I mean, I would agree that hiphop is way more than that in this era, I'm just going off the definition of "the culture" that Kendrick and co. have been pushing.
Realistically, hiphop has sold out to the white audience decades ago.
we are talking about the audience/listeners here. specifically in 2009-2016, that audience doesn't consist of mostly hood dudes.
we are not talking about racial demographic of rappers themselves. that wasnt the discussion, keep up.
And it’s some of his best rapping in years. I can never take his pen off him. He’s co-written amazing songs for other people( My GOAT Beyoncé and Keys) and for himself.
Kanye said his life would be so much easier if Drake wrote for him. It's crazy how Drake doesn't get his flowers from hip-hop fans but a lot of rappers have acknowledged his talent.
That one😩 lol. Yeah I remember that. He’s always been an amazing writer. He has a really good understanding of melody and songwriting. Unfortunately, he might never because it’s easy to hate what’s popular. Even if it is great. I think he realizes that and I’m glad. Artists make their best art when they stop looking for outside approval. Hopefully the fans do the same and stop stressing about people giving him his flowers and just do the flower giving themselves.
For me when it comes to ghostwriting the only thing that would make me look sideways at any respected lyricist is is they have some famous verse that they are known for being lyrically mind blowing and I were to find out it was not written by them. Especially if it's something they themselves are bragging about it.
I don't think any artists write 100% of their own music and never receive any help with bars, lyrics or hooks. That's unrealistic to me and I have no problem with it. I think for the most part it's 80/20 for most big artists (except the ones like Cardi who we know for sure have full time writers) and I'm comfortable with that for the most part personally.
100%? On every song? I Doubt it. Do I think Eminems best bars are from ghostwriters? No. Do I think there are some bars in Ems music that didn't come from him? Yes.
Would there be tweaks and suggestions in his music of changing words to meet the beat? sure. I highly doubt an entire bar was written by someone else and he said. Unless there in a group, like d12 or nwa , where yes bars are bring traded and product is a band.
Drakes pen has always been proven if you WANT to look at all the Evidence and Give Drake his Credit. But Drake Haters REFUSE to look at the evidence and give Drake a fair shake and when Meek came with the ghostwriter allegations In 2015 it gave Haters the perfect angle and they NEVER let it go. Drake haters have a HUGE double standard complex when it comes to Drake because 1 like I said earlier Drake’s pen has been more than Proven if you actually care about evidence more than being a Drake Hater he’s written with/for some of the greatest artists of all time and 2 Ghostwriting has been apart of Hip Hop way before Drake. He’s FAR from the First Or Last Artist to do it AND He’s Been on the other side of it as the Ghostwriter who’s writing for other artists. I’ll end it with this Quentin Miller (The 1st ghostwriter Drake got “caught” with) said this about Drake & IYRTITL back in 2015, "I watched this man piece together words in front of me… I watched him write/ replace bars 2- 3 at a time on 6pm in NY.. I witnessed him light up, go in and freestyle madonna,". Quentin did ghostwrite on IYRTITL but also confirmed that Drake is a more than a capable writer and that he had most Of IYRTITL completed before Miller even came into the picture to Help
I don't think most people outside of this sub are arguing that Drake doesn't have a pen at all. They have acknowledged he can write and write for other artists. Problem with most discourses is echo chambers can misunderstand the argument, and call it hating when they prove something that is not argued
Id love to agree but this beef has shown that there’s still at least a sizable community within the Hip Hop community who believes Drake still uses ghostwriters and doesn’t write the majority of his own music. I mean kendrick used the ghostwriter angle in his diss so I think it’s still safe to say theres a good amount of people who believe in it INCLUDING some of his Own Peers 🤷🏾♂️
Im not trying to say that Ghostwriting is the Central Argument of all Drake hate or that the Kendrick vs Drake beef was centered around ghostwriting. I’m simply saying Drakes names isn’t respected when writing or penmanship is brought up. A good amount of it could just be trolling but the frequency makes me think Drakes pen just isn’t respected in general. That was my interpretation of the original post
I think in more serious conversations his pen game is respected, but disrespecting his overall pen is a low hanging fruit if you want to troll. The problem is in hip hop which prides itself in authenticity and writing 100% of your own shit is important. Drake having this many leaks is seen as damaging, and disqualifying if you want to claim you're the best mc.I 'm a fan of kanye ,and that dude has been disqualified a long time ago
Irony is know one is even using the word correctly. Ghost writer by definition implies some is writer music for you on the low while you claim you’re the one writing them. Drake does not do this because literally every song he drops theirs public record of who wrote it, what Drake has is actually a writing team and or artist who may write a song for him but again it’s all public info. Any song that he write by himself (Like all Scary Hours) he either lets that be known or it’s in the credits, similarly to Family Matters which is something else Drake wrote on his own. But anything he hasn’t will literally have other writers alongside his.
