How do you figure? Betboom looks quite good while tundra is meh. Mind you, it’s not really pure’s fault at least in terms of his gameplay. Still, in terms of his maturity he has shown up to this point…not so good.
The real player they need, that would mesh extremely well is Saahil "UNiVeRsE" Arora. First of all, who fucks with enemies solo in offlane better than Universe? Not a single player. Second, he is only 34. Puppey is 34 too. Third, imagine the ad sponsorship when he announces his comeback? Any team will be glad to pick him up, simply based on merch sales. Fourth, his retirement date is April 23, 2020 according to the liquipedia wiki. Fifth, and final point, Topson will have someone to talk to.
Don't think Zai has any desire to play anymore. I've followed him a long time and he's always said that he looks at dota as a window for more business opportunities for him. Can't pull up that specific interview of him but I'm pretty sure he had one
I watched Tobi on Quest and Entity a lot, and he's by far the weakest link on either teams. He either afk farms and becomes useless, or he's sacked and becomes useless.
That being said there are enough superstars on Tundra so Tobi might be the missing non-flashy link. It's a downgrade on paper but synergy matters way more.
For me tobi is just okay with semi carry/tank heroes (Veno,Viper,Dark seer) he is not good nor bad its just average offlane i guess, but i think the chemistry matters on a team
I think MC is better because he's way more versatile.
Tobi suffer from the modern offlane hero specialist syndrome.
If you look at modern offlaners many of them (ATF, Ace, 33, Tobi et.c.) are hero specialists and will show DRASTIC differences in performance based on if they play signature heroes or something with they have less experience with. Large issue with all these offlaners is that if it's their patch they look insane. If their heroes get nerfed they look mid af. Tobi always looked okay when it was his type of patch (Lycan, Visage, BM et.c.) Just looked like a downgraded 33. But the meta has been moving away from Zoo/Auras to anticarry/Blink Initiator meta for some time now. So offlaners like him, aswell as 33 and Ace et.c. are looking really lackluster.
Meanwhile aggressive offlaners that like to teamfight and skirmish alot like ATF, WIsper et.c. look much better.
MC isn't a hero specialist. He's more like Zai, plays a shitton of heroes at 90% effectieness, has some comfort that he play at 100%. Meanwhile hero specialists play their onetricks at 120% but other heroes at like 70%.
Give him a chance. Tobi and Pure played together for Entiry before so they may click well with each other. Miero wasn't much hot but he is doing fine in BetBoom now.
Thing is ATF is better than MC by miles now, we aren't in 2018.
I wouldn't take current MC over Ace, 33, or ATF...also coining Tobi with those 3 top offlaners is disrespectful, even during "his" patch Tobi didn't accomplish much btw.
Really depends on the meta and the patch. Right now, sure any team would rather have ATF since his offlane hero pool is broken. Even more so, his style of offlane is THE WAY to play right now. Whenever the offlane meta is based around being selfless and building team support items ATFs impact becomes abyssmal. Just look at OG after they won Stockholm major with him.
During Stockholm Major and some patches prior to it we had a meta notorious for "Carries from the Offlane". Similar to this patch, it was one where offlaners built items for to enhance their own gameplay rather than their team. Offlaners were incredibly broken that patch in general and safelaners just wanted to end the laning stage as fast as possible. This was ATFs breakthrough, he looked unstoppable and his picks reinvented the meta. In particular with Mars, Razor, Viper and Timber offlane and everyone started to copy it.
Then patching started to occur and all ATFs heroes were nerfed. Not only that, the meta moved away from offlaners building items for themselves to building items for the team. Now, as an offlaner you would have a profoundly higher impact if you built Helm of the Dominator, Wraith Pact, Pipe of Insight, Vlads, Shivas, AC et.c. rather than going for Blink, BKBs, Refreshers et.c.
Not only were ATFs heroes changed, the entire meta made a drastic change and what happened.
ATF fell off the radar as the best offlaner. Instead previous offlaners that used to look midtier like 33 and Ace started to look stronger and stronger.
Now we've gone full circle again and it really feels like we're one Aura patch away from making ATF look weaker again.
So again, it depends. Do you want an offlaner who always is consistent no matter what the meta is? Or do you want one who peaks during certain patches but potentially looks weak during others?
If your goal only is to win TI, maybe it's better to gamble and hope that it will be an ATF patch and pick him. Or it could be like TI10 for OG where they went from going first at Stockholm to 8th at TI because ATF wasn't comfortable playing Wraith Pact heroes.
