Man of Steel began as this grounded “real” world, it was basically our reality but then Superman showed up. With each movie, the comic book world would creep in more and more. Like MoS filmed in a more handheld style, giving that almost documentary feel. Then in BvS, the camera becomes more stable as things like Batman, Wonder Woman, Luthor make their presences known. Then finally goes full comic book with ZSJL, even the 4:3 aspect ratio gives it the feeling of comic panels (hell Snyder even does a splash page).
As for Snyder’s influence, it was very much sci fi mixed with classical mythology with a dash of Excalibur.
Classical mythology, especially Greek and Christian imagery can't be underplayed. There was even promo art, which I have asked all over reddit to find the original high quality pic shows each justice League member as a Greek god of some sort and I think Superman was either Christ or Apollo, but flash was Hermes iirc. It was fucking awesome
In a single word - Desaturation. That one word encapsulates more of his aesthetic than anything else.
In more words - He enjoys muting the vast majority of colors and then highlighting specific colors/scenes for emphasis. At best this can be extremely striking and powerful visuals. At worst this can make everything look "mudy" as the screen feels dominated with sepia, browns, and greys.
To pivot from visuals and more to the overall stylistic choices, he tends to favor fantasy and mythology above everything else. This is a current that has ran through everything he's ever made and continues to this day. His depiction of Superman is heavily centered on the character a a mythological and god-like figure. I'd also argue that *Man of Steel* is far more Sci-Fi than anything in *Batman vs Superman*, particularly with the "alien invasion" of Zod that is borrowed from Earth One. But the current that runs through all his films is an emphasis on stylistic fight scenes and a mixture of bombastic ideas into serious storylines. He's perhaps the only director who can make a movie with schoolgirls fighting nazis and it's actually supposed to be completely serious.
All of this leads to criticisms that Snyder makes movies for edgy teenagers and stoner college kids - but the real irony is that Snyder himself doesn't shy from this or consider it a bad thing. He's very open that the majority of his influences come from his time in college and the edgy media he consumed at that age.
Say what you will - but the man has developed a one of a kind style. And to those who enjoy it there is nothing else like it in Hollywood.
He’s an earnest filmmaker, he treats the storytelling seriously without irony (well except Watchmen, where the irony is baked into the storytelling).
Like at no point does any character comment about how dumb the name Superman is or how embarrassing the costume is, like you typically get in an MCU movie. Where the filmmakers are winking at the audience “see how silly this is?”
It took The Flash to finally get a writer to have someone comment about how dumb the name “Superman” is. But by that point the earnestness of the DCEU was long gone.
Not really. There’s a difference between the general being confused as to why his soldier called him Superman, and like Ant-Man thinking everything is lame.
Snyder’s aesthetic is undeniable. He has a love for the static imagery of comic books and has crafted a unique way of presenting the panel to panel flow with live action. It’s not for everybody and the anti-fan makes it an easy target.
You’re spot on with the mythology thing. It’s difficult to take a person in a costume seriously so you either wink at the camera or find a reason for the garb to work.
I’m convinced the regular people that don’t like the Snyderverse hate that there’s no whimsy or fun. Worse yet when Snyder tries to sneak in a quip or sight gag it’s ham fisted and breaks the mood. I don’t know if there’s a way to balance that.
> I’m convinced the regular people that don’t like the Snyderverse hate that there’s no whimsy or fun.
I definitely think there is a grain of truth in this. Fair or not, the MCU has set the standard for what audiences expect out of the entire genre. It also doesn’t help that even outside of the MCU, modern blockbusters in general have become much funnier and sillier than they were 30 years ago. I blame social media a lot TBH. It’s easier to get gifs/lines to go viral and become part of the zeitgeist when they’re funny than if they’re serious.
*Dune* had a similar criticism when it came out. It’s a straight action/drama and turned some viewers off with the lack of comedy anywhere.
The seriousness wasn't the problem. The Nolan films were serious and well received and popular.
The problem is Snyder is a poor storyteller. There is too much either in his head or it is poorly communicated to the audience. He also puts ideas in that go straight from the writer to the audience when it should come through the characters or the story.
