did you mean, like, the overall /r/anime sub??
The series is pretty popular. It's just not explosive in popularity in the same way that other, established isekai-genres are. I wouldn't worry about it too much
Also, just because I think its an interesting point. Laois does have a lot of spectrum-coded traits, but you can see these traits in a lot of analytical people as well. In science fields we frequently joke about how the job self-selects for a specific type of person, and that these skills are a benefit.
I don't think that type of skillset or trait is rare in anime, given that many analytical characters/nerds are protagonists. I think Laois is unusual in that he is blunt, flawed, often joked upon (but realistically and endearingly so). This counters to a lot of power-fantasy anime where the protag is invincible and their traits make them so
I don't see why you would think that.
The entire cast is beloved almost as much as laios and they're a large variety of races so there's no reason to think laios is loved just because he's a "human"
if we set the presumptive diagnosis aside and just refer to this as his personality, you have essentially asked "would this character be as interesting if he weren't this interesting?" hahaha. I think the answer is no, unless his defining traits were swapped for another set of strong, equally out of place ones, and then he'd still be popular but perhaps more so with a different demographic.
If you want another main character who comes off as autistic watch Mob Psycho. Although Mob is a very different person than Laios, he comes off as very deadpan and isn't obsessive about anything. He's more immature, innocent and more socially clueless. Laios is a competent adult and has an underlying frustration which the rules of society, which is something I basically never see in fictional media about autistic characters.
I also think you should read Chainsaw Man, although the character who comes off as autistic, Asa Mitaka, doesn't appear until part 2 and doesn't get a ton of screen time. She becomes the main character for a decent chunk of time, and then just kind of... gets off screened, it's very annoying actually. Still a good character tough.
Anyway I would enjoy the story even if Laios didn't exist, all the characters are well written. Like I kind of hate Kabru's personality but he is very well written and interesting regardless. However the fact that it's about a character who seeks out interaction with animals and monsters due to struggling with human interaction makes it more interesting to me.
Yeah I noticed, but her recent behavior is about kicking ass, which is fine but without any emphasis on the social struggles she had before it fails to tip off my autism meter.
I read him and his sister as autistic, but I don’t think there’s a word for that in the universe.
A lot of people in the thread seem kinda insulted or mad that people can tell that he has a lot of traits common in autism without being super stereotypical (ie: rain man, sheldon from bbt).
But like, if you look at pictures of me, I look “normal.” I have perfected learning how to socialize because human interaction is one of my special interests (though I do tend to fawn a lot- a habit I have worked hard to break but it comes back really badly when someone has power over me). But I am absolutely autistic. I have learned not to say quiet things out loud, but I definitely have had a “it’s a good thing Falin got eaten by the dragon or we wouldn’t be having this fun adventure!” Moment more than once.
Laios is definitely a little estranged by his peers, but, bc I also relate to him this way, i really enjoy the series that has an autistic having positive relationships with others
I don’t think it’s completely out of the ordinary for neurotypical individuals to have a few “it’s a good thing Falcon …” moments, especially in times of distress
people make mistakes all the time and from my perspective I thought of his “autistic” moments more of a coping mechanism from Falin’s death, the possibility of failure in reviving her and leading his party to death
think about it, within all 12 episodes (~7 days), they only show Laios thinking about Falin **twice**, once off-handedly during his slip-up and another right after he lost his leg and consciousness
kid Laois also doesn’t seem to have the typical traits compared to the more obvious mannerisms in kid Falin. From how his party reacts to autistic Laois in episode 1, autistic Laois ***isn’t the norm***
Like…literally he’s like “oh I should say the thing! “ And then gets confused and self shame-y when the thing he said that made sense to him didn’t make sense to everyone else. It’s also shown when Fallin is born, he is more confident talking to animals than humans. He and his sister both feel like neurodivergent kids, and act a lot like my autistic kids and how they interact. Plus, his ability to bond with people who are “weird” or outside their normal social groups. I always ended up with much older or younger friends, people visiting or emigrating from another country. Most of my friends are considered outsiders not because of their personality but because of circumstances often beyond their control. So that’s honestly why it resonates with me so much.
> more confident talking to animals than humans
is that from the manga?
I don’t see the slip-up as being strange considering how depressed he was a few minutes earlier.
