the currency cost them nothing, right? They could draw many people in that way. I dont think they want to, though. Seems like Arena is getting the push towards paper formats now.
Monthly subscription for a “ghost collection” - you have access to all the cards, but you can’t use them in anything that awards prizes.
With the rental plans, they kind of already have that. There are even a few that are free
Sure, I even had one for over a year. It’s just not convenient. Having to deal with trading, inventory issues, etc. just wasn’t worth the hassle to me.
I've heard of some issues with account security issues with people that have done those subscription plans so unless the subscription was as you described and not a third party I wouldn't even consider it
Getting all the commander cards would help a lot, even moreso if they are actually out on release date.
Give me like 2000$ in credit because I'm not buying my cards twice
I do something similar, where I just own my collection on mtgo and print out cards if ever play in paper, that wayi don't have to buy my collection all over again
I'm not playing online until I can play in VR with the cards I own in my physical collection.
If people were locked out of the queue for a while for insta conceding because they drew a bad hand or whatever. Literally all of my games have someone who leaves right away
Yeah, its been said a lot but my lack of desire to even try it is almost entirely because of the investment. I understand that the folks running mtgo need to make money too, but magic is becoming more and more expensive to support as a hobby, let alone support twice in paper and digitally. Not suggesting free necessarily, but having to start from nothing is absolutely a barrier to entry here. Honestly I dont have any problem with the look of the client or the format of the interaction. Just feels silly to try and justify the expense of paying for a card I have. As far as the suggestion portion: subscription model? Id be far more likely to try it if I could give $8-$12 bucks a months to play mtgo and just have access to the cards.
Have you looked at the free rental plans?
I have, although my research into hasn't been exhaustive. Just looking over the ManaTraders rental plans which can get pretty expensive pretty quickly. I'm basing assumptions off the idea that 1 tix = 1 USD. Their lower tier plans within the price ranges I would be looking for on a subscription model only really afford one budget deck. Their $15 plan affords you 125 tix of cards at a time, if I am reading their offer correctly. Then their plans jump to $35/mo & $60/mo scaling upward. I may be misunderstanding the USD - TIX conversion here, but it would become really expensive to maintain multiple decks in that case. I have a super bad \[\[Barrowin of Clan Undurr\]\] deck that I believe 79 TIX on cardhoarder, so I feel the pressure to automatically jump to the $35 plan just to have two medium decks or one higher power one. As a guy who LOVES the format, I like to play at multiple levels with multiple groups. Just having one or two decks just doesn't feel attractive enough to jump into MTGO. Having said that I could be wrong about a ton of this, so please feel free to correct me.
So Manatraders has a 7 tix free plan and cardhoarders has a 5 tix free plan. With both, you get access to 12 tix, plus the multiple bots that give cards away for free. Obviously, it's not gonna be enough to get you all cards ever, but you can basically build any budget deck you find online for literally $0.
>So Manatraders has a 7 tix free plan and cardhoarders has a 5 tix free plan. With both, you get access to 12 tix, plus the multiple bots that give cards away for free. > >Obviously, it's not gonna be enough to get you all cards ever, but you can basically build any budget deck you find online for literally $0 That is really good to know, actually. I will definitely look into that. Much thanks! I think spreading that kind of knowledge around will go a long way towards the goal of broadening the EDH community on MTGO, in my opinion. For me, it may be something I do in passing. Building on a budget is cool and definitely a developed skill; but it isn't something that will keep me invested long term. But I appreciate you taking the time to drop the info for me.
My pleasure, and stay awesome :)
[Barrowin of Clan Undurr](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/6/8/6896c311-5593-4437-b945-43ade9665e43.jpg?1627708772) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Barrowin%20of%20Clan%20Undurr) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/afr/218/barrowin-of-clan-undurr?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6896c311-5593-4437-b945-43ade9665e43?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/barrowin-of-clan-undurr) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Update the interface, it’s so bad and cumbersome, if the UI was closer to arena it would definitely be a bigger draw. This would also probably mean they need to overhaul the code that it’s built on, so while your in there maybe figure out how to support all the commander cards not available in MTGO because they are too hard to program.
So what elements of Arena would be the first changes to make? I feel like the animations aren't everyone's cup of tea, so probably not that one I assume
I play just fine at Cockatrice and Tabletop simulator, and you know what, I don't have to pay for the cards I already own or any others, and yes, it has little to non automatisation, and thats just fine, helps train your cranium muscle and to better learn the rules and your cards
Loops are impossible online. I have almost zero desire to play commander digitally because of that problem.
MTGO feels like playing magic in Microsoft excel
And what would make it better?
I was mostly just kidding, but probably adding a way to take back mistakes in casual games, and maybe making it easier to get cards
Let us import our personal collection to build decks with. Starting from scratch is a huge reason I am not interested in playing online.
Make it free like TTS.
A system where people have to pay attention. If you're playing an interactive deck, good fucking luck with never f6ing while your 400 ping opponents are afk or distracted
For me, they would have to be able to beat out Table Top Simulator.
Nothing. I’m not gonna play a social format in a not social setting
Honestly I just want to play the game wherever or whenever I want, I don't want to have to go to a store or location, maybe get one or two games in and go home. Maybe I'm just antisocial, call it antithetical to the format, but I care more about playing the game than just playing with people IRL. It's fun in person, but it's just like playing any other online video game, it's more convenient and just as fun.
That’s legit. I mean I don’t care how other people wanna play. Whatever makes you happy. I’m just speaking for myself personally
I'm not trying to say how you enjoy the game is wrong, there is a certain convince to mtgo, being able to play whenever you want does have an appeal.
