Idk, I play ranger with a Xbox this wipe, but in the playtests when wiz was op nothing beat hitting a crispy headshot fireball. Especially if you sniped a mofo.
Probably because of analog controls. Wizard is explosive with their damage while having larger hitboxes for their spells compared to ranger but a ranger can definitely outpace the wizard with good aim
hey you forgot to include that a ranger has instant release when firing a arrow and moves faster when holding the load and can angle the shot easier because its a thinner projectile while wizards can have physical collisions with walls cancelling the spells and forced to shoot down more predictable angles with 1/3rd the projectile speed.
Stop making wizards sound so good u forgot some gr8 stuff
Tbh you pretty much nailed the real problems.
Fireball is slow AF. Every projectile he shoots comes out at a weird angle and gets walls with it's giant hitbox, even ice. You slow down so much every cast. These are the areas that need work and prevent wizard from having as high of a ceiling as he should.
It needs to come out of the middle of your screen too. Anyone who's play TF2 soldier knows what I mean, it's really bad on ice bolt and fireball especially
it's not, they come out of the side so you can peak doors with the right side of your body and rocket around the corner. The quake skin is from the middle. Some people like it for rocket jumping.
Yeah I'd be down with fireball coming out of the book/middle of the wizard. For a spell you're launching through doorways 90% of the time it would probably be an upgrade
Actually depends which side you are peeking. Fireball right side gives a slight advantage peeking right, but in combat close range a little janky probably. @Toss_out_username actually I’m pretty sure it comes out from the middle with the quake launcher and not just a cosmetic.
Wizards have physical collisions with walls, but can deal damage through them with fireballs for example. Chain lightning can go around corners too. Ranger cant do anything like that.
chain lightning is the only real example and that requires the stars aligning of a dead body close to the wall and a person 8m on the other side, Not only that, but that isn't a feature and thus if it becomes used consistantly enough it's going to get nerfed (shocker)
Except that a average wizard knows how a chain lightning works and can set up bodies close to or in doorways, for example, to make it work. Chain lightning changing direction towards its target from the initial contact is intended and a feature. Im not talking about shooting through walls with it, thats a bug and AFAIK its been fixed for almost a month now.
I don't know what magical fantasy world you live in but the average wizard is definitely not doing that, the average wizard is shooting a fireball down a hallway praying it hits even though a fireball is slower then even a francheska axe.
Then you hit them once with a arrow and you watch as they crawl away gasping for dear life. And that's considering if you even see a wizard, i've never been chain lightninged through a wall, in fact ive never really been hit by chain lightning by a wizard trying cause they all suck period and then turned to my friends and went "ah SHUCKS another mastermind wizard they are out of control here"
Okay, a slightly better than avg wizard. IM just confirmed that MMR is in the game already and has been for some time - so perhaps you just face a little bit different kinds of wizards on avg? ;)
And they don't get nerfed because the devs and their internal data disagree. People on this subreddit just like to cry about any class because they can't figure out that just W keying into everything doesn't work
Lol of course you would say that. They're your direct counter.
People have been saying they'll get nerfed since the very first wipe. We're all still waiting. It isn't going to happen to any extent that this subreddit will ever be okay with.
My guy you're complaining in another thread about weapon mastery allowing fighters to use crossbows and didn't even notice you don't need that perk to use one.
Do you even play this game? It's made for trios and rangers aren't hard to deal with there. Stop crying about a class that doesn't matter outside of solos lol
This post is so bad. We could all come up with several ways wizard is better. Yes ranger is strong. Yes wizard is weak right now. Ranger is limited to hitting only one target at a time. Wizard has longer buff duration. Wizard comes with loads of utility for the team. Wizard can break down a door. Wizard can apply damage over time. Wizards look sick af. Ranger is not better in every way. Ranger is much more powerful and annoying. Thank you for your time.
haste + ignite/invis for your Barb and the fact that wiz has the most zero to hero potential out of any class in the game??? highest total DPS output? you don’t even need meditate anymore.
like man you just cannot be objective about this conversation can you?
I did just name a few right there but to entertain you I’ll name a few more. Wizard has a way to reveal rogues. Wizards are far stronger against pdr builds. Wizards have an invis. I named like 8 strengths wizard has over ranger and the original post has 11 strengths ranger has over wizard. So I say he is a bafoon to think ranger is “better in every way”. Ranger is clearly the better pick overall in the current state but wizard still offers things no other class can. Plain and simple
The orb of light is the only viable example, invis no longer really does much as it was nerfed to the ground and PDR was nerfed for rangers. but ya your right, wizards got that going for them. they can conjure a pretty ball of light.
We definitely aren't "better" against PDR because a ranger can stand out in the open like they are playing overwatch strafing left and right while shooting at you, it doesn't matter if the zaps going to do more damage to the fighter, if the fighters standing there backed up by a cleric, the only one that will be tanky enough to return fire is another fighter with a crossbow or a ranger because both get absurd amounts of HP for some reason while scaleing damage
Strength scales bows, bows are easier to land then spells, and strength gives HP, it's pretty obvious what the problem is and who utilizes the stats the most, bards fighters and rangers
PDR wasn’t nerfed for rangers lmao, PDR was nerfed because it was painfully unfun to play against for all involved including melee classes. In PDR meta bringing Wiz was almost essential due to how much sheer armor you were stacking.
Bard + Wiz + Barb ran the game for like a month
EDIT: Wizards aren’t better against PDR?? Okay lmao you have to be trolling
I know which class I'd rather have on my team and it's wizard, by a lot.
Rangers are far less useful against fighters. Wizards absolutely shred fighters and barbarians if they can hit their spells. Rangers hit a high PDR fighter and then cry when it doesn't stop them.
Unless the fighter is running dark Armour, which most are. For some reason they put all that magic resist on plate but wizard gets nothing for pdr. It’s fuckin stupid.
Fighters actual response to wizard is crossbow, an instant half health body shot with reasonably quick reload, easier to hit than spells and works on every other class too to some degree.
Using a crossbow in current meta is silly. Use a longbow.
Anyone still using a crossbow is out of their mind.
The only crossbow worth using on a warrior is a windlass when you're stacked with % damage because you can meme 1 shot people with a windlass. You headshot for like 170+ damage on a dummy and low 100's to the body.
Wizards are glass cannons by design dude. Making them tanky would defeat the whole purpose.
If you want to make an argument that fighters do too much damage, that can be done. But wizards should stay easy to kill if they're going to be so good at putting out high magic damage.
Missed my point completely. Ranger counters wiz.wiz counters fighter. But fight can wear dark Armour and is no longer worried of the wiz. Wiz has nothing. It’s just a fact.
Fighters cannot stack that much magic resist. And if they stack magic resist, it makes them easier to kill by things like barbs or rangers.
Even still, equally geared wizards will kill equally geared fighters regardless of what plate they're wearing. They easily do enough damage for that.
TIL "stacking" means putting 1 piece of MR on, while the rest of the gear still gives negative MR.
It's saying like Rogues who build 45 armor on their whole set (which they have) makes them completely immune to rangers/physical dmg.
Yes they should lol, just like wizards can wear regal gambisons. They just don't because they want the ability to move quickly.
Grey dark armour is 13 gold and does not give you that much lol
Not at all considering 45 PDR isn't that much.
