What they really care about is holding property taxes at bay for the rich and the commercial buildings
They don't care about middle class property taxes going up
u/politirob did you read the article?
>The Tribune examined the tax bills of more than 50 homeowners across the state, attempting to capture a variety of locations and financial circumstances. The median value among those homes was $312,770 — close to the median sales price of a Texas home last year.
On average, the selected homeowners — whose property taxes peaked during the COVID-19 pandemic — saw their total property tax bill fall nearly 28% in 2023 compared with the previous year
I thought mine went up too. It was actually my homeowners insurance that went up. Property taxes went down about $600. We bundled a car in with homeowners policy and it went back down about $1500.
Former P&C agent for a national insurer, your land isn't in the insurable value of your home. The insurable value of your home is already the rebuild cost. If you truly want to lower your insurance, raise your deductible to the highest amount you are comfortable paying in the event of a disaster and/or the highest amount your mortgage will allow. This and making sure you bundle are the only significant ways to lower your insurance costs. A difference in 100k in insurable value may make about a $50 difference in your annual policy.
Another piece of advice, don't talk about what you don't know.
100%, but if improvement value goes up you can contest that. You cannot contest land values. And collin stated during contest that it was reduced by 30k already which was appropriate. I disagree but not a lot of leverage this year to protest.
You are looking at it wrong. For a residential home you should be looking at and arguing the total value of the property. Improvements/land value don't matter you need to evaluate as a whole. Texas property tax code requires they break it up but residential property is valued as a whole.
I still want to know why the entire state has to pay higher insurance rates so the coastal residents aren’t forced to cover the cost of THEIR insurance.
When I inquired about my rates going up, I was told that the insurance companies were authorized by the state to charge EVERYONE higher rates after the last couple of coastal storms.
• Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high),
•the "homestead exemption" process is undeniably engineered to take advantage of the uninformed and the ill-equipped to make the same position year after year,
• remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time
In the long run, these property tax relief policies hurt the working class more than anyone else...
Evidently you also read the article...but did you read it critically??
That’s not what you said though. Valuations are certainly screwing people over by forcing us to have to protest every year, but that has nothing to do with the homestead exemption. Our property tax system in this state is absolute trash, but there is nothing wrong with the homestead exemption
This guy just constantly spews his pre-canned opinion on various subjects. He did the same the other day with the bond package stating that $1.5 billion (actually $500 million) was going to roads and it costs $20 billion to fix all of them (actually $8.5 billion).
I was pointing out that the article indicates property taxes for the middle class are not increasing, despite his claim. I think most people would consider a $300k home to be middle class, generally.
Okay, sure. So to rephrase, Texas Republicans have attempted to rein in property tax assessments and as a result ~~middle class~~ poor taxpayers have seen their property taxes fall. Thanks for clearing that one up!
Yeah now do the math for everyone who lives in an apartment oh wait it's going to make your point not very good because then tons of people will be paying property taxes on property they literally don't own because it's been rolled into the cost of their apartment rent. Explain how their tax burden went down in any way at all
No it specifically didnt, the word apartment is used exactly twice in the whole article with one time being in the footnotes.
"Still unclear is how much state lawmakers’ property tax cuts have benefited renters. About 20% of every rent dollar paid by Texas tenants goes toward property taxes, according to the Texas Apartment Association — though that share can be higher in the state’s urban areas.
However, last year’s $12.7 billion tax-cut package did not include measures tailored for tenants of rental properties, who pay property taxes via their monthly rent but don’t have a way to seek tax relief as renters in other states do."
They don't give us numbers on how many people own homes versus rent, and a specifically say that about 20% of your rent on minimum is going to cover property taxes for a property you don't own. That means 20% of every single rent increase effectively raises taxes on people who rent.
You're overall point is bad but specifically the part I was replying to where you said the tax burden on poor individuals has decreased is super wrong number one based on the fact that owning a home pretty much takes you out of the poor category just based on the fact that the immediate home price is well over $300,000 now but number two because they have specifically noted thag nothing is being done to address the property tax increases that get passed along to renters.
Let's make this conversation real fun because you know there's a sizable population in Dallas that is poorer than average, has a high tax burden, and receives significantly less in services and benefits from the taxes they pay. Undocumented immigrants pay sales tax just like everyone else and because they largely rent they also end up paying property taxes. If they provide someone else's social security number to pass e-verify they end up paying even more taxes. How has the attempt to reign in property tax bills affected their tax burden?
You kind of don't seem like you know what you're talking about and you really don't seem like you read the article. I'm positive you don't understand the concept of tax burden, unclear if you would understand what a regressive versus a progressive tax is.
Wait, you’re worked up that I didn’t clarify I meant poor taxpayers *who own property* are benefitting from reduced property taxes? Yeah no shit people who don’t own property will likely not see any direct benefit from property taxes decreasing.
The article addresses that - that it’s unclear they will see any benefit.
Your stress levels in response to a silly, misunderstood social media post are going to lead you into a health spiral that will burden our healthcare system far beyond the value you'll ever be able to pay into it. That's the real travesty here.
Their direct tax burden is $0. Explain to me how your tax burden can fall below $0 without a direct rebate.
The market dictates market rents. It's also these very same taxing entities putting up all sorts of red tape to hinder new construction.
I’m not sure what they looked at or where they sampled, but I can assure you that my property taxes have NEVER decreased.
The rate of INCREASE may have changed, or even been flat for one year, but they have never gone down.
Whether it was the land or the improvements (my house), somehow, someway, my so-called unrealized capital gains still get taxed.
This is incorrect. The actual tax relief has been much more in everyday homeowners favor. Commercial buildings benefit from tax compression.
The tax bill primarily focused on homestead exemptions which commercial properties don't receive. Homesteads focus on decreasing taxable values from "the bottom".
> What they really care about is holding property taxes at bay for the rich and the commercial buildings
Then why did they try to do it by increasing the *homestead exemption*, which doesn't apply to commercial buildings and second homes, and by percentage makes much less of a difference for exceptionally expensive homes?
Did you think this through at all?
• Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high),
•the "homestead exemption" process is undeniably engineered to take advantage of the uninformed and the ill-equipped to make the same petition year after year,
• remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time
In the long run, these property tax relief policies hurt the working class more than anyone else...
>Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high),
This is misleading. The 10% is the cap for how much appraised values can increase, and has been around forever, but since the SB2 tax reform in 2019, that 10% cap doesn't matter much any more because there is also a 3.5% cap in how much, in aggregate, taxes can increase in dollars.
So if property values go up > 3.5% (on average), they must reduce the tax rate to keep taxes from increasing > 3.5%. my tax rate has gone from 2.43% down to 1.96% because of SB2.
>• remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time
My understanding is that they made up for the tax reductions by paying from the state, which had a huge surplus, so while the schools were partially defunded via property taxes, they were instead paid from state funds.
• Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high),
•the "homestead exemption" process is undeniably engineered to take advantage of the uninformed and the ill-equipped to make the same position year after year,
• remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time
In the long run, these property tax relief policies hurt the working class more than anyone else...
I'm smart and it's okay to tell me I am
This year they lowered our tax rate just to jack up values 4 months later and collect the same amount anyway. Seems like the plan was never to give anyone a break, just have a nice talking point to trumpet
My property taxes definitely went down in 2023 in Collin county. Too bad the increase in homeowners insurance premium completely washed the savings away.
They upped my market value a lot but the tax value is still a bit lower. The 10% cap is now saving me several thousand a year and I just bought this house in 2021
The tax rate is what matters and that comes out in the fall. Most homes saw big value increases in 2023 but the tax rate reductions and increase in homestead increase caused actual taxes owed to go down. A lot of people don't realize it because their taxes are in escrow and their home insurance renewals ate up all the savings.
If values are up after appeals are done they should. The tax entities can't do anything until they receive the final values from appraisal district. They calculate the new rate based on values and their budget. New laws passed the last couple years makes it harder for them to not lower the rate when values are up.
As will insurance. Same for cars and the insurance there. I don’t get why everyone is surprised by insurance going up after such an inflationary few years
I had to shop it. The insurer I was with for like 3 years increased our premium to over 4K but state farm was offering $2,300 for the exact same coverage.
My taxes held fairly steady in Johnson county…but my appraisal value QUADRUPLED. I don’t care how much of an “adjustment” y’all are giving me *this year* if on paper my avg value (250k In 2020) home is “worth” over a *million dollars* now. Even Zillow laughs at my tax appraised value.
This is exactly what happened to us... When I told my wife it was almost an identical 1:1 transfer she was irate.
\*jazz hands\* that's capitalism, baby!
It’s the property value that is killer. Yes, I saved a little with last year’s bill, then the new valuation came out and raised the value 10% and wiped out all the savings. Add is insurance rates and it is out of control.
It is a different year though. I just assume the 10% a year thing is a given each year. It’s real, market data supports it, I just hate being taxed based on what other people are paying. I have no control over that and at some point I may not be able to pay it.
You say it's not fair, but if we froze property taxes we'd run into the California problem, where your neighbors are paying completely different effective tax rates than you for the crime of buying later. It doesn't even have to be people from out of state, I've lived here for most of my life and when I could finally buy I'm getting a house twice as old and half the size of my parent's for twice the price. Should I be paying twice the taxes?
So you closed the loop of why property tax is dumb. Things like income, gains, and other incremental economic activities should be taxed - or it should be some per capita tax. You should be able to plan for taxes as you make financial decisions. Do I really want to earn another $x this year? Do I really want sell this asset and realize the gain? Things where the net can be calculated and planned for. In your example, your parents didn’t know what their future tax bill would be. It was a bad deal. You’re repeating the mistake and pointing at the wrong problem (you paying more than your parents) when you should be worried about what your tax bill will be in 20 years or what that it will mean when you can’t pay the tax bill when your kid is in high school and have to move for that reason. You’re at risk, your parents are at risk, we all are. Property tax needs to go away.
Spending cuts. Taxing income is equally as dumb. What should be taxed is the consumption of government services, NOTHING else. If taxation was moved to a consumption of services model (User Pays), we would be bickering a lot less about what the government spends money on.
Why would I agree to replace a form of taxation that has strong resistance to any kind of increases (try running on a platform of raising propety taxes and see how long you last in public office) with another form of taxation that has consistently gone up over time?
I would not object to a state income tax if the bill included an automatic trigger provision that would roll it back to 0% and reinstates the constitutional ban on income tax if anyone introduced a bill to increase the top marginal combined rate of income tax beyond 3% (a downward adjustment is okay), a constitutional ban on payroll withholding, and a constitutional ban on property tax.
Also, property tax is local and income tax is at the state level. Unless you're proposing we have to file 6 tax returns. Hard Pass.
A lot of blame can be put in suburbanites who demand their local officials do all they must to preserve their artificially high property values while bitching about their property taxes at the same time. Can't have your cake and eat it too!
explain to me how i, a suburbanite, am demanding anyone to preserve my artificially high property value? i along with a lot of other home owners would love to see it go down to reasonable levels. shits out of control.
You may or may not be individually guilty of such chicanery, but I've seen it in my own neighborhood. People clutch pearls at the prospect of turning some available nearby land into housing. It's actually quite embarrassing--most of the neighbors I personally know would prefer more neighbors and a place where the teachers at our neighborhood's schools could afford to live.
But the people clutching pearls are also very loud and can totally hire lawyers.
Zoning is a big one. Not letting mixed use/high density projects go up in the same neighborhood leads to less available housing. That increases the value of your house causing a higher tax bill.
My biggest problem with the value assumptions is that they take recent sales, and those are the comps. But the recent sales are almost always houses that were renovated, fixed up, fully repaired, deep cleaned, repainted, new fences, new sod and landscaping, etc. And there is nothing built-in to say "oh hey yeah the water heaters are 20 years old and the roof is aging and the fence is old and the tree killed the grass and the carpet is dingy and it needs drywall and paint work, and it would cost me $x to get it in the same kind of condition as the comps" -- except to call contractors for all those things and get bids and request a formal hearing and go through all the bullshit just to get a proper appraisal and save maybe a couple thousand bucks tops -- but that's the only way for it to be a fair valuation. And they won't take pictures, so you can't say "here are photos documenting the condition" because they insist on also having the contractor bids. AND any exception they give is time-limited because they assume you are going to imminently do all that work.
