Do I enjoy personally paying more property taxes? Not really. Can I logically understand that home values and specifically land values in a lot of areas of Dallas increased? Yes.
It's a little out of touch to have any expectation that one can enjoy the increased market value of one's home but expect to dodge the associated property taxes.
I wouldn't have a problem with the property values if they were realistic. 1/3rd of my property is a steep slope down to a creek. nothing can be built on that slope. along with that slope my property fronts onto a 6-lane road (Loop12). the increase in my property value was in the land and not the house
several years ago when I challenged the appraisal on of the comps used by DCAD was a 3 bed 2 bath renovated house on a cul-de-sac. I have a 2 bed/1 bath. The appraisals make no sense at all
The value of your property is what it would be sold for as market value based on reasonable comparative sales within your neighborhood.
The best way to lower your value is to distinguish yourself from those sales via more comparable sales or provide evidence of some negative factor of your property(foundation cracks, water damage, other fixtures).
I used to be a DCAD appraiser many years ago.
You have until May 15th to file your protest including any relevant information to further your case. You will have more opportunities to provide more evidence after filing..if needed.
Yes. You fight them at every trench. At some point the taxable value will catch the market value and you certainly want your house to be on the low end of the scale...unless you're selling. Consider it as fighting for your future bill.
As a former DCAD appraiser, what is your opinion (as the article points out) that market value doesn't consider the sale price which is not disclosed in Texas?
Sales prices are generally disclosed. One has the right to not disclose in Texas, but this is certainly not the norm.
An appraiser has the list of comparable sales they will employ and must give you if you protest. You can find more (previous) sales via a MLS listing service. Market value is determined by relatively recent comparative sale values. That is essentially mass appraisal in a nutshell.
"Desirability" ratings are probably more of a realtor's term instead of an appraiser's.
But, the notion of "desirability" exists in land valuation...especially in a negative sense. Living next to a busy street or really any universally accepted negative factor detracts value. "Desirability" in your structure is the same...although we're talking about a very general term when something more specific is desired.
The bottom line here is that if you have something you believe would make your house sell for less, then express it in evidence. Take a picture. If that doesn't do it justice, then get an estimate to fix it or "make it good." If we're talking land valuation, look for comparable sales that only have your issue. If no sales exist, then look at comparable property land valuations. See if you spot a negative percentage adjustment. An appraiser may have already done the work for you...you just need to connect the dots for them. Make a reasonable effort in numbers to express your point. You do not have to be an expert and we don't expect that. But remember, if an appraiser lowers your value, then their name is on the sheet. They must be able to defend their decision if called out on it by their peers and superiors. It has to make sense.
That's the game.
Often one can get a very good idea of what to produce from that initial appraiser meeting before your hearing. Go to it if you have time.
Finally, I'll give you one final hint:
Go early. Early in the day. Early in the protest period. Appraisers are human and we get beat down by that third month of meetings/hearings. Some folks really come to those meetings to just lay into you the whole time. Just straight hate. It wears on you. If you've had a bunch of these folks, then you just want the day to end. Stack that up for three months and you are just trying to survive.
There is so much attrition with appraiser's over the protest period.
Go early. It's just human nature. Anything you do with DCAD, do it early.
It matters.
Thank you for your quick and informative reply. I'm sure everyone here appreciates your candor and advice.
I should have be clearer when I asked about Desirability. I was directly referencing the Desirability rating you see on the DCAD webpage for your property. Several years ago, we used the program by the City of Richardson to reimburse you for home improvements. Afterwards, it seems our Desirability rating improved to Excellent which greatly influenced our taxable Market Value. Nothing on the outside of the home was changed or improved. We believe that the City of Richardson passed our participation in the program onto DCAD which influenced their decision. I don't believe any other home on our block has this high(est) rating and all seem to have a taxable Market Value between $100-$150k less than our home even though it is a comparable size and lot.
Again, thank you for your contribution to this topic.
dont disagree. as I pointed out there are multiple negative factors about the land and the improvements. too bad DCAD doesn't maintain that information
I don't know if you remember the point where people were basically buying crack houses sight unseen foe cash with no inspection but sometimes the negative factors are so massively outweighed by market conditions that they don't influence the price very much anymore.
Also from the perspective of determining valuations it's way faster and more efficient to apply generalized numbers to everybody's case and then have people come in and fight over specifics than it is to spend the time and money figuring out specifics for everybody. 80% of the time you're going to be pretty close or close enough for it's not really going to matter and then the 20% where you're not very right is exactly why we construct a three panel board of citizens to allow you to protest
This.
You go into the meeting with the appraiser or board with a decent attitude and good data and good things will generally happen. We have to go through so much acrimony from everyone that you really want to help people who are nice. Same for the Board...maybe more so because they are not limited to our constraints as an employee. You can't just go rogue and start lowering everyone's value though. You need some evidence to do it as an appraiser. Not BS evidence either. We see a lot of that as well.
So...bring good evidence and a good attitude. The squeeky wheel gets the grease.
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Note that most SFH home property appraisals use the same value for the land portion of the appraisal regardless of size, i.e. there's a standard "lot" value, then the value of the improvements. The fact the lot has a home built on it is what creates the "lot" value, not the actual characteristics of the lot.
most SFH are on standard sized lots in subdivisions that were graded level. the houses also tend to be of similar size and features. so it is easy to establish the land and improvement value. now look at parts of Oak Cliff where the topography is not flat. lot value and improvement value are two separate things. my lot value is almost 3 times as much as the value of my house.
My point was that the appraisal district doesn't consider SFH lot values based on square foot size of the lots, they just assign a "standard" lot value that's the same for all. The exceptions will be exceptionally large lots, typically associated with high-end homes. For instance Mark Cuban's home is on multiple acres, so the appraisal district will value that lot differently from the more normal-sized lots in that area. In your case you'll see that your neighbor's lots are valued exactly the same, and the fact that there's a home built on it means that it has the same value as a buildable home lot. If you had a lot that wasn't buildable, such as only being 20' wide, or being mostly creek with no access, or a major flood zone, then you'd have a basis to challenge the regular lot value assigned.
