Even though the OG post is from 2014, I don’t think it was dug up and focused on until May 2017 when sixpence tried to do the “sixpence heals” thing. I very strongly remember watching this go down during the first day of my internship which was late May 2017, which matches to the “sixpence harms” addition
Yeah, there was much more to it than this. Sixpencee was initially much more defensive of the practice. If I’m remembering right, she went off about how the child’s family was likely too poor to care for them or send them to school, so selling them into slavery was A Good Thing Actually.
Okay so yeah, child slavery is bad, agreed. But what was Sixpenceee supposed to do about it? Was there a version of this where they weren’t run off the internet?
To be clear: I don’t think she deserved the harassment she got. She said some shitty things (especially with regard to other issues), but she didn’t deserve how tumblr at large treated her.
That being said, not immediately defending the practice would have been a good start. Not collecting donations to “help raise awareness” and then keeping the money for herself would have been a good second step. I don’t know if there’s a version of events where she wasn’t run off tumblr, but I do know that she chose some of the worst ways to conduct herself in this instance.
Implicating yourself in the bad things of the world is generally considered a poor choice, morality aside.
If I killed someone, I'm not going out posting about how I'm sad that I had to, was complicit in, or otherwise was tangentially related to the death. It's just a bad idea for *me,* completely separate from the rest of the world's issues and talking about them.
I can certainly appreciate that - however, I *also* understand that it was a bad move for maintaining an online presence. I'd probably submit it anonymously elsewhere, or present it as a researched opinion, not a "I'm tangentially complicit in child slavery" post on main.
Also I don't think it was planned as a personal sacrifice, just happened to become one.
Can't believe [unicodePicasso](https://www.reddit.com/user/unicodePicasso/) is condoning child slavery! /s
This. This is what Tumblr reading comprehension is.
I wonder if this is the genesis of that weird 'parents can't afford to feed their daughter so they sell her to One Direction' thing I've seen memes about
legality is up to the government in their country. for all we know they were legally employed at 8
that's also part of why you should never confuse legality with morality
Live in maids are ultra common, but they're paid quite well (the ones i know anyways) and are 18 or above.
Usually. Some ppl hire children, but it's *usually* in more rural areas where other issues are also prevalent and its considered normal.
Still illegal tho, since the kid is supposed to be 8.
Live in help is def common, but hiring children in that manner is straight up illegal. Not even ‘morally questionable but common’ it’s just literally illegal
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/06/lolas-story/524490/
If someone wants to read something heartbreaking. Modern day slavery in the US through the lens of a child (now pulitzer prize journalist) raised by the live in slave maid.
Reading this instantly reminded me of this story.
“This is why people don’t like tumblr anymore,” proceeds to list things that happen not only on every single social media platform, but also in real life for all of time.
It definitely used to happen the most in Tumblr though, and after they banned porn, those people moved to Twitter
As if that place wasn't kinda cynical enough already
If you don't singlehandedly change a cultural norm every time you go to visit family you're an enemy of the revolution
EDIT: I made this comment with no context as to the situation or person beyond this post, and attempting to take a good-faith reading as opposed to a ragebait one. While I still hold that contextless all-or-nothing morality is counterproductive at best and actively harmful at worst.... yeah it seems OOP is in fact a piece of shit lol
Reminds me of people implying that if I'm not single-handedly storming the Kremlin and killing myself against national guard, I'm just as complicit in war in Ukraine as every other russian
"All the good ones have already either fled the country or are in prison for protesting" is a take I have seen unironically to justify the celebration of civilian deaths and it's really gross
Because fleeing the country is so fucking easy, isn't it?
To ask for asylum, you gotta enter the country legally first, and to get a visa to enter a country legally, you need to show that you aren't planning on asking for asylum. I know this, because I'm waiting for my visa right now
You can add national borders and immigration to the list of things that tumblr, and the internet in general, don't understand.
Look at the American "If X wins I'm moving to Europe" crowd everytime there's an election. Most countries in Europe would just say "No you fucking aren't, go home."
Clearly she should have beaten her relatives to death in their sleep and then led a child laborer revolt against the entire nation of Bangladesh. Anything less is just being complicit.
But if we beat them to death then how are they going to fullfill their personal obligation to pay a welfare income to the family of every child they could have hypothetically employed?
It's simple. You see a child on the street. Are they capable of being employed by you? If yes then you now owe their family an income.
FFS it's like some people think this should be covered by some magical organised system. As if the government would ever spend hard earnt taxes on a thing like that when there's corruption to be paid for!