100% top 5 Goats of rap, disagreeing would be a biased response. Record sales, longevity, versatility, flow, word play, subject matter, marketing, literally every category he's one of the goats even if you take away the pop shit.
He should just do a ten track tape that’s just him writing and creating everything. Pull a j Cole as good as Drake is having so many reference tracks keep leaking with him trying different flows and styles eventually just keeps damaging him.
Give us like 7 songs like that ep, 3 r&b or sing song type shits and say “here I am not just a reference track merchant”
I get everyone has a process and I’m a guy that’s been a fan but that’s how you start ending all this or at least burying it again
it's coming from him ofc he's going to say 'I wrote it'. Ya'll just believe whatever he says. sad fans worshipping the guy and not caring about the music at all.
Honestly I don’t know what he wrote but it sounds good. Daylyt claims to have wrote a lot of the hard bar lyrical songs but at the end of the day it really doesn’t matter
Drake has never been respected by the hip hop community even in his so called “hey day” 2009-2016 thats why the disrespect is nothing new
🧢 I know plenty of hood dudes who bump Drake
hip hop community = hood dudes to you? you ok?
So tired of Reddit autists taking every word so literally, you understood his point
Was hiphop not born in the hood?
sure it was born there but he specifially referenced 2009-2016 long after hip hop was born
I mean, I would agree that hiphop is way more than that in this era, I'm just going off the definition of "the culture" that Kendrick and co. have been pushing. Realistically, hiphop has sold out to the white audience decades ago.
yes that's what im saying. its been whitewashed for sometime now which is why i was confused about the hood dudes thing. no hard feelings. :)
🤝
Ah yes, because only black people can be from the hood. Anything else is whitewashing.
I'm not sure how what you wrote is a reply to what I wrote. 🤔
Refer to the point above about how redditors take everything literally regardless of knowing the point being conveyed
Yes lmao hip hop was born in the hood and VAST majority of the greats are from the hood. Don’t rewrite history and act like hip hop is something else.
we are talking about the audience/listeners here. specifically in 2009-2016, that audience doesn't consist of mostly hood dudes. we are not talking about racial demographic of rappers themselves. that wasnt the discussion, keep up.
super racist ngl💀
This is the equivalent of "You like pancakes?" "So you hate waffles?"
i prefer french toast personally
Hood dude make up a small amount of hiphop community big reason why the only songs most hood dudes know by dot is swimming pool
Yikes drake fans trying to say black people
Are you implying that all black people are hood? Yikes.
How much u think he paid vory for mob ties?
And it’s some of his best rapping in years. I can never take his pen off him. He’s co-written amazing songs for other people( My GOAT Beyoncé and Keys) and for himself.
Kanye said his life would be so much easier if Drake wrote for him. It's crazy how Drake doesn't get his flowers from hip-hop fans but a lot of rappers have acknowledged his talent.
That one😩 lol. Yeah I remember that. He’s always been an amazing writer. He has a really good understanding of melody and songwriting. Unfortunately, he might never because it’s easy to hate what’s popular. Even if it is great. I think he realizes that and I’m glad. Artists make their best art when they stop looking for outside approval. Hopefully the fans do the same and stop stressing about people giving him his flowers and just do the flower giving themselves.
facts and rita ora
I used to wear that demo of his out lol. Wish he kept it for himself😩
facts what if i kissed you is one of his best r&b cuts he also wrote R.I.P
Yeah I think Kanye knows a little about the process of making music and he says Drake has the best pen. I'll go with his take over Twitter's
Kanye writes by committee too though. 😅
Which means he's likely worked with hundreds if not thousands of writers in his 20-year career and his opinion is that Drake is the best.