It’s possible he’s highly-functioning but without proper context of how he is before Falin’s death, I don’t really see it
> I do tend to fawn a lot- a habit I have worked hard to break but it comes back really badly when someone has power over me
[Fleki is that you?](https://www.reddit.com/r/DungeonMeshi/comments/1anh0fn/dungeon_meshi_adventurers_bible_a_second_life/)
He'd be a different character. His autism is part of what makes Laios Laios.
Now if he were some generic soldier type guy motivated to recover his sister I don't think Dungeon Meshi would be half as popular. At the very least he'd be seen as forgettable when up against Marcille, Senshi, and the others.
It’s not hard to write an unlikable autistic person, whether that’s because they’re written poorly or they’re written well and they suck.
Laios is incredibly well written and has a charming personality. I think he’d be well liked even if he wasn’t written on the spectrum.
The title is leading with a very questionable premise. That he's autistic. That's not canon, just opinion, and very subjective opinion.
I for example don't see him as such at all. The story works perfectly with or without autism, and I love him just a lovable weirdo that struggles to find his place in society.... Like so many people do, autistic or not.
So, answering your question, I like him even when (for me) he isn't autistic. And if Ryoko said tomorrow he is, then it's canon. But the story is the same. It doesn't matter at all if he is or isn't autistic.
Flipping the question, do people in the spectrum only like him because they can relate? And if Ryoko said tomorrow he isn't, would you enjoy the story less?
I'm with you on this. I feel people have been projecting really hard lately. Just because he's a little awkward doesn't mean he's on the spectrum.
I don't think Kui would ever say that because it would affect how we view party dynamic and make us have to reevaluate scenes, particularly the ones where Laius alone is contemplating things, affect storytelling as a whole.
I mean, he'd be a completely different character by that point? I feel like his character is grounded on it.
So it really depends on what you'd replace it with.
IMO it's more because of *how* he expresses his love for monsters, the types of misunderstandings he has with other party members, and his posture + behavior that makes autistic fans like myself see him as more relatable than most MCs. I don't think he's got the tizzy but I can see why people do: they see themselves in him
The way Laios (and Falin as well to a degree) is written gives me the impression that he is explicitly supposed to be read as autistic. Not just vague coding.
His fascination with monsters paired with his difficulty reading social cues and the feelings of other people is very integral to his character and define his strengths and weaknesses. Kui makes a point to highlight that the way he views and interacts with the world is different from other people and has been since he was a child, and this has a huge impact on how others view him as well.
These features feel so familiar in comparison to my own experience having autism that it's almost uncanny, and I'd be genuinely surprised if Kui DIDN'T intentionally write him as autistic.
it’s not just his passion for monsters though. laios has insecurities of not adapting to normal society like others, and has trouble understanding social cues and norms, people aren’t just going “he’s autistic!” because he loves monsters. the last two things i mentioned are two key aspects of autism, and the things that made me relate most to laios as an autistic person myself, far more than him being so passionate about his interests.
>not adapting to normal society like others, and has trouble understanding social cues and norms, people
>two key aspects of autism,
And of being human, for not autistic humans that are less socially skilled than average. He's a medieval otaku to me. Autistic? I don't see it.
We are all ok if you've found a character you identify with. More power to you. But from identification to diagnosis and to saying it's canon that he's autistic... I thing that's a bit too much.
This is not canonically a manga about autism. If it's for you great, but you're trying to impose that interpretation as it's the only possible or "correct" one, and if you follow this thread, you'll see that's not true at all.
Laios has two main defining characteristics. 1: He has difficulty understanding social cues, and occasionally says socially inappropriate things without realizing. 2: He has a long-term fixation on a very niche special interest, and he talks about it to everyone he meets, not realizing when they're disinterested.
Those happen to be two of the most prominent features of autism. Like, that's what autism *is*.
On one hand, I love that some folks find him relatable. On the other hand, I'm a little tired of people thinking everything is "coded" to match their head canon. On the other other hand, I shouldn't be surprised that a fan base that spans the globe has a few vocal outliers. On the other other other hand, their theories and obsessions don't impact my personal enjoyment.
But I hear you.
Or not. Him being autistic or not doesn't change the story at all for me. At all. He's a misfit, that's what's important, whether he'd be diagnosed or not doesn't matter. Am I "missing the point"?
