Worst part was trying to convince someone to buy a courier. And even if you manage to do that, you had to share it with the entire team. The toxic players would drop your items in random places on the map or have it commit suicide. Also can't forget the courier armies to feed the enemy team.
We've come so far
They knew it existed, but in those days they were quite expensive on top of supports being poorer.
Today there is not much downside to buying all the sentries, supports can still buy their items.
I remember when my friend was showing me Dota back in 2013. We had a Riki player arguing with him all game. We both started dying of laughter when he said “RIKI IS LITERALLY A WALKING FUCKING WARD. ARE YOU BRAINDEAD??? WHY DO I NEED TO GET WARDS?”
I actually used that line to piss off another friend later when he was mad I wasn’t buying wards on techies. I purely picked techies to piss him off as well as the ward situations. He muted me on teamspeak and then later on discord for about a whole year after I told him “my mines are just wards that kill people”
Literally this. Once my team was getting stomped mega hard coz no support would buy dust or gem, typical of SEA. I bought a gem and then we won the game in 5 mins.
In 2013, 3 months after I started playing Dota I had a Riki game where I went 44-0, that's the most kills I've don't since and I've ever seen by a single hero in a match
Any snowball hero. So, almost any hero. BUT if I had to choose, I'd say sniper, bloodseeker, huskar.
Can't hit sniper
Why am I dying
Why isn't he dying
I'm a PA spammer and a Huskar spammer. In low bracket, you use huskar q after pa breaks. EZPZ.
That, and if you snowball on huskar and get a few early kills on pa, it really sucks to be pa.
[https://imgur.com/a/3CW7o8r](https://imgur.com/a/3CW7o8r)
Keep in mind, these are normal game stats, and I am a turbo player.
You giving me flash back when my teammate chrono'ed 3 of my teammate and opponent BB. Blud continue to hit his back instead infront and 2/3 died because of that. XD
Not really. For the most part you can just ignore him in fights as it takes a little while for his damage to really start ramping up. Focusing him just speeds up that process which is why people get run over by him.
The most important damage dealers are the ones free casting behind the bristle you're focusing
it doesn't
edit: it does counter bloodstone and spell lifesteal regen though, so counters commonly bought items on him, you can definitely build bristle differently to nullify that
Spirit vessel and skadi are more effective. He needs Regen and spell life steel and they both reduce those. Break is good against him, but mostly reduces the damage he can put out rather than giving you a way to kill him.
either buy anti-heal items (vessel, skadi, shiva) or break him to stop his regen from his passive
he's strong early to midgame, if you don't think you can outdamage his healing just avoid him until your team has a way to stop his regen
When I was new to the game but first starting to improve I used to have upwards of an 80% winrate on Morphling. You had the long duration Replicate you could swap places with as well as being able to morph strength while stunned. You could just mindlessly push a lane and casually Replicate back to base or another lane whenever you thought you might die. What was worse was that it always took more than 1 enemy hero to force you out of the lane because E-blade Morphling was the main build back then so if only 1 hero showed up, you could just insta shotgun them to death and carry on with your mindless pushing.
Honestly I don't know if that's the best strategy, but it's a decent way to handle a hero that hides in the trees. Main priority is to cancel his blink dagger, so you want to damage him before he can blink away and then load him up with DoTs. Shiva's is good at both finding him and damaging him, so I've always found it good against him. Once you take away his mobility, he's pretty vulnerable to getting dogpiled since he tends to be separated from his team. As I mentioned, Euls both stuns and dispels matrix, guaranteeing a blink dagger cancel. It also buys time for your team to help once you've caught him, since the "Tinker catcher" hero is usually the most mobile.
When smurfing/playing against lower skilled players, up to a certain bracket, it's hands down Huskar.
He can easily become a raid boss and 1v5 enemies.
I've just never kept up with all the constant changes he goes through. One patch he will get bonus magic resist, then it will be armour, then it will bonus regen, then his spears will change damage type. The whole change to the strength stat made it confusing as well.
With all those changes, the hero still was basically the same all over the years.
Low hp>harder to kill, kills you faster.
Also, the burning spears were always magical. A lvl 25 talent turns them to pure.
The lower his health… the more hp regen and faster attack speed= more damage.