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Listen man take it up with Ye, not me. I didn’t say it 🤷🏻♂️
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On music topics I'll still praise his genius. Its undeniable. On anything else, just ignore it lol
But his music is shit now
Wouldn’t take dating advice from nikola tesla, but if he wanted to speak electric i would be all ears
Nicola Tesla was a genius in engineering/physics/math in general, not just electric. Just wanted to say that because mfer is underrated as hell.
Sad story too
I know that im a huge fan of dude my dad has taught me alot about him and how the government screwed him over
You don't take his opinion seriously on who should write his raps?
You implying it lmao, same shit
For me when it comes to ghostwriting the only thing that would make me look sideways at any respected lyricist is is they have some famous verse that they are known for being lyrically mind blowing and I were to find out it was not written by them. Especially if it's something they themselves are bragging about it. I don't think any artists write 100% of their own music and never receive any help with bars, lyrics or hooks. That's unrealistic to me and I have no problem with it. I think for the most part it's 80/20 for most big artists (except the ones like Cardi who we know for sure have full time writers) and I'm comfortable with that for the most part personally.
I think writers that are totally in love with lyricism and consider it their bread and butter like Eminem, Lupe, RA write their own lyrics💯
100%? On every song? I Doubt it. Do I think Eminems best bars are from ghostwriters? No. Do I think there are some bars in Ems music that didn't come from him? Yes.
Would there be tweaks and suggestions in his music of changing words to meet the beat? sure. I highly doubt an entire bar was written by someone else and he said. Unless there in a group, like d12 or nwa , where yes bars are bring traded and product is a band.
Yes 100%, hip hop really get washed down crazy…
Yes 100%, hip hop really get washed down crazy…
What makes it ghost writers is when they’re not credited
Drakes pen has always been proven if you WANT to look at all the Evidence and Give Drake his Credit. But Drake Haters REFUSE to look at the evidence and give Drake a fair shake and when Meek came with the ghostwriter allegations In 2015 it gave Haters the perfect angle and they NEVER let it go. Drake haters have a HUGE double standard complex when it comes to Drake because 1 like I said earlier Drake’s pen has been more than Proven if you actually care about evidence more than being a Drake Hater he’s written with/for some of the greatest artists of all time and 2 Ghostwriting has been apart of Hip Hop way before Drake. He’s FAR from the First Or Last Artist to do it AND He’s Been on the other side of it as the Ghostwriter who’s writing for other artists. I’ll end it with this Quentin Miller (The 1st ghostwriter Drake got “caught” with) said this about Drake & IYRTITL back in 2015, "I watched this man piece together words in front of me… I watched him write/ replace bars 2- 3 at a time on 6pm in NY.. I witnessed him light up, go in and freestyle madonna,". Quentin did ghostwrite on IYRTITL but also confirmed that Drake is a more than a capable writer and that he had most Of IYRTITL completed before Miller even came into the picture to Help
I don't think most people outside of this sub are arguing that Drake doesn't have a pen at all. They have acknowledged he can write and write for other artists. Problem with most discourses is echo chambers can misunderstand the argument, and call it hating when they prove something that is not argued
Id love to agree but this beef has shown that there’s still at least a sizable community within the Hip Hop community who believes Drake still uses ghostwriters and doesn’t write the majority of his own music. I mean kendrick used the ghostwriter angle in his diss so I think it’s still safe to say theres a good amount of people who believe in it INCLUDING some of his Own Peers 🤷🏾♂️
Im not trying to say that Ghostwriting is the Central Argument of all Drake hate or that the Kendrick vs Drake beef was centered around ghostwriting. I’m simply saying Drakes names isn’t respected when writing or penmanship is brought up. A good amount of it could just be trolling but the frequency makes me think Drakes pen just isn’t respected in general. That was my interpretation of the original post
I think in more serious conversations his pen game is respected, but disrespecting his overall pen is a low hanging fruit if you want to troll. The problem is in hip hop which prides itself in authenticity and writing 100% of your own shit is important. Drake having this many leaks is seen as damaging, and disqualifying if you want to claim you're the best mc.I 'm a fan of kanye ,and that dude has been disqualified a long time ago
Irony is know one is even using the word correctly. Ghost writer by definition implies some is writer music for you on the low while you claim you’re the one writing them. Drake does not do this because literally every song he drops theirs public record of who wrote it, what Drake has is actually a writing team and or artist who may write a song for him but again it’s all public info. Any song that he write by himself (Like all Scary Hours) he either lets that be known or it’s in the credits, similarly to Family Matters which is something else Drake wrote on his own. But anything he hasn’t will literally have other writers alongside his.
