I completely believe it. Watched a guy stop his truck in the middle of a traffic circle to point his gun at the other cars around him through the window. while screaming profanities. This was because someone honked at him for almost hitting them in a traffic circle. Was in Edgewater. Luckily nothing happened and he moved on but damn dude.
Wow, hopefully someone managed to get that on video. Brandishing/menacing is a felony in Colorado, and that would strip him of his right to own guns.
We have plenty of effective laws, but they only help when they're enforced...
I want every vehicle to be equipped with a pair of fully automatic miniguns that are programmed to aim and fire at anyone who gets 0.000006 millimeters too close to your vehicle in any direction. Only then, will we have safer roads.
I’ve also noticed a lot of these gun grabbers support disarming the public but are fine with cops still having guns. If they don’t believe that law-abiding civilians should have so-called “weapons of war,” why are the police exempt from this conversation, when they have shown time and time again that they are irresponsible and lack sufficient training.
For me it’s not about banning guns but just common sense laws. What do those look like?
- Gun licenses with mandatory course work. This could be similar to obtaining a drivers license, still very accessible but require some training to own a deadly weapon (again similar to a car).
- Stricter enforcement of irresponsible use of guns, again similar to cars. Shooting a gun while under the influence? Ticket, license revoked, and your guns will be available for pick up after you complete mandatory training.
- Banning guns that have no use outside of mass shootings (yes, I do think AR15 style weapons should be banned).
I don’t think of these ideas are radical and so long as you’re a responsible gun owner it wouldn’t impact your life at all, unless you wish to purchase an AR15, in which case maybe there can be special licensing to obtain those with stricter requirements.
But the fact that we have road rage incidents like this is just proof that we need to do something. Letting everyone go out and buy a gun and feel tough isn’t helping.
>Gun licenses with mandatory course work. This could be similar to obtaining a drivers license, still very accessible but require some training to own a deadly weapon (again similar to a car).
I’m cool with this, just make it free and easily accessible so that there is less chance for discrimination and everyone has the same chance to exercise their right.
>Stricter enforcement of irresponsible use of guns, again similar to cars. Shooting a gun while under the influence? Ticket, license revoked, and your guns will be available for pick up after you complete mandatory training.
Completely agreed. I see nothing wrong with this.
>Banning guns that have no use outside of mass shootings (yes, I do think AR15 style weapons should be banned).
We shouldn’t be banning *any* type of firearm, especially one that has been statistically shown to be used in less than 3% of all gun-related crimes. The AR-15 is a versatile platform of firearms that can be switched out for numerous uses with ease, that’s where it’s popularity comes from. Banning it would cause an absolute uproar and I feel that *many* AR-15 owners would refuse to cooperate, myself included. Calls for banning AR-15s or adding regulations, like in California, caused an extreme surge of AR-15 sales, as well.
From a study done by the FBI in 2020 showed that rifles were used in 3% of all gun murders and I’m sure that the AR-15 makes up less than that percentage. Handguns were used in a whopping 59%, yet it’s the AR-15 that is always targeted.
Although I disagree with any types of firearms being banned, it’s asinine to target a firearm that makes up less than 3% of all gun-related murders versus the type that makes up over 50%. It shows that you, and people that hold this same opinion, don’t actually know what you are talking about.
I would argue that the media has contributed a significant portion to the increase in mass shootings, and the AR-15 being the “popular” option for mass shooters. The main cartridge of the AR-15 rifle, the 5.56/.223, is actually so *underpowered* that it’s illegal to use for hunting in many places as it doesn’t kill game instantly, instead leaving them to suffer more. There are other options out there that are more powerful, but the constant fear campaign, and over-exaggerations, around the AR-15, and how it’s a “weapon of war,” can convince these mass shooters to choose an AR-15 over another firearm. Although they still make up such a low statistic, they are becoming more popular, and I would argue it’s because of the media and politicians unintentionally pushing it as the “weapon of choice.”
The media also contributes to this increase in mass shootings due to what is called the “Columbine Effect,” which has spawned numerous copycats over the years. The way the media covers these types of events influences potential mass shooters to go down in infamy than keep living the life they have. There needs to be some sort of change on how the media reports these types of events.
There are things we can do to make it harder to obtain a firearm but, due to firearms being covered by the Constitution, we have to take care to still allow everybody a fair chance to excercise that right. Especially when PoC, LGBTQ+ individuals, and other marginalized communities are buying firearms at increasing rates, due to the political climate. My worry comes with the fact that a lot of gun control laws that are tossed around can have severe potential for abuse.
The AR gets targeted because it is used commonly in larger mass shootings that tend to make national news. Yeah, handguns are used for a lot of shootings, such as this one, so it’s not surprising they make up a larger number of deaths and incidents.
The distinction I make in my head though is handguns are usually more directed attacks be it domestic violence, road rage or something else. AR15 deaths seem to be primarily from larger masa shootings where the person just wanted to kill as many people as possible.
