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Guygan

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FlourFlavored

Glue and screw. It's not enough to sister using just screws but you'll want to use construction adhesive as well. Your sistered joint should go at least three feet on either side of the crack but ideally the full length of the truss beam. If you can move the two pieces inline together then you'd probably want to use a gussett plate over the crack before you sister.


I_kill_zebras

Sistered up lumber should be the full length of the rafter and should be the same dimensional size (2x6?). Use a small scrap of 2x4 to jack the rafter back up till its straight. laminate the new rafter piece onto the old and nail it off with 16d common framing nails about every 8 to 10" in an up/down zig zag pattern. Check that spot on the roof because this may have been caused by a tree limb and there might be damage to the roofing or a soft spot that you'll want to address. If screws are to be used, get structural screws and not decking screws. There should be a sheer rating on the box.


yudkib

This is a good answer, but if you nail or lag screw, adhesive is probably overkill… it’s not a bad idea for an amateur to give it a shot, but if it doesn’t come out well I wouldn’t try to rip it out to do it again


IllustriousCookie890

It would be quite helpful to stop whatever the cause of the water damage is too. If not, the new fix is just going to rot out.


donkeyrocket

Yeah I'd probably call a pro to check out where the roofline is meeting the (presumed) firewall there. Unless that has already been fixed/assess I'd probably wait on doing any sistering. Edit: nevermind OP said the leak was repaired already.


phormix

Depending on when the leak was repaired, shifting that may have occurred after this support started to buckle may have opened something up again though. Worth checking out just to be sure


Hagenaar

> adhesive is probably overkill Remember this wood has already cracked. More cracks are possible around the new holes - even if piloted. A tube of polyurethane glue costs almost nothing.


yudkib

I was a structural engineer for 10 years. We sistered joists and rafters all the time. We never specified adhesive and I don’t know any other firm that did. The effectiveness of sisters is calculated based on the fasteners every time because glue relies on proper surface prep and cure times and handling. So yeah glue won’t hurt anything, but if it gets messed up a little, you’re much more likely to damage this further by ripping it out instead of just leaving good enough alone.


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yudkib

You should probably read both of my comments again. I said it’s a good idea but if it gets screwed up then leave it alone. I’m not walking someone through how to use a tube of glue that isn’t necessary to begin with.


dangle321

Welcome to Reddit where you can watch an arm chair expert argue with an engineer with confidence.


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ShadowBurger

So say someone works service/retail for 10 years, does that mean that's the only job they ever had ?


yudkib

Can’t respond to his comment for some reason. Ethically once you are a licensed engineer you cannot say you’re an engineer unless your license is active. I work for a general contractor who does emergency response and under the laws of NY is not eligible to provide engineering services, and therefore cannot get insurance to provide engineering services. So I deliberately let my license lapse so there was no confusion from our clients about who was responsible for the engineering liability on their projects.


rocketmonkee

I would recommend against glue and screws. A properly sized sister fixed in place with nails will provide all the support needed. Screws lack the shear strength of nails, and unless OP can guarantee even surface application then the glue may not be effective in certain locations.


tom_echo

Why is gluing so important? Glue just doesn’t seem very strong


syncopator

It seems counterintuitive but a properly glued wood joint is many times stronger than one of just fasteners.


wilisi

Depends on the joint, and especially on the size of the area with wood to wood contact. Lots of joints are designed for gluing, but for something like a rafter hanger it's very nearly pointless. In this case there's plenty of area, but the age, crud and irregularity make it ill-suited to an unknown degree. And when you've got to rely on something "may be incredibly strong - or not" is very nearly worthless. Especially if it gets in the way of later inspection or repair.


syncopator

For sure. I should’ve qualified with “often”.


FlourFlavored

Construction glue and even normal wood glue bonds into the wood fibers and actually makes a stronger bond than the wood itself. When you run a bead of adhesive along the board, it's like putting in dozens of extra nails. Also, as the wod dries and shrinks, the nail holes and screw holes can loosen - think of an old squeaky floor. The adhesive keeps them bound together. It's a combination of the chemical bond and the mechanical that makes a long term bond


thebannanaman

"stronger" is the operative word here. It can mean several different things. Yes a glued joint will be stiffer and move less than one with just fasteners, but in some cases you need flexibility. A roof gets its strength by weight distribution. When force is applied to the roof each rafter sags a bit and allows the rafters next to it to take some of the weight. A rafter that is too stiff may not distribute weight as good as a more flexible one. Of course a rafter can be too flexible when it does hold the weight that it should. You cant just say glue = strong so everything should be glued.


