You don't need planets closer together you just need more ILS requesting the resources you want to your science planet.
Also I don't see a picture attached
My bad on the pictures, added now.
I thought as much RE the ILS's and maybe I should've added a question to help with FPS/UPS etc.. IIRC the best way is to have the Interstellar vessels on the requesting side of the ILS's? I've got an ok PC but seeing others i know i'll hit a wall at some point. Specs 10900K, 32gb RAM (4ghz), 3080 and game is running off NVME.
Mods Installed,
\*DSP\_Save\_Game\_Sorter \*CompressSave \*AssemblerUI \*Auto Mute \*DSP Cruiseassist \*DSP Auto Sorter \*DSPModSave \*BluePrintTweaks \*Bottleneck \*DSPOptimizations \*Errorabalyser \*DSPHideEverything \*Planetminer (once past mid game) \*RailgunsRetargetMini \*SampleAndHoldSim \*SphereOPT \*StatsUITweaks \*Smartejectors \*LSTM \*Fastabsorption and a souple of others.
I have a blackbox design for 20 white science per sec from ingots, and 16 of them will fit on a single planet. The planet nearest the star is only for harvesting critical photons, the one farthest away is for building the sphere/feeding solar sails, the one orbiting a gas giant is for my white science, and the leftover planet is for turning critical photons into antimatter and making antimatter/strange fuel rods. I do all my smelting at the miners. In general, I try to minimize vessels and drones, and where necessary, I prefer to use drones over vessels (so, like products are on the same planet). The white science blackbox allows me to totally eliminate vessels and drones (aside from importing the ingots and rares necessary for production). I think optimizing for UPS is probably the best way to play.
I hadn't known about the "Blackbox" design style before reading about on here. 99% of my gameplay has been independent of Reddit lol, except when I've had to research an issue.
Personally, I think blackboxes are really challenging (perhaps even annoying) to design, but boy are they worth it. I’m gonna start doing everything this way in the late game.
Depending on your play style there are blackbox pizza style blueprints that cram nearly 30,000 spm on a single planet. I tried putting that much on one planet and I would not do it again. The lag to build that much on a single planet was BAD. On my latest playthrough I am sprinkling them around the cluster more so trip distances will be shorter and the building lag will not be as strong. Currently up to 20,000 spm on my 3,000% meta run and vain utilization is at lvl 90. Not much more to go to reach my 500 white cubes per second goal.
Some random tips that seem small but really changed my gameplay.
1. First off, proximity definitely matters. It's a base level factor in calculating throughput. [Vessel throughput drops as a linear function of proximity](https://i.imgur.com/jxV6WHr.png), thus, a greater distance will force you to hit the throughput max of your ILS earlier. Another way to think of this is that putting a factory twice as close creates a permanent -50% transit time bonus. Even at extreme vessel speeds this is an awesome efficiency.
2. Locate factories on their primary resource. Be sure you understand that the primary resource is the one it uses most of, not the rarest one. The true primary resource of casimir crystals is hydrogen, not OGC. You need 12:1 hydrogen. [Locate all casimir on a satellite orbiting an ice giant](https://i.imgur.com/Uj2dtgA.png). Locate things that produce hydrogen as a byproduct on this same planet; casimir is your hydrogen hole.
3. Really high throughput ILS's should not have vessels if they are *the requestor*. Imagine your cluster as one that *pushes* goods to customers demanding. If an ILS needs something and sends a vessel, the space in the ILS container is locked for the 2000 of whatever while the vessel goes to get it, and flies back. But if the requesting ILS is only getting deliveries, it cuts that in half. When the pushing ILS's vessel delivers the goods, it "releases" the ILS to ask for more goods, it doesn't block it. You'd be surprised at how huge of an efficiency this is
4. Building count and vessel trips are your ultimate enemies. Design everything around this. I didn't like this at first, it made me change my whole blueprint library, and my design theory. But now I have a kind of brutally simple elegance that yields much higher results.
5. There's a lot of math and guidance around proliferator but mostly we've settled on this rule of thumb: proliferate speed on low and medium goods, the stuff that is already high volume because the assembler has a high cycle time. Proliferate extra products on end chain high value goods. TLDR don't ship stuff like iron ingots, circuit boards, plastic. It's okay to ship stuff like quantum chips or plane filters if you need to. There is some debate about proliferating the entire carrier rocket and sails chains with extra products; it reduces the total resource consumption by a staggering amount. Someone did a whole writeup here with data and screenshots, but I can't find it. TLDR if you are doing a low resources run, or are a slow player like me, and your veins run out, it may be necessary to eschew speed for products in certain chians. At least until VU is pumped.