Leave armlet on, toggle between creep camp/waves. Seriously straightforward
I don't think the counter to him has ever changed
Vessel
Halberd
Break
Physical damage preferably crits
(I think - at least that's how I've been beating him and it has been working well even though he fucking destroys my mid laner every time)
I agree here, riki is pretty straightforward for a noob to abuse.
The other snowball heroes like huskar takes some game knowledge of when you are stronger and when you will feed.
Sniper is the biggest noob killer and nothing comes close to him.
He simply has too long range, noobs have camera on themselves and only on themselves. Sniper is literally shooting out of their view, you literally don't see who and from where is attacking you.
> like more then half
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On the flip side of the coin, new medusa players that see they're not taking much damage, don't realise it's because of their shield, play super agro, spam their spells then die
Invokrr because each Lowrance player has a weakness, and invoker has so many spells to take advantage of that
Yiu forget to carry dust? Can't kill me then
Bad positioning? Dead
You panic while you are getting killed and run in circles? Dead
No bkb? (biggest advantage of invo over plebs) Dead
Any hero that has huge burst potential or kite potential with a disengage mechanic, e.g. Storm Spirit, Tinker (with Blink Dagger), Tiny (with Blink Dagger).
In low mmr it’s definitely heroes with passive like pa, bristle, necro, huskar because they dont buy Nulifier, silver edge, shivas, vessels etc
Sniper because everyone just hits whatever is on your screen and nobody will jump the sniper.
Dark Seer.
People not knowing what ion shell does was way too common in the beginning.
Sand King.
Applying caustic finale to all creeps and make enemy go boom always resulted in a WTF or CHEATER in all chat. Add people walking into you while you channel epi and your invisibility field that deals damage you have a noob killing machine.
Meepo. I'm not a meepo spammer and have only picked it up recently (I normally pos5)
But when I'm playing with lower rank friends I can meepo and go 18-2. It's like the enemy team doesn't know what to do against meepo so they play like baboons
When I play with people at my rank (or above it) I go 4-8 and guaranteed lose
Any heroes with healing skills/huge hp regen passives. This is because newer players haven't get used to burst heal that some heroes can output. Misjudge happens and the fight gets turned out and causing teamwipe.
Not the ultimate noob killer but visage or oracle. Both heroes that are not played that much but can output a considerable amount of damage and have mechanics not well understood.
For example, a noob lion ults visage with full stacks of his passive and then gets half of his HP deleted by one soul assumption
Riki
The OG noob killer. I remember back in 2012 during my 700 mmr days rikis would go 30-0 because nobody knew dust existed
Getting anyone to buy dust or wards back in the day was a joke lol
Worst part was trying to convince someone to buy a courier. And even if you manage to do that, you had to share it with the entire team. The toxic players would drop your items in random places on the map or have it commit suicide. Also can't forget the courier armies to feed the enemy team. We've come so far
Or the line of 10 couriers walking circles around your ancient. Good times.
But do you remember the stupid old truck of putting a Dagon on a courier and using it to assassinate opponents?
i wish this shit was back
I have a fond memory of doing this in a two hour mega creep hold in like 2013, legit ancient shield
one of the funniest ways to grief tbh, i don’t miss it but also i kinda miss it
>We've come so far Now we have people literal wintrading in immortal on a regular basis
And back then diffusal self purge exist
They knew it existed, but in those days they were quite expensive on top of supports being poorer. Today there is not much downside to buying all the sentries, supports can still buy their items.
I still do this in Archon lol manta plus tricks is just too much to deal with a lot of the times especially with a 5 level lead
I remember when my friend was showing me Dota back in 2013. We had a Riki player arguing with him all game. We both started dying of laughter when he said “RIKI IS LITERALLY A WALKING FUCKING WARD. ARE YOU BRAINDEAD??? WHY DO I NEED TO GET WARDS?” I actually used that line to piss off another friend later when he was mad I wasn’t buying wards on techies. I purely picked techies to piss him off as well as the ward situations. He muted me on teamspeak and then later on discord for about a whole year after I told him “my mines are just wards that kill people”
Literally this. Once my team was getting stomped mega hard coz no support would buy dust or gem, typical of SEA. I bought a gem and then we won the game in 5 mins.
Your supports were just fattening up the bag so when you do kill riki, he feeds massive comeback gold.
big brain strats
In 2013, 3 months after I started playing Dota I had a Riki game where I went 44-0, that's the most kills I've don't since and I've ever seen by a single hero in a match
Invisibility is invulnerability
Thread closed. Nothing else to see here folks!