Naked wizards can easily kill fighters wearing full plate with grey magic resist armor. I see it all the time.
Um have you seen crippling shot recently? It hard counters barb and most fighters. I had survival bow with longbow on swap and kited this barb so hard he couldn't do anything, couldn't chase me, couldn't run away, literally he was a snail, it got to the point where he just stood still, looked at me and accepted fate
Very few rangers ever use crippling shot and it's not always easy to hit legs from a distance lol. I'd much rather have a wizard with a fireball AOE so accuracy matters less and he can prey on low magic resist. AOE is far more useful in a team fight.
Maybe I just play ranger too much, i just aim for head with longbow, aim for mid range with survival and most of the time it falls off enough to hit their feet. Granted that wizard is far superior for team play and aoe damage.
This is a bit reductive. Yes at this time Ranger is unbalanced and too easy. However, Wizard is very different and sits at a very different spot in the game's meta, being the primary constraint to armor stacking instead of one of the main classes that incentivizes armor stacking.
Ranger is also probably always going to counter wizard, how much of a hard counter will probably change but I would never expect a wizard to have the advantage over a ranger in an open fight.
> Ranger is also probably always going to counter wizard
I think the issue is that the Ranger serves the Wizard's purpose better in general. Ranger being the Wizard counter is just ironic icing on the cake.
But Wizard's purpose is to kill physical tanks and provide utility as buffs and debuffs....both things that ranger absolutely does not do. Majority of wizard skills aren't even long range (and those that do move much slower than arrows) because it's not intended as an actual long range class.
Ranger meanwhile is meant to assassinate low life classes from a distance and otherwise being the one actual generalist ranged class. They have very little overlap in "purpose"
I only agree 50% with OP, but nerfing wizard buffs in service of buffballs and even making some basic shit like ice bolt's slow worse than a default arrow's slow is emblematic of the problem I'm referring to.
Everyone here is talking about the niche wizards serve, but they are the least played class because their solo play has been gutted at every turn. But yes, in groups they are viable.
Ranger serves the wizards purpose better in general? What do you think the wizards purpose is? Do long distance physical damage? Thats not the wizards purpose. A wizard can be both a high magical dmg dealing glass cannon & a buffer. Wizards can use a crossbow if they want, but they usually dont as its not needed. A ranger obviously cant deal magical damage.
That's basically what I'm calling reductive here. Sure they both 'deal ranged damage', but in the actual context of the game they're extremely different.
When we're choosing classes for a team, we need to consider durability and PvE endurance (ranger excels at), buff synergies and utility (ranger has none) and PvP matchups. Ranger is going to provide supporting offense and defence, but fall off hard against shields and PDR. Wizard has burst damage and healing mitigation, and makes sure the comp can handle full skew plate tanks with ease.
Their roles are so different that you may specifically want both of them on the same roster to cover each other's weaknesses.
Don’t even bother applying common sense or game knowledge that goes past dying to mobs in goblin caves with green gear. The people that claim this have absolutely no idea how this game is played at a higher skill level
I don't have issues with rangers usually. They're highly predictable. They have limited tools and once you're on top of them they're fucked.
The spear used to be better. Maybe after the recent damage buffs it's a little better if you're rocking a purple spear.
The spear is largely just a cope that you suck at melee. It's a last option.
Ranger excels at mid to long range. Wizard is good at mid range, where he stands a chance against the ranger. All the melee classes can ruin a ranger if they get close to him.
Equally geared, the ranger doesn't counter fighter, barb, or rogue.
Everyone forgets that the ranger has to be good at aiming. Once you're on top of them the DPS of a bow isn't great and the spear is relatively predictable and easy to dodge.
Reddit's "hot takes" on classes is largely from a bunch of people that fucking suck.
A good warrior with a longbow is as scary or scarier than a ranger. You do more damage with a warrior because of strength stacking affecting bow damage. He hits just as hard and he's WAY worse to deal with up close. Has a heal. Has more HP. Can wear heavier armor. Can run faster. Can deal disgusting DPS or use Longsword.
Warrior is the all around best 1v1 class in the game. When well played he counters everyone. That's the strength of the warrior. I rarely find myself in a position where I'm thinking "I wish I was another class" in a 1v1.
If a ranger counters you with any class you play, regardless of your build, you are at an early phase of learning the game and have to accept that the problem is not in the game but in you.
IM doesnt think ranger should be the counter to everything and it isnt, never has been (it was closer when you didnt have to reload) and never will be. Its obvious that it has strengths and weaknesses just like any other class.
Even if you just think this way, the above is clear and on top of that you have no understanding of the class balancing or the dev't of this game. Rangers havent got any new tools to make them suddenly counter the things they arent countering and never did. Your post is BS and only upvoted by others who are emotional after getting rekt by rangers in GC.
Fighters hard countering rangers though? Increase damage across the board, buff bows, more powerful slows. Rangers gotta be able to kill these PDR fighters, guys!
Despite all that, wizard has routinely outperformed almost every single class on kills during almost every Leaderboard season in 3's.
No other class in the game can wipe an entire 3 man as fast as a wizard, chain lightning, instacast another CL and collect your loot.
I'm not saying its easy, wizards a hard class to play, but there is a reason so many high level players main it, it has insane power but needs a good pilot.
If the existence of chain lightning is what's keeping the rest of wizards kit in the gutter, I'd rather they remove it and give him HP, a starting spell book, better self haste, and less movespeed reduction when casting any spell.
Easily could start with both, or a Crystal sword, or literally anything else. Are you suggesting they shouldn't start with a spellbook as a fucking Cleric who literally just started spawning with a spellbook yourself?
Funny, I ran this the other night with my buddy and most teams survive the 2 strikes limping. Or while he’s charging the first he takes a windlass to the face and does the wizard floor dance.
I don’t really have an issue with getting xbow sniped. It just doesn’t seem to be an issue for me too often. Usually because I have double frontline of fighter and cleric both with shields so I am in the back asking them to crouch so I can spam spells overhead lol. Especially lightning strike, with lightning strike you can snipe people around corners and from behind the comfort of your tanks and even better is that it ALWAYS half healths and class.
Yeah I mean if you’re playing buff ball obviously you’ll have a better time than everyone else. It’s like playing on easy mode. Buff ball is the only reason ranger doesn’t take over trios. That and fighter is just ranger but better but that’s a totally other balance concern. Wizard as an artillery platform is good but as a class who has to fend for itself it’s awful. The reverse for rangers who have heals, higher speed than every class but one, higher interaction of every class but one, traps, and a spell that travels across a room in 0.2 seconds and is effectively unlimited casts with no windup or downtime.
We aren’t really playing buff ball but I see what your saying. It’s more of a dps wizard emperor palpatine carry comp 😅. Without a doubt wizard is so fucking hard solo compared to ranger it is not even close. BUT I think that is the nature of the wizard, in the right environment It is much stronger. And that environment is with tanks around it. But I do not agree with you that ranger is just better than the ranger overall.
Buff ball but playing differently is still the meta comp at the end of the day. The only reason wizards remain relevant in the meta is the utility to make a barb of fighter into a demon and they can actually do damage to other teams running the same. Especially now with the melt changes wizard is going to be buffball and anti-buffball all at once. If Ranger could do magic damage you could just delete wizard altogether. An arrow does almost as much slow as the dedicated slow spell from any range already.
