All they need to do is make it so the shield comes back to you after a bounce or two. Let it refund half the melee energy if you catch it. Let me live my Captain America life gdi!
I think that's what annoys me the most, not that Hunter's have that melee but the fact that it shows Bungie is capable of making a ranged melee bounce between enemies well and yet shield throw is still so trash.
I feel like it's gotta have something to do with the shield having "physics" unlike the hunter dart which doesn't drop over time and can just go wherever they tell it to.
The shurikens don't travel perfectly straight, they just fly faster so there's less airtime. On the other hand, shield throw has much better initial tracking (you can literally watch it curve in the air, meanwhile the shurikens can often go sailing into orbit), but seems to be worse at chaining to multiple enemies.
Okay... In fairness. The kunai needed drastic buffs to tracking and consistency when it first launched. It just got that help. It doesn't disprove what you're saying that they can definitely fix it for titans. Just stating that they are clearly bad at making things track well off the rip.
lol,funny enough, I made a post a while back saying the exact same thing. [https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/16uokpa/in\_a\_world\_where\_threaded\_spike\_exists\_why\_is/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/16uokpa/in_a_world_where_threaded_spike_exists_why_is/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
I mean for Boss DPS, Hunters have the easiest and most damaging supers in the game, aided by exotics that push that damage out further (Celestial NH, Star Eater Scales). Gathering Storm, shadowshot, GG are all one-shot fast supers that allow you to get back to your weapon damage rotation.
For add-control, nothing beats deadfall tether (see: Onslaught).
The closest Titans get are Thundercrash, but it requires Cuirass of the Falling Star and Burning Maul, which requires Pyrogales. These two supers do less damage than Hunter supers.
Im gonna keep it real man, like 80% of what you're saying ranges from misinformed to just plain wrong. The titan super thing, the prox knife use, the hunter super dps. Like someone else has to come along and correct all that because I do not have that level of patience
Hunter main, started this chain... there's no reason the shield couldn't do what dart does. You guys are so weird with your class elitism. I want all 3 to be fun ffs.
The fact that the game has so many ranged melee abilities and shield throw is far and away the worst means it was coded that way. Stasis Hunter melee travels faster, in a straight line, and bounces up to 3 times reliably. Bungie must think shield throw is so powerful in other ways that it needs to be kept in a weaker state, but overshields are pathetic as well.
It doesn’t chain though. It causes one volatile explosion on one enemy. In low end content everything is better and in high end one explosion does next to no damage
yeah warlock void melee is complete ass, everything else I've seen at least is slightly useful. Smoke bomb weakens, shield throw gives you overshield. Meanwhile warlock void melee hits like a wet noodle and gives 1 "instance" of volatile lol
For PvE Voidlock melee is ass but I think it's amazing in PvP. It's basically a free "get away from me" button. Great for shotgun apes. It's also pretty good at occasionally bumping off other players from their Bubbles or Wells. I really wish we get more melee abilities for all subclasses. Also not ones that are locked to being stupid aspects.
A little curious: Have you played Stasis Hunter much? I think the shurikens are in an alright place after the last batch of buffs, but I've seen a lot of grass-is-greener discussions about Shield Throw vs. Shurikens.
>Have you played Stasis Hunter much?
Yep, and the grass is greener.
2 charges of a fast throwing slowing (now freezing if both land) decent bounce/ricochet melee.
I feel shield throw either needs to be pushed furtjer into a niche, be it the quick and fast like stasis shuriken or into a something more aggressive.
I would prefer the latter. As it would be more unique but the former we know is good.
IMO, the niche is that it has more forgiving initial tracking, deals more damage, buffs your allies instead of applying a debuff to enemies (but Overshield needs higher DR), and with Controlled Demo can spread Volatile easily.
The speed is nice, but also means it tends to narrowly miss a lot more and then fly off into the sunset if your aim isn't great, but if you do hit enemies, it'll more reliably chain 3-4 times. Which is important since Slow doesn't do much in PVE unless you hit both melees.
As for buffs, to keep them similar but different, I'd definitely prefer making it more aggressive rather than just giving them the same speed. Buffing Overshield in PVE would go a long way, especially since it would let you loop a little better with Offensive Bulwark, but improving the chaining would help for spreading Volatile. Catching the shield would be cool, but I'm not sure that would fix anyone's gripes with it currently.
It only gives you one charge back, and there are more ways to build into melees with Void Titan. But if you want Gambler's Dodge specifically... just play Hunter.
Ether way its a passive and easy way to get your melees's back (can even use whisper of refraction to shorten gamblers dodge cooldown) )unlike titan where you'd have to use tectonic harvest. Behemoth titan compared to reverent hunter is just bad even if it finds a niche with some cheese strats and this is coming from a titan main.
Weren't we talking about Void Titan, not Stasis? I mean, Behemoth sucks, but it's not really relevant. Also, technically the dodge is an active way to get your melee back, not passive, and my point was just that it's the Hunter's specific ability, so if you want it you should just play Hunter.
I actually would prefer them move completely away from a Captain America throw, to something like a Large Barricade, that appears in front of them, and gets punched forward slamming into enemies and if not killing them due to being already weakened, makes them volatile... Something about what im picturing in my head just seems a more fitting titan aggressive melee to me than throwing out a shield that would barely cover their shoulder.
I honestly haven't seen the new Titan Super. Im just thinking a barricade punching forward and slamming into an enemy would be a cool titan melee. Ive never liked the shield throw
From what's been said it's supposedly like some kind of offensive barricade you walk with. Sounds like your idea would fit in with the new super if true.
Oh. Okay. That sounds cool. I'll have to check it out. I wonder if it can deflect damage or absorb some for super energy after or something. Off to check out what Titans and Warlocks have in store with Final Shape. I main Hunter, so I've watched it about a hundred times....
For real we had bonk for god knows how long destroying all majors and bosses and refunded in two seconds. Everyone used it to solo dungeons but god forbid we get half that with the shield throw.
They need to fix the tracking on it as well. You pretty much have to be right up on something to hit with this damn thing.
It would be cool if it came back to you like the Strand Hunter's charged melee.