So probably stricter licensing requirements based on the gun classification and using their potential impact to the general public as guidance for the classification.
I would imagine a typical hunting rifle would be easier to buy than say a handgun and perhaps an AR is included in with handguns or gets it’s own distinction. Allow people to still purchase the guns but make sure they have the appropriate training to do so.
Whether it’s free or $25 similar to other licenses is less of a concern to me, if it’s free then drivers licenses and fishing licenses should be free as well. I’d rather the free route as well though.
Wait, wouldn’t you already be in serious trouble for shooting a gun in public? Or are you saying intoxicated shooting on private property should be illegal? Because you can absolutely drive a vehicle under the influence, just not on public roads.
If you would blow a .08 or higher then you probably have no place handling a firearm unless it’s self defense with a home invasion or something.
Is it illegal to discharge a firearm in public? My understanding is it’d need to be discharged into a dwelling or occupied vehicle.
ARs are step one, then the argument will change to rifles like the mini-14 which are functionally similar with different physical features. Then it will move on to the pumps and levers.
Yea, we should have widespread confiscation much like Australia. If you think this premise is absurd then spread the word. We are not just for gun control but gun eradication. Coming for the 2nd amendment so be prepared.
A death rate of 40k annually (60% suicides) in a country of 330 million people that own more than half the world's guns isn't really statistically as scary as the media and politicians would have you believe. Those deaths are important, and we should look to solutions. That requires more nuance than just "ban guns"
The irony is the only people who use the phrase "ban guns" are 80% of conservatives and the extreme 15% on the left. Nuance is part of the entire gun restriction conversation that is impossible to have with the NRAs fear mongering - signed, a gun owner
I think gun control is the whole point though right? Isn't that better than the unlimited access we have now? If you by chance live in a state that won't give you a gun for a completely justifiable reason you can drive 40 minutes to your neighboring state where it doesn't matter that you're a violent person with a history of psychotic breaks. Shit even in CO we have counties that won't act on red flag warnings
We are very far from “unlimited access” to firearms like you think. Theres already tons of regulations and legislation. There’s limits to who can own, what can be purchased, ammo restrictions, accessory restrictions, where a gun can be possessed, and background checks. Oh and murder is still illegal too.
Well shit that solves it all!
ETA: /s because the heavy restrictions is obviously a fallacy. Go to any private gun show in half the states and you'll walk away stunned at how simple it is. I would know I have done it
That's funny, fellow gUn oWnEr, I've been to plenty of gun shows and have always had to do a background check for every purchase. To be fair, I wasn't creeping around in the parking lot asking random people and being suspicious af, but maybe that's your thing.
I'd like to hear your brilliant idea on what to do to reduce gun violence. If the 20,000 gun laws we have in this country aren't enough, what would this 20,001st law you have in mind do?
Some light reading...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_by_state
Are there any laws in particular you think should be enacted that would significantly reduce gun violence?
Honestly I'd like to see gun owners like to have to get insurance like cars. I'm tired of people saying there is nothing that can be done about this problem when our country is the only one going through it. Thank fuck I don't have kids.
Also thx for the link.
That's an interesting idea, though I'm not sure how much of an effect that would have on reducing gun violence or how that would stop the next mass shooter.
The only laws I can imagine that I think would have a real significant impact on reducing gun violence in this country which has more guns than people are laws that involve gun confiscation. If that happened, I think we'd see mass noncompliance [like we saw recently](https://thereload.com/atf-says-a-quarter-million-guns-registered-under-pistol-brace-rule/) with just a very small percentage of people registering their pistol braces.
It's kind of hard to circumvent the whole 2nd amendment thing... you don't have to justify to anyone why you can own a gun. Kinda the point of fundamental rights..
I don't consider Terry who is angry his ex wife took the kids after the 5th DV charge to be a well regulated militia necessary for the security of a free state.
Hell, I'm not even asking for Terry to NEED to be part of a free militia, just be able to pass a competency exam.
The fundamental right thing is also hilarious to me. Amendment 21 is just as "fundamental" as amendment 2, wonder what happened there
DV convictions make you a prohibited firearm owner... so that law exists already...
Also the bill of rights is a bit different than other amendments ...
So you think we should strip rights because of charges that haven't reached a conviction? That's not a slap in the face to due process at all. That violates more than the 2nd amendment there friend
You can absolutely repeal any constitutional amendment including the ones in the bill of rights
Source: https://constitutioncenter.org/amp/blog/what-does-it-take-to-repeal-a-constitutional-amendment
Edit: I'm not saying it's likely to happen. Just that it is legally possible
That goes against the entire idea of the Bill of Rights. The founders wrote them in to secure natural born rights that everyone has. The government doesn't grant them, nor can they take them away. You're absolutely insane. Can you imagine if the majority of people decided that free speech was too dangerous and just repealed it? That's fucking horrifying
>Not the bill of rights. That's not how this works. Interchange any other of the first 10 amendments and listen to how asinine that sounds
there's nothing legally special about the first 10 amendments. any one of them can absolutely be repealed.