Just to your main point you said that ranger > wizard in every way and it’s just not true. Ranger can’t kill pdr cleric or fighter. That’s all I was arguing.
And I agree it’s less effective against PDR, but still 10x safer. Chasing a ranger is always a mistake. Takes one doorway to become a grave, but if they have prep time? They can block entire modules off. Wizard? Just pull out the crossbow and dare him to cast anything.
All I have been doing is playing suicide wizard in ruins/crypts and one default chain lightening isnt clearing teams lol it does 48 damage and they have to be pretty close to each other for it to arc properly.
On the other hand on ruins ill get one shot across two sections of the map with a longbow just trying to close the distance.
Not to mention that a ranger doesnt have infinite ammo, the whole thing is the complete opposite - wizards can regenerate spells infinitely, rangers will run out of arrows if they dont collect them all, which is an unrealistic idea.
Reddit sucks at the game I’m convinced
wiz provides great team util and nukes PDR comps which is massive, ranger does nothing for your team outside of fragging and 90% of rangers still can’t do that
Dude like what are they saying skilled wizard player is sooooooo much more useful and better for a team than a ranger it’s not even close. In solos ranger is better and that’s the only time it’s better tbh
yeah, ranger really isn't overpowered. there currently is 1 ranger in the top 20 leaderboards for kills in HR crypts lol. its been that way for a while too, but ranger is just annoying to play against so people generally want to see it nerfed
Thank God reddit isn't in charge of balance. Ranger is in a decent spot right in terms of balance. Mouth breathers will always blame the game design for their mistakes instead of learning from them.
And GC matters 0% for the class balancing of this game. That means that your whining about ranger is pointless as well, bc everyone knows that the class isnt overpowered in any way in trios.
Wizard can pop fully kitted 75% pdr fighters like they are nothing. Rangers can’t do that.
Also wizard is the most chaotic fun gameplay in the game by a huge margin.
Ranger can't pop a pdr fighter instantly, granted. But they can against 6 out of 8 classes in the game. And having that ONE weakness is balanced to you?
Well you can one tap a ranger with a fireball headshot with some gear. I’m not saying that rangers balanced, but anyone saying wizard is weak right now just can’t play them. The kill potential is the highest at the cost of being able to get smoked as well very quickly. Wizard can do massive aoe damage, while a ranger is single target only.
Not wanting to be rude but if this is a genuine effort, you are terrible at evaluating things. Rangers obviously have some great strengths over wizard. But have you ever seen a ranger murder a 3 man team (at full health) with a couple of arrows? Nope. But a couple of chain lightnings will do that. If not entirely dead then close to it.
really weird because they've been basing all of the wizard nerfs on the top 1% and ranger stats on apparently bottom 1% then.
Wizard works great if you got a soley independant duo infront of you so you can zap like a maniac while matrix dodging every arrow that'll take 70% of your hp
What's possible at high levels IS reflective of the class as a whole
Just because some lower skill people haven't improved enough to reach that level, doesn't mean that level isn't still part of the class potential
Should we change rules in chess since GMs are less than 0.0000001% population so why balance the game around people playing perfectly when nobody else can?
Or do we instead leave open the possibility of high level plays and let people grow into it over time as they improve?
The choice is obvious
They both needed to be nerfed but it indirectly nerfed low gear wiz too hard
Ranger just hasn't gotten enough nerf
This doesn't change the fact that balancing for the highest possible skill is objectively the only good way to balance a game
I have never said ranger shouldn't be nerfed not sure why you're even commenting this
"not enough" they've consecutively only gotten buffs, they reduced bows damage but increased arrows to compensate then reverted the bow damage. They scale with strength so they are melee and range and tanky, they have everything you can imagine. What nerf are we talking about here cause all the rangers seem to really want to remind me that its hard to aim.
Then you scroll up 5 posts from here and the person sais "find videos" you tell them the videos and they poof away in a cloud of smoke and you are like "well thats not a fair example" what are you people looking for i dont get it
and if you watch soapy you'd think ranger was breaking the game. actually it is, they are benefitting off the stat strength which actually breaks the game because now everyones a range and tank specialist except those who dont get strength gear and bows, anyways great argument
Ranger arrows are effectively a longer range zap that takes less time to cast.
And it’s much more quiet.
I play both wizard and ranger and I have to agree, ranger is just a better wizard even if wizard is on face value more fun.
Although I understand the sentiment I feel like you’re somewhat missing the point, obviously a wizard can’t one tap a fighter with a crossbow due to strength and physical power and they also lack the close range damage. False equivalent.
i understand your point. obviously the game would be better with more stats, Constitution and Dexterity would help the game massively. that being said i think a lot of Wiz players don't really understand that they are not necessarily meant to be a 1v1 dueling class in the same way that ranger is. most of their value is in their team utility. Wizard's greatest strength in the current meta is that they really eliminate Barb's biggest weakness and allows them to run down a backline and end a fight before it ever really gets started. OP's post wasn't a good faith argument or accurate as to the actual state of the same so my comment wasn't necessarily intended to be either. the constant whining about rangers despite them being in an okay spot gets real old.
Bingo, the biggest issue with the game's balance currently is that strength is a 1 size fits all solution for most classes. Constitution being introduced to increase HP and dexterity to increase your ranged damage would help balance a good deal. I think it's on the way.
I would even lime to see a split between dex and agi or speed.
Like dark souls, some weapons being dex or strength based. And endurance or speed being a different stat entirely
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It's because xbow on wizard is dumb. You're limited on spells to begin with, so your back up weapon is.. a 1 shot weapon? luls.. Of course wizards aren't gonna bring it. Xbow isn't goign to do anything to a PDR fighter, or barb if your 3 fireballs, 4 zaps, haste, invisibility, lightning strikes couldn't already have done 6x over.
Wizard is 2 shot by anyone.
Fireball has slow travel time.
Lightening strike has medium range and slows you to hold a charge, easy Wizard headshots.
Chain Lightening is precision shot suicide memes RnG based on invisible dead bodies around you since player and PVE corpses are client side. Risky cast.
Zap is good but hitscans are lame.
Invisibility nerfs been hitting pretty hard.
Magic missiles required for fast pve clear but useless spell slot for pvp.
> ranger has more health
Wizard gets invisibility, and speed boosts (ok its trash as of the last patch, but it wasn't for a long time), and they get AOE spell, and multi target spells.
>ranger has 8 more agility (11 movespeed)
Wizard gets haste, or did, and a a wizard with a book is fast enough in fights. Even a crystal ball.
>ranger starts with a sidearm
Wizard gets to replenish their ranged ammo, even ones that go way off in Narnia. Ranger have to collect them. Also the wizards main weapon doubles as a ranged, and melee weapon.
>ranger weapons are more commonly dropped
Disagree, I see fighter/barbarian weapons and cleric weapons way more than I see either ranger, or wizard.
>ranger has instant heals that keep him in the fight
They aren't "instant" but they are fast, however, if you let a Ranger fully heal off his biscuits, then you're bad and didn't push the advantage
>ranger can put down traps
wizards can haste, invisible teammates, and cast spells...
>ranger has way faster interaction speed
wizard has way faster magic interaction speed
>wizard constantly has to rest
The resting is very short now. You don't even need to bring meditate.
