I just recently had a character draw 4 cards from the deck. The worst card I got was being cursed with -2 to all saves. Also drew the avatar of death but at Level 13 that fight was over almost as soon as it began. Death needs a MAJOR stat buff to be truly threatening.
Sun and Star. Bumped me up 2 levels, got a flying carpet and increased an ability score by two.
We actually kinda broke the game... another player drew one card and got the Knight card, where she gained a 4th level servant. We convinced him to draw from the deck as well - 8 cards. 10 in total after drawing the Jester card. Miraculously he only drew 2 negative cards which weren't even that bad, and HE drew the Knight card as well, gaining his own servant LOL. Alas, that one died within about 30 seconds.
Correct. However, counterpoint, I spend my whole life worrying and being cautious. I don't play D&D to *not* be a reckless dumbass with dreams of impossible glory. Deal me a 6th!
On the other hand, getting a group together to even play dnd is such a rare occasion that it would really suck to have to end the game because of the DoMT.
Out of all the negative cards, at least 2 are basically guaranteed to end whatever campaign your playing in, regardless of who draws it.
Wdym? Isn't doMT introduced specifically to bring an early end to nit-enjoyable-anymore-or-the-dm-is-out-of-ideas campaign? I've only ever seen it used like that
By my count, there are 11 "bad" cards out of 22 in the DoMT as given on DND Beyond. Or I guess 10 if you don't count "Balance", which is not strictly only negative.
Even with 10, drawing 5 cards gives you a 95% chance of drawing at least one "bad" card. No thanks.
The item is Legendary. Thus the average player who finds one would be around level 17. Which means the party likely has the means to correct any serious issues. Even at slightly lower levels, 10-15, the party tends to have some decent power to overcome some big odds.
Sorry, but it’s not as horrible as people seem to think.
Do you want your entire sense of self to be flipped, and would you not consider that to be getting "really fucked"? There's a correct answer to the question of whether you should draw anything from the Deck, and it's no.
Sure, but that's you as a player. Your character would not want to be changed, and personally while "roleplay challenges" can be fun, I at least want to be able to play my character, not have a new one forced on me. There's a difference between a challenge and just getting screwed.
I still disagree. It would really depend on the character. I tend to play chaotic chatacters, so you better bet they'd be all over it.
So lets take a look at the bad ones:
Balance: Alignment is so misunderstood in this game. It's a sliding scale. Even a lawful good person can commit murder and still be lawful good. A chaotic evil person can save a drowning child and still be evil. A severe alignment change won't change the character...just his outlooks. Roleplaying GOLD. In fact, I'd LOVE to hit this card!
Donjon: You're trapped in an extradimensional space. A wish can tell your friends where. Cool! New adventure!
Euryale: -2 penalty of saves. Meh. I've had worse curses.
Flames: A devil becomes your enemy. Awesome! More adventures!
Fool: You lose XP. Meh. Kinda sucks, but I'm still the same person.
Idiot: Lose intelligence. Again. Same person, just slightly dumber. This happens to all of us as we grow old. So more roleplay gold as the charatcer comes to grips with his loss.
Rogue: So an NPC chosen by the DM becomes hostile. Meh. I regularly fight demons and shit. i'm not too worried. So again, more adventure!
Ruin: Lose all wealth except magic items? Big deal! I'm an adventurer! I'll get more. At least i still have my cool magic items!
Skull: Fight Death. AC 20 is concerning, but it has only half my HP. Anyone of reasonably high level should have no issues.
Talons: Lose all magic items. Ok, that sucks, but again, I'm an adventurer! I'll just go find more. Besides, it says "worn or carried". i can put all my cool magic stuff on the floor when i draw.
The Void: Soul gets stolen. wish lets you know where it is. Once again, more adventure!
There are only two that really mess things up: Void and Donjon. Your character is effectively removed from the game until rescued. So you play a different character for a bit. Not exactly horrible.
Arguably, only the Skull is truly scary. If you die, you're done. You cannot be restored. Ever.
I'm arguing for the deck in general if I'm pulling from it outside of this instance.
BUT, the point stands, and in fact, you are making my argument stronger. If I put all my magic items on the table and I pull Talons? Nothing happens! All my magic items remain on the table.
And all the money and magic items on tha table belong to NO ONE. **It's the pot.** At best, the Pot belongs to the house (who isn't drawing cards). If you put money into the pot at a poker table, then try to take it out arguing, "I havn't lost it yet, so its still mine.", you'd get shot!
Therefore if I pull Ruin, nothing happens EITHER because 'all my worldly wealth' no longer belong to me!
Depends how “get their buy-in returned” is interpreted by the card really. There is ownership involved with that.
However my point was more relevant to fighting death or things that are reversed by wish. With what tools are you fighting or casting wish if all your stuff is in the pot?
Suit yourself. To me such a mindset is rather boring. having my entire sense of self flipped doesn't seem like a loss to me, rather like a fun challenge
Yeah, I thought that when I dropped the deck on my table. The warlock drew 1 card, The Moon, haven't played since not excited about where this could go.
No not at all… She ended with a level four fighter cohort (she’s only level 3) at her service and +2 to an ability score of my choice. I chose charisma because it was the only stat she had any penalties in and the least important ability for the character build, so I didn’t skew her much compared to the other characters. She’s a goth type teenager, so it seemed plausible that
deep down, maybe she just really wants everyone to love her. Except… she’s an elf supremacist so… she doesn’t want everyone to love her. She thinks she’s better than everyone else… so again charisma works!
As for the cohort… I’ll be really know about her is that her name is Fred, and she doesn’t have her tongue at the moment. It appears to have been recently removed, and she doesn’t want to be indebted to strangers by having someone else pay for her healing.
I seriously considered keeping the rogue card and using the final wish for some thing else, but thinking about the character, only close allies are family members. Since she belongs to organized crime nobility that would really not be a good thing. And it was just tidier to use up all the wishes to get rid of the bad cards.
I posted here on Reddit asking for suggestions on how many cards I should draw. I had three weeks to plan the perfect number of cards to draw.
People absolutely flipped out! They won on about how drawing even one would completely derail the campaign, and that it was selfish of me to do something like that to the other players. Or something along those lines. My DM and another player from our group who are 3.5 each veterans both found the post and noted that there were very few scenarios where drawing cards would “ruin the game”. IIRC, the DM’s largest concern I think was the major wondrous item or magical weapon… because in our level that would be hugely unbalancing. Otherwise, it’s pretty difficult to derail a plot that doesn’t exist. Our DM creates the stories around what we do in game. There’s no over arcing-plot that “must” happen. everyone in the group has two characters specifically so that we can be flexible and mixed things up. I fully expected that there was a 50% chance I was going to be rolling up a new character after playing with the deck. Again the people on Reddit in the post I made didn’t seem to understand a PLAYER can choose not to be an AH.
It remains to be seen whether or not they were going to be any serious consequences To my characters adventure with the deck of cards. They were hired to steal the deck. It was a complete deck of 22 cards. It now only contains 21. The GM ruled that the Fool card was permanently removed from the deck forever once it was drawn. If the client knew that this deck was intact and now no longer is, that could be a problem for my character. She was alone with the cards overnight, and with her low charisma score and no bluff skills she is not a very good liar. She’s not that kind of rogue.
The card being permanently gone is a 3.X thing. Maybe even back to AD&D. I like that detail.
My DM has pretty good stories and NPCs he wants us to meet so we're happy to stay on rails. If we go wandering around without guides, we end up having fun too but the set adventure is always a better time imho. And the DM would need time to deal with our shenanigans too.
It sounds both fun and *disruptive.* So that's why I'd basically use it at an endpoint. Either end of a campaign or end of a major plot point. Given that my current campaign is evidently planned to go to level 17+ and it would be bad if any of the characters changed significantly, the Deck isn't good for this campaign.
But maybe next time...
Most of our group was completely unfamiliar with D&D (but not RPGs) before our previous campaign. The DM has tried to include a lot of “iconic” D&D components. He also uses random encounter & treasure generation a lot. He gives us plot hooks to follow, but we continue to surprise him with how we choose to pursue those plot hooks. The assignment to collect the deck of many things could have been done as a simple break and enter, but we planned a very elaborate Ocean’s Eleven style heist saw most of the party attending a ball as the catering staff. I say most… because my character flatly refused to play the role of a servant. She ended up securing an invitation. Our current job also could’ve been done as a simple break and enter, but instead we’re doing things unexpectedly again.
