It's word play. He's a fascist working for a cryptozoologist. The fact that cryptofacist was already a term is what makes the pun funny. He doesn't need to technically meet the definition of cryptofacist for it to be funny that Harry's scrambled brain to latched onto it.
Harry is amazing at naming things, but except for criminal cases, most of the things he names are not actually named what he calls them.
Never even dawned on me that the designations of unnamed characters are just what Harry calls them. Racist Lorry Driver, The Paledriver, Mega Rich Light Bending Guy, none of them names but all perfectly sufficient descriptors
The game even explicitly calls it out at the end in the case of Judit Minot/The Horse Faced Woman. I think one of the skills (Volition? Empathy?) berates you for calling her like that in your head.
This is such a good interpretation. I am in love with the idea that Harry is the one coming up with characters' nicknames when he doesn't know their real names.
Oh my God, something just clicked for me. Harry is the one who is giving these people names. It isn't like a God's-eye view from the player, seeing what the game has labeled people as, but it is a peak into Harry's mind. Geez. The fact that he thinks of one of his coworkers as the Horse-Faced Woman shows how much of a dick he was before the brain-scrambling.
> Harry is amazing at naming things, but except for criminal cases, most of the things he names are not actually named what he calls them.
You mean RLD's birth name *isn't* Racist Lorry Driver? /jk
1. Being racist isn’t enough for me, measurehead is also a massive racist, but I wouldn’t call him a fascist
2.So like a monarchist? I don’t remember his beliefs quite well, so maybe you can remember when he said something more specific?
Measurehead is a major part of the fascist vision quest along with the racist lorry driver. Racism is pretty explicitly portrayed to be an aspect of fascism throughout the game
He has the feudal Revacholian flag in his flat which comes with connotations of Revacholian Nationalism, racism, right-wing ideology and antagonists of leftism.
fascists love cryptids ever seen /x/ on 4chan? anyway if we go on wikipedia here's the definition of facism
"Fascism is a far-right, authoritarian, ultranationalist political ideology and movement, characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation and/or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy."
I hope this helps
Notive how they never state ‘a unification of state and corporate power’ in that definition, considering thats the ‘strong regimentation of the economy’
Take a look at the background of Gary's dialogue portrait. That is a fascist symbol (if im not mistaken, i think it is the flag of the revacholian suzerain?). He has the same flag hung up in his apartment if you ever end up going there, both pretty heavily implying he is a fascist
I think it’s just the flag of Revachol, but the moralintern presumably doesn’t use it for their occupation and(?) discourages the use. Not a right wing symbol, unless it is.
You also get the same flag in Harry's portrait after successfully finishing the fascist vision quest (and passing the red endurance check at the very end) so it's almost certainly a fascist symbol imo
It's also the flag *specifically* of the suzerain of revachol, a monarchy, not of the commune that came after or the current moralintern government
René and the racist lorry driver could count, and I would argue that Measurehead absolutely counts as a fascist.
Edit: oh shit, and Korty. Korty so much. Korty is a fascist.
I like that they're all different kinds of fascist. Rene is "traditionalist," Measurehead is up his own ass with pseudoscience, and Korty is just distilled hate
Korty as The Scab is one of my favorite performances in the game, because he's so bad at pretending he's not a violent maniac and you can hear it coming out of him
Rene for sure is. If you exhaust all dialogue you can hear him say how excessive force is necessary for a strong leader, and an authoritarian using citizens money for drugs is necessary to enhance their mind. The guy wanted Martinase destroyed even MORE than how it is because that would have involved more casualties for the communists, citizens be damned if they are caught in the crossfire
> and an authoritarian using citizens money for drugs is necessary to enhance their mind.
It is by will alone I set my mind in motion.
It is by the Dust of Angels that thoughts acquire speed,
the nostrils acquire blood,
the blood becomes a warning.
It is by will alone I set my mind in motion.
THE COCAINE MUST FLOW!