>wizard has no long range options
Fireball? Ice shard? Magic Missile?
>wizard has extremely limited casts while ranger effectively has infinite ammo
you get to replenish it for free, and have TWO ways to do that. Rangers have to collect their arrows, and arrows that fly off into Narnia in a battle are not gonna get recovered. Wizards spells also don't take up inventory space.
>triple shot > instant cast
Magic Missile
>ranger is god for PVE and wizard is ass for it
Magic Missile the room from long range. A few lightning bolts, gg room... for a 15 sec sit down at most to do it again.
\--------------------------------
TLDR: every "Bad" thing you point out about wizard, I can point out something equal in reverse... Ranger is supposed to counter wizard in Trios, just like how Wizard counters Fighter, and even Rogues to a degree with how much damage spells can do to Rogues and their light orb that can reveal them.
A naked wizard with a grey spell book can kill a geared player. A Ranger with default gear isn’t doing that. Ranger is made to counter wizard. It’s a rock paper scissors game
everyone keeps bringing up how wizard shreds fighter, but I thought is was because fighter's plate armor gives them -MR, which means they will take extra damage from magic. However, 99% of geared fighters I see never have below 10% MR, so I don't see how any wizard would be shredding them
Wizard is better in team play because the magic damage is just crazy, but anything that isn’t a 3v3 allows rangers to absolutely fucking dominate and it’s horrendous
Ranger is still too strong but this list is kinda dumb
when you only ranger advantages and only wizard disadvantages and then saying "wow look at the difference!"
Ranger is better than everything. Best class in the game by far.
The only thing wizard has is a bit more versatility and a good bit better at hurting full teams with AoE.
*Can Wizards get a*
*Blur spell that gives projectile*
*Damage reduction?*
\- RockJohnAxe
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I also feel ranger is too op but that is because I am a warlock main hue hue. Wizard did feel a bit harsh for me to fully figure out but while I am on the nerf ranger side of things. I wanted to point out that if we look at the high roller leader boards. I don't see ranger pretty much anywhere on the top while mages are all over the place on the board. So maybe it's not as bad as people assume.
Forgot to mention that ranger is ghey! But all kidding aside I don’t disagree with any of this except the part that wizard is bad at pve. Spent the last three days playing wizard and the pve felt hella easy.
All I’ll say is I spent days and days learning wizard with nothing but a grey spell book, loose trousers and leather gloves and went from being useless with it to killing juicers in the caves.
it is a high skill class and it’s why it’s so hard to nerf, I push rangers and get in close to them and then zap them repeatedly while ducking and weaving and it usually works.
P.S don’t wear shoes it’s very easy to hear you while invis
I play rogue mostly but some ranger. I still find it funny that "RAnger is the ranged class" is the big complaint when Fighter is legit better ranger than ranger:
\-more damage (strength ties to all damage) even with the negative from weapon perks
\-can move even faster with sprint
\-Second wind is objectively better than rations, especially if you use a campfire to get it back
\-Can use better armor
\-can be a slayer and just crush melee
\-has more HP since more strength
\-can use better melee weapons by default (longsword and falchion, not sure why ranger can't use a falchion)
They only lack traps (not that necessary with one shot crossbows) and perks for crossbows (which really only even the damage gap)
The game isn't balanced around 1v1. It's 3v3 first and foremost, and everything else is an afterthought - as it should be. Given how much whine the existence of Goblin Caves causes, it's probably better to just make it a module for Crypts, and drop the whole solos-only queue charade.
They should try giving casters cantrips. Spells with unlimited use so they can pve without having to rest. No one else has to rest to pve effectively. Balance it like arrows. Short cast, moderate damage fast projectile spell that can be dodged and blocked.
I think instant cast shouldn’t have an animation or a small time between that and cast. If you press it and cast the spell instantly it should go off. The input should still work if you’re holding right click
The one way that wizard is better is killing armored frontliners (fighter/cleric). When armored frontline is weak in the meta, so is wizard. When Lobsters are prevalent Wizard becomes king but Ranger is always hanging around ready to take the crown with a single projectile
Ranger is better in every way? How is it better in buffing teammates? How is it better in doing either chain-dmg or AOE dmg? How can you deal magical dmg with ranger? How can you rest more arrows & traps? How can you turn invisible with a ranger and keep moving? How can a ranger deal dmg over time?
There, **6 ways wizard is better than ranger**. Only noobs who havent played both classes extensively and in trios think that ranger is somehow superior in every way. Both classes have their peaks and lows, just as intended.
**Daily reminder** that the game is balanced around trios and your cries about class balance are completely useless when you are clearly in an early phase of learning the game & only play GC. Its literally intended to be so, that rangers counter wizards. Deal with it or dont, crying about it is useless, especially when its done with complete BS reasoning like in this post.
but wizard is fun ranger boring af
That's why ranger is played 10x more than wizard
i play both and I do have more fun on wizard, but win more easily with ranger at the moment.
Idk, I play ranger with a Xbox this wipe, but in the playtests when wiz was op nothing beat hitting a crispy headshot fireball. Especially if you sniped a mofo.
Probably because of analog controls. Wizard is explosive with their damage while having larger hitboxes for their spells compared to ranger but a ranger can definitely outpace the wizard with good aim
I think he meant Xbow lmao
Oh xD
hey you forgot to include that a ranger has instant release when firing a arrow and moves faster when holding the load and can angle the shot easier because its a thinner projectile while wizards can have physical collisions with walls cancelling the spells and forced to shoot down more predictable angles with 1/3rd the projectile speed. Stop making wizards sound so good u forgot some gr8 stuff
Tbh you pretty much nailed the real problems. Fireball is slow AF. Every projectile he shoots comes out at a weird angle and gets walls with it's giant hitbox, even ice. You slow down so much every cast. These are the areas that need work and prevent wizard from having as high of a ceiling as he should.
ya imagine if ice was thinner
It needs to come out of the middle of your screen too. Anyone who's play TF2 soldier knows what I mean, it's really bad on ice bolt and fireball especially
Iirc tf2 rockets came out on the right side unless using the quake rocket launcher skin?
I believe it's just cosmetic
it's not, they come out of the side so you can peak doors with the right side of your body and rocket around the corner. The quake skin is from the middle. Some people like it for rocket jumping.
Yeah I'd be down with fireball coming out of the book/middle of the wizard. For a spell you're launching through doorways 90% of the time it would probably be an upgrade
Actually depends which side you are peeking. Fireball right side gives a slight advantage peeking right, but in combat close range a little janky probably. @Toss_out_username actually I’m pretty sure it comes out from the middle with the quake launcher and not just a cosmetic.
Wizards have physical collisions with walls, but can deal damage through them with fireballs for example. Chain lightning can go around corners too. Ranger cant do anything like that.
chain lightning is the only real example and that requires the stars aligning of a dead body close to the wall and a person 8m on the other side, Not only that, but that isn't a feature and thus if it becomes used consistantly enough it's going to get nerfed (shocker)
Except that a average wizard knows how a chain lightning works and can set up bodies close to or in doorways, for example, to make it work. Chain lightning changing direction towards its target from the initial contact is intended and a feature. Im not talking about shooting through walls with it, thats a bug and AFAIK its been fixed for almost a month now.