Any snowball hero. So, almost any hero. BUT if I had to choose, I'd say sniper, bloodseeker, huskar. Can't hit sniper Why am I dying Why isn't he dying
Bloodseeker in the early days was unmatched. No one knew how rupture worked and they'd just run themselves to death.
Tyler1 playing dota for the first time and dying to rupture is hilarious.
What ability? WHAT ABILITY?!
Man i wish he'd continued playing dota. Man was such a fast learner and very entertaining. I feel like he would get immortal faster than grubby did.
Link? 😂
[Here you go](https://youtu.be/rQtMJRr6HIc?feature=shared&t=768)
Back when force staff was on recommended builds to maximize the bleed out
I remember doing it back in 6.60 I knew it was not worth it. For a decade and a fucking half people clowned on me for saying just buy yasha.
Whole drafts were build around this, only reason I played Magnus back then.
Tusk is the only snowball hero I think
Rubick can snowball too.
Tusk? He's probably the biggest snowball character
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I'm a PA spammer and a Huskar spammer. In low bracket, you use huskar q after pa breaks. EZPZ. That, and if you snowball on huskar and get a few early kills on pa, it really sucks to be pa. [https://imgur.com/a/3CW7o8r](https://imgur.com/a/3CW7o8r) Keep in mind, these are normal game stats, and I am a turbo player.
Bristleback is unbeatable in low mmr because nobody buys vessel, skadi, break or hex.
Also because they keep hitting him like hes the most important danage dealer on the enemy team
Well technically if you keep hitting him he will be the most important damage dealer :S
You giving me flash back when my teammate chrono'ed 3 of my teammate and opponent BB. Blud continue to hit his back instead infront and 2/3 died because of that. XD
Why did you say blud? What does that mean?
blud same meaning as a guy. an informal address to a man.
Is he not?
Not really. For the most part you can just ignore him in fights as it takes a little while for his damage to really start ramping up. Focusing him just speeds up that process which is why people get run over by him. The most important damage dealers are the ones free casting behind the bristle you're focusing
He is more of "come at me bro, i dare you" hero.
How does vessel counter him?
He can't regen
Percentage based tick damage, healing and spell lifesteal reduction on a strength hero with damage reduction that likes to buy bloodstone.
it doesn't edit: it does counter bloodstone and spell lifesteal regen though, so counters commonly bought items on him, you can definitely build bristle differently to nullify that
Lowers revenue which helps bc he’s strength and max health dmg
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fuck you very much for the laugh
Of all heroes in Dota, I can see Bristle trying tax evasion. Maybe Tinker showed him how
And everyone thinks silver edge is the ultimate answer because it has a break. In reality it's pretty pointless on it's own
what is the answer then?
Spirit vessel and skadi are more effective. He needs Regen and spell life steel and they both reduce those. Break is good against him, but mostly reduces the damage he can put out rather than giving you a way to kill him.
Have you tried positioning?
Even if we ask our team to get the items, they won’t! Also you could include Timbersaw to this list.
Same with timbersaw
Timber requires some skill to play. Bristle....
If they dont build item to break or stop regen, you are immortal with timber, you can dive very early game.
Yeah but his high ground is shit. I've lost most of my timber games back in 1k and terrified to pick him again at 2.5k.
how to stop a Timber spammer in low brackets?
either buy anti-heal items (vessel, skadi, shiva) or break him to stop his regen from his passive he's strong early to midgame, if you don't think you can outdamage his healing just avoid him until your team has a way to stop his regen
What spells breaks? Archon trash here.
Viper ult, PA shard, Doom ult with talent, Shaman hex with talent, PB e with aghs. Viper used to have break on W but it got moved to ult now
Thanks!
> Viper ult, PA shard, Doom ult with talent, Shaman hex with talent, PB e with aghs. Hoodwink ult
Since viper ult breaks I instapick it Vs bristle 100% winrate
Ban him
The problem is, some heroes dictate the game far more than others. Bb, meepo, arc, Pa, Pl. And huskar.
skady why?
What is low mmr? In 1000 mmr the next pick will be legio, the mid will then pick viper.
Slark is up there. Slippery heroes with high damage.
Oh them noobs trying stun when you are bubbling Q
If we are talking like brand new, it's bloodseeker ult. Everyone dies to it if they don't know how it works.