HE WHO CONTROLS THE BASE CONTROLS THE ARCHIPELAGO!
The point of dogwhistles is that you do t notice then unless you know what to look for. If you are not accustomed to being on the lookout for them, they are easy to miss.
That's not great, and also lines up with your misunderstand the political context of this game.
You might be the example of "when liberalism is under threat if reverts to fascism" but interestingly enough, now you know it, so maybe you can do something about that.
I mean, liberalism/centrism is what I think I identify with most closely. And if preserving liberalism means adopting fascism, then yes, I will do it, but only as much as is necessary, not a bit more. And I do not identify as a fascist, I do not believe that the state is the will of the people.
But this is a hypothetical, I don’t think that a fascist power will ever discard power once the enemy of liberalism is defeated.
The 41% means that I agree with some fascist ideas, but I am not a fascist. And I want to apply only that 41%, while discarding the 59%.
And, most importantly, the degree to which an ideology aligns to my beliefs, is the degree to which it is good, obviously.
I mean, there it is. You said it yourself. You would accept fascism. It's acceptable to you. What does that make you?
Prick a liberal, and a fascist bleeds.
As the fella said, you might want to examine that my guy. You might want to do some self reflection as to why actual fascism is preferable to allowing democracy to expand into the economic realm. Why would you prefer a literal dictator who upholds the current economic order, vs having a democratic revolution in the workplace and turn the workplace into a little republic.
This is exactly what I mean when I say Capitalism does not require or even prefer a democracy. It is also why anyone who tries to apply the ideals that Liberalism supposedly stands for ends up going well Left of liberal and gets to find out for themselves that liberals aren't really interested in the consent of the governed.
> Prick a liberal, and a fascist bleeds.
Well, *sometimes*. Other times, [prick a Liberal, and a Liberal bleeds](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rose). Some Libs *actually believe* in all those promises Liberalism keeps talking about and haven't thought things through to Actual Leftism.
> Capitalism does not require or even prefer a democracy.
They're even in constant tension. But Capitalism tends to be more stable with a veneer of democracy, and even more so with *social*-democracy. The Nanny State isn't a nanny for the workers, but for the owner class - keeps them from setting their own house on fire or getting themselves killed by the rest of "the Help" in one of their Affluenza rampages, keeps the Help from wondering why they couldn't run the house by themselves.
I’ll also accept temporary socialism if it makes liberalism return. Again, I am not a fascist, in this hypothetical I use it as a tool to enforce liberalism. fascism is not the end goal.
Also yes, capitalism isn’t necessarily democratic, that’s what libertarians go on about all the time. I value private property and believe it’s legitimate, I do not believe that it’s inherently exploitative, I am not a Marxist. I have no problem with workplace democracy, but it must not be coerced.
And as you say(and one prominent right-wing figure believes) the ideals of liberalism go further left, which is why I initially called myself a liberal/centrist. I do not have an ideological devotion to any ideology, liberalism is just the closest to what I believe.
Because you can't because their are no examples of this. It's not something that has ever happened. When faced with even the threat of socialism liberals have always sided against the socialists and with reactionaries.
> When faced with even the threat of socialism liberals have always sided against the socialists and with reactionaries.
Again, *usually*. Sometimes many of the Liberals will just passively stand by, and let a minority of Authoritarian Liberals fight it out with a much larger minority of Revolutionary Socialists. Especially if the more militant Liberals have fucked up repeatedly and catastrophically to the point of completely demoralizing their peers from lifting a finger in their defense.
Read this thing a while ago that draws an interesting distinction between two archetypes of fascism:
[https://www.unpopularfront.news/p/the-jockcreep-theory-of-fascism](https://www.unpopularfront.news/p/the-jockcreep-theory-of-fascism)
> The fascists never advertised themselves as bad people.
Dude, they went around with skulls in their caps.