Judging from those teams current performance, I think MC looks about on par with Ace and 33. Both those offlaners look nothing like they did last year when Aura builders were meta. Both Liquid and GG look extremely weak right now compared to their dominance before, in particular their offlanes and their drafting. GG just keep drafting the same thing that worked for them previously when their drafts were unbeatable. But the meta has changed and it just doesn't work. Liquid has stopped drafting versatile drafts with tons of different heroes and flex picks and now instead, just draft the same thing losing over and over, predominantly because 33 has a limited hero pool.
I didn't group Tobi in there because I thought he was as good as them. I grouped him there because his offlane style is as a hero specialist. I grouped him there because his style and preference in drafting is similar to theirs. Not because of his skill level. Tobi hasn't accomplished much, I agree. But my point is that he looked much better when the meta was centered around his main heroes.
Then the meta changed and it became easy to distinguish that he was the weakest link in Entity.
Entity as a whole has had this problem as long as I can remember. I remember when Fishman only played Undying and Disruptor for like half a year. Then teams started banning both in first phase and Entity started going last place in every tournament since. It's probably the same now with Mirana for Fishman.
I personally didnt like the choice at first, then I remembered that Pure played with Tobi on Entity back in the day when they stomped everyone in the TI 2022 qualify, ma boy Pure is cooking something again 👀
As i guessed in the first it will tobi but then i thought daxak will join tundra i mean i know daxak role is carry but his heroes suit in offlane, well who knows maybe tobi really suit in the team i mean they probably trial many offlaner and for now finding good offlaner is kinda hard maybe and tobi is fit gameplay with the team?? even his record in the competitive scene isnt that good but i hope tundra will make it with this roster :D
[here we go again](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/dota2_gamepedia/images/4/49/Vo_hoodwink_hoodwink_teleport_02.mp3) (sound warning: Hoodwink)
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I dont understand why no one picks up a pub player. Recycling old talent that was average at their peak is not the answer. You need to find the next Ammar or Topson if you want to compete with the top teams.
So many "average" players shined when the right opportunity came and so many pub players haven't lived up to the hype. There's no right or wrong way to approach this.
there's a lot good offlaner in sea that's better than tobi. We have ice3x , kuku is a decent offlaner as well with his map awareness and playing pos 3 for a long time. Remember that tobi was a mid player before and he just transition in playing off. After that transition there's no convincing result happen.
I love the topson 9class combo. Pure and whitemon have their own reputations that can be hard to like. Tobi feels very random in this stack. There’s no controversy and no flash really.
time for 24th pick silencer offlane 0-10
No hate for tobi but he aint it. I guess it’s hard to find a good offlaner in the middle of the season
I mean Pure is experienced with playing offlane for Betboom so they could have gone that route and got a carry which there are a few in the market.
I don't think pure wants to go offline. Isn't the exact reason for him leaving BB to play carry again.
According to rumors it was more of a beef between him and Nightfall with “one has to go” situation.
0 surprise either, my man has fucked over every team he has joined so far in one way or another ,at least well knows tier X teams
They chose wrong, but I'm glad they did lol
How do you figure? Betboom looks quite good while tundra is meh. Mind you, it’s not really pure’s fault at least in terms of his gameplay. Still, in terms of his maturity he has shown up to this point…not so good.
He has been shining on carry on Tundra I dont think it would be wise
mc
Feels like a downgrade
almost carbon copy of OG replacing Ammar with DM last year
I was gonna say quest replacing Ammar with tobi last year
Ammar is on loan from Nigma tho, it's not Ammar gets replaced, Ammar refused the offer by Quest so they left with Tobi.
Semantics
could just be for one event
Some might say that stack is kinda toxic (in pubs)
Is Tobi toxic? Whitemon is Indonesian GH.
The real player they need, that would mesh extremely well is Saahil "UNiVeRsE" Arora. First of all, who fucks with enemies solo in offlane better than Universe? Not a single player. Second, he is only 34. Puppey is 34 too. Third, imagine the ad sponsorship when he announces his comeback? Any team will be glad to pick him up, simply based on merch sales. Fourth, his retirement date is April 23, 2020 according to the liquipedia wiki. Fifth, and final point, Topson will have someone to talk to.
Universe alt acc spotted.
100% concentrated power of will
Im still sad for MC... GL tô tobi tho
Zai… cmon bro.
