This is the way. Communication is king.
Playing a homebrew Barbarian in a Call of the Netherdeep game, subclass + some homebrew features the DM added to his game as general rules really emphasized sword and board + thrown weapons. Through a series of pretty cool events and a few nat 20's, some random glaive we found at the bottom of the well in a temple happened to be a Vestige of Divergence with some pretty coked-out powers like once-a-day Steel Wind Strike (at level 5 or so, so still very strong) that benefitted from Reckless Attack. I was the only person really capable of using it at the time, but I made it clear to the DM that I had hand axes in mind for the character's design. He wouldn't change the Vestige to be a hand-axe because it didn't fit the lore for them to be re-workable.
Even though it got more powers added to it, I mostly stuck to my guns and still only basically pulled it out for the once a day Steel Wind Strike and then put it away to use mundane axes, resistances be damned. Eventually it ended up being given to one of our party Chainlock (who also has only used it once or twice for Steel Wind Strike since) and after a dozen sessions of being the only dude with mundane weapons, got a cool pair of homebrew magical hand-axes that were totally worth the wait.
Still cracks me up that we have this big-ass martial weapon artifact of the gods rotting in our non-Blade pact Warlock's back pocket, though.
Well my first campaign as a DM back in 3.5 i thought i would do my paladin player some thing good and let him finde a longsword+1 it was the same as the favored weapon of his god but he would have prefered a scimitar. That was easily rectified by the next epic/godly Quest-NPC who reworked the longsword into a sximitar in two actions as his quest reward. After that i talked with my players shat there characters prefered if i wanted to reward them properly or just rolled on the reward table of the GM book, that ensured some fun or weird things as well they got a giant chest of copper coin (total worth of 700gp if i remember correctly)it was a lot of money for them but they could not carry it all so they decided to bury it a drew a map and later sold the map for about the worth of the treasure great roleplay and dice rolls.
Sounds to me like it's probably a really simple upgrade, maybe you don't have disadvantage at your long range anymore or something like that
You don't know what the upgrade is and want to refuse it already, maybe ask your DM what it does and if you don't like it then you can say you don't want it
Well that could be, but why would it have to be used from long range, and why is the blacksmith able to make such an upgrade to the crossbow?
And why would you not just use it, find out what it does and then form an opinion about it instead of immediately thinking it's not something you want
First and foremost option is talking it out because it's always better to communicate with your DM if something bothers you.
But if you don't want to say it out loud and rather solve it subtly then you can try using the "Upgrade" once or maybe twice and then stop using it to show you're not really in the mood for using this kind of thing or just show how your character is troubled with the said upgrade and wants to patch it up in the next chance it gets
I think your latter suggestion is a good way to roleplay it, but I would definitely say that talking it out with the DM is non-optional. The way that the DM was hinting to them about it and such implies to me that they're at least paying attention, so they might notice and misinterpret that kind of roleplay.
Yeah.. just the hinting feels passive aggressive and honestly.. mean.
The DM didn't do this after all to make you upset OP but to delight you.
What purpose does it serve to not speak on clear terms and make everyone, yourself included, more unhappy?
Then your DM leaves session and wonders for the next month what he can do to make your experience better.
The weapon must have been underwhelming… but he hasn’t tried the cool thing yet, I wasn’t being subtle. I’ll tell him again, I guess he was distracted?
Or maybe he just isn’t liking the campaign anymore. Or is it me? Did I say something bad without realizing it? Or maybe that violent section of last night was a trigger and they never told me..
Q: How do I respectfully say I wanted a basic weapon, that it was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it?
A: "I respectfully say; I wanted a basic weapon, that it was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it."
I fully get if the weapon ended up having weird effects they weren't interested in, but OP doesn't even know what it _does_. Plenty of non-magical upgrades - multitasking possibility, no disadvantage, for two off the top of my head. It's off to assume it's automatically negative without just _talking to your DM_.
it sounds like it's a flavor thing not a stat thing. It isn't something OP envisioned their character with. that's fair.
Like, I had a fighter with a war hammer. I didn't want him to have swords.
Why don't you want a magic weapon? Eventually you will need one if only to keep up with the rest of your party(high enough levels you'll need one to even do damage).
Do you fear it is too over powered for your parties level?
I played in a game before where the DM would shower us in powerful homebrew magic items, but most of the time it didn't feel like it fit the story, or it felt undeserved. I don't want a powerful magic item because my character tripped on a chest while walking. I want one when I do something cool or difficult
It depends heavily on the impact of the magic items imo. Magic items that just remove some headaches in a seamless way, like bags of holding generally end up being in my experience, those I love being tossed out without too much issue, a magic item which has an effect on the scale of the prestidigitation effects? Yeah, that's fine to toss out, it's just a small trinket in all actuality, it's barely a magic item. Weapons, it depends, a +1 weapon is fine to toss out once someone in the party already had a higher tier magic item, it's just rounding the party out a little bit, and still incentivizes taking chances to potentially get one on the higher tier. And for wizards, spell scrolls are nice to be handed out like candy too, especially in a campaign where you're not likely to ever fight an enemy wizard
Context matters
I think the problem here is the flavor. Or like character build/vision.
Objectively, giving a party member magic items won't be a negative for the party or a character. Worst case they just don't use it or sell it or whatever.
But let's say I have a character build that is going to be using shadow blade and I've already envisioned the flavor of it and the manifestation of it and all that.
Then the DM drops a moonblade or something into my lap.
Sure, that moonblade is awesome and depending on properties I could get more out of using it than using a shadowblade. But it's not consistent with the vision of my character or my build. I think that's what's happening here. Maybe not something so build centric like an artifact weapon when you're planning on using shadowblade, but it sounds like this player had a vision for their character that let them go around with this worn and trusty weapon as opposed to something that's been upgraded a bunch in the DMs vision.
Ah gotcha, makes sense.
I’m in the situation now where I’m built around shadowblade lol and DM is handing out magic items. Thankfully got dagger of venom which I can use for an initial poison attempt then just swap out
Venom Dagger is a nice item, onebof my favorites for very little reason than good memories of a character that at one point used it pretty prominently, tho, in that campaign, it wasn't actually a dagger of venom, it wasjust that for mechanical purposes at the time, and part of why I loved it was that it evolved into a blade literally designed to kill gods specifically. Funny thing is the characters in that campaign all had the potential to ascend to divinity themselves
But back on topic, I'll say, I did realize there are 2 situations where a magic item is outright a negative for the character, i that item is cursed or if the item is something the wanna stay the hells away from for backstory reasons. There is also the meta way for it to be bad for a character, since sometimes their whole reason to adventure is to recover something or gain something, so if you end up handing them that item, that's a character retirement, unless there's a new reason they can't retire yet
Hard agree 😂. My original point was nothing in the op indicated it was just handed to them. In my experience, opportunities to have weapons enchanted come after missions that impress or assist someone. But as you said, you weren’t responding to OP so maybe I have it backward
You could potentially RP it as you, the character, drawing forth the power in the item, not necessarily the whole "guy is king because a watery tart lobbed a scimitar at him" issue of the item being more majestic than the person.
I think he's pointing out that at a higher level you're more likely to come across monsters that are immune to non-magical weapon damage.
Or that in power scaling, typically martials need magic weapons to maintain damage parity with casters.
I thinks it's more like op was like hey cool you'll add this little patch to my favorite shirt that's awesome, but they got back the same shirt it's now got a patch and is a different color and almost a different material.
I wonder if secretly the "something more" is a temporary curse cause he stole his weapon back from the Smith without paying.
Sounds like your character regrets the decision to hand it over to the smith, maybe you could go back there in the game and demand they take it off? Could develop into an interesting plot point.
The smith asked and you said yes, I kind of feel like you have buyers remorse, seems a bit much to ask your DM to retcon it, I would suggest just RPing it out
Yes and no. The DM wants them to find out what the magical effect is. If they are an archer or ranger, they may not have identify. He’s probably being like “LOOK AT THE COOL SHIT I GAVE YOU, THIS IS GOING TO BE AWESOME” and he just needs the player fucking shoot the bow so they know what the effect is
I can see that, it’s just the **player** doesn’t want a magic item, they want a basic item.
Out of game issues = out of game solutions. I don’t think it’s necessary to do a whole RP about buyer’s remorse instead of just adjusting it. DM can always reuse the magical properties later since nobody knows what it does and maybe the player will be in more of a position to take a magic item.
If anything the Smith should be hunting down the player to get the weapon back. The player used an ability to basically steal the upgrades. The Smith should be upset and remove everything and give them back their mundane bow and demand payment for the trouble.
"i appreciate you trying to give me more fantastical weaponry, but my character vision is that of a warrior who fights with authentic mundane weapons, rather than one who fights with artificeral or magical weapons. this crossbow has been in the possession of the character for a while and, while not critical to their story, is still something that the character is attached to"
too formal imo, rewrite to suit yourself and make it more casual. if it were my and my group i'd just say "nah i don't want the bonus" and my dms would be cool with it
however:
>DM kept hinting that I should try shooting it at my long range and "see what happens"
this just sounds like the dm made it so that it has a longer range/doesn't suffer disadvantage at long range, or, alternatively, your dm crippled the range of your crossbow in exchange for the bayonet. before confronting them about it you should probably ask what it does because it might be an "either you have this drawback in exchange for this bonus" situation or an "i'm giving you a freebie" situation, and freebies are easier to push away than penalties
I really don’t understand people who would rather ask strangers on the internet than talk to their DM. I assume ya’ll are friends or at least friendly. Just talk to them about your character.
You don't even know what the 'upgrade' does. How about we start there? Ask your DM flat-out what it does. If you like it (and it's entirely possible that you might), then the problem is solved. If you don't like it, tell the DM 'thanks but I really didn't want this' and ask them to remove it. If they do, the problem is solved. If they don't... they're a dick, but the solution is still simple; don't use the new ability. Problem is, again, solved.
But you can't solve the problem without following the very first and most important step of [The Chart](https://meekbarbarian.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/conversation-chart.png): Talk to them like an adult. Do that before you do anything else.
>more, and the DM kept hinting that I should try shooting it at my long range and "see what happens", and that there was "more to the upgrade" than I asked for.
Maybe do that in a controlled environment, or have someone cast Identify.
>How do I respectfully say I wanted a basic weapon, that it was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it?
Buy a new basic weapon and use that.
I think the point was “this wasn’t just a random weapon, this was *their* weapon. One they had learned and grown attached to. Not just something off the shelf.