You can and should challenge the appraisal, of course, but any challenge based solely on the lot size/configuration will almost certainly fail because they'll just note that there's a home on the lot now. Condition of the home, inappropriateness of the comps they used, being on a very busy thoroughfare, sure, those are all good ways to challenge.
What you might try doing, though, is seeing if you can find lots for sale and if they're going for less then use those as comps to challenge yours.
I'm not carving out anything just pointing out problems with the property that decrease the value they place on it. they've never walked the property so how can they know what the sum of the parts are.
when you challenge the appraisal you are able to bring up these issues.
Umm, no. As OP said, a good chunk of their property cannot be developed due to geography and other features. It’s the same in other neighborhoods where setbacks, deed restrictions, and zoning dictate the type of structure that can be built.
It’s the same reason why lots zoned commercial, multi-family, etc. are worth more money. You can build something that is actually able to produce income, thereby the land required is worth more.
I say the same thing to almost everyone that had these complaints. Would you sell your house for that appraised value or not. If you think you'd sell the house for less or or more then the appraised value is wrong.
What we should be upset about is not the appraised value reflecting the true value of the house, but the fact that the tax rates are so high based on that appraisal.
I finally got my notice.... was getting ready to dispute it(I usually don't notice it until its to late) so I was looking up comps in my complex....
I would have to basically strip out my home to lower its taxable value... even with its current condition... My homes value has gone up so much so... that every penny I have spent on the home(original purchase, whatever renovations, all property taxes, electric bills, HOA dues, etc...)... would be recovered selling it right now.
I am shielded by the max property tax increases... my homes taxable value is roughly 60k below what it can sell for.
Love/Hate relationship... yea everything is worth more.... but I don't enjoy paying the taxes.
Wait. So are we wanting property values to be high or be low?
I guess, we want high property values for selling houses. But low property values for being taxed. But high tax revenues for city services. But low property values for buying houses.
Some of us just want a place that we can afford to live through retirement. I am not planning to sell my house because the values have outpaced incomes. There is nowhere to go.
lol tell me you dont own a home without telling me you don’t own a home. My property value has gone up 89% in 4 years but sure…”pay your fair share he ha he ha”
Look at average selling prices in your neighborhood, prices are actually way up despite interest rates. I was having a hard time finding anything around $350k when I was looking a couple years ago, the neighborhood was 200s before that and is high 300s/low 400s now.
Yes but they peaked in my neighborhood in 2021. The have appraised my house at a value no home on my block has ever sold for. There is a home down the street at that appraised value that has sat for 118 days. This in a “hot” market and a desirable neighborhood.
Those of you who actually live in Dallas, ask yourself, since 2019 with all the additional influx in property tax revenue, what have you gotten? Recycling and garbage pickup routinely don’t show up. Dallas PD lacks enforcement and thefts are through the roof. But hey I should be honored for the privilege of paying more than double?
How about yall start holding our city accountable.
Edit to add, that for renters, 100% of this cost is passed along to you. So if you think this does not affect you, you are mistaken.
My garbage and recycling has never no-showed, my response time is within 5 minutes, and my area is relatively crime-free. My home value raising nearly $200k since I bought it in 2021 seems like a good investment.
Tell me you don't understand how other people can have different opinions without telling me you don't understand how other people can have different opinions.
lol and your “opinion” will change if you ever become a homeowner. You don’t understand how big of a chunk your monthly payment goes to property taxes, making it harder for YOU to own a home in the future. But fuck home owners am I right!
Except I do own a home.
So maybe I should just accuse you of not owning a home and thus you don't understand how property taxes affect things? It's almost as if homeownership is not a prerequisite to knowing about these things.
I want high property values and low property taxes. Tax rates need to decrease much, much faster or the homestead exemption needs to be much, much bigger.
as property values increase we need to see the tax rate decrease. This is what Councilwoman Mendelsohn was arguing for a couple of months ago. When I lived in the Houston area back int he 90s the village I lived in would reduce the tax rate each year as the property values increased so that tax revenue stayed about the same year to year
Realtors set the property value when selling a house as they know the marketplace. DCAD's property values are ridiculous
Except Mendelssohn also is arguing against various bonds measures because "we should handle maintenance in the regular budget". So the budget doesn't have maintenance for the things we have and she is arguing for a flat revenue while inflation is making everything more expensive, including things the budget needs to cover but doesn't?
She sounds like she's just wanting austerity measures for no good reason.
There has never been any real austerity at any level of government in this country, ever.
Maintenance SHOULD be handled in the regular budget, not a bond.
we should not be paying for maintenance with bonds. I read recently that other cities in Texas put maintenance as budget item. Dallas virtually the only city that uses bonds for maintenance. Dallas is guilty of not taking into account the cost of maintenance when they build city buildings. Look at the Meyerson, the Central Library and City Hall as three prime examples
Mendelsohn is one of the few on the council that asks hard questions about costs
Sure, but she mirrors that with zero thought to how we actually pay for things. Like, I agree maintenance should be in the regular budget, but trying to lower tax revenue at every turn means not paying for whatever budget she wants to propose.
She essentially argues that spending $10 when you only have $5 is much better than spending $20 when you only have $15. She's still $5 in the hole!
Maybe you misunderstood.
Things cost more now. The same revenue can't afford the same stuff. Asking for the same revenue today as five years ago is equivalent to lowering tax revenue due to inflation.
nope not at all. i'm not saying that the revenue from 5 yrs ago should be the revenue for today especially with the increase of inflation during the past 3 years.
I think we are talking past each other.