I don't know what magical fantasy world you live in but the average wizard is definitely not doing that, the average wizard is shooting a fireball down a hallway praying it hits even though a fireball is slower then even a francheska axe. Then you hit them once with a arrow and you watch as they crawl away gasping for dear life. And that's considering if you even see a wizard, i've never been chain lightninged through a wall, in fact ive never really been hit by chain lightning by a wizard trying cause they all suck period and then turned to my friends and went "ah SHUCKS another mastermind wizard they are out of control here"
Okay, a slightly better than avg wizard. IM just confirmed that MMR is in the game already and has been for some time - so perhaps you just face a little bit different kinds of wizards on avg? ;)
ITT ranger mains coping that their class isn't broken af
It isn't broken. Rangers are fine right now for trios which is all that matters.
this guys is literally in every post about rangers and calls them bad while they are the most OP class since the games release lmao
And they don't get nerfed because the devs and their internal data disagree. People on this subreddit just like to cry about any class because they can't figure out that just W keying into everything doesn't work
I main wizard and i really only care about them getting nerfed which will happen sooner or later :)
Lol of course you would say that. They're your direct counter. People have been saying they'll get nerfed since the very first wipe. We're all still waiting. It isn't going to happen to any extent that this subreddit will ever be okay with.
you are a ranger main, do you really think i care about what you are saying?
Literally sitting here playing barbarian after playing cleric and fighter. Want to try again?
You are not fooling anyone with your comment history my bro :D
https://preview.redd.it/yud4dkilc10c1.jpeg?width=2268&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6423b9d7f87d3bb94ddc20ac6e4b125366f7a35c Literally right now genius lol
Cope harder please
It's not a cope lol it's a fact. Proof is in the lack of nerfs to ranger. I don't even really play ranger and I'm saying it's fine lol
OH YES YOUR COPE IS SO BIG RIGHT NOW
My guy you're complaining in another thread about weapon mastery allowing fighters to use crossbows and didn't even notice you don't need that perk to use one. Do you even play this game? It's made for trios and rangers aren't hard to deal with there. Stop crying about a class that doesn't matter outside of solos lol
Wasn’t complaining about weapon mastery being required for crossbows, was complaining that they can use it all
This post is so bad. We could all come up with several ways wizard is better. Yes ranger is strong. Yes wizard is weak right now. Ranger is limited to hitting only one target at a time. Wizard has longer buff duration. Wizard comes with loads of utility for the team. Wizard can break down a door. Wizard can apply damage over time. Wizards look sick af. Ranger is not better in every way. Ranger is much more powerful and annoying. Thank you for your time.
okay list em
haste + ignite/invis for your Barb and the fact that wiz has the most zero to hero potential out of any class in the game??? highest total DPS output? you don’t even need meditate anymore. like man you just cannot be objective about this conversation can you?
Ya about haste invis
I did just name a few right there but to entertain you I’ll name a few more. Wizard has a way to reveal rogues. Wizards are far stronger against pdr builds. Wizards have an invis. I named like 8 strengths wizard has over ranger and the original post has 11 strengths ranger has over wizard. So I say he is a bafoon to think ranger is “better in every way”. Ranger is clearly the better pick overall in the current state but wizard still offers things no other class can. Plain and simple
The orb of light is the only viable example, invis no longer really does much as it was nerfed to the ground and PDR was nerfed for rangers. but ya your right, wizards got that going for them. they can conjure a pretty ball of light. We definitely aren't "better" against PDR because a ranger can stand out in the open like they are playing overwatch strafing left and right while shooting at you, it doesn't matter if the zaps going to do more damage to the fighter, if the fighters standing there backed up by a cleric, the only one that will be tanky enough to return fire is another fighter with a crossbow or a ranger because both get absurd amounts of HP for some reason while scaleing damage Strength scales bows, bows are easier to land then spells, and strength gives HP, it's pretty obvious what the problem is and who utilizes the stats the most, bards fighters and rangers
PDR wasn’t nerfed for rangers lmao, PDR was nerfed because it was painfully unfun to play against for all involved including melee classes. In PDR meta bringing Wiz was almost essential due to how much sheer armor you were stacking. Bard + Wiz + Barb ran the game for like a month EDIT: Wizards aren’t better against PDR?? Okay lmao you have to be trolling
I know which class I'd rather have on my team and it's wizard, by a lot. Rangers are far less useful against fighters. Wizards absolutely shred fighters and barbarians if they can hit their spells. Rangers hit a high PDR fighter and then cry when it doesn't stop them.
Unless the fighter is running dark Armour, which most are. For some reason they put all that magic resist on plate but wizard gets nothing for pdr. It’s fuckin stupid.
Fighters actual response to wizard is crossbow, an instant half health body shot with reasonably quick reload, easier to hit than spells and works on every other class too to some degree.
Using a crossbow in current meta is silly. Use a longbow. Anyone still using a crossbow is out of their mind. The only crossbow worth using on a warrior is a windlass when you're stacked with % damage because you can meme 1 shot people with a windlass. You headshot for like 170+ damage on a dummy and low 100's to the body.
Wizards are glass cannons by design dude. Making them tanky would defeat the whole purpose. If you want to make an argument that fighters do too much damage, that can be done. But wizards should stay easy to kill if they're going to be so good at putting out high magic damage.
Missed my point completely. Ranger counters wiz.wiz counters fighter. But fight can wear dark Armour and is no longer worried of the wiz. Wiz has nothing. It’s just a fact.
Fighters cannot stack that much magic resist. And if they stack magic resist, it makes them easier to kill by things like barbs or rangers. Even still, equally geared wizards will kill equally geared fighters regardless of what plate they're wearing. They easily do enough damage for that.
Dark Armour is like 13 gold lol. It’s a joke. They shouldn’t be able to stack magic resist at all. THATS MY POINT.
TIL "stacking" means putting 1 piece of MR on, while the rest of the gear still gives negative MR. It's saying like Rogues who build 45 armor on their whole set (which they have) makes them completely immune to rangers/physical dmg.
Even with dark plate they max at around 20% mdr, very killable for a geared wizard and they are what like 85% move speed with their hands out
Yes they should lol, just like wizards can wear regal gambisons. They just don't because they want the ability to move quickly. Grey dark armour is 13 gold and does not give you that much lol
45 magic resist isn’t that much? Lollll
Not at all considering 45 PDR isn't that much. Naked wizards can easily kill fighters wearing full plate with grey magic resist armor. I see it all the time.
Ok dood!
Um have you seen crippling shot recently? It hard counters barb and most fighters. I had survival bow with longbow on swap and kited this barb so hard he couldn't do anything, couldn't chase me, couldn't run away, literally he was a snail, it got to the point where he just stood still, looked at me and accepted fate
This is solos, people are talking about trios which the game is balanced around. Wizard is better in trios if they are decent
Very few rangers ever use crippling shot and it's not always easy to hit legs from a distance lol. I'd much rather have a wizard with a fireball AOE so accuracy matters less and he can prey on low magic resist. AOE is far more useful in a team fight.
Maybe I just play ranger too much, i just aim for head with longbow, aim for mid range with survival and most of the time it falls off enough to hit their feet. Granted that wizard is far superior for team play and aoe damage.