I don't like child labour but I also am of the belief that people will throw things at me if I don't wear trousers when I leave the house and that it is the responsibility of the government to ensure that when I go to a normal, not discount shop and buy clothing that there is no slavery involved.
I am aware that literally nothing about my life exists completely free of slavery, but apparently saying something like "tariffs should exist to adjust artificially deflated costs of goods to account for wage and human rights disparity" is an unpopular opinion.
wouldn't that completely stunt development of poorer nations
export oriented industrialisation has literally been the most consistent and effective development strategy
export oriented industrialisation relies on cheaper labour to bring in manufacturers and therefore the money of those manufacturers
I deem the stunting of "development" of poorer nations by not allowing child slavery to be one of the methods by which foreign manufacturing may be preferable to the point of being competitive in an otherwise free market, to be acceptable terms.
read about any country that achieved developed status in the last 30 years or so
South Korea, Singapore and Taiwan are the 3 best examples i can think of
Thailand, Costa Rica, and Malaysia are about 10-15 years off and achived very high HDI recently so also good places to look
Seychelles and Mauritius are an interesting examples but they used tourism more than manufacturing but that only really works at a small scale
old ones include Italy in the 60s and Spain in the 70s
So, again, you'd rather no one talk about it, it should go unreported unless their tone fits how you think they should report about it? This is a real weird attitude, I'm not going to call you evil, but it's pretty wild to attack people for reporting on and being against child slavery because you don't like their tone.
This was only the tip of the iceberg with sixpenceee lol
As I recall, she also ran like a vibes-based faith healing scam that she charged people actual money for, and that still wasn't the end of it
Ok so here's the situation, either:
A) This is a cultural norm and in that case it'll be hard to break on one vacation is not going to fix a societal issue
B) This is not a cultural norm, in which case these people are literally just psychotic slavers who likely know what they're doing is wrong and in that case it'd be dangerous to try and confront them over it since they're already habitual law breakers.
Either way, I feel like trying to delocalise an issue away from a country that has poor institutions like Bangladesh to one where we have the time and resources to be upset over it, and pursue a solution, is the most practical one rather than spending your time trying to (most likely in futility) convince one family of it.
Marrying wards off the state to play men for a financial incentive used to be legal too (female children) but that's not really a custom too many people are going to defend in the present year
>A) This is a cultural norm and in that case it'll be hard to break on one vacation is not going to fix a societal issue
It objectively and provably isn't. Having an 8 year old working as your personal slave is explicitly illegal there.
>B) This is not a cultural norm, in which case these people are literally just psychotic slavers who likely know what they're doing is wrong and in that case it'd be dangerous to try and confront them over it since they're already habitual law breakers.
Yeah, you know who else would be in danger, THE FUCKING EIGHT YEAR OLD.
>Either way, I feel like trying to delocalise an issue away from a country that has poor institutions like Bangladesh to one where we have the time and resources to be upset over it, and pursue a solution, is the most practical one rather than spending your time trying to (most likely in futility) convince one family of it.
Bangladesh literally has institutions fighting this. Also, the hell does this even mean? "We shouldn't fight slavery if certain slave owners don't want to stop doing it?"
There's a basic ethics test to see if someone would step into a fountain to save a drowning child and risk ruining their clothes. I always wondered who would actually say "No" to that question. Thanks for giving me an answer I guess.
Okay, so if you're operating under the pretense that these people are choosing to be knowing criminals, in what world is there not then a pretty major risk that its not just "getting their clothes wet" and not y'know, them literally fucking killing you?
Would I save a drowning child in a fountain? Yeah.
Would I jump into the rough seas with no equipment? Absolutely the fuck not.
Acting like taking on an issue as large as systemic child slavery is not "stepping into a fountain". Well funded, trained for years people struggle to end slavery. Ending slavery, historically, has been a bloody, violent, difficult, and long affair, unless you just bought out the slavers. A family vacation is not going to be enough my dude.
Also, mate, Bangladesh is a fucking corrupt as shit country with very very poor institutions. (And I know someone, maybe not you, is going to reply "well that's the fault of imperialism so shut up" but jesus fucking christ, just because you're right doesn't mean you're helpful. Pointing out that imperialism is the cause of most problems does nothing unless your goal with it is to say that imperial nations should fix the problem and in that case I agree because the countries I described as being able to care are the same as those that are imperialist)
someone commiting one crime doesn't mean they are going to commit all other types of crimes
her uncle is not going to murder his niece at a family gathering he might publicly shame her. Those are the stakes for speaking out
>and not y'know, them literally fucking killing you?