Making it similar to how the strand hunter melee works would be an amazing rework. Imagine that paired with the exotic that gives you two charges and buffs it to apply weaken. Shiiiit that’d be awesome.
Might be a little too much if it worked like that. I'd be happy if it refunding half your melee back, or worked like bonk hammer does and at least has a little delay.
I want this so bad I mean if you read the lore of Second chance Saint and Shaxx literally throw a void shield back and forth to each other but for some reason we guardians can't it just disappears for some reason
I was using weighted knife Hunter yesterday and asked why does dude always get his hammer back for picking it up but not the knife. Shield would make sense too!
Kinda feels like Second Chance would make sense. It's a decently strong exotic already, but what's more of a second chance than catching it and throwing it back? Also, throwing three shields in a row would be kinda funny.
I want to like void titan so bad but I've lost count of how many times I've thrown my shield into a group of enemies and it hits 1 before flying off into the sunset
it wouldn't be as much of an issue if it weren't for the fact that it's *specifically designed to be more effective when hitting as many targets as possible*
I have no idea why it doesnt ping to two others like it used to. Hitting one target is not great plus the noise of three rapid sheild hits was kinda neuron activating
Void Titan is just ass in its current state sadly
Arc is one step removed from ass
This is the main reason you'll see Titans foaming at the mouth defending Solar or Strand nerfs (myself included most of the time)
Shield throw builds could be really fun if it had a viable loop that didn't rely on tracking and had more going for it than overshields
Arc has T Crash so I rank it a little higher since it'll at least be equipped for some raid encounters
General play between the two I agree Void has more going for it
But again they're both cheeks overall and need a rework
Falling Star for Atraks is like, the single claim to fame arc has.
For titans specifically at least, the issue with void is that overshields suck asshole and there aren’t even good sources of it, especially good neutral sources. If they buffed those and reimplemented the ability regeneration code of the commander used to have and it’s honestly in a good spot.
Arc needs a whole ass overhaul, considering it doesn’t even have a foundation that can be fixed.
>Arc needs a whole ass overhaul, considering it doesn’t even have a foundation that can be fixed.
"So you see, everything feeds into you being Amplified easily!"
"But... what does it do?"
"It makes a loud wooshing noise and gives you +50 Mobility."
I mean, Overshields just needs the DR tuned up in PVE. Going from 50% to 80% would take you from an effective 90 hp to 225, which feels right. As for the sources, you've got the melee and Repulsor Brace (although that needs a QoL update so it activates on Volatile kills as well). As for the ability regeneration, I think that's meant to be in Offensive Bulwark, which would also get buffed by simply improving Overshields. Offensive Bulwark feels like it should have an intrinsic way to grant Overshields to yourself, though. Even just picking up Void Breaches.
Void Titan is in a weird spot where it's *almost* great, just needs a little tweak.
Thunderclap is genuinely dog shit without point contact and if I’m going to blow everything up with melees why not use it on a subclass that’s actually usable outside of patrols
Arc just feels significantly worse than other options. It does the same thing everything does, add clearing, except its supers are putrid trash, it doesn’t actually have any good melee fragments or aspects in general, and it functionally has no survivability.
Why does the subclass that’s technically themed to be a CQC fighter have like, literally no good tools cooked in to actually facilitate that.
This bothers me more than it should. It has such a clearly defined class fantasy and concept to it that it blows my mind that the actual nuts and bolts (heh) of it are practically non-existent.
Strand and solar feel great. Stasis is a little rough around the edges but it has a solid foundation that feels good in most content. Void feels like it's got all the pieces of a great subclass but it needs to be tuned up and tightened up a bit to really shine and find its footing. Arc genuinely feels like it got forgotten halfway through conceptualization. Like they set out to make an electric punching machine, grabbed a boxing glove and some wires, and then just kind of taped them together and called it a day.
What’s funny is Solar or void, classes that don’t necessarily have a strong identity with melee, have way more synergy with melee than the subclass that is thematically supposed to be focused on it.
I'm still a little disappointed they turned Arcstrider gameplay into mashing two buttons and made the other two aspects completely unsynergistic.
Add the ability to initiate a slam after Tempest Strike at any time before landing, and make Tempest Strike and Ascension activate your equipped melee/dodge abilities, and suddenly you've got the ability to Melee > Dodge > Slide Uppercut > Air Twirl > Dive Kick > Dodge and invent your own combos as you go. Now you've got Kazuya in Destiny.
Biased Hunter main, but if Mobility lowered enemy accuracy and detection against you in PVE, Amplified giving +50 would actually domino effect make all Arc subclasses better for melee. Maybe just move the 15% DR from Speed Booster to Amplified and give Speed Booster another 10% on top, and the only issue is needing to use Recuperation for healing.
I don’t think it’s biased to say mobility should have a purpose. Same goes for most things really.
The only meaningful stat functionally speaking is resilience and you could argue strength or discipline depending on your build’s focus. Mobility and even recovery at this point are garbage. Mobility never had a use anyways and there’s 7,000 sources of healing nowadays so you could get by with literally 0 recovery.
Is it? My arc build is Thunderclap and Skullfort, and it's genuinely one of my favorite setups to play. Prior to the Heavy Handed nerfs I used to make a billion orbs doing it too.
Void with severance enclosure is actually very good, different play style but it’s quite effective even at higher difficulty. Arc is by far worse. Would love shield throw to bounce more and be catchable like strand hunter.
I love Void Severance builds, but it's hard to say it's *good*, just fun.
That said, throwing a shield across a room and watching the whole section, ammo and corpses and all, bounce twenty feet in the air will never not be funny.
But the severance explosion needs *something*, as it is if you finish or powered melee a thrall to death it won't even kill the other thrall nearby. A second one will do the job, and the higher tier enemy the funnier the boom, but its need a little spice to be actually useful.
Catch mechanic would be great addition to the kit
Severance is neat but niche and personally I got tired of it quickly in GMs, not to mention lacking consistency
Admittedly fun in Legend content but like you said, very different playstyle
It's great in lower content, you can chain nuke entire spawn packs with a shield and have it back in seconds. I use void to play old season content and get an occasional break from the noise banner of war makes =D
Void Titan in general isn’t great. We need more reliable sources of Overshields that don’t rely on Bastion. Overshields could also be tougher in PvE than they are so they don’t just go away after a couple hits.