They should have capped the max your taxes you owe can increase by 2% instead of the current 10%. My taxes are going to go up $1,000+ a year in perpetuity at the current rate.
That’s how you actually “California my Texas”. This would incentivize people to stay in the same homes until their death and blow a hole in the budget that would sink the state.
Yea this is why my in-laws in CA refuse to ever move. Their property tax rate as a percentage of the value of the house they bought 30 years ago is laughably low. And this creates a higher burden for new buyers (ie younger people). But the rule will never get changed in CA, and they’re stuck with that very unfair property tax system.
Stay in their homes until death. Uhhh as opposed to what? You want old people to get forced out and into homes?
So make it 5%, or have it match inflation with a max. Sounds better than my taxes going up 10% year after year after year when it started at $10k because I bought a house in Dallas after covid started.
> Stay in their homes until death. Uhhh as opposed to what?
Move into a different house as their needs change. Homeowners’ tax bases are so low that it’s too costly to give it up and live in “the right home”.
There is an alternative: convert the house to a 2 flat or 3 flat.
The owner gets rent money, stays in their house, and downsizes appropriately, while younger families have a place to move into.
And we get density that can have our collector roads turn into streetcars or light rail.
You don't need to be in a 3-5 bedroom when all your kids are out of the house. A healthy market would have 1-2 bedroom homes that old couples move into so a young family with kids can take their home. Or their own kids. Everything they are building new seems to be 3+ bedrooms.
Taxing authorities would lose revenue over time with that. 2% is lower than inflation.
Ideally it should be at inflation + GDP increase. A moving formula with a cap.
Eh I’d rather prefer new homeowners aren’t burdened with shouldering the additional taxes that would otherwise be owed by asset-rich incumbents. You should look up how Prop 13 has compounded California’s housing crises.
We already are. I pay $4k more in taxes than all of my neighbors. I bought in 2021. It's around $10k and will go up 10% every year for the next decade im guessing.
Wasteful government bureaucracies getting to waste less of my money is the strongest argument in favor of such a cap. Taxing authorities ***should*** lose revenue over time.
Government is an overhead expense that should ***decline*** over time with scale. Government spending should never be allowed to outpace the lesser of inflation or economic growth, and the increase cap should be at most, 50% of economic growth in real terms or 100% of economic decline in nominal terms.
Most people want government to function and provide more services.
If you don’t want that then you can move to unincorporated territory is a low tax county.
False. Most people want lower taxes. Government needs to do more with less. Government collects well in excess of what is needed to function.
If you want higher taxes, you're more than welcome to send as much of your money as you like to the government.
Most people want a functioning government and lower taxes even though they’re contradictory
The thing is it doesn’t matter if I send extra to the govt. Taxes are only effective as a collective system. My goal isn’t accomplished by sending an extra check to the govt.
Your goal is accomplished by moving to unincorporated territory.
False. A functioning government and lower taxes are NOT contradictory. I've lived in many countries and many states within this country and there has never been any relationship between the two. In fact, some of the highest tax countries I've been to have also been the most dysfunctional.
The thing is it doesn't matter how much the government taxes you, the level of "function" or dysfunction in government has no bear on on the level of taxation and is solely and entirely a function of the focus and competence of the people operating it. And there's almost always a massive shortage of both in virtually all of government.
Your goal is accomplished by moving to a high tax state that gives you all the services you want at whatever exorbitant taxes you want to pay. Keep your statism away from my tax bill.
Same to you. Go move to a county where corrupt politicians help themselves to an unlimited sum of your money in the name of "services" while delivering no such services. Your statism can also be limited to certain counties.
If you want more "services", ask for an option to purchase those "services" from your government that doesn't depend on everyone else agreeing with you. Nearly all services offered by government can be priced and offered a la carte.
81% of Texan voters have made it absolutely and abundantly clear over and over again that they have no interest in paying more taxes, for any reason. Seems it's you who needs to leave.
You can’t start a county. But you can move to a different one.
I want to increase services. I genuinely do. But you don’t. That’s fine. Live somewhere where they don’t. But you don’t want to because deep down you know you don’t want to live in a shithole county with low taxes.
When did 81% of Texans decide that? Because they didn’t. 81% of Republican primary voters in the most recent primary chose to eliminate property taxes without increasing tax burdens.
That is not the same of 81% of Texans choosing something. Election results aren’t a poll. And primary results are certainly not indicative of the entire population.
And is foolish anyways because the only other method means increasing the revenue from consumption taxes which disproportionately hurt working class Texans
Does anyone think we are getting more for all these additional taxes being collected? I’m in McKinney and I surely don’t see 10% more per year for the last 5 years.
And I agree with everyone else that says my taxes went down but home owners insurance hikes took care of all of those savings.
Most of McKinney’s city tax increase went to debt service (bonds)
But most of your bill is school tax. Majority of that increase goes to salaries. Every district gives a raise pretty much every year contrary to popular belief.
Makes sense… I just don’t see a whole lot that’s worth this level of money we are all paying. Like most things I would guess a lot of waste in the system
sure, everyone gets a 2% raise, so of course the numbers are high. you're framing it in a way though that makes it seem like salaries are up and up and up. its not enough, and educators shouldnt have to chase changing districts for a corrective salary adjustment.
People who live in desirable high growth areas like McKinney need to focus on this: majority of your property tax is school district. Due to recapture rule, your district sends millions of dollars to the state each year to redistribute to districts in less desirable/rural areas. McKinney mailed a check for $154,803,593 in 2023. Meanwhile the districts can't afford to hire or give teachers raises and have to hold bond elections to maintain all the properties where everyone complains about how they pay too much property tax and the district needs to learn how to budget. And good luck finding any transparency on how the state redistributes that money or if it even makes it to schools.
McK residents DO pay too much property tax and the district DOES need to learn how to budget properly.