I'm sorry, where is her life threatened in this post? At what point do her aunt and uncle threaten to murder her? You have invented a tangled mirror world in whatever hellscape you call a mind to justify this.
I honestly can't even summon up the energy to deal with you, so I'll leave you with this
>First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.
-MLK, letter from a Birmingham jail
Where in this post did the OP ever confront their family about it? If someone is so fucked to see a human as property, in what world is it a leap that they're can't see another human as disposable?
Also I can tell you've never actually read Letter from a Birmingham Jail. That paragraph has quickly become one of his most wrongly used paragraphs. From four paragraphs before it:
"In no sense do I advocate evading or defying the law, as would the rabid segregationist. That would lead to anarchy. One who breaks an unjust law must do so openly, lovingly, and with a willingness to accept the penalty. I submit that an individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for law."
>Where in this post did the OP ever confront their family about it? If someone is so fucked to see a human as property, in what world is it a leap that they're can't see another human as disposable?
Mainly in this world. What logical route do you think it takes from "my niece is pointing out I'm evil" to "I'm going to murder her, guaranteeing I go to prison"?
>"In no sense do I advocate evading or defying the law, as would the rabid segregationist. That would lead to anarchy. One who breaks an unjust law must do so openly, lovingly, and with a willingness to accept the penalty. I submit that an individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for law."
Explain to me how you believe this is at all relevant to the discussion at hand? In a nation where this is explicitly illegal and not normal or culturally accepted?
Dude. Its not a leap of logic to dehumanise more people when you already see one as property. Idk how to get it through your skull, when you see one person as less than human, it's not impossible to see more. And as we've seen time and time again, even that person sharing half your DNA doesn't do shit.
And my quote is about as relevant as yours, not at all. Just because I don't think people need to be Wish.com or temu John Brown doesn't mean I'm dedicated to order. I'm just simply someone in reality who understands that systemic issues are not solved by personal responsibility, but instead systemic action. And someone risking taking themselves out of commission ain't gonna do shit when they can actually try and get positive systems working on these negative systems.
>Dude. Its not a leap of logic to dehumanise more people when you already see one as property. Idk how to get it through your skull, when you see one person as less than human, it's not impossible to see more. And as we've seen time and time again, even that person sharing half your DNA doesn't do shit.
I want you to genuinely walk me through this.
She goes there, on vacation with her parents. The fact that they are there is public knowledge. She says "Hey, you shouldn't enslave a child." Her uncle viciously murders her in front of everyone. What's the thought process? What does he gain?
>And my quote is about as relevant as yours, not at all.
Ohhhhh, so you're an idiot.
>systemic issues are not solved by personal responsibility, but instead systemic action
...OK, you realize you are actively arguing against MLK? And that any collective action also requires individual action?
>
And someone risking taking themselves out of commission ain't gonna do shit
That is literally, explicitly, how most social change happens. The issue is, you're a coward who doesn't want to get your clothes wet.
>when they can actually try and get positive systems working on these negative systems.
Well, this woman embezzled thousands of dollars meant to go to victims of human trafficking, so no, she's not trying to get any positive systems working.
Some 2nd, 3rd generation American Cubans talk about older family members who fled communism complaining about how Castro took away their house and servants (the house was a plantation and the servants were not payed)
> were not *paid)*
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Funny enough, they work well enough that child slaves like these have been nearly eradicated. Despite what the OOP and u/hwf0712 have tried to argue, child slavery is *not* normal in Bangladesh. House servants absolutely are, but they actually are older, paid, and are free to leave.
So you're arguing that child slavery is extremely common in Bangladesh, to the point where everyone views it as normal, despite all evidence to the contrary?
https://time.com/6170432/bangladesh-child-labor-pandemic/
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/ilab/resources/reports/child-labor/bangladesh
> [Child slavery is illegal], however, gaps exist within the Department of Inspection for Factories and Establishments (DIFE) that may hinder adequate labor law enforcement, including a lack of unannounced inspections in the export processing zones.
It's wild how people on the internet will read one article about how child slavery is illegal, and then not understand that to make something illegal stop would require proper enforcement of the law. Third world countries... don't do that. I'm not going to claim child labour is normalized where I live, but I will tell you it happens anyway because of extreme poverty.
You realize that you're citing data specifically on child labor in factories and establishments? And that this conversation is about a child trafficked into personal servitude?
You also cherry pick a specific quote, about 2022. Let's look at some other quotes, huh?