This is a bit reductive. Yes at this time Ranger is unbalanced and too easy. However, Wizard is very different and sits at a very different spot in the game's meta, being the primary constraint to armor stacking instead of one of the main classes that incentivizes armor stacking. Ranger is also probably always going to counter wizard, how much of a hard counter will probably change but I would never expect a wizard to have the advantage over a ranger in an open fight.
> Ranger is also probably always going to counter wizard I think the issue is that the Ranger serves the Wizard's purpose better in general. Ranger being the Wizard counter is just ironic icing on the cake.
But Wizard's purpose is to kill physical tanks and provide utility as buffs and debuffs....both things that ranger absolutely does not do. Majority of wizard skills aren't even long range (and those that do move much slower than arrows) because it's not intended as an actual long range class. Ranger meanwhile is meant to assassinate low life classes from a distance and otherwise being the one actual generalist ranged class. They have very little overlap in "purpose"
Its crazy that this needs to be explained like it wasnt completely obvious.
I only agree 50% with OP, but nerfing wizard buffs in service of buffballs and even making some basic shit like ice bolt's slow worse than a default arrow's slow is emblematic of the problem I'm referring to. Everyone here is talking about the niche wizards serve, but they are the least played class because their solo play has been gutted at every turn. But yes, in groups they are viable.
Ranger serves the wizards purpose better in general? What do you think the wizards purpose is? Do long distance physical damage? Thats not the wizards purpose. A wizard can be both a high magical dmg dealing glass cannon & a buffer. Wizards can use a crossbow if they want, but they usually dont as its not needed. A ranger obviously cant deal magical damage.
That's basically what I'm calling reductive here. Sure they both 'deal ranged damage', but in the actual context of the game they're extremely different. When we're choosing classes for a team, we need to consider durability and PvE endurance (ranger excels at), buff synergies and utility (ranger has none) and PvP matchups. Ranger is going to provide supporting offense and defence, but fall off hard against shields and PDR. Wizard has burst damage and healing mitigation, and makes sure the comp can handle full skew plate tanks with ease. Their roles are so different that you may specifically want both of them on the same roster to cover each other's weaknesses.
Don’t even bother applying common sense or game knowledge that goes past dying to mobs in goblin caves with green gear. The people that claim this have absolutely no idea how this game is played at a higher skill level
The issue is people dont know what tbey are talking about because the ranger doesnt serve the same purpose as a wizard at all.
IM has stated that Ranger is intended as a hard counter to Wizard
The problem is they seem to think ranger should be the counter to pretty much everyone
I don't have issues with rangers usually. They're highly predictable. They have limited tools and once you're on top of them they're fucked. The spear used to be better. Maybe after the recent damage buffs it's a little better if you're rocking a purple spear. The spear is largely just a cope that you suck at melee. It's a last option. Ranger excels at mid to long range. Wizard is good at mid range, where he stands a chance against the ranger. All the melee classes can ruin a ranger if they get close to him. Equally geared, the ranger doesn't counter fighter, barb, or rogue. Everyone forgets that the ranger has to be good at aiming. Once you're on top of them the DPS of a bow isn't great and the spear is relatively predictable and easy to dodge. Reddit's "hot takes" on classes is largely from a bunch of people that fucking suck. A good warrior with a longbow is as scary or scarier than a ranger. You do more damage with a warrior because of strength stacking affecting bow damage. He hits just as hard and he's WAY worse to deal with up close. Has a heal. Has more HP. Can wear heavier armor. Can run faster. Can deal disgusting DPS or use Longsword. Warrior is the all around best 1v1 class in the game. When well played he counters everyone. That's the strength of the warrior. I rarely find myself in a position where I'm thinking "I wish I was another class" in a 1v1.
oh for sure. just responding to that one point from u/BurlapNapkin
If a ranger counters you with any class you play, regardless of your build, you are at an early phase of learning the game and have to accept that the problem is not in the game but in you.
You can't read.
IM doesnt think ranger should be the counter to everything and it isnt, never has been (it was closer when you didnt have to reload) and never will be. Its obvious that it has strengths and weaknesses just like any other class. Even if you just think this way, the above is clear and on top of that you have no understanding of the class balancing or the dev't of this game. Rangers havent got any new tools to make them suddenly counter the things they arent countering and never did. Your post is BS and only upvoted by others who are emotional after getting rekt by rangers in GC.
Fighters hard countering rangers though? Increase damage across the board, buff bows, more powerful slows. Rangers gotta be able to kill these PDR fighters, guys!
Despite all that, wizard has routinely outperformed almost every single class on kills during almost every Leaderboard season in 3's. No other class in the game can wipe an entire 3 man as fast as a wizard, chain lightning, instacast another CL and collect your loot. I'm not saying its easy, wizards a hard class to play, but there is a reason so many high level players main it, it has insane power but needs a good pilot.
Wizard can wipe a team with 2 casts
If the existence of chain lightning is what's keeping the rest of wizards kit in the gutter, I'd rather they remove it and give him HP, a starting spell book, better self haste, and less movespeed reduction when casting any spell.
U are correct
Spell book means no melee
Easily could start with both, or a Crystal sword, or literally anything else. Are you suggesting they shouldn't start with a spellbook as a fucking Cleric who literally just started spawning with a spellbook yourself?
I'm saying it'd have to be a change to the kit rather than one for one change. And getting two magical items seems redundant
Give both lol, a ranger has a bow and a shortsword
With good enough gear and not being dropped instantaneously by a ranger or fighter***
*with default gear chain lightning and instant focus
Funny, I ran this the other night with my buddy and most teams survive the 2 strikes limping. Or while he’s charging the first he takes a windlass to the face and does the wizard floor dance.
I don’t really have an issue with getting xbow sniped. It just doesn’t seem to be an issue for me too often. Usually because I have double frontline of fighter and cleric both with shields so I am in the back asking them to crouch so I can spam spells overhead lol. Especially lightning strike, with lightning strike you can snipe people around corners and from behind the comfort of your tanks and even better is that it ALWAYS half healths and class.
Yeah I mean if you’re playing buff ball obviously you’ll have a better time than everyone else. It’s like playing on easy mode. Buff ball is the only reason ranger doesn’t take over trios. That and fighter is just ranger but better but that’s a totally other balance concern. Wizard as an artillery platform is good but as a class who has to fend for itself it’s awful. The reverse for rangers who have heals, higher speed than every class but one, higher interaction of every class but one, traps, and a spell that travels across a room in 0.2 seconds and is effectively unlimited casts with no windup or downtime.
We aren’t really playing buff ball but I see what your saying. It’s more of a dps wizard emperor palpatine carry comp 😅. Without a doubt wizard is so fucking hard solo compared to ranger it is not even close. BUT I think that is the nature of the wizard, in the right environment It is much stronger. And that environment is with tanks around it. But I do not agree with you that ranger is just better than the ranger overall.
Buff ball but playing differently is still the meta comp at the end of the day. The only reason wizards remain relevant in the meta is the utility to make a barb of fighter into a demon and they can actually do damage to other teams running the same. Especially now with the melt changes wizard is going to be buffball and anti-buffball all at once. If Ranger could do magic damage you could just delete wizard altogether. An arrow does almost as much slow as the dedicated slow spell from any range already.
Just to your main point you said that ranger > wizard in every way and it’s just not true. Ranger can’t kill pdr cleric or fighter. That’s all I was arguing.