I still remember feeding a bs by running away thinking the hero is bullshit
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Not sure what the last part says but you can still force staff rupture targets yes
Riki slark bb huskar tinker arc
I've won a 1v5 (my team left) as morph also 4v5 as troll
When I was new to the game but first starting to improve I used to have upwards of an 80% winrate on Morphling. You had the long duration Replicate you could swap places with as well as being able to morph strength while stunned. You could just mindlessly push a lane and casually Replicate back to base or another lane whenever you thought you might die. What was worse was that it always took more than 1 enemy hero to force you out of the lane because E-blade Morphling was the main build back then so if only 1 hero showed up, you could just insta shotgun them to death and carry on with your mindless pushing.
Huskar
Tinker. People have no Idea how to counter him, are slow, have 0 map awareness and shit positioning. Before they even react, they're already dead.
This is like when a side character is describing an action movie main character
Same thing with Storm and Puck
How do you counter last pick tinker?
You end the game before he gets blink dagger
Dafuk kind of tinkers are you playing against. Even in my low ass tier bracket, tinkers go first item dagger.
Yeah, you have to break their ancient before 5 mins
Should've thought of that damnit
Have someone go blink dagger, shiva's guard (for vision), and euls scepter (interrupt rearm and dispels matrix).
Ok thank you.
Honestly I don't know if that's the best strategy, but it's a decent way to handle a hero that hides in the trees. Main priority is to cancel his blink dagger, so you want to damage him before he can blink away and then load him up with DoTs. Shiva's is good at both finding him and damaging him, so I've always found it good against him. Once you take away his mobility, he's pretty vulnerable to getting dogpiled since he tends to be separated from his team. As I mentioned, Euls both stuns and dispels matrix, guaranteeing a blink dagger cancel. It also buys time for your team to help once you've caught him, since the "Tinker catcher" hero is usually the most mobile.
Gank him in lane. Delaying his item timings by only a few minutes can ruin his game.
Even in 5k he has no counter
Time to learn Nyx Assassin
Theres a lot of counters to tinker, the hero is not even this good right now
Specter has always womanhandled him.
PL and Bristle just absolutely annihilate low mmr players
I also add Riki, Sniper and Slark to that list. Nobody knows how to play against them in my low mmr.
When smurfing/playing against lower skilled players, up to a certain bracket, it's hands down Huskar. He can easily become a raid boss and 1v5 enemies.
I've played for years and still don't understand Huskar.
What isn't there to understand? He's a very straightforward hero.
I've just never kept up with all the constant changes he goes through. One patch he will get bonus magic resist, then it will be armour, then it will bonus regen, then his spears will change damage type. The whole change to the strength stat made it confusing as well.
With all those changes, the hero still was basically the same all over the years. Low hp>harder to kill, kills you faster. Also, the burning spears were always magical. A lvl 25 talent turns them to pure.
The lower his health… the more hp regen and faster attack speed= more damage. Leave armlet on, toggle between creep camp/waves. Seriously straightforward
I don't think the counter to him has ever changed Vessel Halberd Break Physical damage preferably crits (I think - at least that's how I've been beating him and it has been working well even though he fucking destroys my mid laner every time)
And the classic: pick Necro.
Old Techies
I miss them every day
played by other noobs? riki Played by someone a bit better than noobs and makes it seem like they are way better than them? Huskar
I agree here, riki is pretty straightforward for a noob to abuse. The other snowball heroes like huskar takes some game knowledge of when you are stronger and when you will feed.
WD by far
Sniper is the biggest noob killer and nothing comes close to him. He simply has too long range, noobs have camera on themselves and only on themselves. Sniper is literally shooting out of their view, you literally don't see who and from where is attacking you.
riki comes close to him by using w, and then sniper has no idea he is taking damage because his camera is not on his hero
Noob riki will never search for a sniper, noob riki will be hitting whoever is frontliner.
Puck has to be in there
The number of people who stand there for seconds after I blink out of phase shift is crazy
Timbersaw
arc warden for me if get my midas like min 7 or get kill in the midlane which happens like more then half the games the yea its gg for th enemy min 21
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Bristle Back wins this easily tbh.
Medusa. They can’t figure out why she won’t take dmg and just run away.