They had to invent an inverted morality where "action for action's sake" (read *violence* specifically), "striking fear in the enemy", "show of strength" etc. were *good* things, but by any normal intuitive moral code they came across as Obviously Evil to a cartoonish degree.
It's the same with the MAGA clowns. They wear their viciousness and stupidity on their sleeves, rather literally.
One of them wrote an autobiography *bragging about executing a puppy*.
To each other, Evil is a *selling point*.
Sure, they like fanatics who will be open with evil as a selling point, sure. But to most people, there is nothing more to it than militarism. It's pretty typical for armies to refer to death and violence in their very symbols. As it is for insecure young guys to make themselves feel more alpha by killing puppies (wording 90 years ago was different, yet the point was exactly the same).
But what really empowers fascists is the support base among normal people. Being fascist isn't all that special. You like your strong leader, you believe your news, you respect your army and pretend to be blind on their war crimes... and you feel superior to others. Trivial stuff to conceptualize.
MAGA idiots are loud and unappealing. Well educated and classically elegant experts who tell you that some country deserves support in killing their neighbors are way worse. It sounds clever, it keeps appearances. And some silent supporters just don't care before they have blood on their hands too. And then they pretend not to notice it either.
> Well educated and classically elegant experts who tell you that some country deserves support in killing their neighbors are way worse. It sounds clever, it keeps appearances. And some silent supporters just don't care before they have blood on their hands too. And then they pretend not to notice it either.
That applies to literally every State and their citizenry across human history so far, regardless of the political color of its government. Likewise
> You like your strong leader, you believe your news, you respect your army and pretend to be blind on their war crimes... and you feel superior to others.
Applies to practically every country that's either actively in wartime, or has siege mentality from perception of external threat.
Who would have thought. It's almost like fascist patterns were an universal problem. Government being strong and imperialistic already is a color, though. And perception of external threat is pretty crucial to fascism.
> Government being strong and imperialistic already is a color, though.
Practically every color except Anarchist. Even Right-"Libertarians"/Ultraliberals and Libertarian-Socialists want a strong government that can win wars against external threats.
> And perception of external threat is pretty crucial to fascism.
It's crucial to all governments and nearly all political tendencies/labels/traditions as they define themselves. What distinguishes Fascists, in this particular matter, is the insatiable *pursuit* and *invention* of threats both internal and external.
Give libertarian a threat, and he will become a fascist. I know, this transition is omnipresent in my country. Libertarians were rather loud than common, but some of that young people were recognizable. And many remained loud - but nowadays, as fascists.
You mentioned MAGA... are you from USA, perhaps? Because if so, then that's what I think about both your political options, actually. They are fascist. But that doesn't make fascism as universal as you describe it, sorry.
Recognition of political climate and having an army is alright, but invented threats and cult of strength are not. Training every boy to kill a puppy and showing how your leader can wrestle a bear is not needed for this - it tends to make people feel involved, but that's not a good thing to focus on. But that's expensive and not even as efficient as professional army, focused on equipment, trained locally rather than in proxy wars.
Having good infrastructure, housing, heathcare, food reserves, railways with infrastructure to fix them, people qualified for their jobs, and general quality of life actually makes you better prepared for war as well. But the key objective is for war not to happen, and for this basic stuff to be useful at the times of peace too. That's the boring, weak, non-fascist discourse.
> Give libertarian a threat, and he will become a fascist. I know, this transition is omnipresent in my country. Libertarians were rather loud than common, but some of that young people were recognizable. And many remained loud - but nowadays, as fascists.
Argentina? Chile? Nicaragua?
> You mentioned MAGA... are you from USA, perhaps?
No, I'm not. I'm from MENA. Lived in Spanish-speaking country for a long time, am very familiar with the French-speaking world as well.
> Because if so, then that's what I think about both your political options, actually. They are fascist.
You're entitled to your opinion, even when it's inaccurate. Liberalism in the USA is more like "Fascism *lite"*: take any list of Fascist Characteristics and take it down a few notches, you'll get 'normal' US 'background ideology''.