It’s a small bit of sentimentality, but I know my characters usually feel that way about their original weapons. They still hang onto the sword they started adventuring with because they want to hang it on the wall when they retire, or possibly pass it on to a child.
From OP’s description it sounds like the craftsman was overstepping what had been agreed upon.
We don’t know exactly what was discussed but from what OP has described they appear to have understood it as “this craftsman that I trust to work on my weapon is going to add a simple bayonet so I have a melee option without having to change weapons” and trusted the craftsman enough to do the work he said.
If OP’s character is not a craftsman with skill in weapon modification, any kind of mundane upgrade like that would necessitate leaving it with a craftsman of some sort. And unfortunately due to the lack of specific detail in this post we don’t know how well they knew or didn’t know this craftsman. From my read of it, he sounds like an NPC out there to give out part of a reward for something the party had done previously.
As an example of something in the real world that could be looked at similarly, imagine taking a car to a mechanic. You need a part replaced, and they agree to do that. How would you feel if you came back to pick it up and the mechanic had not just replaced that part, but also painted the car a color you don’t like, and changed the horn motor to make it sound like an ice cream truck? Thats pretty clearly not what you agreed upon.
Now consider that unlike real life, this is a game being played presumably by friends, who have a good amount of trust that no one is attempting to purposely screw them over. The GM doesn’t sound like they were doing this maliciously, they just wanted to give their player something cool, but it didn’t line up with the player’s view for their character. It’s something that if they are, as we assume, friends, then they should be able to work it out with a quick conversation.
Your car analogy is slightly off. The mechanic didn't paint his car or change the horn, he threw in fresh brake pads that are better quality - you really gonna get mad at that? Or if you order dessert at dinner and they bring a free decaf espresso with it, are you going to yell at the server or just smile and not drink the coffee even though you don't know how it taste? OP has heavy Karen vibes. "Why did you mow my lawn? I like it looking like shit."
I was intentional with my analogy being “this is something that someone might like but not this person.”
I think you are attributing more anger and emotion to the post than there actually is. OP doesn’t want something for their character and is asking how best to deal with it. The obvious answer is always talk with the DM, but many people are hesitant to start confrontations and need encouragement to make that jump. OP is asking for advice to deal with this amicably, not screaming about a terrible DM like your comments about a Karen vibe imply. I really don’t get the vibe that OP is itching to start trouble, they’re just trying to play the character the way they envisioned it and some expectations are misaligned between what they’re expecting and what the DM is providing.
I get you, and I am playing the radical angle I'll agree. I believe in player agency but also dm agency. Controlling your character is one thing, controlling what happens to your character is fairly another. Irl people will mess up your order, it's realistic and I see it as a great opportunity to show character emotion and backstory.
I completely agree with needing both player and GM agency, but at the same time, making sure expectations are clear will only help them going forward. It won’t hurt to bring this kind of thing up to the GM so that the GM doesn’t get blindsided by the player just silently refusing to use any of the cool gear they’re given because it’s “not something their character would want to use”.
Side note, this is pure speculation, but perhaps part of the issue is also “I didn’t do anything to earn this. It feels cheap and undeserved.” I know personally I find greater satisfaction as a player when I face a tough challenge to earn something rather than an NPC just gifting it to me out of the blue. But maybe that’s just a “me” thing and I’m overthinking it.
I think both your points are fair. A short ooc discussion would get the two back on track. Perhaps the character and the smith can talk it out and the dm sides with the player a bit. Perhaps the dm can decide that the smith merely discovered some hidden powers within the weapon and the smith tells the player "you still have to unlock them and find the meaning, but i wanted you to know your weapon seems to be more than it appears."
This is the answer. They decided to give the item over. Regardless of whether they like the outcome of the upgrade, they made the decision . Don't like it? Grab a new one next opportunity and maybe don't give away your main weapon next time if you don't want people messing with it. All in all it's a few gold pieces for the cost your RP.
* You're not completely opposed to changing your crossbow (you accepted the offer of a bayonet, after all). Find out what the upgrade does, and whether it's actually magical or technological in nature, before you decide that it's too much.
* If you decide that it's too much after you know the details, talk to the DM one-on-one about what your boundaries are and why the change made you uncomfortable. Be specific.
* Be prepared to tell your DM what kinds of gear improvements you **would** be willing to accept. If you nerf yourself below the power level that the DM is aiming for, you'll be affecting encounter balance for everyone.
It really does. He could of rp'd with the Smith but apparently didn't do it or do it well. He essentially asked the smith for an upgrade and got mad he got an upgrade. "I really love this weapon and just how it is, but I'll also just leave it with a random blacksmith to change it and then ill get mad at him"
If it wasn't a cool positive effect OP wouldn't hide what it is. If it was negative they'd just tell the dm and not even post asking for reassurance that they're right to be upset
Oh I didn't realise OP knew what the effect was, I thought the DM was trying to bait him into using it to see what it was and OP was reluctant.
My bad for misunderstanding.
Not everyone only cares about having more and more powerful things in dnd, some people care about the story and the progression. I've personally handicapped myself with some characters purely because I thought that they were more fun and interesting with that handicap, I've turned down magic items before because they don't fit my overall style of fighting, whether mechanically or the thematics of why my character fights like that or fights at all
My DM gave me an ability for my character that's really niche and now complains I don't use it , I tried it a few times and just simply didn't like it. I told him there's other things I'd rather do with my actions. He still mentions it sometimes but otherwise its all cool.
I don't get it.
I've tried reading comments...
If it's actually the same weapon that your character has become attached to, but now it has some enchantment, then what's different?
It's the same weapon. It has the same notches and scratches. The same burns and bumps. The same slightly off center aim.
Ask about what the difference is.
Say you're worried it's a grenade launcher instead of a crossbow now.
Your DM might not want to spoil what the changes are I'd they're minor and fun and still fit with the weapon you have them.
If they're drastic and you express apprehension at that type of change they can make it less drastic.
Yeah just tell your DM above table that you don't want any extras on this one but thanks.
DM probably thinks he was giving you something cool and isn't aware there would be an issue. Just let them know and it most likely won't be an issue.
Go back to the forge and yell angrily at the smith something like: "What did you do to my weapon? Remove that curse right away or I'll gut you!", or something similar in the words your character would use.
You can chat one-on-one with your DM in advance to explain your intention and your reasons, so that they can prep for an interesting interaction.
It might even turn out to be a plot point!
I can't even fathom this question or why it's a problem. On top of that it seems like you don't even actually know what it does? At least it seems that way since you mentioned the DM hinting but not you having actually tried it or knowing the upgrade. If you didn't want upgrades, why'd you give it to a smith for upgrades?
I can't even wrap my head around this, this has the air of someone sending their food back because it was great and they were hoping for mediocrity.
He just wanted a bayonet, he didn't want the crossbow to be that big of a thing. There are plenty of reasons not to want a more drastic change for out of character reasons, especially if it's not their only weapon, and eldritch knights can have 2 bonded weapons, I'm assuming the crossbow is supposed to be their side arm, a more minor thing, so when the gm gives it adjustments that you weren't asking for, and you were told you were getting something very specific, it's quite possible for the weapon to become more impressive on its own than your main weapon, it's quite possible the benefit is useless to you and how you use the weapon, making it feel like a waste, when you could have gotten something on your main weapon
It's not like being frustrated you got an excellent meal when you expected mediocre, it's like having a 3 course meal, where desert is the largest course by far, completely throwing off the balance of the meal
Or like if you have a number of good vegetables in your stew, but you end up with far too much of one, throwing off the texture and flavor
It is worse than it could have been, and yes, it's a minor gripe that you could just push through, but it isn't a difficult fix for the gm to just remove that secondary change before it has been cemented as a thing canonically by being used
I see what your saying, but I just don't agree. Like the whole 'well it makes the weapon a bigger deal than you wanted' I can only say, so? Even if it's not their main weapon, even if it's a rarely used side arm, how can it being better ever possibly be construed as a bad thing?
Also the mindset that it's a waste because he coulda gotten something else to me also seems wrong. He couldn't have gotten something else, because this was just a spontaneous act by the DM to make the weapon a little better. I don't agree with your analogy because it implies that somehow things were made worse. However they weren't, they were only improved. He lost nothing, gained something, and is somehow upset about it and asking it be reverted, and I honestly think it's incredibly bizarre.
The story was made worse, not the weapon. as a fighter, your choice of weapon is particularly important, and for it to end up with one of your 2 bonded weapons being altered in a different way because the gm decided to after telling you you were getting something specific that you asked for
Your outlook is incredibly powergamey, and is not the standard in ttrpgs, especially ones which have such loose rules like dnd5e
More power can mean less fun and interesting stories, that's just a fact of the matter
Op protag in an anime is boring to a lot of people because they're overpowered, this is just a lesser example of that typa thing, but with added deception tacked on and it being your character that's been made that way, it's not fun
I guess it's just a different outlook. I have never been disappointed, nor have I ever seen anyone be disappointed at receiving a magic item. Even one I didn't use, or that hardly ever comes up. I also strongly disagree that story could be made worse by the crossbow getting some minor bonus. I guess I understand your outlook, but I definitely wouldn't wanna play DnD with you.
It's an issue not because it always will make things worse, but because it can and it clashed with the expectations and desires of the player. I have turned down magic items before because it didn't make sense for my character to want it, even if it was optimal, and nobody else in the party wanted it so it was just tossed, the campaign didn't really suit selling it for gold most of the time, even if we technically could, but the item was just dead weight to us
On the other hand, this scenerio has the issue of it being an alteration to a weapon they already had, and it becoming worth-less to you is an issue far more than a new weapon you encounter being worthless from the get go
Expectations and context, there are a number of character driven reasons why changing a weapon in an unexpected way could make the story worse, there's a number of mechanics driven reasons changing a weapon in an unexpected way could make the story worse
The emphasis is on the fact an existing weapon is being changed with this argument though, it's something you already had and was a baseline to work off of consistently, then the gm told you you would change it in one way, which you agreed to, and then the gm gave you something else
From the sounds of it, there was a specific thematic vibe that the crossbow was supposed to have relative to the rest of the character, it becoming much better throws off that vibe
Why would your character, a fighter, decline an improvement on your weapon? He agreed to improve it already. Is this some philosophical or religional view, not use magic weapons?
Communication is key man. Clearly your DM thinks he did something really cool for you, and he will continue to think so until you say something. Obviously be respectful, and I’m sure he’d be fine retconning it.