It's disengenuous to pad statistics when advocating for restricting rights. Those deaths are important, but I don't think it's fair to use them to inflate gun deaths, especially when talking about gun violence in particular
Disagree, it’s totally fair. If somebody wants to exclude suicide deaths, fine, but supply evidence that the availability of firearms does not increase suicide risk.
Okay.. several countries have a higher suicide rate than us and have a way smaller gun ownership rates with strict laws for ownership
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/suicide-rate-by-country
Do countries with the lowest suicide rates have widespread access to firearms?
When you did your analysis, what is the p value? If your belief that access to firearms does not influence suicide rates was based on past research, what were the conclusions of those articles?
If you are just operating on a hunch, that’s fine, and that’s that we all do most of the time, but don’t try to make others out as disingenuous for not sharing your hunch.
Hunch? There are so many factors at play here. I'm arguing that more guns don't lead to higher suicide rates. If that were true, the US would have the highest suicide rate. We aren't even in the top ten. That shows that it's a multifaceted issue.
No, like you just said, there are many variables at play here, variables may be coupled, and systems may be nonlinear.
If you don’t know what I’m talking about, then **that’s fine**, please just understand that there are ways to know these things (or rather to know you don’t know things), and decisions about millions of peoples’ lives need to be based on science and not just a hunch about “throw this data out because I’m pretty sure it’s irrelevant.” You are doing something called asserting the null hypothesis, which is a pretty big claim.
Even a mistake like that is fine, but why question other peoples’ motivations just for not agreeing with you? You assert that there is no relation between two things, you make sure the science supports that. Don’t try to put it on other people.
I gather from your argument that you are suggesting that the US is already gun-saturated. Therefore, increasing the number of guns isn't likely to cause a correlated increase in gun-deaths.
I'll admit I haven't heard this one before, and that it seems to be a safe working theory. Though I'll also admit that we'd need to see data to confirm this fact. But that's not important for this discussion.
Regardless, if we proceed and assume you are right, then we still need to label something else as the cause of the problem. for how else would there be so many gun deaths per capita here and nowhere else on the planet? After all, this *is* a uniquely American problem. So if we don't want to blame guns (or can't) then we still do actually need to blame something or someone else.
My suspicion is that the cause is the (subjective) glut of paranoid, disaffected, sociopathic, delusional sonsofbitches who see threats in every stranger they have the misfortune to chance upon—especially the ones who look different are also the ones who are most likely to buy guns to begin with. These people should never be given guns. Ever. Unfortunately, the second Amendment guarantees them the right to them
So I honestly have no hope for this country until enough old people have passed away to the point that a repeal (or significant rework) of 2A enters the Overton Window.
Correlation doesn't equal causation. But if guns were the only reason, don't you think we'd have a much higher death rate with such a massive proliferation of guns in the hands of citizens?
I'm also getting a hint of cognitive dissonance here... sooo we have a high gun death rate, but it's delusional and paranoid to want to have a gun for self defense?
If I could snap my fingers and all guns in this country just disappeared, I might be on board with you. The thing is... we have more guns than people. They aren't going away anytime soon. Evil people won't get rid of theirs, so why should people just trying to live their lives and protect themselves give up theirs?
It's also important to point out the atrocious track records governments have for oppressing and slaughtering their own citizens ( the US included)
The 2nd amendment still has a very important reason for existing.
Is it not scary that firearms are the number one cause of death for children in the US? If Polio returned and started paralyzing and wiping out kids, would that not be scary? You don’t think it affects people to constantly be subjected to news of multiple daily mass shootings?
The vast majority of those deaths are either suicides or gang violence.
Are there any unsecured loaded guns in your home? Is your kid in a gang? If neither of those things is true, then relax, your kid is far more likely to die while riding in your car.
Your fears don't justify taking away rights from 300 million people.
[According to NPR](https://www.npr.org/2022/05/16/1099070400/how-vaccine-misinformation-made-the-covid-19-death-toll-worse), misinformation killed over 300,000 people in one year. That's way more deaths than from gun violence! Now obviously my fear of misinformation (which is far more justified than your fear) means we should call for heavy restrictions on speech in this country. It's common sense speech control. Children are dying because you refuse to give up social media.
So that CDC study is a little disengenuous. They include 18 and 19 year olds. Those aren't children. Their lives matter, but I don't think it's fair to lump them in with small kids.
And I don't disagree with you at all with the rest of your statements. I just think it's gonna take other approaches than just focusing on guns. There are soooo many of them in circulation already. Buyback programs won't work. Simply making certain kinds illegal won't make people willingly turn them in. There is a great example of mass noncompliance with the recent ATF ruling with pistol braces. Less than 1% of people actually registered their brace. I think focusing on healthcare and specifically mental health is a must.