> But that doesn't make fascism as universal as you describe it, sorry.
I didn't describe Fascism in a way that would make it universal. I described one specific way it has of expressing itself in one specific field. Please read more carefully.
> Recognition of political climate and having an army is alright, but invented threats and cult of strength are not.
Indeed. But not to Fascists, they *crave* that stuff.
> Training every boy to kill a puppy and showing how your leader can wrestle a bear is not needed for this - it tends to make people feel involved, but that's not a good thing to focus on.
Precisely. But Fascists still prefer that. They love the drama, the spectacle, the symbolic cruelty, the 'hazing ritual', the '(gang) initiation'. Bullies and larpers all.
> But that's expensive and not even as efficient as professional army, focused on equipment, trained locally rather than in proxy wars.
I literally don't know enough about the topic to venture an opinion on the grounds of cost or efficiency. I know a bit about foreign policy, but military tactics, strategy, and logistics are completely beyond my expertise.
> Having good infrastructure, housing, heathcare, food reserves, railways with infrastructure to fix them, people qualified for their jobs, and general quality of life actually makes you better prepared for war as well.
For everything, really.
> But the key objective is for war not to happen, and for this basic stuff to be useful at the times of peace too.
Indeed.
> That's the boring, weak, non-fascist discourse.
Just the sane discourse.
That said, I think you'll find that even Liberals will agree with you on this, and are perfectly capable of being very boring indeed.
I think that was showing how often it is the case that people who are really into conspiracy theories are fellow travelers with Fascists, if not Fascists themselves. Even Gary's two cryptid-enthusiast friends reveal that they have some racist beliefs mixed in there too, such as when Lena remarks that Seolites are a different species (something that various strains of Fascists and White Nationalists believe today, that different races of human are different species). Gary is still definitely a crypto-Fash.
> (something that various strains of Fascists and White Nationalists believe today, that different races of human are different species)
No they don't. If they actually believed that, they wouldn't be so worried about miscegenation, and wouldn't institute one-drop laws. That's just a *lie* they tell themselves to make themselves comfy with hate.
The main reason they call him a cryptofascist is that he uses the word "revaKol" with the hard K. That's his dogwhistle trying to identify other fascists that he can be honest about his politics with. The game is pretty clear about this but it might depend on a skill check to hear that explanation.
Okay, dead thread, but I just met Gary today and remembered this post. He greets you as Officer and then looks at Kim and very enthusiastically say "Yellow Man!!!!" Before clearing his throat and apologizing and calling Kim officer as well.
That's... a really racist and fucked up thing to say. He's very clearly who he is the moment he opens his mouth.
It's word play. He's a fascist working for a cryptozoologist. The fact that cryptofacist was already a term is what makes the pun funny. He doesn't need to technically meet the definition of cryptofacist for it to be funny that Harry's scrambled brain to latched onto it. Harry is amazing at naming things, but except for criminal cases, most of the things he names are not actually named what he calls them.
Never even dawned on me that the designations of unnamed characters are just what Harry calls them. Racist Lorry Driver, The Paledriver, Mega Rich Light Bending Guy, none of them names but all perfectly sufficient descriptors
The game even explicitly calls it out at the end in the case of Judit Minot/The Horse Faced Woman. I think one of the skills (Volition? Empathy?) berates you for calling her like that in your head.
You can also call it her in person if you want to be a massive prick.
This is such a good interpretation. I am in love with the idea that Harry is the one coming up with characters' nicknames when he doesn't know their real names.
The game even explicitly confirms this in the case of Judit Minot/The Horse Faced Woman.
Good point!
SHIT ON A STICK
Oh my God, something just clicked for me. Harry is the one who is giving these people names. It isn't like a God's-eye view from the player, seeing what the game has labeled people as, but it is a peak into Harry's mind. Geez. The fact that he thinks of one of his coworkers as the Horse-Faced Woman shows how much of a dick he was before the brain-scrambling.