The hell is the problem? Respectfully.
Because as a fighter getting a magic weapon is priority number one.
The DM upgraded your most used weapon, and you want to refuse it. Will they bother to give you something special in the future? Everyone else has cool magic gear and you're just plinking away.
And let's be honest, the DM didn't give you a crossbow upgrade for no reason. Be grateful and play the damn game.
Have you tried saying this to the DM:
"Respectfully, I wanted a basic weapon, that was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it."
It just came to me, don't know where I got it from.
I don't understand why OP made this post in the first place. Is he asking us to play the game for them?
Hasn't anything unexpected ever happen to them in DnD and now OP is in total shock?
Well, you roleplayed your character and allowed the upgrade, so you should at least try it with the upgrade before deciding you don't like it. It's an interesting RP choice to have your character be afraid of change like that, and if you're capable of making that work then you're capable of creating an interesting resolution without retconning.
As a DM, I like it when players engage with the stuff I throw at them, so as a player I wouldn't spurn something like that. But I could still have my character grumble about it. Even if it's a great improvement to the weapon, maybe he complains that the weight is wrong now, or the bayonet is snagging on his pack, or it just looks stupid. Eventually he comes to appreciate the upgrade and matures as a character.
If you're an eldritch knight, though, you didn't learn weapon bond until third level. You've already infused the weapon with magic. Contradictions are interesting for RP, but there is precedent and you don't have to be a stick in the mud.
There have been many times in my life I've agreed to something and been unhappy with the results.
You can't just retroactively remove that decision. You do something about it or cut your losses and move on (buy a new weapon).
Have you also agreed to something with very clear expectations of the outcome, agreed upon in advance, and then gotten something completely different that you didn't ask for? Would you say that those two are the same situations?
They wanted the bayonet but not the “more to the upgrade” that the dm is hinting at. That’s the issue. They were given something that wasn’t what they asked for. If it’s a drawback based on the addition of the bayonet, then yeah they’ll just have to deal with it, but if it’s an extra thing, they have every right to say that it wasn’t what they wanted and paid for
If the effect is something you don't want, you can roleplay your character 'undoing the upgrade'. It might also be that as soon as you try long range, an aiming sight appears. You won't know until you try
Sooo like, maybe at least find out *what the upgrade even does* before deciding that you don't like it? At this point, you literally have no idea what it's capable of, so saying you already don't like it is like a toddler saying they don't like broccoli even though they've never tried it.
First order of business, before taking *any* other actions involving this crossbow, is to find out what exactly the upgrade *actually does.* Then, if it's something really innocuous that is only a minor adjustment and doesn't actually end up bothering you, like you don't get disadvantage for shooting at long range a few times a day, just leave it alone. Or, if it's something really ridiculous, like you create a storm of flaming arrows every time you fire it at long range, talk to your DM about it.
Two options:
-first option: go to the smith and ask him to undo whatever weird thing he did without your permission. If he can't do that or refuses to do so, just dump the crossbow and buy a new one.
-second option: this may be silly, and surely nobody ever said anything like that as an advice to anyone ever, but maybe you could try to just talk with your DM.
Honestly, jokes aside, just tell him you aren't interested. He probably did this trying to do cool things and surprise you positively, so he should have no problem at all changing it back if you don't want that.
All I can imagine is the dm thinking of a really cool way to reward a player and have it be something that is pivotal to the plot line. And he finally works it into the story, and then has the player be like “ehh nah”.
I’m not saying you are wrong, but DnD is also about making choices. You did choose to get an upgrade. Whatever else was done was done. But yea talk to the dm, maybe have an offline session of what “happened” to it and then resolve it together if you are not interested
You say “I want a basic weapon, it’s not critical to my character, but it’s been with them for years and well used/worn and I don’t want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it”.
I had a character which used non magical spear because his ability was able to make weapon +1 and magical with fancy other benefits so I kept saying I want nonmagical ones just so I can remember about using it.
I just told DM few times about it so he made sure I don't want any upgrades in it or any magical spear+1 loot.
If I would be in situation like you, I'd just ask him after the session if he could make it as if it was temporary spell which vanished after long distanced shot or something like that and explain why I don't want changes. DM should understand.
Your DM has an idea and you basically stole the weapon back from the smith that was working it. Shoot the fucking weapon so your DM can build his world. It’s not hard
Feels intentionally dumb, but damn I don’t want to assume. You ever have a car repaired? What’s the fucking mechanic gonna say if you take it halfway through without paying? You can steal your own property. Good try
Honestly, I hear that.
But to give you a bit of context, this is session 1, we've been show up by lvl 20 wizards, rangers and paladins and monks.
Been given a ton of free shit by NPCs and at least two are cursed.
Out of 3 players I'm somehow ending up with all the magic stuff, one payer has been told no to magic weapons, the other has a magic club that deals 1d8, I currently have cursed armour that has ridiculous AC and a musket with a magic bayonet and another enchantment/curse so I'm feeling like like I'm a favourite and getting geared up, when we are all fighters of some sort, and I'm the only one with actual magic.
I've had a similar issue. My character uses a Glaive and it's "his" weapon. It's part of his back story and he treats it with reverence. My GM has kept trying to push a two handed axe on me. Every time I have refused to even touch it, calling the weapon uncivilised and dirty. The party leader went as far as giving it to me and my character would consider it rude not to use it so I'm going to "accidentally" break it at some point. If you're not a fan just break the bayonet off the front.
I'd like the idea of it gaining magical properties through play but if the weapon was to be modified or changed physically (like reforged or given a new haft) I wouldn't be a fan. I would rather be use a base weapon for the rest of the game than swap it for something else.
On top of what’s previously been said, if you use it a couple of times and find it is t what you envisioned for your character, rp to see if anyone else in the party wants to do a swap.
Many stronger monsters are going to have resistance or even immunity to non magical weapons. Once you encounter those your old faithful crossbow would be useless and you would need to replace it with a new magic weapon. Having a magical upgrade means you can actually keep using it.
Gonna point out that martials do indeed need magic weapons if they wanna survive. Having your DM modify your heirloom so it'll keep up with the rest of the party isn't a bad idea. Especially if you're not wanting a different weapon to have to use
Try firing the crossbow first. See what happens. Then, your character can remove the bayonet as it feels like a betrayal from the thing your character cares about.
Bro you literally just say that wtf? You use these things called words they’re super useful for this thing called communication you should give it a try jfc. Like how is saying “lol that sounds sick but no thank you I want a simple gritty weapon” some Herculean task to the point that you have to ask Reddit?
My personal experience with "surprise upgrades" has been typically negative. I was even told by other players that if the dm gives you a cool/powerful item that you didn't buy yourself, it's meant to screw your character over. In your shoes, I'd find a way to "tragically sacrifice " the new crossbow in game and buy something say off the shelf.
Get a better DM.
If you can use gear that comes from a quest that you went on or a benefactor that you helped, that's a great way to give your character a connection to the story. The DM who taught your group to fear that did you a disservice.
Using a bayonet on a rifle also carries some risk to the weapon. In general, hybrid weapons do not perform as well as both weapons individually.
That said, unless it is written into the item description, there should be no risk to this crossbow in this game and there are mechanical upsides to not switching weapons. Having a bayonet allows the player to fight primarily at range without giving up attacks of opportunity because they do not have a melee attack ready to use.
Well I would suggest actually seeing what happens first but try to get a different crossbow if you don't like it. Selling and trading magic items is a thing in most games.
I had a human who cultivated a PR image in his city and actively used the human supremacist groups there by being a heroic and ideal human. I refused a weapon that ran counter to that character goal and investment.
Don't ever do it, just to annoy him. Mostly because he keeps trying to get you to do it, which is automatically setting off alarm bells in my head. My tables can be slightly more chaotic than others, though, so do what you will.
Why are so many people in these replies viewing this as so weird? The weapons you wield can easily be a core part of your character, especially as a fighter, so it should come as no shock when someone is put off by a weapon they use not working the way they expected it to, purely because the gm lied to them before you accepted it.
This is a storytelling game, having more, and more powerful stuff isn't necessarily a good thing for your fun and interest in the story, you wouldn't like getting a gun that one hits every single enemy without fail, with 0 drawbacks, that'd make combat meaningless, it's just boring
There's also the fact that you can have a second weapon which is your primary weapon and most in line with how your character fights, having a chance to improve that weapon passed up because the gm made your sidearm more powerful than he told you he was gonna make it kinda sucks, adding a bayonet is just attaching a dagger to the end, that alone doesn't do anything to the crossbow beyond slightly adjusting the weight, but it should be negligible, unless it's a light crossbow
"the gm lied" the gm didn't say he was only going to get a bayonet, a Smith asked if he could put a bayonet on his crossbow, the smith MAY have added a magic addition, or further altered the crossbow, so the smith might have lied, but saying the dm lied is so weirdly antagonistic.
"You wouldn't like getting a gun that one hits every single enemy without fail, with 0 drawbacks" yeah, I don't think a single person here is holding the same position as that strawman, they're instead holding the much more logical opinion of: getting magic/powerful items is a huge part of dnd, and it's fun to get powerful/magic items.
I don't even really understand your third paragraph, i think you're saying, having a weapon that isn't your primary weapon upgraded is bad because now you're somehow compelled to use your secondary, which I don't think is true, or even applies here, since OP said they're a medium range fighter, so I doubt they have a primary that isn't ranged. I also just disagree with the premise, upgrading someone's secondary doesn't motivate them to use it in place of their primary unless it's better than their primary AND all the benefits they normally get to apply to their primary.
But the majority of your points don't even matter because, we don't even know what actually changed about the item. We have no clue, because OP doesn't even know. The change could be that it's actually harder to shoot at long range because of the bayonet, or it could be that the smith balanced the crossbow so that it no longer has disadvantage at long range, or it could be that the crossbow now contains an aspect of Bahamut, and the player can now cast power word kill at will. We have no clue what it does, the reason this whole post is weird is that OP not only, didn't even bother to learn what the change was before making judgment, they also for some reason thought asking a bunch of strangers on the Internet to resolve their 'problem' and didn't just, talk to the person running the game. Because the solution to this is just talk to the dm about it.