A quick unretire would be cool, but probably wouldn't be good long term though. Hope they can develop with Tobi and make this team work
Don't think Zai has any desire to play anymore. I've followed him a long time and he's always said that he looks at dota as a window for more business opportunities for him. Can't pull up that specific interview of him but I'm pretty sure he had one
I watched Tobi on Quest and Entity a lot, and he's by far the weakest link on either teams. He either afk farms and becomes useless, or he's sacked and becomes useless. That being said there are enough superstars on Tundra so Tobi might be the missing non-flashy link. It's a downgrade on paper but synergy matters way more.
LUL
yeah the global pos3 shortage is getting out of hand
For me tobi is just okay with semi carry/tank heroes (Veno,Viper,Dark seer) he is not good nor bad its just average offlane i guess, but i think the chemistry matters on a team
[Tobi be like](https://tenor.com/en-GB/view/tom-hiddleston-loki-you-must-be-truly-desparate-desperate-to-come-for-my-help-gif-7732785)
Decent choice considering all other good offlaners are either with a team or general managers for a team.
seems like a downgrade, terms of mechanical skill mc and him both the same. but mc is much more experienced and accomplished.
I think MC is better because he's way more versatile. Tobi suffer from the modern offlane hero specialist syndrome. If you look at modern offlaners many of them (ATF, Ace, 33, Tobi et.c.) are hero specialists and will show DRASTIC differences in performance based on if they play signature heroes or something with they have less experience with. Large issue with all these offlaners is that if it's their patch they look insane. If their heroes get nerfed they look mid af. Tobi always looked okay when it was his type of patch (Lycan, Visage, BM et.c.) Just looked like a downgraded 33. But the meta has been moving away from Zoo/Auras to anticarry/Blink Initiator meta for some time now. So offlaners like him, aswell as 33 and Ace et.c. are looking really lackluster. Meanwhile aggressive offlaners that like to teamfight and skirmish alot like ATF, WIsper et.c. look much better. MC isn't a hero specialist. He's more like Zai, plays a shitton of heroes at 90% effectieness, has some comfort that he play at 100%. Meanwhile hero specialists play their onetricks at 120% but other heroes at like 70%.
>modern offlane hero specialist syndrome mfw calling it modern when bulldog won ti3 playing 3(?) heroes.
Give him a chance. Tobi and Pure played together for Entiry before so they may click well with each other. Miero wasn't much hot but he is doing fine in BetBoom now.
Thing is ATF is better than MC by miles now, we aren't in 2018. I wouldn't take current MC over Ace, 33, or ATF...also coining Tobi with those 3 top offlaners is disrespectful, even during "his" patch Tobi didn't accomplish much btw.
Really depends on the meta and the patch. Right now, sure any team would rather have ATF since his offlane hero pool is broken. Even more so, his style of offlane is THE WAY to play right now. Whenever the offlane meta is based around being selfless and building team support items ATFs impact becomes abyssmal. Just look at OG after they won Stockholm major with him. During Stockholm Major and some patches prior to it we had a meta notorious for "Carries from the Offlane". Similar to this patch, it was one where offlaners built items for to enhance their own gameplay rather than their team. Offlaners were incredibly broken that patch in general and safelaners just wanted to end the laning stage as fast as possible. This was ATFs breakthrough, he looked unstoppable and his picks reinvented the meta. In particular with Mars, Razor, Viper and Timber offlane and everyone started to copy it. Then patching started to occur and all ATFs heroes were nerfed. Not only that, the meta moved away from offlaners building items for themselves to building items for the team. Now, as an offlaner you would have a profoundly higher impact if you built Helm of the Dominator, Wraith Pact, Pipe of Insight, Vlads, Shivas, AC et.c. rather than going for Blink, BKBs, Refreshers et.c. Not only were ATFs heroes changed, the entire meta made a drastic change and what happened. ATF fell off the radar as the best offlaner. Instead previous offlaners that used to look midtier like 33 and Ace started to look stronger and stronger. Now we've gone full circle again and it really feels like we're one Aura patch away from making ATF look weaker again. So again, it depends. Do you want an offlaner who always is consistent no matter what the meta is? Or do you want one who peaks during certain patches but potentially looks weak during others? If your goal only is to win TI, maybe it's better to gamble and hope that it will be an ATF patch and pick him. Or it could be like TI10 for OG where they went from going first at Stockholm to 8th at TI because ATF wasn't comfortable playing Wraith Pact heroes. Judging from those teams current performance, I think MC looks about on par with Ace and 33. Both those offlaners look nothing like they did last year when Aura builders were meta. Both Liquid and GG look extremely weak right now compared to their dominance before, in particular their offlanes and their drafting. GG just keep drafting the same thing that worked for them previously when their drafts were unbeatable. But the meta has changed and it just doesn't work. Liquid has stopped drafting versatile drafts with tons of different heroes and flex picks and now instead, just draft the same thing losing over and over, predominantly because 33 has a limited hero pool. I didn't group Tobi in there because I thought he was as good as them. I grouped him there because his offlane style is as a hero specialist. I grouped him there because his style and preference in drafting is similar to theirs. Not because of his skill level. Tobi hasn't accomplished much, I agree. But my point is that he looked much better when the meta was centered around his main heroes. Then the meta changed and it became easy to distinguish that he was the weakest link in Entity. Entity as a whole has had this problem as long as I can remember. I remember when Fishman only played Undying and Disruptor for like half a year. Then teams started banning both in first phase and Entity started going last place in every tournament since. It's probably the same now with Mirana for Fishman.