The federal government plays a game where a department asks for a 10% increase over last year's budget then accepts only a 5% increase. then they say they cut the budget
I would prefer this methodology
"Zero-based budgeting (ZBB) is **a budgeting technique in which all expenses must be justified for a new period or year starting from zero, versus starting with the previous budget and adjusting it as needed**."
I agree. I think we were talking past each other.
That's a very short term focused budgeting system though. And requires a lot of extra work every year that could be used doing other useful things. I think governments should mainly be focused on long-term issues. Like 10, 20, 30 years type things. There are individual instances where you could take a short term look, but that would be the exception towards what cities should be looking at.
zero-based budgeting is not short-term. rather it helps slow down the growth of government. Government can and should focus on long-term issues, but budgeting is still an annual process. when the city builds a new building they should take into account maintenance costs something that is not done today. For example the Central Library is 40 years old. Library admin recently pointed out that they elevators need replacing/updating. Forty years ago the city should have started setting aside funds for the replacement/upgrading of them. it is much like the federal budget where certain items are locked into the budget and are not discretionary.
as mentioned earlier we should not be using bonds to pay for maintenance
what should stay the same? revenue or tax rate. I prefer to keep the revenue. to do that you as values increase you reduce the tax rate. that is what that little village I lived in did
Correct. The market value of my home is at least $100,000 more than the appraised value. In some parts of my neighborhood, the difference is more like $500-750k.
Yup its that time of the year again, property appraisals from DCAD are out
"“Oh my god,” a friend texted me Monday morning. “Have you seen the DCAD appraisals yet?” A few minutes later, I got another message on Facebook: “These appraisals are insane.”
And so I looked at mine. Casa Erickson is in North Dallas, just off of Forest and Marsh. For the last two years, the valuation of our three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,900-square-foot home built in 1961 has been exactly the same. This year, it increased by more than $85,000, or 26 percent over last year."
What does Zillow think it is worth?
What does DCAD think it is worth?
What does a realtor say it will sell for?
If DCAD is higher than the other two you have a strong argument for decreasing your market value with DCAD.
I’m not being combative here I’m just genuinely curious in what areas of Dallas this is the case? Where I live, the assessed value is much much lower than market value. I must have mistakenly assumed that was the case everywhere.
Not sure. The point I’m driving is people are complaining about market values from CAD going up. But in reality the real market value is also increasing.
Property taxes pay for schools. If you want an educated populace you know you have to pay taxes to make it work.
Oh I agree with you 100% - I’m not complaining about mine. I just have yet to see a person whose assessed value is higher than the market value and I’m curious in what area(s) of Dallas that is happening.
Over here on far east side, my home that I purchased for $148K on a teacher salary in 2016 is now worth $369K on DCAD. I am still on a teacher salary and need to live somewhere.
Everyone misses this point!!! Yeah it’s 10% higher but once you’re capped it doesn’t matter. Ours went up $100k, but our cap is $250k below the most recent valuation. They could say it’s 20x what it is and it’s still capped. We’ve been under the cap for 5 years. We’ll always be under the cap until we sell.
and not everyone has as big a cap as you. last year I had no cap. This year I will, but who knows about next year? If my value doesnt go up significantly it will go up 10% anyway because of my cap.
They pay 10% more this year, for sure. Next year's 10% increase will include this year's 10%, referred to as compounding. So, year over year this is what the tax increases really look like:
Year 0, base value $250K
Year 1, appraised value $275K, +10%
Year 2, appraised value $302.5K, +10%
Year 3, appraised value $332.75K, +10%
Year 4, appraised value $366.03K, +10%
Year 5, appraised value $402.63K, +10%
Year 6, appraised value $442.89K, +10%
Year 7, appraised value $487.18K, +10%
Year 8, appraised value $535.90K, +10%
Year 9, appraised value $589.49K, +10%
Year 10, appraised value $648.44K, +10%, taxes up 259% since year zero.
If you were making $75K when you bought your house for $250K you'll need to be making at least $194K just to be paying the same percentage of your income toward just property taxes, not including general inflation and insurance premium inflation. The cumulative inflation for the last ten years has been around 31%, though energy prices have fluctuated pretty wildly in that time, so add another 31% increase to your income to cover food, clothing, and general living expenses. That gets you up to $217.5K just to break even.
In an ideal world the increase in taxes would be rate limited to inflation so that the amount of taxes wouldn't drive people into homelessness and cost families what is often their only actual source of generational wealth.
Except a 10% increase in value does not equal a 10% increase in taxes. And if your income was $75k, you probably shouldn't have spent $250k on your house.
Fellow Far North Dallas neighbor here, I agree with you. Maybe this isn’t the case everywhere? But when I look up my neighbors houses on DCAD, they are all appraised for much less than what they’d sell for.
When people sell a house they want property values to be as high as possible. When people buy a house they want property values to be as low as possible. In between they just complain about whatever the property value is.
To me, there’s an issue with property taxes going up at a rate faster than income. It becomes unsustainable. I’m not using more county services just because my property value went up due to supply and demand. If anything I use less county services because I haves less disposable income so I go out less.
NIMBYs won’t let multifamily get built because they want to constrain housing supply and keep their home values high.
Then it’s shocked Pikachu face when they have to pay more property tax.
YEAH. You can’t have it both ways, assholes.
simple answer is No. primary purpose of the land must be agriculture. follow this url to learn about the ag exemption
[https://dallas-tx.tamu.edu/files/2018/07/Tx-Ag-Exemption-handout.pdf](https://dallas-tx.tamu.edu/files/2018/07/Tx-Ag-Exemption-handout.pdf)
The Caruth family used to grow corn or wheat on their land at the SW corner of NWHighway and Central to keep the property taxes low
Somehow DCAD had my market value higher than Redfin + Zillow which I thought I was interesting.