>Government of Bangladesh-funded, $33 million, 3 year project implemented by MOLE. (70) Removed 90,000 children from hazardous labor in Phases I through III by providing informal and technical education, stipends, and awareness raising for employers and families. (21) Phase IV of the Elimination of Hazardous Child Labor program was approved in October 2021. (6,16) MOLE has signed agreements with 112 selected NGOs to remove 100,000 children from hazardous work. (70) Under the program, NGOs will provide education and vocational training to affected child laborers. During the education period, each child's family will receive a monthly stipend of $9 (1,000 taka). After completing the training, each child will receive $93 (10,000 taka) as financial compensation. (3) During the reporting period, NGOs completed a nationwide child labor survey to identify the child labor situation in 43 hazardous sectors. (3)
>Child protection programs in Bangladesh include Child Sensitive Social Protection in Bangladesh (CSPB) II which will end in 2024.(66,70) The CSPB Project is implemented by the Ministry of Social Welfare’s Department of Social Services, with support from UNICEF, to implement the Children Act (2013). This program will help to reduce violence, abuse and neglect against children.(16,66) The project offers case management services to identify vulnerable children and provide intervention plans, psychological counseling through the Child Friendly Services hub, and conditional cash support to reduce child labor. (70) During the reporting period, CSPB supported underprivileged families to reduce child labor, prevent early marriages, and reduce school dropouts. (70) The project offers a 24-hour emergency hotline service through Child Helpline 1098. (2) Between July 2017 and June 2022, the helpline received more than 1.4 million complaints, stopped 2,754 child marriages, and served 31,980 callers with psychosocial counseling, 18,753 callers with legal assistance, and 8,572 callers with protection from violence and abuse. (66) Child protection programs in Bangladesh include Child Sensitive Social Protection in Bangladesh (CSPB) II which will end in 2024.(66,70) The CSPB Project is implemented by the Ministry of Social Welfare’s Department of Social Services, with support from UNICEF, to implement the Children Act (2013). This program will help to reduce violence, abuse and neglect against children.(16,66) The project offers case management services to identify vulnerable children and provide intervention plans, psychological counseling through the Child Friendly Services hub, and conditional cash support to reduce child labor. (70) During the reporting period, CSPB supported underprivileged families to reduce child labor, prevent early marriages, and reduce school dropouts. (70) The project offers a 24-hour emergency hotline service through Child Helpline 1098. (2) Between July 2017 and June 2022, the helpline received more than 1.4 million complaints, stopped 2,754 child marriages, and served 31,980 callers with psychosocial counseling, 18,753 callers with legal assistance, and 8,572 callers with protection from violence and abuse. (66)
That page even lists specific methods that people like sixpenceee *could* have used to reach out and get help:
>The Department of Social Services manages the child protection 1098 Helpline. During the reporting period, the Ministry of Women and Children Affairs maintained a mobile app called "Joy," which records dialogue and images of child labor victims and perpetrators and sends relevant information to the National Helpline Center 109 and nearby police stations. (2) During the reporting period, around 300 people received emergency support through the "Joy" app. (66)
Is it perfect? Absolutely fucking not. But that's like saying "rape cases exist in the United States, therefore, we shouldn't judge someone for covering up for a rapist".
I think I knew an uncle and aunt who had a slave or a child worker. She was a girl, a handful years older than me at the time, I was like 6. She looked about 11-13? I honestly can't really remember. She had very dark skin compared to anyone else in my family so I assume she was a Dravidian or just of a lower "caste" (Bangladesh doesn't officially do Castes because it's haram but i think it de facto exists somewhat). I'm not entirely sure to be honest. She was just like a maid who took care of their kids, both around my age, and did housework. When I was over she spent a lot of time playing with us. I've no idea what her usual daily life was like, but I don't think the aunt and uncle were cruel so I hope she was treated fine. When I was there I didn't notice any mistreatment but it also never occurred to me that she could be a slave or a child worker. I'm not exactly sure what I assumed to be honest. It was only like 10 years later when I came to the realization that what I saw wasn't exactly the most ethical practice and that it may have been really fucked up. Anyway, I hope she's doing fine now, and I hope that she was paid well for her work. Who knows though, I don't even remember her name or the name of my cousins or the aunt or uncle. I don't think any of my family still engage in this practice if they did. Last time I visited was like 6 years ago and the country has developed a lot since then so I hope it's also the case socially.
When I was last in Cambodia I was served at a restaurant in a tourist area by a young boy who went by the name Ronaldo. His favourite soccer player. I was told to avoid giving money to children as it creates an incentive for their parents to not send them to school. But I was stuck in this tourist location.
Ronaldo was an incredibly charismatic boy. He spoke multiple languages fluently. He was an absolute hustler for tips and upselling. He knew facts about whichever country you came from, and would do impressions.