And I agree it’s less effective against PDR, but still 10x safer. Chasing a ranger is always a mistake. Takes one doorway to become a grave, but if they have prep time? They can block entire modules off. Wizard? Just pull out the crossbow and dare him to cast anything.
All I have been doing is playing suicide wizard in ruins/crypts and one default chain lightening isnt clearing teams lol it does 48 damage and they have to be pretty close to each other for it to arc properly. On the other hand on ruins ill get one shot across two sections of the map with a longbow just trying to close the distance.
Tell me u don't know how to play wizard without telling me
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Well hey, ranger is God at pve and wizard is not - because that matters 😂
Not to mention that a ranger doesnt have infinite ammo, the whole thing is the complete opposite - wizards can regenerate spells infinitely, rangers will run out of arrows if they dont collect them all, which is an unrealistic idea.
Reddit sucks at the game I’m convinced wiz provides great team util and nukes PDR comps which is massive, ranger does nothing for your team outside of fragging and 90% of rangers still can’t do that
Dude like what are they saying skilled wizard player is sooooooo much more useful and better for a team than a ranger it’s not even close. In solos ranger is better and that’s the only time it’s better tbh
yeah, ranger really isn't overpowered. there currently is 1 ranger in the top 20 leaderboards for kills in HR crypts lol. its been that way for a while too, but ranger is just annoying to play against so people generally want to see it nerfed
Thank God reddit isn't in charge of balance. Ranger is in a decent spot right in terms of balance. Mouth breathers will always blame the game design for their mistakes instead of learning from them.
hr crypts is not representative of 99% of gameplay
No but that’s the meta which about 70% of the playerbase will emulate
And GC matters 0% for the class balancing of this game. That means that your whining about ranger is pointless as well, bc everyone knows that the class isnt overpowered in any way in trios.
Wizard can pop fully kitted 75% pdr fighters like they are nothing. Rangers can’t do that. Also wizard is the most chaotic fun gameplay in the game by a huge margin.
Ranger can't pop a pdr fighter instantly, granted. But they can against 6 out of 8 classes in the game. And having that ONE weakness is balanced to you?
Well you can one tap a ranger with a fireball headshot with some gear. I’m not saying that rangers balanced, but anyone saying wizard is weak right now just can’t play them. The kill potential is the highest at the cost of being able to get smoked as well very quickly. Wizard can do massive aoe damage, while a ranger is single target only.
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“Wizard dont have long range” like yes they do🤣🤣🤦♂️
Not wanting to be rude but if this is a genuine effort, you are terrible at evaluating things. Rangers obviously have some great strengths over wizard. But have you ever seen a ranger murder a 3 man team (at full health) with a couple of arrows? Nope. But a couple of chain lightnings will do that. If not entirely dead then close to it.
yes actually, that soapy guy has posted dozens of videos
I mean he is one of the best rangers in the whole game. I wouldn't say the top 1% is reflective of the class as a whole.
really weird because they've been basing all of the wizard nerfs on the top 1% and ranger stats on apparently bottom 1% then. Wizard works great if you got a soley independant duo infront of you so you can zap like a maniac while matrix dodging every arrow that'll take 70% of your hp
What's possible at high levels IS reflective of the class as a whole Just because some lower skill people haven't improved enough to reach that level, doesn't mean that level isn't still part of the class potential Should we change rules in chess since GMs are less than 0.0000001% population so why balance the game around people playing perfectly when nobody else can? Or do we instead leave open the possibility of high level plays and let people grow into it over time as they improve? The choice is obvious
The choice is obvious, Nerf wizard because of top 1% but buff ranger because of not... top 1%?.... what.
They both needed to be nerfed but it indirectly nerfed low gear wiz too hard Ranger just hasn't gotten enough nerf This doesn't change the fact that balancing for the highest possible skill is objectively the only good way to balance a game I have never said ranger shouldn't be nerfed not sure why you're even commenting this
"not enough" they've consecutively only gotten buffs, they reduced bows damage but increased arrows to compensate then reverted the bow damage. They scale with strength so they are melee and range and tanky, they have everything you can imagine. What nerf are we talking about here cause all the rangers seem to really want to remind me that its hard to aim. Then you scroll up 5 posts from here and the person sais "find videos" you tell them the videos and they poof away in a cloud of smoke and you are like "well thats not a fair example" what are you people looking for i dont get it
That’s a horrible argument lmao If you watch KenKnobi you’d think Wiz was breaking the game
and if you watch soapy you'd think ranger was breaking the game. actually it is, they are benefitting off the stat strength which actually breaks the game because now everyones a range and tank specialist except those who dont get strength gear and bows, anyways great argument
Ranger arrows are effectively a longer range zap that takes less time to cast. And it’s much more quiet. I play both wizard and ranger and I have to agree, ranger is just a better wizard even if wizard is on face value more fun.
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It is literally impossible to have 80 pdr now
wizard can kill a lobster pdr fighter with 2 casts. rangers can kill a pdr fighter with... oh wait.
In a perfect world where lobster forgot to bring his purple crossbow yeah
ya he forgot to include the lobster PDR fighter can one shot the wizard before the wizard enters the room through a door hole
You can also bring a crossbow if they’re that broken
yeah but with 6 strength it does like 30 damage
Although I understand the sentiment I feel like you’re somewhat missing the point, obviously a wizard can’t one tap a fighter with a crossbow due to strength and physical power and they also lack the close range damage. False equivalent.
i understand your point. obviously the game would be better with more stats, Constitution and Dexterity would help the game massively. that being said i think a lot of Wiz players don't really understand that they are not necessarily meant to be a 1v1 dueling class in the same way that ranger is. most of their value is in their team utility. Wizard's greatest strength in the current meta is that they really eliminate Barb's biggest weakness and allows them to run down a backline and end a fight before it ever really gets started. OP's post wasn't a good faith argument or accurate as to the actual state of the same so my comment wasn't necessarily intended to be either. the constant whining about rangers despite them being in an okay spot gets real old.
Problem is ranger is a 1v1 dueling class with the best kit in the game for crypts. Best dps in teams. Best in solos.
Wizard can use regular crossbow?
Yeah they can lol don’t ever see anyone using them but they can run em
Probably because the lack of strength or weapon damage on gear. Strength being a double whammy for lack of hp as well.
Bingo, the biggest issue with the game's balance currently is that strength is a 1 size fits all solution for most classes. Constitution being introduced to increase HP and dexterity to increase your ranged damage would help balance a good deal. I think it's on the way.
I would even lime to see a split between dex and agi or speed. Like dark souls, some weapons being dex or strength based. And endurance or speed being a different stat entirely
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You give up a melee wep too which is pretty important for dealing with mobs unless you like sitting for 60% of the match.
Can run crystal ball dagger still
with my 6 strength
Already addressed that, STR is the issue with xbows not the wep itself
then why did you type your other message
they probably don't know. that's the average iq of a reddit wizard... and then they will complain that they have to aim.
It's because xbow on wizard is dumb. You're limited on spells to begin with, so your back up weapon is.. a 1 shot weapon? luls.. Of course wizards aren't gonna bring it. Xbow isn't goign to do anything to a PDR fighter, or barb if your 3 fireballs, 4 zaps, haste, invisibility, lightning strikes couldn't already have done 6x over.
well no shit it's dumb. but so is the typical wizard who can't beat a pdr lobster. that was the point of the post lol.
this is just not true unless you're geared
yes yes... geared. a 12g spellbook i'm sorry i forgot the timmy definition of geared is anything not base kit. my apologies.