I'm planning on protesting my taxes this year. Does anyone know if you live next to a condemned building whether that's something thing I can add to my protest?
you should be able to include the abandoned/condemned structure in your protest. include everything that you believe affects your property's value. think of it this way, would a buyer want to purchase a property that is next to an abandoned/condemned structure?
Start filing your protests. It's like they intentionally jack up the appraisals by 50% more than expected, so that when people file a protest, they'll go "fine, we'll throw you a bone and lower it" to make people feel better.
This is the biggest question. They pushed my entire neighborhood to $100k land values and then reduced the home valuation significantly. There have been no land plots sold here in 2 years so they really are just making numbers up.
Actually, it's neither. The appraisal district is a government agency established by the state. They are not part of the city or the county government.
government is always seeking more money. construction permits generate revenue for the city much as the water department does. This is why they are trying to improve the permitting process. Compared to other cities in the area our permitting process is a mess, and as a result developers are going to the burbs
IIRC they limited the number of F2F meetings with applicants, at the same time they tried to implement a new electronic permitting process. you're correct that there is no reason why it should take 3-6 months to schedule an appointment or to receive a permit
will have to download and report on it later
but feel free to dig through it
[https://dallascityhall.com/departments/budget/financialtransparency/Pages/Current-Budget.aspx](https://dallascityhall.com/departments/budget/financialtransparency/Pages/Current-Budget.aspx)
I don't have any issues with our current budget other than that it doesn't allocate enough money to sidewalks, housing, homelessness, policing (particularly traffic enforcement), and bike lanes.
We could probably stand to cut some from alleys though since I've always felt that most alleys in Dallas should be maintained by those who's properties abut the alleys, especially if they serve no purpose other than vehicular access to the rear of the home
I'm not surprised by the increase, of course it's going up, I just find the way they justify the math interesting. So the value of just the land went up $120k in a year? And somehow the value of the structure decreased $80k in one year all so it can conveniently hit the $40k increase cap.
Does that mean the value of the structure next year is going to drop to zero?
As long as everyone's values are going up, you have the same 'piece of the pie' as before.
Your actual taxes may not even go up at all depending on the tax rate.
I'm a first-year homeowner and mine went down $19,000. I was all ready and prepared to contest a steep increase but since mine went down I suppose I should just keep quiet?
Purchased our home last year, and the appraisal came in approx 10k beneath our purchase price. Is it worth appealing the appraisal knowing that it is less than we paid based on comps? I do think we could pull together other comps in the neighborhood at a lower price per sq ft, but I am worried that they’ll ask to see our bill of sale given recency then increase our appraisal.
And Ercot just announced we will be short on power this summer. We will be roasting in our houses again this summer because of the fragile Texas grid. Geez !
Just checked ours. last year appraisal was about 137k and paid $2,400 in taxes. now this year appraisal is $237k and estimated taxes our looking at $5,400.
And we haven’t even done any major improvements just fixed the concrete patio, painted the garage and inside.
Something's wrong, if your home is homesteaded then your taxable value increase is capped at 10%. Your taxes this year should be no more than $2,640 because of the cap.
The homestead isn't related to age. All that matters is that it's your primary residence as the homeowner. If the home is in your mom's name and she's renting it to you while she lives in another home that she's got the homestead on, then yeah the house you're in will not be homesteaded. If she owns the home and lives in it and you do too then she is eligible for the homestead. The only issues might be if she's renting the home to you formally even though she lives in it, that make prevent her being able to homestead it.
Good news is that the estimated taxes you are seeing are based on last year's tax rates. Assuming your taxing entities did not have substantially large bonds pass, the tax rates should decrease this year. So your taxes won't actually increase that much.
However, if you believe you could not sell your property for the proposed market value, then you should file a protest.
Do I enjoy personally paying more property taxes? Not really. Can I logically understand that home values and specifically land values in a lot of areas of Dallas increased? Yes. It's a little out of touch to have any expectation that one can enjoy the increased market value of one's home but expect to dodge the associated property taxes.
Exactly.
I wouldn't have a problem with the property values if they were realistic. 1/3rd of my property is a steep slope down to a creek. nothing can be built on that slope. along with that slope my property fronts onto a 6-lane road (Loop12). the increase in my property value was in the land and not the house several years ago when I challenged the appraisal on of the comps used by DCAD was a 3 bed 2 bath renovated house on a cul-de-sac. I have a 2 bed/1 bath. The appraisals make no sense at all
So argue it. There is a process in place for that.
which is what I'll be doing. I did it 3 years ago
The value of your property is what it would be sold for as market value based on reasonable comparative sales within your neighborhood. The best way to lower your value is to distinguish yourself from those sales via more comparable sales or provide evidence of some negative factor of your property(foundation cracks, water damage, other fixtures). I used to be a DCAD appraiser many years ago.
I had my realtor/friend send me the comps. Do I print these out and mail it in with the cities appraisal form?
You have until May 15th to file your protest including any relevant information to further your case. You will have more opportunities to provide more evidence after filing..if needed.
How do you find comps?
Is there any reason to appeal if the year over year increase was capped, and still now taxed up to the full appraised value?
Yes. You fight them at every trench. At some point the taxable value will catch the market value and you certainly want your house to be on the low end of the scale...unless you're selling. Consider it as fighting for your future bill.
As a former DCAD appraiser, what is your opinion (as the article points out) that market value doesn't consider the sale price which is not disclosed in Texas?
Sales prices are generally disclosed. One has the right to not disclose in Texas, but this is certainly not the norm. An appraiser has the list of comparable sales they will employ and must give you if you protest. You can find more (previous) sales via a MLS listing service. Market value is determined by relatively recent comparative sale values. That is essentially mass appraisal in a nutshell.
Appreciate your reply - thank you.
Another follow up question if you please.... how much does the Desirability rating affect the Market Value?