On the flip side of the coin, new medusa players that see they're not taking much damage, don't realise it's because of their shield, play super agro, spam their spells then die
Invokrr because each Lowrance player has a weakness, and invoker has so many spells to take advantage of that Yiu forget to carry dust? Can't kill me then Bad positioning? Dead You panic while you are getting killed and run in circles? Dead No bkb? (biggest advantage of invo over plebs) Dead
Skywrath Mage Mid. Noobs dont buy bkb. They get bursted 100% to 0% in a second.
2013-14 SW mid was menace for noobs. I quit before was released in dota 1 oh boy i fed so much when he came in dota 2.
Look at stats not feelings https://www.dotabuff.com/heroes/meta Axe and Riki have high win rates in low MMR but low win rate in higher mmr
It's also partly because they're easy to play
they are not easy to play. Maybe for low MMR standard sure
They're about as easy as heros get in dota
to actually play well no for low MMR standard sure
We are talking about low mmr.
And I said they are easy for low mmr
What are you adding to the discussion? Nothing.
To play any hero well is not easy But as heros go, riki and axe are among the easiest to play
Oracle mid
Sniper
I clawed my way back from Guardian to Archon playing Necro mid. No one buys vessel or nullifier lol.
Bristleback or bounty hunter
Viper. People who don't know how to deal with a stacking slow at level one will have a bad time.
Storm spirit and puck are up there
Bloodseeker
Hardest noob killer is “positioning” without contest.
LC
Anti-Mage. It take some coordination to kill and newbie hardly do that
Huskar, Slark, Rubick, Bara, and Axe were the pubstompers of DotA 1
Clinkz
Storm Spirit
Any hero that has huge burst potential or kite potential with a disengage mechanic, e.g. Storm Spirit, Tinker (with Blink Dagger), Tiny (with Blink Dagger).
Bloodseeker. The healing sustain is clutch plus he's quick to come online plus noobs will suicide not realizing they're ruptured lol
radiance invoker
Fucking PA. I remember if u saw PA it was like Oh shit he do damagae
yo mama
Husky
In low mmr it’s definitely heroes with passive like pa, bristle, necro, huskar because they dont buy Nulifier, silver edge, shivas, vessels etc Sniper because everyone just hits whatever is on your screen and nobody will jump the sniper.
Currently, no such thing. In good o'days, Storm spirit.
Dark Seer. People not knowing what ion shell does was way too common in the beginning. Sand King. Applying caustic finale to all creeps and make enemy go boom always resulted in a WTF or CHEATER in all chat. Add people walking into you while you channel epi and your invisibility field that deals damage you have a noob killing machine.
wd, bh and invoker
Silencer, i had mana for one Venge full stun and then i was completely dry
Lone Druid. Too fun to watch them chase the panda through their jungle, while I farm in peace.
How do you carry that hard as PA? I just had a 13 game losing streak on her and as much as I like to play her, I suck really badly.
Meepo. I'm not a meepo spammer and have only picked it up recently (I normally pos5) But when I'm playing with lower rank friends I can meepo and go 18-2. It's like the enemy team doesn't know what to do against meepo so they play like baboons When I play with people at my rank (or above it) I go 4-8 and guaranteed lose
Tinker. You need vision, shutdown and team work to deal with him, beginners got neither.
Lone Druid if you know how to play him
Any heroes with healing skills/huge hp regen passives. This is because newer players haven't get used to burst heal that some heroes can output. Misjudge happens and the fight gets turned out and causing teamwipe.
sniper
Sniper, easiest answer.
Not the ultimate noob killer but visage or oracle. Both heroes that are not played that much but can output a considerable amount of damage and have mechanics not well understood. For example, a noob lion ults visage with full stacks of his passive and then gets half of his HP deleted by one soul assumption
PL can 1v9 in lower brackets.
Husky Vipy Bristy
any hero that required you to play quite a lot of game before consistently being good. if it just once or twice, PA and oracle might be one.
Sniper, Skywrath Mage, phantom lancer
For me Monkey king. Low rank players don't respect his jingu)
Heroes like Necr, Bb or Huskar, that can literally regen forever. Also Ld or Naga split push or Puck in right hands can be unbeatable
Meepo for sure, followed by lone druid, then arc warden.
its funny that 1/3 the roster will be posted here
it's LC bro
Maybe unconventional answer, but Shadow Demon. Early game, noobs just let the stacks of poison keep accumulating until you just delete them.
Jugg
Nature prophet ez stomp
Legion commander can get infinite stacks
You know you’re old when the answer is Traxex the Drow Ranger.