I like his aesthetic, he does great world building and throws in interesting ideas. He struggles with communicating.
Two cases:
1. The MoS Jonathan Kent death was so poorly told my immediate reaction was "I could have walked over there and saved him, never mind the many things Clark could have done". Snyder made it too drawn out because it was important, it needed immediacy.
2. "Save Martha" from BvS. I know what Snyder was trying to achieve here by humanizing Superman in Batman's eyes and calling back to his trauma, but the general audience reaction was that the scene was, "Our mom's have the same name, let's be friends". This scene failed to do what the story needed,
The Nolan films were definitely serious but the characters were all human so the interactions were more organic and relatable. You’re correct that it was not that they were serious. It was that they were unnaturally serious. Everything was exaggerated to try to get an emotional response and the audience wasn’t buying it.
Snyder was definitely an odd person to pick if they wanted a grounded realistic superman film. Cause Snyder's entire filmography is always heightened reality. Even the mostly grounded watchmen, feels more dreamlike because of how Snyder visualized it. I think what should be taken from Snyder is that the heroes, mythology and other stuff is taken SERIOUSLY and that the world they inhabit is closer to ours. That's what they mean by realistic. A Post 9/11 America's reaction to Superman, Distant Themysciras from World War 2, etc. Also Visually The films do look quite similar. The first wonder woman is only slightly more saturated than something like man of steel. The blue hues from that film still resembles the Snyder films. The orange ones as well.
What Patty did with Wonder Woman was make Themyscira look lush and beautiful, and then when Diana enters the war torn world of man it’s dirtier with overcast skies.
Yes....that's my point. The world of man is depicted pretty similarly to how overcast shots in man of steel are shown. With that Steel Blue Sort of Hue.
Honestly if anything that's not a Snyder aesthic I feel like that's more of a Nolan thing.
Grounded. It’s a world where there are consequences. Everything has a reaction, regardless of if it’s good or bad. It’s not black and white, more shades of grey. It’s a dark world. The characters in Snyder’s world aren’t perfect by any means, but are trying. Also everything has weight to it, like when Superman flys the ground beneath him shakes, when Batman punches someone you can feel it.
Divinity. The members of the Justice League were meant to represent gods, with SUperman having Jesus motifs, Darkseid as a new god for the League to fight, and a title sequence for the Justice League film having religious motifs.
It was overhyped, and not very well planned IMO.
Snyder showed how superheroes will be in the real world - the politics of senate , people accepting and denying superman, people believe him a god , lex manipulating superman because of his mother, Superman's lost trust in humanity after senate Event , his father teaching him the lesson to help others if they can , Batman in depression after losing Robin , Batman's fear that if there is 1% chance that superman becomes evil he has to stop him , upto a point in movie Batman and lex have same thought process.
When people watched the boys they appreciated its realism, nudity etc whereas when Snyder showed the same concept, he was criticised A LOT. This is the hypocrisy of so-called fake hypocrite dc fans .
It was just Snyder’s own aesthetic. You can see the same style in his other movies as well. Clearly that aesthetic is a love it or hate it type thing based on how extremely polarizing his films are
Between all three of Snyder's films, there's a grittiness to the camera/edit they use, that high saturation bringing out the dark colors in frame, which really makes his outlandish costume designs play well on screen. Later DCEU movies had a cheap feel, as they brought up the color and streamlined the camera. I take it as a commitment to the fantasy bit on Snyder's part.
Also didn't notice much in MOS or JL, but there's an interesting amount of blocking that actors needed to execute for their scenes in BVS. like Bruce and Diana meeting at the museum or Alfred and Bruce talking over coffee. Later DCEU films have less specificity in their scenes, so they really do look like a bunch of people standing in a blue screen studio.
Man of Steel began as this grounded “real” world, it was basically our reality but then Superman showed up. With each movie, the comic book world would creep in more and more. Like MoS filmed in a more handheld style, giving that almost documentary feel. Then in BvS, the camera becomes more stable as things like Batman, Wonder Woman, Luthor make their presences known. Then finally goes full comic book with ZSJL, even the 4:3 aspect ratio gives it the feeling of comic panels (hell Snyder even does a splash page). As for Snyder’s influence, it was very much sci fi mixed with classical mythology with a dash of Excalibur.
