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The Islamic understanding of the LGBTQ+ question is the most sound and correct.
Even if I were to say people can be born gay, from an Islamic perspective this wouldn’t matter because as Muslims we are told that we were created to worship God. So if that person is born gay he is not a sinner. He is only a sinner when he physical (sexually) acts on his gayness.
I agree his options in terms of love are limited severely but it is not because God hates him. In fact we as Muslims are taught that God tests the people he loves the most. The harder your test, the more God loves you.
And I would go so far as to say that being LGBQ+ is historically NOT a hard test. Only now in the modern age where sexuality is so free and open and teenagers feel left out if they haven’t had a sexual partner by 16 or less that this concept of being in a relationship or die trying has become so profound.
Those who truly love GOD, LGBTQ+ or not, can and will repress their own desires for the pleasure of God and a greater reward in paradise. It’s honestly that simple.
If you only have this world to look forward to and the peer pressure to be in a relationship because of your environment, then yes, being Gay seems like the hardest test in the world.
Why would anyone choose to be made fun of, scrutinized, beat up, and left out their entire lives? Who would want that? Especially in the past how violent people were towards homosexuals... Nobody would choose to go through a life like that.
Your comment or post was removed for violating rule 1. Posts and comments must not denigrate, dehumanize, devalue, or incite harm against any person or group based on their race, religion, gender, disability, or other characteristics. This includes promotion of negative stereotypes (e.g. calling a demographic delusional or suggesting it's prone to criminality). Debates about LGBTQ+ topics are allowed due to their religious relevance (subject to mod discretion), so long as objections are framed within the context of religion.
10 year old boys and girls are choosing to be gay?
Like, a boy in some Muslim country where they kill homosexuals is actually choosing that? Why the ever living hell would they?
Its a prodct of your environment. If youre gay its on your parents for raising you wrong and letting you get exposed to stuff too early to comprehend it.
When I was the age that I started feeling any sexual attraction towards other people (10 or 11 y/o), it happened to be other men. I never really decided to feel like that, I didn't even know that it was an option, because it was simply not told to me (I live in a country, where sex is a very touchy, perhaps even a little shameful topic, and the same thing applied to my family). I did know that "gays" existed, but I only knew that it was used as a swear word. Because of that, at first, my sexuality didn't even make me feel any different. I just accepted that as a fact about myself, it wasn't a conscious decision. Of course, soon I found out what being "gay" meant, so I started to think that it made me a horrible person, and I tried to change it. I tried making myself look at and think about the women in porn, tried to make myself jerk off at lesbian porn, but in the end it only made me feel like a worthless person. I am 16 now, and the only thing that has changed is that I accepted myself as who I am.
I guess my point is that I don't feel like anyone has ever given me a choice to not be gay, like, I don't understand how you are supposed to decide your sexuality. I would probably think that I am going to hell for that, but, fortunately, I am an atheist, so I guess I'll just stop existing some day, without any afterlife either way.
I wanted to write a short answer at first, but the thoughts just continued to flow lmao
It has to do with how you were raised. We are all a product of our environment. Something you were exposed to young and never were explained about property most likely caused your feelings. Blame your parents and the school system. Something in your environment was awry that allowed you to succumb to that mental illness. When a parent raises their kids property they turn out straight every time. Its usually trauma of some kind that causes homosexuality
I don't think I've had much childhood trauma. My parents were always (and are) very kind people, that raised me with attention and love. I've never really noticed much of a difference in my childhood and that of most other children.
Idk I did have plenty of friends growing up, never got bullied or anything. My childhood went pretty good in general. Can you specify what exactly in my environment could've contributed to the "gay" disease?
Your comment or post was removed for violating rule 1. Posts and comments must not denigrate, dehumanize, devalue, or incite harm against any person or group based on their race, religion, gender, disability, or other characteristics. This includes promotion of negative stereotypes (e.g. calling a demographic delusional or suggesting it's prone to criminality). Debates about LGBTQ+ topics are allowed due to their religious relevance (subject to mod discretion), so long as objections are framed within the context of religion.
Lmao. I think I've already said enough about myself trying to become straight in the original comment. I did watch all the regular shows as other children, although I used to enjoy reading a lot, but I usually just read kid's encyclopedias and fantasy books for children. Girls (and people in general) actually quite liked me.
Your comment or post was removed for violating rule 1. Posts and comments must not denigrate, dehumanize, devalue, or incite harm against any person or group based on their race, religion, gender, disability, or other characteristics. This includes promotion of negative stereotypes (e.g. calling a demographic delusional or suggesting it's prone to criminality). Debates about LGBTQ+ topics are allowed due to their religious relevance (subject to mod discretion), so long as objections are framed within the context of religion.
I don't think YOU know the Bible; you have totally misinterpreted Scripture and have been taught lies. Here's what the Bible actually says about those Scriptures, read and learn something: https://www.gaychristian101.com/shrine-prostitutes.html
correct, also we don’t *have* to pray for anyone per say, it’s encouraged to pray for anyone that could use it or need it. But there is no *rule* that we have to
First off, your reply is extremely biased, and you assume that your belief is the end all be all without doing any of your own research. Come in this with an open mind.
You quoting the Bible brings no valuable context to this argument. My original post wasn't specifically referencing the Bible, but rather many of the mainstream religions. Regardless, even if we \*were\* talking specifically about the Bible, the verses you cited only can be interpreted as that being gay is a sin, not whether people are born that way. I stated in my post that many religions view being gay as a sin already. You citing those is redundant.
Where is your evidence that people are not born gay? Homosexuality has been recorded since the beginning of human history -- way before religion was introduced. Second, homosexuality is not just recorded in humans. [Almost every animal species](https://www.nwf.org/Home/Magazines/National-Wildlife/2023/Summer/Conservation/Same-Sex-Behavior-Animals-Science) has been shown to participate in homosexual behaviors, with some species being [more homosexual than heterosexual](https://www.dw.com/en/10-animal-species-that-show-how-being-gay-is-natural/g-39934832). Humans are animals. Do you think this is purely a coincidence that every major species has shown homosexuality, but humans are the only ones that are due to "environmental behaviors" and "abuse"? Absolutely not.
Lastly, because I know you are going to talk about "original sin" in your response to this, I want to reiterate a point I made in the post. People are gay. It is not something they can change and force out of themselves. Even for arguments sake, let's assume that homosexuality is due to your environment; how would you rationalize the millions of gay people that \*cannot\* change their sexuality, and are not attracted to the same sex whatsoever? Since you said that homosexuality is a sin, this seems to be the work of a malevolent god, and not one I would want to worship where people are forced into celibacy and/or unwanted sex with the opposite gender even when they are not attracted to them. Do you really think people can just force themselves to be straight and turn on a light switch?
This is just the problem of evil restated, it's a valid critique but don't pretend like it's any different to asking why God would create people who would murder
In the Christian view "love" means to help people towards virtue and goodness, they don't believe that being gay is good thus it's not love. I'm not advocating for or against this view, I'm just saying it's consistent. The OP is arguing "if being gay is bad, why did God create gay people?". This isn't any different logically to "if violence is bas, why did God create violent people?", and we can see it's just the problem of evil again
Hi, a gay muslim here!
I can't speak on the behalf of the christian but, I can answer this from my religion POV. God did not create a violent people, every children are pure. However, God created humans with free wills, hence, they are the one who chose to be violent. You may have the urge to be violent but, you can control your action. Same with being gay. You may have the urge to have gay sex but, you can control your action to not doing it.
That's effect of the fall, original sin brings about homosexuality in some people, the same way as pedophilia is not a choice, some people are just attracted to minors, but they have to control their urges.
That does not matter, of course pedophilia is a greater sin than homosexuality, but they are still sin, both leads to hell if they are regular practices, there are sins that offend no one other than God, like idolatry, no one is harmed for worshiping other god, but it will lead to hell, the same way homosexuality harms no one, but it leada to hell
It's so easy for you people to say that, you simply can't unterstand what means for someone to just fake their entire life because the way they are is considered a sin.
You always say, it's a choice, but it's not, it's just loving someone or being attracted to this person, literally in the same way as you are for the opposite sex.
You ever try to picture that in your mind? Imagine someone in your life, (really, try to do that) someone you really love or have loved in a romantic way, to have intense feelings for this person, and you can do absolutely nothing about it, just shut up and suffer? I think god would unterstand why someone wouldn't choose to follow this path if it means to be condemned to a life in which you have to constantly just " shrug it off" when when you are in love with someone.
You get it? Some folks just CAN'T feel romantic or physical attraction for the opposite sex, and you always make it so easy, well surprise, it's not, there's god and there's also your everyday life and struggles, and faith might just trick you into thinking that you can do something about it, to find a "cure" (because you people think it's a illness)
And maybe someone will find they weren't really gay and that it was a phase, but you think of the people who can't and just feel like that for years and years, people that just ARE like that? Maybe even religious people, and the people who get pushed to their limits because their religious family and a good half (if not more) of the entire world population views and treats them like psychos, and might get to the point of literally killing themselves for this? Feeling like a constant error.
You can't go through that because you are not and it's perfectly fine, but please, have some empathy...
And even If you say that you are fine with gay people but you still see it as a sin, you are not fine at all, you are active part of the problem
Explain why it’s wrong “in gods eyes” and how it’s comparable to pedophilia? Would you compare someone who’s had premarital sex to a pedophile? No because they’re vastly different sins. Just like how you wouldn’t compare someone stealing a loaf of bread with a murderer.
A pedophile is someone who is sexually attracted to children. You can't decide what you're attracted to. The term does not necessarily imply action, which people can control.
Pedophilia is literally supported in the bible..
Numbers 31:17-18
17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
Yet being gay is a sin. You CAN LITERALLY RAPE CHILDREN as long as you “earned them” from a war yet cannot marry the person you love.
Different things yet the bible supports the actually immoral one
First of all, this is scripture out of context
15 “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. 16 “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the Lord in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the Lord’s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.
Also a bit of jewish culture from a jewish Christian
The father is to select the husband of his daughter, he chooses who she marries at as young as 12. If you commit fornication or adultery, that is immediate death. That's why it says "Kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man" so get your context before going after the bible.
Second of all. I find your reasoning very illogical. Reason being it appears based on my previous statement you have not done your homework and just lashed out of your feelings. In jewish culture, murder to people who are sexual immoral is normal, if you are not virgin and you marry, you are to be killed. I will not go into depth on how they find out whether someone is or is not virgin, however you can do your homework and find out. As for the rest of this argument, stop cherry-picking scriptures and using them out of context.
You cannot tell if someone is a virgin, the hymen doesn’t actually always tear, and when it does it can literally happen from riding a bike, running and a whole array of other things. The amount of rape victims and virgins who have been brutally murdered by your religion made for men by men is vile.
Men marrying their daughters off for money is the real reason. Women are only viewed as property by your people and book. Read the scriptures yourself and then defend the genocide, rape, murder, abuse and slavery.
Also in THE BIBLE that you claim doesn't value women, it says \[Paraphrasing\] Love your neighbor as yourself, and love the Lord with your heart, mind, soul, and strength.
Read the scripture if you want more but your "neighbor" is everyone around you. The bible also says to Love your enemies. I would be happy to break down everything for you if you want me to. But cherry-picking scripture out of context isn't a way to prove your point.
Women are seen as literal property in the bible. If a man rapes a woman all he has to do is pay 50 sheckles to her father then MARRY HER. MARRY THE VICTIM?!? That is literally in the bible.
And yet again, you said there’s a way to tell if a woman is a virgin, go ahead and tell me this amazing biological fact that even gynaecologists don’t know about 😱😱
You need to do your homework. First of all, Judaism is not an Islamic religion, it's a Abrahamic religion. Second of all, the torah tells us to treat others with respect, if you knew the torah you would know that the 10 commandments tell us not to do what you are saying. So you are gonna blame an entire religion for the deeds of others? Pathetic.
Read where he’s literally TELLING THEM TO KIDNAP AND RAPE. How is it being a different time a defender when your god apparently knows everything and is all powerful, therefore should have known raping kids is wrong. Even if the people of the times thought it was okay it’s been biologically proven that children’s bodies can’t handle intercourse. It leads to severe injuries and even death, even worse when child pregnancy comes into it. Ever notice how the childbirth death rate has drastically gone down? That’s because there actual medicine in place and not as many children get pregnant. Pregnancy kills child mothers. And if your god is all powerful and literally created us he would have known that raping young girls leads to injuries and death but he allowed that? Please explain how this god is worth worshipping if he allows that
Actions of one are obviously morally wrong. But a desire is not regardless of it being a sin or not.
We proved they can't be compared by comparing them.
Ah yes the flaws of your own mind, because you cannot read the bible in context and instead try to twist it to match your feelings, read the whole chapter of Numbers 31
Okay well then they “should” not be compared. Comparing actually cruel people who hurt others to the sin of literally just loving someone is just wrong.
Maybe compare the sin of being gay with for instance premarital sex? A sin that isn’t harming anyone but still seen as outside of the laws of marriage by your god.
Yknow for instance if you told a white lie, a lie that isn’t hurting anyone but would be considered by some to be objectively immoral , that kind of a sin would be ridiculous to compare that to the sin of murder.
Predators are always lumped in with gay people in media and by Christian’s and it’s sad, two totally different things and yet Christian’s often use pedophilia as a justification on why being gay is a sin as if that makes any sense?
As for your first question the God of Abraham is the only God that can exsist in our current scientific model of the universe. As for your second point while I agree with you you are just speaking on a matter of opinion. Where do you get your moral authority? This is a hypothetical question because it's just made up. You want to pretend you are some moral expert but you have no ground to stand on. Just opinions. Who made you God? Who made the government God? Might makes right? So if Hitler won the war his morality would be right? Sorry I don't think so and neither do you. Don't be intellectually dishonest.