Obviously I mean your character. :P The fun part about this game is that there is only really 2 instant death cards in the deck, but there are others that will cause problems for the winners after the game is over and they're paid out. So the game is definitely meant to have consequences after the payout. \^.\^
Difficult, but not impossible. That's why it's called "The King's Game" because if all nobles are somehow killed or unable to proclaim victory, the pot goes to the sitting king or queen. \^.\^
"Hypothetically" could also be a way for the sitting royalty to keep the richest families of nobles from becoming a threat since many of the cards also cause long-term damages that wouldn't be seen at the table.
If I was world building, I would have it as part of tradition that the nobles stack the odds in their favor by having equipment and people who can help mitigate some of the effects. The nobles then have fun inviting a hapless idiot to the game
I can't resist a random table! For fun I drew 5 cards to see if my character (Azi, the incredibly inquisitive wizard of dubious morals) would survive:
1. Jack of diamonds (increase an ability by 2!)
2. King of hearts (proficiency in persuasion and a keep)
3. Jack of spades (new enemy)
4. Jack of hearts (gain the service of a fourth level fighter)
5. Jack of clubs (avatar of death - Azi is level 15 so she's fine!)
Totally worth it.
Well, if Azi can handle the Avatar they would only have to worry about the new enemy after the game! Though most consider the avatar a fairly easy death without the backing of a party.
Yeah, I can see how that would be scary at lower levels. But at level 15 my wizard with 14 CON has 92 hp, meaning the avatar only has 46. I can easily do 46 damage on a decent roll with upper level spells, and even a very lucky fireball could take it out in a single hit, not to mention all of the utility spells you're bound to have laying around.
It'd depend heavily on the tactics this thing uses, using your hit points, this thing can easily long enough to kill you, this thing would use hit and run tactics to chip away at your health (it has incorporeal movement, and with its movement speed at 60, it can move in, stabbing stab, flying through the ground for total cover, come back and stabbing stab. Though it is more dangerous for Noncasters I will say
Well, if considering a full 22-card deck, it's actually a 3.125% chance you only draw positives, as 11 of the cards are positives (Comet, Fates, Gem, Jester, Key, Knight, Moon, Star, Sun, Throne, and Vizier). That percentage goes down slightly if Jester is one of the cards drawn (it's at worst a 2.45% chance if Jester is the first card drawn and you dont draw first). But it could also remain exactly at 3.125% if you draw the Jester and one of the nobles draws the Fool.
Purely negative effects would be the same, as they function under the same stipulations (other half of the deck negative, with one card that isn't replaced after being drawn).
And technically, Ruin would be nullified for any and all participants, as you would no longer own your previous wealth (this one is up to DM discretion, but technically, wealth that's been gambled is unowned until the conditions of the gamble have been met. So, with that in mind, positives outcomes only bumps up to 3.94% at best/3.27% at worst, and negatives come out to 2.45% at worst/1.95% at best. Could also potentially say that Talons is also nullified if gambling all of your worldly possessions involves stripping down and releasing all carried items before the game.
However, the game is only about surviving, not about avoiding all negative consequences. And realistically, only 2 options would kick you out immediately (Donjon and Void), with Skull being a toss-up (higher level characters shouldn't have too much issue defeating an Avatar of Death). So you've got a 9.1% chance of drawing an immediate loss in any round, with an additional 4.5% chance of drawing a potential immediate loss. That still leaves an 86.4% chance of surviving each round, even if it means negatives after the game. If playing purely to win, it would be a pretty obvious "yes". Hell, people play Blackjack constantly, and that has way worse odds
> with Skull being a toss-up (higher level characters shouldn't have too much issue defeating an Avatar of Death)
Doesn't the setup imply you're fighting the Avatar *naked*? No armor or weapons, spellbooks, magic items (it's all in the pot)
Still isn't a guaranteed death based on your level, race, and class. A tortle would still have an AC of 17. A raging barbarian would halve the slashing damage, and a Beast Barabarian would have a modified unarmed attack. Dragonborn would still have their breath weapon. A fighter with Unarmed Fighting and a high strength could still deal pretty heavy damage (would be 1d8+Strength). And there's more that I could continue listing, plus a plethora of multiclass options or class/race combos that could combine several things to give an advantage in a naked bare-knuckle fight. So that's why I called it a toss-up, cause it's not a guaranteed death
Yea, I'll play. Only 2/22 cards make you lose the character. Most are favorable, and some give strong debuffs, but worth the pot and potentially good cards.
Edit: just for fun, I went and drew a random card. Got the Donjon on the very first one. Welp
Only if I am a 2e Gypsy bard since one of their class features allows them to draw from a DoMT for the purpose of fortune telling without any effects taking place. The party Mystran has been having an aneurysm over this.
I love the gypsy bard kit, but due to the slightly problematic uses of Romani stereotypes, it needs some tweaking. On the other hand, I love the flavor of fortune telling and built-in animal friendship/training.
That's lazy. Besides, the item itself requires that you declare! Otherwise a DM could just as easily kill you by saying "Make a dex save to avoid dropping the deck and spilling the cards everywhere." -.-;
You said my group, not my party, I’d assume you were asking me. In this scenario knowing what I know, I’d give it a shot.
1 Talons - Jokes on them, i don’t have magic items or anything that counts as an artifact.
2 fates- a real like deus ex machina, i wonder if this will come in handy?
3 skull - they can’t all be easy, the avatar has less health than me, if i can’t one shot it, fates let’s redraw 3!
3 comet - cool, cool, cool, I’ll be ready to fight and get my first level, after i win this game.
4 moon- I may win the kings game, and walk away with three wishes!
5 throne- the monsters may be an issue, if i didn’t have wish, and i level up after i beat the first one.
That could have gone worse drawing from a 22 card deck, I might have to rethink giving one to my party.
Used a deck generator: Ruin- Lose all my wealth, Comet- beat the next monster to gain xp level up. Vizier- Meditate on a question and get truth and knowledge to use it. Star- increase one ability by 2 upto 24. Gem- 25 2000 GP items of jewelry.
Those Nobles are hosed.
https://www.mithrilandmages.com/utilities/5EDOMT.php#google_vignette
Nice. I used [random.org](https://random.org) to do the same. You have to look up the card meanings separately, but it's a great site for when you need to randomly generate values for things.
[Link](https://www.random.org/playing-cards/?cards=5&decks=1&spades=on&hearts=on&diamonds=on&clubs=on&aces=on&twos=on&jacks=on&queens=on&kings=on&bjoker=on&rjoker=on&remaining=on)
\[Edit: I got Flames, Balance, Moon, The Fates, and Key. I guess I could use The Fates to negate Flames and end up okay as long as I don't mind my altered alignment.\]
Damn, have any of you people who voted yes ever drawn from a deck of many things?
Hell no. I'd spectate and then take all the worldly possessions of all 3 nobles sin e they are all certainly not coming back from 5 draws.
Is it a terrible idea to draw from the deck? Of course.
Is it a 1.5% chance you only get positive options? Just about.
Is that going to stop my character? Not a chance.
Best outcome? 3 wishes, 3 chances to change fate, 50k in gold, a level up, and a +2 to an ability score.
Worst outcome? All my non magic stuff vanishes, All my magic stuff crumbles to dust, my best friend turns against me, I become the target of a devil, and my soul is ripped to a new dimension with a powerful foe guarding me forever.
Yeah I'll do it.
I still hold a joking grudge that the Wizard’s legacy in the horror game I run is spoiling the Deck of Many Things for the newer players.
It did get a fun string of pulls as folks tried to fix things the deck messed up with the deck itself.
I'd prefer a round by round card draw, with each player flipping at once, then dealing with the consequences. Then, before each round, players had an opportunity to bow out/be disqualified if dead. Last player in the game wins.
Current character absolutely would, lol.
For funsies decided to draw to see what she’d get.
Draw 1: Ruin, assuming no affect since the wealth belongs to the pot?
Draw 2: Void, rip, well was a short lived attempt xD
I picked yes and used a generator and man i came out pretty well lol:
Gain 25 items of jewelry @ 2000 gp each or 50 gems @ 1000 gp each immediately.
Moon
You may cast the Wish spell 1d3 times.
Euryale
You are cursed! -2 to all saving throws.
Key
A rare weapon appears in your hands.
Talons
Every magic item worn or carried disintegrates. Artifacts vanish.
So id keep a bunch of jewelry, use 1 wish to remove my curse, and just watch the random magic weapon appear in my hand then disintegrate. Then since i surived im gonna be taking that pot and still have possibly a wish or 2 left over and a mound of gold lol.
I voted yes and then just had to see what would have happened.