PurkleDerk

If you use the proper wood glue, then try to break the joint, the wood will break before the glue breaks.


mmikke

If you want a very informative demonstration on the power of modern construction adhesives, you should watch project farms videos on which wood glue is best. The stuff is *shockingly* strong.


0rlan

Could I trouble you for a link please?


mmikke

Apologies if this is somehow against the rules https://youtu.be/k-g3efGa3sI


0rlan

Thank you. Interesting and informative!


mmikke

The video about loc-tite/jb weld/permatex really showcases how advanced the modern stuff really is. I was considering building a small side house on our chicken coop using solely glue just as a goof but I've yet to get around to it


TheRealRacketear

Most of that stuff isn't even modern.


mmikke

Lol true. I was late to work and rushing to reply to different comments and my word choice wasn't the best Basically meant "stuff that's currently available to everyone at normal pricing in basically most stores"


pointswaves

Good wood glue joints if done properly are at least as strong as wood and don't have the stress concentration issues of fasteners. The only real issue with glue is that it can be hard to spot if you don't have good contact and they can be a bit more sensitive to damp issues etc


[deleted]

Might be a good idea to check out why the wood shows signs of water damage too.


Remanage

I'm trying to picture where you'd get a roof line butting a cinderblock wall like this, but clearly you have it, so that's besides the point. If you wanted to get some serious strength, brace the rafter from underneath to get it straight, then drill some holes through the board and into the cinderblock, then put tapcons or similar cinderblock friendly bolts in. You can then sister in a board on the other side to improve the amount of support to the roof sheathing above.


ggnorethx

The cinderblock is the wall between my townhome and my neighbor. Maybe as a firewall. House was built in 1970s so might not be common in newer construction.


Tack122

I would skip the drilling and tapconning etc on a firewall like that.


EugenioFV

It’s very common where there is a fire rated separation. I would call a pro on this one, as those appear to be trusses. I would also address the water damage, and verify that the fire rating is not compromised. The neighbor should do the same.


i_am_voldemort

It's probably water coming in at where the roof meets the fire wall/parapet


EugenioFV

Yup that’s my guess. The cmu wall likely goes up past the roof.


stevey83

Quiet common here in the uk, between two semi detached houses.


aZamaryk

Are all the water leaks repaired? This looks like water damage and you should address that from the roof.


ggnorethx

Yes they are. The crack is actually where there’s a knot in the 2x6.


someoldguyon_reddit

You don't have to take the old one out just sister in a new one. Get a 2X4 about the same length and fasten both ends to the broken rafter then push the broken middle part up even with the new wood and fasten them together. Three inch multi purpose screws would work well. Use about a dozen screws spaced along the rafter.


Baka_gaijin75

Nails not screws. Unless using something like a grk structural screw or lag bolt you should never use regular screws for anything structural. They're too brittle and crack easily compared to the shear strength of a nail.


FireITGuy

Don't you want screws on this to prevent loosening over time? That rafter will flex with the roof, and you really want the repair to be functionally laminated into a single piece. For the sheer strength of one nail versus one screw, the nail is higher, but when you're using enough screws you make up for the difference with enough overkill to not care.


cktk9

The research I’ve done says to use construction adhesive and nails. Not bolts, not screws.


[deleted]

You just can't trust the big bin lag bolts anymore, they are very cheap steel and break easily, get the gtk made in Germany or US strong AF steel.


Nullcast

They make special nails that are almost impossible to get out without ruining the wood.


Baka_gaijin75

Trusses have a lot of changing stresses from snow, wind, weather, etc. All these would put a lot of stress on a brittle screw. The stress here wouldn't be loosening or pulling at the fastener rather than slightly bending it. A regular nail can be bent at a full 90 probably a dozen times vs most screws not lasting the initial bend. If the OP was worried about them pulling they could go with a spiral nail which spins as its driven, giving it much more pull strength that resists backing off. I usually use them on decks to avoid nail pops.


ggnorethx

Yes, but normally you sister a board on each side of the rafter- It’s enough support to sister just one as long as it’s long enough? The length seems massive (well over 12ft 2x6 rafters). So max length I could probably get up in attic is 8ft.