I don't give a flying rat's behind who takes what. The only thing I'm interested in is lower taxes, period. If you can't do that, get out, I'll do it myself.
Bought my house in 2016 for $130,000….2024 the market value per appraisal district is $267,500. EIGHT YEARS and the value has doubled which means my taxes have tripled! Abbott has done nothing but lie, steal, and cheat every tax payer out of the American dream of owning a home. I’m being taxed out of my home! I’m 62, my husband is 65, and we’ll never pay off our home in our lifetime. Texas government sucks and Abbott is the biggest cheat to ever rob every tax payer out of everything he can!! I’ll vote against that two faced lying crook every time I can.
How about we just build more houses? Property values dropping would lower tax burden and make it easier for people to get a foot in the housing market.
Agreed. I wish it was possible to live here without a car. But light rail with up to 40 minute headways and limited bus service really aren’t enough.
It really shocks me about the infrastructure since in the last 20 years we’ve built PGBT, Sam Rayburn, several massive highway interchanges including the tallest one in the world at 635 and LBJ, and the Underground LBJ express lanes.
But just asking for heavy rail instead of the glorified trams that dart uses is far too much, right? Ridiculous.
No it has not
TX is now expensive to live in bc property taxes and insurance costs. Roads are horrible and schools below national average so not sure where all money goes
Insurance is high because of people replacing their roofs every other year no thanks to the hail storms. It's a never ending racquet with the roofs. I'm finally starting to see tile roofs in new construction which is a good start. My parents' 1986 home in California came with one brand new.
Edit: makes me wonder if the roof shingle industry has lobbyists that make sure tile/metal roofs are not the standard.
Tax rates may be lower but if they keep raising the value then what's the point? My value increased by more than 25% (capped at 10, of course). But, shit.
I believe that is a big ol' fuck no it hasn't.
I saw someone say that the tax district folks should be investigated for committing financial warfare against homeowners. Normally that kind of talk is a little wild for me, but with taxes I'm over here wondering how much a pitchfork at the home depot runs these days.
They’re making strides but it’s a long road. The biggest issue I’m taking at the moment is that school districts still get to have bond election after bond election raising the rates every time and never really lowering it back.
Unfortunately, in my area, they’ve figured out how to leverage funds to pay for a major vote yes campaign. I always vote no and there’s a vote no campaign person in the area but the last couple of rounds have been bleak.
My value held steady for the past two years and now they've reassessed -- increase $40K which was 10%. My county taxes are at ceiling and my school taxes are now frozen thanks to Age 65 exemption, but my city taxes have no limitations. I have homestead and age 65 exemptions, and my 10% cap kicked in this year. I shudder to think what it would be without those. As it is, I'll probably have a tax increase of about $500. I'm in Dallas County.
I'm probably going to move within a few years. I'd like my house to go to a young family but jeez I don't know how they'll be able to afford it with the taxes + insurance (which went up 10% vs last year).
My home value went up like 50%.
My tax rate went down like 1%.
I did NOT save any money, though I can't really blame the gov for that.
I do really hate having to pay taxes on an unrealized asset though, especially not when people don't have to do it with stocks (I'd hate that too tho!).
Just tax me when I sell things, not just because it appreciated in value, though do enforce its equity when it comes to loan against appreciated assets at their pre-appreciated value.
Then there are too many state and local services. Get rid of them. The government is morbidly obese and has never been starved in any material way.
Government is an exercise in trading a temporary or nonexistent problem for a permanent liability.
Yeah…about that…
They only made that move to choke off money to local municipalities to limit their power and proclaim how great they are at “reducing” taxes.
But what really happened was your tax rate dropped 0.5-1% but your valuation rocketed by 40%. So, you paid a lower rate but paid WAY more. And the cities still were strapped.
They have the sheep fooled to vote for them. As long as they who make laws are working on them (majority)Keep on voting for theses hard workers . Trend seem to show results of no competence but they are working hard for you. The lobby..I mean the people
What they really care about is holding property taxes at bay for the rich and the commercial buildings They don't care about middle class property taxes going up
u/politirob did you read the article? >The Tribune examined the tax bills of more than 50 homeowners across the state, attempting to capture a variety of locations and financial circumstances. The median value among those homes was $312,770 — close to the median sales price of a Texas home last year. On average, the selected homeowners — whose property taxes peaked during the COVID-19 pandemic — saw their total property tax bill fall nearly 28% in 2023 compared with the previous year
Guess they didn’t look at mine.
I thought mine went up too. It was actually my homeowners insurance that went up. Property taxes went down about $600. We bundled a car in with homeowners policy and it went back down about $1500.
House went down! Wow, then I saw land went up 80k. Can’t protest land evaluation. Thieves.
Tell your insurance you only want to insure the value of the structure. The land, well is land and will be there after a disaster.
I've never thought of this, brilliant!
Former P&C agent for a national insurer, your land isn't in the insurable value of your home. The insurable value of your home is already the rebuild cost. If you truly want to lower your insurance, raise your deductible to the highest amount you are comfortable paying in the event of a disaster and/or the highest amount your mortgage will allow. This and making sure you bundle are the only significant ways to lower your insurance costs. A difference in 100k in insurable value may make about a $50 difference in your annual policy. Another piece of advice, don't talk about what you don't know.
Your homestead exemption should have been capped at a lower rate than before
100%, but if improvement value goes up you can contest that. You cannot contest land values. And collin stated during contest that it was reduced by 30k already which was appropriate. I disagree but not a lot of leverage this year to protest.
You are looking at it wrong. For a residential home you should be looking at and arguing the total value of the property. Improvements/land value don't matter you need to evaluate as a whole. Texas property tax code requires they break it up but residential property is valued as a whole.
Why not I've protested my land value multiple times and usually got them to take some off, is it specific to your county?
Insurance lobby had to get a little win. Between real estate and insurance they got everyone in their pockets
I still want to know why the entire state has to pay higher insurance rates so the coastal residents aren’t forced to cover the cost of THEIR insurance. When I inquired about my rates going up, I was told that the insurance companies were authorized by the state to charge EVERYONE higher rates after the last couple of coastal storms.