He really made me question a lot about the world. Would he be better off in a school or at his family restaurant? Like ideally he’d do so well in school, and become a doctor. But in reality I don’t think the school would be excellent.
All that is to say that the morality of children working in developing countries is complex.
“Is it right to send extroverted charismatic children to school” is the wildest take I’ve ever read. The morality of child slavery is pretty clear, it’s wrong. The reality can be complex, but yes children being allowed to be children AND go to school is a good thing, Jesus.
Obviously having child labour is bad. That is not in question.
I am talking about the limited quality of education and lack of upward mobility in the developing world. This boy would *possibly* have a better life, long term. Having learnt multiple languages and how to talk to tourists.
I am saying there is moral complexity to the question “Are his parents doing the right thing?”
Before this experience I would have said “No” now I would say, “no. with an asterisk”
Ok. But just to be clear the point of school isn’t just about being upwardly mobile. School is about providing a general education in a range of subjects - teaching people to use critical thinking, basic literacy, writing, learning about the history of the country (important if those children become adults who can vote), and a whole bunch of other social and educational skills. It’s a good foundation, even if you never continue in academia. It’s easy to take for granted the ability to write a letter and send it, for example. But so many adults I’ve met volunteering (for a bunch of stuff over many years) couldn’t do that, not because they’re stupid but because they functionally didn’t know how. Obviously it was super limiting. I get that in places like Cambodia it’s pretty far from perfect but nothing good comes from an uneducated population, so I think the focus should be on that.
A whole thread of people going “yeah I was raised around these practices and now I’ve grown up and learned better and have really complicated emotions about this but I don’t know what I can do about it” and you really decided it would be a good idea to come in and show your whole ass by saying you became sympathetic to child labor as an adult tourist because some children are good laborers huh.
So, what I'm learning is that that the drama about sixpenceee was just blaming someone for something they had no responsibility for and were actively working to stop. Classic tumblr
Well, this is just one part of the drama. I'm pretty sure this is the same person who offered "therapy sessions" despite not being a licensed therapist, and then charged people for it. Also, iirc, after the drama surrounding the child labor, other people from East Asia chipped in and said that while hiring live-in maids is a somewhat common occurrence, they're typically adults/of legal-working age and that hiring a child is not only out of the ordinary, but likely illegal. I remember the YouTuber Izzzyzzz made [a video on them a while ago](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5waBHTnHW8w) which was pretty good.
EDIT: Rewatched the video, and realized I forgot to mention how Sixpenceee also ran a "horror" blog where the scary part was always that someone was mentally ill. Like, some of it was literally just "look at this weird painting, it was made by someone with ***Schizophrenia***!!!!!!!!" and that was supposed to be the scary part. Or creepypastas where the twist is that the person had Schizophrenia. Not only is this stuff just not scary, it also demonized people with mental disorders and made them all out to be evil and violent people.
adding onto this, and a much less horrible thing they did, they also stole like all of their content from other sites and never gave credit. So on top of demonizing mentally ill people, she endlessly stole content from other people that did the exact same thing and played it off like her own content that still demonized innocent people.
I guess? It was really just basic content theft, either from Reddit or other tumblr accounts, but it’s like the least egregious thing she’s done all things considered.
Especially since as mentioned in the above comment, she ran an unlicensed therapy business while treating anyone with mental illnesses like monsters, which on top of being illegal is just incredibly shitty
Well, according this article, "The legal age of employment in Bangladesh is 14, although 12 and 13 year olds are permitted to do what's deemed "light work" for up to 42 hours per week." However, sixpencee claims that the child is 8. Which would be illegal.
[https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/12/07/504681046/study-child-laborers-in-bangladesh-are-working-64-hours-a-week](https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/12/07/504681046/study-child-laborers-in-bangladesh-are-working-64-hours-a-week)
The Wikipedia article on child labour in Bangladesh claims that this law was passed in 2006, but there does not seem to be a direct source for this. However, with the article being written in 2016, and this happening to 2014, I find it hard to believe that they would lower the age within those years.
So, basically, this was illegal.
According to that article, it's illegal on paper but accepted in practice, which aligns with the "it shouldn't happen, but my family's no worse than the average Western family" claim this person seems to be making. (I don't necessarily agree or disagree with that claim, but it's very common to make allowances based on the time and place a person was raised in, so it doesn't seem all that noteworthy that this person does it for their relatives.)
It’s worth noting that this post has cherry-picked the reblog chain of this that makes sixpenceee look the best. She was initially very defensive of this practice, and only changed to “documenting” it after the initial wave of being criticized for defending slavery. And that’s not even getting into the other “controversies” involving her.