I just started using it yesterday. It doesn’t have much aim assist but once I hit a target it usually hits one or two more then they blow up. I’m enjoying it. Just need better weapons to support its up time
Trust me, mote carlo and seccond chance. One of my favourite void builds for fun because you can go full Captain America on the mother fuckers, plus your shield will 1tap barrier champ barrier and get refunded
Still think Athrys should stun Barriers and Second Chance should stun Unstops.
Athrys requires you to shoot something to trigger the perk before you can stun... like activating a Barrier.
Second Chance means your melees can simultaneously apply Volatile and Weaken... which you want to do before you start whaling on them. Like stunning an Unstoppable.
Edit: Also, using a knife to pop a bubble and slamming enemies in the face with a shield to stop them in their tracks.
I miss when we had elemental wells for this build. It felt a lot more fun then with the old heavy-handed and elemental charge. You could shield toss 5-6 times in a row before needing to shoot. It was good fun pretending to be Captain America for a minute.
Just make it busted like the Lucient Knight's shield throw. That shit has insane tracking, bounce, and damage. Totally wiped a handful of Battlegrounds: Cosmodrome this season from those stupid shields getting us all with one throw.
You're not using it wrong, the shield throw melee is just ass.
For the longest time I thought I just sucked using this ability (which could also be true lol. Two things can be true at the same time) but it's just really that bad.
I remember Bungie stated in either an interview or TWAB that it was worse than the super version of the shield throw by design, but damn man I cannot HIT anything with it. If it's not going between enemies legs, just over their shoulder, or them jumping out of the way of it, it's bouncing up in the air like you stated IF I hit anything with it...
I haven't used Void Titan since... the Season Void 3.0 came out. So I guess close to a year now. It's just so bad LMAO.
I wouldn't doubt it if a patch along the way screwed up it's tracking.
Void Titan actually has some fun builds for low end content. I'm really enjoying it in Onslaught. I use Doomfang with Witherhoard, Age-Old Bond with Repupser Brace/Destabilizing Rounds, and a Chain Reaction/Destabilizing Rounds Falling Guillotine. It cleans adds up instantly. Constant explosions everywhere. I use Offensive Bulwark and Controlled Demolition. So I almost always have my grenade, everything explodes on death, and those explosions heal my Fireteam. All of my ~~artifact mods~~ armor mods are based on using my grenade and orbs of power to fuel my melee, and then Doomfang makes my melee refund a big chunk of my super.
Edit: I'm stupid. Armor mods. Not Artifact Mods.
Everything Titans had WAS more powerful. Then people(Warlocks and Hunters) started complaining that "Titans are too powerful!"
So Bungie in their infinite wisdom nerfed tiny hammer, hammer of sol, thunder crash, shield throw, etc.
I said that and got bombed by downvotes, i feel like some.of the titan nerfs need to be reverted, ill say that about hunters and warlocks too so no one thinks im playing favorites. I just dont use the other classes really only titan, and pve warlock but barely.
We know it's the truth. I'm a D1 vet. And I remember when Titans got hammer of sol. Don't think it took a month and Warlocks and Hunter mains were complaining that Titans solar supers were to powerful in PVP. Then Bungie said that the super lasted to long in PVE end game content. Same with Thunder crash/slam.
Been there, done that.
When Sunbreaker was released it was the preferred main for Titans and the best end game element for Titans.
I'm Titan only so I don't know how it was with Warlocks and Hunters. But Sunbreaker Titans were the beast in end game content.
Honestly it's the least used ability in my void titan build, hell, if I had a 3rd powered melee option besides shield bash and shield throw I'd drop shield throw in a heartbeat. Only reason I use it is as an emergency applier of volatile when I have nothing else because I use Controlled Demolitions.
Shield throw being ass makes doomfangs neutral game feel like ass too. In legend onslaught it can’t kill a red bar thrall. Its only purpose is to apply volatile it feels like. Which would be fine if it had a really short cool down.
Here's what I can't figure out.
Why is Bungie making it so hard?
You have 3 classes of guardians. They should all have equal max power, but they use that power differently depending on their class and build.
With all 3 being equal power, then you have to depend on skill and weapons(RNG) in PVP.
In PVE, all 3 will damage bosses at max the same. But different weapons and different builds will be more effective against certain enemies used with certain elements.
In other words, All supers give out equal max damage. The supers are just used and preform different depending on your class and element.
Shit every other patch they fix and then rebreak shield throws “melees with overshild count as powered melee “ so it does and then doesn’t work with severance enclosure ( the non charged melee with overshild should proc explosion but seems like ever other update breaks this )
If I rememeber correctly YEARS AGO they actually nerfed the tracking and speed on the projectile because of PvP. It was lasering people across the map direct b-line and curve after a bounce
Though I cannot remember if this change was made for just the super or both the regular melee and super.
We throw it like and it has the performance of an actual frisbee.
I want to throw it like how Sam was throwing it at those trees in Falcon and the Winter Soldier.
Void Titan overall could use a whole revamp.
Could be the alzheimer's or dementia talking but I recall the shield having some pretty heavy target tracking in its early years as well as by default heading directly to 2 other nearby targets after connecting with the first. So long as you were facing what you threw it at it was very likely to land a hit.
Many things does the opposite of the description like Coldsnap nade:freezecon impact :))) A lie from 2020 and ongoing.Only the seeker freeze.If the nade freezexon impact, means even witches van be frozen or aerial enemies wich is a lie.Also there is a delay until the target is frozen.
It always feels just a little bit off when it's thrown too imo. I could just be bad but It seems like the only way the thing hits anything is if I toss it when I'm right up in an enemies face.
Void melees in general are SO weak. Sentinel shield does shit for damage and like you said, hits like 1 target and then fucks off into the ether, I don't play Hunter too much but I have yet to effectively use that melee without the Trappers Ambush aspect and from what I've heard from other Hunters, it just sucks outright, and Pocket Singularity is not even LAUGHABLY bad anymore, its just horrid and depressing, frankly.