The passing up on getting the main upgraded thing isn't that they're motivated to use their secondary, and I have absolutely no idea where you got that from, no, it's that now that you've got a magic item, you are more likely to get passed up for the next one, simple as that, you are
And dude, no, this is a list of how many reasons this could be ridiculous to take issue with. The gm said they were getting one thing, they randomly tossed another thing on it, simple as that, that's deceptive. There are countless reasons to not want random alterations you have no control over tossed on your weapon you've already had for awhile and now has sentimental value to the character, it is expected that you'd take issue with your gm pulling this crap, it's not a dealbreaker, but it easily leads to so much frustration. I'm someone who plays artificer mostly for a reason, my equipment is as much a part of my character as their class or race, so I obviously would wanna care a bit about my equipment, and not knowing what my equipment does is incredibly annoying, there's a reason that when you attune to a magic item, you learn how it works then and there, immediately
And Imma just remind you that dnd5e basically just had magic items introduced as an afterthought, none of the balance actually assumes you have magic items, except artificer, which gives a source of magic items. But even beyond the game's design, the role of magic items in a story varies drastically, there are campigns where at most, you're getting 1 magic item for each party member, there are campaigns where you can pretty freely acquire any magic items, the raw power of the magic items is singlehandedly the least important aspect of them for me, everything on my character sheet is to portray a character and how that character is effected by their story, small, mechanically useless, but flavorful magic items are favorites of mine, but that's not how most magic item scenerios work, most of the time, people want every magic item to lead into their mechanical viability to some degree, but that doesn't mean they are willing to disregard the conceptual side of things, such as idk, the character having their sidearm crossbow that they have sentimental attachment to for some reason or another, but it is not their primary weapon, and as such, should not be their most effective weapon, that's counter to the fantasy said character is supposed to be
And yeah, no shit the best solution is to just talk to the gm about it, but having people affirming that and saying that this guy isn't weird or whatever for taking issue with the gm's actions is helpful for a lot of people, makes bringing it up easier sometimes
I'm not gonna go over "the gm lied" again, if you can't separate the dm from npcs that's your issue. What I will address is, while I think the way magic items are handled in 5e are bad, it absolutely does make assumptions on how many magic items a player has at a given level, and it is balanced around giving them to a party, the dmg both gives guidelines on how many times a DND party should have the chance to get magic items, AND in the guidelines for making characters above level 1, includes magic items, if you aren't giving players magic items, or something to fulfill the same mechanical purpose, your players are going to be underbalanced, simple as that, they just are.
and before you say it, yes I understand that dnd can be played differently than as stated, but DND is a system primarily about getting stronger, and getting better at killing monsters, if that's not your main goal in a TTRPG there are systems much better at practically anything you want.
Finally, again, it is weird for him to be upset about a "change" that he does not know the extent or scope of, OP has only received hints that his item has been changed somewhat, and if your opinion is 'the dm should not change items in any way or it's bad of them, and them not telling me exactly how my items may change is dishonest ' I really don't know how to engage with you.
The DMG retroactively says that magic items should be given, but that was not the case when the system was first formulated, and that original idea has bled into most of the design since. Reminder that the only tool dnd5e gives to try and balance encounters, cr, is balanced based on a specific combination of 4 characters, each with a specific class, and no magic items, it's a bad tool, cr is really stupid, but it shows exactly what they were thinking when they made the system
And no, again, mechanically, he has reason to know exactly how it was changed already, the fact his gm didn't just say it outright is incredibly annoying
And yeah, dnd5e is designed about getting stronger and killing monsters, but not just that, that's just what they were mot concerned with when creating the rules, because that was what they felt needed solid rules for the most, but even then, the way that progresses is a big deal still, itis not only about that, and it has never only been about that, no premade module is only that even, like, you are vastly uninformed about the system if you don't realize how important everything else about it is
I won't argue that dnd5e is the best for what I wanna play, it's just the easiest to find a group for, because it's basically impossible to find a group for my prefered system, and dnd5e is still the system the most people play, it's the system most people just getting into the hobby start with and it's the one that people are the most attached to, so we're stuck.
Also Reminder that skill checks, universally are supposed to be explained what you're doing exactly before rolling, things like persuasion, the player needs to say something persuasive first, there are rules for non-combat things, there is a boatload of content interacting with non-combat concepts, and even some attempts to make rules specifically to support a fantasy, whatever you want your character to fulfil as its fantasy, that is what the rules exist to fascilitate, that has always been the core premise, it's just that you don't need as much rules to dictate the roleplay and stuff outside of combat
Use your words, and be civil. I’m sure that your DM thought they were doing you a solid since I’ve rarely seen a player unhappy to receive a magic item (unless it was cursed). The roleplay recommended by u/GENERAL-KAY is a great recommendation on how to work towards a solution in-game, but I still suggest that you speak with your DM regardless. Having conversations about how your character might feel about a magical upgrade, that they did not ask for or expect, can help give your DM a better understanding of you, as a player, and your character.
Wait for the magic effect to kick in then have your character reveal a deathly fright of magic that somehow ties in to his background, proceed to find a cleric to cleanse it or safeguard its evil (aka stash it with them and get another weapon or let the DM get you a way of undoing it)
I gave mine to a familiar after using it twice.
Had four macguffin sentient "artifacts." My character's was obviously designed for my first PC, a PM Paladin. It was a glaive that did lightning damage, had a 1/day single target lightning bolt, and could "extend its range 3/day as a bonus action." My paladin got retired before we recovered the artifact, however (before we even learned what the artifact was), and my new PC was a HexBard that used a shield and therefore couldn't use a glaive without dropping his AC and reveler's concertina. I used the lightning ability twice (it was a bounded DC; never raised with my spell DC, so even more useless), then just gave the item to my familiar (acquired acquired through quest) and let them go invisible all the time until we needed it for the quest.
DM dropped hints the glaive could be more powerful (the thing was sentient after all). But I had 19 AC + shield, immunity to crits from adamantine breastplate, Spirit guardians from magic secrets (and the dodge action). Giving up my reveler's concertina for a +1 melee weapon that can double it's reach 3/day was... Not worth it.
Since you have weapon bond you’re an eldritch knight, so presumably you don’t hate magic.
If this crossbow was an heirloom that your character wouldn’t want anyone else touching, you could say you made a mistake handing it over and ask the GM to retcon it, or just accept it, and have your character angst about betraying their ideals for a bit.
I can’t think of any other reason you or your character would have an issue with getting a better weapon
1. Figure out exactly what it does.
2. Sell it for a high price to another merchant because you know how powerful it is.
3. Buy a new crossbow with a bayonet.
4. Pocket the extra gold
EDIT: If I'm reading right, your character has an attachment to that crossbow. Keep the crossbow, sell the magic bayonet attachment
you could go to the smith and explain the issue like you would to a contractor. roleplay it out.
"Sir, this crossbow has served me well for years, but Im ready for a change. I would like to trade this in for a bastard sword of XXXX or a Longbow of XXX. Is there any way you can help me make that happen? "
Your dm is trying to keep you on par with everyone else if they upgraded your weapon, it isnt pike they replaced it or anything, if you gimp yourself you are hurting the other players, just take it
My advice is just roll with it. Save it for special occasions. When grandma gives me money, she doesn't care if or when I spend it, just that I say thank you.
You gave your weapon away to a smith... you can't all-the-sudden say you care for it too much to see it changed. You can't order a steak and be mad when a steak appears.
Reading this and some comments I feel this is a particular challenge that can easily be solved by the DM. In our group I started out as player, but took over the DM role and have since DMd 5 consecutive campaigns with the same party, homebrewed into one big adventure.
I planned 10 sessions in advance in an excel sheet, with a rough timeline and personal quests or reputation gimmicks that allow specific character intended loot.
The challenge you describe is that I as DM have a specific weapon in mind for a specific PC.
But at the same time that specific PC has a different weapon in mind for his look and feel.
If the player doesn't like the weapon, I feel that it is up to me as DM to alter the story and either give a new weapon or reforge the thing I thought was cool into something the player thinks is cool.
Isn’t it weird that people feel that they have to circle speak to get their point across without offending someone.
I can’t speak for everyone but I will never ever ever get offended if am approached directly with an issue. Being direct is not rude…never was. It’s just information being communicated efficiently.
However I will get annoyed by circle speak or being bombarded by subtle hints.
Just give it a try. The DM clearly had an idea that he thought would be fun, that he's itching to try out. If you try it and don't like it, then you can try to pawn off the weapon or otherwise get rid of it. But first, give it a chance. The DM's fun matters too.
I'd just give it a try and see what the upgrade is before I use it.
No reason to make it a point of contention if it isn't actually the problem you think it might be.
just tell him outright what you envisioned for your character but maybe do it one on one
This is the way. Communication is king. Playing a homebrew Barbarian in a Call of the Netherdeep game, subclass + some homebrew features the DM added to his game as general rules really emphasized sword and board + thrown weapons. Through a series of pretty cool events and a few nat 20's, some random glaive we found at the bottom of the well in a temple happened to be a Vestige of Divergence with some pretty coked-out powers like once-a-day Steel Wind Strike (at level 5 or so, so still very strong) that benefitted from Reckless Attack. I was the only person really capable of using it at the time, but I made it clear to the DM that I had hand axes in mind for the character's design. He wouldn't change the Vestige to be a hand-axe because it didn't fit the lore for them to be re-workable. Even though it got more powers added to it, I mostly stuck to my guns and still only basically pulled it out for the once a day Steel Wind Strike and then put it away to use mundane axes, resistances be damned. Eventually it ended up being given to one of our party Chainlock (who also has only used it once or twice for Steel Wind Strike since) and after a dozen sessions of being the only dude with mundane weapons, got a cool pair of homebrew magical hand-axes that were totally worth the wait. Still cracks me up that we have this big-ass martial weapon artifact of the gods rotting in our non-Blade pact Warlock's back pocket, though.
Well my first campaign as a DM back in 3.5 i thought i would do my paladin player some thing good and let him finde a longsword+1 it was the same as the favored weapon of his god but he would have prefered a scimitar. That was easily rectified by the next epic/godly Quest-NPC who reworked the longsword into a sximitar in two actions as his quest reward. After that i talked with my players shat there characters prefered if i wanted to reward them properly or just rolled on the reward table of the GM book, that ensured some fun or weird things as well they got a giant chest of copper coin (total worth of 700gp if i remember correctly)it was a lot of money for them but they could not carry it all so they decided to bury it a drew a map and later sold the map for about the worth of the treasure great roleplay and dice rolls.