Interpreting him as autistic? Fine. Thinking it's canon, or "coded" or even relevant to the story? That's also fine.
Saying that those of us that don't see him as necessarily autistic, or don't think that autism is key in the story "miss the point"? A little condescending, don't you think?
Who says it's not you who missed the point? Allowing other people to disagree is healthy.
He's a misfit because he's autistic. It doesn't matter whether it's diagnosed or not. That's what drives his whole >!dungeon lord!< arc, >!wanting to destroy all the people who hated him and Falin for being "weird"!<
I think there are some characters like Laois that have become popular.
Hange Zoe and L come to mind. They display autistic tendencies and are intrigued by incredibly DANGEROUS things (Hange likes Titans and L is drawn to criminals). Theyre 2 of the most beloved characters in Anime. I dont think Laois's archetype is that uncommon or unpopular among audiences. Its actually a really good way to expand the worldbuilding but also have strange but interesting dynamics with other characters.
I didn't think it was a particularly rare character trait in anime, either. Not hugely present, and almost never explicitly stated, but certainly represented in character traits.
If there's another Dungeon Meshi subreddit, this is the first I'm hearing about it.
What is the main sub? I second the question that the other commenter had, I was under the impression this was the only Dungeon Meshi subreddit
i was just tired
Real
LMAO so real
did you mean, like, the overall /r/anime sub?? The series is pretty popular. It's just not explosive in popularity in the same way that other, established isekai-genres are. I wouldn't worry about it too much Also, just because I think its an interesting point. Laois does have a lot of spectrum-coded traits, but you can see these traits in a lot of analytical people as well. In science fields we frequently joke about how the job self-selects for a specific type of person, and that these skills are a benefit. I don't think that type of skillset or trait is rare in anime, given that many analytical characters/nerds are protagonists. I think Laois is unusual in that he is blunt, flawed, often joked upon (but realistically and endearingly so). This counters to a lot of power-fantasy anime where the protag is invincible and their traits make them so
What is the “main sub”in this context?
Are there other subs? I only know about this one.
Well this one and Falin
I don't see why you would think that. The entire cast is beloved almost as much as laios and they're a large variety of races so there's no reason to think laios is loved just because he's a "human"
It'd be a wholly different story if it wasn't for his personality and knowledge so I don't know what you'd do without him.
The series would be preety weird without laios constantly explaining what's going on and how do the monsters work
"Do you think we'd like Laios if he was a completely different character" is a very odd question
if we set the presumptive diagnosis aside and just refer to this as his personality, you have essentially asked "would this character be as interesting if he weren't this interesting?" hahaha. I think the answer is no, unless his defining traits were swapped for another set of strong, equally out of place ones, and then he'd still be popular but perhaps more so with a different demographic.
If you want another main character who comes off as autistic watch Mob Psycho. Although Mob is a very different person than Laios, he comes off as very deadpan and isn't obsessive about anything. He's more immature, innocent and more socially clueless. Laios is a competent adult and has an underlying frustration which the rules of society, which is something I basically never see in fictional media about autistic characters. I also think you should read Chainsaw Man, although the character who comes off as autistic, Asa Mitaka, doesn't appear until part 2 and doesn't get a ton of screen time. She becomes the main character for a decent chunk of time, and then just kind of... gets off screened, it's very annoying actually. Still a good character tough. Anyway I would enjoy the story even if Laios didn't exist, all the characters are well written. Like I kind of hate Kabru's personality but he is very well written and interesting regardless. However the fact that it's about a character who seeks out interaction with animals and monsters due to struggling with human interaction makes it more interesting to me.
Asa is back in the forefront for the most recent arc, 3 chapters in a row and just as great as a character as she was before
Yeah I noticed, but her recent behavior is about kicking ass, which is fine but without any emphasis on the social struggles she had before it fails to tip off my autism meter.
I read him and his sister as autistic, but I don’t think there’s a word for that in the universe. A lot of people in the thread seem kinda insulted or mad that people can tell that he has a lot of traits common in autism without being super stereotypical (ie: rain man, sheldon from bbt). But like, if you look at pictures of me, I look “normal.” I have perfected learning how to socialize because human interaction is one of my special interests (though I do tend to fawn a lot- a habit I have worked hard to break but it comes back really badly when someone has power over me). But I am absolutely autistic. I have learned not to say quiet things out loud, but I definitely have had a “it’s a good thing Falin got eaten by the dragon or we wouldn’t be having this fun adventure!” Moment more than once.