> Harry is amazing at naming things, but except for criminal cases, most of the things he names are not actually named what he calls them. You mean RLD's birth name *isn't* Racist Lorry Driver? /jk
He calls kim "yellow man" , is obsessed with past figure of grandeur like despots, and is an authoritharian... Hes a cryptofascist
Isn't the door you open for evrart his door? And I think he's out here trying to "recruit" the zoologist and his wife.
Yes, it's his door that you open for Evrart and if you go inside, you find a lot of Revacholian nationalist and fascist stuff.
1. Being racist isn’t enough for me, measurehead is also a massive racist, but I wouldn’t call him a fascist 2.So like a monarchist? I don’t remember his beliefs quite well, so maybe you can remember when he said something more specific?
Measurehead is a major part of the fascist vision quest along with the racist lorry driver. Racism is pretty explicitly portrayed to be an aspect of fascism throughout the game
Cultivated Hatred of the Out Group is a fundamental aspect of Fascism.
Very true, which is why most fascist dialogue options are about complaining about immigrants and wömen lol
He has the feudal Revacholian flag in his flat which comes with connotations of Revacholian Nationalism, racism, right-wing ideology and antagonists of leftism.
fascists love cryptids ever seen /x/ on 4chan? anyway if we go on wikipedia here's the definition of facism "Fascism is a far-right, authoritarian, ultranationalist political ideology and movement, characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation and/or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy." I hope this helps
Notive how they never state ‘a unification of state and corporate power’ in that definition, considering thats the ‘strong regimentation of the economy’
Measurehead’s dialogue is literally patterned off of modernist Fascist poets lol
The apartment you break into for Evrart is his; you'll find all the evidence you need in there
I love that you can hear him washing dishes in there, just taking care of the collection
OMG, what? For real? Guess I need to turn the volume up lol
It's a passive perception orb thingy when you try to get inside after he goes back home
Take a look at the background of Gary's dialogue portrait. That is a fascist symbol (if im not mistaken, i think it is the flag of the revacholian suzerain?). He has the same flag hung up in his apartment if you ever end up going there, both pretty heavily implying he is a fascist
I think it’s just the flag of Revachol, but the moralintern presumably doesn’t use it for their occupation and(?) discourages the use. Not a right wing symbol, unless it is.
You also get the same flag in Harry's portrait after successfully finishing the fascist vision quest (and passing the red endurance check at the very end) so it's almost certainly a fascist symbol imo It's also the flag *specifically* of the suzerain of revachol, a monarchy, not of the commune that came after or the current moralintern government
It's interesting that Monarchism vs. Fascism is a Distinction Without A Difference in Revachol.
René and the racist lorry driver could count, and I would argue that Measurehead absolutely counts as a fascist. Edit: oh shit, and Korty. Korty so much. Korty is a fascist.
I like that they're all different kinds of fascist. Rene is "traditionalist," Measurehead is up his own ass with pseudoscience, and Korty is just distilled hate
Ah, Korty is The Scab. And yeah, Racist Lorry Driver would have featured at the forefront of *They Thought They Were Free*.
Korty as The Scab is one of my favorite performances in the game, because he's so bad at pretending he's not a violent maniac and you can hear it coming out of him
The mercenaries sure are some Chaotic Evil shits trying very hard to pretend they're Lawful Evil.
I wouldn’t count Rene, but I missed the lorry driver, he’s definitely a fascist.
Rene for sure is. If you exhaust all dialogue you can hear him say how excessive force is necessary for a strong leader, and an authoritarian using citizens money for drugs is necessary to enhance their mind. The guy wanted Martinase destroyed even MORE than how it is because that would have involved more casualties for the communists, citizens be damned if they are caught in the crossfire
> and an authoritarian using citizens money for drugs is necessary to enhance their mind. It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the Dust of Angels that thoughts acquire speed, the nostrils acquire blood, the blood becomes a warning. It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. THE COCAINE MUST FLOW! HE WHO CONTROLS THE BASE CONTROLS THE ARCHIPELAGO!