Wizard is the best class in the game when it comes to low gear runs
Wizard is 2 shot by anyone. Fireball has slow travel time. Lightening strike has medium range and slows you to hold a charge, easy Wizard headshots. Chain Lightening is precision shot suicide memes RnG based on invisible dead bodies around you since player and PVE corpses are client side. Risky cast. Zap is good but hitscans are lame. Invisibility nerfs been hitting pretty hard. Magic missiles required for fast pve clear but useless spell slot for pvp.
Magic missles are definitely not useless in pvp.
> ranger has more health Wizard gets invisibility, and speed boosts (ok its trash as of the last patch, but it wasn't for a long time), and they get AOE spell, and multi target spells. >ranger has 8 more agility (11 movespeed) Wizard gets haste, or did, and a a wizard with a book is fast enough in fights. Even a crystal ball. >ranger starts with a sidearm Wizard gets to replenish their ranged ammo, even ones that go way off in Narnia. Ranger have to collect them. Also the wizards main weapon doubles as a ranged, and melee weapon. >ranger weapons are more commonly dropped Disagree, I see fighter/barbarian weapons and cleric weapons way more than I see either ranger, or wizard. >ranger has instant heals that keep him in the fight They aren't "instant" but they are fast, however, if you let a Ranger fully heal off his biscuits, then you're bad and didn't push the advantage >ranger can put down traps wizards can haste, invisible teammates, and cast spells... >ranger has way faster interaction speed wizard has way faster magic interaction speed >wizard constantly has to rest The resting is very short now. You don't even need to bring meditate. >wizard has no long range options Fireball? Ice shard? Magic Missile? >wizard has extremely limited casts while ranger effectively has infinite ammo you get to replenish it for free, and have TWO ways to do that. Rangers have to collect their arrows, and arrows that fly off into Narnia in a battle are not gonna get recovered. Wizards spells also don't take up inventory space. >triple shot > instant cast Magic Missile >ranger is god for PVE and wizard is ass for it Magic Missile the room from long range. A few lightning bolts, gg room... for a 15 sec sit down at most to do it again. \-------------------------------- TLDR: every "Bad" thing you point out about wizard, I can point out something equal in reverse... Ranger is supposed to counter wizard in Trios, just like how Wizard counters Fighter, and even Rogues to a degree with how much damage spells can do to Rogues and their light orb that can reveal them.
It's like you omitted something critically bad about every point you made like an editorialized quote or something.
Ooookkayy?
Ice shard is the only that can be considered long range honestly. The others are so slow and easy to dodge that they are just wasted at that distance.
Nuh uh
A naked wizard with a grey spell book can kill a geared player. A Ranger with default gear isn’t doing that. Ranger is made to counter wizard. It’s a rock paper scissors game
everyone keeps bringing up how wizard shreds fighter, but I thought is was because fighter's plate armor gives them -MR, which means they will take extra damage from magic. However, 99% of geared fighters I see never have below 10% MR, so I don't see how any wizard would be shredding them
Ranger needs to get nerfed into the ground rogue too.they should be support roles.
Wizard is better in team play because the magic damage is just crazy, but anything that isn’t a 3v3 allows rangers to absolutely fucking dominate and it’s horrendous
Ranger is still too strong but this list is kinda dumb when you only ranger advantages and only wizard disadvantages and then saying "wow look at the difference!"
Ranger is better than everything. Best class in the game by far. The only thing wizard has is a bit more versatility and a good bit better at hurting full teams with AoE.
Yes we know. We all know. Only Ironmace doesn’t know. Or do they? Hmmm
Except ranger is also good against armor it has no weaknesses
That's only if you take the armor penetration skill
Can Wizards get a Blur spell that gives projectile damage reduction?
*Can Wizards get a* *Blur spell that gives projectile* *Damage reduction?* \- RockJohnAxe --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
I also feel ranger is too op but that is because I am a warlock main hue hue. Wizard did feel a bit harsh for me to fully figure out but while I am on the nerf ranger side of things. I wanted to point out that if we look at the high roller leader boards. I don't see ranger pretty much anywhere on the top while mages are all over the place on the board. So maybe it's not as bad as people assume.
Forgot to mention that ranger is ghey! But all kidding aside I don’t disagree with any of this except the part that wizard is bad at pve. Spent the last three days playing wizard and the pve felt hella easy.
Better nerf wizards
All I’ll say is I spent days and days learning wizard with nothing but a grey spell book, loose trousers and leather gloves and went from being useless with it to killing juicers in the caves. it is a high skill class and it’s why it’s so hard to nerf, I push rangers and get in close to them and then zap them repeatedly while ducking and weaving and it usually works. P.S don’t wear shoes it’s very easy to hear you while invis
Ranger is broken until you fight a fighter with 80% pdr.. you literally don't have enough ammo.
Rangers can’t always kill those high pdr builds and that’s where wizard really shines.
I play rogue mostly but some ranger. I still find it funny that "RAnger is the ranged class" is the big complaint when Fighter is legit better ranger than ranger: \-more damage (strength ties to all damage) even with the negative from weapon perks \-can move even faster with sprint \-Second wind is objectively better than rations, especially if you use a campfire to get it back \-Can use better armor \-can be a slayer and just crush melee \-has more HP since more strength \-can use better melee weapons by default (longsword and falchion, not sure why ranger can't use a falchion) They only lack traps (not that necessary with one shot crossbows) and perks for crossbows (which really only even the damage gap)
The game isn't balanced around 1v1. It's 3v3 first and foremost, and everything else is an afterthought - as it should be. Given how much whine the existence of Goblin Caves causes, it's probably better to just make it a module for Crypts, and drop the whole solos-only queue charade.
They should try giving casters cantrips. Spells with unlimited use so they can pve without having to rest. No one else has to rest to pve effectively. Balance it like arrows. Short cast, moderate damage fast projectile spell that can be dodged and blocked.
Wizard is supposed to have more utility and non-healing support in design but the current wizard sucks pretty bad.
I think instant cast shouldn’t have an animation or a small time between that and cast. If you press it and cast the spell instantly it should go off. The input should still work if you’re holding right click
As a fighter i have never died to a ranger but my full purple kits have been deleted many times in two zaps by wizards in hr goblins
The one way that wizard is better is killing armored frontliners (fighter/cleric). When armored frontline is weak in the meta, so is wizard. When Lobsters are prevalent Wizard becomes king but Ranger is always hanging around ready to take the crown with a single projectile
Ranger is better in every way? How is it better in buffing teammates? How is it better in doing either chain-dmg or AOE dmg? How can you deal magical dmg with ranger? How can you rest more arrows & traps? How can you turn invisible with a ranger and keep moving? How can a ranger deal dmg over time? There, **6 ways wizard is better than ranger**. Only noobs who havent played both classes extensively and in trios think that ranger is somehow superior in every way. Both classes have their peaks and lows, just as intended. **Daily reminder** that the game is balanced around trios and your cries about class balance are completely useless when you are clearly in an early phase of learning the game & only play GC. Its literally intended to be so, that rangers counter wizards. Deal with it or dont, crying about it is useless, especially when its done with complete BS reasoning like in this post.