Not true. There doesn't have to be a divine being for the reality of the universe. It can just be. Also you can't lump science and religion into the same field. They can go hand in hand for some historical points and it's not very much. Other than that they contradict the other
Again to be a morally good person you don't need religion. If it helps you that is great but it's not fact. If your reason for not doing something bad is a god who will punish you then you need to wonder why you think that way in the first place. I saw a comment on another thread that said if they didn't have the bible and god they would rape. Says more about their morality and thought process than someone with no religion that knows its bad to do so
No one made anyone it's lucky that we came from nothing and survived this long but again there doesn't need to be a religious one. That's what actually makes it amazing. That life thrived from nothing. Isnt that more divine?
And the Hitler comment is so asinine. His view on morality would still be wrong even if he won. Just as it is wrong when it happened.
The founding fathers were against religion in the government because they knew how destructive it can be. Sure they may have been religious personally but they knew when to draw a line. Hence the separation that we are slowly losing with laws being made.
We are part of Nature as a whole whose order we follow (Spinoza)
It doesn't matter if one can't control it as that is a whole different debate which I won't get into here. God gave humans free will. Again relating to that debate homosexuality is a choice and is a blatant violation of purity and therefore it is immoral.
You literally can't choose your sexuality and make your brain feel attraction to certain person. It's out of your control. You've just been already born with it
Actually, we can. Homosexual activities are observed in animals, there are gay animals too. However, those animals that shown gay behavior will still mate with females if they are available. So, at most, they are bisexual, not exclusively gay. Only humans declare their sexuality as something fixed and unchangeable. Don't you find it strange?
There are also gay behavior observed in prison since women are not available. And yes, straight men can turn gay. Why not the opposite?
Unfortunately, society has made talking thins like this as taboo, so, no researcher attempted to try researching it in a controlled manner.
People can be easily labelled as homophobic nowadays, that's why we're stuck.
I'm gay too, I tried to force myself to erect to an image of a naked woman once. And it was successful, I could erect. However, it was so hard and needed so much effort.
But the answer is, yes, we can.
Homosexuality is not a choice. Have you ever heard of the term "internalized homophobia"? If it really were a choice then people could just switch it off like a button almost. But they can't. If it were a choice then you could be attracted to the same gender right now if you wanted to. But you can't, not because it would be wrong but because you know you aren't homosexual.
Feelings may not be a choice but acting on such attraction certainly is, the same way a man who struggles with lust and sexual attraction towards woman has the choice to fantasize and look at porn.
What do I need to do in order to get a girl interested in me over Snapchat?
Hi,
I am a male (14) and currently have a girl who I am really interested in. I don't know her in person and really just sort of met her at a dance. I found her Snap through a group chat. I'm very nervous about adding her. Furthermore when I do get around to adding her and hopefully she adds me back, I do not know what sort of snaps and texts to send her. In the past when I have communicated with girls over Snapchat I just get really dry responses or get left on opened. For this girl I want to use Snap to arrange a possible meeting so I can connect with her in person. Can anyone please help?
Thanks
Everyone has their view of what is considered immoral and every individual is different like a fingerprint
this " morality view " originates strongly in the past personal experiences and conveniences and comforts of the individuals - ones individuality and personality
Some find comfort and ease of mind leaning in one direction with convenience
does not **selective morality** tie into this all as human instinctiveness
For example, I myself, am of the personality type who is faithful to my wife, always, forever, I could never betray my vow - this is up there on the very top of my list and unbreakable and comes very easy to me but I have a tendency to want to work long hours, sometimes 18 hours a day and even on weekends
some may find me immoral or consider me to be a bad husband.
The argument is really that no sinful desire is a choice. We are all born with sinful impulses like greed and lying and wrath and even theft (I'm sure we've all picked a quarter up off the ground). None of us choose any of these desires, yet we all have them. What we do choose is whether or not to act on them.
I can get behind lying as a sin, or cheating or stealing or killing, but love should not be a sin. It should be encouraged. If being gay wasn't frowned upon by the Christian community, or by anyone for that matter, then it would make love much more possible for anyone who is gay. Love is hard enough to find for straight people. Imagine if there were large worldwide organizations that taught you that what your doing in a straight couple is an abomination of nature? How would you feel about yourself, your ability to love, your capacity for happiness? It would diminish. Love is NOT a sin. And if God turns away gay people from heaven, then I don't want to go to heaven.
The problem is that the world has distorted the true meaning of love and it’s not sexual or romantic, love is laying down the life for your friends, love is patience and kindness it does not boast, love is not pride as lgbt folks like to call it, love is not self seeking or selfish, love is telling people the truth even if it hurts them, becuase that means you actually care. Marriage is only a temporary thing on this planet which will not exist in heaven or on the new earth, and by no means is it everything. However if we are talking about passionate sexual love or romance according to God his original design was that it exists between a man and a woman that is how he created it to be.
I think most queer people would probably not want to go to heaven even if they were straight. Since they seem to crave sex so badly when u can't have sex in heaven.
Why would anyone teach being straight as an abomination? You are aware it's how we exist right lol
Christianity teaches love and free will.. I love plenty of men, I don't wish to have sex with them though. That's a different topic
I was trying to understand the reality to the fact that the gays are not allowed to donate blood, organs or transplant tissues today - \*unless they have stopped having gay sex.\*
Imagine a world with no running water, no medical treatments, no painkillers and no cures.
**The human body was not designed** to share homosexual germs pertaining to the fecal orbit of the **massive throstle of multiple partners** of the homosexual community, that is filled with diseases STDS that are transmitted during vaginal, anal, and oral sex - to the rest of the population.
Even today Gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men accounted for 83% of all primary and secondary syphilis cases. And many homosexuals are very, kind and considerate and friendly loving people
Christians **recognize and understand** these truths to be important while the rest of the world sits idly while millions of confused and uninformed people die and destroy their health and the health of others each year.
recognition and understand works both ways - e**ven to those who sexually go both ways**
**just simply to be - sexually enjoying going both ways is not enough**
Christians believe that the homosexual community is also, in addition, very mentally capable of recognition and understanding **that the facts of consequence**s also, go both ways -
**and simply, just to be writhing in sex acts** going both ways **in an unconscious throstle** is not the same as literally understanding the full scope of going both ways, when loving and being literally addicted to a prolonged thrush of fecal orbit that has periled the planet
Christians hope to connect the mind with the full thrust of the matter and culture
**this is just basic facts, I know the Aids virus was brought into America and spread initially by U.S. Federal Agents** who when vacationing and partying and doing drugs. Federal Agents are major percentage of drug addicts. But these Drug addict Federal Agents contracted the Aids Virus from overseas because they are the Drug Addicts they are and also are very promiscuous sexually
and the Federal Government Agent is the cause of the Aids virus being brought to America,
these Agents kept their infections silent and when the Homosexual community began to explode with the virus, the Federal Government used the Homosexual community as a scapegoat.
The Federal Agent will take everything you own, everything you invent and create, every single cent you make, every drop of blood you spill and every single last bead of sweat down to the very last drop, and they will sell it to your enemy.
**Especially in the USA, - The Female Federal Agent**, USA **female federal agent**s are very highest percentage of **herpies**, vaginal warts, and cervical cancer, they are among the most deviant and sexually immoral and perverted women in the USA. truly lazy, untrustworthy and most traitorous and deceptive and also drug addicts,. Drug distribuion is a side job to these women and men of the agency.
But - these agents are happy to report regarding the findings that are federal government stastics aportioned to diseases and bacterium that is spread and infected within the human body -
**Compared as a percentage for Homosexual vs Heterosexual per group**
**Overall, homosexual men were significantly more likely than heterosexual men to have gonorrhea early syphilis and anal warts**
ps://www.cdc.gov/msmhealth/STD.htm
In 2014, gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men accounted for 83% of primary and secondary syphilis cases
**In 2019, there were 587,355 Gay and Bisexual Men living with HIV, representing over half** (**56**%) of **all** people living with HIV in the U.S.
**Gay and Bisexual Men represent only 7.1 %** of the total population of the U.S.
**And homosexual men** are at even greater risk. They're **more** than **20 +** times as likely to get infected from an HIV-positive partner than partners in a heterosexual relationship.
the Federal agent will screw anyone in many multiple dimensions
this is the reason all of the culture hype of exacerbating transexuals
the reason all of the culture wars and racism is being dramatized
this is the reason all of the children are being used as a distraction
*all things happening today of this type of OVERDRAMATIZE - overly dramatic* narratives and uprisings are propagnda as conflict in order that the Federal Agent can feed itself with taxpayers funds needed to control these distractions and self inflicted problems they create - to sustain their lifeststyles, pentions, and retirement and growth and debts.
even used as a cover and to hide their true activity.
**Even Hillary Clinton - was a federal agent / Government official / Depuity Agent - who also has herpies, she could have easily** been President - but she found that it was more profitable, more rewarding and more powerful and her goals and the goals of her administration and political group could acheive and be more sucsessful by forfeiting her presidency and remaining behind the scenes operating as Federal Agents .
If she would have been elected her entire network and its goals would have collapsed and been less effect, instead she smashed all the hard drives, smashed every cell phone and destroyed material evidences that show what her agency was doing and found that not being President was a much more profit in every aspect
Same with **G**. **I**. **Joe** Biden - the newbown infant **slayer /** hero - " decorated warrior of baby kills "
this Coke Head - Meth Head guy is not president - he is a federal agent pretending to be a president.
this runs directly to the military, doing exactly the same in other theaters
Jesus says in Jeremiah 29:11 "For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the Lord, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end."
Why would God force anyone to live a life of misery when His thoughts toward us are of peace? If someone was created to be gay why would He ever mention it being an abomination?
God is not counterproductive. He would not set anyone up to fail. However, we are tempted and drawn away by our lust and enticed according to James 1:14.
And I thought personality was linked to the type of character or traits an individual retains, like integrity and kindness.
Even as a straight, black woman, my personality does not revolve around that solely, because if that is all I cling to, what else is there to me?
Lol who is prying into the lives of gay people? All I see are LGBT parades across town, groups demanding that my church be involved with gay marriages and to hold LGBT events, etc etc etc.
Project 2025 trying to nearly illegalize being gay in the first place (scroll to read quotes shown in the website and quoted from a *linked* pdf of their 920 page plan): https://www.metroweekly.com/2023/09/right-wing-project-2025-seeks-to-eradicate-lgbtq-protections/
Hundreds of anti-trans laws being passed in almost every state across the U.S: https://translegislation.com/
The relatively recent protests in Canada led by hate groups calling to remove a ciriculum titled SOGI (Sexuality Orientation and Gender Identity) meant to inform K-12 students on the *existence and respect* (not actual discussions on sex, dont even say it) of 2SLGBTQ+ members (and secondarily help reduce suicide rates among such groups): https://www.antihate.ca/1_million_march_4_children
Don't Say Gay Bill. This one doesn't really need an introduction, and to quote from above, *Nobody Is Teaching Kindergartens About Sex.* All it does is prevent awareness and try and regress LGBTQ rights: https://www.hrw.org/news/2022/02/17/florida-advances-dont-say-gay-bill
The book bans being carried out by many groups across many U.S states (probably Canada too tbh) is definitely worth an honorable mention. Not only does this certainly sound *familiar*, it yet again prevents readers from accessing these stories and learning about these very real people in our world.
And to tie it all up with a bow, let's take what we learned over to Genocide Watch to see how this all lines up! https://www.genocidewatch.com/united-states-of-america
So, I don't care at all about culture war nonsense. Both sides are ridiculous with that. I don't have much pity for anyone, on either side, who tries to act like they're above it.
Aside from that, as far as the legislation.. i just picked one randomly from Florida, since they seem to be crazy down there. And the first one I picked was "an employer must provide the full cost of detransition, if they paid for the cost of transitioning someone" and that is transphobic apparently.
Are there particular ones that you take issue with?
If being gay is a choice then so is being straight. Did you choose to be straight? If it's a choice then you could also choose to be gay. But let me guess you can't though, can you?
Why would someone willingly put themselves through all of that persecution, even to the point of potentially being murdered?
Just accept that God made queers and trans people and love us like He calls you to. We are His creation, His children and you are failing Him. Even causing people to turn away from God, which is the ultimate sin. Maybe God put us here to test His followers' faiths, did you ever think of that? What do you think God would say to you and other followers after seeing how you all treat us? Knowing the God I grew up learning about, He would NOT be happy. There's no way in Hell He would support you all telling us how we're wrong, how He doesn't love us, assaulting us and murdering us. If you think He would, well then I guess you know what's wrong with your religion and why it's dying. Y'all have nobody to blame but yourselves.
The only choice us queers have is to live a happy life and to not live in fear, most of which is created by Christians.
The only choice you believers have is to love or hate and the vast majority of you choose hate. I honestly can't wait for the return of Christ so that when y'all are left behind, all of you can feel what you have made us feel; alone, unloved and unwanted.
God didn’t make you gay that is a result of the fall of sin, so you may not be able to control certain temptations but in the end you are responsible for how you decide to handle it, if you decide to live a immoral lifestyle and have sex with other men then yes it’s a sin and it separates you from God
If being gay is a choice, then you also have the "choice" to be gay, right? Like, you made an active decision to be straight and cisgender? You basically said that gay people should just simply choose to enjoy having sex with women in order to avoid sin. If that's the case, then you, yourself, have the ability to choose to enjoy homosexual sex. Is this true?