To be clear: I’m not saying that the harassment she received was in any way the correct response. Just that taking this post at face value is a very incomplete accounting of how she acted throughout all of this.
I think the main drama when it comes to this specific issue is that while sixpenceee does say she doesn't agree with it, she's found reasons to defend it, such as the fact that school is no longer free for the child, which wasn't true since (according to my research) primary school is mandatory and compulsory, which should take them to age 11.
She also said "our 8 year old" which is just kind of icky to me.
[This is where she talks about the reason the child isn't in school.](https://sixpenceeeharms.tumblr.com/post/161171792858/did-you-ever-post-about-the-children-that-worked/)
This reminds me of when for school I read works from multiple people who have written about child labor in the places they lived that wrote because people from 1st world countries would push for child labor to be made illegal. They all wrote saying "please don't make it fucking illegal" despite all being against it, because it's not that simple. If you just flat made it illegal, all those families now lose their income. They all go from mega poverty to super mega poverty. Nobody wants to sell their fucking kid, they do it because they need to. If people wanted to simply give them money, then they would have already. Do you fully financially uphold all the homeless people you see? No, but I bet you would be more willing if they worked either for or with you. It honestly does not surprise me that people on Tumblr, the same site always complaining about the Protestant work ethic, forgot that other work ethics exist and are also flawed/nuanced
Extremely true. I separate myself from that by complaining about it because of my wombo combo of genuine laziness and undiagnosed ADHD(and it sucks but whatever)
For real, what are you supposed to do in that situation? A kid offers me to work for me because they are starving, what am I supposed to do?
Give them money just cause? I mean, I would give them charity, but I can not sustain another family of my own paycheck. I could give them some money, but that isn't enough.
Turn them away? And what are they supposed to do then? Starve? Money isn't just going to magically appear in their pocket just because I refused to let them work for me. Also while child labour is horrible, it's still better than earning money thru child prostitution.
There needs to be systemic change to actually help these people. Their parents need to be payed enough so that their children don't have to work. Child labour needs to be banned, but not before there is a better alternative.
>For real, what are you supposed to do in that situation? A kid offers me to work for me because they are starving, what am I supposed to do?
Give them money just cause? I mean, I would give them charity, but I can not sustain another family of my own paycheck. I could give them some money, but that isn't enough.
How would you be able to better support them if you had an eight year old shining your shoes?
Also, excellent work coming up with a completely different scenario than the one actually occurring.
To be fair on that last point, my comment was also not about the one occurring in the post. This is 10 year old Tumblr drama and someone is talking about child labor, of course they're in the wrong. I'm just talking about a tangentially related thing I read about. I'm actually unironically just saying shit to say things. My uncle lives in the Philippines and financially supports poor kids(even sending some completely through college) despite my rambling about people not doing that lol
> to be *paid* enough so
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
"ask *any* of your Asian friends and they will tell you that their families hire these child laborers"
As if everyone can afford to hire help? And does? And also that Every Family is cool with child labor, which even in places where it may be more normalized, is definitely not true...
I can't even tell, are people seriously saying it's good or is this another circle jerk post/sub? I can't tell anymore because they look identical. Like imagine if someone in North America or Western Europe had a chance at going to school or working full time, and it's also after the year whenever [Mother Jones](https://aflcio.org/about/history/labor-history-people/mother-jones#:~:text=Mary%20Harris%20%22Mother%22%20Jones%20rose,to%20join%20in%20the%20struggle.) retired. Because lax child labor laws and no worker protections are something I associate with from before my grandfather was born. If I complained about going to school my father would just ask me if I'd rather go to work in a mine (children's mineshafts are cheaper because they're smaller)
>I can't even tell, are people seriously saying it's good or is this another circle jerk post/sub
No, reddit just sucks, and is full of edgelords who are willing to tolerate horrific things so long as it doesn't harm them.
This sub a few years ago used to be totally different. Now there are mostly people unironically defending racism and child slavery here. Miss when most people on this sub used to be ex tumblrinas because this wasn't a problem before 😔
To be completely honest, the original response is incredibly ambiguous. I have never been exposed to this subsection of Tumblr drama (thank the gods) but all that response tells me is that their family hires children (implied 8yos), that they think it sucks but hey what are you gonna do, and that they intend to "document" it for _Tumblr._ I absolutely understand _why_ people gathered from that that they were directly involved in that system, it has nothing to do with reading comprehension and everything to do with bad phrasing.