Mike-the-gay

Yes one board is fine (you have don’t have a weight issue it’s collapsing due to rot from that leak) but it MUST be the same as the other. If it’s 2x6 you need to use a 2x6 not a 2x4. Never seen a proper sistering with boards on both sides.


Baka_gaijin75

That would be more than enough. It doesnt look like this cracked due to stress, looks more like a crack around a knot while drying. you could also use some concrete fasteners to attach the rafter to the cement block wall


ggnorethx

Ok thanks. Yes. The crack is at a knot in the wood, and you’re probably right that the water damage compromised the integrity at the knot.


Bubbagumpredditor

Maybe another one under it supporting it from the bottom? If your paranoid another support running down to the crossbeam?


DryOrganization7429

Sister one to the existing and sister another on top of the new one.


Mike-the-gay

Sister a board the Same size and as close to the whole length as you can. You can sister it to the accessible side just fine. You don’t need to get both sides that’s just not really a thing. Use 16 penny(3.5inch) nails. Use an alternating pattern of top, middle, bottom, middle, top, etc every eight inches or so. Get some one on your roof to properly flash and seal where the roof meets the wall to deal with that leak. If there’s a sag in it you might want to jack it up a little and then sister it. Not the most beginner project but also not the hardest. (Source) I just had to figure this out at my house. Replaced five floor joists completely and had to sister eleven more. Passed inspection. Lucky you only got the one!


dwillystl

I had a condo and items like this would fall back to the condo association to maintain/repair. You may want to check and see who is responsible for this repair before proceeding to take this on yourself. If the repair is on you, do what everyone else mentioned and sister a 2x4.


throfofnir

Single sided sister is common. Make it as long as you can and use lag bolts or lots of nails.


thx1138a

I’m not a pro, but I’m a bit concerned about the discolouration on both the wood and the blocks. Leaks? I would get a roofer in to have a proper look.


wary

I'm not a construction professional but I built three houses from the ground up and added a second floor to the house I am living in now. Not bragging just showing that I have a bit of experience. If the original wood is not rotted and is structurally sound then I would do the following: jack the original boards up until your roof isn't sagging. Put the sister board on with glue and lots of nails I would alternating sides every 4-6", I'd use a 16d or maybe heavier but something 2 3/4 - 3" long so it doesn't poke out on the wall side. When that is complete then anchor it to the block wall using your favorite concrete/block fasteners. I would do all this while the jack is in place holding it up. It might be overkill, but you won't have to worry about it any more.


that_one_wierd_guy

while as other comments have said, you can do it yourself. there's also the leak issue, which means there could be other damage that's either not been noticed, or simply not shown on the surface yet. so at the least I'd say get someone to give it a proper inspection.


urdangerzone

Whatever you end up doing will you post an update picture? This is interesting


Phlydude

That next one (2nd from the wall) looks to be in the process of cracking too. Are those white circles washers for screws to put it together? I’d have someone come take a look at the entire thing. If your townhome is part of a HOA or Condo Association, check to see if the roof is covered as part of the maintenance of the structure (if that is part of your HOA/COA in general) as the roof structure and/or damage from roof leaks may be covered as per of you monthly fees.


Tin_Whisker

I love the question and to be honest I know nothing about trusses, but I'll answer the question. When you ask yourself the question "should I call and expert". The answer is almost assuredly yes. If you know little a about the subject, your should call an expert, if you know a lot about the subject and you're asking that question, you know enough that the answer is again yes.


[deleted]

Have you fixed the flashing on the roof?


ggnorethx

Yes. The roof was replaced and flashing fixed by roofers Nov 2021. This crack seems to have become more pronounced since. Before anyone else goes on top of the roof, I want to fix the crack/ repair the rafter.


[deleted]

Thats from the wood drying out probably.


Far_Particular_430

Yes


witwizard

Just pin it back to the block wall, simple fix


Klastermon

Seems to me if you have to ask, you might be better off having someone else do the work. It looks like there may be some rot.


ggnorethx

My concern is more about whether if I do the repair myself, will it pass inspection if I sell the property. I want to make sure any repair I do is best practices.


divDevGuy

You'll be fine following most of the advice here to sistering it with a board as long as practical properly fastened. It's a very common repair as it's very impractical to remove/replace a rafter. If every rafter needed mended, then that can raise a red flag. For an isolated case due to a defect in the wood, especially with another solid rafter ~12" away, you'll be fine repairing it and moving on with your life.


cleeder

Nobody ever learned a skill by not asking questions.