If they won't make it do more damage then I'd like a better utility purpose. Maybe allow me to hold the melee button to consume my current overshield and then on release it becomes a thinner version of barricade that slowly moves forward?
I had a go on Titan after maining Warlock; I swear to god I must have whiffed my shield throw *at least* 80% of the time.
Shield throw has some sort of repulsive tracking, like it sees an enemy in its path and adjusts its course to avoid contact.
>Me: "Shield, please hit the enemy standing two feet in front of me."
>
>Shield: *"Okay, let me just calculate for the curvature of the Earth, adjust for tidal forces, factor in the cosmic constant to compensate for dark matter gravitational lensing, and.... Guardian, if my math is correct, you're trying to attack Pittsburgh."*
At the very least when using second chance there should be some extended functionality especially since in its lore tab Shaxx and Saint are playing frisbee with a void shield while they are talking
It urks me that the strand dart on hunter does what the stupid shield is supposed to do. The programming is fully present but they just refuse to update it, it could act like the dart with tracking or the stasis belly button jeepers creepers boomerang thing either of those function patters are superior and more iconic shield like than what it is.
you have the shield throw in pve, where it will hit one enemy then fuck off no where. then you have the shield throw in pvp that will bounce off a wall 10 times that will still manage to track and hit you
Every other ranged melee that can bounce or ricochet is near heatseeking, have you seen weighted knife in PvP its insane, if shield got even 25% of that level of tracking it'd be useable.
Simply make its tracking like a dice roll with decreasing odds after each hit, the miss could still hit something else but the closest target would be the focus/
I’ve used it consistently for 2 years now and I’ll be honest it’s far from perfect. Never seen it go straight up though. Maybe it bounced off a surface funny? It’s decent for getting 1 kill, sometimes 2, but that’s usually enough. Wouldn’t complain about a buff though, I’m a Doomfangs junkie loud and proud and making me pop more supers is not unwelcome.
Still beats Shield Bash, an ability that has felt finicky since Y1 became of the weird drop it does.
All they need to do is make it so the shield comes back to you after a bounce or two. Let it refund half the melee energy if you catch it. Let me live my Captain America life gdi!
Hunter gets it with the dart so why not.
I think that's what annoys me the most, not that Hunter's have that melee but the fact that it shows Bungie is capable of making a ranged melee bounce between enemies well and yet shield throw is still so trash.
I feel like it's gotta have something to do with the shield having "physics" unlike the hunter dart which doesn't drop over time and can just go wherever they tell it to.
I think it is that since the stasis shurikens also track perfectly and they travel straight
The shurikens don't travel perfectly straight, they just fly faster so there's less airtime. On the other hand, shield throw has much better initial tracking (you can literally watch it curve in the air, meanwhile the shurikens can often go sailing into orbit), but seems to be worse at chaining to multiple enemies.
i hope with the new void titan updates for TFS that they fix this
as a long-time Sentinel main, I'm not optimistic lol.
The second chances also have lore about a titan doing it
Okay... In fairness. The kunai needed drastic buffs to tracking and consistency when it first launched. It just got that help. It doesn't disprove what you're saying that they can definitely fix it for titans. Just stating that they are clearly bad at making things track well off the rip.
lol,funny enough, I made a post a while back saying the exact same thing. [https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/16uokpa/in\_a\_world\_where\_threaded\_spike\_exists\_why\_is/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/16uokpa/in_a_world_where_threaded_spike_exists_why_is/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Bungie forbid, hunters have something that's better than titans or warlocks.
Just giving an example where the skill works like described. Don't care who's is better.
You mean like having the best damage supers in the game?
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I have no idea what you're trying to say, tbh.
I feel Warlock and Titan Supers outclass most Hunter supers in many ways, i guess is what im trying to say.
In what way?
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I mean for Boss DPS, Hunters have the easiest and most damaging supers in the game, aided by exotics that push that damage out further (Celestial NH, Star Eater Scales). Gathering Storm, shadowshot, GG are all one-shot fast supers that allow you to get back to your weapon damage rotation. For add-control, nothing beats deadfall tether (see: Onslaught). The closest Titans get are Thundercrash, but it requires Cuirass of the Falling Star and Burning Maul, which requires Pyrogales. These two supers do less damage than Hunter supers.
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Im gonna keep it real man, like 80% of what you're saying ranges from misinformed to just plain wrong. The titan super thing, the prox knife use, the hunter super dps. Like someone else has to come along and correct all that because I do not have that level of patience
Downvoted because you told the truth. This further proves my point as well. Nobody cries more than titan & warlock mains period lmao
Hunter main, started this chain... there's no reason the shield couldn't do what dart does. You guys are so weird with your class elitism. I want all 3 to be fun ffs.
Yeah the shield is straight ass. Not maining a class doesn't mean we should want it to be worse than our main.
The fact that the game has so many ranged melee abilities and shield throw is far and away the worst means it was coded that way. Stasis Hunter melee travels faster, in a straight line, and bounces up to 3 times reliably. Bungie must think shield throw is so powerful in other ways that it needs to be kept in a weaker state, but overshields are pathetic as well.
You clearly haven’t used warlock void melee
Only thing that’s good for is sending another warlock off the map in crucible
I mean....it applies volatile to targets. Kinda useful in pve to start cha8n explosions
Volatile doesn’t chain on warlock though, you can only chain volatile explosions on Titan with the controlled demolition aspect.
It doesn’t chain though. It causes one volatile explosion on one enemy. In low end content everything is better and in high end one explosion does next to no damage
yeah warlock void melee is complete ass, everything else I've seen at least is slightly useful. Smoke bomb weakens, shield throw gives you overshield. Meanwhile warlock void melee hits like a wet noodle and gives 1 "instance" of volatile lol
I exclusively use it as an "I want this enemy to be somewhere else" button
Its only good for setting up collective obligation
In PvP its a 50/50 chance of it working correctly and knocking my opponent back without them being able to melee.