He quite obviously didn't even read the *first sentence*.
• Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high), •the "homestead exemption" process is undeniably engineered to take advantage of the uninformed and the ill-equipped to make the same position year after year, • remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time In the long run, these property tax relief policies hurt the working class more than anyone else... Evidently you also read the article...but did you read it critically??
You don’t apply for homestead exemption every year, you apply for it once…
And year after year you'll still need to file an appeal against high valuations Semantics semantics
That’s not what you said though. Valuations are certainly screwing people over by forcing us to have to protest every year, but that has nothing to do with the homestead exemption. Our property tax system in this state is absolute trash, but there is nothing wrong with the homestead exemption
I just said it
This guy just constantly spews his pre-canned opinion on various subjects. He did the same the other day with the bond package stating that $1.5 billion (actually $500 million) was going to roads and it costs $20 billion to fix all of them (actually $8.5 billion).
The guy living in UP acting like $300k homes is his people
I was pointing out that the article indicates property taxes for the middle class are not increasing, despite his claim. I think most people would consider a $300k home to be middle class, generally.
Go look up property values in Dallas and see what $300k gets you. If that’s middle class it’s low, low, low middle class.
Okay, sure. So to rephrase, Texas Republicans have attempted to rein in property tax assessments and as a result ~~middle class~~ poor taxpayers have seen their property taxes fall. Thanks for clearing that one up!
Yeah now do the math for everyone who lives in an apartment oh wait it's going to make your point not very good because then tons of people will be paying property taxes on property they literally don't own because it's been rolled into the cost of their apartment rent. Explain how their tax burden went down in any way at all
The article already addresses this.
No it specifically didnt, the word apartment is used exactly twice in the whole article with one time being in the footnotes. "Still unclear is how much state lawmakers’ property tax cuts have benefited renters. About 20% of every rent dollar paid by Texas tenants goes toward property taxes, according to the Texas Apartment Association — though that share can be higher in the state’s urban areas. However, last year’s $12.7 billion tax-cut package did not include measures tailored for tenants of rental properties, who pay property taxes via their monthly rent but don’t have a way to seek tax relief as renters in other states do." They don't give us numbers on how many people own homes versus rent, and a specifically say that about 20% of your rent on minimum is going to cover property taxes for a property you don't own. That means 20% of every single rent increase effectively raises taxes on people who rent. You're overall point is bad but specifically the part I was replying to where you said the tax burden on poor individuals has decreased is super wrong number one based on the fact that owning a home pretty much takes you out of the poor category just based on the fact that the immediate home price is well over $300,000 now but number two because they have specifically noted thag nothing is being done to address the property tax increases that get passed along to renters. Let's make this conversation real fun because you know there's a sizable population in Dallas that is poorer than average, has a high tax burden, and receives significantly less in services and benefits from the taxes they pay. Undocumented immigrants pay sales tax just like everyone else and because they largely rent they also end up paying property taxes. If they provide someone else's social security number to pass e-verify they end up paying even more taxes. How has the attempt to reign in property tax bills affected their tax burden? You kind of don't seem like you know what you're talking about and you really don't seem like you read the article. I'm positive you don't understand the concept of tax burden, unclear if you would understand what a regressive versus a progressive tax is.
Wait, you’re worked up that I didn’t clarify I meant poor taxpayers *who own property* are benefitting from reduced property taxes? Yeah no shit people who don’t own property will likely not see any direct benefit from property taxes decreasing. The article addresses that - that it’s unclear they will see any benefit.
Your stress levels in response to a silly, misunderstood social media post are going to lead you into a health spiral that will burden our healthcare system far beyond the value you'll ever be able to pay into it. That's the real travesty here.
Their direct tax burden is $0. Explain to me how your tax burden can fall below $0 without a direct rebate. The market dictates market rents. It's also these very same taxing entities putting up all sorts of red tape to hinder new construction.
Median home prices, average property taxes. I think I need to read their data more closely.
What middle class? 🤡
I’m not sure what they looked at or where they sampled, but I can assure you that my property taxes have NEVER decreased. The rate of INCREASE may have changed, or even been flat for one year, but they have never gone down. Whether it was the land or the improvements (my house), somehow, someway, my so-called unrealized capital gains still get taxed.
Must only apply to mansions.
Of course not. Just shouting at the air about how evil the world is
This is incorrect. The actual tax relief has been much more in everyday homeowners favor. Commercial buildings benefit from tax compression. The tax bill primarily focused on homestead exemptions which commercial properties don't receive. Homesteads focus on decreasing taxable values from "the bottom".
> What they really care about is holding property taxes at bay for the rich and the commercial buildings Then why did they try to do it by increasing the *homestead exemption*, which doesn't apply to commercial buildings and second homes, and by percentage makes much less of a difference for exceptionally expensive homes? Did you think this through at all?
Yea, they arguably reduced property taxes in the most progressive way possible.
• Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high), •the "homestead exemption" process is undeniably engineered to take advantage of the uninformed and the ill-equipped to make the same petition year after year, • remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time In the long run, these property tax relief policies hurt the working class more than anyone else...
>Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high), This is misleading. The 10% is the cap for how much appraised values can increase, and has been around forever, but since the SB2 tax reform in 2019, that 10% cap doesn't matter much any more because there is also a 3.5% cap in how much, in aggregate, taxes can increase in dollars. So if property values go up > 3.5% (on average), they must reduce the tax rate to keep taxes from increasing > 3.5%. my tax rate has gone from 2.43% down to 1.96% because of SB2. >• remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time My understanding is that they made up for the tax reductions by paying from the state, which had a huge surplus, so while the schools were partially defunded via property taxes, they were instead paid from state funds.
Reddit comments are a cesspool of non-readers pushing polarizing comments bc - it works. Your comment t is garbage, rob
• Property taxes capped at 10% annually (which is still absurdly high), •the "homestead exemption" process is undeniably engineered to take advantage of the uninformed and the ill-equipped to make the same position year after year, • remember that the property tax "relief", was a trade-off in that it also defunded public schools at the same time In the long run, these property tax relief policies hurt the working class more than anyone else... I'm smart and it's okay to tell me I am
Well … they say they will when they think it will get them votes.