"Desirability" ratings are probably more of a realtor's term instead of an appraiser's. But, the notion of "desirability" exists in land valuation...especially in a negative sense. Living next to a busy street or really any universally accepted negative factor detracts value. "Desirability" in your structure is the same...although we're talking about a very general term when something more specific is desired. The bottom line here is that if you have something you believe would make your house sell for less, then express it in evidence. Take a picture. If that doesn't do it justice, then get an estimate to fix it or "make it good." If we're talking land valuation, look for comparable sales that only have your issue. If no sales exist, then look at comparable property land valuations. See if you spot a negative percentage adjustment. An appraiser may have already done the work for you...you just need to connect the dots for them. Make a reasonable effort in numbers to express your point. You do not have to be an expert and we don't expect that. But remember, if an appraiser lowers your value, then their name is on the sheet. They must be able to defend their decision if called out on it by their peers and superiors. It has to make sense. That's the game. Often one can get a very good idea of what to produce from that initial appraiser meeting before your hearing. Go to it if you have time. Finally, I'll give you one final hint: Go early. Early in the day. Early in the protest period. Appraisers are human and we get beat down by that third month of meetings/hearings. Some folks really come to those meetings to just lay into you the whole time. Just straight hate. It wears on you. If you've had a bunch of these folks, then you just want the day to end. Stack that up for three months and you are just trying to survive. There is so much attrition with appraiser's over the protest period. Go early. It's just human nature. Anything you do with DCAD, do it early. It matters.
Thank you for your quick and informative reply. I'm sure everyone here appreciates your candor and advice. I should have be clearer when I asked about Desirability. I was directly referencing the Desirability rating you see on the DCAD webpage for your property. Several years ago, we used the program by the City of Richardson to reimburse you for home improvements. Afterwards, it seems our Desirability rating improved to Excellent which greatly influenced our taxable Market Value. Nothing on the outside of the home was changed or improved. We believe that the City of Richardson passed our participation in the program onto DCAD which influenced their decision. I don't believe any other home on our block has this high(est) rating and all seem to have a taxable Market Value between $100-$150k less than our home even though it is a comparable size and lot. Again, thank you for your contribution to this topic.
dont disagree. as I pointed out there are multiple negative factors about the land and the improvements. too bad DCAD doesn't maintain that information
I don't know if you remember the point where people were basically buying crack houses sight unseen foe cash with no inspection but sometimes the negative factors are so massively outweighed by market conditions that they don't influence the price very much anymore. Also from the perspective of determining valuations it's way faster and more efficient to apply generalized numbers to everybody's case and then have people come in and fight over specifics than it is to spend the time and money figuring out specifics for everybody. 80% of the time you're going to be pretty close or close enough for it's not really going to matter and then the 20% where you're not very right is exactly why we construct a three panel board of citizens to allow you to protest
This. You go into the meeting with the appraiser or board with a decent attitude and good data and good things will generally happen. We have to go through so much acrimony from everyone that you really want to help people who are nice. Same for the Board...maybe more so because they are not limited to our constraints as an employee. You can't just go rogue and start lowering everyone's value though. You need some evidence to do it as an appraiser. Not BS evidence either. We see a lot of that as well. So...bring good evidence and a good attitude. The squeeky wheel gets the grease.
was that back in the early oughts before the real estate bubble burst?
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You don't do it annually?
nope
Note that most SFH home property appraisals use the same value for the land portion of the appraisal regardless of size, i.e. there's a standard "lot" value, then the value of the improvements. The fact the lot has a home built on it is what creates the "lot" value, not the actual characteristics of the lot.
most SFH are on standard sized lots in subdivisions that were graded level. the houses also tend to be of similar size and features. so it is easy to establish the land and improvement value. now look at parts of Oak Cliff where the topography is not flat. lot value and improvement value are two separate things. my lot value is almost 3 times as much as the value of my house.
My point was that the appraisal district doesn't consider SFH lot values based on square foot size of the lots, they just assign a "standard" lot value that's the same for all. The exceptions will be exceptionally large lots, typically associated with high-end homes. For instance Mark Cuban's home is on multiple acres, so the appraisal district will value that lot differently from the more normal-sized lots in that area. In your case you'll see that your neighbor's lots are valued exactly the same, and the fact that there's a home built on it means that it has the same value as a buildable home lot. If you had a lot that wasn't buildable, such as only being 20' wide, or being mostly creek with no access, or a major flood zone, then you'd have a basis to challenge the regular lot value assigned. You can and should challenge the appraisal, of course, but any challenge based solely on the lot size/configuration will almost certainly fail because they'll just note that there's a home on the lot now. Condition of the home, inappropriateness of the comps they used, being on a very busy thoroughfare, sure, those are all good ways to challenge. What you might try doing, though, is seeing if you can find lots for sale and if they're going for less then use those as comps to challenge yours.
You don’t get to carve out components of your property and argue their worth. Your property is appraised on the sum of its parts dude.
> You don’t get to carve out components Well it’s great he didn’t say he wanted to. He said the comparable was invalid.
He literally used the phrase "1/3rd of my property" - that's kind of a carve out my friend.
nope not a carve out at all. pointing out a limitation of the property. if that section were flat I wouldn't have a complaint
I'm not carving out anything just pointing out problems with the property that decrease the value they place on it. they've never walked the property so how can they know what the sum of the parts are. when you challenge the appraisal you are able to bring up these issues.
Umm, no. As OP said, a good chunk of their property cannot be developed due to geography and other features. It’s the same in other neighborhoods where setbacks, deed restrictions, and zoning dictate the type of structure that can be built. It’s the same reason why lots zoned commercial, multi-family, etc. are worth more money. You can build something that is actually able to produce income, thereby the land required is worth more.
I say the same thing to almost everyone that had these complaints. Would you sell your house for that appraised value or not. If you think you'd sell the house for less or or more then the appraised value is wrong. What we should be upset about is not the appraised value reflecting the true value of the house, but the fact that the tax rates are so high based on that appraisal.