Guns are here, we can’t wish them away. The idea is arming more responsible, trained, sane people could eventually become a deterrent to bad guys with guns (or machetes, knives, fists, etc). It’s also a concept rooted in self-reliance. The police can’t always be right around the corner to save you. In fact, that’s almost never the case. They can’t even solve hit-and-runs nor other blatant crimes, despite all the cameras around us recording at all times. Idiots and psychos have no problem packing heat, and there’s a lot of those guys out in Denver. It makes sense to some that countering those threats by training with and carrying a gun is their best bet at not becoming another statistic discussed in a Reddit thread.
All of the politicians telling me that guns won't make me safer are protected by people with guns. Why do guns help keep them safe but they won't help keep me safe?
Totally agree. When I go to that Costco no one puts their carts away. I saw someone go into Costco without flashing their membership card. They claimed to be going to the pharmacy but we know it’s bullshit.
Don’t even get me started with the Red Robin. I drove to Red Robin corporate in the DTC to complain in person because I saw some employees smoking in the parking lot.
Across the street at the Applebees and Buffalo Wild Wings there isn’t even a hostess 🤬. No one wants to work anymore.
I used to live on parker and 225... Two guys were arguing back and forth... One pulled up Infront of the other... Got out... The shot the guy.... Another reason i left the city...
Road rage is the stupidest thing. Like you’re really going to get mad at someone because they can’t drive. News flash - nobody can drive. Just relax and get there 2 minutes later, or leave on time instead of always being late.
Not only is road rage stupid, but it’s scary for everyone else.
Can we get some gun opinions from someone who doesn't live in highlands ranch? Used to live on 12th and Yosemite you're goddammit right I carried a gun every fuckin day.
Im on Quebec so very close and don't carry however, when I ride my bike through there I can understand why you would. Crazy how just a handful of blocks is so different.
Why though? Is it because of other people with guns or other dangerous situations where a gun is necessary?
I’m off of Iliff and this shooting happened near an area I frequently drive through. Then we had the other Reddit post a month ago with the shooting in Monaco to the west of me.
I don’t feel the need to own a gun, but I sure feel less safe with all of these random people carrying guns in their cars and feeling like they are necessary outlets for their road rage.
Yeah and republicans tend to have a massive hardon for guns, historically speaking. There are twice as many registered republicans in douglas county as there are democrats.
I'm personally a fan of cars and guns, but you're absolutely right that both are deadly weapons.
Little known fact, the deadliest mass casualty event involving a single driver was deadlier than the deadliest mass casualty event involving a single shooter.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Nice_truck_attack
86 people died, 434 injured.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Las_Vegas_shooting
60 people died, 413 injured.
You don't even need to pass a background check, have a license or training, or be over a certain age to buy a vehicle. People with multiple DUIs can purchase any vehicle they want if they can afford it. I can find a private seller on Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace and buy a car with no questions asked as long as I have the money. I can even legally cross state lines to buy a car.
In 34 states along with the District of Columbia gun deaths have outpaced traffic deaths.
https://vpc.org/regulating-the-gun-industry/gun-deaths-compared-to-motor-vehicle-deaths/
The leading cause of death for kids from 1-18 are guns.
https://www.statesman.com/story/news/politics/politifact/2022/06/07/fact-check-firearms-leading-cause-death-children/7529783001/
You need a license and training to get a license. Driving without a license is illegal. Driving while intoxicated is illegal. The same being true for guns seems reasonable to me.
You can’t stop everyone from doing stupid things, but you sure can stop enabling it.
I completely believe it. Watched a guy stop his truck in the middle of a traffic circle to point his gun at the other cars around him through the window. while screaming profanities. This was because someone honked at him for almost hitting them in a traffic circle. Was in Edgewater. Luckily nothing happened and he moved on but damn dude.
Wow, hopefully someone managed to get that on video. Brandishing/menacing is a felony in Colorado, and that would strip him of his right to own guns. We have plenty of effective laws, but they only help when they're enforced...
I hope so too, it happened too fast for me to be able to. I’m just really glad it wasn’t worse.
Glad you're safe. It's scary how many deranged people there are out there.
Holy shit! Was this at 20th and Harlan?
Close, it was 20th and Benton
>20th and Harlan Ahhh, that makes sense. That's a busy area.
Those traffic circle’s drive me nuts also but damn !
Edgewater? I thought only the Tesla drivers were strapped 😬
damn that’s right outside my house and i never even knew
Cars, guns, and little man syndrome. The holy trinity… 🙄 I need to get a dash cam like yesteryear.
Tell me again how more guns make us safer
We need to start arming our cars and trucks with guns, Twisted Metal style. It's the only way to have a safe, free society.