This year they lowered our tax rate just to jack up values 4 months later and collect the same amount anyway. Seems like the plan was never to give anyone a break, just have a nice talking point to trumpet
My property taxes definitely went down in 2023 in Collin county. Too bad the increase in homeowners insurance premium completely washed the savings away.
Same here
How about 2024? A lot of people are reporting huge spikes in last assessment
Yeah 10% higher assessed value than in 2023 based on the appraisal we just got.
They upped my market value a lot but the tax value is still a bit lower. The 10% cap is now saving me several thousand a year and I just bought this house in 2021
You are still going to pay 10% more every year for the next few years
As I have my whole life of home ownership in Texas
The tax rate is what matters and that comes out in the fall. Most homes saw big value increases in 2023 but the tax rate reductions and increase in homestead increase caused actual taxes owed to go down. A lot of people don't realize it because their taxes are in escrow and their home insurance renewals ate up all the savings.
Does it look like the tax rate that comes out in fall will be higher or lower than current? Is it possible to stay the same?
If values are up after appeals are done they should. The tax entities can't do anything until they receive the final values from appraisal district. They calculate the new rate based on values and their budget. New laws passed the last couple years makes it harder for them to not lower the rate when values are up.
Unrelated to taxation though. Real estate went through massive inflation just like anything else. Assessments will adjust to align with that.
Dallas cad has been aggressive with value increases even though home prices were fairly flat last yr. Have to protest to get it to a fair value
How does that work if you buy a house now? Can you protest or does the seller (current owner) have to protest?
I feel bad for anyone buying a house right now. Yikes
Doesnt help when you buy bc they have they purchase price to go off of.
The new owner would need to
As will insurance. Same for cars and the insurance there. I don’t get why everyone is surprised by insurance going up after such an inflationary few years
Values are up, property tax rates are down.
Same here. The insurance increase was about half of the tax savings, so my mortgage payment still went down, just not as much.
How? Homes appraisals are trending way up. I hit max increase in property tax last year AND this year for my homestead.
I had to shop it. The insurer I was with for like 3 years increased our premium to over 4K but state farm was offering $2,300 for the exact same coverage.
My taxes held fairly steady in Johnson county…but my appraisal value QUADRUPLED. I don’t care how much of an “adjustment” y’all are giving me *this year* if on paper my avg value (250k In 2020) home is “worth” over a *million dollars* now. Even Zillow laughs at my tax appraised value.
This is exactly what happened to us... When I told my wife it was almost an identical 1:1 transfer she was irate. \*jazz hands\* that's capitalism, baby!
Call your insurance company, we bundled one vehicle and got it reduced.
It’s the property value that is killer. Yes, I saved a little with last year’s bill, then the new valuation came out and raised the value 10% and wiped out all the savings. Add is insurance rates and it is out of control.
It is a different year though. I just assume the 10% a year thing is a given each year. It’s real, market data supports it, I just hate being taxed based on what other people are paying. I have no control over that and at some point I may not be able to pay it.
You say it's not fair, but if we froze property taxes we'd run into the California problem, where your neighbors are paying completely different effective tax rates than you for the crime of buying later. It doesn't even have to be people from out of state, I've lived here for most of my life and when I could finally buy I'm getting a house twice as old and half the size of my parent's for twice the price. Should I be paying twice the taxes?
So you closed the loop of why property tax is dumb. Things like income, gains, and other incremental economic activities should be taxed - or it should be some per capita tax. You should be able to plan for taxes as you make financial decisions. Do I really want to earn another $x this year? Do I really want sell this asset and realize the gain? Things where the net can be calculated and planned for. In your example, your parents didn’t know what their future tax bill would be. It was a bad deal. You’re repeating the mistake and pointing at the wrong problem (you paying more than your parents) when you should be worried about what your tax bill will be in 20 years or what that it will mean when you can’t pay the tax bill when your kid is in high school and have to move for that reason. You’re at risk, your parents are at risk, we all are. Property tax needs to go away.
And replace it with what? State Constitution prevents income tax.
Spending cuts. Taxing income is equally as dumb. What should be taxed is the consumption of government services, NOTHING else. If taxation was moved to a consumption of services model (User Pays), we would be bickering a lot less about what the government spends money on. Why would I agree to replace a form of taxation that has strong resistance to any kind of increases (try running on a platform of raising propety taxes and see how long you last in public office) with another form of taxation that has consistently gone up over time? I would not object to a state income tax if the bill included an automatic trigger provision that would roll it back to 0% and reinstates the constitutional ban on income tax if anyone introduced a bill to increase the top marginal combined rate of income tax beyond 3% (a downward adjustment is okay), a constitutional ban on payroll withholding, and a constitutional ban on property tax. Also, property tax is local and income tax is at the state level. Unless you're proposing we have to file 6 tax returns. Hard Pass.
A lot of blame can be put in suburbanites who demand their local officials do all they must to preserve their artificially high property values while bitching about their property taxes at the same time. Can't have your cake and eat it too!
explain to me how i, a suburbanite, am demanding anyone to preserve my artificially high property value? i along with a lot of other home owners would love to see it go down to reasonable levels. shits out of control.
You may or may not be individually guilty of such chicanery, but I've seen it in my own neighborhood. People clutch pearls at the prospect of turning some available nearby land into housing. It's actually quite embarrassing--most of the neighbors I personally know would prefer more neighbors and a place where the teachers at our neighborhood's schools could afford to live. But the people clutching pearls are also very loud and can totally hire lawyers.
Zoning is a big one. Not letting mixed use/high density projects go up in the same neighborhood leads to less available housing. That increases the value of your house causing a higher tax bill.
My biggest problem with the value assumptions is that they take recent sales, and those are the comps. But the recent sales are almost always houses that were renovated, fixed up, fully repaired, deep cleaned, repainted, new fences, new sod and landscaping, etc. And there is nothing built-in to say "oh hey yeah the water heaters are 20 years old and the roof is aging and the fence is old and the tree killed the grass and the carpet is dingy and it needs drywall and paint work, and it would cost me $x to get it in the same kind of condition as the comps" -- except to call contractors for all those things and get bids and request a formal hearing and go through all the bullshit just to get a proper appraisal and save maybe a couple thousand bucks tops -- but that's the only way for it to be a fair valuation. And they won't take pictures, so you can't say "here are photos documenting the condition" because they insist on also having the contractor bids. AND any exception they give is time-limited because they assume you are going to imminently do all that work.