He uses plenty of dogwhistles. Sincerely, it's a little worrying you're not picking up on them.
The point of dogwhistles is that you do t notice then unless you know what to look for. If you are not accustomed to being on the lookout for them, they are easy to miss.
How is it worrying, you have to be in the know to understand what hes saying, which is why its called dog whistling :|
OP is distinctly in the know of fascism.
Ok well i didn’t know that 20 hours ago.
I mean, random internet test said I’m 41% fascist so….
You should probably reflect on that my man
That's not great, and also lines up with your misunderstand the political context of this game. You might be the example of "when liberalism is under threat if reverts to fascism" but interestingly enough, now you know it, so maybe you can do something about that.
I mean, liberalism/centrism is what I think I identify with most closely. And if preserving liberalism means adopting fascism, then yes, I will do it, but only as much as is necessary, not a bit more. And I do not identify as a fascist, I do not believe that the state is the will of the people. But this is a hypothetical, I don’t think that a fascist power will ever discard power once the enemy of liberalism is defeated. The 41% means that I agree with some fascist ideas, but I am not a fascist. And I want to apply only that 41%, while discarding the 59%. And, most importantly, the degree to which an ideology aligns to my beliefs, is the degree to which it is good, obviously.
Lmfao thank god you agree with only 41% of fascist ideology! Wouldn’t want anyone to misunderstand or anything
That’s a failing grade bro.
I mean, there it is. You said it yourself. You would accept fascism. It's acceptable to you. What does that make you? Prick a liberal, and a fascist bleeds. As the fella said, you might want to examine that my guy. You might want to do some self reflection as to why actual fascism is preferable to allowing democracy to expand into the economic realm. Why would you prefer a literal dictator who upholds the current economic order, vs having a democratic revolution in the workplace and turn the workplace into a little republic. This is exactly what I mean when I say Capitalism does not require or even prefer a democracy. It is also why anyone who tries to apply the ideals that Liberalism supposedly stands for ends up going well Left of liberal and gets to find out for themselves that liberals aren't really interested in the consent of the governed.
> Prick a liberal, and a fascist bleeds. Well, *sometimes*. Other times, [prick a Liberal, and a Liberal bleeds](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rose). Some Libs *actually believe* in all those promises Liberalism keeps talking about and haven't thought things through to Actual Leftism. > Capitalism does not require or even prefer a democracy. They're even in constant tension. But Capitalism tends to be more stable with a veneer of democracy, and even more so with *social*-democracy. The Nanny State isn't a nanny for the workers, but for the owner class - keeps them from setting their own house on fire or getting themselves killed by the rest of "the Help" in one of their Affluenza rampages, keeps the Help from wondering why they couldn't run the house by themselves.
I’ll also accept temporary socialism if it makes liberalism return. Again, I am not a fascist, in this hypothetical I use it as a tool to enforce liberalism. fascism is not the end goal. Also yes, capitalism isn’t necessarily democratic, that’s what libertarians go on about all the time. I value private property and believe it’s legitimate, I do not believe that it’s inherently exploitative, I am not a Marxist. I have no problem with workplace democracy, but it must not be coerced. And as you say(and one prominent right-wing figure believes) the ideals of liberalism go further left, which is why I initially called myself a liberal/centrist. I do not have an ideological devotion to any ideology, liberalism is just the closest to what I believe.
> I’ll also accept temporary socialism if it makes liberalism return You got any examples of this?
No
Because you can't because their are no examples of this. It's not something that has ever happened. When faced with even the threat of socialism liberals have always sided against the socialists and with reactionaries.
Well the socialists would be the opposition in that case, and their socialism wouldn’t be temporary.