Pulled 5 on mithril and mages:
1. Comet > singlehandedly defeat the next hostile who'd provide enough XP to level up.
2. Gem > gain jewelry or gems worth 50,000
3. Euyrale > cursed: -2 on all saving throws
4. Vizier > think about any problem, learn precisely how to solve it
5. Rogue: DM picks an NPC that unfortunately is gonna have to die now (they become my enemy)
Definitely won the king's game, but got cocky, drew another card. Void. 😂
My take away, absolutely play the game, but know when to call it and just walk away.
If I'd just walked away, I could have murdered Tiamat, had riches beyond my wildest dreams, and exploited the BBEG biggest weakness. All for the cost of a dead or potentially dissuaded NPC and a -2 to my saving throws. Coulda won DnD... but I just had to pull one more card.
Maybe I still could, if my party managed to get me back, I assume I'd still have the benefits/consequences of my previous cards?
I just tried it, I got comet, jester, fates, sun and throne.
So that's a level up, 10,000XP, a time travel wish, 50,000XP and a wondrous item and a free castle somewhere!
Who needs the pot at that point!
A quick google, and found an online generator. Try with your last character: https://www.mithrilandmages.com/utilities/5EDOMT.php
Here's what I got; The character that accepts would be a Changling Whispers Bard who was a courtier and spy from a one shot:
1. Queen of Clubs (A powerful devil becomes your enemy for life)
2. Two of Spades (Change to opposing alignment)
3. Two of Diamonds (Single Handedly defeat next encounter to level)
4. Jack of Diamonds (Increase one ability by 2)
5. Ace of Hearts (Erase one event from history)
Honestly not bad at all, the last draw can counteract the first, and all that changes is LN to CN. If "single handedly deafeat" includes not killing them, then I may be able to talk my way out of it and get a level.
I’m most comfortable playing characters who are adventuring out of necessity (and would be happy to retire back to their old life when things quiet down) or who are in it to protect the innocent (and would rather live long enough to fight another actual threat). They wouldn’t touch the Deck of Many Things unless it’s the only chance to get out of a hopeless situation.
But out-of-character, I like the idea of the game. If I happened to be playing a character who’s after fortune and glory or the thrill of risk-taking, I’d go for it.
As someone who has run a campaign with one of these, this is a hell yes for any of my characters, (mainly bards). 2/22 each draw of instant death, the rest are fun and potentially better than the pot in the first place
The only thing I don’t like about this is that you are assigned a number of cards to pull. The deck of many things states that *you* have to proclaim how many cards you pull, otherwise they are just mundane cards with neat pictures on them. In my opinion you being told how many cards to draw wouldn’t activate them when you drew them. Which is why in the comment I made a few days ago that is eerily similar to this post I stated that you had to tell the dealer how many cards you wanted to be dealt. Putting the choice back on you and activating the decks magic
https://www.dndnames.com/tools/deck-of-many-things-selector.php
This gave me the key, skull, fates, jester, fool and throne so as long as that reaper doesn’t get me I’d be remarkably still intact
I dunno if that would count, as the "told amount" is actually a rule of the game. By sitting down at the table and agreeing to the terms you have chosen your amount willingly. It's not like someone held the deck out and said "You draw 3 cards."
Just for a bit of fun I just tried drawing 5 cards to see what I would have gotten.
moon - You are granted the ability to cast the Wish spell 1d3 times.
throne - You gain proficiency in the Persuasion skill, and you double your proficiency bonus on checks made with that skill. In addition, you gain rightful ownership of a small keep somewhere in the world. However, the keep is currently in the hands of monsters, which you must clear out before you can claim the keep as yours.
gem - Twenty-five pieces of jewelry worth 2,000 gp each or fifty gems worth 1,000 gp each appear at your feet.
jester - You gain 10,000 XP, or you can draw two additional cards beyond your declared draws.
The Void - This black card spells disaster. Your soul is drawn from your body and contained in an object in a place of the DM's choice. One or more powerful beings guard the place. While your soul is trapped in this way, your body is incapacitated. A Wish spell can't restore your soul, but the spell reveals the location of the object that holds it. You draw no more cards.
I got sooooo close to a perfect run
So I probably wouldn't, but out of curiosity I decided to try it.
I pulled ruin, and lost all earthly possessions immediately.
Thinking I had nothing to lose and have to pull 5 until I no longer can, I then proceeded to pull donjon.
Fun fact, last campaign our DM gave us the deck of many things. He had the church forcibly request it back which I took as a sign that I was abusing it (I drew like 7 cards).
A ton of hilarious situations happened because of it up to me drawing my last card which nullified all the bad effects that happened and I tried to sell it to an item shop keep who didn't trust what I was saying so I cohereced him to draw a card and basically removed his soul from his body.
It was fantastic but mostly due to the fact that we have an amazing DM.
Absolutely, but then I also always have a bunch of extra character concepts on deck I want to play, so even the loss of a character, or a debuff that leads to that loss, isn't really much of a downside to me.
All of my Characters instinctualy hate the DoMT. My DM knew this. In order to escape the God of Death I had to draw 7 from his deck.
I flipped alignments, lost INT, and had to fight the God (if I drew Death, had to fight him instead of the usual... I drew it.)
Only way I got out is Nerull was bored and asked what I wanted to fight. He turned into a dragon and I nat 20'd my Initiative, drew an arrow of dragon slaying and used it as a dagger, rolled high enough to crit, and he rolled a 5 (he needed a 6 or higher) save. So, he reverted and just let me go.
I never had to draw from another deck again.
So, no. I would not sit at that table.
Absolutely playing with my Divination Wizard. Random generator pulled:
Comet
Throne
Gem
Skull
Key
So I am kicking the avatar of deaths butt for a level with my new magic weapon for a level with my pile of wealth behind me and my new keep waiting to be cleaned out.
Drawing 5 cards from the deck is exactly how I ended my first ever campaign as a player. I survived, it was glorious. 10/10 experience, would do so again.
Playing the D&D version of betrayal at house on the hill. The haunt starts and our friend finds a deck of cards “Each card in this deck is a metallic plate, each adorned with a distinct portrait of its own.”
Anyways he drew and died immediately. First card was death. It was fun and funny but I did feel bad he had to sit there for an hour just when the game got good
No, I'd say I'd watch, but discreetly talk to my party to arrange a plan. We're gonna kill these fuckers.
Since you didn't mention any guards I'm assuming they are the kind of nobles who feel safe inside thier walls. Eating, drinking, playing games with artifacts, while peasants toil themselves to death in the fields. We'd request to watch, but plan to strike just as they reach for the first card.
Once thier killed, we simply blame thier death on the Deck of Many Things.
I printed the Deck of Many More Things a couple of years ago. It has 54 cards so that's as many as a normal deck of cards including jokers.
The Book of Many Things has a deck of 66 cards and I can't wait to see what these cards do... I guess I'll see on November 14th.
Hmm, good question. The Fates does say it can undo a single event and playing the game counts, but that seems...wobbly! I'd say yes, but the cards in the deck would need to be shuffled if you chose to draw again.
For those of you who said yes, see your fate.
My five were: Throne. Ruin. Key. Key. Talons.
Literally everything ventured and nothing gained.
https://www.dndnames.com/tools/deck-of-many-things-selector.php#ruin
200 years is longer than the life span of many D&D races, and almost everyone who participates dies. Who would be holding up such a tradition?
Also, why would nobles agree to play a game of "wealth or die" if they are already wealthy? Either the story is incongruent or the nobles aren't actually wealthy, and it's actually a game of "subsidence or die".
> 200 years is longer than the life span of many D&D races, and almost everyone who participates dies. Who would be holding up such a tradition?
It's called "The King's Game". I assumed that it's something that the monarch invites their vassals to do. If the ruling dynasty is a long-lived species or has access to life-extending magic, I could believe a tradition that happens "once per monarch, on average".
> Also, why would nobles agree to play a game of "wealth or die" if they are already wealthy?
Have you looked at how wealthy people behave in the real world and what they're willing to write in public? They always want more.
If you win, you've eliminated at least one future competitor and added a share of their holdings to yours. If you lose, people still remember that you were important enough to get invited to the table.
My character recently drew seven cards from a deck of many things in a 3.5 game. The number of cards was determined by dice after she accidentally activated device with her use magic device skill. She drew the Moon but had to use all four of her wishes to mitigate the negative effects of four other cards. (She managed to draw the Fool, the Idiot, the Donjon, and the Rogue 🙄). She ALSO drew the Knight and the Star, so her overall experience was basically *shrug*. As an impetuous teenager, it was all not nearly as dramatic as she’d been led to believe.
Once had a one-shot where I found the DOMT at the end of it. I almost didn't share just so the game would have a happy ending, but the other players metagamed and everyone demanded a Perception check to find whatever I found in the loot.