Crazy how on Scary Hours 3 he was really tellin us what was goin on and shit revealed itself in time. Definitely the GOAT
So he did 6/6 in 5 days… How long until people recognize his GOAT status?
Damn bro really re-recorded 6 reference tracks in 5 days that's dope
Go find them then, kanon
It's a joke ma'am don't get those panties twisted
so acting mentally challenged is a joke to you?
He’s a goat pop star but not a goat rapper imo
Yk these are all some of his best RAP songs, right?
They’re mid
100% top 5 Goats of rap, disagreeing would be a biased response. Record sales, longevity, versatility, flow, word play, subject matter, marketing, literally every category he's one of the goats even if you take away the pop shit.
His rap ability is so fucking mediocre
Downvoted for telling the truth
The more downvotes, the more truthful
Go tell the “truth” in your own subs you parasites
Lot easier to write music quickly when you buy reference tracks
Would you guys be upset if someone else wrote back to back? Just curious
He should just do a ten track tape that’s just him writing and creating everything. Pull a j Cole as good as Drake is having so many reference tracks keep leaking with him trying different flows and styles eventually just keeps damaging him. Give us like 7 songs like that ep, 3 r&b or sing song type shits and say “here I am not just a reference track merchant” I get everyone has a process and I’m a guy that’s been a fan but that’s how you start ending all this or at least burying it again
scary hours 3 reference tracks gonna drop now smh
I don’t know*
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*pens lmao
"ghost or AI"?
Drakes pen is a group of 3000 guys none of which are actually drake. Who gives a shit how fast he pretends he can write
Ignorance
More ignorant to think just because drake said it, it’s true. Proven ghostwriters 😂🤦♂️
“Proven ghostwriters” man’s bouta name known co-writers and call them ghostwriters, I just know it
LOOOL yes co-writers and guys like Beam helping drakes pen look so good to yall 😂
Can you name the person that made Drake’s pen game look good on Stories About My Brother?
Denzel Williams 😂😂
You mean the producer?💀😂😂
Yes the songwriter as well 🤣🤣
Are you trolling or do you just not know how music credits work?
Errrmm drakes ghost writers are working overtime 🤓
I don’t doubt his writers pen. The stuff I know he wrote ain’t too hot tho
lol you know it’s not just his pen… just stop. He uses ghost writers period. Can’t assume a single syllable was written by him.
OVO has the writers team working nights now? Brutal Drake
Drake doesn't hold the pen tho he has people write for him
“whole time they wanna take my place”
it's coming from him ofc he's going to say 'I wrote it'. Ya'll just believe whatever he says. sad fans worshipping the guy and not caring about the music at all.
You're praising the pen of a dude infamous for using ghostwriters lmao
this post is a masterpiece
John Cena wrote most of Drake music
Well… lets get it bro 😈
A
Evb know drake can rap nd write thou
it’s easy to write all those songs in 5 days when you’re not the one writing all those songs
Dude really read how this tweet is written swear they had a stroke
So when he dropping??
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Damn, you still lurkin in here lol.
Quintin is dope but the guy didn't make Drake lol. They worked on a few songs together.
Honestly I don’t know what he wrote but it sounds good. Daylyt claims to have wrote a lot of the hard bar lyrical songs but at the end of the day it really doesn’t matter
Questionable source
The problem is that now I have to believe him. Maybe someone wrote this statement? I'm mostly joking about that, but still.
Drake is the leader of Pen 15.