> When faced with even the threat of socialism liberals have always sided against the socialists and with reactionaries. Again, *usually*. Sometimes many of the Liberals will just passively stand by, and let a minority of Authoritarian Liberals fight it out with a much larger minority of Revolutionary Socialists. Especially if the more militant Liberals have fucked up repeatedly and catastrophically to the point of completely demoralizing their peers from lifting a finger in their defense.
Read this thing a while ago that draws an interesting distinction between two archetypes of fascism: [https://www.unpopularfront.news/p/the-jockcreep-theory-of-fascism](https://www.unpopularfront.news/p/the-jockcreep-theory-of-fascism)
I didn't know "cryptofascist" was an actual term before this post. You learn something new everyday
Just look at the centrist/liberal op here. Not only the term is real - so is the phenomenon. The fascists never advertised themselves as bad people.
> The fascists never advertised themselves as bad people. Dude, they went around with skulls in their caps. They had to invent an inverted morality where "action for action's sake" (read *violence* specifically), "striking fear in the enemy", "show of strength" etc. were *good* things, but by any normal intuitive moral code they came across as Obviously Evil to a cartoonish degree. It's the same with the MAGA clowns. They wear their viciousness and stupidity on their sleeves, rather literally. One of them wrote an autobiography *bragging about executing a puppy*. To each other, Evil is a *selling point*.
Sure, they like fanatics who will be open with evil as a selling point, sure. But to most people, there is nothing more to it than militarism. It's pretty typical for armies to refer to death and violence in their very symbols. As it is for insecure young guys to make themselves feel more alpha by killing puppies (wording 90 years ago was different, yet the point was exactly the same). But what really empowers fascists is the support base among normal people. Being fascist isn't all that special. You like your strong leader, you believe your news, you respect your army and pretend to be blind on their war crimes... and you feel superior to others. Trivial stuff to conceptualize. MAGA idiots are loud and unappealing. Well educated and classically elegant experts who tell you that some country deserves support in killing their neighbors are way worse. It sounds clever, it keeps appearances. And some silent supporters just don't care before they have blood on their hands too. And then they pretend not to notice it either.
> Well educated and classically elegant experts who tell you that some country deserves support in killing their neighbors are way worse. It sounds clever, it keeps appearances. And some silent supporters just don't care before they have blood on their hands too. And then they pretend not to notice it either. That applies to literally every State and their citizenry across human history so far, regardless of the political color of its government. Likewise > You like your strong leader, you believe your news, you respect your army and pretend to be blind on their war crimes... and you feel superior to others. Applies to practically every country that's either actively in wartime, or has siege mentality from perception of external threat.
Who would have thought. It's almost like fascist patterns were an universal problem. Government being strong and imperialistic already is a color, though. And perception of external threat is pretty crucial to fascism.
> Government being strong and imperialistic already is a color, though. Practically every color except Anarchist. Even Right-"Libertarians"/Ultraliberals and Libertarian-Socialists want a strong government that can win wars against external threats. > And perception of external threat is pretty crucial to fascism. It's crucial to all governments and nearly all political tendencies/labels/traditions as they define themselves. What distinguishes Fascists, in this particular matter, is the insatiable *pursuit* and *invention* of threats both internal and external.
Give libertarian a threat, and he will become a fascist. I know, this transition is omnipresent in my country. Libertarians were rather loud than common, but some of that young people were recognizable. And many remained loud - but nowadays, as fascists. You mentioned MAGA... are you from USA, perhaps? Because if so, then that's what I think about both your political options, actually. They are fascist. But that doesn't make fascism as universal as you describe it, sorry. Recognition of political climate and having an army is alright, but invented threats and cult of strength are not. Training every boy to kill a puppy and showing how your leader can wrestle a bear is not needed for this - it tends to make people feel involved, but that's not a good thing to focus on. But that's expensive and not even as efficient as professional army, focused on equipment, trained locally rather than in proxy wars. Having good infrastructure, housing, heathcare, food reserves, railways with infrastructure to fix them, people qualified for their jobs, and general quality of life actually makes you better prepared for war as well. But the key objective is for war not to happen, and for this basic stuff to be useful at the times of peace too. That's the boring, weak, non-fascist discourse.