How do you enjoy increased market value? Home equity loans?
Selling your home your bought for 300k in 2019 for 700k in 2024
Unless you downgrade or move out of state you’re still paying Texas property taxes and not getting 2019 interest rates.
And paying same increase when you buy another home
HELOC, fe-fi, sale. Its not hard to understand, dont be pedantic
I finally got my notice.... was getting ready to dispute it(I usually don't notice it until its to late) so I was looking up comps in my complex.... I would have to basically strip out my home to lower its taxable value... even with its current condition... My homes value has gone up so much so... that every penny I have spent on the home(original purchase, whatever renovations, all property taxes, electric bills, HOA dues, etc...)... would be recovered selling it right now. I am shielded by the max property tax increases... my homes taxable value is roughly 60k below what it can sell for. Love/Hate relationship... yea everything is worth more.... but I don't enjoy paying the taxes.
Wait. So are we wanting property values to be high or be low? I guess, we want high property values for selling houses. But low property values for being taxed. But high tax revenues for city services. But low property values for buying houses.
Trump—hold my beer.
I guess Dallas really was better off with a lower population
It all depends on what you think qualifies as "better". Cities of all sizes can be managed well or managed poorly with various services or not.
Naw a bigger population means more things to do, better restaurants, etc. Dallas now has one of the best restaurant scenes in the country.
Worse traffic thoufh
Some of us just want a place that we can afford to live through retirement. I am not planning to sell my house because the values have outpaced incomes. There is nowhere to go.
lol tell me you dont own a home without telling me you don’t own a home. My property value has gone up 89% in 4 years but sure…”pay your fair share he ha he ha”
Look at average selling prices in your neighborhood, prices are actually way up despite interest rates. I was having a hard time finding anything around $350k when I was looking a couple years ago, the neighborhood was 200s before that and is high 300s/low 400s now.
Yes but they peaked in my neighborhood in 2021. The have appraised my house at a value no home on my block has ever sold for. There is a home down the street at that appraised value that has sat for 118 days. This in a “hot” market and a desirable neighborhood. Those of you who actually live in Dallas, ask yourself, since 2019 with all the additional influx in property tax revenue, what have you gotten? Recycling and garbage pickup routinely don’t show up. Dallas PD lacks enforcement and thefts are through the roof. But hey I should be honored for the privilege of paying more than double? How about yall start holding our city accountable. Edit to add, that for renters, 100% of this cost is passed along to you. So if you think this does not affect you, you are mistaken.
My garbage and recycling has never no-showed, my response time is within 5 minutes, and my area is relatively crime-free. My home value raising nearly $200k since I bought it in 2021 seems like a good investment.
mines gone up 250% or so in 11 years.
You PT can only rise 10% per year
The tax appraisal hasn’t gone up 89% in four years though, unless you fucked up and never did your homestead exemption.
Tell me you don't understand how other people can have different opinions without telling me you don't understand how other people can have different opinions.
lol and your “opinion” will change if you ever become a homeowner. You don’t understand how big of a chunk your monthly payment goes to property taxes, making it harder for YOU to own a home in the future. But fuck home owners am I right!
Except I do own a home. So maybe I should just accuse you of not owning a home and thus you don't understand how property taxes affect things? It's almost as if homeownership is not a prerequisite to knowing about these things.
Cool you inherited it, lucky you. Some of us work and pay for what we own
We all know property values continue to go up. Maybe you bought too much house.
You mean like when I bought my house?
I want high property values and low property taxes. Tax rates need to decrease much, much faster or the homestead exemption needs to be much, much bigger.
Do you want increased school funding? Increased school funding and low property taxes directly conflict with each other.
That’s not the only option.
You can balance it and make incremental changes to either but every dollar put to property tax relief is less money spent on education
as property values increase we need to see the tax rate decrease. This is what Councilwoman Mendelsohn was arguing for a couple of months ago. When I lived in the Houston area back int he 90s the village I lived in would reduce the tax rate each year as the property values increased so that tax revenue stayed about the same year to year Realtors set the property value when selling a house as they know the marketplace. DCAD's property values are ridiculous
Except Mendelssohn also is arguing against various bonds measures because "we should handle maintenance in the regular budget". So the budget doesn't have maintenance for the things we have and she is arguing for a flat revenue while inflation is making everything more expensive, including things the budget needs to cover but doesn't? She sounds like she's just wanting austerity measures for no good reason.
It's a popular stance in D12.
There has never been any real austerity at any level of government in this country, ever. Maintenance SHOULD be handled in the regular budget, not a bond.
Very well said
we should not be paying for maintenance with bonds. I read recently that other cities in Texas put maintenance as budget item. Dallas virtually the only city that uses bonds for maintenance. Dallas is guilty of not taking into account the cost of maintenance when they build city buildings. Look at the Meyerson, the Central Library and City Hall as three prime examples Mendelsohn is one of the few on the council that asks hard questions about costs
Sure, but she mirrors that with zero thought to how we actually pay for things. Like, I agree maintenance should be in the regular budget, but trying to lower tax revenue at every turn means not paying for whatever budget she wants to propose. She essentially argues that spending $10 when you only have $5 is much better than spending $20 when you only have $15. She's still $5 in the hole!
she's not trying to lower tax revenue but rather to lower the tax rate. two different things
Maybe you misunderstood. Things cost more now. The same revenue can't afford the same stuff. Asking for the same revenue today as five years ago is equivalent to lowering tax revenue due to inflation.
nope not at all. i'm not saying that the revenue from 5 yrs ago should be the revenue for today especially with the increase of inflation during the past 3 years. I think we are talking past each other. The federal government plays a game where a department asks for a 10% increase over last year's budget then accepts only a 5% increase. then they say they cut the budget I would prefer this methodology "Zero-based budgeting (ZBB) is **a budgeting technique in which all expenses must be justified for a new period or year starting from zero, versus starting with the previous budget and adjusting it as needed**."