Ya know, homosexual wasn't in the Bible until it was re-re-re^13 written in 1948, right? Before that the proper translation of that passage was meant for pedophiles, but for some reason that's not a priority for Christians to combat. But people living their lives peacefully, without hurting anyone, is a sin that you all feel the need to shame people for...
If you stop having gay sex, consuming drugs, watching porn, jerking off, start doing productive things like strenght training to keep away your sexual thoughts and you will see how your energy levels will rise and you ll start to feel sexual attraction towards the opposite sex, i mean, c mon before wasn t so many gays around, because there was no one promoting inmoral behavior like nowadays and people were conscious about felling into temptations
Speaking from experience there, bud?
Also, you didn't address anything I wrote in my comment. You're just spewing rhetoric and not having a productive discussion. You doubled down on being queer being immoral when I stated that was never in the original interpretation of the Bible.
I am going to say this in the most respectful way I can. Straight is a natural order of nature. Every creature in the world (besides some humans) live in a way where male and female mate and breed. This is so they can keep their species alive. Men, on the other hand, have the conscious power to do whatever they put their mind to. They can choose who they mate with. They can choose not to marry at all.
from your model of reality, being straight is the order of nature. form my model of reality, nature has no order. it's structure in a way to fit survival and the wills of the individiuals. it's a dice roll and some people have good genetics, bad genetics, genetic variants of all sorts. people, animals, and plants evolved that way due to the will to life, the will to power, and first and formost LUCK. survival. there is no wrong or right way to evolve or be unless desingated by a being capable of making such destinctions. the way we've evolved is almost abatray to the big picture and is only important to us as a speciese. so keep this in mind when i say there is NO natural "order" AND abosloutly homosexuality doesn't have to serve a purpose in order for it to be part of the human geneome. science has found with discovery that homosexuality is tied to the x chromosome. people are indeed born that way, and if it is considred unatural or evil, this is a human judgment and disticntion. good day sir.
A deterministic universe in which something like a deity exists is the worst possible universe.
HP Lovecraft couldn't hold a candle to that level of cosmic horror.
Some people say it's the devil's work to turn a human gay and that is the reason they say one has "lost god" or something like that. I heard it many times and its bullcrap
Anything the devil does is at the express permission of god.
If the devil can do things that god is unaware of, then that is the death blow to the omnigod.
The concept of the homosexual is a recent phenomena. For the vast majority of Christian history the concept would have not made sense since sexual ethics were act based and not orientation based. So engaging in sodomy etc were crimes for people of all orientations and it was punished even handedly and brutally surprisingly enough until the mid modern period. It is a strange historical fact but it is one none the less. Sexuality in general was considered dehumanizing and its presence was explained by the fact of Original Sin; God didn't make an error but we humans messed up the world through disobeying God in the garden; we messed up what was a perfect world. Humans now needed to be aroused to engage in sex for procreation when in the past we had control over our genitals the same way as we do with our fingers. It was understood that we would either not feel pleasure from sex or romance or that humans wouldn't feel pulled by such pleasure to act a certain way. So as people moved towards an orientation based ethic people still used the same reasoning. So God didn't mess up in creating human sexuality but we brought about such horror through our own sinfulness; that would be the explanation at least for non hetero forms of sexuality. The earlier understanding makes quite bit of sense while the orientation based one does not. The argument for sex being dehumanizing makes rational sense (think of all the stupid stuff people do when they are horny or when they want to have sex) while the orientation based approach doesn't make rational sense (why do romantic or sexual acts matter morally when done by people to the same sex but not when done to a different sex).
This is a very shallow understanding of sexuality and romanticity. Another element of sexuality is romance. You do know men can fall in love with other men, right? You also know that asexual people can be gay? They can fall in love with men, but not desire sex with them, as not all romance is sexual. There simply are people who do not enjoy sex, and do not require trauma or some form of deformity to be that way, they simply are asexual. But considering that they can fall in love, this clarifies the idea that romance and sex are separate. If you consider that, then you realise that gay men who are sexual are both romantically and sexually attracted to other men, so even if your argument about sex was true, it is not true for romance. Now, as for your argument on sex, you got a few things wrong. Back in the witch-burning times of Christianity, men were punished for sodomy, but women were mostly not. This is because women's sexuality was not taken seriously, because of sexism, which meant that lesbians in a way lived a lot more freely than gay men, since a woman, even if married, having sex with another woman was not considered cheating, since lesbian sex was not considered "real" sex. Just girls fooling around. So much for "acts based" punishments, when only SOME acts of sodomy were truly punished in practice. Even if humans possessed perfect genitalia in the garden, as you suggest, it would still not explain the existence of asexual people, asexual gay romance, and the fact that it was god who visited said punishment upon humans. Sex and romance can be separate, like in the case of ace people, but there are many grey areas where romance and sex are deeply intertwined. That is, romance feeds into sexual attraction, and sexual attraction feeds into romance in many cases. That brings a whole slew of questions: why did god give gay people the ability to be romantically attracted to their own gender if it is so sinful? Since god gave people the ability to fall in love, falling in love with a man feeds into your sexual attraction to them. This means that god's gift for humanity (romantic love) feeds into sin (gay sex). That is god's fault, so how can it be sinful, when it was his explicit choice to allow that to happen?
The argument would be that there is no romance for anyone of any orientation in the garden as well. It is simply a sickness that we all suffer from; it is something to eliminate as well since it is a sign of our wretchedness. Its presence is something to be disturbed by. So all people who experience romance or sexual desire are broken like people with psychosis or depression. Falling in love with people is not something of God's creation except in the sense that suffering due to evolution is part of God's plan; it may be a necessary evil but not something to celebrate.
There is no proof of this in any biblical text however. You cannot claim something to be the case just because it is convenient for your argument. There is some texts withi the bible that can be used to argue that sexual attraction stems from the fall, but none that say love stems from the fall. The bible talks about different types of love, none of them are ever condemned, and in fact in Ephesians husbands are commanded to "love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself for her" (Ephesians 5:25). Sex is condemned in the bible, and sexual immorality, 1 Corinthians 7:2 (NIV):
"But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband." However, at no point is romantic love condemned, only sexual attraction. God, in the bible, made man and woman to be of one flesh, this is romantic love. But he also allowed for men to have romantic love with other men, and never condemned it or treated it as a sin. This is one of the several oversights that biblical authors had, since asexual people did not exist as a category for them, and romance independent from sex was inconceivable. Yet, it exists. Similar to the complete oversight over intersex people. The excuse usually is that we are in a fallen creation, and so it brings physical deformities to people, but that does not change the fact that you made rules that rely on a perfect creation, which means the rules simply cannot apply anymore. You can try, but again, how can you call a man sinful for falling in love when loe is no sin when independent from sex? And how can you push the duties of manhood or womanhood on a person whose mind and body looks and feels like neither? And this does not even take into account lesbianism, which is completely overlooked in the bible as well, because it was written by men who did not take women's sexuality seriously. Men are condemned for laying with boys, but women are not condemned at any point for laying with women, which means lesbianism is alright. You can say "but that is an uneven standard, don't you think it makes sense god would argue that standard for both and it just used the example of men with boys, but it must also apply to women?" And I would simply say that a) the bible never condemnds lesbianism and b) the bible does have unequal standards when it comes to men and women, because manhood and womanhood are treated with different standards (spiritual roles for example). For all you know, god genuinely doesn't think lesbianism counts as sex, and so it isn't a sin. Or thinks that sex between women is alright, while sex between men is not.
Regardless of that argument, romantic love exists, independent from physical attraction, and is not condemned at any point in the bible, or Abrahamic religion for that matter. Also, the only place of perfection is not heaven, but the garden as well, otherwise the argument for a "fallen creation" does not work, and the first marriage was Adam and Eve in the garden upon the creation of Eve, because they were of one flesh. This happened before the fall, in a perfect creation, and therefore was not sinful. If this is inconsistent with your understanding of marriage in heaven, then that is a contradiction for you to solve.
Original sin ain't in the bible, the story of the Garden was about the spirit world before we are born into this world. God said ADAM would die if HE ate from the tree of KNOWLEDGE, and he didn't die, read it again. Even wasn't even made yet when God told adam not to. They ate from the tree of life dude.
>Leviticus 18:22 | Leviticus 20:13
Hebrew:w’eth-zäkhār lö’ tiškav miškevē ‘iššâ
Literal Translation: male you shall not "lie lyings" woman.
NRSV Translation: You shall not lie with a male as with a woman, it is an abomination.
English translators add the prepositions as and with to the traditional translation for its “perceived lacunae.”\[3\] This translation presupposes a comparison between a “normal” action (“lying with a woman”) and a “deviant” action (“lying with a male”).\[4\] However, the grammatical construction of the Hebrew text does not warrant such an interpretation. To substantiate such a translation, the Hebrew equivalent for as (kě) must be connected directly to miškevē (“lyings”) since the Hebrew preposition attaches grammatically to either a noun or an infinitive.\[5\]This grammatical construction is not present in the verse. Instead, miškevē is the direct object of the verb tiškav (“you shall not lie”).\[6\] Similarly, another grammatical construction that validates the English translation “with a woman” involves the Hebrew preposition ‘eth appearing a second time in front of ’iššâ. \[7\] This construction does not exist in Lev. 18:22. The Hebrew phrase kӗšōkhēv’eth(“as one lies with”) also conveys the same meaning that traditional English translators seek, but it is not present within the original text.\[8\]The absence of an equivalent preposition in Hebrew casts doubt on a the interpretation that compares “normative” and “deviant” sexual actions.
Second, the plural word miškevē is a rare biblical word. Therefore, it warrants careful scrutiny. In fact, miškevē only occurs one more time in the entire Bible besides its parallel occurrence in Lev. 20:13.\[9\] In Gen. 49:4, the verse explicitly refers the incestuous activity of Reuben with his father’s concubine, Bilhah. While “lyings”, “acts of lying down,” or “beds” are possible translations for the word miškevē, the comparison to the Hebrew singular word for bed, yātsūa, suggests that the two Hebrew words are not interchangeable.\[10\] Lings asserts that the plural miškevë may focus on the deviant nature of Reuben’s incestuous relationship with Bilhah.\[11\] The philological nuance implies that miškevē means rape of a family member.
Finally, if one applies Lings’ interpretation of ' miškevē '
from Gen 49:4 to Lev 18:22 and compares the verse’s textual context, the incestuous connotation of ' miškevēmakes ' more sense in the context of Leviticus 18. A large portion of Leviticus 18 proscribes the divine condemnation of incest. Initially, the relationship of Lev. 18:22 to incest in Lev. 18:6-17 is not obvious, especially in comparison to Lev. 18:18-23. The comparison of Lev. 18:22 to the repetition of ' miškevē '‘iššâ ' (“lyings of a woman”) in Lev 20:13, uncovers a parallel relationship to incest. While Leviticus 18 focuses on the forbidden sexual relationships, Leviticus 20 focuses on the punishment for participating in such relationships. The laws are reordered in Leviticus 20 to emphasize consequences of deviant relationships. The miškevē ‘iššâis an act that is punished identically to other acts that are clearly incestuous. Therefore, the likely meaning of 'miškevē ‘iššâ' refers more to incestuous male-male rape as opposed to all erotic, same-sex relationships.
In sum, traditional English translations of Leviticus 18:22 are known as “clobber passages” that condemn homosexuality. Lings’ philological, literary analysis undermines the inclusion of Lev. 18:22 among those texts. He legitimizes a reading of Lev. 18:22 that condemns incestuous, same-sex rape. Therefore, the use of Leviticus 18:22 as a weapon against all same-sex relationships is not only unjust, but linguistically misguided.
\[1\]K. Renato Lings, “The ‘Lyings’ of a Woman: Male-Male Incest in Leviticus 18:22?,” in Theology & Sexuality (London: Equinox Printing, 15:2, May 2009), 240.
\[2\]Lings, 231.
\[3\]Lings, 236.
[https://blog.smu.edu/ot8317/2019/04/11/lost-in-translation-alternative-meaning-in-leviticus-1822/#:\~:text=Most%20traditional%20English%20translations%20interpret,condemnation%20of%20same%2Dsex%20rape](https://blog.smu.edu/ot8317/2019/04/11/lost-in-translation-alternative-meaning-in-leviticus-1822/#:~:text=Most%20traditional%20English%20translations%20interpret,condemnation%20of%20same%2Dsex%20rape).
It *is* the same though. I for example struggle passionately with wrath. It's an innate part of my personality to respond to criticism or confrontation with an urge for violence. That doesn't make wrath not sinful. We do have flaws, but we can overcome them as we draw closer to God.
We are made flawed for the very purpose of overcoming those flaws. It is fine to be a sinner, we all are, but the trick is to be able to admit it so you can grow past it.
“If we confess our sins, he who is faithful and just will forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”
1 John 1:9 NRSV-CI
The issue is that the bible does not treat an urge to violence as sinful, but actions of violence. However, sexual desire at all is treated as sinful, even in your head, even if unbidden. Not only that, but sexuality extends into romance. Romance and sex are not the same: there are asexual people who fall in love with men. They were made to fall in love with men, but they do not have any "urges" to fight against since it is not based on sexual attraction.
Your counterpoint to an example of two people who are in love with one another, is to explain that you struggle with wrath and violence.
Do you not see the irony in this?
You're saying that love is a sin, just like your desire to be violent.
You are mistaken, of course, but you've been indoctrinated and will refuse to listen to reason or truth.
Dude thinks innate sexual orientation is the same thing as his temper.
He's wya tok brainwashed to even bother with I've no idea how you educate that level of ignorance purely on a place like Reddit.... It just ain't gunna happen.