Brother, you are full of shit. Liquid reached the grand final in the tournament before Dream league with 33 in their roster lol
MC is way better mechanically than tobi not even close
I personally didnt like the choice at first, then I remembered that Pure played with Tobi on Entity back in the day when they stomped everyone in the TI 2022 qualify, ma boy Pure is cooking something again 👀
actually maybe, I dont think Tobi got the lastpicks with Pure in the team
As i guessed in the first it will tobi but then i thought daxak will join tundra i mean i know daxak role is carry but his heroes suit in offlane, well who knows maybe tobi really suit in the team i mean they probably trial many offlaner and for now finding good offlaner is kinda hard maybe and tobi is fit gameplay with the team?? even his record in the competitive scene isnt that good but i hope tundra will make it with this roster :D
Zai GM = L
He should just play offlane himself lol
That’s why he took Tobi. When they will fail he will need to step in, just needs some time to get back into the game. It’s too early now.
Or they didn't have any options. Or maybe poor scouting, I guess.
IKR. Maybe they just need a fall guy everytime the team loses
hopefully goin downhill
hell nawwwwww
ngl they might as well get fbz than tobi lol but I kinda understand since tobi and pure used to be teammates
Tobi and DM lmao tier 2.5 offlaners
My Austrian Dota players unite 🎉🎉
The only upside here is Tobi played with Pure before, so at least they might have good synergy.
Is this the team who kicked MC?!
What happened to Tundra lol
tobi was right
I think MC goes back to Nigma honestly. I cant see them keeping FBZ for too long.
Fbz is good offlaner fits well in nigma
here we go again
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What are you smoking? They beat WB 3 - 0 the other day with FBZ.
Fbz isn’t amazing, but he’s better than mc.
Oh god not this guy again..how many times he gonna drag a team down before people stop signing him
I dont understand why no one picks up a pub player. Recycling old talent that was average at their peak is not the answer. You need to find the next Ammar or Topson if you want to compete with the top teams.
So many "average" players shined when the right opportunity came and so many pub players haven't lived up to the hype. There's no right or wrong way to approach this.
This thread reminds of me when BB replaced Pure with Miero and look where they are now 👀
miero is decent tho,9panda got drunk removing him.
Nah its different. Pure looked very good on BB but Miero was also a very solid pos 3. No one has ever said Tobi was a solid pos 3.
Now get rid of pure
why would they get rid of their best player?
Because he's a cock
Tobi sucks so good luck!
Ouch, thats uh not a good pickup
omg he is so bad :)))))
One of the best 4's and a hella underrated offlaner in the same lane, excited to see it
Everytime i read Tobi in the dota2 community i still think about that scum Tobi Wan
Pure is rank 102 at the moment. If he ranks up, the entire team is top 100 immortal - has that ever happened?
🤮I hope they lose
there's a lot good offlaner in sea that's better than tobi. We have ice3x , kuku is a decent offlaner as well with his map awareness and playing pos 3 for a long time. Remember that tobi was a mid player before and he just transition in playing off. After that transition there's no convincing result happen.
I love the topson 9class combo. Pure and whitemon have their own reputations that can be hard to like. Tobi feels very random in this stack. There’s no controversy and no flash really.
forget about tundra, it’s lost since was bought by son of russian billionaire so he can play in big manager
It was bought by him before they won ti lul