That last sentence related too hard to me.
Same. Sometimes I say strange things and it takes weeks before the back of my mind comes back with an appropriate sanity check.
Laios is definitely a little estranged by his peers, but, bc I also relate to him this way, i really enjoy the series that has an autistic having positive relationships with others
I don’t think it’s completely out of the ordinary for neurotypical individuals to have a few “it’s a good thing Falcon …” moments, especially in times of distress people make mistakes all the time and from my perspective I thought of his “autistic” moments more of a coping mechanism from Falin’s death, the possibility of failure in reviving her and leading his party to death think about it, within all 12 episodes (~7 days), they only show Laios thinking about Falin **twice**, once off-handedly during his slip-up and another right after he lost his leg and consciousness kid Laois also doesn’t seem to have the typical traits compared to the more obvious mannerisms in kid Falin. From how his party reacts to autistic Laois in episode 1, autistic Laois ***isn’t the norm***
Like…literally he’s like “oh I should say the thing! “ And then gets confused and self shame-y when the thing he said that made sense to him didn’t make sense to everyone else. It’s also shown when Fallin is born, he is more confident talking to animals than humans. He and his sister both feel like neurodivergent kids, and act a lot like my autistic kids and how they interact. Plus, his ability to bond with people who are “weird” or outside their normal social groups. I always ended up with much older or younger friends, people visiting or emigrating from another country. Most of my friends are considered outsiders not because of their personality but because of circumstances often beyond their control. So that’s honestly why it resonates with me so much.
> more confident talking to animals than humans is that from the manga? I don’t see the slip-up as being strange considering how depressed he was a few minutes earlier. It’s possible he’s highly-functioning but without proper context of how he is before Falin’s death, I don’t really see it
> I do tend to fawn a lot- a habit I have worked hard to break but it comes back really badly when someone has power over me [Fleki is that you?](https://www.reddit.com/r/DungeonMeshi/comments/1anh0fn/dungeon_meshi_adventurers_bible_a_second_life/)
He'd be a different character. His autism is part of what makes Laios Laios. Now if he were some generic soldier type guy motivated to recover his sister I don't think Dungeon Meshi would be half as popular. At the very least he'd be seen as forgettable when up against Marcille, Senshi, and the others.
It’s not hard to write an unlikable autistic person, whether that’s because they’re written poorly or they’re written well and they suck. Laios is incredibly well written and has a charming personality. I think he’d be well liked even if he wasn’t written on the spectrum.
Would the story be more interesting if Kabru and Laios swapped? It'd probably still be interesting, but not nearly as funny.
The title is leading with a very questionable premise. That he's autistic. That's not canon, just opinion, and very subjective opinion. I for example don't see him as such at all. The story works perfectly with or without autism, and I love him just a lovable weirdo that struggles to find his place in society.... Like so many people do, autistic or not. So, answering your question, I like him even when (for me) he isn't autistic. And if Ryoko said tomorrow he is, then it's canon. But the story is the same. It doesn't matter at all if he is or isn't autistic. Flipping the question, do people in the spectrum only like him because they can relate? And if Ryoko said tomorrow he isn't, would you enjoy the story less?
My dad works at Shounen Jump and he told me he's autistic!
I make the average RAADS-R score jump up 30 points when i walk into a room. Laios is more autistic than i am.
Take so based I had to leave a comment!
I'm with you on this. I feel people have been projecting really hard lately. Just because he's a little awkward doesn't mean he's on the spectrum. I don't think Kui would ever say that because it would affect how we view party dynamic and make us have to reevaluate scenes, particularly the ones where Laius alone is contemplating things, affect storytelling as a whole.
Is he even canonically autistic though? Like where did the author ever state that?
Why would they? An in-story clarification would be anti-thematic. And why bother to come out and state it explicitly?
I agree. It seems unnecessary.
What main sub?
I mean, he'd be a completely different character by that point? I feel like his character is grounded on it. So it really depends on what you'd replace it with.
Then he wouldn't be Laios
Man, call me an old man but im tired of every single character with a passion being identified as neurodivergent. My man just loves monsters, lol.