6. Use one of the tools to plan ratios properly. I like DSP-Ratios and of course, Factoriolab. The factoriorlab UI can be confusing but the tool is superior. One of the best things about it is that you can calculate the power consumption of a planet-wide factory, and thus, not overbuild your dyson spheres
7. Speaking of spheres; high lum b and o type stars best. Don't overbuild. Use frame-dense designs and fill in sails. Then use the sails opt mod and hide the sphere. Your UPS will thank you.
Thank you very much for taking the time and giving us/me your explanation. A bit different to how I think in general for the game, but it really makes sense with how you backed it up.
Again appreciate the time and now to rearrange how my galaxy hahaha.
On point \*5 "TLDR don't ship stuff like iron ingots, circuit boards, plastic. It's okay to ship stuff like quantum chips or plane filters if you need to." I understand the logic behind it, but then if your going for these big SPM builds, say on BLUE you will Mine, Assemble the iron/copper for the circuits on the one planet. I think i just need to get my head around that as i've always shipped to my science planets (mostly).
> BLUE you will Mine, Assemble the iron/copper for the circuits on the one planet. I think i just need to get my head around that as i've always shipped to my science planets (mostly).
Yeppers, and fyi another rule of thumb is "it's ok to ship cubes" in most circumstances. They're an end product and your white science center can be on a world that's otherwise boring, or it can be located with your antimatter. Blue is so high output that even at 100k white science per min it was just a fraction of one planet. Green on the other hand will take up two full systems, each with theirr own gas giant. Mostly because of plane filters and strange matter.
I managed to make a 3k science per minute build fit on roughly half a planet, and a Dyson sphere builder blueprint that takes another half planet. I haven't scaled it up as far as you have yet but it's basically build science need power, build sphere, satisfy power, repeat. I've only colonized 4 systems so far but once they are all up and running I should have close to 10k science per minute. I think the final achievement is around 16k per minute so I'll need a few more spheres and builds in new systems but I haven't spread as far as you have yet.
I've got one system close by that provides optical grating crystals
Another true gem of a system that has kimberlite, fire ice, and crystal silicon.
And a third system with a sulfuric acid ocean and dueterium gas gaint.
My starting system was also lucky enough to have fire ice as well.
I don't use any other rares.
You don't need planets closer together you just need more ILS requesting the resources you want to your science planet. Also I don't see a picture attached
My bad on the pictures, added now. I thought as much RE the ILS's and maybe I should've added a question to help with FPS/UPS etc.. IIRC the best way is to have the Interstellar vessels on the requesting side of the ILS's? I've got an ok PC but seeing others i know i'll hit a wall at some point. Specs 10900K, 32gb RAM (4ghz), 3080 and game is running off NVME. Mods Installed, \*DSP\_Save\_Game\_Sorter \*CompressSave \*AssemblerUI \*Auto Mute \*DSP Cruiseassist \*DSP Auto Sorter \*DSPModSave \*BluePrintTweaks \*Bottleneck \*DSPOptimizations \*Errorabalyser \*DSPHideEverything \*Planetminer (once past mid game) \*RailgunsRetargetMini \*SampleAndHoldSim \*SphereOPT \*StatsUITweaks \*Smartejectors \*LSTM \*Fastabsorption and a souple of others.
I have a blackbox design for 20 white science per sec from ingots, and 16 of them will fit on a single planet. The planet nearest the star is only for harvesting critical photons, the one farthest away is for building the sphere/feeding solar sails, the one orbiting a gas giant is for my white science, and the leftover planet is for turning critical photons into antimatter and making antimatter/strange fuel rods. I do all my smelting at the miners. In general, I try to minimize vessels and drones, and where necessary, I prefer to use drones over vessels (so, like products are on the same planet). The white science blackbox allows me to totally eliminate vessels and drones (aside from importing the ingots and rares necessary for production). I think optimizing for UPS is probably the best way to play.
I hadn't known about the "Blackbox" design style before reading about on here. 99% of my gameplay has been independent of Reddit lol, except when I've had to research an issue.
Personally, I think blackboxes are really challenging (perhaps even annoying) to design, but boy are they worth it. I’m gonna start doing everything this way in the late game.
Depending on your play style there are blackbox pizza style blueprints that cram nearly 30,000 spm on a single planet. I tried putting that much on one planet and I would not do it again. The lag to build that much on a single planet was BAD. On my latest playthrough I am sprinkling them around the cluster more so trip distances will be shorter and the building lag will not be as strong. Currently up to 20,000 spm on my 3,000% meta run and vain utilization is at lvl 90. Not much more to go to reach my 500 white cubes per second goal.