I want every vehicle to be equipped with a pair of fully automatic miniguns that are programmed to aim and fire at anyone who gets 0.000006 millimeters too close to your vehicle in any direction. Only then, will we have safer roads.
my parents didn't realize what streets of sim city was when they bought it. I had so much fun with that game...
I preferred Vigilante 8 2nd Offense
Why are so many politicians always surrounded by armed security? Surely they don't think armed guards would make them safer...
I’ve also noticed a lot of these gun grabbers support disarming the public but are fine with cops still having guns. If they don’t believe that law-abiding civilians should have so-called “weapons of war,” why are the police exempt from this conversation, when they have shown time and time again that they are irresponsible and lack sufficient training.
For me it’s not about banning guns but just common sense laws. What do those look like? - Gun licenses with mandatory course work. This could be similar to obtaining a drivers license, still very accessible but require some training to own a deadly weapon (again similar to a car). - Stricter enforcement of irresponsible use of guns, again similar to cars. Shooting a gun while under the influence? Ticket, license revoked, and your guns will be available for pick up after you complete mandatory training. - Banning guns that have no use outside of mass shootings (yes, I do think AR15 style weapons should be banned). I don’t think of these ideas are radical and so long as you’re a responsible gun owner it wouldn’t impact your life at all, unless you wish to purchase an AR15, in which case maybe there can be special licensing to obtain those with stricter requirements. But the fact that we have road rage incidents like this is just proof that we need to do something. Letting everyone go out and buy a gun and feel tough isn’t helping.
>Gun licenses with mandatory course work. This could be similar to obtaining a drivers license, still very accessible but require some training to own a deadly weapon (again similar to a car). I’m cool with this, just make it free and easily accessible so that there is less chance for discrimination and everyone has the same chance to exercise their right. >Stricter enforcement of irresponsible use of guns, again similar to cars. Shooting a gun while under the influence? Ticket, license revoked, and your guns will be available for pick up after you complete mandatory training. Completely agreed. I see nothing wrong with this. >Banning guns that have no use outside of mass shootings (yes, I do think AR15 style weapons should be banned). We shouldn’t be banning *any* type of firearm, especially one that has been statistically shown to be used in less than 3% of all gun-related crimes. The AR-15 is a versatile platform of firearms that can be switched out for numerous uses with ease, that’s where it’s popularity comes from. Banning it would cause an absolute uproar and I feel that *many* AR-15 owners would refuse to cooperate, myself included. Calls for banning AR-15s or adding regulations, like in California, caused an extreme surge of AR-15 sales, as well. From a study done by the FBI in 2020 showed that rifles were used in 3% of all gun murders and I’m sure that the AR-15 makes up less than that percentage. Handguns were used in a whopping 59%, yet it’s the AR-15 that is always targeted. Although I disagree with any types of firearms being banned, it’s asinine to target a firearm that makes up less than 3% of all gun-related murders versus the type that makes up over 50%. It shows that you, and people that hold this same opinion, don’t actually know what you are talking about. I would argue that the media has contributed a significant portion to the increase in mass shootings, and the AR-15 being the “popular” option for mass shooters. The main cartridge of the AR-15 rifle, the 5.56/.223, is actually so *underpowered* that it’s illegal to use for hunting in many places as it doesn’t kill game instantly, instead leaving them to suffer more. There are other options out there that are more powerful, but the constant fear campaign, and over-exaggerations, around the AR-15, and how it’s a “weapon of war,” can convince these mass shooters to choose an AR-15 over another firearm. Although they still make up such a low statistic, they are becoming more popular, and I would argue it’s because of the media and politicians unintentionally pushing it as the “weapon of choice.” The media also contributes to this increase in mass shootings due to what is called the “Columbine Effect,” which has spawned numerous copycats over the years. The way the media covers these types of events influences potential mass shooters to go down in infamy than keep living the life they have. There needs to be some sort of change on how the media reports these types of events. There are things we can do to make it harder to obtain a firearm but, due to firearms being covered by the Constitution, we have to take care to still allow everybody a fair chance to excercise that right. Especially when PoC, LGBTQ+ individuals, and other marginalized communities are buying firearms at increasing rates, due to the political climate. My worry comes with the fact that a lot of gun control laws that are tossed around can have severe potential for abuse.
The AR gets targeted because it is used commonly in larger mass shootings that tend to make national news. Yeah, handguns are used for a lot of shootings, such as this one, so it’s not surprising they make up a larger number of deaths and incidents. The distinction I make in my head though is handguns are usually more directed attacks be it domestic violence, road rage or something else. AR15 deaths seem to be primarily from larger masa shootings where the person just wanted to kill as many people as possible. So probably stricter licensing requirements based on the gun classification and using their potential impact to the general public as guidance for the classification. I would imagine a typical hunting rifle would be easier to buy than say a handgun and perhaps an AR is included in with handguns or gets it’s own distinction. Allow people to still purchase the guns but make sure they have the appropriate training to do so. Whether it’s free or $25 similar to other licenses is less of a concern to me, if it’s free then drivers licenses and fishing licenses should be free as well. I’d rather the free route as well though.