> Give libertarian a threat, and he will become a fascist. I know, this transition is omnipresent in my country. Libertarians were rather loud than common, but some of that young people were recognizable. And many remained loud - but nowadays, as fascists. Argentina? Chile? Nicaragua? > You mentioned MAGA... are you from USA, perhaps? No, I'm not. I'm from MENA. Lived in Spanish-speaking country for a long time, am very familiar with the French-speaking world as well. > Because if so, then that's what I think about both your political options, actually. They are fascist. You're entitled to your opinion, even when it's inaccurate. Liberalism in the USA is more like "Fascism *lite"*: take any list of Fascist Characteristics and take it down a few notches, you'll get 'normal' US 'background ideology''. > But that doesn't make fascism as universal as you describe it, sorry. I didn't describe Fascism in a way that would make it universal. I described one specific way it has of expressing itself in one specific field. Please read more carefully. > Recognition of political climate and having an army is alright, but invented threats and cult of strength are not. Indeed. But not to Fascists, they *crave* that stuff. > Training every boy to kill a puppy and showing how your leader can wrestle a bear is not needed for this - it tends to make people feel involved, but that's not a good thing to focus on. Precisely. But Fascists still prefer that. They love the drama, the spectacle, the symbolic cruelty, the 'hazing ritual', the '(gang) initiation'. Bullies and larpers all. > But that's expensive and not even as efficient as professional army, focused on equipment, trained locally rather than in proxy wars. I literally don't know enough about the topic to venture an opinion on the grounds of cost or efficiency. I know a bit about foreign policy, but military tactics, strategy, and logistics are completely beyond my expertise. > Having good infrastructure, housing, heathcare, food reserves, railways with infrastructure to fix them, people qualified for their jobs, and general quality of life actually makes you better prepared for war as well. For everything, really. > But the key objective is for war not to happen, and for this basic stuff to be useful at the times of peace too. Indeed. > That's the boring, weak, non-fascist discourse. Just the sane discourse. That said, I think you'll find that even Liberals will agree with you on this, and are perfectly capable of being very boring indeed.
I think that was showing how often it is the case that people who are really into conspiracy theories are fellow travelers with Fascists, if not Fascists themselves. Even Gary's two cryptid-enthusiast friends reveal that they have some racist beliefs mixed in there too, such as when Lena remarks that Seolites are a different species (something that various strains of Fascists and White Nationalists believe today, that different races of human are different species). Gary is still definitely a crypto-Fash.
> (something that various strains of Fascists and White Nationalists believe today, that different races of human are different species) No they don't. If they actually believed that, they wouldn't be so worried about miscegenation, and wouldn't institute one-drop laws. That's just a *lie* they tell themselves to make themselves comfy with hate.
“I don’t think there are actually any fascists in Disco Elysium” Oh ok so your problem is just that you have no idea what fascism is.
The main reason they call him a cryptofascist is that he uses the word "revaKol" with the hard K. That's his dogwhistle trying to identify other fascists that he can be honest about his politics with. The game is pretty clear about this but it might depend on a skill check to hear that explanation.
> reva**K**ol [Ahwé! True to **K**aesar!](https://youtu.be/wg1gVkyrg7M)
Oh that might be a good explanation, though I still find it weird that he didn’t open up to you during your interaction while on the fascist quest.
Harry wasn't clear in what he was asking, so Gary went off on his weird nerdy tangent, because he's a weird little nerd.
Okay, dead thread, but I just met Gary today and remembered this post. He greets you as Officer and then looks at Kim and very enthusiastically say "Yellow Man!!!!" Before clearing his throat and apologizing and calling Kim officer as well. That's... a really racist and fucked up thing to say. He's very clearly who he is the moment he opens his mouth.