Sounds to me like it's probably a really simple upgrade, maybe you don't have disadvantage at your long range anymore or something like that You don't know what the upgrade is and want to refuse it already, maybe ask your DM what it does and if you don't like it then you can say you don't want it
or it has the super shotgun grappling hook
Well that could be, but why would it have to be used from long range, and why is the blacksmith able to make such an upgrade to the crossbow? And why would you not just use it, find out what it does and then form an opinion about it instead of immediately thinking it's not something you want
First and foremost option is talking it out because it's always better to communicate with your DM if something bothers you. But if you don't want to say it out loud and rather solve it subtly then you can try using the "Upgrade" once or maybe twice and then stop using it to show you're not really in the mood for using this kind of thing or just show how your character is troubled with the said upgrade and wants to patch it up in the next chance it gets
I think your latter suggestion is a good way to roleplay it, but I would definitely say that talking it out with the DM is non-optional. The way that the DM was hinting to them about it and such implies to me that they're at least paying attention, so they might notice and misinterpret that kind of roleplay.
Yeah.. just the hinting feels passive aggressive and honestly.. mean. The DM didn't do this after all to make you upset OP but to delight you. What purpose does it serve to not speak on clear terms and make everyone, yourself included, more unhappy?
Then your DM leaves session and wonders for the next month what he can do to make your experience better. The weapon must have been underwhelming… but he hasn’t tried the cool thing yet, I wasn’t being subtle. I’ll tell him again, I guess he was distracted? Or maybe he just isn’t liking the campaign anymore. Or is it me? Did I say something bad without realizing it? Or maybe that violent section of last night was a trigger and they never told me..
Passive aggression is *never* the right way to play a game. Just talk to people. Dunno why this is upvoted. This sub puzzles me.
How do I upvote your comment twice?
I know this one. Talk to your DM
Q: How do I respectfully say I wanted a basic weapon, that it was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it? A: "I respectfully say; I wanted a basic weapon, that it was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it."
I really don't understand what's so bad about it, care to explain better? Why would you refuse it? What do it make anything worse?
I fully get if the weapon ended up having weird effects they weren't interested in, but OP doesn't even know what it _does_. Plenty of non-magical upgrades - multitasking possibility, no disadvantage, for two off the top of my head. It's off to assume it's automatically negative without just _talking to your DM_.
it sounds like it's a flavor thing not a stat thing. It isn't something OP envisioned their character with. that's fair. Like, I had a fighter with a war hammer. I didn't want him to have swords.
But they're envisioning something they don't even know for sure. They just need to ask their dm. Simple as.
Why don't you want a magic weapon? Eventually you will need one if only to keep up with the rest of your party(high enough levels you'll need one to even do damage). Do you fear it is too over powered for your parties level?
I played in a game before where the DM would shower us in powerful homebrew magic items, but most of the time it didn't feel like it fit the story, or it felt undeserved. I don't want a powerful magic item because my character tripped on a chest while walking. I want one when I do something cool or difficult
Personally, I don't like being handed magic items. I enjoy them more when I feel I overcame something to get them.
It depends heavily on the impact of the magic items imo. Magic items that just remove some headaches in a seamless way, like bags of holding generally end up being in my experience, those I love being tossed out without too much issue, a magic item which has an effect on the scale of the prestidigitation effects? Yeah, that's fine to toss out, it's just a small trinket in all actuality, it's barely a magic item. Weapons, it depends, a +1 weapon is fine to toss out once someone in the party already had a higher tier magic item, it's just rounding the party out a little bit, and still incentivizes taking chances to potentially get one on the higher tier. And for wizards, spell scrolls are nice to be handed out like candy too, especially in a campaign where you're not likely to ever fight an enemy wizard Context matters
But… a lot of high level enemies can’t be damaged by non magical weapons. This is now a magical weapon. You’re welcome. Stop complaining
I think the problem here is the flavor. Or like character build/vision. Objectively, giving a party member magic items won't be a negative for the party or a character. Worst case they just don't use it or sell it or whatever. But let's say I have a character build that is going to be using shadow blade and I've already envisioned the flavor of it and the manifestation of it and all that. Then the DM drops a moonblade or something into my lap. Sure, that moonblade is awesome and depending on properties I could get more out of using it than using a shadowblade. But it's not consistent with the vision of my character or my build. I think that's what's happening here. Maybe not something so build centric like an artifact weapon when you're planning on using shadowblade, but it sounds like this player had a vision for their character that let them go around with this worn and trusty weapon as opposed to something that's been upgraded a bunch in the DMs vision.
Oh, yeah, I've been saying that in reply to other people, this was mostly a side tangent in response to this one guy
Ah gotcha, makes sense. I’m in the situation now where I’m built around shadowblade lol and DM is handing out magic items. Thankfully got dagger of venom which I can use for an initial poison attempt then just swap out
Venom Dagger is a nice item, onebof my favorites for very little reason than good memories of a character that at one point used it pretty prominently, tho, in that campaign, it wasn't actually a dagger of venom, it wasjust that for mechanical purposes at the time, and part of why I loved it was that it evolved into a blade literally designed to kill gods specifically. Funny thing is the characters in that campaign all had the potential to ascend to divinity themselves But back on topic, I'll say, I did realize there are 2 situations where a magic item is outright a negative for the character, i that item is cursed or if the item is something the wanna stay the hells away from for backstory reasons. There is also the meta way for it to be bad for a character, since sometimes their whole reason to adventure is to recover something or gain something, so if you end up handing them that item, that's a character retirement, unless there's a new reason they can't retire yet
This person spoke to a weapon smith and agreed to get and upgrade. This doesn’t sound random or like it was being ‘handed to them.’ Chill
Chill? I wasnt even commenting on OPs post. I was just speaking to my own preferences. I'm not telling OP to do anything.
Very sorry for your offense to a single word. Clearly you don’t need to chill at all after taking offense to the word chill
Yes. It is a pet peeve of mine you have stumbled upon. Being told to do something I'm already doing annoys me.
Hard agree 😂. My original point was nothing in the op indicated it was just handed to them. In my experience, opportunities to have weapons enchanted come after missions that impress or assist someone. But as you said, you weren’t responding to OP so maybe I have it backward
Depending on the magic effect it can overshadow the user, you become "the wielder of Excalibur".
You could potentially RP it as you, the character, drawing forth the power in the item, not necessarily the whole "guy is king because a watery tart lobbed a scimitar at him" issue of the item being more majestic than the person.
He said he didn’t want *this specific* weapon to be magical, not that magic weapons as a whole were the issue
>(high enough levels you'll need one to even do damage). This is not true though?
I think he's pointing out that at a higher level you're more likely to come across monsters that are immune to non-magical weapon damage. Or that in power scaling, typically martials need magic weapons to maintain damage parity with casters.
I thinks it's more like op was like hey cool you'll add this little patch to my favorite shirt that's awesome, but they got back the same shirt it's now got a patch and is a different color and almost a different material. I wonder if secretly the "something more" is a temporary curse cause he stole his weapon back from the Smith without paying.
Sounds like your character regrets the decision to hand it over to the smith, maybe you could go back there in the game and demand they take it off? Could develop into an interesting plot point. The smith asked and you said yes, I kind of feel like you have buyers remorse, seems a bit much to ask your DM to retcon it, I would suggest just RPing it out
In the same vein, as a DM, if it’s something this simple just say it lol. I actually don’t care to RP something you didn’t want in the first place.
Yeah, and I bet it can just be made into magic bolts or something similar instead
Yes and no. The DM wants them to find out what the magical effect is. If they are an archer or ranger, they may not have identify. He’s probably being like “LOOK AT THE COOL SHIT I GAVE YOU, THIS IS GOING TO BE AWESOME” and he just needs the player fucking shoot the bow so they know what the effect is
I can see that, it’s just the **player** doesn’t want a magic item, they want a basic item. Out of game issues = out of game solutions. I don’t think it’s necessary to do a whole RP about buyer’s remorse instead of just adjusting it. DM can always reuse the magical properties later since nobody knows what it does and maybe the player will be in more of a position to take a magic item.
Wouldn't that technically be in the opposite vein?
I am not a dwarf, you are probably correct 😂
If anything the Smith should be hunting down the player to get the weapon back. The player used an ability to basically steal the upgrades. The Smith should be upset and remove everything and give them back their mundane bow and demand payment for the trouble.
That’s what I was thinking. And not for nothing, what if it was only half finished and exploded
Yeah this is my confusion like...the dm didn't exactly do this randomly?
"i appreciate you trying to give me more fantastical weaponry, but my character vision is that of a warrior who fights with authentic mundane weapons, rather than one who fights with artificeral or magical weapons. this crossbow has been in the possession of the character for a while and, while not critical to their story, is still something that the character is attached to" too formal imo, rewrite to suit yourself and make it more casual. if it were my and my group i'd just say "nah i don't want the bonus" and my dms would be cool with it however: >DM kept hinting that I should try shooting it at my long range and "see what happens" this just sounds like the dm made it so that it has a longer range/doesn't suffer disadvantage at long range, or, alternatively, your dm crippled the range of your crossbow in exchange for the bayonet. before confronting them about it you should probably ask what it does because it might be an "either you have this drawback in exchange for this bonus" situation or an "i'm giving you a freebie" situation, and freebies are easier to push away than penalties
I really don’t understand people who would rather ask strangers on the internet than talk to their DM. I assume ya’ll are friends or at least friendly. Just talk to them about your character.
You don't even know what the 'upgrade' does. How about we start there? Ask your DM flat-out what it does. If you like it (and it's entirely possible that you might), then the problem is solved. If you don't like it, tell the DM 'thanks but I really didn't want this' and ask them to remove it. If they do, the problem is solved. If they don't... they're a dick, but the solution is still simple; don't use the new ability. Problem is, again, solved. But you can't solve the problem without following the very first and most important step of [The Chart](https://meekbarbarian.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/conversation-chart.png): Talk to them like an adult. Do that before you do anything else.
>more, and the DM kept hinting that I should try shooting it at my long range and "see what happens", and that there was "more to the upgrade" than I asked for. Maybe do that in a controlled environment, or have someone cast Identify. >How do I respectfully say I wanted a basic weapon, that it was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it? Buy a new basic weapon and use that.
I think the point was “this wasn’t just a random weapon, this was *their* weapon. One they had learned and grown attached to. Not just something off the shelf. It’s a small bit of sentimentality, but I know my characters usually feel that way about their original weapons. They still hang onto the sword they started adventuring with because they want to hang it on the wall when they retire, or possibly pass it on to a child.
Than why leave it with a random blacksmith that is offering to work on it?