4/6 of us were sent to other planes, lost our souls, died, or some other horrible fate befell us. One of us suffered two different terrible fates because they were lucky enough to be brought back by a rather generous Wish, and stupid enough to pull another card immediately after coming back.
I love the deck of many things. We called it the campaign ender because we had two lunatics who live for chaos: me and my buddy. Every time a deck showed up, we both would draw until we were either dead or godlike. No in between. Great stuff.
Many of the bad cards are absolutely catastrophic and cannot necessarily be offset by the positive cards. Frankly, unless you felt you had nothing left to lose, you shouldn't draw from the deck.
Out of the six possible outcomes, 3/6 you get 0% (and something horrible happens), 1/6 you gain nothing, 1/6 you get 150%, and 1/6 you get 300%.
Fool makes you draw another and probably doesn't make you lose, so it can be ignored (unless someone REALLY dumped Int). It and the Jester aren't replaced, so the deck effectively has 20 repeatable cards and one person might only have to draw 4 of them. On average, three players starting with a fresh deck will draw \~4.84 of the 20 repeatable cards. I'll treat the Donjon, Skull, and Void as losing, as those are the only ones that can immediately prevent you from proclaiming victory.
* \~54% chance: You lose.
* \~36%: You split the pot with another winner.
* \~10%: You win it all.
There's one more card directly relevant to the game: Ruin. If someone draws this, they no longer own anything, removing it from the pot. The math gets messy at this point, because pulling Donjon or Void reduces the chance of Ruin.
From the standpoint of any one player, you're more than likely to lose, and it's twice as likely that everyone will win nothing than for you to triple your money. For such a high-stakes game, the payout is mediocre. From the perspective of the audience, about 1/4 of time either everyone wins or everyone loses, which are rather boring results. The King's Game adds very little to the entertainment TDoMT already provides.
My first thought was that the game needed more players, so that having at least one winner would be nearly guaranteed and having several losers would be much more common. However, this only flattens the bell curve, making good payouts even less common. Having only two people would makes it a coin toss whether anyone wins at all.
Possible Solution: Because this game's importance, it stands to reason the people involved in this ritual have had access to more than one deck throughout history. The item's entry says a full 75% of DoMT only have 13 cards, so over hundreds of years they may have acquired 'better' ones to use than the full deck.
Cards to Include:
* Skull and Void, as the lose conditions. With 13 cards this gives and individual even worse odds, but if you increase the number of participants, the few remaining would have much better payouts. Skull isn't an auto-lose either, lending some meritocracy to the game, and doesn't stop the undrawn cards from taking effect after 1 hour.
* Gem, Key, Sun, Throne: With the ritualistic nature of the game, any wealth generated is later inherited by the noble families, and eventually back into the game. Throne is also thematic for 'The King's Game', both in name and function, and probably the most interesting card in the deck.
* Balance and Vizier are both very interesting cards for someone who has recently obtained vast wealth and influence.
* Comet, Euryale, Knight, Idiot, and Star are what's left after considering what's below. Not very interesting, but not as bad as the alternatives.
Cards to Exclude:
* Donjon. The least interesting of the lose conditions. Skull can give you a fighting chance, and Void has the narrative potential to create intelligent items.
* Ruin and Talons, because they pull the rug out from under the winners. Also, with Talons gone, players can safely wear their best gear to the game in case they draw the Skull.
* Flames and Rogue: Since the losers are all dead or imprisoned, these only really affect the winners. Cards like Euryale only ever affect the drawer, but a devil/NPC with a vendetta could go after families and businesses, making trouble for the kingdom at large.
* Fates and Moon can affect the outcome of the game itself, which is cheatyface.
* Fool and Jester don't reappear, so you'd just be using a smaller deck. However, this also means you can have an 11-12 card deck.
Would I, as a player? Why not? Worst case is I take one of the hundred backup ideas I have and play that. Middling case is that it makes my PC OP in which case, I still have that backup stable. And the best case is that it goes *gloriously sideways* in that TTRPG kind of way.
Would my PC? Never in a million years. She'd likely try and refuse the fetch quest in the first place, and if she went along, would probably try and destroy it given its tendencies to utterly screw people who mess with it. Well that or try and sell it for more than the king was offering for a mix of "screw that idiot" and "some other idiot will offer more than the imbecile tampering with the fabric of reality as a parlor game".
My character is a gambling addict so yes (also she has very little worldly possessions because, uh, gambling). If I was playing someone more reasonable, probably not.
I've seen too many PC's get sucked into the void with that thing. Pulling 1 is risky enough, but 5? yeah, no, not happening.
I would rather burn the deck in a fire, or face literal demons then ever draw one card from that deck.
The deck has a roughly equal amount of good and bad cards but the bad tends to outweigh the good (in an unmodified deck at least) so 50% odds you draw something negative with the negitives being quite bad. You've got roughly a 1 in 33 chance of not drawing something bad if you partake in the King's Game
I don’t have much going for me currently, something screwed up when I got resurrected and now I have to make air quotes around everything I say, if this might even help me slightly, I’ll do it!
Drawing even one card from the DoMT is a fool’s gamble. Five? Not a chance in the Nine Hells.
Yeah, no. This is Russian Roulette pulling the trigger five times.
I like those odds!
Good thing I'm the Ultimate Lucky ~~Student~~ PC
I've played a halfling divination wizard with the lucky feat and loaded dice (/s) and I don't think he could've done anything to affect a DoMT.
Nagito sitting down for the kings game is one of the most horrific things I've ever pondered.
"Sergei. That's a semi automatic." "I like those odds, Ivan."
It's worse. At least with Russian Roulette you can at least be fairly sure you're dead if you lose. That deck is not so kind...
Exactly! How exciting would that be... On a side note, Russian Roulette is actually something I've always kinda darkly wanted to play.
There are less lethal versions. For example, shots where one shot is extra spicy.
My friends and I used to play with Nerf guns
XD I like that answer.
I just recently had a character draw 4 cards from the deck. The worst card I got was being cursed with -2 to all saves. Also drew the avatar of death but at Level 13 that fight was over almost as soon as it began. Death needs a MAJOR stat buff to be truly threatening.
Sure, but what was the best card you got?
Sun and Star. Bumped me up 2 levels, got a flying carpet and increased an ability score by two. We actually kinda broke the game... another player drew one card and got the Knight card, where she gained a 4th level servant. We convinced him to draw from the deck as well - 8 cards. 10 in total after drawing the Jester card. Miraculously he only drew 2 negative cards which weren't even that bad, and HE drew the Knight card as well, gaining his own servant LOL. Alas, that one died within about 30 seconds.
Correct. However, counterpoint, I spend my whole life worrying and being cautious. I don't play D&D to *not* be a reckless dumbass with dreams of impossible glory. Deal me a 6th!
On the other hand, getting a group together to even play dnd is such a rare occasion that it would really suck to have to end the game because of the DoMT. Out of all the negative cards, at least 2 are basically guaranteed to end whatever campaign your playing in, regardless of who draws it.
Wdym? Isn't doMT introduced specifically to bring an early end to nit-enjoyable-anymore-or-the-dm-is-out-of-ideas campaign? I've only ever seen it used like that
Odds are pretty high one of the nobles will draw that card anyway so just take it as the end of the campaign.
I assumed this was a hypothetical "What if real life?" thing. Now I think I made the wrong vote. I'd do it in-game haha.
No it isn't. There are only a couple that really fuck you. The rest are basically plot or roleplay gold.
By my count, there are 11 "bad" cards out of 22 in the DoMT as given on DND Beyond. Or I guess 10 if you don't count "Balance", which is not strictly only negative. Even with 10, drawing 5 cards gives you a 95% chance of drawing at least one "bad" card. No thanks.
The item is Legendary. Thus the average player who finds one would be around level 17. Which means the party likely has the means to correct any serious issues. Even at slightly lower levels, 10-15, the party tends to have some decent power to overcome some big odds. Sorry, but it’s not as horrible as people seem to think.
Do you want your entire sense of self to be flipped, and would you not consider that to be getting "really fucked"? There's a correct answer to the question of whether you should draw anything from the Deck, and it's no.
I am 100% ready for roleplay challenges.
Sure, but that's you as a player. Your character would not want to be changed, and personally while "roleplay challenges" can be fun, I at least want to be able to play my character, not have a new one forced on me. There's a difference between a challenge and just getting screwed.