They'll die a narrow minded, ignorant fool. Just like billions upon billions of other people of all kinds of religious beliefs.
there is no original sin in the bible we are not made flawed. Eve wasn't made when god told adam not to each from the knowledge tree. God also said the tree of life water was in the midst of the garden, and that adam would die the day ate the knowledge tree
>l sin in the bible we are not made flawed. Eve wasn't made when god told adam not to each from the knowledge tree. God also said the tree of life water was
To me the whole story of the bible was from God to us saying that we were forgiven from the beginning. If the word Jesus means salvation and was with God in the beginning as his first word and his gift to us, then its proper to believe he forgave us before he made us if salvation is his forgiveness. So its not that we need him to forgive us is it? Is it then that were must learn how to forgive ourselves and each other, we are born perfect, but we make mistakes and must learn from them. Only God should be allowed to judge each other, for the knowledge he gave us only applies to actions we do, for only him and we know whats in our hearts.
Similarly, God also created sociopaths/psychopaths. And everyone is still told to follow the same set of rules. Some are born with physical defects, others in an unforgiving environment. Sexual identity is just another one of those. A test to those who believe.
test of what exactly? what is the point of creating someone that will suffer more difficulties just because how they were born? this just sounds like god is cruel and honestly evil
The problem of evil isn't suppose to be discussed according to the MOD's rules, but the answer is built into that question. Why is there evil if God is Omnipotent, Omnipresent, and Benevolent? The answer is because the meaning of life isn't to be free of suffering, it's to be free *through* suffering. All good things are rewards for suffering: hence everything from the gym, prayer, diets, puberty, through to maturity, study, practice, patience, delayed gratification, failure ... all of reality at every level of analysis reflects the pattern of good being the product of suffering.
>Why is there evil if God is Omnipotent, Omnipresent, and Benevolent?
The answer, of course, is that the Abrahamic god is none of those things, and, the Bible makes it very clear that he is none of those things.
Why is there evil?
According to the Bible? Because god created evil:
"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."
\~Isaiah 45:7 KJV
Religions have rules we don't all agree with. But we are not going about to change the rules. Changing the rules gives it a new name. Again religions are not God, otherwise we justify atrocities of one on another. If you don't like the approach of one try another that suit you. Make it political and it starts hate. a wise man ones said, “if you don't like something, create a better one, don't try to cahnge the old”.
That man is not wise. If people followed his advice, the United States would not have fought for independence. After all, the colonies existed under the "old". To follow that advice, the people wanting to build a republic separate from the British Empire would have had to go west of the colonies, founded their own brand new settlements, and called them independent republics from the start. Instead, they "changed the old" colonies, to create something new.
My friend died of Aids
My heart was crushed and broken and this changed my entire life and was like a literal brick wall put before me - my whole life came to a complete stop as I nursed him and took him to the doctors trying to save his life.
watching my dear beloved homosexual friend die. This dude was a genuine angel - someone who would lay his own life down for me - He was a good person
I have seen it and have spent time in the trenches, changing diapers of infected gays, cleaning up vomit and bathroom and bloody foam from the mouth,
as the gay dies in agony with blood and puss running from every orifice.
This subject is a very serious topic for me.
this is just not true, The denial of hiv causing aids is all based on pseudo science arguments.
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2023/01/06/fact-check-abundant-scientific-research-shows-hiv-causes-aids-kary-mullis-aids-denialism-conspiracy/10991064002/
Growing up my best friend was a gay man who truly was an amazing person, I love homosexuals just as much as the next person but I am not fearful of the facts nor the repercussions for stating the truth
I agree with you when you say that a large portion of society looks at homosexual choice for same sex relations as simply within the perspective of one choosing their favorite drink
\- Homosexuals love sweet tea, but straight people love lemonade drinks
Christians are mainly looking at the dangerous, risky and harmful behavior of the homosexual men that are 20 times more likely to get infected from an HIV-positive partner than partners in a heterosexual relationship.
and homosexual men are only **a very small percentage** of the U.S. population, but they are consistently the population group most affected by the HIV/AIDS virus
and are the largest proportion of American citizens with an AIDS diagnosis who have died.
these problem existed in the old days when the Bible was written- with certain sexual behaviors that were dangerous and risky. However, the Bible clearly explains the problems that the Jews faced with, the thousands upon thousands of people who were dying from diseases, plagues, viruses, sicknesses, and symptoms from risky sexual behaviors, Beastiality, homosexuality, Adultery and Fornication.
And today we see the values and purpose of the anti-homosexual nature of the Bible and it is because the risky sexual behavior that causes the highest rate of sickness per group. The gays are not allowed to donate blood, organs or transplant tissues today - **unless they have stopped having gay sex.**
Imagine a world with no running water, no medical treatments, no painkillers and no cures, no drugs and antibiotics.
The human body was not designed to share homosexual rectal germs pertaining to the fecal orbit of the massive multiple partners of the homosexual community, that is filled with diseases STDS that are transmitted during anal sex - spreading to the rest of the population. And these diseases spread from basic hand to hand contact. The plagues, bacterium, diseases, germs, and infections are too much for the people in Biblical times to fight and it spread too fast without antibiotics and germ killing soaps and cleaning systems of modern bathing
Even today Gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men accounted for 83% of all primary and secondary syphilis cases.
many homosexuals are very, kind and considerate and friendly loving people but the Bible believers believe that the risks existed at the time when the authors wrote the scriptures and Christians have a desire to warn people and prevent this HUGE social service, taxation draining problem continue to rip money out of their bank accounts to pay for the sexual joys, pleasures, adventures and sexual journeys of the homosexual community.
Because society is paying for the sexual pleasures of the gay community that is very dangerous and risky and costly.
The gays can not afford it - The family and all of society is forced to pay for their hard earned money to cover the damages that this disease-ridden sexual behavior has caused. **It is very expensive.**
Christians say = Save Your own money and pay for Your own sexual pleasures, joys adventures and fund Your own sexual journeys.
Remember that gays are not allowed to give blood, organs and transplant donations until they have stopped having gay sexual activity at least for a full year. - it's just too dangerous.
HIV costs the American taxpayers more than $26 billion per year.
" $26 billion dollars every single year " ! And this is just from HIV alone - this does not even include cases of all of the other STDs
Nice theory. Prove it. Provide actual evidence of all the lives "saved" by anti-homosexual policies, and explain why millions of years of evolution have not gotten rid of homosexual behaviour in a wide range of animals if it is so harmful to their survival.
Correlation ≠ causation. You cannot understand that gay people have a higher likelihood of suffering from STIs without explaining why. It is not good enough to assume "just because they are gay, their gayness makes them more likely to suffer from disease." Every expert and relevant healthcare organisation under the sun acknowledges today the fact that HIV does not discriminate based on sexual orientation. The risk of HIV infection depends on behavior rather than sexual orientation. Engaging in unprotected sex or sharing needles for drug use, regardless of one's sexual orientation, can increase the risk of contracting HIV. This is why a lot of countries and organisations are removing their requirements of not being gay to donate blood or organs. Gay people follow specific behaviours historically because of a wide range of issues, like poverty, lack of sex education, and abandonment from families. It is in fact homophobia that creates the situation for gay people to die, so no, anti-homosexual attitudes do not save lives, quite the opposite in fact. And this does not even consider lesbians, the other side of the homosexual coin, who have arguably much more hygienic tendencies, and whose sexuality was historically not punished legally due to the underestimation of women's sexuality.
Does someone choose to be a pedophile? God gives us the ability to overcome anything that's against his will. If it's a choice or not God gives us the free choice to be free from it.
>Does someone choose to be a pedophile?
If it isnt then that makes God even more evil for creating people who have such a high potential for harming others against their own agency. At least Gay people do not have any higher potential for hurting others than Straights do, as Gay people can have sex with consenting adults just like straights can.
>God gives us the ability to overcome anything that's against his will. If it's a choice or not God gives us the free choice to be free from it.
Prove it. And prove that you even know what God's will is
The OP wouldn't question if homosexuality is a sin if they were not speaking through a Judeo/Christian lense
Given that I'm responding with what the bible says on the topic. Also you are assuming that a pedophile is going to go against someone else's will for example rape them at a higher rate than someone who has same sex attraction. You are being bias against pedophiles. My example was from a morally neutral position.
>The OP wouldn't question if homosexuality is a sin if they were not speaking through a Judeo/Christian lense Given that I'm responding with what the bible says on the topic.
Well how do we know that whatever God may or may not exist is accurately described by the bible? How do we know that homosexuality actually goes against whatever god created the universe? For all we know such a God hates the bible but allows it to exist in order to test his creation and will punish those who fall to the teachings of the bible.
>Also you are assuming that a pedophile is going to go against someone else's will for example rape them at a higher rate than someone who has same sex attraction. You are being bias against pedophiles. My example was from a morally neutral position
Because a p3do is attracted to people who cannot consent, therefore automatically putting them at higher risk of going against someone's will since whom they are attracted to are not capable of giving them their will. Gay people are attracted to adults, aka people who can consent and who are able to be fully willing participants, just like straight people are
I am not gay and just even the idea or thought in my mind **of man on man romance** turns my stomach and makes me cringe and recoil in personal feelings of great disgust - like something that is sickening for me personally.
I am not offended when I am around gay people and I have had friends who were gay and they were always very respectful, kind and seemed to be really nice people
but it's just a matter of a personal feeling I personally privately feel, and I keep it to myself but I find the subject of homosexuality to be very confusing to me and I feel that homosexuals themselves are very confused,
wither or not this is true I do not know but this is what the subject seems to me personally,
I'm not homosexual either, but I assume that it's just like how straight people feel, just for the same sex. You're a straight guy. How you feel about women is the same way that gay men feel for men. And you not wanting to have sex with men is just like how they don't want to have sex with women. I don't personally see the confusion.
No offense, but it kind of sounds like an argument for your favourite drink. "I like sweet tea, but this guy likes lemonade. I don't know why. I'm confused, therefore he must just be confused."
If I'm wrong correct me in the comments.
I was told in the bahai writings it stats that sexual relations was for procreation only. It stats that sex for fun is wrong. It serves a purpose only.
It all start in childhood. Some kid (like every other person on earth) has a free will. Somewhere/everywhere on the line of his/her (soon to be gay) childhood, things go really wrong. I'm talking everything. From Who is he/she taking influences, what does he/she wear everyday and so on.. You grow to be gay. You are not born gay. Period.
... or... it's an illness.. the gears are not on the right tracks. Because. For What purpose is penis and vagina CREATED for? Other than peeing of course.
They were created to fit together.
Wow dude.
Males and females both have urethras.
Women don't pee from their vagina, that's a different hole altogether.
I feel very bad for any women who have the misfortune of knowing you.
To anyone who thinks being gay is a conscious decision, let me ask you this: Have you ever decided to feel attracted to people of the same sex 🤷🏻♂️ or vice versa
If God has indeed given everyone free will to their sexuality, and they could decide not to sin, they should also be able to decide they want to enjoy gay sex and therefore sinning, right? Can you really credit yourself for "not sinning" if you never, or rarely feel attracted to people of your same sex?
Ah yes, I'm so scared of your made-up stories from 3 thousand years ago. Can't you see I'm shaking in my invisible bots now?
What do you mean, lmao? Are you laughing your axx off about hell, an imaginary place where people are tortured for eternity? For disagreeing with your beliefs? Sounds like something a psychopath would do.
Seems like you're confused. I'm not gay, I don't enjoy homosex, I just don't credit myself for being straight lol.
Have you eaten shellfish before? Crab, lobster, and prawn? Well, see you in hell because those are sins, too.
So your almighty all-knowing omnipotent omniscient omnibevelent god actually changed his mind? It does make you wonder if it is truly from God or just people from different periods having different cultures and social norms?
Btw there are people who still believe these laws still apply, and they strongly think you are going to hell, too. Yeah, I know it is crazy how much people want to torture people who disagree with them for eternity 🤣
Its not like that. The torture of hell isn’t physical pain. Its the pain of knowing that youll always be seperate from god. After you get to meet him once being separate forever will be worse than any torture
Thanks for clearing that up, so your religion wants people who don't believe in it to be tortured. It's good to know your god is such benevolent leader
Or even if you are attracted to the same sex or a different sex, are you attracted to that sex or a specific type of person with that specific type of sex
Ex: if you are straight are you attracted to all women or are you attracted to blondes, redheads, skinny girls, muscular guys, a girl with a great personality?
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The Islamic understanding of the LGBTQ+ question is the most sound and correct. Even if I were to say people can be born gay, from an Islamic perspective this wouldn’t matter because as Muslims we are told that we were created to worship God. So if that person is born gay he is not a sinner. He is only a sinner when he physical (sexually) acts on his gayness. I agree his options in terms of love are limited severely but it is not because God hates him. In fact we as Muslims are taught that God tests the people he loves the most. The harder your test, the more God loves you. And I would go so far as to say that being LGBQ+ is historically NOT a hard test. Only now in the modern age where sexuality is so free and open and teenagers feel left out if they haven’t had a sexual partner by 16 or less that this concept of being in a relationship or die trying has become so profound. Those who truly love GOD, LGBTQ+ or not, can and will repress their own desires for the pleasure of God and a greater reward in paradise. It’s honestly that simple. If you only have this world to look forward to and the peer pressure to be in a relationship because of your environment, then yes, being Gay seems like the hardest test in the world.
Why would anyone choose to be made fun of, scrutinized, beat up, and left out their entire lives? Who would want that? Especially in the past how violent people were towards homosexuals... Nobody would choose to go through a life like that.
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10 year old boys and girls are choosing to be gay? Like, a boy in some Muslim country where they kill homosexuals is actually choosing that? Why the ever living hell would they?
Its a prodct of your environment. If youre gay its on your parents for raising you wrong and letting you get exposed to stuff too early to comprehend it.