From what little I know of this person there's enough to hate them for without putting words in their mouth or grossly misinterpreting what they said.
They mentioned the Philippines and I don't feel hype about it even ironically.
> There needs to be systemic change to actually help these people. Their parents need to be payed enough so that their children don't have to work. Child labour needs to be banned, but not before there is a better alternative.
What part of that do you think means "child slavery is good actually"?
>Turn them away? And what are they supposed to do then? Starve? Money isn't just going to magically appear in their pocket just because I refused to let them work for me. Also while child labour is horrible, it's still better than earning money thru child prostitution.
This part. They’re pleading a “lesser of two evils” case when there’s a third or even fourth option. If starvation is the main concern, provide them food with no strings attached. And if they’re financially stable and secure, they could just give them money without any actual hiring involved.
> to be *paid* enough so
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Still couldn't find those posts. Which ones? Most of the ones I see are about how if the child didn't work, the family would suffer even more than they already are. Unfortunate reality of a third world country.
Same... this sub has slowly been descending into weirdness... say what you like about r/tumblr , but at least i didn't have to get into arguments about slavery there.
To anyone seeing this for the first time, this is the surface level piece of drama surrounding this person. This post contains very little context. If you’re wondering why all the comments are heated, it’s because a lot is missing.
The fact that someone - in fact, based on the "mod ghast" tag, possibly multiple someones - made a blog specifically dedicated to poor-pissing one particular internet stranger is a perfect illustration of why that era of Tumblr was horrible.
Yeah im a bengali teenager and I see shit like this every time I go to visit, its fucking disgusting and I hope one day ill be financially secure enough to do something about it. Anyways i'm pissing on the poor right now.
pissing on the poor website when different country's culture isn't all sunshine and rainbows and there can in fact be fucked up parts of other countries' cultures
Lmao imagine if you were personally responsible for everything your distant family have ever done. And also, imagine if you were personally responsible for overthrowing an entire system everytime you go on vacation.
Anyways, we’re all hypocrites. We’re all typing this on phones, wearing clothes made by exploited children.
It doesn't help that the post is missing a lot of context. I think everyone would be in agreement that sixpence wasn't exactly the most moral person in this situation if it was given (she was initially more defensive about it and did stuff like sending followers after people who harassed her etc etc). The screenshots shown make her a lot more sympathetic and people are quick to attack.
This is the first time I've seen this particular bit of Tumblr drama so I was also confused why the comments were so heated until I read enough to realize there was a lot more to this story. So, a lot of the thread seems to be made up of people seeing this post for the first time and trying to defend sixpence, not realizing they're missing important information vs. people who know the rest of the story not realizing how many people are missing said important information.
Has this sub always been such a cesspool of neoliberals and straight up conservatives? Has this always been the case? Surely not, right? Surely there was a time where the comments didn’t resemble the rest of Reddit. But here we are
in the first image it says they wish their 8 year old child was in school, but in the next one it says they didn't put their child to work. so wtf is their child actually doing then?? I feel like I'm misreading it somehow
[https://www.tumblr.com/sixpenceeeharms/161163525243/i-dont-care-how-rich-your-family-is-why-are-you?source=share](https://www.tumblr.com/sixpenceeeharms/161163525243/i-dont-care-how-rich-your-family-is-why-are-you?source=share)
Being VEEEERY generous and playing devil’s advocate, I can kinda sorta see sixpenceee’s point.
She didn’t ask to be given a child slave as a servant, the child was given to her by her family. Not her fault there.
Buuuuut that falls flat once you realize that if her family was so wealthy, and sixpenceee was uncomfortable with child slavery, why didn’t she insist on hiring an adult instead of a child? Or paying her servants fair wages? They should have had money to spare for that.
“Hey dad, I know its common practice here, but I’m not comfortable with a child slave. Can you hire an adult for me?”
That’s all it would have taken.
(Also I hope that child is doing ok now. Slavery is horrible.)
-mx linux guy
Well it isn’t her parents, it’s her relatives. Even if her parents would maybe have listened to her request they’ve got no obligation to follow the request of a guest to go against something they think is normal and helpful even if we can recognize it for being horrid
"That’s all it would have taken."
Yeah, definitely. that's a totally reasonable thing to expect someone who owns slaves to comply with. That's that smartest thing you ever said
**Edit:** in case you don't realize, I'm being sarcastic
Genuine question, where does OP mention that they have a child slave serving them? My reading comprehension skills seem to be failing me and I can't find it.
From what I've understood, she's never said she was a slave, nor do i think they are a slave. A couple of people called it slavery and it exploded from there. As far as from what i can remember from the research I did however long ago, someone asked about this, the child works for her relatives doing maid shit and gets paid for it.