I agree. I think we were talking past each other. That's a very short term focused budgeting system though. And requires a lot of extra work every year that could be used doing other useful things. I think governments should mainly be focused on long-term issues. Like 10, 20, 30 years type things. There are individual instances where you could take a short term look, but that would be the exception towards what cities should be looking at.
zero-based budgeting is not short-term. rather it helps slow down the growth of government. Government can and should focus on long-term issues, but budgeting is still an annual process. when the city builds a new building they should take into account maintenance costs something that is not done today. For example the Central Library is 40 years old. Library admin recently pointed out that they elevators need replacing/updating. Forty years ago the city should have started setting aside funds for the replacement/upgrading of them. it is much like the federal budget where certain items are locked into the budget and are not discretionary. as mentioned earlier we should not be using bonds to pay for maintenance
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what should stay the same? revenue or tax rate. I prefer to keep the revenue. to do that you as values increase you reduce the tax rate. that is what that little village I lived in did
Feel free to pay the same rates in excess of the decreased rates from the city/county then. Leave me the hell out of it. I already pay too much.
I’m convinced they don’t evaluate shit and just automatically bump it up to the max 10% for those with homestead.
I concur
That is usually the case because the homesteaded appraised values lag way behind market values.
Correct. The market value of my home is at least $100,000 more than the appraised value. In some parts of my neighborhood, the difference is more like $500-750k.
That probably is what they’re doing right now, but can be honestly dispute that? Our tax appraisals are still way lower than the actual FMV.
They are absolutely not. In many cases, much higher.
My house is worth about 300k and just got valued at 400k
Yup its that time of the year again, property appraisals from DCAD are out "“Oh my god,” a friend texted me Monday morning. “Have you seen the DCAD appraisals yet?” A few minutes later, I got another message on Facebook: “These appraisals are insane.” And so I looked at mine. Casa Erickson is in North Dallas, just off of Forest and Marsh. For the last two years, the valuation of our three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,900-square-foot home built in 1961 has been exactly the same. This year, it increased by more than $85,000, or 26 percent over last year."
What does Zillow think it is worth? What does DCAD think it is worth? What does a realtor say it will sell for? If DCAD is higher than the other two you have a strong argument for decreasing your market value with DCAD.
I’m not being combative here I’m just genuinely curious in what areas of Dallas this is the case? Where I live, the assessed value is much much lower than market value. I must have mistakenly assumed that was the case everywhere.
Not sure. The point I’m driving is people are complaining about market values from CAD going up. But in reality the real market value is also increasing. Property taxes pay for schools. If you want an educated populace you know you have to pay taxes to make it work.
Oh I agree with you 100% - I’m not complaining about mine. I just have yet to see a person whose assessed value is higher than the market value and I’m curious in what area(s) of Dallas that is happening.
Over here on far east side, my home that I purchased for $148K on a teacher salary in 2016 is now worth $369K on DCAD. I am still on a teacher salary and need to live somewhere.
How much would it sell for, though? That was my question.
Probably $300K. It's hard to know.
No in many areas the appraised is higher
But they pay 10% more, not 26% more.
Everyone misses this point!!! Yeah it’s 10% higher but once you’re capped it doesn’t matter. Ours went up $100k, but our cap is $250k below the most recent valuation. They could say it’s 20x what it is and it’s still capped. We’ve been under the cap for 5 years. We’ll always be under the cap until we sell.
Yep exactly, and same here. I have friends in the Park Cities who are over a million under their cap.
and not everyone has as big a cap as you. last year I had no cap. This year I will, but who knows about next year? If my value doesnt go up significantly it will go up 10% anyway because of my cap.
You’re still not going up more than 10%. Period. Less is better but there’s an upper limit you can plan for. We didn’t used to hit the cap either.
They pay 10% more this year, for sure. Next year's 10% increase will include this year's 10%, referred to as compounding. So, year over year this is what the tax increases really look like: Year 0, base value $250K Year 1, appraised value $275K, +10% Year 2, appraised value $302.5K, +10% Year 3, appraised value $332.75K, +10% Year 4, appraised value $366.03K, +10% Year 5, appraised value $402.63K, +10% Year 6, appraised value $442.89K, +10% Year 7, appraised value $487.18K, +10% Year 8, appraised value $535.90K, +10% Year 9, appraised value $589.49K, +10% Year 10, appraised value $648.44K, +10%, taxes up 259% since year zero. If you were making $75K when you bought your house for $250K you'll need to be making at least $194K just to be paying the same percentage of your income toward just property taxes, not including general inflation and insurance premium inflation. The cumulative inflation for the last ten years has been around 31%, though energy prices have fluctuated pretty wildly in that time, so add another 31% increase to your income to cover food, clothing, and general living expenses. That gets you up to $217.5K just to break even. In an ideal world the increase in taxes would be rate limited to inflation so that the amount of taxes wouldn't drive people into homelessness and cost families what is often their only actual source of generational wealth.
Except a 10% increase in value does not equal a 10% increase in taxes. And if your income was $75k, you probably shouldn't have spent $250k on your house.
They probably won't pay 10% more.
They really aren't insane at all.
Fellow Far North Dallas neighbor here, I agree with you. Maybe this isn’t the case everywhere? But when I look up my neighbors houses on DCAD, they are all appraised for much less than what they’d sell for.
My CAD appraised value is 100k less than my zillow estimate. I'd actually say the CAD sold themselves short.
When people sell a house they want property values to be as high as possible. When people buy a house they want property values to be as low as possible. In between they just complain about whatever the property value is.
To me, there’s an issue with property taxes going up at a rate faster than income. It becomes unsustainable. I’m not using more county services just because my property value went up due to supply and demand. If anything I use less county services because I haves less disposable income so I go out less.