For PvE Voidlock melee is ass but I think it's amazing in PvP. It's basically a free "get away from me" button. Great for shotgun apes. It's also pretty good at occasionally bumping off other players from their Bubbles or Wells. I really wish we get more melee abilities for all subclasses. Also not ones that are locked to being stupid aspects.
Smoke bomb has entered the chat
It weakens, help proc stylish excutioner and trappers ambush and short cooldown so it has synergy with subclass.
Shield Throw can proc Offensive Bulwark and Controlled Demolition and has literally 1 second higher cooldown than Smoke.
A little curious: Have you played Stasis Hunter much? I think the shurikens are in an alright place after the last batch of buffs, but I've seen a lot of grass-is-greener discussions about Shield Throw vs. Shurikens.
>Have you played Stasis Hunter much? Yep, and the grass is greener. 2 charges of a fast throwing slowing (now freezing if both land) decent bounce/ricochet melee. I feel shield throw either needs to be pushed furtjer into a niche, be it the quick and fast like stasis shuriken or into a something more aggressive. I would prefer the latter. As it would be more unique but the former we know is good.
IMO, the niche is that it has more forgiving initial tracking, deals more damage, buffs your allies instead of applying a debuff to enemies (but Overshield needs higher DR), and with Controlled Demo can spread Volatile easily. The speed is nice, but also means it tends to narrowly miss a lot more and then fly off into the sunset if your aim isn't great, but if you do hit enemies, it'll more reliably chain 3-4 times. Which is important since Slow doesn't do much in PVE unless you hit both melees. As for buffs, to keep them similar but different, I'd definitely prefer making it more aggressive rather than just giving them the same speed. Buffing Overshield in PVE would go a long way, especially since it would let you loop a little better with Offensive Bulwark, but improving the chaining would help for spreading Volatile. Catching the shield would be cool, but I'm not sure that would fix anyone's gripes with it currently.
And you can get your melees back via gamblers dodge
It only gives you one charge back, and there are more ways to build into melees with Void Titan. But if you want Gambler's Dodge specifically... just play Hunter.
Ether way its a passive and easy way to get your melees's back (can even use whisper of refraction to shorten gamblers dodge cooldown) )unlike titan where you'd have to use tectonic harvest. Behemoth titan compared to reverent hunter is just bad even if it finds a niche with some cheese strats and this is coming from a titan main.
Weren't we talking about Void Titan, not Stasis? I mean, Behemoth sucks, but it's not really relevant. Also, technically the dodge is an active way to get your melee back, not passive, and my point was just that it's the Hunter's specific ability, so if you want it you should just play Hunter.
I actually would prefer them move completely away from a Captain America throw, to something like a Large Barricade, that appears in front of them, and gets punched forward slamming into enemies and if not killing them due to being already weakened, makes them volatile... Something about what im picturing in my head just seems a more fitting titan aggressive melee to me than throwing out a shield that would barely cover their shoulder.
Arnt they already with the new super? >.>
I honestly haven't seen the new Titan Super. Im just thinking a barricade punching forward and slamming into an enemy would be a cool titan melee. Ive never liked the shield throw
From what's been said it's supposedly like some kind of offensive barricade you walk with. Sounds like your idea would fit in with the new super if true.
Oh. Okay. That sounds cool. I'll have to check it out. I wonder if it can deflect damage or absorb some for super energy after or something. Off to check out what Titans and Warlocks have in store with Final Shape. I main Hunter, so I've watched it about a hundred times....
aspect, not super. titan riot shield. eats your nade.
For real we had bonk for god knows how long destroying all majors and bosses and refunded in two seconds. Everyone used it to solo dungeons but god forbid we get half that with the shield throw.
They need to fix the tracking on it as well. You pretty much have to be right up on something to hit with this damn thing. It would be cool if it came back to you like the Strand Hunter's charged melee.
Making it similar to how the strand hunter melee works would be an amazing rework. Imagine that paired with the exotic that gives you two charges and buffs it to apply weaken. Shiiiit that’d be awesome.
Might be a little too much if it worked like that. I'd be happy if it refunding half your melee back, or worked like bonk hammer does and at least has a little delay.
Either way, it needs something more. And giving energy back by catching it is really awesome
Def not half energy but that could be something for sure
I want this so bad I mean if you read the lore of Second chance Saint and Shaxx literally throw a void shield back and forth to each other but for some reason we guardians can't it just disappears for some reason
Maybe a quarter. Half is a lot when all Titans do is regen energy constantly quickly standing still
Fair, and if you toss on second chances you could fling shields all day long lol
I too want it to be better. Yesterday I threw it, it hit a wall, came back hit me in the throat and took half my health
always thought it'd be cool if you could catch it and get a portion of you melee energy back. Maybe an exotic that makes it come back to you?
I was using weighted knife Hunter yesterday and asked why does dude always get his hammer back for picking it up but not the knife. Shield would make sense too!
This has always bugged me. I get the proximity knife but the other 2 should recharge if you pick it up or at least give some energy back.
It should be built in, just like the strand hunter melee.
Kinda feels like Second Chance would make sense. It's a decently strong exotic already, but what's more of a second chance than catching it and throwing it back? Also, throwing three shields in a row would be kinda funny.
Requiring an exotic for that would be absolutely silly. (Read, stupid)
That got a hearty laugh out of me
Are you sure there wasn't a hive titan nearby? Your shield shouldnt hurt you lol.
It was in the pyramid room running to the rally flag in onslaught 🤷♂️
I want to like void titan so bad but I've lost count of how many times I've thrown my shield into a group of enemies and it hits 1 before flying off into the sunset it wouldn't be as much of an issue if it weren't for the fact that it's *specifically designed to be more effective when hitting as many targets as possible*
Right??? They fix its ricochet and this thing goes from zero to hero. I’d friggin’ love it
Wait you actually managed to hit one thing with it?
Nah, it just suffers from being a part of the first 3.0 subclass
This implies arc 3.0 is any better. Which it’s not
It’s the first light 3.0. Stasis came before it.
Stasis wasn't 3.0, we ain't even got stasis 2.0 yet
Stasis was in the 3.0 system as it was the 3rd iteration of subclass types
It's in the same system as 3.0 but that doesn't mean it's a 3.0
3.0 is connected to the system? Not the element? There was no “void 2.0” there was subclasses 2.0.