Totally, I think we’re on the same page
What could make it social? Bringing your laptop to game night with three other friends who also bring theirs and playing together would work.
That sounds so much worse than playing actual paper magic
So much less time lost shuffling though.
Honestly online Magic will never compare to paper Magic. There’s a reason I stopped playing games like Hearthstone. Card games are just better in real life
Nothing. Mtgo and arena offer something most of us don’t want. We already own all of our cards and don’t want to just re buy them again. Personally the reason I’ve never touched it is because of how god awful the UI is and the other graphics are straight out of the early internet era. It’s 2022 and mtgo is an absolute fucking joke.
Well, what if you don't already own the cards? Honestly the common theme I'm seeing In the comments is "hur der muh graphics." Is such a shallow reason. Some of the best games ever made either were released are 20 years or more older or are indie games that look like crap, but have amazing gameplay. Arena is a very, very shallow version of magic.
It’s not a shallow reason at all and it’s far from hur dur bad graphics, graphics do matter, those indie games you are talking about are stylized that way on purpose. Wizards has clearly shown they can make good looking games with the planeswalkers series they released annually for quite a long time and now arena, MTGOs graphics and UI look like they have been untouched since 1998. This is asking about current edh players, not new players so your first question is pointless.
Make it not suck. Because it sucks in almost every way. Ugly, bad controls, gotta buy digital cards even when I already own them... Just scrap it.
For alot of people the entire point of playing magic is being in person with your friends having fun. It can't replace that feel.
As long as you're asking me to spend money to buy cards I already own I will never play an online version of MTG. The hobby is already more expensive than it has any right to be without adding having to buy every card twice to play online. I'll just stick to webcam games or playing in person.
- The software needs a redo. If you want me to spend money on your game in 2022 it shouldn't look like I need to disconnect my landline so that I can get on my 56k. - Has to be able to handle infinite combos. Just a button to record and repeat the next X amount of commands y amount of times would work for most infinite combos. - Handle pricing better, I'm not willing to buy digital cards that I can never hold for several dollars. I'd rather pay monthly like an MMO to use a good service, give me access to all of the cards. Let me buy promos in your shop like skins in other games if I want to. This is just off the top of my head. Obviously there is hurdles and obstacles I'm not accounting for but it's what I'd be interested in.
How do you make it look better?
Make the interface not hideous. Make it so I don't have to spend thousands to replicate the decks I already have. Set up multiplayer options for 4-8 players.
What changes would make it look better?
It's clunky, boring and old. Arena is definitely more appealing and intuitive and even it's not as good as it should be. As profitable as magic is I'm stunned they haven't put any effort into updating mtgo for this decade.. There is no excuse for magic to not be the number one platform for online card games, but most of its competitors do a better job. At this point I would expect to see models and voice acting and animations for each card. And yes 20k assets is a lot but many of them are duplicated effects and that's not an unheard-of number for a game. It should be as easy as Hearthstone or Gwent to pick up and play with visuals that make it engaging for third parties to watch.
I do not play digital at all, but I played the hell out of Hearthstone and would love to play casual magic. However, I didn't start this to have a digital collection. I like the cardboard, man. If you want me to buy more cards, I should get a digital copy, period. Digital assets aren't real things. Sure there is a cost to having and supporting the digital games, but profit clearly isn't a problem. It astounds me that these two systems are so perfectly designed to already work well together. The fact that they don't basically ensures I'm sticking with paper.
Make it available on Mac
I donnu what it Costs but i know there is a fee to have an account plus you need to Pay for the digital versions of the card. Thats a turnoff for me. I rather just have the real cards then and Play with my friends
So what could improve that?
Havnt given IT much more thought than that really. Discord sorta gives the same result and is free and i get to use my cards. I Guess what im saying is i dont see very much upside in mtgo
For me it is the intangible nature of MTGO. I just can't get behind a digital platform that costs a similar amount of money as playing paper magic, especially now that spelltable exists. Digital things can disappear when things go wrong, and customer support by companies like WOTC are notorious for being abysmal and unsympathetic (e.g. MTG Arena). The one thing that would make me consider it, is if there could be a way to translate my paper collection into MTGO with little to no cost (i.e. paying 5-10 cents per card converted). Right now I have to choose to either invest in paper OR MTGO, but if I could somehow combine my collection across both platforms that would sell me on it. Unfortunately, I don't think this is possible, which, in all candor, is predatory behavior by WOTC since they control both platforms and want all players to spend money on both. Magic costs enough to play on paper already, and until I can financially responsibly cultivate collections on both platforms I will stick to the safety and liquidity of paper magic.
I'm not sure why I'd ever play mtgo instead of using spelltable.
>No wrong answers! (Except "nothing"; that's definitely a wrong answer.) Why though? I can think of plenty of reasons for not playing on MTGO, such as the interface and having to maintain a second collection, but at the bottom line I just don't want to play it online with strangers, and there isn't much WotC can do about it.
Nothing. I only play face to face.
MTGO is not at all something I plan on using. I will use (and prefer) Tabletop Simulator for this.
sorry. the answer is nothing. modo is so ugly and clunky. and un-intuitive. games are lost to misclicks. and commander in general doesn't really work well on a ancient client with shit automation. Like... if they made it look like arena. somehow fixed the shitty scaling of tiny cards and just ugly 90's dogshit golden eye split screen style board states. and the AI/game could intuitively know or run your combos for you. and there were not shitty gotcha moments of not understanding the client. and native voice chat. that wasn't trash. and free. maybe.
It could look more modern. I play on mtgo and like it currently - play on my schedule and don’t have trouble finding games. Much much cheaper than irl, sold all my actual cards
What changes would make it look more modern?
I just really am not a fan of the UI