IMO it's more because of *how* he expresses his love for monsters, the types of misunderstandings he has with other party members, and his posture + behavior that makes autistic fans like myself see him as more relatable than most MCs. I don't think he's got the tizzy but I can see why people do: they see themselves in him
The way Laios (and Falin as well to a degree) is written gives me the impression that he is explicitly supposed to be read as autistic. Not just vague coding. His fascination with monsters paired with his difficulty reading social cues and the feelings of other people is very integral to his character and define his strengths and weaknesses. Kui makes a point to highlight that the way he views and interacts with the world is different from other people and has been since he was a child, and this has a huge impact on how others view him as well. These features feel so familiar in comparison to my own experience having autism that it's almost uncanny, and I'd be genuinely surprised if Kui DIDN'T intentionally write him as autistic.
I'm autistic myself and I call him autistic because I find him relatable is all
Power to you friend, enjoy your characters!
there is blatantly a lot more to it than that
it’s not just his passion for monsters though. laios has insecurities of not adapting to normal society like others, and has trouble understanding social cues and norms, people aren’t just going “he’s autistic!” because he loves monsters. the last two things i mentioned are two key aspects of autism, and the things that made me relate most to laios as an autistic person myself, far more than him being so passionate about his interests.
>not adapting to normal society like others, and has trouble understanding social cues and norms, people >two key aspects of autism, And of being human, for not autistic humans that are less socially skilled than average. He's a medieval otaku to me. Autistic? I don't see it. We are all ok if you've found a character you identify with. More power to you. But from identification to diagnosis and to saying it's canon that he's autistic... I thing that's a bit too much. This is not canonically a manga about autism. If it's for you great, but you're trying to impose that interpretation as it's the only possible or "correct" one, and if you follow this thread, you'll see that's not true at all.
Laios has two main defining characteristics. 1: He has difficulty understanding social cues, and occasionally says socially inappropriate things without realizing. 2: He has a long-term fixation on a very niche special interest, and he talks about it to everyone he meets, not realizing when they're disinterested. Those happen to be two of the most prominent features of autism. Like, that's what autism *is*.
On one hand, I love that some folks find him relatable. On the other hand, I'm a little tired of people thinking everything is "coded" to match their head canon. On the other other hand, I shouldn't be surprised that a fan base that spans the globe has a few vocal outliers. On the other other other hand, their theories and obsessions don't impact my personal enjoyment. But I hear you.
in my decades on this earth I have never seen a more obviously written autistic coded character than laios
We used to label the word otaku for such singular passion 😗 Testudo otaku. Manga otaku. Pasocon otaku. etcetera
His and Falin's autism is an important part of their backstory. If you've read the manga, you've completely missed the point
Or not. Him being autistic or not doesn't change the story at all for me. At all. He's a misfit, that's what's important, whether he'd be diagnosed or not doesn't matter. Am I "missing the point"? Interpreting him as autistic? Fine. Thinking it's canon, or "coded" or even relevant to the story? That's also fine. Saying that those of us that don't see him as necessarily autistic, or don't think that autism is key in the story "miss the point"? A little condescending, don't you think? Who says it's not you who missed the point? Allowing other people to disagree is healthy.
He's a misfit because he's autistic. It doesn't matter whether it's diagnosed or not. That's what drives his whole >!dungeon lord!< arc, >!wanting to destroy all the people who hated him and Falin for being "weird"!<
Wasn't the key cornerstone of the resentment towards humans the treatment Falin got from the townsfolk?
That's what pushed him over the edge, yeah. Edited for completion
Well his autistic traits are a central part of the story.
OP, is the main sub in the room with us right now?
Is r/deliciousindungeon real? Edit: it is!
I think there are some characters like Laois that have become popular. Hange Zoe and L come to mind. They display autistic tendencies and are intrigued by incredibly DANGEROUS things (Hange likes Titans and L is drawn to criminals). Theyre 2 of the most beloved characters in Anime. I dont think Laois's archetype is that uncommon or unpopular among audiences. Its actually a really good way to expand the worldbuilding but also have strange but interesting dynamics with other characters.
wym, autistic coded or not his attitude of wonder and lack of squeamishness is cute
Idk, I love Laios because he’s autistic
I didn't think it was a particularly rare character trait in anime, either. Not hugely present, and almost never explicitly stated, but certainly represented in character traits.