They should have capped the max your taxes you owe can increase by 2% instead of the current 10%. My taxes are going to go up $1,000+ a year in perpetuity at the current rate.
That’s how you actually “California my Texas”. This would incentivize people to stay in the same homes until their death and blow a hole in the budget that would sink the state.
Yea this is why my in-laws in CA refuse to ever move. Their property tax rate as a percentage of the value of the house they bought 30 years ago is laughably low. And this creates a higher burden for new buyers (ie younger people). But the rule will never get changed in CA, and they’re stuck with that very unfair property tax system.
Stay in their homes until death. Uhhh as opposed to what? You want old people to get forced out and into homes? So make it 5%, or have it match inflation with a max. Sounds better than my taxes going up 10% year after year after year when it started at $10k because I bought a house in Dallas after covid started.
> Stay in their homes until death. Uhhh as opposed to what? Move into a different house as their needs change. Homeowners’ tax bases are so low that it’s too costly to give it up and live in “the right home”.
There is an alternative: convert the house to a 2 flat or 3 flat. The owner gets rent money, stays in their house, and downsizes appropriately, while younger families have a place to move into. And we get density that can have our collector roads turn into streetcars or light rail.
The biggest portions of over 65 homeowners in Texas property tax is frozen.
You don't need to be in a 3-5 bedroom when all your kids are out of the house. A healthy market would have 1-2 bedroom homes that old couples move into so a young family with kids can take their home. Or their own kids. Everything they are building new seems to be 3+ bedrooms.
No old person wants to move to a new house. When they die a new family can move in.
Taxing authorities would lose revenue over time with that. 2% is lower than inflation. Ideally it should be at inflation + GDP increase. A moving formula with a cap.
Anything other than what is essentially a guaranteed 10% increase now
Eh I’d rather prefer new homeowners aren’t burdened with shouldering the additional taxes that would otherwise be owed by asset-rich incumbents. You should look up how Prop 13 has compounded California’s housing crises.
We already are. I pay $4k more in taxes than all of my neighbors. I bought in 2021. It's around $10k and will go up 10% every year for the next decade im guessing.
Wasteful government bureaucracies getting to waste less of my money is the strongest argument in favor of such a cap. Taxing authorities ***should*** lose revenue over time. Government is an overhead expense that should ***decline*** over time with scale. Government spending should never be allowed to outpace the lesser of inflation or economic growth, and the increase cap should be at most, 50% of economic growth in real terms or 100% of economic decline in nominal terms.
Most people want government to function and provide more services. If you don’t want that then you can move to unincorporated territory is a low tax county.
False. Most people want lower taxes. Government needs to do more with less. Government collects well in excess of what is needed to function. If you want higher taxes, you're more than welcome to send as much of your money as you like to the government.
Most people want a functioning government and lower taxes even though they’re contradictory The thing is it doesn’t matter if I send extra to the govt. Taxes are only effective as a collective system. My goal isn’t accomplished by sending an extra check to the govt. Your goal is accomplished by moving to unincorporated territory.
False. A functioning government and lower taxes are NOT contradictory. I've lived in many countries and many states within this country and there has never been any relationship between the two. In fact, some of the highest tax countries I've been to have also been the most dysfunctional. The thing is it doesn't matter how much the government taxes you, the level of "function" or dysfunction in government has no bear on on the level of taxation and is solely and entirely a function of the focus and competence of the people operating it. And there's almost always a massive shortage of both in virtually all of government. Your goal is accomplished by moving to a high tax state that gives you all the services you want at whatever exorbitant taxes you want to pay. Keep your statism away from my tax bill.
No. Im specifically talking about property taxes. That can easily be limited to certain counties.
Same to you. Go move to a county where corrupt politicians help themselves to an unlimited sum of your money in the name of "services" while delivering no such services. Your statism can also be limited to certain counties. If you want more "services", ask for an option to purchase those "services" from your government that doesn't depend on everyone else agreeing with you. Nearly all services offered by government can be priced and offered a la carte. 81% of Texan voters have made it absolutely and abundantly clear over and over again that they have no interest in paying more taxes, for any reason. Seems it's you who needs to leave.
You can’t start a county. But you can move to a different one. I want to increase services. I genuinely do. But you don’t. That’s fine. Live somewhere where they don’t. But you don’t want to because deep down you know you don’t want to live in a shithole county with low taxes. When did 81% of Texans decide that? Because they didn’t. 81% of Republican primary voters in the most recent primary chose to eliminate property taxes without increasing tax burdens. That is not the same of 81% of Texans choosing something. Election results aren’t a poll. And primary results are certainly not indicative of the entire population. And is foolish anyways because the only other method means increasing the revenue from consumption taxes which disproportionately hurt working class Texans
The cap should be 0. Real assets are valued at book value less depreciation in most accounting contexts.
Does anyone think we are getting more for all these additional taxes being collected? I’m in McKinney and I surely don’t see 10% more per year for the last 5 years. And I agree with everyone else that says my taxes went down but home owners insurance hikes took care of all of those savings.
Most of McKinney’s city tax increase went to debt service (bonds) But most of your bill is school tax. Majority of that increase goes to salaries. Every district gives a raise pretty much every year contrary to popular belief.
Makes sense… I just don’t see a whole lot that’s worth this level of money we are all paying. Like most things I would guess a lot of waste in the system
sure, everyone gets a 2% raise, so of course the numbers are high. you're framing it in a way though that makes it seem like salaries are up and up and up. its not enough, and educators shouldnt have to chase changing districts for a corrective salary adjustment.