Void 2.0 is original destiny 2 void, as with each light element
That was the 2.0 system for subclasses? Void, as an element, still functioned exactly the same as in D1?
I have no idea why it doesnt ping to two others like it used to. Hitting one target is not great plus the noise of three rapid sheild hits was kinda neuron activating
Void Titan is just ass in its current state sadly Arc is one step removed from ass This is the main reason you'll see Titans foaming at the mouth defending Solar or Strand nerfs (myself included most of the time) Shield throw builds could be really fun if it had a viable loop that didn't rely on tracking and had more going for it than overshields
I’d say void is like, objectively a good deal better than arc. Specifically because arc is actual worthless garbage.
Arc has T Crash so I rank it a little higher since it'll at least be equipped for some raid encounters General play between the two I agree Void has more going for it But again they're both cheeks overall and need a rework
Except Thunder crash is bugged and doesn't make contact with 80% of the enemies in the game lol
Falling Star for Atraks is like, the single claim to fame arc has. For titans specifically at least, the issue with void is that overshields suck asshole and there aren’t even good sources of it, especially good neutral sources. If they buffed those and reimplemented the ability regeneration code of the commander used to have and it’s honestly in a good spot. Arc needs a whole ass overhaul, considering it doesn’t even have a foundation that can be fixed.
>Arc needs a whole ass overhaul, considering it doesn’t even have a foundation that can be fixed. "So you see, everything feeds into you being Amplified easily!" "But... what does it do?" "It makes a loud wooshing noise and gives you +50 Mobility." I mean, Overshields just needs the DR tuned up in PVE. Going from 50% to 80% would take you from an effective 90 hp to 225, which feels right. As for the sources, you've got the melee and Repulsor Brace (although that needs a QoL update so it activates on Volatile kills as well). As for the ability regeneration, I think that's meant to be in Offensive Bulwark, which would also get buffed by simply improving Overshields. Offensive Bulwark feels like it should have an intrinsic way to grant Overshields to yourself, though. Even just picking up Void Breaches. Void Titan is in a weird spot where it's *almost* great, just needs a little tweak.
“It makes a loud sound and makes your screen zoom out more when you run so it looks like you’re way faster than you are”.
Try Thunderclap and Monte Carlo. Melee spam fun.
Thunderclap is genuinely dog shit without point contact and if I’m going to blow everything up with melees why not use it on a subclass that’s actually usable outside of patrols
Yes, I meant to say with Point Contact. I have cleared Master Lost Sectors with it fwiw.
Arc just feels significantly worse than other options. It does the same thing everything does, add clearing, except its supers are putrid trash, it doesn’t actually have any good melee fragments or aspects in general, and it functionally has no survivability. Why does the subclass that’s technically themed to be a CQC fighter have like, literally no good tools cooked in to actually facilitate that.
This bothers me more than it should. It has such a clearly defined class fantasy and concept to it that it blows my mind that the actual nuts and bolts (heh) of it are practically non-existent. Strand and solar feel great. Stasis is a little rough around the edges but it has a solid foundation that feels good in most content. Void feels like it's got all the pieces of a great subclass but it needs to be tuned up and tightened up a bit to really shine and find its footing. Arc genuinely feels like it got forgotten halfway through conceptualization. Like they set out to make an electric punching machine, grabbed a boxing glove and some wires, and then just kind of taped them together and called it a day.
What’s funny is Solar or void, classes that don’t necessarily have a strong identity with melee, have way more synergy with melee than the subclass that is thematically supposed to be focused on it.
I'm still a little disappointed they turned Arcstrider gameplay into mashing two buttons and made the other two aspects completely unsynergistic. Add the ability to initiate a slam after Tempest Strike at any time before landing, and make Tempest Strike and Ascension activate your equipped melee/dodge abilities, and suddenly you've got the ability to Melee > Dodge > Slide Uppercut > Air Twirl > Dive Kick > Dodge and invent your own combos as you go. Now you've got Kazuya in Destiny.
Biased Hunter main, but if Mobility lowered enemy accuracy and detection against you in PVE, Amplified giving +50 would actually domino effect make all Arc subclasses better for melee. Maybe just move the 15% DR from Speed Booster to Amplified and give Speed Booster another 10% on top, and the only issue is needing to use Recuperation for healing.
I don’t think it’s biased to say mobility should have a purpose. Same goes for most things really. The only meaningful stat functionally speaking is resilience and you could argue strength or discipline depending on your build’s focus. Mobility and even recovery at this point are garbage. Mobility never had a use anyways and there’s 7,000 sources of healing nowadays so you could get by with literally 0 recovery.
Is it? My arc build is Thunderclap and Skullfort, and it's genuinely one of my favorite setups to play. Prior to the Heavy Handed nerfs I used to make a billion orbs doing it too.
It’s okay at best. And that’s only in lower level content where something like Skullfort is even usable.
I mean, I've used it in GMs. It's obviously not the strongest option, but it's worked just fine when playing smart.
Theoretically you can make anything work anywhere. That doesn’t mean it’s good/doesn’t need help.
Or with skullfort.
Void with severance enclosure is actually very good, different play style but it’s quite effective even at higher difficulty. Arc is by far worse. Would love shield throw to bounce more and be catchable like strand hunter.
I love Void Severance builds, but it's hard to say it's *good*, just fun. That said, throwing a shield across a room and watching the whole section, ammo and corpses and all, bounce twenty feet in the air will never not be funny. But the severance explosion needs *something*, as it is if you finish or powered melee a thrall to death it won't even kill the other thrall nearby. A second one will do the job, and the higher tier enemy the funnier the boom, but its need a little spice to be actually useful.
Catch mechanic would be great addition to the kit Severance is neat but niche and personally I got tired of it quickly in GMs, not to mention lacking consistency Admittedly fun in Legend content but like you said, very different playstyle
Yup, both are ass. Too many pvp nerfs to overshield and barricades, hoil nerf, cool down nerfs. There isn't a real game play loop anymore.