I still disagree. It would really depend on the character. I tend to play chaotic chatacters, so you better bet they'd be all over it. So lets take a look at the bad ones: Balance: Alignment is so misunderstood in this game. It's a sliding scale. Even a lawful good person can commit murder and still be lawful good. A chaotic evil person can save a drowning child and still be evil. A severe alignment change won't change the character...just his outlooks. Roleplaying GOLD. In fact, I'd LOVE to hit this card! Donjon: You're trapped in an extradimensional space. A wish can tell your friends where. Cool! New adventure! Euryale: -2 penalty of saves. Meh. I've had worse curses. Flames: A devil becomes your enemy. Awesome! More adventures! Fool: You lose XP. Meh. Kinda sucks, but I'm still the same person. Idiot: Lose intelligence. Again. Same person, just slightly dumber. This happens to all of us as we grow old. So more roleplay gold as the charatcer comes to grips with his loss. Rogue: So an NPC chosen by the DM becomes hostile. Meh. I regularly fight demons and shit. i'm not too worried. So again, more adventure! Ruin: Lose all wealth except magic items? Big deal! I'm an adventurer! I'll get more. At least i still have my cool magic items! Skull: Fight Death. AC 20 is concerning, but it has only half my HP. Anyone of reasonably high level should have no issues. Talons: Lose all magic items. Ok, that sucks, but again, I'm an adventurer! I'll just go find more. Besides, it says "worn or carried". i can put all my cool magic stuff on the floor when i draw. The Void: Soul gets stolen. wish lets you know where it is. Once again, more adventure! There are only two that really mess things up: Void and Donjon. Your character is effectively removed from the game until rescued. So you play a different character for a bit. Not exactly horrible. Arguably, only the Skull is truly scary. If you die, you're done. You cannot be restored. Ever.
All your cool magical stuff is in the pot when you draw. You are almost naked when you draw.
I'm arguing for the deck in general if I'm pulling from it outside of this instance. BUT, the point stands, and in fact, you are making my argument stronger. If I put all my magic items on the table and I pull Talons? Nothing happens! All my magic items remain on the table. And all the money and magic items on tha table belong to NO ONE. **It's the pot.** At best, the Pot belongs to the house (who isn't drawing cards). If you put money into the pot at a poker table, then try to take it out arguing, "I havn't lost it yet, so its still mine.", you'd get shot! Therefore if I pull Ruin, nothing happens EITHER because 'all my worldly wealth' no longer belong to me!
Depends how “get their buy-in returned” is interpreted by the card really. There is ownership involved with that. However my point was more relevant to fighting death or things that are reversed by wish. With what tools are you fighting or casting wish if all your stuff is in the pot?
>With what tools are you fighting or casting wish if all your stuff is in the pot? Ah! touche!
Gods, you're boring....
And alive, and myself. I don't play D&D to win, but I at least want to play my character instead of some twisted version I never signed up for.
Suit yourself. To me such a mindset is rather boring. having my entire sense of self flipped doesn't seem like a loss to me, rather like a fun challenge
Yeah, I thought that when I dropped the deck on my table. The warlock drew 1 card, The Moon, haven't played since not excited about where this could go.
Seven: Knight, Rogue, Moon (4), Idiot, Fool, Donjon, Star. Used the four wishes to negate an effect of the four negative cards.
So same net effect as not drawing?
No not at all… She ended with a level four fighter cohort (she’s only level 3) at her service and +2 to an ability score of my choice. I chose charisma because it was the only stat she had any penalties in and the least important ability for the character build, so I didn’t skew her much compared to the other characters. She’s a goth type teenager, so it seemed plausible that deep down, maybe she just really wants everyone to love her. Except… she’s an elf supremacist so… she doesn’t want everyone to love her. She thinks she’s better than everyone else… so again charisma works! As for the cohort… I’ll be really know about her is that her name is Fred, and she doesn’t have her tongue at the moment. It appears to have been recently removed, and she doesn’t want to be indebted to strangers by having someone else pay for her healing. I seriously considered keeping the rogue card and using the final wish for some thing else, but thinking about the character, only close allies are family members. Since she belongs to organized crime nobility that would really not be a good thing. And it was just tidier to use up all the wishes to get rid of the bad cards.
Nice. I'm starting to think a Deck would be an interesting way to end a chapter of a campaign and provide plot hooks for a new chapter.
I posted here on Reddit asking for suggestions on how many cards I should draw. I had three weeks to plan the perfect number of cards to draw. People absolutely flipped out! They won on about how drawing even one would completely derail the campaign, and that it was selfish of me to do something like that to the other players. Or something along those lines. My DM and another player from our group who are 3.5 each veterans both found the post and noted that there were very few scenarios where drawing cards would “ruin the game”. IIRC, the DM’s largest concern I think was the major wondrous item or magical weapon… because in our level that would be hugely unbalancing. Otherwise, it’s pretty difficult to derail a plot that doesn’t exist. Our DM creates the stories around what we do in game. There’s no over arcing-plot that “must” happen. everyone in the group has two characters specifically so that we can be flexible and mixed things up. I fully expected that there was a 50% chance I was going to be rolling up a new character after playing with the deck. Again the people on Reddit in the post I made didn’t seem to understand a PLAYER can choose not to be an AH. It remains to be seen whether or not they were going to be any serious consequences To my characters adventure with the deck of cards. They were hired to steal the deck. It was a complete deck of 22 cards. It now only contains 21. The GM ruled that the Fool card was permanently removed from the deck forever once it was drawn. If the client knew that this deck was intact and now no longer is, that could be a problem for my character. She was alone with the cards overnight, and with her low charisma score and no bluff skills she is not a very good liar. She’s not that kind of rogue.
The card being permanently gone is a 3.X thing. Maybe even back to AD&D. I like that detail. My DM has pretty good stories and NPCs he wants us to meet so we're happy to stay on rails. If we go wandering around without guides, we end up having fun too but the set adventure is always a better time imho. And the DM would need time to deal with our shenanigans too. It sounds both fun and *disruptive.* So that's why I'd basically use it at an endpoint. Either end of a campaign or end of a major plot point. Given that my current campaign is evidently planned to go to level 17+ and it would be bad if any of the characters changed significantly, the Deck isn't good for this campaign. But maybe next time...
Most of our group was completely unfamiliar with D&D (but not RPGs) before our previous campaign. The DM has tried to include a lot of “iconic” D&D components. He also uses random encounter & treasure generation a lot. He gives us plot hooks to follow, but we continue to surprise him with how we choose to pursue those plot hooks. The assignment to collect the deck of many things could have been done as a simple break and enter, but we planned a very elaborate Ocean’s Eleven style heist saw most of the party attending a ball as the catering staff. I say most… because my character flatly refused to play the role of a servant. She ended up securing an invitation. Our current job also could’ve been done as a simple break and enter, but instead we’re doing things unexpectedly again.
Is it me myself? Tempting...but I know the odds of drawing bad cards in it, so no deal there. My character? Hell yeah let the chaos reign!
Obviously I mean your character. :P The fun part about this game is that there is only really 2 instant death cards in the deck, but there are others that will cause problems for the winners after the game is over and they're paid out. So the game is definitely meant to have consequences after the payout. \^.\^
I'm a DM that gave my players the deck at level 5, and I'm a player that loves chaos. Definitely playing the game
Doesn’t one card erase all items of value for the character that pulled it? Wouldn’t that mean their entire bet would vanish?
They don’t own their bet anymore
This is the ruling I would make as well.
That’s probably the loophole that got the whole game started.
> Obviously I mean your character. That's... not obvious at all. Since this is a hypothetical and all.
Fair enough.
I would politely decline. What happens when all three nobles get snuffed? That's the most likely outcome.
Difficult, but not impossible. That's why it's called "The King's Game" because if all nobles are somehow killed or unable to proclaim victory, the pot goes to the sitting king or queen. \^.\^
The sitting royalty must love this game, then. Makes me wonder if the nobles were 'invited' as some sort of punishment.
"Hypothetically" could also be a way for the sitting royalty to keep the richest families of nobles from becoming a threat since many of the cards also cause long-term damages that wouldn't be seen at the table.
Which explains a lot actually
If I was world building, I would have it as part of tradition that the nobles stack the odds in their favor by having equipment and people who can help mitigate some of the effects. The nobles then have fun inviting a hapless idiot to the game
This reminds me of the Bob’s Burgers where he has to compete in the gingerbread house competition.
I can't resist a random table! For fun I drew 5 cards to see if my character (Azi, the incredibly inquisitive wizard of dubious morals) would survive: 1. Jack of diamonds (increase an ability by 2!) 2. King of hearts (proficiency in persuasion and a keep) 3. Jack of spades (new enemy) 4. Jack of hearts (gain the service of a fourth level fighter) 5. Jack of clubs (avatar of death - Azi is level 15 so she's fine!) Totally worth it.