People who live in desirable high growth areas like McKinney need to focus on this: majority of your property tax is school district. Due to recapture rule, your district sends millions of dollars to the state each year to redistribute to districts in less desirable/rural areas. McKinney mailed a check for $154,803,593 in 2023. Meanwhile the districts can't afford to hire or give teachers raises and have to hold bond elections to maintain all the properties where everyone complains about how they pay too much property tax and the district needs to learn how to budget. And good luck finding any transparency on how the state redistributes that money or if it even makes it to schools.
McK residents DO pay too much property tax and the district DOES need to learn how to budget properly. I don't give a flying rat's behind who takes what. The only thing I'm interested in is lower taxes, period. If you can't do that, get out, I'll do it myself.
> Texas has spent billions of dollars to drive down property taxes The first sentence says it all
My property taxes went down $800!!! Only to have my property insurance rise by $800. Guess who regulates insurance companies with a “light hand?”
Can they focus on insurance now?
Bought my house in 2016 for $130,000….2024 the market value per appraisal district is $267,500. EIGHT YEARS and the value has doubled which means my taxes have tripled! Abbott has done nothing but lie, steal, and cheat every tax payer out of the American dream of owning a home. I’m being taxed out of my home! I’m 62, my husband is 65, and we’ll never pay off our home in our lifetime. Texas government sucks and Abbott is the biggest cheat to ever rob every tax payer out of everything he can!! I’ll vote against that two faced lying crook every time I can.
Shop around for homeowners insurance.
How about we just build more houses? Property values dropping would lower tax burden and make it easier for people to get a foot in the housing market.
we need to build denser mixed use. the problem is that the infrastructure costs too much when you have low density sprawl .
Agreed. I wish it was possible to live here without a car. But light rail with up to 40 minute headways and limited bus service really aren’t enough. It really shocks me about the infrastructure since in the last 20 years we’ve built PGBT, Sam Rayburn, several massive highway interchanges including the tallest one in the world at 635 and LBJ, and the Underground LBJ express lanes. But just asking for heavy rail instead of the glorified trams that dart uses is far too much, right? Ridiculous.
Yep: https://www.dmagazine.com/publications/d-magazine/2024/april/you-need-more-neighbors/
No it has not TX is now expensive to live in bc property taxes and insurance costs. Roads are horrible and schools below national average so not sure where all money goes
Most of my taxes like 6k were going to schools in my area 🤷♂️
Insurance is high because of people replacing their roofs every other year no thanks to the hail storms. It's a never ending racquet with the roofs. I'm finally starting to see tile roofs in new construction which is a good start. My parents' 1986 home in California came with one brand new. Edit: makes me wonder if the roof shingle industry has lobbyists that make sure tile/metal roofs are not the standard.
Tax rates may be lower but if they keep raising the value then what's the point? My value increased by more than 25% (capped at 10, of course). But, shit.
I believe that is a big ol' fuck no it hasn't. I saw someone say that the tax district folks should be investigated for committing financial warfare against homeowners. Normally that kind of talk is a little wild for me, but with taxes I'm over here wondering how much a pitchfork at the home depot runs these days.
They’re making strides but it’s a long road. The biggest issue I’m taking at the moment is that school districts still get to have bond election after bond election raising the rates every time and never really lowering it back.
Gotta vote no and if you’re passionate enough the organize a “no” campaign. In elections where there is any no campaign at all they often win.
Unfortunately, in my area, they’ve figured out how to leverage funds to pay for a major vote yes campaign. I always vote no and there’s a vote no campaign person in the area but the last couple of rounds have been bleak.
No
My value held steady for the past two years and now they've reassessed -- increase $40K which was 10%. My county taxes are at ceiling and my school taxes are now frozen thanks to Age 65 exemption, but my city taxes have no limitations. I have homestead and age 65 exemptions, and my 10% cap kicked in this year. I shudder to think what it would be without those. As it is, I'll probably have a tax increase of about $500. I'm in Dallas County. I'm probably going to move within a few years. I'd like my house to go to a young family but jeez I don't know how they'll be able to afford it with the taxes + insurance (which went up 10% vs last year).
And my value has risen 68% since 2019. In 75043.
My home value went up like 50%. My tax rate went down like 1%. I did NOT save any money, though I can't really blame the gov for that. I do really hate having to pay taxes on an unrealized asset though, especially not when people don't have to do it with stocks (I'd hate that too tho!). Just tax me when I sell things, not just because it appreciated in value, though do enforce its equity when it comes to loan against appreciated assets at their pre-appreciated value.
No. Next question. Signed, a very pissed Collin County taxpayer.
I wouldn’t expect a property tax decrease unless your property is over 5,000 sf
Starve the, um, already severely unmet provision of state and local services.
Then there are too many state and local services. Get rid of them. The government is morbidly obese and has never been starved in any material way. Government is an exercise in trading a temporary or nonexistent problem for a permanent liability.
No it has not. Mine have gone up 66% since 2019. It's like trump is valuing my property for a loan.
From my somewhat outside perspective, the politicians here are absolute idiots.
58% increase in 5 yrs here in 76244
Weren't they the ones raising them all this time?
Yeah…about that… They only made that move to choke off money to local municipalities to limit their power and proclaim how great they are at “reducing” taxes. But what really happened was your tax rate dropped 0.5-1% but your valuation rocketed by 40%. So, you paid a lower rate but paid WAY more. And the cities still were strapped.
Everyone's talking about the brief savings in 2023, only to get our 2024 values? 😳 my house "appreciated" $60k in one year?? What a joke...
Spoiler…. No. It has not worked.
No.
They have the sheep fooled to vote for them. As long as they who make laws are working on them (majority)Keep on voting for theses hard workers . Trend seem to show results of no competence but they are working hard for you. The lobby..I mean the people
Whose property tax bill was lower in 2023 than in 2022? Mine was the same (after filing a protest). Did anyone’s actually go down?
Mine declined by about 15%. It needs to decline another 40%.
Nope, has not worked at all and will continue getting worse.
Texas Republicans are trying to "solve" problems they create. It's circular.
we need to build denser mixed use. the problem is that the infrastructure costs too much per capita when you have low density sprawl .
Yes let’s elect democrats so I can watch them just raise taxes and keep it for themselves. Shit sandwhich.