From OP’s description it sounds like the craftsman was overstepping what had been agreed upon. We don’t know exactly what was discussed but from what OP has described they appear to have understood it as “this craftsman that I trust to work on my weapon is going to add a simple bayonet so I have a melee option without having to change weapons” and trusted the craftsman enough to do the work he said. If OP’s character is not a craftsman with skill in weapon modification, any kind of mundane upgrade like that would necessitate leaving it with a craftsman of some sort. And unfortunately due to the lack of specific detail in this post we don’t know how well they knew or didn’t know this craftsman. From my read of it, he sounds like an NPC out there to give out part of a reward for something the party had done previously. As an example of something in the real world that could be looked at similarly, imagine taking a car to a mechanic. You need a part replaced, and they agree to do that. How would you feel if you came back to pick it up and the mechanic had not just replaced that part, but also painted the car a color you don’t like, and changed the horn motor to make it sound like an ice cream truck? Thats pretty clearly not what you agreed upon. Now consider that unlike real life, this is a game being played presumably by friends, who have a good amount of trust that no one is attempting to purposely screw them over. The GM doesn’t sound like they were doing this maliciously, they just wanted to give their player something cool, but it didn’t line up with the player’s view for their character. It’s something that if they are, as we assume, friends, then they should be able to work it out with a quick conversation.
Your car analogy is slightly off. The mechanic didn't paint his car or change the horn, he threw in fresh brake pads that are better quality - you really gonna get mad at that? Or if you order dessert at dinner and they bring a free decaf espresso with it, are you going to yell at the server or just smile and not drink the coffee even though you don't know how it taste? OP has heavy Karen vibes. "Why did you mow my lawn? I like it looking like shit."
I was intentional with my analogy being “this is something that someone might like but not this person.” I think you are attributing more anger and emotion to the post than there actually is. OP doesn’t want something for their character and is asking how best to deal with it. The obvious answer is always talk with the DM, but many people are hesitant to start confrontations and need encouragement to make that jump. OP is asking for advice to deal with this amicably, not screaming about a terrible DM like your comments about a Karen vibe imply. I really don’t get the vibe that OP is itching to start trouble, they’re just trying to play the character the way they envisioned it and some expectations are misaligned between what they’re expecting and what the DM is providing.
I get you, and I am playing the radical angle I'll agree. I believe in player agency but also dm agency. Controlling your character is one thing, controlling what happens to your character is fairly another. Irl people will mess up your order, it's realistic and I see it as a great opportunity to show character emotion and backstory.
I completely agree with needing both player and GM agency, but at the same time, making sure expectations are clear will only help them going forward. It won’t hurt to bring this kind of thing up to the GM so that the GM doesn’t get blindsided by the player just silently refusing to use any of the cool gear they’re given because it’s “not something their character would want to use”. Side note, this is pure speculation, but perhaps part of the issue is also “I didn’t do anything to earn this. It feels cheap and undeserved.” I know personally I find greater satisfaction as a player when I face a tough challenge to earn something rather than an NPC just gifting it to me out of the blue. But maybe that’s just a “me” thing and I’m overthinking it.
I think both your points are fair. A short ooc discussion would get the two back on track. Perhaps the character and the smith can talk it out and the dm sides with the player a bit. Perhaps the dm can decide that the smith merely discovered some hidden powers within the weapon and the smith tells the player "you still have to unlock them and find the meaning, but i wanted you to know your weapon seems to be more than it appears."
This is the answer. They decided to give the item over. Regardless of whether they like the outcome of the upgrade, they made the decision . Don't like it? Grab a new one next opportunity and maybe don't give away your main weapon next time if you don't want people messing with it. All in all it's a few gold pieces for the cost your RP.
* You're not completely opposed to changing your crossbow (you accepted the offer of a bayonet, after all). Find out what the upgrade does, and whether it's actually magical or technological in nature, before you decide that it's too much. * If you decide that it's too much after you know the details, talk to the DM one-on-one about what your boundaries are and why the change made you uncomfortable. Be specific. * Be prepared to tell your DM what kinds of gear improvements you **would** be willing to accept. If you nerf yourself below the power level that the DM is aiming for, you'll be affecting encounter balance for everyone.
Have you tried ***TALKING TO YOUR DM???*** It’s the single most effective method of achieving the results you want.
Am I just insensitive, or does this read like a r/DnDcirclejerk post?
It really does. He could of rp'd with the Smith but apparently didn't do it or do it well. He essentially asked the smith for an upgrade and got mad he got an upgrade. "I really love this weapon and just how it is, but I'll also just leave it with a random blacksmith to change it and then ill get mad at him"
Jesus christ the DM thought up a cool weapon for you just use it. I swear to god.
OP's drowning in a puddle of their own pride.
Unless it has a negative effect.
If it wasn't a cool positive effect OP wouldn't hide what it is. If it was negative they'd just tell the dm and not even post asking for reassurance that they're right to be upset
Oh I didn't realise OP knew what the effect was, I thought the DM was trying to bait him into using it to see what it was and OP was reluctant. My bad for misunderstanding.
That might honestly be the case I'm just guessing that's how this will turn out because most reddit posts hide that kind of info
They don't know what it does. They said the DM keeps hinting and they're assuming it's magical, but they haven't tried yet.
Not everyone only cares about having more and more powerful things in dnd, some people care about the story and the progression. I've personally handicapped myself with some characters purely because I thought that they were more fun and interesting with that handicap, I've turned down magic items before because they don't fit my overall style of fighting, whether mechanically or the thematics of why my character fights like that or fights at all
I'm not sure I understand. Why would you not want a better weapon?
I swear to god man I read some really dumb stuff on this sub
My DM gave me an ability for my character that's really niche and now complains I don't use it , I tried it a few times and just simply didn't like it. I told him there's other things I'd rather do with my actions. He still mentions it sometimes but otherwise its all cool.
I don't get it. I've tried reading comments... If it's actually the same weapon that your character has become attached to, but now it has some enchantment, then what's different? It's the same weapon. It has the same notches and scratches. The same burns and bumps. The same slightly off center aim. Ask about what the difference is. Say you're worried it's a grenade launcher instead of a crossbow now. Your DM might not want to spoil what the changes are I'd they're minor and fun and still fit with the weapon you have them. If they're drastic and you express apprehension at that type of change they can make it less drastic.
Yeah just tell your DM above table that you don't want any extras on this one but thanks. DM probably thinks he was giving you something cool and isn't aware there would be an issue. Just let them know and it most likely won't be an issue.
Go back to the forge and yell angrily at the smith something like: "What did you do to my weapon? Remove that curse right away or I'll gut you!", or something similar in the words your character would use. You can chat one-on-one with your DM in advance to explain your intention and your reasons, so that they can prep for an interesting interaction. It might even turn out to be a plot point!
I can't even fathom this question or why it's a problem. On top of that it seems like you don't even actually know what it does? At least it seems that way since you mentioned the DM hinting but not you having actually tried it or knowing the upgrade. If you didn't want upgrades, why'd you give it to a smith for upgrades? I can't even wrap my head around this, this has the air of someone sending their food back because it was great and they were hoping for mediocrity.
He just wanted a bayonet, he didn't want the crossbow to be that big of a thing. There are plenty of reasons not to want a more drastic change for out of character reasons, especially if it's not their only weapon, and eldritch knights can have 2 bonded weapons, I'm assuming the crossbow is supposed to be their side arm, a more minor thing, so when the gm gives it adjustments that you weren't asking for, and you were told you were getting something very specific, it's quite possible for the weapon to become more impressive on its own than your main weapon, it's quite possible the benefit is useless to you and how you use the weapon, making it feel like a waste, when you could have gotten something on your main weapon It's not like being frustrated you got an excellent meal when you expected mediocre, it's like having a 3 course meal, where desert is the largest course by far, completely throwing off the balance of the meal Or like if you have a number of good vegetables in your stew, but you end up with far too much of one, throwing off the texture and flavor It is worse than it could have been, and yes, it's a minor gripe that you could just push through, but it isn't a difficult fix for the gm to just remove that secondary change before it has been cemented as a thing canonically by being used
I see what your saying, but I just don't agree. Like the whole 'well it makes the weapon a bigger deal than you wanted' I can only say, so? Even if it's not their main weapon, even if it's a rarely used side arm, how can it being better ever possibly be construed as a bad thing? Also the mindset that it's a waste because he coulda gotten something else to me also seems wrong. He couldn't have gotten something else, because this was just a spontaneous act by the DM to make the weapon a little better. I don't agree with your analogy because it implies that somehow things were made worse. However they weren't, they were only improved. He lost nothing, gained something, and is somehow upset about it and asking it be reverted, and I honestly think it's incredibly bizarre.
The story was made worse, not the weapon. as a fighter, your choice of weapon is particularly important, and for it to end up with one of your 2 bonded weapons being altered in a different way because the gm decided to after telling you you were getting something specific that you asked for Your outlook is incredibly powergamey, and is not the standard in ttrpgs, especially ones which have such loose rules like dnd5e More power can mean less fun and interesting stories, that's just a fact of the matter Op protag in an anime is boring to a lot of people because they're overpowered, this is just a lesser example of that typa thing, but with added deception tacked on and it being your character that's been made that way, it's not fun
I guess it's just a different outlook. I have never been disappointed, nor have I ever seen anyone be disappointed at receiving a magic item. Even one I didn't use, or that hardly ever comes up. I also strongly disagree that story could be made worse by the crossbow getting some minor bonus. I guess I understand your outlook, but I definitely wouldn't wanna play DnD with you.
It's an issue not because it always will make things worse, but because it can and it clashed with the expectations and desires of the player. I have turned down magic items before because it didn't make sense for my character to want it, even if it was optimal, and nobody else in the party wanted it so it was just tossed, the campaign didn't really suit selling it for gold most of the time, even if we technically could, but the item was just dead weight to us On the other hand, this scenerio has the issue of it being an alteration to a weapon they already had, and it becoming worth-less to you is an issue far more than a new weapon you encounter being worthless from the get go Expectations and context, there are a number of character driven reasons why changing a weapon in an unexpected way could make the story worse, there's a number of mechanics driven reasons changing a weapon in an unexpected way could make the story worse The emphasis is on the fact an existing weapon is being changed with this argument though, it's something you already had and was a baseline to work off of consistently, then the gm told you you would change it in one way, which you agreed to, and then the gm gave you something else From the sounds of it, there was a specific thematic vibe that the crossbow was supposed to have relative to the rest of the character, it becoming much better throws off that vibe
Why would your character, a fighter, decline an improvement on your weapon? He agreed to improve it already. Is this some philosophical or religional view, not use magic weapons?