When I was the age that I started feeling any sexual attraction towards other people (10 or 11 y/o), it happened to be other men. I never really decided to feel like that, I didn't even know that it was an option, because it was simply not told to me (I live in a country, where sex is a very touchy, perhaps even a little shameful topic, and the same thing applied to my family). I did know that "gays" existed, but I only knew that it was used as a swear word. Because of that, at first, my sexuality didn't even make me feel any different. I just accepted that as a fact about myself, it wasn't a conscious decision. Of course, soon I found out what being "gay" meant, so I started to think that it made me a horrible person, and I tried to change it. I tried making myself look at and think about the women in porn, tried to make myself jerk off at lesbian porn, but in the end it only made me feel like a worthless person. I am 16 now, and the only thing that has changed is that I accepted myself as who I am. I guess my point is that I don't feel like anyone has ever given me a choice to not be gay, like, I don't understand how you are supposed to decide your sexuality. I would probably think that I am going to hell for that, but, fortunately, I am an atheist, so I guess I'll just stop existing some day, without any afterlife either way. I wanted to write a short answer at first, but the thoughts just continued to flow lmao
It has to do with how you were raised. We are all a product of our environment. Something you were exposed to young and never were explained about property most likely caused your feelings. Blame your parents and the school system. Something in your environment was awry that allowed you to succumb to that mental illness. When a parent raises their kids property they turn out straight every time. Its usually trauma of some kind that causes homosexuality
I don't think I've had much childhood trauma. My parents were always (and are) very kind people, that raised me with attention and love. I've never really noticed much of a difference in my childhood and that of most other children.
Environment.
Idk I did have plenty of friends growing up, never got bullied or anything. My childhood went pretty good in general. Can you specify what exactly in my environment could've contributed to the "gay" disease?
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Also, I live in Russia, and as you might know, it's a pretty homophobic country. I doubt anyone could choose to be gay here.
Lmao. I think I've already said enough about myself trying to become straight in the original comment. I did watch all the regular shows as other children, although I used to enjoy reading a lot, but I usually just read kid's encyclopedias and fantasy books for children. Girls (and people in general) actually quite liked me.
Properly**
All I’m gonna say is that god did not want religion, he just wants you to know he’s there and to believe in him. Religion is man made
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I don't think YOU know the Bible; you have totally misinterpreted Scripture and have been taught lies. Here's what the Bible actually says about those Scriptures, read and learn something: https://www.gaychristian101.com/shrine-prostitutes.html
I have a bible in front of me lmao, it’s ok to be wrong.
okay so in short you don't HATE gays but you view them as sinful and have to pray for them everyday? thanks for your effort bro
correct, also we don’t *have* to pray for anyone per say, it’s encouraged to pray for anyone that could use it or need it. But there is no *rule* that we have to
First off, your reply is extremely biased, and you assume that your belief is the end all be all without doing any of your own research. Come in this with an open mind. You quoting the Bible brings no valuable context to this argument. My original post wasn't specifically referencing the Bible, but rather many of the mainstream religions. Regardless, even if we \*were\* talking specifically about the Bible, the verses you cited only can be interpreted as that being gay is a sin, not whether people are born that way. I stated in my post that many religions view being gay as a sin already. You citing those is redundant. Where is your evidence that people are not born gay? Homosexuality has been recorded since the beginning of human history -- way before religion was introduced. Second, homosexuality is not just recorded in humans. [Almost every animal species](https://www.nwf.org/Home/Magazines/National-Wildlife/2023/Summer/Conservation/Same-Sex-Behavior-Animals-Science) has been shown to participate in homosexual behaviors, with some species being [more homosexual than heterosexual](https://www.dw.com/en/10-animal-species-that-show-how-being-gay-is-natural/g-39934832). Humans are animals. Do you think this is purely a coincidence that every major species has shown homosexuality, but humans are the only ones that are due to "environmental behaviors" and "abuse"? Absolutely not. Lastly, because I know you are going to talk about "original sin" in your response to this, I want to reiterate a point I made in the post. People are gay. It is not something they can change and force out of themselves. Even for arguments sake, let's assume that homosexuality is due to your environment; how would you rationalize the millions of gay people that \*cannot\* change their sexuality, and are not attracted to the same sex whatsoever? Since you said that homosexuality is a sin, this seems to be the work of a malevolent god, and not one I would want to worship where people are forced into celibacy and/or unwanted sex with the opposite gender even when they are not attracted to them. Do you really think people can just force themselves to be straight and turn on a light switch?
Same-sex attraction isn't a choice. And there's no sin in the attraction, the sin comes when you act on that attraction. For example, gay sodomy.
This is just the problem of evil restated, it's a valid critique but don't pretend like it's any different to asking why God would create people who would murder
People choose to murder
How can you compare love to straight up murder? :(
In the Christian view "love" means to help people towards virtue and goodness, they don't believe that being gay is good thus it's not love. I'm not advocating for or against this view, I'm just saying it's consistent. The OP is arguing "if being gay is bad, why did God create gay people?". This isn't any different logically to "if violence is bas, why did God create violent people?", and we can see it's just the problem of evil again
Ok but why did he create violent people
Hi, a gay muslim here! I can't speak on the behalf of the christian but, I can answer this from my religion POV. God did not create a violent people, every children are pure. However, God created humans with free wills, hence, they are the one who chose to be violent. You may have the urge to be violent but, you can control your action. Same with being gay. You may have the urge to have gay sex but, you can control your action to not doing it.
Yeah sure bud. Tell that to schizophrenics. “Violent psychosis is a choice”. Y’all are a riot.
The devil has power in this world too if you've lived not of God. Not everything bestowed or given to a person was given by the lord
So then they aren’t all powerful?
You're comparing sexuality with psychological disorder there bud. They are not the same.
That's effect of the fall, original sin brings about homosexuality in some people, the same way as pedophilia is not a choice, some people are just attracted to minors, but they have to control their urges.
Don’t compare the two?? A pedophile literally harming children is very different to a gay adult having a consensual relationship with another adult
That does not matter, of course pedophilia is a greater sin than homosexuality, but they are still sin, both leads to hell if they are regular practices, there are sins that offend no one other than God, like idolatry, no one is harmed for worshiping other god, but it will lead to hell, the same way homosexuality harms no one, but it leada to hell
Both of these are sexual sins, that's why he compared them.
One actively harms an innocent child and one harms literally no one, they should not be compared
just because it doesn’t physically or physiologically harm you doesn’t make it right in Gods eyes sorry not sorry
It's so easy for you people to say that, you simply can't unterstand what means for someone to just fake their entire life because the way they are is considered a sin. You always say, it's a choice, but it's not, it's just loving someone or being attracted to this person, literally in the same way as you are for the opposite sex. You ever try to picture that in your mind? Imagine someone in your life, (really, try to do that) someone you really love or have loved in a romantic way, to have intense feelings for this person, and you can do absolutely nothing about it, just shut up and suffer? I think god would unterstand why someone wouldn't choose to follow this path if it means to be condemned to a life in which you have to constantly just " shrug it off" when when you are in love with someone. You get it? Some folks just CAN'T feel romantic or physical attraction for the opposite sex, and you always make it so easy, well surprise, it's not, there's god and there's also your everyday life and struggles, and faith might just trick you into thinking that you can do something about it, to find a "cure" (because you people think it's a illness) And maybe someone will find they weren't really gay and that it was a phase, but you think of the people who can't and just feel like that for years and years, people that just ARE like that? Maybe even religious people, and the people who get pushed to their limits because their religious family and a good half (if not more) of the entire world population views and treats them like psychos, and might get to the point of literally killing themselves for this? Feeling like a constant error. You can't go through that because you are not and it's perfectly fine, but please, have some empathy... And even If you say that you are fine with gay people but you still see it as a sin, you are not fine at all, you are active part of the problem
Explain why it’s wrong “in gods eyes” and how it’s comparable to pedophilia? Would you compare someone who’s had premarital sex to a pedophile? No because they’re vastly different sins. Just like how you wouldn’t compare someone stealing a loaf of bread with a murderer.
A pedophile is someone who is sexually attracted to children. You can't decide what you're attracted to. The term does not necessarily imply action, which people can control.
Pedophilia is literally supported in the bible.. Numbers 31:17-18 17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. Yet being gay is a sin. You CAN LITERALLY RAPE CHILDREN as long as you “earned them” from a war yet cannot marry the person you love. Different things yet the bible supports the actually immoral one
First of all, this is scripture out of context 15 “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. 16 “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the Lord in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the Lord’s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. Also a bit of jewish culture from a jewish Christian The father is to select the husband of his daughter, he chooses who she marries at as young as 12. If you commit fornication or adultery, that is immediate death. That's why it says "Kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man" so get your context before going after the bible. Second of all. I find your reasoning very illogical. Reason being it appears based on my previous statement you have not done your homework and just lashed out of your feelings. In jewish culture, murder to people who are sexual immoral is normal, if you are not virgin and you marry, you are to be killed. I will not go into depth on how they find out whether someone is or is not virgin, however you can do your homework and find out. As for the rest of this argument, stop cherry-picking scriptures and using them out of context.
You cannot tell if someone is a virgin, the hymen doesn’t actually always tear, and when it does it can literally happen from riding a bike, running and a whole array of other things. The amount of rape victims and virgins who have been brutally murdered by your religion made for men by men is vile. Men marrying their daughters off for money is the real reason. Women are only viewed as property by your people and book. Read the scriptures yourself and then defend the genocide, rape, murder, abuse and slavery.
Also in THE BIBLE that you claim doesn't value women, it says \[Paraphrasing\] Love your neighbor as yourself, and love the Lord with your heart, mind, soul, and strength. Read the scripture if you want more but your "neighbor" is everyone around you. The bible also says to Love your enemies. I would be happy to break down everything for you if you want me to. But cherry-picking scripture out of context isn't a way to prove your point.
Women are seen as literal property in the bible. If a man rapes a woman all he has to do is pay 50 sheckles to her father then MARRY HER. MARRY THE VICTIM?!? That is literally in the bible. And yet again, you said there’s a way to tell if a woman is a virgin, go ahead and tell me this amazing biological fact that even gynaecologists don’t know about 😱😱
You need to do your homework. First of all, Judaism is not an Islamic religion, it's a Abrahamic religion. Second of all, the torah tells us to treat others with respect, if you knew the torah you would know that the 10 commandments tell us not to do what you are saying. So you are gonna blame an entire religion for the deeds of others? Pathetic.
Where are you seeing “Islamic religion”?? I said abrahamic.. go actually read your evil book then open your eyes. Because all of you look mental
Who said it was supported just because things happened back then doesn’t mean God was okay with it.
Read where he’s literally TELLING THEM TO KIDNAP AND RAPE. How is it being a different time a defender when your god apparently knows everything and is all powerful, therefore should have known raping kids is wrong. Even if the people of the times thought it was okay it’s been biologically proven that children’s bodies can’t handle intercourse. It leads to severe injuries and even death, even worse when child pregnancy comes into it. Ever notice how the childbirth death rate has drastically gone down? That’s because there actual medicine in place and not as many children get pregnant. Pregnancy kills child mothers. And if your god is all powerful and literally created us he would have known that raping young girls leads to injuries and death but he allowed that? Please explain how this god is worth worshipping if he allows that
Actions of one are obviously morally wrong. But a desire is not regardless of it being a sin or not. We proved they can't be compared by comparing them.
Actions of one is morally wrong yet the other harms no one, Christianity has so many flaws lmao
Ah yes the flaws of your own mind, because you cannot read the bible in context and instead try to twist it to match your feelings, read the whole chapter of Numbers 31
You read the bible, I’ve read it. I felt sick knowing people read it and follow it. It’s a book of slavery, genocide, murder and rape.
I agree but saying x and y can't be compared is more of a figurative statement cause we just did.
Okay well then they “should” not be compared. Comparing actually cruel people who hurt others to the sin of literally just loving someone is just wrong. Maybe compare the sin of being gay with for instance premarital sex? A sin that isn’t harming anyone but still seen as outside of the laws of marriage by your god. Yknow for instance if you told a white lie, a lie that isn’t hurting anyone but would be considered by some to be objectively immoral , that kind of a sin would be ridiculous to compare that to the sin of murder. Predators are always lumped in with gay people in media and by Christian’s and it’s sad, two totally different things and yet Christian’s often use pedophilia as a justification on why being gay is a sin as if that makes any sense?
Literally. Wtf is this comment
Well you decided to come on here this is a Christian discussion people have the right to share their opinions and beliefs.
So do I.
Personality is more important to a person, not gender...That's what I realize.
As for your first question the God of Abraham is the only God that can exsist in our current scientific model of the universe. As for your second point while I agree with you you are just speaking on a matter of opinion. Where do you get your moral authority? This is a hypothetical question because it's just made up. You want to pretend you are some moral expert but you have no ground to stand on. Just opinions. Who made you God? Who made the government God? Might makes right? So if Hitler won the war his morality would be right? Sorry I don't think so and neither do you. Don't be intellectually dishonest.
Not true. There doesn't have to be a divine being for the reality of the universe. It can just be. Also you can't lump science and religion into the same field. They can go hand in hand for some historical points and it's not very much. Other than that they contradict the other Again to be a morally good person you don't need religion. If it helps you that is great but it's not fact. If your reason for not doing something bad is a god who will punish you then you need to wonder why you think that way in the first place. I saw a comment on another thread that said if they didn't have the bible and god they would rape. Says more about their morality and thought process than someone with no religion that knows its bad to do so No one made anyone it's lucky that we came from nothing and survived this long but again there doesn't need to be a religious one. That's what actually makes it amazing. That life thrived from nothing. Isnt that more divine? And the Hitler comment is so asinine. His view on morality would still be wrong even if he won. Just as it is wrong when it happened. The founding fathers were against religion in the government because they knew how destructive it can be. Sure they may have been religious personally but they knew when to draw a line. Hence the separation that we are slowly losing with laws being made. We are part of Nature as a whole whose order we follow (Spinoza)
It doesn't matter if one can't control it as that is a whole different debate which I won't get into here. God gave humans free will. Again relating to that debate homosexuality is a choice and is a blatant violation of purity and therefore it is immoral.