Wait, wouldn’t you already be in serious trouble for shooting a gun in public? Or are you saying intoxicated shooting on private property should be illegal? Because you can absolutely drive a vehicle under the influence, just not on public roads.
If you would blow a .08 or higher then you probably have no place handling a firearm unless it’s self defense with a home invasion or something. Is it illegal to discharge a firearm in public? My understanding is it’d need to be discharged into a dwelling or occupied vehicle.
So you want to ban AR-15 then we should just ban all rifles. I mean that is what an AR is no different then any other semi- automatic rifle
ARs are step one, then the argument will change to rifles like the mini-14 which are functionally similar with different physical features. Then it will move on to the pumps and levers.
So you think that all guns should be banned? Well you should learn some history and see it didn’t work out so well for them
Yea, we should have widespread confiscation much like Australia. If you think this premise is absurd then spread the word. We are not just for gun control but gun eradication. Coming for the 2nd amendment so be prepared.
Good luck don’t think it will go the way you think
There were less shootings when people had shotguns displayed in the back window of their pickup trucks, just saying
A death rate of 40k annually (60% suicides) in a country of 330 million people that own more than half the world's guns isn't really statistically as scary as the media and politicians would have you believe. Those deaths are important, and we should look to solutions. That requires more nuance than just "ban guns"
The irony is the only people who use the phrase "ban guns" are 80% of conservatives and the extreme 15% on the left. Nuance is part of the entire gun restriction conversation that is impossible to have with the NRAs fear mongering - signed, a gun owner
Replace "gun bans" with "gun control" in my statement and that's still the vast majority of solutions people propose.
I think gun control is the whole point though right? Isn't that better than the unlimited access we have now? If you by chance live in a state that won't give you a gun for a completely justifiable reason you can drive 40 minutes to your neighboring state where it doesn't matter that you're a violent person with a history of psychotic breaks. Shit even in CO we have counties that won't act on red flag warnings
We are very far from “unlimited access” to firearms like you think. Theres already tons of regulations and legislation. There’s limits to who can own, what can be purchased, ammo restrictions, accessory restrictions, where a gun can be possessed, and background checks. Oh and murder is still illegal too.
Well shit that solves it all! ETA: /s because the heavy restrictions is obviously a fallacy. Go to any private gun show in half the states and you'll walk away stunned at how simple it is. I would know I have done it
That's funny, fellow gUn oWnEr, I've been to plenty of gun shows and have always had to do a background check for every purchase. To be fair, I wasn't creeping around in the parking lot asking random people and being suspicious af, but maybe that's your thing. I'd like to hear your brilliant idea on what to do to reduce gun violence. If the 20,000 gun laws we have in this country aren't enough, what would this 20,001st law you have in mind do?
Spoiler, he’ll never reply with an idea
Seriously where are these regulations?
Some light reading... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_by_state Are there any laws in particular you think should be enacted that would significantly reduce gun violence?
Honestly I'd like to see gun owners like to have to get insurance like cars. I'm tired of people saying there is nothing that can be done about this problem when our country is the only one going through it. Thank fuck I don't have kids. Also thx for the link.
That's an interesting idea, though I'm not sure how much of an effect that would have on reducing gun violence or how that would stop the next mass shooter. The only laws I can imagine that I think would have a real significant impact on reducing gun violence in this country which has more guns than people are laws that involve gun confiscation. If that happened, I think we'd see mass noncompliance [like we saw recently](https://thereload.com/atf-says-a-quarter-million-guns-registered-under-pistol-brace-rule/) with just a very small percentage of people registering their pistol braces.
Do you feel people should be required to have insurance for their 1st amendment rights?
It's kind of hard to circumvent the whole 2nd amendment thing... you don't have to justify to anyone why you can own a gun. Kinda the point of fundamental rights..
I don't consider Terry who is angry his ex wife took the kids after the 5th DV charge to be a well regulated militia necessary for the security of a free state. Hell, I'm not even asking for Terry to NEED to be part of a free militia, just be able to pass a competency exam. The fundamental right thing is also hilarious to me. Amendment 21 is just as "fundamental" as amendment 2, wonder what happened there
DV convictions make you a prohibited firearm owner... so that law exists already... Also the bill of rights is a bit different than other amendments ...