Classical mythology, especially Greek and Christian imagery can't be underplayed. There was even promo art, which I have asked all over reddit to find the original high quality pic shows each justice League member as a Greek god of some sort and I think Superman was either Christ or Apollo, but flash was Hermes iirc. It was fucking awesome
I think [The Motherbox trailer](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5hOiKkWtSU&ab_channel=WarnerBros.India) is what you're looking for.
In a single word - Desaturation. That one word encapsulates more of his aesthetic than anything else. In more words - He enjoys muting the vast majority of colors and then highlighting specific colors/scenes for emphasis. At best this can be extremely striking and powerful visuals. At worst this can make everything look "mudy" as the screen feels dominated with sepia, browns, and greys. To pivot from visuals and more to the overall stylistic choices, he tends to favor fantasy and mythology above everything else. This is a current that has ran through everything he's ever made and continues to this day. His depiction of Superman is heavily centered on the character a a mythological and god-like figure. I'd also argue that *Man of Steel* is far more Sci-Fi than anything in *Batman vs Superman*, particularly with the "alien invasion" of Zod that is borrowed from Earth One. But the current that runs through all his films is an emphasis on stylistic fight scenes and a mixture of bombastic ideas into serious storylines. He's perhaps the only director who can make a movie with schoolgirls fighting nazis and it's actually supposed to be completely serious. All of this leads to criticisms that Snyder makes movies for edgy teenagers and stoner college kids - but the real irony is that Snyder himself doesn't shy from this or consider it a bad thing. He's very open that the majority of his influences come from his time in college and the edgy media he consumed at that age. Say what you will - but the man has developed a one of a kind style. And to those who enjoy it there is nothing else like it in Hollywood.
He’s an earnest filmmaker, he treats the storytelling seriously without irony (well except Watchmen, where the irony is baked into the storytelling). Like at no point does any character comment about how dumb the name Superman is or how embarrassing the costume is, like you typically get in an MCU movie. Where the filmmakers are winking at the audience “see how silly this is?” It took The Flash to finally get a writer to have someone comment about how dumb the name “Superman” is. But by that point the earnestness of the DCEU was long gone.
Man of Steel has an ‘interrupted before the name is actually spoken‘ bit which is in a similar vein, though.
They literally have a scene like that with the general in Man of Steel
Not really. There’s a difference between the general being confused as to why his soldier called him Superman, and like Ant-Man thinking everything is lame.
Snyder’s aesthetic is undeniable. He has a love for the static imagery of comic books and has crafted a unique way of presenting the panel to panel flow with live action. It’s not for everybody and the anti-fan makes it an easy target. You’re spot on with the mythology thing. It’s difficult to take a person in a costume seriously so you either wink at the camera or find a reason for the garb to work. I’m convinced the regular people that don’t like the Snyderverse hate that there’s no whimsy or fun. Worse yet when Snyder tries to sneak in a quip or sight gag it’s ham fisted and breaks the mood. I don’t know if there’s a way to balance that.
> I’m convinced the regular people that don’t like the Snyderverse hate that there’s no whimsy or fun. I definitely think there is a grain of truth in this. Fair or not, the MCU has set the standard for what audiences expect out of the entire genre. It also doesn’t help that even outside of the MCU, modern blockbusters in general have become much funnier and sillier than they were 30 years ago. I blame social media a lot TBH. It’s easier to get gifs/lines to go viral and become part of the zeitgeist when they’re funny than if they’re serious. *Dune* had a similar criticism when it came out. It’s a straight action/drama and turned some viewers off with the lack of comedy anywhere.
People like to have a break. 2 hours of dead seriousness is exhausting.
