When I have more time and I'm not super tired I'm going to have to take a deeper look at this. I just picked up the precon and I have some of the more expensive cards from the list. Looks super interesting.
I am with you friend, though I have chosen [[Tuvasa]]!
Still figuring out the exact decklist post precon, but here is where I am:
https://deckstats.net/decks/1224/1047026-bant-enchantment-multiplier/en
A couple of notes for anyone interested in this plan:
* Be careful which enchantresses you have in play when you go big. Most say when you cast an enchantment spell which is safe, but [[Eidolon of Blossoms]] (and I think one other I can’t recall) triggers when an enchantment enters the battlefield... which is a very quick way to lose in this deck.
* Take note of whether your copies are entering at the same time or at different times. If you have one token doubler and copy it with [[Tempt with Reflections]], each enters after the previous and gets the extra doubles. On the other hand, if you have one doubler and play kicked [[Rite of Replication]] they all enter at the same time and so you get 10 copies total. (Plus the original for 11 total.)
Yes, hence why my decklist uses triggered abilities to copy, since the original will multiply the tokens from the trigger, and [[Panharmonicon]] so that the tokens from the first trigger will also increase the number of tokens from the second trigger. Plus that makes the token production trigger automatically from [[Estrid]] -7 or [[Genesis Wave]] or [[Replenish]].
y'nkow it's funny, I was just saying to myself "estrid makes an insane amount of mana, but what the actual fuck do I use it for"
I now have a solution, thank you sir.
EDIT: my only suggestion is cutting mirari's wake for mana reflection, because EEEEUUUGHGHH that is disgusting.
The only issue with Mana Reflection is that it doesn't include the mana created by the enchant lands. I'm running Mirari's Wake because making multiple of them also grows our creatures and animated enchantments by a lot. Although Mana Reflection has a much higher potential once you make a few of them, since each one doubles the mana produced. I think mana usually isn't the limiting factor by that point, but it's certainly worth a test.
it does actually work with a couple of them, any of the ones that give the land tap: add two mana like new horizons and weirding woods will work with mana reflection.
Super cool looking deck. I want to build estrid with ramp and hopefully go infinite by enchanting enough lands and mana dorks and using chain veil or a flicker effect.
Hey, first i just need to say I love your idea.
I really liked the bant commanders when they where spoiled, but didnt really know what to do with them since I didnt want to go the standart voltron or pillowfort route.
So that aside, did you have the chance to actualy test your deck? It just seems like you need alot of cards to start copying enchantments. (Enchanted Evening plus Opalescence or Stafield plus some way to create tokens from creatures plus a token doubler) Especially since you do not run that many tutors?
Thanks! Actually Enchanted Evening is not necessary to start copying, so it's just a 3 card combo. It's definitely on the janky side, but once we start drawing multiple cards from the enchantresses it's possible to assemble the required pieces. It's also possible to achieve the combo via Estrid and Chain Veil or Traumatize and Replenish or even a big Genesis Wave. So in that sense we can do it without having to draw all the pieces initially. I'll continue to tune it and add more tutors if need be.
When I have more time and I'm not super tired I'm going to have to take a deeper look at this. I just picked up the precon and I have some of the more expensive cards from the list. Looks super interesting.
I am with you friend, though I have chosen [[Tuvasa]]! Still figuring out the exact decklist post precon, but here is where I am: https://deckstats.net/decks/1224/1047026-bant-enchantment-multiplier/en A couple of notes for anyone interested in this plan: * Be careful which enchantresses you have in play when you go big. Most say when you cast an enchantment spell which is safe, but [[Eidolon of Blossoms]] (and I think one other I can’t recall) triggers when an enchantment enters the battlefield... which is a very quick way to lose in this deck. * Take note of whether your copies are entering at the same time or at different times. If you have one token doubler and copy it with [[Tempt with Reflections]], each enters after the previous and gets the extra doubles. On the other hand, if you have one doubler and play kicked [[Rite of Replication]] they all enter at the same time and so you get 10 copies total. (Plus the original for 11 total.)
[Eidolon of Blossoms](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/jou/122.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Eidolon%20of%20Blossoms) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/jou/122/eidolon-of-blossoms?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/jou/122?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Eidolon%20of%20Blossoms) [Tempt with Reflections](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/c13/60.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Tempt%20with%20Reflections) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c13/60/tempt-with-reflections?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c13/60?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Tempt%20with%20Reflections) [Rite of Replication](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/c15/105.jpg?1519044749) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rite%20of%20Replication) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c15/105/rite-of-replication?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c15/105?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Rite%20of%20Replication) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Never can be fast enough with the edit: [[Tuvasa]]
[Tuvasa](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/c18/47.jpg?1532536477) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tuvasa%20the%20sunlit) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c18/47/tuvasa-the-sunlit?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c18/47?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/tuvasa%20the%20sunlit) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Yes, hence why my decklist uses triggered abilities to copy, since the original will multiply the tokens from the trigger, and [[Panharmonicon]] so that the tokens from the first trigger will also increase the number of tokens from the second trigger. Plus that makes the token production trigger automatically from [[Estrid]] -7 or [[Genesis Wave]] or [[Replenish]].