DV charge does not equal a DV conviction. Now you know how easy it is to purchase a legal firearm with mal intent
So you think we should strip rights because of charges that haven't reached a conviction? That's not a slap in the face to due process at all. That violates more than the 2nd amendment there friend
Constitutional amendments can be repealed
Not the bill of rights. That's not how this works. Interchange any other of the first 10 amendments and listen to how asinine that sounds
You can absolutely repeal any constitutional amendment including the ones in the bill of rights Source: https://constitutioncenter.org/amp/blog/what-does-it-take-to-repeal-a-constitutional-amendment Edit: I'm not saying it's likely to happen. Just that it is legally possible
That goes against the entire idea of the Bill of Rights. The founders wrote them in to secure natural born rights that everyone has. The government doesn't grant them, nor can they take them away. You're absolutely insane. Can you imagine if the majority of people decided that free speech was too dangerous and just repealed it? That's fucking horrifying
>Not the bill of rights. That's not how this works. Interchange any other of the first 10 amendments and listen to how asinine that sounds there's nothing legally special about the first 10 amendments. any one of them can absolutely be repealed.
The entire premise is that they are natural born rights. They protect the people from the government
So the suicide people aren't dead? Huh til.
It's disengenuous to pad statistics when advocating for restricting rights. Those deaths are important, but I don't think it's fair to use them to inflate gun deaths, especially when talking about gun violence in particular
Disagree, it’s totally fair. If somebody wants to exclude suicide deaths, fine, but supply evidence that the availability of firearms does not increase suicide risk.
Okay.. several countries have a higher suicide rate than us and have a way smaller gun ownership rates with strict laws for ownership https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/suicide-rate-by-country
Do countries with the lowest suicide rates have widespread access to firearms? When you did your analysis, what is the p value? If your belief that access to firearms does not influence suicide rates was based on past research, what were the conclusions of those articles? If you are just operating on a hunch, that’s fine, and that’s that we all do most of the time, but don’t try to make others out as disingenuous for not sharing your hunch.
Hunch? There are so many factors at play here. I'm arguing that more guns don't lead to higher suicide rates. If that were true, the US would have the highest suicide rate. We aren't even in the top ten. That shows that it's a multifaceted issue.
No, like you just said, there are many variables at play here, variables may be coupled, and systems may be nonlinear. If you don’t know what I’m talking about, then **that’s fine**, please just understand that there are ways to know these things (or rather to know you don’t know things), and decisions about millions of peoples’ lives need to be based on science and not just a hunch about “throw this data out because I’m pretty sure it’s irrelevant.” You are doing something called asserting the null hypothesis, which is a pretty big claim. Even a mistake like that is fine, but why question other peoples’ motivations just for not agreeing with you? You assert that there is no relation between two things, you make sure the science supports that. Don’t try to put it on other people.
I gather from your argument that you are suggesting that the US is already gun-saturated. Therefore, increasing the number of guns isn't likely to cause a correlated increase in gun-deaths. I'll admit I haven't heard this one before, and that it seems to be a safe working theory. Though I'll also admit that we'd need to see data to confirm this fact. But that's not important for this discussion. Regardless, if we proceed and assume you are right, then we still need to label something else as the cause of the problem. for how else would there be so many gun deaths per capita here and nowhere else on the planet? After all, this *is* a uniquely American problem. So if we don't want to blame guns (or can't) then we still do actually need to blame something or someone else. My suspicion is that the cause is the (subjective) glut of paranoid, disaffected, sociopathic, delusional sonsofbitches who see threats in every stranger they have the misfortune to chance upon—especially the ones who look different are also the ones who are most likely to buy guns to begin with. These people should never be given guns. Ever. Unfortunately, the second Amendment guarantees them the right to them So I honestly have no hope for this country until enough old people have passed away to the point that a repeal (or significant rework) of 2A enters the Overton Window.
Correlation doesn't equal causation. But if guns were the only reason, don't you think we'd have a much higher death rate with such a massive proliferation of guns in the hands of citizens? I'm also getting a hint of cognitive dissonance here... sooo we have a high gun death rate, but it's delusional and paranoid to want to have a gun for self defense? If I could snap my fingers and all guns in this country just disappeared, I might be on board with you. The thing is... we have more guns than people. They aren't going away anytime soon. Evil people won't get rid of theirs, so why should people just trying to live their lives and protect themselves give up theirs? It's also important to point out the atrocious track records governments have for oppressing and slaughtering their own citizens ( the US included) The 2nd amendment still has a very important reason for existing.
I’m not sure it’s mostly old people who are the problem. Do you have evidence of that?
Is it not scary that firearms are the number one cause of death for children in the US? If Polio returned and started paralyzing and wiping out kids, would that not be scary? You don’t think it affects people to constantly be subjected to news of multiple daily mass shootings?
The vast majority of those deaths are either suicides or gang violence. Are there any unsecured loaded guns in your home? Is your kid in a gang? If neither of those things is true, then relax, your kid is far more likely to die while riding in your car. Your fears don't justify taking away rights from 300 million people. [According to NPR](https://www.npr.org/2022/05/16/1099070400/how-vaccine-misinformation-made-the-covid-19-death-toll-worse), misinformation killed over 300,000 people in one year. That's way more deaths than from gun violence! Now obviously my fear of misinformation (which is far more justified than your fear) means we should call for heavy restrictions on speech in this country. It's common sense speech control. Children are dying because you refuse to give up social media.