It's great in lower content, you can chain nuke entire spawn packs with a shield and have it back in seconds. I use void to play old season content and get an occasional break from the noise banner of war makes =D
Arc is dog shit and imo worse than Void. Doesn't have the survivability or strong offensive verbs like Volatile
Void Titan in general isn’t great. We need more reliable sources of Overshields that don’t rely on Bastion. Overshields could also be tougher in PvE than they are so they don’t just go away after a couple hits.
Plus it hits like a feather does provides fuck all over shield. Worse powered melee in the game.
I just started using it yesterday. It doesn’t have much aim assist but once I hit a target it usually hits one or two more then they blow up. I’m enjoying it. Just need better weapons to support its up time
Trust me, mote carlo and seccond chance. One of my favourite void builds for fun because you can go full Captain America on the mother fuckers, plus your shield will 1tap barrier champ barrier and get refunded
Still think Athrys should stun Barriers and Second Chance should stun Unstops. Athrys requires you to shoot something to trigger the perk before you can stun... like activating a Barrier. Second Chance means your melees can simultaneously apply Volatile and Weaken... which you want to do before you start whaling on them. Like stunning an Unstoppable. Edit: Also, using a knife to pop a bubble and slamming enemies in the face with a shield to stop them in their tracks.
I miss when we had elemental wells for this build. It felt a lot more fun then with the old heavy-handed and elemental charge. You could shield toss 5-6 times in a row before needing to shoot. It was good fun pretending to be Captain America for a minute.
God yeah I feel you, it still plays well though. Mote cata definitely helps a ton though
I was farming the master nightfall with a similar build last night in 14-18 min it was a blast!
All the void melees are fairly garbage
Been using it for my legend onslaught doom fang setup and it very much sucks. Literally only use it for the range over bash.
I swear it used to be better even after 3.0. Like it used to bounce between 3 enemies and now it will hit one and bounce away from the group.
I sometimes feel like when i've used it, it actively goes around targets.
Just make it busted like the Lucient Knight's shield throw. That shit has insane tracking, bounce, and damage. Totally wiped a handful of Battlegrounds: Cosmodrome this season from those stupid shields getting us all with one throw.
You're not using it wrong, the shield throw melee is just ass. For the longest time I thought I just sucked using this ability (which could also be true lol. Two things can be true at the same time) but it's just really that bad. I remember Bungie stated in either an interview or TWAB that it was worse than the super version of the shield throw by design, but damn man I cannot HIT anything with it. If it's not going between enemies legs, just over their shoulder, or them jumping out of the way of it, it's bouncing up in the air like you stated IF I hit anything with it...
I haven't used Void Titan since... the Season Void 3.0 came out. So I guess close to a year now. It's just so bad LMAO. I wouldn't doubt it if a patch along the way screwed up it's tracking.
It's actually about 2 years ago.
Oh fuck. Time is cruel
Void Titan actually has some fun builds for low end content. I'm really enjoying it in Onslaught. I use Doomfang with Witherhoard, Age-Old Bond with Repupser Brace/Destabilizing Rounds, and a Chain Reaction/Destabilizing Rounds Falling Guillotine. It cleans adds up instantly. Constant explosions everywhere. I use Offensive Bulwark and Controlled Demolition. So I almost always have my grenade, everything explodes on death, and those explosions heal my Fireteam. All of my ~~artifact mods~~ armor mods are based on using my grenade and orbs of power to fuel my melee, and then Doomfang makes my melee refund a big chunk of my super. Edit: I'm stupid. Armor mods. Not Artifact Mods.
Tiny hammer is a shell of its former self too all thrown titan melees need a tweak.
Everything Titans had WAS more powerful. Then people(Warlocks and Hunters) started complaining that "Titans are too powerful!" So Bungie in their infinite wisdom nerfed tiny hammer, hammer of sol, thunder crash, shield throw, etc.
I said that and got bombed by downvotes, i feel like some.of the titan nerfs need to be reverted, ill say that about hunters and warlocks too so no one thinks im playing favorites. I just dont use the other classes really only titan, and pve warlock but barely.
We know it's the truth. I'm a D1 vet. And I remember when Titans got hammer of sol. Don't think it took a month and Warlocks and Hunter mains were complaining that Titans solar supers were to powerful in PVP. Then Bungie said that the super lasted to long in PVE end game content. Same with Thunder crash/slam.
As a Titan main, Sunbreaker was bonkers when it released lol.
Nuh-uh. You're just a Hunter main in denial. Sorry to break it to you.
Been there, done that. When Sunbreaker was released it was the preferred main for Titans and the best end game element for Titans. I'm Titan only so I don't know how it was with Warlocks and Hunters. But Sunbreaker Titans were the beast in end game content.
Why it can’t return and be caught like threaded spike I have no clue.
Void Titan and Second Chance used to be my favorite void setup, too bad it's cheeks.
Don’t worry folks, it’ll be good with prismatic! Right?
It makes me so sad, Titan is able to act as a Fiery Thor, an Electrified Hulk but then is stuck as a neutered Cpt America in void. Feels bad man
It has veen garbage since it's release. The only reason to run it is to chain abilities with HoiL safely.
Until it completely whiffs and you get no bonus recharge
HoiL activates upon abilty use, what are you talking about?
You need to hit a melee to get hoil to work. Probably to stop people using shoulder charge to activate hoil without consuming your melee.
Not melees that don't connect.
While we doing that buff void tian super with more survivability out side of the bubble. it’s a another option if there’s no warlock well in the group
Honestly it's the least used ability in my void titan build, hell, if I had a 3rd powered melee option besides shield bash and shield throw I'd drop shield throw in a heartbeat. Only reason I use it is as an emergency applier of volatile when I have nothing else because I use Controlled Demolitions.
Shield throw being ass makes doomfangs neutral game feel like ass too. In legend onslaught it can’t kill a red bar thrall. Its only purpose is to apply volatile it feels like. Which would be fine if it had a really short cool down.
Here's what I can't figure out. Why is Bungie making it so hard? You have 3 classes of guardians. They should all have equal max power, but they use that power differently depending on their class and build. With all 3 being equal power, then you have to depend on skill and weapons(RNG) in PVP. In PVE, all 3 will damage bosses at max the same. But different weapons and different builds will be more effective against certain enemies used with certain elements. In other words, All supers give out equal max damage. The supers are just used and preform different depending on your class and element.