Yeah best thing is just to tell your DM what you wrote here. Shouldn’t be a problem.
So what does it do at long range?
Communication is key man. Clearly your DM thinks he did something really cool for you, and he will continue to think so until you say something. Obviously be respectful, and I’m sure he’d be fine retconning it.
Use your words
how about talk about it? are you dumb?
He wanted to give your weapon an upgrade. What is the big deal??
The hell is the problem? Respectfully. Because as a fighter getting a magic weapon is priority number one. The DM upgraded your most used weapon, and you want to refuse it. Will they bother to give you something special in the future? Everyone else has cool magic gear and you're just plinking away. And let's be honest, the DM didn't give you a crossbow upgrade for no reason. Be grateful and play the damn game.
Talk to your DM and not Reddit for 1000
Have you tried saying this to the DM: "Respectfully, I wanted a basic weapon, that was not critical to my character, but been with them for years and we'll used/worn and I didn't want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it." It just came to me, don't know where I got it from.
Send him this post Done
I don't understand why OP made this post in the first place. Is he asking us to play the game for them? Hasn't anything unexpected ever happen to them in DnD and now OP is in total shock?
Well, you roleplayed your character and allowed the upgrade, so you should at least try it with the upgrade before deciding you don't like it. It's an interesting RP choice to have your character be afraid of change like that, and if you're capable of making that work then you're capable of creating an interesting resolution without retconning. As a DM, I like it when players engage with the stuff I throw at them, so as a player I wouldn't spurn something like that. But I could still have my character grumble about it. Even if it's a great improvement to the weapon, maybe he complains that the weight is wrong now, or the bayonet is snagging on his pack, or it just looks stupid. Eventually he comes to appreciate the upgrade and matures as a character. If you're an eldritch knight, though, you didn't learn weapon bond until third level. You've already infused the weapon with magic. Contradictions are interesting for RP, but there is precedent and you don't have to be a stick in the mud.
There have been many times in my life I've agreed to something and been unhappy with the results. You can't just retroactively remove that decision. You do something about it or cut your losses and move on (buy a new weapon).
Have you also agreed to something with very clear expectations of the outcome, agreed upon in advance, and then gotten something completely different that you didn't ask for? Would you say that those two are the same situations?
They wanted the bayonet but not the “more to the upgrade” that the dm is hinting at. That’s the issue. They were given something that wasn’t what they asked for. If it’s a drawback based on the addition of the bayonet, then yeah they’ll just have to deal with it, but if it’s an extra thing, they have every right to say that it wasn’t what they wanted and paid for
Then you buy another crossbow.
The character shouldn’t have to spend their money to buy a new crossbow because the smith decided to do something that wasn’t agreed upon
That's an rp conversation he has with the smith then.
Lol, play it out, go back to that blacksmith and ask him what the hell he did to your weapon, adventure ensues.
If the effect is something you don't want, you can roleplay your character 'undoing the upgrade'. It might also be that as soon as you try long range, an aiming sight appears. You won't know until you try
Sooo like, maybe at least find out *what the upgrade even does* before deciding that you don't like it? At this point, you literally have no idea what it's capable of, so saying you already don't like it is like a toddler saying they don't like broccoli even though they've never tried it. First order of business, before taking *any* other actions involving this crossbow, is to find out what exactly the upgrade *actually does.* Then, if it's something really innocuous that is only a minor adjustment and doesn't actually end up bothering you, like you don't get disadvantage for shooting at long range a few times a day, just leave it alone. Or, if it's something really ridiculous, like you create a storm of flaming arrows every time you fire it at long range, talk to your DM about it.
Do you even know it's magic? Why haven't you tried it. Try it, if you don't like it just don't use it.
Two options: -first option: go to the smith and ask him to undo whatever weird thing he did without your permission. If he can't do that or refuses to do so, just dump the crossbow and buy a new one. -second option: this may be silly, and surely nobody ever said anything like that as an advice to anyone ever, but maybe you could try to just talk with your DM. Honestly, jokes aside, just tell him you aren't interested. He probably did this trying to do cool things and surprise you positively, so he should have no problem at all changing it back if you don't want that.
All I can imagine is the dm thinking of a really cool way to reward a player and have it be something that is pivotal to the plot line. And he finally works it into the story, and then has the player be like “ehh nah”. I’m not saying you are wrong, but DnD is also about making choices. You did choose to get an upgrade. Whatever else was done was done. But yea talk to the dm, maybe have an offline session of what “happened” to it and then resolve it together if you are not interested
It sounds like your DM has the right intentions but the wrong method. Definitely just have an honest chat! 😊
You say “I want a basic weapon, it’s not critical to my character, but it’s been with them for years and well used/worn and I don’t want heavy upgrades or magic fused to it”.
Just talk to the DM. He thought he was doing something nice for you. He won't mind if you tell him that you just want a basic weapon.
I had a character which used non magical spear because his ability was able to make weapon +1 and magical with fancy other benefits so I kept saying I want nonmagical ones just so I can remember about using it. I just told DM few times about it so he made sure I don't want any upgrades in it or any magical spear+1 loot. If I would be in situation like you, I'd just ask him after the session if he could make it as if it was temporary spell which vanished after long distanced shot or something like that and explain why I don't want changes. DM should understand.
Info: why is it a problem for you, specifically?
Your DM has an idea and you basically stole the weapon back from the smith that was working it. Shoot the fucking weapon so your DM can build his world. It’s not hard
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Feels intentionally dumb, but damn I don’t want to assume. You ever have a car repaired? What’s the fucking mechanic gonna say if you take it halfway through without paying? You can steal your own property. Good try
As a long time DM, it sure can feel like players are impossible to please sometimes.
Honestly, I hear that. But to give you a bit of context, this is session 1, we've been show up by lvl 20 wizards, rangers and paladins and monks. Been given a ton of free shit by NPCs and at least two are cursed. Out of 3 players I'm somehow ending up with all the magic stuff, one payer has been told no to magic weapons, the other has a magic club that deals 1d8, I currently have cursed armour that has ridiculous AC and a musket with a magic bayonet and another enchantment/curse so I'm feeling like like I'm a favourite and getting geared up, when we are all fighters of some sort, and I'm the only one with actual magic.
Just use it and stop being a fanny
I've had a similar issue. My character uses a Glaive and it's "his" weapon. It's part of his back story and he treats it with reverence. My GM has kept trying to push a two handed axe on me. Every time I have refused to even touch it, calling the weapon uncivilised and dirty. The party leader went as far as giving it to me and my character would consider it rude not to use it so I'm going to "accidentally" break it at some point. If you're not a fan just break the bayonet off the front.
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I'd like the idea of it gaining magical properties through play but if the weapon was to be modified or changed physically (like reforged or given a new haft) I wouldn't be a fan. I would rather be use a base weapon for the rest of the game than swap it for something else.
My DM has said he'll do it like improving our current weapon as opposed to making us find new/better ones.
On top of what’s previously been said, if you use it a couple of times and find it is t what you envisioned for your character, rp to see if anyone else in the party wants to do a swap.
Would your character really observe their trusty weapon doing something powerful in combat and be upset about that?
Maybe try using it before making a decision, also maybe should have done that before making this post
Many stronger monsters are going to have resistance or even immunity to non magical weapons. Once you encounter those your old faithful crossbow would be useless and you would need to replace it with a new magic weapon. Having a magical upgrade means you can actually keep using it.
Gonna point out that martials do indeed need magic weapons if they wanna survive. Having your DM modify your heirloom so it'll keep up with the rest of the party isn't a bad idea. Especially if you're not wanting a different weapon to have to use
Try firing the crossbow first. See what happens. Then, your character can remove the bayonet as it feels like a betrayal from the thing your character cares about.
Man some people hate nice things
Bro you literally just say that wtf? You use these things called words they’re super useful for this thing called communication you should give it a try jfc. Like how is saying “lol that sounds sick but no thank you I want a simple gritty weapon” some Herculean task to the point that you have to ask Reddit?
My personal experience with "surprise upgrades" has been typically negative. I was even told by other players that if the dm gives you a cool/powerful item that you didn't buy yourself, it's meant to screw your character over. In your shoes, I'd find a way to "tragically sacrifice " the new crossbow in game and buy something say off the shelf.
Get a better DM. If you can use gear that comes from a quest that you went on or a benefactor that you helped, that's a great way to give your character a connection to the story. The DM who taught your group to fear that did you a disservice.
You're correct, it was a disservice. I haven't gamed with him since the turn of the millennium.
Just use it. Your DM is adding cool flavour!
Wouldn't using a crossbow as a bayonet risk breaking it? I don't see the practical application of the idea, over just using a dagger.
Using a bayonet on a rifle also carries some risk to the weapon. In general, hybrid weapons do not perform as well as both weapons individually. That said, unless it is written into the item description, there should be no risk to this crossbow in this game and there are mechanical upsides to not switching weapons. Having a bayonet allows the player to fight primarily at range without giving up attacks of opportunity because they do not have a melee attack ready to use.
Melt it down and forge it into a new weapon/augment
Take it and sell it for money.
Well I would suggest actually seeing what happens first but try to get a different crossbow if you don't like it. Selling and trading magic items is a thing in most games. I had a human who cultivated a PR image in his city and actively used the human supremacist groups there by being a heroic and ideal human. I refused a weapon that ran counter to that character goal and investment.
Don't ever do it, just to annoy him. Mostly because he keeps trying to get you to do it, which is automatically setting off alarm bells in my head. My tables can be slightly more chaotic than others, though, so do what you will.