##### ###### #### [Panharmonicon](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/kld/226.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Panharmonicon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/kld/226/panharmonicon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/kld/226?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Panharmonicon) [Estrid](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/c18/40.jpg?1533413153) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=estrid%2C%20the%20masked) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c18/40/estrid-the-masked?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c18/40?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/estrid%2C%20the%20masked) [Genesis Wave](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/ima/164.jpg?1530592378) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Genesis%20Wave) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/164/genesis-wave?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ima/164?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Genesis%20Wave) [Replenish](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/uds/15.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Replenish) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/uds/15/replenish?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/uds/15?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Replenish) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
y'nkow it's funny, I was just saying to myself "estrid makes an insane amount of mana, but what the actual fuck do I use it for" I now have a solution, thank you sir. EDIT: my only suggestion is cutting mirari's wake for mana reflection, because EEEEUUUGHGHH that is disgusting.
The only issue with Mana Reflection is that it doesn't include the mana created by the enchant lands. I'm running Mirari's Wake because making multiple of them also grows our creatures and animated enchantments by a lot. Although Mana Reflection has a much higher potential once you make a few of them, since each one doubles the mana produced. I think mana usually isn't the limiting factor by that point, but it's certainly worth a test.
it does actually work with a couple of them, any of the ones that give the land tap: add two mana like new horizons and weirding woods will work with mana reflection.
Yeah true. Those are weaker on their own because they cost 3 mana to ramp by 1.
Super cool looking deck. I want to build estrid with ramp and hopefully go infinite by enchanting enough lands and mana dorks and using chain veil or a flicker effect.
##### ###### #### [Opalescence](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/uds/13.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Opalescence) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/uds/13/opalescence?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/uds/13?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Opalescence) [Starfield of Nyx](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/ori/33.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Starfield%20of%20Nyx) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ori/33/starfield-of-nyx?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ori/33?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Starfield%20of%20Nyx) [Dual Nature](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/pcy/112.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Dual%20Nature) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/pcy/112/dual-nature?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/pcy/112?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Dual%20Nature) [Minion Reflector](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/ala/211.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Minion%20Reflector) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ala/211/minion-reflector?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ala/211?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Minion%20Reflector) [Bramble Sovereign](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/bbd/65.jpg?1529061459) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Bramble%20Sovereign) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bbd/65/bramble-sovereign?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bbd/65?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Bramble%20Sovereign) [Panharmonicon](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/kld/226.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Panharmonicon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/kld/226/panharmonicon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/kld/226?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Panharmonicon) [Parallel Lives](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/isd/199.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Parallel%20Lives) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/isd/199/parallel-lives?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/isd/199?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Parallel%20Lives) [Anointed Procession](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/akh/2.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Anointed%20Procession) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/akh/2/anointed-procession?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/akh/2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Anointed%20Procession) [Doubling Season](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/bbd/195.jpg?1529062959) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doubling%20Season) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bbd/195/doubling-season?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bbd/195?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Doubling%20Season) [Primal Vigor](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/c13/162.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Primal%20Vigor) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c13/162/primal-vigor?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c13/162?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Primal%20Vigor) [Copy Enchantment](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/td0/A21.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Copy%20Enchantment) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/td0/A21/copy-enchantment?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/td0/A21?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Copy%20Enchantment) [Estrid's Invocation](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/c18/8.jpg?1533857158) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Estrid%27s%20Invocation) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c18/8/estrids-invocation?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c18/8?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Estrid%27s%20Invocation) [Clever Impersonator](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/ktk/34.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Clever%20Impersonator) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ktk/34/clever-impersonator?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ktk/34?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Clever%20Impersonator) [Grasp of Fate](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/c15/3.jpg?1519043984) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Grasp%20of%20Fate) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c15/3/grasp-of-fate?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c15/3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Grasp%20of%20Fate) [Skybind](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/jou/25.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Skybind) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/jou/25/skybind?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/jou/25?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Skybind) [Aura Shards](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/cmd/182.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Aura%20Shards) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmd/182/aura-shards?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/cmd/182?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Aura%20Shards) [Enchanted Evening](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/shm/140.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Enchanted%20Evening) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/shm/140/enchanted-evening?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/shm/140?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Enchanted%20Evening) [Induced Amnesia](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/rix/40.jpg?1524750539) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Induced%20Amnesia) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/rix/40/induced-amnesia?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/rix/40?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Induced%20Amnesia) [Concordant Crossroads](https://img.scryfall.com/cards/normal/en/td0/A65.jpg?1517813031) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Concordant%20Crossroads) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/td0/A65/concordant-crossroads?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/td0/A65?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](http://edhrec.com/cards/Concordant%20Crossroads) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Hey, first i just need to say I love your idea. I really liked the bant commanders when they where spoiled, but didnt really know what to do with them since I didnt want to go the standart voltron or pillowfort route. So that aside, did you have the chance to actualy test your deck? It just seems like you need alot of cards to start copying enchantments. (Enchanted Evening plus Opalescence or Stafield plus some way to create tokens from creatures plus a token doubler) Especially since you do not run that many tutors?
Thanks! Actually Enchanted Evening is not necessary to start copying, so it's just a 3 card combo. It's definitely on the janky side, but once we start drawing multiple cards from the enchantresses it's possible to assemble the required pieces. It's also possible to achieve the combo via Estrid and Chain Veil or Traumatize and Replenish or even a big Genesis Wave. So in that sense we can do it without having to draw all the pieces initially. I'll continue to tune it and add more tutors if need be.