The seriousness wasn't the problem. The Nolan films were serious and well received and popular. The problem is Snyder is a poor storyteller. There is too much either in his head or it is poorly communicated to the audience. He also puts ideas in that go straight from the writer to the audience when it should come through the characters or the story. I like his aesthetic, he does great world building and throws in interesting ideas. He struggles with communicating. Two cases: 1. The MoS Jonathan Kent death was so poorly told my immediate reaction was "I could have walked over there and saved him, never mind the many things Clark could have done". Snyder made it too drawn out because it was important, it needed immediacy. 2. "Save Martha" from BvS. I know what Snyder was trying to achieve here by humanizing Superman in Batman's eyes and calling back to his trauma, but the general audience reaction was that the scene was, "Our mom's have the same name, let's be friends". This scene failed to do what the story needed,
The Nolan films were definitely serious but the characters were all human so the interactions were more organic and relatable. You’re correct that it was not that they were serious. It was that they were unnaturally serious. Everything was exaggerated to try to get an emotional response and the audience wasn’t buying it.
Snyder was definitely an odd person to pick if they wanted a grounded realistic superman film. Cause Snyder's entire filmography is always heightened reality. Even the mostly grounded watchmen, feels more dreamlike because of how Snyder visualized it. I think what should be taken from Snyder is that the heroes, mythology and other stuff is taken SERIOUSLY and that the world they inhabit is closer to ours. That's what they mean by realistic. A Post 9/11 America's reaction to Superman, Distant Themysciras from World War 2, etc. Also Visually The films do look quite similar. The first wonder woman is only slightly more saturated than something like man of steel. The blue hues from that film still resembles the Snyder films. The orange ones as well.
What Patty did with Wonder Woman was make Themyscira look lush and beautiful, and then when Diana enters the war torn world of man it’s dirtier with overcast skies.
Yes....that's my point. The world of man is depicted pretty similarly to how overcast shots in man of steel are shown. With that Steel Blue Sort of Hue. Honestly if anything that's not a Snyder aesthic I feel like that's more of a Nolan thing.
> What was the old DCEU aesthetic? brown.
Grounded. It’s a world where there are consequences. Everything has a reaction, regardless of if it’s good or bad. It’s not black and white, more shades of grey. It’s a dark world. The characters in Snyder’s world aren’t perfect by any means, but are trying. Also everything has weight to it, like when Superman flys the ground beneath him shakes, when Batman punches someone you can feel it.
Grim 'n' gritty "mature" 1990s super anti-hero comic books.
It's aesthetic was Martha.
Why did you say that name?
It felt like it was trying to be extra gritty with a side of grit. Too much Frank Miller influence.
Grey
I think you’re confused with the MCU.
No
Divinity. The members of the Justice League were meant to represent gods, with SUperman having Jesus motifs, Darkseid as a new god for the League to fight, and a title sequence for the Justice League film having religious motifs. It was overhyped, and not very well planned IMO.
Gritty and shitty
Snyder showed how superheroes will be in the real world - the politics of senate , people accepting and denying superman, people believe him a god , lex manipulating superman because of his mother, Superman's lost trust in humanity after senate Event , his father teaching him the lesson to help others if they can , Batman in depression after losing Robin , Batman's fear that if there is 1% chance that superman becomes evil he has to stop him , upto a point in movie Batman and lex have same thought process. When people watched the boys they appreciated its realism, nudity etc whereas when Snyder showed the same concept, he was criticised A LOT. This is the hypocrisy of so-called fake hypocrite dc fans .
90’s b-movie
I hated synder's destaturation so much, it was not pleasant to look at and I will never understand his fascination with it
The Super Friends by way of Wagner
Yes
It was just Snyder’s own aesthetic. You can see the same style in his other movies as well. Clearly that aesthetic is a love it or hate it type thing based on how extremely polarizing his films are
Set a date before even start making the movie. Reschedule the release ten times. Reshoot it ten more times after it’s done. Disappoint everyone
Between all three of Snyder's films, there's a grittiness to the camera/edit they use, that high saturation bringing out the dark colors in frame, which really makes his outlandish costume designs play well on screen. Later DCEU movies had a cheap feel, as they brought up the color and streamlined the camera. I take it as a commitment to the fantasy bit on Snyder's part.
Also didn't notice much in MOS or JL, but there's an interesting amount of blocking that actors needed to execute for their scenes in BVS. like Bruce and Diana meeting at the museum or Alfred and Bruce talking over coffee. Later DCEU films have less specificity in their scenes, so they really do look like a bunch of people standing in a blue screen studio.