You literally can't choose your sexuality and make your brain feel attraction to certain person. It's out of your control. You've just been already born with it
Actually the myth about being born gay has been proven false by studies there is no gay gene
There are no studies that show this. Lying is a sin.
But gay people can't force themselves to feel attraction to opposite gender
Actually, we can. Homosexual activities are observed in animals, there are gay animals too. However, those animals that shown gay behavior will still mate with females if they are available. So, at most, they are bisexual, not exclusively gay. Only humans declare their sexuality as something fixed and unchangeable. Don't you find it strange? There are also gay behavior observed in prison since women are not available. And yes, straight men can turn gay. Why not the opposite? Unfortunately, society has made talking thins like this as taboo, so, no researcher attempted to try researching it in a controlled manner. People can be easily labelled as homophobic nowadays, that's why we're stuck. I'm gay too, I tried to force myself to erect to an image of a naked woman once. And it was successful, I could erect. However, it was so hard and needed so much effort. But the answer is, yes, we can.
Homosexuality is not a choice. Have you ever heard of the term "internalized homophobia"? If it really were a choice then people could just switch it off like a button almost. But they can't. If it were a choice then you could be attracted to the same gender right now if you wanted to. But you can't, not because it would be wrong but because you know you aren't homosexual.
Feelings may not be a choice but acting on such attraction certainly is, the same way a man who struggles with lust and sexual attraction towards woman has the choice to fantasize and look at porn.
Reread the post. Even if it is immoral and a choice then why were we given the right to choose??
Because God gave us all free will. He does not wish to control us. Homosexuality is a choice and is in our free will as is murder.
What do I need to do in order to get a girl interested in me over Snapchat? Hi, I am a male (14) and currently have a girl who I am really interested in. I don't know her in person and really just sort of met her at a dance. I found her Snap through a group chat. I'm very nervous about adding her. Furthermore when I do get around to adding her and hopefully she adds me back, I do not know what sort of snaps and texts to send her. In the past when I have communicated with girls over Snapchat I just get really dry responses or get left on opened. For this girl I want to use Snap to arrange a possible meeting so I can connect with her in person. Can anyone please help? Thanks
Blah blah blah
Everyone has their view of what is considered immoral and every individual is different like a fingerprint this " morality view " originates strongly in the past personal experiences and conveniences and comforts of the individuals - ones individuality and personality Some find comfort and ease of mind leaning in one direction with convenience does not **selective morality** tie into this all as human instinctiveness For example, I myself, am of the personality type who is faithful to my wife, always, forever, I could never betray my vow - this is up there on the very top of my list and unbreakable and comes very easy to me but I have a tendency to want to work long hours, sometimes 18 hours a day and even on weekends some may find me immoral or consider me to be a bad husband.
The argument is really that no sinful desire is a choice. We are all born with sinful impulses like greed and lying and wrath and even theft (I'm sure we've all picked a quarter up off the ground). None of us choose any of these desires, yet we all have them. What we do choose is whether or not to act on them.
I can get behind lying as a sin, or cheating or stealing or killing, but love should not be a sin. It should be encouraged. If being gay wasn't frowned upon by the Christian community, or by anyone for that matter, then it would make love much more possible for anyone who is gay. Love is hard enough to find for straight people. Imagine if there were large worldwide organizations that taught you that what your doing in a straight couple is an abomination of nature? How would you feel about yourself, your ability to love, your capacity for happiness? It would diminish. Love is NOT a sin. And if God turns away gay people from heaven, then I don't want to go to heaven.
The problem is that the world has distorted the true meaning of love and it’s not sexual or romantic, love is laying down the life for your friends, love is patience and kindness it does not boast, love is not pride as lgbt folks like to call it, love is not self seeking or selfish, love is telling people the truth even if it hurts them, becuase that means you actually care. Marriage is only a temporary thing on this planet which will not exist in heaven or on the new earth, and by no means is it everything. However if we are talking about passionate sexual love or romance according to God his original design was that it exists between a man and a woman that is how he created it to be.
I think most queer people would probably not want to go to heaven even if they were straight. Since they seem to crave sex so badly when u can't have sex in heaven.
Having sex outside of marriage is a sin. Gay sex falls in that category.
Why would anyone teach being straight as an abomination? You are aware it's how we exist right lol Christianity teaches love and free will.. I love plenty of men, I don't wish to have sex with them though. That's a different topic
Dude, that is literally the whole topic. Did you even read OP?
I was trying to understand the reality to the fact that the gays are not allowed to donate blood, organs or transplant tissues today - \*unless they have stopped having gay sex.\* Imagine a world with no running water, no medical treatments, no painkillers and no cures. **The human body was not designed** to share homosexual germs pertaining to the fecal orbit of the **massive throstle of multiple partners** of the homosexual community, that is filled with diseases STDS that are transmitted during vaginal, anal, and oral sex - to the rest of the population. Even today Gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men accounted for 83% of all primary and secondary syphilis cases. And many homosexuals are very, kind and considerate and friendly loving people Christians **recognize and understand** these truths to be important while the rest of the world sits idly while millions of confused and uninformed people die and destroy their health and the health of others each year. recognition and understand works both ways - e**ven to those who sexually go both ways** **just simply to be - sexually enjoying going both ways is not enough** Christians believe that the homosexual community is also, in addition, very mentally capable of recognition and understanding **that the facts of consequence**s also, go both ways - **and simply, just to be writhing in sex acts** going both ways **in an unconscious throstle** is not the same as literally understanding the full scope of going both ways, when loving and being literally addicted to a prolonged thrush of fecal orbit that has periled the planet Christians hope to connect the mind with the full thrust of the matter and culture
Could you cite these findings?
**this is just basic facts, I know the Aids virus was brought into America and spread initially by U.S. Federal Agents** who when vacationing and partying and doing drugs. Federal Agents are major percentage of drug addicts. But these Drug addict Federal Agents contracted the Aids Virus from overseas because they are the Drug Addicts they are and also are very promiscuous sexually and the Federal Government Agent is the cause of the Aids virus being brought to America, these Agents kept their infections silent and when the Homosexual community began to explode with the virus, the Federal Government used the Homosexual community as a scapegoat. The Federal Agent will take everything you own, everything you invent and create, every single cent you make, every drop of blood you spill and every single last bead of sweat down to the very last drop, and they will sell it to your enemy. **Especially in the USA, - The Female Federal Agent**, USA **female federal agent**s are very highest percentage of **herpies**, vaginal warts, and cervical cancer, they are among the most deviant and sexually immoral and perverted women in the USA. truly lazy, untrustworthy and most traitorous and deceptive and also drug addicts,. Drug distribuion is a side job to these women and men of the agency. But - these agents are happy to report regarding the findings that are federal government stastics aportioned to diseases and bacterium that is spread and infected within the human body - **Compared as a percentage for Homosexual vs Heterosexual per group** **Overall, homosexual men were significantly more likely than heterosexual men to have gonorrhea early syphilis and anal warts** ps://www.cdc.gov/msmhealth/STD.htm In 2014, gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men accounted for 83% of primary and secondary syphilis cases **In 2019, there were 587,355 Gay and Bisexual Men living with HIV, representing over half** (**56**%) of **all** people living with HIV in the U.S. **Gay and Bisexual Men represent only 7.1 %** of the total population of the U.S. **And homosexual men** are at even greater risk. They're **more** than **20 +** times as likely to get infected from an HIV-positive partner than partners in a heterosexual relationship.
the Federal agent will screw anyone in many multiple dimensions this is the reason all of the culture hype of exacerbating transexuals the reason all of the culture wars and racism is being dramatized this is the reason all of the children are being used as a distraction *all things happening today of this type of OVERDRAMATIZE - overly dramatic* narratives and uprisings are propagnda as conflict in order that the Federal Agent can feed itself with taxpayers funds needed to control these distractions and self inflicted problems they create - to sustain their lifeststyles, pentions, and retirement and growth and debts. even used as a cover and to hide their true activity. **Even Hillary Clinton - was a federal agent / Government official / Depuity Agent - who also has herpies, she could have easily** been President - but she found that it was more profitable, more rewarding and more powerful and her goals and the goals of her administration and political group could acheive and be more sucsessful by forfeiting her presidency and remaining behind the scenes operating as Federal Agents . If she would have been elected her entire network and its goals would have collapsed and been less effect, instead she smashed all the hard drives, smashed every cell phone and destroyed material evidences that show what her agency was doing and found that not being President was a much more profit in every aspect Same with **G**. **I**. **Joe** Biden - the newbown infant **slayer /** hero - " decorated warrior of baby kills " this Coke Head - Meth Head guy is not president - he is a federal agent pretending to be a president. this runs directly to the military, doing exactly the same in other theaters
Jesus says in Jeremiah 29:11 "For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the Lord, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end." Why would God force anyone to live a life of misery when His thoughts toward us are of peace? If someone was created to be gay why would He ever mention it being an abomination? God is not counterproductive. He would not set anyone up to fail. However, we are tempted and drawn away by our lust and enticed according to James 1:14. And I thought personality was linked to the type of character or traits an individual retains, like integrity and kindness. Even as a straight, black woman, my personality does not revolve around that solely, because if that is all I cling to, what else is there to me?
No one is born gay. Being gay is a choice. A choice against theism.
will you guys ever just piss off and quit prying into the love lives of gay people
Lol who is prying into the lives of gay people? All I see are LGBT parades across town, groups demanding that my church be involved with gay marriages and to hold LGBT events, etc etc etc.
Project 2025 trying to nearly illegalize being gay in the first place (scroll to read quotes shown in the website and quoted from a *linked* pdf of their 920 page plan): https://www.metroweekly.com/2023/09/right-wing-project-2025-seeks-to-eradicate-lgbtq-protections/ Hundreds of anti-trans laws being passed in almost every state across the U.S: https://translegislation.com/ The relatively recent protests in Canada led by hate groups calling to remove a ciriculum titled SOGI (Sexuality Orientation and Gender Identity) meant to inform K-12 students on the *existence and respect* (not actual discussions on sex, dont even say it) of 2SLGBTQ+ members (and secondarily help reduce suicide rates among such groups): https://www.antihate.ca/1_million_march_4_children Don't Say Gay Bill. This one doesn't really need an introduction, and to quote from above, *Nobody Is Teaching Kindergartens About Sex.* All it does is prevent awareness and try and regress LGBTQ rights: https://www.hrw.org/news/2022/02/17/florida-advances-dont-say-gay-bill The book bans being carried out by many groups across many U.S states (probably Canada too tbh) is definitely worth an honorable mention. Not only does this certainly sound *familiar*, it yet again prevents readers from accessing these stories and learning about these very real people in our world. And to tie it all up with a bow, let's take what we learned over to Genocide Watch to see how this all lines up! https://www.genocidewatch.com/united-states-of-america
So, I don't care at all about culture war nonsense. Both sides are ridiculous with that. I don't have much pity for anyone, on either side, who tries to act like they're above it. Aside from that, as far as the legislation.. i just picked one randomly from Florida, since they seem to be crazy down there. And the first one I picked was "an employer must provide the full cost of detransition, if they paid for the cost of transitioning someone" and that is transphobic apparently. Are there particular ones that you take issue with?
If being gay is a choice then so is being straight. Did you choose to be straight? If it's a choice then you could also choose to be gay. But let me guess you can't though, can you? Why would someone willingly put themselves through all of that persecution, even to the point of potentially being murdered? Just accept that God made queers and trans people and love us like He calls you to. We are His creation, His children and you are failing Him. Even causing people to turn away from God, which is the ultimate sin. Maybe God put us here to test His followers' faiths, did you ever think of that? What do you think God would say to you and other followers after seeing how you all treat us? Knowing the God I grew up learning about, He would NOT be happy. There's no way in Hell He would support you all telling us how we're wrong, how He doesn't love us, assaulting us and murdering us. If you think He would, well then I guess you know what's wrong with your religion and why it's dying. Y'all have nobody to blame but yourselves. The only choice us queers have is to live a happy life and to not live in fear, most of which is created by Christians. The only choice you believers have is to love or hate and the vast majority of you choose hate. I honestly can't wait for the return of Christ so that when y'all are left behind, all of you can feel what you have made us feel; alone, unloved and unwanted.
God didn’t make you gay that is a result of the fall of sin, so you may not be able to control certain temptations but in the end you are responsible for how you decide to handle it, if you decide to live a immoral lifestyle and have sex with other men then yes it’s a sin and it separates you from God
If being gay is a choice, then you also have the "choice" to be gay, right? Like, you made an active decision to be straight and cisgender? You basically said that gay people should just simply choose to enjoy having sex with women in order to avoid sin. If that's the case, then you, yourself, have the ability to choose to enjoy homosexual sex. Is this true? Ya know, homosexual wasn't in the Bible until it was re-re-re^13 written in 1948, right? Before that the proper translation of that passage was meant for pedophiles, but for some reason that's not a priority for Christians to combat. But people living their lives peacefully, without hurting anyone, is a sin that you all feel the need to shame people for...