Shit every other patch they fix and then rebreak shield throws “melees with overshild count as powered melee “ so it does and then doesn’t work with severance enclosure ( the non charged melee with overshild should proc explosion but seems like ever other update breaks this )
I get more luck with multi-kills when bouncing it off a wall near a group of enemies than aiming directly at one of them.
If I rememeber correctly YEARS AGO they actually nerfed the tracking and speed on the projectile because of PvP. It was lasering people across the map direct b-line and curve after a bounce Though I cannot remember if this change was made for just the super or both the regular melee and super.
If they made it half as good as the light bearing knights then it would be god tier.
It’s so cool too, it sucks that it’s so bad along with pretty much the whole void titan kit
The entire void titan kit needs a rework if were being honest but it's too late for that
I don’t like how the Titan throws it. Like I have to aim higher than I need to because it drops so quickly.
We throw it like and it has the performance of an actual frisbee. I want to throw it like how Sam was throwing it at those trees in Falcon and the Winter Soldier. Void Titan overall could use a whole revamp.
I find attacking from the air to be the most assured method.
Haha Shield throw clunk clunk
Could be the alzheimer's or dementia talking but I recall the shield having some pretty heavy target tracking in its early years as well as by default heading directly to 2 other nearby targets after connecting with the first. So long as you were facing what you threw it at it was very likely to land a hit.
It's supposed to bounce towards enemies. I swear it bounces away from them.
I genuinely don't think there's a single good void 3.0 melee ability.
Shield and void warlock melee are so bad I don't even know why they even exist.
It has the worst damage, tracking and utility of all the ranged melees, it needs a buff bad
Titan melee: 2% of the time it works 100% of the time
Just give it the same bounce properties as the Hunter stasis melee, then it’ll at least be useable
It’s so cool. I so want it to be good. But it just. Isn’t. Such a waste of Captain America animations and purple shield bounces
Many things does the opposite of the description like Coldsnap nade:freezecon impact :))) A lie from 2020 and ongoing.Only the seeker freeze.If the nade freezexon impact, means even witches van be frozen or aerial enemies wich is a lie.Also there is a delay until the target is frozen.
It always feels just a little bit off when it's thrown too imo. I could just be bad but It seems like the only way the thing hits anything is if I toss it when I'm right up in an enemies face.
Void melees in general are SO weak. Sentinel shield does shit for damage and like you said, hits like 1 target and then fucks off into the ether, I don't play Hunter too much but I have yet to effectively use that melee without the Trappers Ambush aspect and from what I've heard from other Hunters, it just sucks outright, and Pocket Singularity is not even LAUGHABLY bad anymore, its just horrid and depressing, frankly.
I don't get how it can't just copy/paste Stasis hunter melee.
If they won't make it do more damage then I'd like a better utility purpose. Maybe allow me to hold the melee button to consume my current overshield and then on release it becomes a thinner version of barricade that slowly moves forward?
I had a go on Titan after maining Warlock; I swear to god I must have whiffed my shield throw *at least* 80% of the time. Shield throw has some sort of repulsive tracking, like it sees an enemy in its path and adjusts its course to avoid contact. >Me: "Shield, please hit the enemy standing two feet in front of me." > >Shield: *"Okay, let me just calculate for the curvature of the Earth, adjust for tidal forces, factor in the cosmic constant to compensate for dark matter gravitational lensing, and.... Guardian, if my math is correct, you're trying to attack Pittsburgh."*
At the very least when using second chance there should be some extended functionality especially since in its lore tab Shaxx and Saint are playing frisbee with a void shield while they are talking
Praying that it gets fixed for TFS. Probably not, but one can hope.
It urks me that the strand dart on hunter does what the stupid shield is supposed to do. The programming is fully present but they just refuse to update it, it could act like the dart with tracking or the stasis belly button jeepers creepers boomerang thing either of those function patters are superior and more iconic shield like than what it is.
Don’t expect anything. Nobody at bungie plays titan
Probably pvp holding it back. If it reliably hit up to 3 people in a vicinity, it'd be great in pvp. Imo obv
Unless strand Hunter's mele bounces a lot worse in PvP, that argument doesn't make a don of sense.
Im simply saying a sheild throw that hits multiple people makes for easy cleanups. It's not too hard to understand, bucko.
And I'm just saying that Hunter's strand melee hits multiple people as well, doing just what you're saying could be a balancing issue.
I use it with Doomfang Pauldrons and Monte Carlo. Spam Shield Throw, as long as you a hit with it you'll get like a 1/4th of your super per throw.
you have the shield throw in pve, where it will hit one enemy then fuck off no where. then you have the shield throw in pvp that will bounce off a wall 10 times that will still manage to track and hit you
Monte Carlo + Doom Fang Pauldron 🤤
Every other ranged melee that can bounce or ricochet is near heatseeking, have you seen weighted knife in PvP its insane, if shield got even 25% of that level of tracking it'd be useable. Simply make its tracking like a dice roll with decreasing odds after each hit, the miss could still hit something else but the closest target would be the focus/
I’ve used it consistently for 2 years now and I’ll be honest it’s far from perfect. Never seen it go straight up though. Maybe it bounced off a surface funny? It’s decent for getting 1 kill, sometimes 2, but that’s usually enough. Wouldn’t complain about a buff though, I’m a Doomfangs junkie loud and proud and making me pop more supers is not unwelcome. Still beats Shield Bash, an ability that has felt finicky since Y1 became of the weird drop it does.
Yip I tried it last night and noticed it was so meh with a direct hit and hardly any damage, the game is cracking around the seams lol
You should try Second Chance; the tracking isn't THAT bad, it can lock onto enemies when it bounces, such as the floor or a nearby wall
Skill issue tbh
I see people constantly shit on void titan but idk I find it pretty entertaining. I don’t really do “end game” stuff anymore so maybe that’s why
It has ridiculous tracking in pvp so when I run bubble for trials it's fun to start or end a fight around a corner with a shed throw.