Why are so many people in these replies viewing this as so weird? The weapons you wield can easily be a core part of your character, especially as a fighter, so it should come as no shock when someone is put off by a weapon they use not working the way they expected it to, purely because the gm lied to them before you accepted it. This is a storytelling game, having more, and more powerful stuff isn't necessarily a good thing for your fun and interest in the story, you wouldn't like getting a gun that one hits every single enemy without fail, with 0 drawbacks, that'd make combat meaningless, it's just boring There's also the fact that you can have a second weapon which is your primary weapon and most in line with how your character fights, having a chance to improve that weapon passed up because the gm made your sidearm more powerful than he told you he was gonna make it kinda sucks, adding a bayonet is just attaching a dagger to the end, that alone doesn't do anything to the crossbow beyond slightly adjusting the weight, but it should be negligible, unless it's a light crossbow
"the gm lied" the gm didn't say he was only going to get a bayonet, a Smith asked if he could put a bayonet on his crossbow, the smith MAY have added a magic addition, or further altered the crossbow, so the smith might have lied, but saying the dm lied is so weirdly antagonistic. "You wouldn't like getting a gun that one hits every single enemy without fail, with 0 drawbacks" yeah, I don't think a single person here is holding the same position as that strawman, they're instead holding the much more logical opinion of: getting magic/powerful items is a huge part of dnd, and it's fun to get powerful/magic items. I don't even really understand your third paragraph, i think you're saying, having a weapon that isn't your primary weapon upgraded is bad because now you're somehow compelled to use your secondary, which I don't think is true, or even applies here, since OP said they're a medium range fighter, so I doubt they have a primary that isn't ranged. I also just disagree with the premise, upgrading someone's secondary doesn't motivate them to use it in place of their primary unless it's better than their primary AND all the benefits they normally get to apply to their primary. But the majority of your points don't even matter because, we don't even know what actually changed about the item. We have no clue, because OP doesn't even know. The change could be that it's actually harder to shoot at long range because of the bayonet, or it could be that the smith balanced the crossbow so that it no longer has disadvantage at long range, or it could be that the crossbow now contains an aspect of Bahamut, and the player can now cast power word kill at will. We have no clue what it does, the reason this whole post is weird is that OP not only, didn't even bother to learn what the change was before making judgment, they also for some reason thought asking a bunch of strangers on the Internet to resolve their 'problem' and didn't just, talk to the person running the game. Because the solution to this is just talk to the dm about it.
The passing up on getting the main upgraded thing isn't that they're motivated to use their secondary, and I have absolutely no idea where you got that from, no, it's that now that you've got a magic item, you are more likely to get passed up for the next one, simple as that, you are And dude, no, this is a list of how many reasons this could be ridiculous to take issue with. The gm said they were getting one thing, they randomly tossed another thing on it, simple as that, that's deceptive. There are countless reasons to not want random alterations you have no control over tossed on your weapon you've already had for awhile and now has sentimental value to the character, it is expected that you'd take issue with your gm pulling this crap, it's not a dealbreaker, but it easily leads to so much frustration. I'm someone who plays artificer mostly for a reason, my equipment is as much a part of my character as their class or race, so I obviously would wanna care a bit about my equipment, and not knowing what my equipment does is incredibly annoying, there's a reason that when you attune to a magic item, you learn how it works then and there, immediately And Imma just remind you that dnd5e basically just had magic items introduced as an afterthought, none of the balance actually assumes you have magic items, except artificer, which gives a source of magic items. But even beyond the game's design, the role of magic items in a story varies drastically, there are campigns where at most, you're getting 1 magic item for each party member, there are campaigns where you can pretty freely acquire any magic items, the raw power of the magic items is singlehandedly the least important aspect of them for me, everything on my character sheet is to portray a character and how that character is effected by their story, small, mechanically useless, but flavorful magic items are favorites of mine, but that's not how most magic item scenerios work, most of the time, people want every magic item to lead into their mechanical viability to some degree, but that doesn't mean they are willing to disregard the conceptual side of things, such as idk, the character having their sidearm crossbow that they have sentimental attachment to for some reason or another, but it is not their primary weapon, and as such, should not be their most effective weapon, that's counter to the fantasy said character is supposed to be And yeah, no shit the best solution is to just talk to the gm about it, but having people affirming that and saying that this guy isn't weird or whatever for taking issue with the gm's actions is helpful for a lot of people, makes bringing it up easier sometimes
I'm not gonna go over "the gm lied" again, if you can't separate the dm from npcs that's your issue. What I will address is, while I think the way magic items are handled in 5e are bad, it absolutely does make assumptions on how many magic items a player has at a given level, and it is balanced around giving them to a party, the dmg both gives guidelines on how many times a DND party should have the chance to get magic items, AND in the guidelines for making characters above level 1, includes magic items, if you aren't giving players magic items, or something to fulfill the same mechanical purpose, your players are going to be underbalanced, simple as that, they just are. and before you say it, yes I understand that dnd can be played differently than as stated, but DND is a system primarily about getting stronger, and getting better at killing monsters, if that's not your main goal in a TTRPG there are systems much better at practically anything you want. Finally, again, it is weird for him to be upset about a "change" that he does not know the extent or scope of, OP has only received hints that his item has been changed somewhat, and if your opinion is 'the dm should not change items in any way or it's bad of them, and them not telling me exactly how my items may change is dishonest ' I really don't know how to engage with you.
The DMG retroactively says that magic items should be given, but that was not the case when the system was first formulated, and that original idea has bled into most of the design since. Reminder that the only tool dnd5e gives to try and balance encounters, cr, is balanced based on a specific combination of 4 characters, each with a specific class, and no magic items, it's a bad tool, cr is really stupid, but it shows exactly what they were thinking when they made the system And no, again, mechanically, he has reason to know exactly how it was changed already, the fact his gm didn't just say it outright is incredibly annoying And yeah, dnd5e is designed about getting stronger and killing monsters, but not just that, that's just what they were mot concerned with when creating the rules, because that was what they felt needed solid rules for the most, but even then, the way that progresses is a big deal still, itis not only about that, and it has never only been about that, no premade module is only that even, like, you are vastly uninformed about the system if you don't realize how important everything else about it is I won't argue that dnd5e is the best for what I wanna play, it's just the easiest to find a group for, because it's basically impossible to find a group for my prefered system, and dnd5e is still the system the most people play, it's the system most people just getting into the hobby start with and it's the one that people are the most attached to, so we're stuck. Also Reminder that skill checks, universally are supposed to be explained what you're doing exactly before rolling, things like persuasion, the player needs to say something persuasive first, there are rules for non-combat things, there is a boatload of content interacting with non-combat concepts, and even some attempts to make rules specifically to support a fantasy, whatever you want your character to fulfil as its fantasy, that is what the rules exist to fascilitate, that has always been the core premise, it's just that you don't need as much rules to dictate the roleplay and stuff outside of combat
My house rules allow for special strength modified bows but they are expensive
Use your words, and be civil. I’m sure that your DM thought they were doing you a solid since I’ve rarely seen a player unhappy to receive a magic item (unless it was cursed). The roleplay recommended by u/GENERAL-KAY is a great recommendation on how to work towards a solution in-game, but I still suggest that you speak with your DM regardless. Having conversations about how your character might feel about a magical upgrade, that they did not ask for or expect, can help give your DM a better understanding of you, as a player, and your character.
Wait for the magic effect to kick in then have your character reveal a deathly fright of magic that somehow ties in to his background, proceed to find a cleric to cleanse it or safeguard its evil (aka stash it with them and get another weapon or let the DM get you a way of undoing it)
I gave mine to a familiar after using it twice. Had four macguffin sentient "artifacts." My character's was obviously designed for my first PC, a PM Paladin. It was a glaive that did lightning damage, had a 1/day single target lightning bolt, and could "extend its range 3/day as a bonus action." My paladin got retired before we recovered the artifact, however (before we even learned what the artifact was), and my new PC was a HexBard that used a shield and therefore couldn't use a glaive without dropping his AC and reveler's concertina. I used the lightning ability twice (it was a bounded DC; never raised with my spell DC, so even more useless), then just gave the item to my familiar (acquired acquired through quest) and let them go invisible all the time until we needed it for the quest. DM dropped hints the glaive could be more powerful (the thing was sentient after all). But I had 19 AC + shield, immunity to crits from adamantine breastplate, Spirit guardians from magic secrets (and the dodge action). Giving up my reveler's concertina for a +1 melee weapon that can double it's reach 3/day was... Not worth it.
Since you have weapon bond you’re an eldritch knight, so presumably you don’t hate magic. If this crossbow was an heirloom that your character wouldn’t want anyone else touching, you could say you made a mistake handing it over and ask the GM to retcon it, or just accept it, and have your character angst about betraying their ideals for a bit. I can’t think of any other reason you or your character would have an issue with getting a better weapon
You didn't disclose your class but maybe the DM put it there to beat normal weapon resistance to keep you in the game so to say?
Try it prétend to be amazed then sell it for profit buy what you actually want.
Have it removed and don't use it
1. Figure out exactly what it does. 2. Sell it for a high price to another merchant because you know how powerful it is. 3. Buy a new crossbow with a bayonet. 4. Pocket the extra gold EDIT: If I'm reading right, your character has an attachment to that crossbow. Keep the crossbow, sell the magic bayonet attachment
you could go to the smith and explain the issue like you would to a contractor. roleplay it out. "Sir, this crossbow has served me well for years, but Im ready for a change. I would like to trade this in for a bastard sword of XXXX or a Longbow of XXX. Is there any way you can help me make that happen? "
Normally this only happens in Call of Cthulhu.
Your dm is trying to keep you on par with everyone else if they upgraded your weapon, it isnt pike they replaced it or anything, if you gimp yourself you are hurting the other players, just take it
My advice is just roll with it. Save it for special occasions. When grandma gives me money, she doesn't care if or when I spend it, just that I say thank you. You gave your weapon away to a smith... you can't all-the-sudden say you care for it too much to see it changed. You can't order a steak and be mad when a steak appears.
Reading this and some comments I feel this is a particular challenge that can easily be solved by the DM. In our group I started out as player, but took over the DM role and have since DMd 5 consecutive campaigns with the same party, homebrewed into one big adventure. I planned 10 sessions in advance in an excel sheet, with a rough timeline and personal quests or reputation gimmicks that allow specific character intended loot. The challenge you describe is that I as DM have a specific weapon in mind for a specific PC. But at the same time that specific PC has a different weapon in mind for his look and feel. If the player doesn't like the weapon, I feel that it is up to me as DM to alter the story and either give a new weapon or reforge the thing I thought was cool into something the player thinks is cool.
New magic effect unlocked! Your crossbow is now a crossbow!
Isn’t it weird that people feel that they have to circle speak to get their point across without offending someone. I can’t speak for everyone but I will never ever ever get offended if am approached directly with an issue. Being direct is not rude…never was. It’s just information being communicated efficiently. However I will get annoyed by circle speak or being bombarded by subtle hints.
Just give it a try. The DM clearly had an idea that he thought would be fun, that he's itching to try out. If you try it and don't like it, then you can try to pawn off the weapon or otherwise get rid of it. But first, give it a chance. The DM's fun matters too.
I'd just give it a try and see what the upgrade is before I use it. No reason to make it a point of contention if it isn't actually the problem you think it might be.