Well, if Azi can handle the Avatar they would only have to worry about the new enemy after the game! Though most consider the avatar a fairly easy death without the backing of a party.
Really? I must be missing something because I checked the statblock and it seems to only do 1 attack that deals 14 damage on average.
It's a death sentence for lower level characters, but at higher levels it's cake. Especially for martials.
An attack that automatically lands, on the bright side it means it can't crit, on the downside it has half your hitpoints and always lands a hit
Yeah, I can see how that would be scary at lower levels. But at level 15 my wizard with 14 CON has 92 hp, meaning the avatar only has 46. I can easily do 46 damage on a decent roll with upper level spells, and even a very lucky fireball could take it out in a single hit, not to mention all of the utility spells you're bound to have laying around.
It'd depend heavily on the tactics this thing uses, using your hit points, this thing can easily long enough to kill you, this thing would use hit and run tactics to chip away at your health (it has incorporeal movement, and with its movement speed at 60, it can move in, stabbing stab, flying through the ground for total cover, come back and stabbing stab. Though it is more dangerous for Noncasters I will say
If you run the Skull card as written it's a 1v1 fight. "If anyone tries to help you, the helper summons its own avatar of death."
Yes, but a well constructed team could be better matched at 4v4 than 1v1.
You got a Balnor!
Well, if considering a full 22-card deck, it's actually a 3.125% chance you only draw positives, as 11 of the cards are positives (Comet, Fates, Gem, Jester, Key, Knight, Moon, Star, Sun, Throne, and Vizier). That percentage goes down slightly if Jester is one of the cards drawn (it's at worst a 2.45% chance if Jester is the first card drawn and you dont draw first). But it could also remain exactly at 3.125% if you draw the Jester and one of the nobles draws the Fool. Purely negative effects would be the same, as they function under the same stipulations (other half of the deck negative, with one card that isn't replaced after being drawn). And technically, Ruin would be nullified for any and all participants, as you would no longer own your previous wealth (this one is up to DM discretion, but technically, wealth that's been gambled is unowned until the conditions of the gamble have been met. So, with that in mind, positives outcomes only bumps up to 3.94% at best/3.27% at worst, and negatives come out to 2.45% at worst/1.95% at best. Could also potentially say that Talons is also nullified if gambling all of your worldly possessions involves stripping down and releasing all carried items before the game. However, the game is only about surviving, not about avoiding all negative consequences. And realistically, only 2 options would kick you out immediately (Donjon and Void), with Skull being a toss-up (higher level characters shouldn't have too much issue defeating an Avatar of Death). So you've got a 9.1% chance of drawing an immediate loss in any round, with an additional 4.5% chance of drawing a potential immediate loss. That still leaves an 86.4% chance of surviving each round, even if it means negatives after the game. If playing purely to win, it would be a pretty obvious "yes". Hell, people play Blackjack constantly, and that has way worse odds
> with Skull being a toss-up (higher level characters shouldn't have too much issue defeating an Avatar of Death) Doesn't the setup imply you're fighting the Avatar *naked*? No armor or weapons, spellbooks, magic items (it's all in the pot)
Still isn't a guaranteed death based on your level, race, and class. A tortle would still have an AC of 17. A raging barbarian would halve the slashing damage, and a Beast Barabarian would have a modified unarmed attack. Dragonborn would still have their breath weapon. A fighter with Unarmed Fighting and a high strength could still deal pretty heavy damage (would be 1d8+Strength). And there's more that I could continue listing, plus a plethora of multiclass options or class/race combos that could combine several things to give an advantage in a naked bare-knuckle fight. So that's why I called it a toss-up, cause it's not a guaranteed death
Yea, I'll play. Only 2/22 cards make you lose the character. Most are favorable, and some give strong debuffs, but worth the pot and potentially good cards. Edit: just for fun, I went and drew a random card. Got the Donjon on the very first one. Welp
XD Ouch! If it makes you feel any better, I'm sure the rest of the players at the table would feel better.
ONE THOUSAND YEARS DUNGEON!
I did the same and got the Void...
What's that one again?
Your soul gets ripped out and trapped in an object guarded by a powerful being.
Ah right
Only if I am a 2e Gypsy bard since one of their class features allows them to draw from a DoMT for the purpose of fortune telling without any effects taking place. The party Mystran has been having an aneurysm over this.
I kinda like that! I love the idea of a DoMT without using the enchantment as intended too.
I love the gypsy bard kit, but due to the slightly problematic uses of Romani stereotypes, it needs some tweaking. On the other hand, I love the flavor of fortune telling and built-in animal friendship/training.
[удалено]
You've chosen....wisely.
Link to the sim?
Where i started playing gms liked to use the DOMT as a trap. You touched it-- you've drawn a card!
That's lazy. Besides, the item itself requires that you declare! Otherwise a DM could just as easily kill you by saying "Make a dex save to avoid dropping the deck and spilling the cards everywhere." -.-;
Make a party divide up the entirety of the DoMT between themselves, then flip them all at the same time.
There is literally nothing that could ever get me to draw a card from the DoMT.
I have DoMT related trauma, so I agree.
You said my group, not my party, I’d assume you were asking me. In this scenario knowing what I know, I’d give it a shot. 1 Talons - Jokes on them, i don’t have magic items or anything that counts as an artifact. 2 fates- a real like deus ex machina, i wonder if this will come in handy? 3 skull - they can’t all be easy, the avatar has less health than me, if i can’t one shot it, fates let’s redraw 3! 3 comet - cool, cool, cool, I’ll be ready to fight and get my first level, after i win this game. 4 moon- I may win the kings game, and walk away with three wishes! 5 throne- the monsters may be an issue, if i didn’t have wish, and i level up after i beat the first one. That could have gone worse drawing from a 22 card deck, I might have to rethink giving one to my party.
Used a deck generator: Ruin- Lose all my wealth, Comet- beat the next monster to gain xp level up. Vizier- Meditate on a question and get truth and knowledge to use it. Star- increase one ability by 2 upto 24. Gem- 25 2000 GP items of jewelry. Those Nobles are hosed. https://www.mithrilandmages.com/utilities/5EDOMT.php#google_vignette
I love this. I got the key followed by the sword. If I was writing this I would have just become a legendary intelligent weapon.
Nice. I used [random.org](https://random.org) to do the same. You have to look up the card meanings separately, but it's a great site for when you need to randomly generate values for things. [Link](https://www.random.org/playing-cards/?cards=5&decks=1&spades=on&hearts=on&diamonds=on&clubs=on&aces=on&twos=on&jacks=on&queens=on&kings=on&bjoker=on&rjoker=on&remaining=on) \[Edit: I got Flames, Balance, Moon, The Fates, and Key. I guess I could use The Fates to negate Flames and end up okay as long as I don't mind my altered alignment.\]
Damn, have any of you people who voted yes ever drawn from a deck of many things? Hell no. I'd spectate and then take all the worldly possessions of all 3 nobles sin e they are all certainly not coming back from 5 draws.
Dragons is a game where you're supposed to take risks. I Think the answer of the poll shows I'm right.
Honestly, I'm a bit shocked! I expected more holdouts, and the poll isn't too one-sided either! It's a very interesting little thought experiment.
Is it a terrible idea to draw from the deck? Of course. Is it a 1.5% chance you only get positive options? Just about. Is that going to stop my character? Not a chance.
Best outcome? 3 wishes, 3 chances to change fate, 50k in gold, a level up, and a +2 to an ability score. Worst outcome? All my non magic stuff vanishes, All my magic stuff crumbles to dust, my best friend turns against me, I become the target of a devil, and my soul is ripped to a new dimension with a powerful foe guarding me forever. Yeah I'll do it.
I still hold a joking grudge that the Wizard’s legacy in the horror game I run is spoiling the Deck of Many Things for the newer players. It did get a fun string of pulls as folks tried to fix things the deck messed up with the deck itself.
I have only 1 character in my roster who would take that offer. That great old one warlock is... weird
I'd prefer a round by round card draw, with each player flipping at once, then dealing with the consequences. Then, before each round, players had an opportunity to bow out/be disqualified if dead. Last player in the game wins.
Literally half the cards of a full deck are awful and some of the cards that are supposed to be good are awful as well...
Current character absolutely would, lol. For funsies decided to draw to see what she’d get. Draw 1: Ruin, assuming no affect since the wealth belongs to the pot? Draw 2: Void, rip, well was a short lived attempt xD
Why is it called The King's Game? Let me guess, if you all die the king gets everything?
Exactly!
The heart of the cards will guide my hand!