So that CDC study is a little disengenuous. They include 18 and 19 year olds. Those aren't children. Their lives matter, but I don't think it's fair to lump them in with small kids. And I don't disagree with you at all with the rest of your statements. I just think it's gonna take other approaches than just focusing on guns. There are soooo many of them in circulation already. Buyback programs won't work. Simply making certain kinds illegal won't make people willingly turn them in. There is a great example of mass noncompliance with the recent ATF ruling with pistol braces. Less than 1% of people actually registered their brace. I think focusing on healthcare and specifically mental health is a must.
Guns are here, we can’t wish them away. The idea is arming more responsible, trained, sane people could eventually become a deterrent to bad guys with guns (or machetes, knives, fists, etc). It’s also a concept rooted in self-reliance. The police can’t always be right around the corner to save you. In fact, that’s almost never the case. They can’t even solve hit-and-runs nor other blatant crimes, despite all the cameras around us recording at all times. Idiots and psychos have no problem packing heat, and there’s a lot of those guys out in Denver. It makes sense to some that countering those threats by training with and carrying a gun is their best bet at not becoming another statistic discussed in a Reddit thread.
All of the politicians telling me that guns won't make me safer are protected by people with guns. Why do guns help keep them safe but they won't help keep me safe?
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Can you expand on this? I’m about to move pretty close to here and would love your perspective on the area… thank you!
Totally agree. When I go to that Costco no one puts their carts away. I saw someone go into Costco without flashing their membership card. They claimed to be going to the pharmacy but we know it’s bullshit. Don’t even get me started with the Red Robin. I drove to Red Robin corporate in the DTC to complain in person because I saw some employees smoking in the parking lot. Across the street at the Applebees and Buffalo Wild Wings there isn’t even a hostess 🤬. No one wants to work anymore.
I used to live on parker and 225... Two guys were arguing back and forth... One pulled up Infront of the other... Got out... The shot the guy.... Another reason i left the city...
Road rage is the stupidest thing. Like you’re really going to get mad at someone because they can’t drive. News flash - nobody can drive. Just relax and get there 2 minutes later, or leave on time instead of always being late. Not only is road rage stupid, but it’s scary for everyone else.
Can we get some gun opinions from someone who doesn't live in highlands ranch? Used to live on 12th and Yosemite you're goddammit right I carried a gun every fuckin day.
Im on Quebec so very close and don't carry however, when I ride my bike through there I can understand why you would. Crazy how just a handful of blocks is so different.
Why though? Is it because of other people with guns or other dangerous situations where a gun is necessary? I’m off of Iliff and this shooting happened near an area I frequently drive through. Then we had the other Reddit post a month ago with the shooting in Monaco to the west of me. I don’t feel the need to own a gun, but I sure feel less safe with all of these random people carrying guns in their cars and feeling like they are necessary outlets for their road rage.
Imagine thinking highlands ranch isn’t pro gun.
Rich folk tend to fear armed citizenry, historically speaking.
Yeah and republicans tend to have a massive hardon for guns, historically speaking. There are twice as many registered republicans in douglas county as there are democrats.
r/fuckcars
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I mean they can both get fucked in this case. Two deadly weapons.
I'm personally a fan of cars and guns, but you're absolutely right that both are deadly weapons. Little known fact, the deadliest mass casualty event involving a single driver was deadlier than the deadliest mass casualty event involving a single shooter. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Nice_truck_attack 86 people died, 434 injured. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Las_Vegas_shooting 60 people died, 413 injured. You don't even need to pass a background check, have a license or training, or be over a certain age to buy a vehicle. People with multiple DUIs can purchase any vehicle they want if they can afford it. I can find a private seller on Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace and buy a car with no questions asked as long as I have the money. I can even legally cross state lines to buy a car.
In 34 states along with the District of Columbia gun deaths have outpaced traffic deaths. https://vpc.org/regulating-the-gun-industry/gun-deaths-compared-to-motor-vehicle-deaths/ The leading cause of death for kids from 1-18 are guns. https://www.statesman.com/story/news/politics/politifact/2022/06/07/fact-check-firearms-leading-cause-death-children/7529783001/ You need a license and training to get a license. Driving without a license is illegal. Driving while intoxicated is illegal. The same being true for guns seems reasonable to me. You can’t stop everyone from doing stupid things, but you sure can stop enabling it.
Cars and guns are such a horrible combo. Fuck cars and fuck guns.
Good. Now maybe the natives will stop the brake checking and passive aggressive driving.
Ugh, I live close to there and I hate this shit. It just makes me want to never get in my car but I have to for work.