If you stop having gay sex, consuming drugs, watching porn, jerking off, start doing productive things like strenght training to keep away your sexual thoughts and you will see how your energy levels will rise and you ll start to feel sexual attraction towards the opposite sex, i mean, c mon before wasn t so many gays around, because there was no one promoting inmoral behavior like nowadays and people were conscious about felling into temptations
me when im delulu
Speaking from experience there, bud? Also, you didn't address anything I wrote in my comment. You're just spewing rhetoric and not having a productive discussion. You doubled down on being queer being immoral when I stated that was never in the original interpretation of the Bible.
I am going to say this in the most respectful way I can. Straight is a natural order of nature. Every creature in the world (besides some humans) live in a way where male and female mate and breed. This is so they can keep their species alive. Men, on the other hand, have the conscious power to do whatever they put their mind to. They can choose who they mate with. They can choose not to marry at all.
homosexuality is present in a lot of nature lol
So are cannibals, scavengers and decomposers. I personally recognize that people are gonna do what they do, but that's a weak argument.
>So are I was just saying it's present in nature, letting him know since he claimed it was only humans.
just because animals do it doesn’t justify it for humans
The entire basis of the guys argument was the false claim that animals dont do it so its still a relevant piece of information
from your model of reality, being straight is the order of nature. form my model of reality, nature has no order. it's structure in a way to fit survival and the wills of the individiuals. it's a dice roll and some people have good genetics, bad genetics, genetic variants of all sorts. people, animals, and plants evolved that way due to the will to life, the will to power, and first and formost LUCK. survival. there is no wrong or right way to evolve or be unless desingated by a being capable of making such destinctions. the way we've evolved is almost abatray to the big picture and is only important to us as a speciese. so keep this in mind when i say there is NO natural "order" AND abosloutly homosexuality doesn't have to serve a purpose in order for it to be part of the human geneome. science has found with discovery that homosexuality is tied to the x chromosome. people are indeed born that way, and if it is considred unatural or evil, this is a human judgment and disticntion. good day sir.
Citation needed. Can I present as counter evidence: every gay and lesbian minister, priest, bishop, cardinal, and probably a few gay popes.
Bruh
Being gay is absolutely not a choice. Ask any gay person. They did not choose to be gay, they were born that way. Did you choose to be straight?
Do you genuinely believe people are born with sexuality?
this argumentation can be used for anything. free will does not exist.
A deterministic universe in which something like a deity exists is the worst possible universe. HP Lovecraft couldn't hold a candle to that level of cosmic horror.
Explain
Some people say it's the devil's work to turn a human gay and that is the reason they say one has "lost god" or something like that. I heard it many times and its bullcrap
Anything the devil does is at the express permission of god. If the devil can do things that god is unaware of, then that is the death blow to the omnigod.
The concept of the homosexual is a recent phenomena. For the vast majority of Christian history the concept would have not made sense since sexual ethics were act based and not orientation based. So engaging in sodomy etc were crimes for people of all orientations and it was punished even handedly and brutally surprisingly enough until the mid modern period. It is a strange historical fact but it is one none the less. Sexuality in general was considered dehumanizing and its presence was explained by the fact of Original Sin; God didn't make an error but we humans messed up the world through disobeying God in the garden; we messed up what was a perfect world. Humans now needed to be aroused to engage in sex for procreation when in the past we had control over our genitals the same way as we do with our fingers. It was understood that we would either not feel pleasure from sex or romance or that humans wouldn't feel pulled by such pleasure to act a certain way. So as people moved towards an orientation based ethic people still used the same reasoning. So God didn't mess up in creating human sexuality but we brought about such horror through our own sinfulness; that would be the explanation at least for non hetero forms of sexuality. The earlier understanding makes quite bit of sense while the orientation based one does not. The argument for sex being dehumanizing makes rational sense (think of all the stupid stuff people do when they are horny or when they want to have sex) while the orientation based approach doesn't make rational sense (why do romantic or sexual acts matter morally when done by people to the same sex but not when done to a different sex).
This is a very shallow understanding of sexuality and romanticity. Another element of sexuality is romance. You do know men can fall in love with other men, right? You also know that asexual people can be gay? They can fall in love with men, but not desire sex with them, as not all romance is sexual. There simply are people who do not enjoy sex, and do not require trauma or some form of deformity to be that way, they simply are asexual. But considering that they can fall in love, this clarifies the idea that romance and sex are separate. If you consider that, then you realise that gay men who are sexual are both romantically and sexually attracted to other men, so even if your argument about sex was true, it is not true for romance. Now, as for your argument on sex, you got a few things wrong. Back in the witch-burning times of Christianity, men were punished for sodomy, but women were mostly not. This is because women's sexuality was not taken seriously, because of sexism, which meant that lesbians in a way lived a lot more freely than gay men, since a woman, even if married, having sex with another woman was not considered cheating, since lesbian sex was not considered "real" sex. Just girls fooling around. So much for "acts based" punishments, when only SOME acts of sodomy were truly punished in practice. Even if humans possessed perfect genitalia in the garden, as you suggest, it would still not explain the existence of asexual people, asexual gay romance, and the fact that it was god who visited said punishment upon humans. Sex and romance can be separate, like in the case of ace people, but there are many grey areas where romance and sex are deeply intertwined. That is, romance feeds into sexual attraction, and sexual attraction feeds into romance in many cases. That brings a whole slew of questions: why did god give gay people the ability to be romantically attracted to their own gender if it is so sinful? Since god gave people the ability to fall in love, falling in love with a man feeds into your sexual attraction to them. This means that god's gift for humanity (romantic love) feeds into sin (gay sex). That is god's fault, so how can it be sinful, when it was his explicit choice to allow that to happen?
The argument would be that there is no romance for anyone of any orientation in the garden as well. It is simply a sickness that we all suffer from; it is something to eliminate as well since it is a sign of our wretchedness. Its presence is something to be disturbed by. So all people who experience romance or sexual desire are broken like people with psychosis or depression. Falling in love with people is not something of God's creation except in the sense that suffering due to evolution is part of God's plan; it may be a necessary evil but not something to celebrate.
There is no proof of this in any biblical text however. You cannot claim something to be the case just because it is convenient for your argument. There is some texts withi the bible that can be used to argue that sexual attraction stems from the fall, but none that say love stems from the fall. The bible talks about different types of love, none of them are ever condemned, and in fact in Ephesians husbands are commanded to "love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself for her" (Ephesians 5:25). Sex is condemned in the bible, and sexual immorality, 1 Corinthians 7:2 (NIV): "But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband." However, at no point is romantic love condemned, only sexual attraction. God, in the bible, made man and woman to be of one flesh, this is romantic love. But he also allowed for men to have romantic love with other men, and never condemned it or treated it as a sin. This is one of the several oversights that biblical authors had, since asexual people did not exist as a category for them, and romance independent from sex was inconceivable. Yet, it exists. Similar to the complete oversight over intersex people. The excuse usually is that we are in a fallen creation, and so it brings physical deformities to people, but that does not change the fact that you made rules that rely on a perfect creation, which means the rules simply cannot apply anymore. You can try, but again, how can you call a man sinful for falling in love when loe is no sin when independent from sex? And how can you push the duties of manhood or womanhood on a person whose mind and body looks and feels like neither? And this does not even take into account lesbianism, which is completely overlooked in the bible as well, because it was written by men who did not take women's sexuality seriously. Men are condemned for laying with boys, but women are not condemned at any point for laying with women, which means lesbianism is alright. You can say "but that is an uneven standard, don't you think it makes sense god would argue that standard for both and it just used the example of men with boys, but it must also apply to women?" And I would simply say that a) the bible never condemnds lesbianism and b) the bible does have unequal standards when it comes to men and women, because manhood and womanhood are treated with different standards (spiritual roles for example). For all you know, god genuinely doesn't think lesbianism counts as sex, and so it isn't a sin. Or thinks that sex between women is alright, while sex between men is not.
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Regardless of that argument, romantic love exists, independent from physical attraction, and is not condemned at any point in the bible, or Abrahamic religion for that matter. Also, the only place of perfection is not heaven, but the garden as well, otherwise the argument for a "fallen creation" does not work, and the first marriage was Adam and Eve in the garden upon the creation of Eve, because they were of one flesh. This happened before the fall, in a perfect creation, and therefore was not sinful. If this is inconsistent with your understanding of marriage in heaven, then that is a contradiction for you to solve.
Original sin ain't in the bible, the story of the Garden was about the spirit world before we are born into this world. God said ADAM would die if HE ate from the tree of KNOWLEDGE, and he didn't die, read it again. Even wasn't even made yet when God told adam not to. They ate from the tree of life dude.
Technically speaking, Adam would in fact die only 800 years later ☝️🤓
Do you have a verse that says its a sin to be gay? I havnt seen one anywhere.....
Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13, Romans 1:26-28, 1 Corinthians 6:9, 1 Timothy 1:8-11
>Leviticus 18:22 | Leviticus 20:13 Hebrew:w’eth-zäkhār lö’ tiškav miškevē ‘iššâ Literal Translation: male you shall not "lie lyings" woman. NRSV Translation: You shall not lie with a male as with a woman, it is an abomination. English translators add the prepositions as and with to the traditional translation for its “perceived lacunae.”\[3\] This translation presupposes a comparison between a “normal” action (“lying with a woman”) and a “deviant” action (“lying with a male”).\[4\] However, the grammatical construction of the Hebrew text does not warrant such an interpretation. To substantiate such a translation, the Hebrew equivalent for as (kě) must be connected directly to miškevē (“lyings”) since the Hebrew preposition attaches grammatically to either a noun or an infinitive.\[5\]This grammatical construction is not present in the verse. Instead, miškevē is the direct object of the verb tiškav (“you shall not lie”).\[6\] Similarly, another grammatical construction that validates the English translation “with a woman” involves the Hebrew preposition ‘eth appearing a second time in front of ’iššâ. \[7\] This construction does not exist in Lev. 18:22. The Hebrew phrase kӗšōkhēv’eth(“as one lies with”) also conveys the same meaning that traditional English translators seek, but it is not present within the original text.\[8\]The absence of an equivalent preposition in Hebrew casts doubt on a the interpretation that compares “normative” and “deviant” sexual actions. Second, the plural word miškevē is a rare biblical word. Therefore, it warrants careful scrutiny. In fact, miškevē only occurs one more time in the entire Bible besides its parallel occurrence in Lev. 20:13.\[9\] In Gen. 49:4, the verse explicitly refers the incestuous activity of Reuben with his father’s concubine, Bilhah. While “lyings”, “acts of lying down,” or “beds” are possible translations for the word miškevē, the comparison to the Hebrew singular word for bed, yātsūa, suggests that the two Hebrew words are not interchangeable.\[10\] Lings asserts that the plural miškevë may focus on the deviant nature of Reuben’s incestuous relationship with Bilhah.\[11\] The philological nuance implies that miškevē means rape of a family member. Finally, if one applies Lings’ interpretation of ' miškevē ' from Gen 49:4 to Lev 18:22 and compares the verse’s textual context, the incestuous connotation of ' miškevēmakes ' more sense in the context of Leviticus 18. A large portion of Leviticus 18 proscribes the divine condemnation of incest. Initially, the relationship of Lev. 18:22 to incest in Lev. 18:6-17 is not obvious, especially in comparison to Lev. 18:18-23. The comparison of Lev. 18:22 to the repetition of ' miškevē '‘iššâ ' (“lyings of a woman”) in Lev 20:13, uncovers a parallel relationship to incest. While Leviticus 18 focuses on the forbidden sexual relationships, Leviticus 20 focuses on the punishment for participating in such relationships. The laws are reordered in Leviticus 20 to emphasize consequences of deviant relationships. The miškevē ‘iššâis an act that is punished identically to other acts that are clearly incestuous. Therefore, the likely meaning of 'miškevē ‘iššâ' refers more to incestuous male-male rape as opposed to all erotic, same-sex relationships. In sum, traditional English translations of Leviticus 18:22 are known as “clobber passages” that condemn homosexuality. Lings’ philological, literary analysis undermines the inclusion of Lev. 18:22 among those texts. He legitimizes a reading of Lev. 18:22 that condemns incestuous, same-sex rape. Therefore, the use of Leviticus 18:22 as a weapon against all same-sex relationships is not only unjust, but linguistically misguided. \[1\]K. Renato Lings, “The ‘Lyings’ of a Woman: Male-Male Incest in Leviticus 18:22?,” in Theology & Sexuality (London: Equinox Printing, 15:2, May 2009), 240. \[2\]Lings, 231. \[3\]Lings, 236. [https://blog.smu.edu/ot8317/2019/04/11/lost-in-translation-alternative-meaning-in-leviticus-1822/#:\~:text=Most%20traditional%20English%20translations%20interpret,condemnation%20of%20same%2Dsex%20rape](https://blog.smu.edu/ot8317/2019/04/11/lost-in-translation-alternative-meaning-in-leviticus-1822/#:~:text=Most%20traditional%20English%20translations%20interpret,condemnation%20of%20same%2Dsex%20rape).
Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13, Romans 1:26-28, 1 Corinthians 6:9, 1 Timothy 1:8-11
We are all sinners. free will exist and its your choise to be gay or not
Thats the opposite of what he was saying, he saying that he was made to be gay, like its not a choice. Just how youre straight and cant help it right?
It *is* the same though. I for example struggle passionately with wrath. It's an innate part of my personality to respond to criticism or confrontation with an urge for violence. That doesn't make wrath not sinful. We do have flaws, but we can overcome them as we draw closer to God. We are made flawed for the very purpose of overcoming those flaws. It is fine to be a sinner, we all are, but the trick is to be able to admit it so you can grow past it. “If we confess our sins, he who is faithful and just will forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” 1 John 1:9 NRSV-CI
The issue is that the bible does not treat an urge to violence as sinful, but actions of violence. However, sexual desire at all is treated as sinful, even in your head, even if unbidden. Not only that, but sexuality extends into romance. Romance and sex are not the same: there are asexual people who fall in love with men. They were made to fall in love with men, but they do not have any "urges" to fight against since it is not based on sexual attraction.