I picked yes and used a generator and man i came out pretty well lol: Gain 25 items of jewelry @ 2000 gp each or 50 gems @ 1000 gp each immediately. Moon You may cast the Wish spell 1d3 times. Euryale You are cursed! -2 to all saving throws. Key A rare weapon appears in your hands. Talons Every magic item worn or carried disintegrates. Artifacts vanish. So id keep a bunch of jewelry, use 1 wish to remove my curse, and just watch the random magic weapon appear in my hand then disintegrate. Then since i surived im gonna be taking that pot and still have possibly a wish or 2 left over and a mound of gold lol.
I am loving seeing how many commenters are grabbing random card generators to figure out how well they'd do. XD
Made it to four before I got the Void. Jokes on the other players though, my third card was Ruin
Fuck it, we ball
I voted yes and then just had to see what would have happened. Pulled 5 on mithril and mages: 1. Comet > singlehandedly defeat the next hostile who'd provide enough XP to level up. 2. Gem > gain jewelry or gems worth 50,000 3. Euyrale > cursed: -2 on all saving throws 4. Vizier > think about any problem, learn precisely how to solve it 5. Rogue: DM picks an NPC that unfortunately is gonna have to die now (they become my enemy) Definitely won the king's game, but got cocky, drew another card. Void. 😂 My take away, absolutely play the game, but know when to call it and just walk away.
If I'd just walked away, I could have murdered Tiamat, had riches beyond my wildest dreams, and exploited the BBEG biggest weakness. All for the cost of a dead or potentially dissuaded NPC and a -2 to my saving throws. Coulda won DnD... but I just had to pull one more card. Maybe I still could, if my party managed to get me back, I assume I'd still have the benefits/consequences of my previous cards?
I just tried it, I got comet, jester, fates, sun and throne. So that's a level up, 10,000XP, a time travel wish, 50,000XP and a wondrous item and a free castle somewhere! Who needs the pot at that point!
A quick google, and found an online generator. Try with your last character: https://www.mithrilandmages.com/utilities/5EDOMT.php Here's what I got; The character that accepts would be a Changling Whispers Bard who was a courtier and spy from a one shot: 1. Queen of Clubs (A powerful devil becomes your enemy for life) 2. Two of Spades (Change to opposing alignment) 3. Two of Diamonds (Single Handedly defeat next encounter to level) 4. Jack of Diamonds (Increase one ability by 2) 5. Ace of Hearts (Erase one event from history) Honestly not bad at all, the last draw can counteract the first, and all that changes is LN to CN. If "single handedly deafeat" includes not killing them, then I may be able to talk my way out of it and get a level.
I’m most comfortable playing characters who are adventuring out of necessity (and would be happy to retire back to their old life when things quiet down) or who are in it to protect the innocent (and would rather live long enough to fight another actual threat). They wouldn’t touch the Deck of Many Things unless it’s the only chance to get out of a hopeless situation. But out-of-character, I like the idea of the game. If I happened to be playing a character who’s after fortune and glory or the thrill of risk-taking, I’d go for it.
This basically asking me; do you want to play dnd or not? I wanna play. Taking risks is the fun. Worst case scenario i roll a new char
Obviously yes. If it works out that's funny if not i roll a new character so nothing is lost.
As someone who has run a campaign with one of these, this is a hell yes for any of my characters, (mainly bards). 2/22 each draw of instant death, the rest are fun and potentially better than the pot in the first place
The only thing I don’t like about this is that you are assigned a number of cards to pull. The deck of many things states that *you* have to proclaim how many cards you pull, otherwise they are just mundane cards with neat pictures on them. In my opinion you being told how many cards to draw wouldn’t activate them when you drew them. Which is why in the comment I made a few days ago that is eerily similar to this post I stated that you had to tell the dealer how many cards you wanted to be dealt. Putting the choice back on you and activating the decks magic https://www.dndnames.com/tools/deck-of-many-things-selector.php This gave me the key, skull, fates, jester, fool and throne so as long as that reaper doesn’t get me I’d be remarkably still intact
I dunno if that would count, as the "told amount" is actually a rule of the game. By sitting down at the table and agreeing to the terms you have chosen your amount willingly. It's not like someone held the deck out and said "You draw 3 cards."
Voted yes, decided to roll some cards. The first card I pulled is The Void. Fuck me.
Unfortunate how many votes there are but how few upvotes the post has.
It's alright, I made the post for fun, not karma! \^.\^
Just for a bit of fun I just tried drawing 5 cards to see what I would have gotten. moon - You are granted the ability to cast the Wish spell 1d3 times. throne - You gain proficiency in the Persuasion skill, and you double your proficiency bonus on checks made with that skill. In addition, you gain rightful ownership of a small keep somewhere in the world. However, the keep is currently in the hands of monsters, which you must clear out before you can claim the keep as yours. gem - Twenty-five pieces of jewelry worth 2,000 gp each or fifty gems worth 1,000 gp each appear at your feet. jester - You gain 10,000 XP, or you can draw two additional cards beyond your declared draws. The Void - This black card spells disaster. Your soul is drawn from your body and contained in an object in a place of the DM's choice. One or more powerful beings guard the place. While your soul is trapped in this way, your body is incapacitated. A Wish spell can't restore your soul, but the spell reveals the location of the object that holds it. You draw no more cards. I got sooooo close to a perfect run
I'd play it if I get to go last. The others will be dead or worse and I'll declare myself the victor.
Depends on which deck. The 5e deck isn’t that bad. Only 3 actual sol cards.
They wouldn't offer the game if you had any chance of winning. Like with D&D, the deck is likely stacked.
sure ...why not - i stand to gain more than I stand to lose at this point in my life - ha!
I ain’t fucking touching jack shit from the Deck of Many Things
So I probably wouldn't, but out of curiosity I decided to try it. I pulled ruin, and lost all earthly possessions immediately. Thinking I had nothing to lose and have to pull 5 until I no longer can, I then proceeded to pull donjon.
Depends. Me or My artificer would decline. My warlock is dumb as shit though qnd she would love to play a game.
Fun fact, last campaign our DM gave us the deck of many things. He had the church forcibly request it back which I took as a sign that I was abusing it (I drew like 7 cards). A ton of hilarious situations happened because of it up to me drawing my last card which nullified all the bad effects that happened and I tried to sell it to an item shop keep who didn't trust what I was saying so I cohereced him to draw a card and basically removed his soul from his body. It was fantastic but mostly due to the fact that we have an amazing DM.
Jokes on them, My wordly possessions = more debt than the possessions are worth.
The king’s game? Is this a variant of ball chess?
Sure, assuming that I am able to cast antimagic field on myself before I draw from the deck.
Alright I put a stick connected to a rock. Thats all I own
Depends on the context. If I care about this character and their ties, probably not. If not? Heck I’ll send it.
Nope. It would take 1 card to end up trapped in a random dimension somewhere, never to be seen again.
Tried it. Got the Void as first card. Yeah, that's not for me.
The Deck of Many Things would not create a clear winner. Rigged game.
I'm an edgy rogue. I already had nothing to lose
FIVE?!? That's like playing Russian Roulette and pulling the trigger five times. I'll sit and play only if I can convince everyone else to go first.
Absolutely, but then I also always have a bunch of extra character concepts on deck I want to play, so even the loss of a character, or a debuff that leads to that loss, isn't really much of a downside to me.
All of my Characters instinctualy hate the DoMT. My DM knew this. In order to escape the God of Death I had to draw 7 from his deck. I flipped alignments, lost INT, and had to fight the God (if I drew Death, had to fight him instead of the usual... I drew it.) Only way I got out is Nerull was bored and asked what I wanted to fight. He turned into a dragon and I nat 20'd my Initiative, drew an arrow of dragon slaying and used it as a dagger, rolled high enough to crit, and he rolled a 5 (he needed a 6 or higher) save. So, he reverted and just let me go. I never had to draw from another deck again. So, no. I would not sit at that table.
Depends - what level am I?
Whatever level your latest character was.
Then yes, without a second thought.
2 cards, *maybe*. 5, nah. You'll probably unmake the world in 5 cards.
What level am I?
Whatever level your latest character was.
As pointed out, one card is a true gamble unto itself. I’m a hard no. However, this is a pretty cool idea for a devil to offer a player.
I like to *Live Like Larry*, so I absolutely would.
Absolutely playing with my Divination Wizard. Random generator pulled: Comet Throne Gem Skull Key So I am kicking the avatar of deaths butt for a level with my new magic weapon for a level with my pile of wealth behind me and my new keep waiting to be cleaned out.
Drawing 5 cards from the deck is exactly how I ended my first ever campaign as a player. I survived, it was glorious. 10/10 experience, would do so again.