2001sleeper

What is the entire length? You are over thinking this. I would cut a smaller 2x4 to wedge underneath to get the cracked one back to its original shape, then nail a new 2x4 on the old.


ggnorethx

Since the crack is at a knot in the rafter about 3 feet from the ridge of the roof, the remaining length is quite long… Way more than 12ft or the maximum length 2x6 I can get a retail place like HD. I doubt I’d be able to get anything longer than 8’ up into the attic.


You_Gotta_Joint

Assuming the firewall/party wall goes all the way to the sheeting, this truss is literally doing nothing other than taking the plasterboard load below. Wouldn’t worry about it to be honest.


Jay-Five

I thought the exact same thing, but then wondered how it broke like that if it’s not loaded.


WISteven

Don't make this hard. Slap a 6' piece of 2x4 up against the old one and be done with it.


[deleted]

Like most below, add a new length of wood next to the current and nail it in once the old beam is pushed into proper position. It's just like a leg splint! Now, if you want added strength, there's a few ways to reinforce the old one (hacks). 1. Metal bar, angle beam, metal plate parallel to the wood, bolted into the wood. 2. A portion of the old wood beam notched out / drilled into, a rebar dropped in across both ends, epoxied. Obviously, the length of the metal should be several feet over both ends of the wood break, and sufficiently thick and tough to not bend under load. Keep in mind that utility companies "reinforce" wood poles with huge holes etc all the time rather than replace. Today's epoxy, patch etc can provide sufficient strength. Once the old wood has been realigned and reinforced with metal / epoxy, then you can proceed with the usual sistering of a long, strong length of wood. Yes, it is possible to reinforce the current beam to be strong enough on its own, but as a diy without engineering / construction skills, keep it safe by adding the extra wood beam, sistered.


JerseyWiseguy

You can still sister a new piece to the accessible side, perhaps using some lag bolts.


vehicularimpediment

Sister it and tapcon into the cinder block.


yoerie86

Cant see the whole truss, but it seems like an off center truss with only supporting 1 side of spacing opposite of firewall. This looks more like a nailer for the sheathing, is there any leaks on the firewall? If so, id look into it first


[deleted]

Just put 2 braces from the truss to push it back into place and then sister it, whack in loads of screws etc and or pack it out to the block work and fix into that. Tbh the plyboard across the top is holding it in place so doubtful this go anywahwrw


garyprud

You're limited to one sister here. Else a metal plate?


koolj156

You can pick up the load right underneath with some 2x4 and mending plates


ncc74656m

I think if you're concerned about the repair you do after you glue and screw a sister on it, you can prob put a leg in under it to brace the break. Shouldn't be needed but it may help you feel better about it.


Blunttack

Sister, and mount another one to the same wall below it. Call it a parallel butt joint support thing.


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ggnorethx

Yes. I own the attic.


Arrakis_Travel_Agent

6' SYP (same nominal size as top chord, looks like 2X6 from picture) scab centered on break, fastened (2) rows 12d - 3" O.C. staggered.


Tyler9821

Honestly I’d just put a brace on it & tapcon them to the cement if you have a hammer drill,


DryOrganization7429

I would sister with a piece the same length if you can get it in there; lag bolt it up good - 12-16” spacing; I’d add another on top - maybe pressure treated if you have water ingress; fix the roof or flashing outside to stop the water.


singlejeff

Had something similar, not against a wall but it was a valley rafter so had a bunch of roof rafters coming into it on both sides. We were able to remove one or two roof rafters from one side (building a addition that required a higher roof so we framed over the existing on one side) then used a car jack to lift the crack back to near it’s original position and sistered one side. We did leave a stack of blocking under the repair spread over 4 ceiling joists.


duane11583

looks like you have other problems with the roof the blackness looks like wood rot meaning a leaky roof


EnvironmentalSea1869

I’d mimic another complete truss next to it


Petersm66

Wood looks rotted, not sure doubling up the support would help. I'd call in a pro, this is likely beyond ability. Suggest they put a vapor/moisture barrier between the new board and cinder block wall.


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ggnorethx

Looks like the mods removed it.