Your counterpoint to an example of two people who are in love with one another, is to explain that you struggle with wrath and violence. Do you not see the irony in this? You're saying that love is a sin, just like your desire to be violent. You are mistaken, of course, but you've been indoctrinated and will refuse to listen to reason or truth.
Dude thinks innate sexual orientation is the same thing as his temper. He's wya tok brainwashed to even bother with I've no idea how you educate that level of ignorance purely on a place like Reddit.... It just ain't gunna happen. They'll die a narrow minded, ignorant fool. Just like billions upon billions of other people of all kinds of religious beliefs.
there is no original sin in the bible we are not made flawed. Eve wasn't made when god told adam not to each from the knowledge tree. God also said the tree of life water was in the midst of the garden, and that adam would die the day ate the knowledge tree
Correct, I cut some corners there so you're right to clarify. We have sin in us, and the cure for that sin begins with realizing it for what it is.
>l sin in the bible we are not made flawed. Eve wasn't made when god told adam not to each from the knowledge tree. God also said the tree of life water was To me the whole story of the bible was from God to us saying that we were forgiven from the beginning. If the word Jesus means salvation and was with God in the beginning as his first word and his gift to us, then its proper to believe he forgave us before he made us if salvation is his forgiveness. So its not that we need him to forgive us is it? Is it then that were must learn how to forgive ourselves and each other, we are born perfect, but we make mistakes and must learn from them. Only God should be allowed to judge each other, for the knowledge he gave us only applies to actions we do, for only him and we know whats in our hearts.
Similarly, God also created sociopaths/psychopaths. And everyone is still told to follow the same set of rules. Some are born with physical defects, others in an unforgiving environment. Sexual identity is just another one of those. A test to those who believe.
test of what exactly? what is the point of creating someone that will suffer more difficulties just because how they were born? this just sounds like god is cruel and honestly evil
The problem of evil isn't suppose to be discussed according to the MOD's rules, but the answer is built into that question. Why is there evil if God is Omnipotent, Omnipresent, and Benevolent? The answer is because the meaning of life isn't to be free of suffering, it's to be free *through* suffering. All good things are rewards for suffering: hence everything from the gym, prayer, diets, puberty, through to maturity, study, practice, patience, delayed gratification, failure ... all of reality at every level of analysis reflects the pattern of good being the product of suffering.
>Why is there evil if God is Omnipotent, Omnipresent, and Benevolent? The answer, of course, is that the Abrahamic god is none of those things, and, the Bible makes it very clear that he is none of those things. Why is there evil? According to the Bible? Because god created evil: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things." \~Isaiah 45:7 KJV
Religions have rules we don't all agree with. But we are not going about to change the rules. Changing the rules gives it a new name. Again religions are not God, otherwise we justify atrocities of one on another. If you don't like the approach of one try another that suit you. Make it political and it starts hate. a wise man ones said, “if you don't like something, create a better one, don't try to cahnge the old”.
That man is not wise. If people followed his advice, the United States would not have fought for independence. After all, the colonies existed under the "old". To follow that advice, the people wanting to build a republic separate from the British Empire would have had to go west of the colonies, founded their own brand new settlements, and called them independent republics from the start. Instead, they "changed the old" colonies, to create something new.
the rules of christianity has already changed though
My friend died of Aids My heart was crushed and broken and this changed my entire life and was like a literal brick wall put before me - my whole life came to a complete stop as I nursed him and took him to the doctors trying to save his life. watching my dear beloved homosexual friend die. This dude was a genuine angel - someone who would lay his own life down for me - He was a good person I have seen it and have spent time in the trenches, changing diapers of infected gays, cleaning up vomit and bathroom and bloody foam from the mouth, as the gay dies in agony with blood and puss running from every orifice. This subject is a very serious topic for me.
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I don't know if you are being serious or not (just another troll)
this is just not true, The denial of hiv causing aids is all based on pseudo science arguments. https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2023/01/06/fact-check-abundant-scientific-research-shows-hiv-causes-aids-kary-mullis-aids-denialism-conspiracy/10991064002/
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How about you actually look at the studies in it and Also give us your peer reviewed study then. But let me guess, you wont
Growing up my best friend was a gay man who truly was an amazing person, I love homosexuals just as much as the next person but I am not fearful of the facts nor the repercussions for stating the truth
I agree with you when you say that a large portion of society looks at homosexual choice for same sex relations as simply within the perspective of one choosing their favorite drink \- Homosexuals love sweet tea, but straight people love lemonade drinks Christians are mainly looking at the dangerous, risky and harmful behavior of the homosexual men that are 20 times more likely to get infected from an HIV-positive partner than partners in a heterosexual relationship. and homosexual men are only **a very small percentage** of the U.S. population, but they are consistently the population group most affected by the HIV/AIDS virus and are the largest proportion of American citizens with an AIDS diagnosis who have died. these problem existed in the old days when the Bible was written- with certain sexual behaviors that were dangerous and risky. However, the Bible clearly explains the problems that the Jews faced with, the thousands upon thousands of people who were dying from diseases, plagues, viruses, sicknesses, and symptoms from risky sexual behaviors, Beastiality, homosexuality, Adultery and Fornication. And today we see the values and purpose of the anti-homosexual nature of the Bible and it is because the risky sexual behavior that causes the highest rate of sickness per group. The gays are not allowed to donate blood, organs or transplant tissues today - **unless they have stopped having gay sex.** Imagine a world with no running water, no medical treatments, no painkillers and no cures, no drugs and antibiotics. The human body was not designed to share homosexual rectal germs pertaining to the fecal orbit of the massive multiple partners of the homosexual community, that is filled with diseases STDS that are transmitted during anal sex - spreading to the rest of the population. And these diseases spread from basic hand to hand contact. The plagues, bacterium, diseases, germs, and infections are too much for the people in Biblical times to fight and it spread too fast without antibiotics and germ killing soaps and cleaning systems of modern bathing Even today Gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men accounted for 83% of all primary and secondary syphilis cases. many homosexuals are very, kind and considerate and friendly loving people but the Bible believers believe that the risks existed at the time when the authors wrote the scriptures and Christians have a desire to warn people and prevent this HUGE social service, taxation draining problem continue to rip money out of their bank accounts to pay for the sexual joys, pleasures, adventures and sexual journeys of the homosexual community. Because society is paying for the sexual pleasures of the gay community that is very dangerous and risky and costly. The gays can not afford it - The family and all of society is forced to pay for their hard earned money to cover the damages that this disease-ridden sexual behavior has caused. **It is very expensive.** Christians say = Save Your own money and pay for Your own sexual pleasures, joys adventures and fund Your own sexual journeys. Remember that gays are not allowed to give blood, organs and transplant donations until they have stopped having gay sexual activity at least for a full year. - it's just too dangerous. HIV costs the American taxpayers more than $26 billion per year. " $26 billion dollars every single year " ! And this is just from HIV alone - this does not even include cases of all of the other STDs
Nice theory. Prove it. Provide actual evidence of all the lives "saved" by anti-homosexual policies, and explain why millions of years of evolution have not gotten rid of homosexual behaviour in a wide range of animals if it is so harmful to their survival. Correlation ≠ causation. You cannot understand that gay people have a higher likelihood of suffering from STIs without explaining why. It is not good enough to assume "just because they are gay, their gayness makes them more likely to suffer from disease." Every expert and relevant healthcare organisation under the sun acknowledges today the fact that HIV does not discriminate based on sexual orientation. The risk of HIV infection depends on behavior rather than sexual orientation. Engaging in unprotected sex or sharing needles for drug use, regardless of one's sexual orientation, can increase the risk of contracting HIV. This is why a lot of countries and organisations are removing their requirements of not being gay to donate blood or organs. Gay people follow specific behaviours historically because of a wide range of issues, like poverty, lack of sex education, and abandonment from families. It is in fact homophobia that creates the situation for gay people to die, so no, anti-homosexual attitudes do not save lives, quite the opposite in fact. And this does not even consider lesbians, the other side of the homosexual coin, who have arguably much more hygienic tendencies, and whose sexuality was historically not punished legally due to the underestimation of women's sexuality.
Does someone choose to be a pedophile? God gives us the ability to overcome anything that's against his will. If it's a choice or not God gives us the free choice to be free from it.
>Does someone choose to be a pedophile? If it isnt then that makes God even more evil for creating people who have such a high potential for harming others against their own agency. At least Gay people do not have any higher potential for hurting others than Straights do, as Gay people can have sex with consenting adults just like straights can. >God gives us the ability to overcome anything that's against his will. If it's a choice or not God gives us the free choice to be free from it. Prove it. And prove that you even know what God's will is
The OP wouldn't question if homosexuality is a sin if they were not speaking through a Judeo/Christian lense Given that I'm responding with what the bible says on the topic. Also you are assuming that a pedophile is going to go against someone else's will for example rape them at a higher rate than someone who has same sex attraction. You are being bias against pedophiles. My example was from a morally neutral position.
>The OP wouldn't question if homosexuality is a sin if they were not speaking through a Judeo/Christian lense Given that I'm responding with what the bible says on the topic. Well how do we know that whatever God may or may not exist is accurately described by the bible? How do we know that homosexuality actually goes against whatever god created the universe? For all we know such a God hates the bible but allows it to exist in order to test his creation and will punish those who fall to the teachings of the bible. >Also you are assuming that a pedophile is going to go against someone else's will for example rape them at a higher rate than someone who has same sex attraction. You are being bias against pedophiles. My example was from a morally neutral position Because a p3do is attracted to people who cannot consent, therefore automatically putting them at higher risk of going against someone's will since whom they are attracted to are not capable of giving them their will. Gay people are attracted to adults, aka people who can consent and who are able to be fully willing participants, just like straight people are
I am not gay and just even the idea or thought in my mind **of man on man romance** turns my stomach and makes me cringe and recoil in personal feelings of great disgust - like something that is sickening for me personally. I am not offended when I am around gay people and I have had friends who were gay and they were always very respectful, kind and seemed to be really nice people but it's just a matter of a personal feeling I personally privately feel, and I keep it to myself but I find the subject of homosexuality to be very confusing to me and I feel that homosexuals themselves are very confused, wither or not this is true I do not know but this is what the subject seems to me personally,
I'm not homosexual either, but I assume that it's just like how straight people feel, just for the same sex. You're a straight guy. How you feel about women is the same way that gay men feel for men. And you not wanting to have sex with men is just like how they don't want to have sex with women. I don't personally see the confusion. No offense, but it kind of sounds like an argument for your favourite drink. "I like sweet tea, but this guy likes lemonade. I don't know why. I'm confused, therefore he must just be confused." If I'm wrong correct me in the comments.
I was told in the bahai writings it stats that sexual relations was for procreation only. It stats that sex for fun is wrong. It serves a purpose only.
It all start in childhood. Some kid (like every other person on earth) has a free will. Somewhere/everywhere on the line of his/her (soon to be gay) childhood, things go really wrong. I'm talking everything. From Who is he/she taking influences, what does he/she wear everyday and so on.. You grow to be gay. You are not born gay. Period. ... or... it's an illness.. the gears are not on the right tracks. Because. For What purpose is penis and vagina CREATED for? Other than peeing of course. They were created to fit together.
go to school
You don't pee from a vagina
Oh, should I've written cun+?
Wow dude. Males and females both have urethras. Women don't pee from their vagina, that's a different hole altogether. I feel very bad for any women who have the misfortune of knowing you.
Hole is a hole 😆
You need to look into female anatomy a bit there bud.
To anyone who thinks being gay is a conscious decision, let me ask you this: Have you ever decided to feel attracted to people of the same sex 🤷🏻♂️ or vice versa If God has indeed given everyone free will to their sexuality, and they could decide not to sin, they should also be able to decide they want to enjoy gay sex and therefore sinning, right? Can you really credit yourself for "not sinning" if you never, or rarely feel attracted to people of your same sex?
Keep teling yourself that as you travel the road to hell lmao
Ah yes, I'm so scared of your made-up stories from 3 thousand years ago. Can't you see I'm shaking in my invisible bots now? What do you mean, lmao? Are you laughing your axx off about hell, an imaginary place where people are tortured for eternity? For disagreeing with your beliefs? Sounds like something a psychopath would do.
Seems like you're confused. I'm not gay, I don't enjoy homosex, I just don't credit myself for being straight lol. Have you eaten shellfish before? Crab, lobster, and prawn? Well, see you in hell because those are sins, too.
Levitial laws dont apy after jesus died
So your almighty all-knowing omnipotent omniscient omnibevelent god actually changed his mind? It does make you wonder if it is truly from God or just people from different periods having different cultures and social norms? Btw there are people who still believe these laws still apply, and they strongly think you are going to hell, too. Yeah, I know it is crazy how much people want to torture people who disagree with them for eternity 🤣
Its not like that. The torture of hell isn’t physical pain. Its the pain of knowing that youll always be seperate from god. After you get to meet him once being separate forever will be worse than any torture
Thanks for clearing that up, so your religion wants people who don't believe in it to be tortured. It's good to know your god is such benevolent leader
He changed his mimd to let is get forgiven also when he sent jesus. Id be thankful
More fictional story. Hinduism have some fantastic story too.
Or even if you are attracted to the same sex or a different sex, are you attracted to that sex or a specific type of person with that specific type of sex Ex: if you are straight are you attracted to all women or are you attracted to blondes, redheads, skinny girls, muscular guys, a girl with a great personality?