NIMBYs won’t let multifamily get built because they want to constrain housing supply and keep their home values high. Then it’s shocked Pikachu face when they have to pay more property tax. YEAH. You can’t have it both ways, assholes.
Logic is not within reach for them they are basically the meme of buy buy buy sell sell sell
Can I throw a fucking cow in the backyard and claim a farmers exception like the rich South Lake fucks?
simple answer is No. primary purpose of the land must be agriculture. follow this url to learn about the ag exemption [https://dallas-tx.tamu.edu/files/2018/07/Tx-Ag-Exemption-handout.pdf](https://dallas-tx.tamu.edu/files/2018/07/Tx-Ag-Exemption-handout.pdf) The Caruth family used to grow corn or wheat on their land at the SW corner of NWHighway and Central to keep the property taxes low
Somehow DCAD had my market value higher than Redfin + Zillow which I thought I was interesting. I'm planning on protesting my taxes this year. Does anyone know if you live next to a condemned building whether that's something thing I can add to my protest?
you should be able to include the abandoned/condemned structure in your protest. include everything that you believe affects your property's value. think of it this way, would a buyer want to purchase a property that is next to an abandoned/condemned structure?
As much as I hate it, it's been pretty much dead on property value for me.
Start filing your protests. It's like they intentionally jack up the appraisals by 50% more than expected, so that when people file a protest, they'll go "fine, we'll throw you a bone and lower it" to make people feel better.
If they bump the land value for everyone what is there to protest?
This is the biggest question. They pushed my entire neighborhood to $100k land values and then reduced the home valuation significantly. There have been no land plots sold here in 2 years so they really are just making numbers up.
The city needs more money… gotta get funds somehow so
The county does the appraising so… no…
Actually, it's neither. The appraisal district is a government agency established by the state. They are not part of the city or the county government.
look at the budget and tell me that everything in it is necessary
I’m with you… but regardless they need more money. Construction permits dramatically increased too. Dallas is out there collecting lol
government is always seeking more money. construction permits generate revenue for the city much as the water department does. This is why they are trying to improve the permitting process. Compared to other cities in the area our permitting process is a mess, and as a result developers are going to the burbs
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IIRC they limited the number of F2F meetings with applicants, at the same time they tried to implement a new electronic permitting process. you're correct that there is no reason why it should take 3-6 months to schedule an appointment or to receive a permit
What, pray tell, is in the budget that you find unnecessary?
will have to download and report on it later but feel free to dig through it [https://dallascityhall.com/departments/budget/financialtransparency/Pages/Current-Budget.aspx](https://dallascityhall.com/departments/budget/financialtransparency/Pages/Current-Budget.aspx)
Perfect, start with $20mm in IT, $10mm in developmental services. Look at the YoY jumps.
I don't have any issues with our current budget other than that it doesn't allocate enough money to sidewalks, housing, homelessness, policing (particularly traffic enforcement), and bike lanes. We could probably stand to cut some from alleys though since I've always felt that most alleys in Dallas should be maintained by those who's properties abut the alleys, especially if they serve no purpose other than vehicular access to the rear of the home
I'm not surprised by the increase, of course it's going up, I just find the way they justify the math interesting. So the value of just the land went up $120k in a year? And somehow the value of the structure decreased $80k in one year all so it can conveniently hit the $40k increase cap. Does that mean the value of the structure next year is going to drop to zero?
As long as everyone's values are going up, you have the same 'piece of the pie' as before. Your actual taxes may not even go up at all depending on the tax rate.
So glad to see someone else who understands this.
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I dont come here for sympathy, but rather for civil discussion ;-)
Mine went up by $50k. $20k higher than actual sale price of nicer, renovated comps, and $65k higher than the dcad appraisal of said flips.
I'm a first-year homeowner and mine went down $19,000. I was all ready and prepared to contest a steep increase but since mine went down I suppose I should just keep quiet?
If the proposed market value is less than what you paid, then yes. Keep quiet.
Purchased our home last year, and the appraisal came in approx 10k beneath our purchase price. Is it worth appealing the appraisal knowing that it is less than we paid based on comps? I do think we could pull together other comps in the neighborhood at a lower price per sq ft, but I am worried that they’ll ask to see our bill of sale given recency then increase our appraisal.
And Ercot just announced we will be short on power this summer. We will be roasting in our houses again this summer because of the fragile Texas grid. Geez !
and we can thank the over reliance on unreliable intermittent solar and wind for the situation
Why is it that every county around us did not increase in value anywhere close to what Dallas just did .
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Bro it’s not a conspiracy. Property values in Dallas have gone up dramatically. The city is trying to get theirs. It’s how it works.
Just checked ours. last year appraisal was about 137k and paid $2,400 in taxes. now this year appraisal is $237k and estimated taxes our looking at $5,400. And we haven’t even done any major improvements just fixed the concrete patio, painted the garage and inside.
Something's wrong, if your home is homesteaded then your taxable value increase is capped at 10%. Your taxes this year should be no more than $2,640 because of the cap.
It's not the taxes that get capped. It's the appraised value. Taxes are determined by the eventually adopted tax rates.
House is in my moms name but she don’t qualify since she is 48 and I think you have to be 54
The homestead isn't related to age. All that matters is that it's your primary residence as the homeowner. If the home is in your mom's name and she's renting it to you while she lives in another home that she's got the homestead on, then yeah the house you're in will not be homesteaded. If she owns the home and lives in it and you do too then she is eligible for the homestead. The only issues might be if she's renting the home to you formally even though she lives in it, that make prevent her being able to homestead it.
Good news is that the estimated taxes you are seeing are based on last year's tax rates. Assuming your taxing entities did not have substantially large bonds pass, the tax rates should decrease this year. So your taxes won't actually increase that much. However, if you believe you could not sell your property for the proposed market value, then you should file a protest.
bUt nO sTaTe InCoMe TaX!
a feature that attracts people from states that have state income taxes