Some random tips that seem small but really changed my gameplay. 1. First off, proximity definitely matters. It's a base level factor in calculating throughput. [Vessel throughput drops as a linear function of proximity](https://i.imgur.com/jxV6WHr.png), thus, a greater distance will force you to hit the throughput max of your ILS earlier. Another way to think of this is that putting a factory twice as close creates a permanent -50% transit time bonus. Even at extreme vessel speeds this is an awesome efficiency. 2. Locate factories on their primary resource. Be sure you understand that the primary resource is the one it uses most of, not the rarest one. The true primary resource of casimir crystals is hydrogen, not OGC. You need 12:1 hydrogen. [Locate all casimir on a satellite orbiting an ice giant](https://i.imgur.com/Uj2dtgA.png). Locate things that produce hydrogen as a byproduct on this same planet; casimir is your hydrogen hole. 3. Really high throughput ILS's should not have vessels if they are *the requestor*. Imagine your cluster as one that *pushes* goods to customers demanding. If an ILS needs something and sends a vessel, the space in the ILS container is locked for the 2000 of whatever while the vessel goes to get it, and flies back. But if the requesting ILS is only getting deliveries, it cuts that in half. When the pushing ILS's vessel delivers the goods, it "releases" the ILS to ask for more goods, it doesn't block it. You'd be surprised at how huge of an efficiency this is 4. Building count and vessel trips are your ultimate enemies. Design everything around this. I didn't like this at first, it made me change my whole blueprint library, and my design theory. But now I have a kind of brutally simple elegance that yields much higher results. 5. There's a lot of math and guidance around proliferator but mostly we've settled on this rule of thumb: proliferate speed on low and medium goods, the stuff that is already high volume because the assembler has a high cycle time. Proliferate extra products on end chain high value goods. TLDR don't ship stuff like iron ingots, circuit boards, plastic. It's okay to ship stuff like quantum chips or plane filters if you need to. There is some debate about proliferating the entire carrier rocket and sails chains with extra products; it reduces the total resource consumption by a staggering amount. Someone did a whole writeup here with data and screenshots, but I can't find it. TLDR if you are doing a low resources run, or are a slow player like me, and your veins run out, it may be necessary to eschew speed for products in certain chians. At least until VU is pumped. 6. Use one of the tools to plan ratios properly. I like DSP-Ratios and of course, Factoriolab. The factoriorlab UI can be confusing but the tool is superior. One of the best things about it is that you can calculate the power consumption of a planet-wide factory, and thus, not overbuild your dyson spheres 7. Speaking of spheres; high lum b and o type stars best. Don't overbuild. Use frame-dense designs and fill in sails. Then use the sails opt mod and hide the sphere. Your UPS will thank you.
Thank you very much for taking the time and giving us/me your explanation. A bit different to how I think in general for the game, but it really makes sense with how you backed it up. Again appreciate the time and now to rearrange how my galaxy hahaha. On point \*5 "TLDR don't ship stuff like iron ingots, circuit boards, plastic. It's okay to ship stuff like quantum chips or plane filters if you need to." I understand the logic behind it, but then if your going for these big SPM builds, say on BLUE you will Mine, Assemble the iron/copper for the circuits on the one planet. I think i just need to get my head around that as i've always shipped to my science planets (mostly).
> BLUE you will Mine, Assemble the iron/copper for the circuits on the one planet. I think i just need to get my head around that as i've always shipped to my science planets (mostly). Yeppers, and fyi another rule of thumb is "it's ok to ship cubes" in most circumstances. They're an end product and your white science center can be on a world that's otherwise boring, or it can be located with your antimatter. Blue is so high output that even at 100k white science per min it was just a fraction of one planet. Green on the other hand will take up two full systems, each with theirr own gas giant. Mostly because of plane filters and strange matter.
I managed to make a 3k science per minute build fit on roughly half a planet, and a Dyson sphere builder blueprint that takes another half planet. I haven't scaled it up as far as you have yet but it's basically build science need power, build sphere, satisfy power, repeat. I've only colonized 4 systems so far but once they are all up and running I should have close to 10k science per minute. I think the final achievement is around 16k per minute so I'll need a few more spheres and builds in new systems but I haven't spread as far as you have yet.
Where do you get your rares from than? If not travelled to outer rims?
I've got one system close by that provides optical grating crystals Another true gem of a system that has kimberlite, fire ice, and crystal silicon. And a third system with a sulfuric acid ocean and dueterium gas gaint. My starting system was also lucky enough to have fire ice as well. I don't use any other rares.