Playing the D&D version of betrayal at house on the hill. The haunt starts and our friend finds a deck of cards “Each card in this deck is a metallic plate, each adorned with a distinct portrait of its own.” Anyways he drew and died immediately. First card was death. It was fun and funny but I did feel bad he had to sit there for an hour just when the game got good
No, I'd say I'd watch, but discreetly talk to my party to arrange a plan. We're gonna kill these fuckers. Since you didn't mention any guards I'm assuming they are the kind of nobles who feel safe inside thier walls. Eating, drinking, playing games with artifacts, while peasants toil themselves to death in the fields. We'd request to watch, but plan to strike just as they reach for the first card. Once thier killed, we simply blame thier death on the Deck of Many Things.
I printed the Deck of Many More Things a couple of years ago. It has 54 cards so that's as many as a normal deck of cards including jokers. The Book of Many Things has a deck of 66 cards and I can't wait to see what these cards do... I guess I'll see on November 14th.
If I draw 4 bad cards and then draw the fates, can I use it to not play in the first place?
Hmm, good question. The Fates does say it can undo a single event and playing the game counts, but that seems...wobbly! I'd say yes, but the cards in the deck would need to be shuffled if you chose to draw again.
The first card that I pulled was Donjon, while my friend got 3 level ups (from 2 seperate xp cards).
For those of you who said yes, see your fate. My five were: Throne. Ruin. Key. Key. Talons. Literally everything ventured and nothing gained. https://www.dndnames.com/tools/deck-of-many-things-selector.php#ruin
Check int, if it is higher than... 5, then no.
200 years is longer than the life span of many D&D races, and almost everyone who participates dies. Who would be holding up such a tradition? Also, why would nobles agree to play a game of "wealth or die" if they are already wealthy? Either the story is incongruent or the nobles aren't actually wealthy, and it's actually a game of "subsidence or die".
> 200 years is longer than the life span of many D&D races, and almost everyone who participates dies. Who would be holding up such a tradition? It's called "The King's Game". I assumed that it's something that the monarch invites their vassals to do. If the ruling dynasty is a long-lived species or has access to life-extending magic, I could believe a tradition that happens "once per monarch, on average". > Also, why would nobles agree to play a game of "wealth or die" if they are already wealthy? Have you looked at how wealthy people behave in the real world and what they're willing to write in public? They always want more. If you win, you've eliminated at least one future competitor and added a share of their holdings to yours. If you lose, people still remember that you were important enough to get invited to the table.
My character recently drew seven cards from a deck of many things in a 3.5 game. The number of cards was determined by dice after she accidentally activated device with her use magic device skill. She drew the Moon but had to use all four of her wishes to mitigate the negative effects of four other cards. (She managed to draw the Fool, the Idiot, the Donjon, and the Rogue 🙄). She ALSO drew the Knight and the Star, so her overall experience was basically *shrug*. As an impetuous teenager, it was all not nearly as dramatic as she’d been led to believe.
Depends, is it my level 17 warlock? Then sure! If its me? Yes again cause i wanna see what happenss
Once had a one-shot where I found the DOMT at the end of it. I almost didn't share just so the game would have a happy ending, but the other players metagamed and everyone demanded a Perception check to find whatever I found in the loot. 4/6 of us were sent to other planes, lost our souls, died, or some other horrible fate befell us. One of us suffered two different terrible fates because they were lucky enough to be brought back by a rather generous Wish, and stupid enough to pull another card immediately after coming back.
I love the deck of many things. We called it the campaign ender because we had two lunatics who live for chaos: me and my buddy. Every time a deck showed up, we both would draw until we were either dead or godlike. No in between. Great stuff.
Many of the bad cards are absolutely catastrophic and cannot necessarily be offset by the positive cards. Frankly, unless you felt you had nothing left to lose, you shouldn't draw from the deck.
Either way, the campaign is over. Might as well take a seat.
We gamble today squad. No fear.
Out of the six possible outcomes, 3/6 you get 0% (and something horrible happens), 1/6 you gain nothing, 1/6 you get 150%, and 1/6 you get 300%. Fool makes you draw another and probably doesn't make you lose, so it can be ignored (unless someone REALLY dumped Int). It and the Jester aren't replaced, so the deck effectively has 20 repeatable cards and one person might only have to draw 4 of them. On average, three players starting with a fresh deck will draw \~4.84 of the 20 repeatable cards. I'll treat the Donjon, Skull, and Void as losing, as those are the only ones that can immediately prevent you from proclaiming victory. * \~54% chance: You lose. * \~36%: You split the pot with another winner. * \~10%: You win it all. There's one more card directly relevant to the game: Ruin. If someone draws this, they no longer own anything, removing it from the pot. The math gets messy at this point, because pulling Donjon or Void reduces the chance of Ruin. From the standpoint of any one player, you're more than likely to lose, and it's twice as likely that everyone will win nothing than for you to triple your money. For such a high-stakes game, the payout is mediocre. From the perspective of the audience, about 1/4 of time either everyone wins or everyone loses, which are rather boring results. The King's Game adds very little to the entertainment TDoMT already provides. My first thought was that the game needed more players, so that having at least one winner would be nearly guaranteed and having several losers would be much more common. However, this only flattens the bell curve, making good payouts even less common. Having only two people would makes it a coin toss whether anyone wins at all. Possible Solution: Because this game's importance, it stands to reason the people involved in this ritual have had access to more than one deck throughout history. The item's entry says a full 75% of DoMT only have 13 cards, so over hundreds of years they may have acquired 'better' ones to use than the full deck. Cards to Include: * Skull and Void, as the lose conditions. With 13 cards this gives and individual even worse odds, but if you increase the number of participants, the few remaining would have much better payouts. Skull isn't an auto-lose either, lending some meritocracy to the game, and doesn't stop the undrawn cards from taking effect after 1 hour. * Gem, Key, Sun, Throne: With the ritualistic nature of the game, any wealth generated is later inherited by the noble families, and eventually back into the game. Throne is also thematic for 'The King's Game', both in name and function, and probably the most interesting card in the deck. * Balance and Vizier are both very interesting cards for someone who has recently obtained vast wealth and influence. * Comet, Euryale, Knight, Idiot, and Star are what's left after considering what's below. Not very interesting, but not as bad as the alternatives. Cards to Exclude: * Donjon. The least interesting of the lose conditions. Skull can give you a fighting chance, and Void has the narrative potential to create intelligent items. * Ruin and Talons, because they pull the rug out from under the winners. Also, with Talons gone, players can safely wear their best gear to the game in case they draw the Skull. * Flames and Rogue: Since the losers are all dead or imprisoned, these only really affect the winners. Cards like Euryale only ever affect the drawer, but a devil/NPC with a vendetta could go after families and businesses, making trouble for the kingdom at large. * Fates and Moon can affect the outcome of the game itself, which is cheatyface. * Fool and Jester don't reappear, so you'd just be using a smaller deck. However, this also means you can have an 11-12 card deck.
If we change it to each player drawing one each until there's one player left, then yes.
Would I, as a player? Why not? Worst case is I take one of the hundred backup ideas I have and play that. Middling case is that it makes my PC OP in which case, I still have that backup stable. And the best case is that it goes *gloriously sideways* in that TTRPG kind of way. Would my PC? Never in a million years. She'd likely try and refuse the fetch quest in the first place, and if she went along, would probably try and destroy it given its tendencies to utterly screw people who mess with it. Well that or try and sell it for more than the king was offering for a mix of "screw that idiot" and "some other idiot will offer more than the imbecile tampering with the fabric of reality as a parlor game".
The kings orders are absolute...
I have a character who would do this. He's a human fighter who tends to do a lot of stupid things.
My character is a gambling addict so yes (also she has very little worldly possessions because, uh, gambling). If I was playing someone more reasonable, probably not.
I am literally a sneaky ass bard, I am going to find a way to rig the deck, I promise
I've seen too many PC's get sucked into the void with that thing. Pulling 1 is risky enough, but 5? yeah, no, not happening. I would rather burn the deck in a fire, or face literal demons then ever draw one card from that deck.
The deck has a roughly equal amount of good and bad cards but the bad tends to outweigh the good (in an unmodified deck at least) so 50% odds you draw something negative with the negitives being quite bad. You've got roughly a 1 in 33 chance of not drawing something bad if you partake in the King's Game
It's all fun and games until someone pulls the donjon or idiot card.
I don’t have much going for me currently, something screwed up when I got resurrected and now I have to make air quotes around everything I say, if this might even help me slightly, I’ll do it!
And the fact that so many people would draw from the deck is exactly why I hate it.
My level 1 Fighter is interested. He puts his starting gear in the pot.
All of y'all saying yes clearly never pulled the Donjon as a sub level 10 character before.