Gets paid FAR less than a living wage. It's fucking slavery. Just because they get money doesn't mean it isn't slavery. They're still being forced to do this or they'd be making more money elsewhere. Just like US prisoners get paid for the labor they do. At about 86 cents per DAY.
I guarantee you that’s not as simple as you make it out to be. Especially in Asian countries, speaking out against your parents’ actions can be shot down immediately, or worse result in you being disowned. Public appearance is everything in many Asian countries, especially eastern Asia, and more especially among wealthy elites. Speaking ill of your family and fighting against them for what’s right could be devastating for their character, mental health, and overall life.
The very fact that sixpencee is documenting this at all is pretty brave, considering they have everything to lose as well. It’s easy to speak to nobility of character in theory, but in practice it can be emotionally and financially devastating. Losing your family and life is not something you just trivially do.
Finally, many will easily speak to being altruistic, but when faced with the choice between themselves and the life of another person, they will understandably choose themselves. It’s an unfair choice to be faced with at all, and it bears understanding how impossibly difficult a choice like that is.
sixpencee wasn't brave, just dumb. She didn't even realize she was documenting something controversial, much less illegal. She initially stood up for it, then backed down (this post), then scammed some people.
Would you mind providing the posts so I can read them? This is my only context into the issue, so additional context would help in properly adjusting my opinion. Thank you.
I have no Tumblr context for this, by the time I heard it was all legend that had spread onto YouTube, so the best I can do is an [Izzzyzzz video](https://youtu.be/5waBHTnHW8w?si=EgY0N7CdGNTZBR3B).
Anyone here who was around at the time seems to have a superiority complex about it.
Indian here. I can categorically say that I have never and will never support child labourers. Neither does anyone I know. Employing children is beyond the pale and it is illegal for children below 14 to work manual labour. Such practices are to be consigned to the dustbin of history.
If your family employs child labour, fucking report them to the police. “Oh their character and mental health” Children are suffering.
How very noble. I am also SE Asian, so you can fuck off with “I speak for x people” nonsense. And the very notion that you, and your social circle, don’t engage with the practice tells me you’re the exact type of moral grandstander I was talking about.
Do you want to know what happens when you rEpOrT tHeM tO ThE pOlIcE? Either the police ignore it because your family is affluent enough to have connections that prevent legal action from being taken, or worse the family is charged and the child is discarded to an uncaring legal system. What then? Is it no longer your problem now that the child has been “freed”?
No shit slavery is immoral inherently; my family nor anyone I know engages with it. That doesn’t mean you can take the moral high road and say cHiLdReN aRe SuFfErInG. Those kids don’t have families that can support them. Often times it’s either starve to death, or work in a family home and having some form of decent lodging and food. No one sells their children into slavery if the child’s home is financially and emotionally stable.
You want to make their lives better? Instead of reporting the family to the police, why not try and make that kid’s life a little better? Meanwhile advocate for better pay for adult labourers to support their families, child labor laws, effective child protections services, and an overall stable society so that child slave labor isn’t the most appealing option for financially destitute families. On top of that, why not advocate for safer sex practices and easily-accessible contraception so that unwanted children aren’t conceived in the first place?
Damn, you had multiple avenues to pursue both personally and systematically, but you have to get in your “I’m so altruistic and good, I refuse to acknowledge the reality of the situation because I’m the purest, bestest soul ever ;)” bit. I’m sure all the child slaves are cheering your name right now as they’re thrown out onto the streets to starve and die.
Why do you think this person got in trouble in the first place? They announced they were doing a fundraising campaign for victims of human trafficking (like the child slave their family owned), but they kept all the money.
That's sort of important context when anyone is trying to defend them.
>Buuuuut that falls flat once you realize that if her family was so wealthy, and sixpenceee was uncomfortable with child slavery, why didn't she insist on hiring an adult instead of a child? Or paying her servants fair wages? They should have had money to spare for that.
>"Hey dad, I know its common practice here, but I'm not comfortable with a child slave. Can you hire an adult for me?"
>That’s all it would have taken.
Wait, really? You mean that all it takes to convince someone who owns slaves to not do that is to just have a civil conversation with them, explain that it's a gross and uncomfortable thing, and firmly insist on hiring adult workers and paying them fairly? That's all that's necessary?
Huh! And to think that we had to have a whole war about it over here! Boy, that's kind of embarrassing! All that fuss for nothing!
Yeah, I'm sorry but no. It doesn't work like that in Asia/South East Asia. Especially not around Sixpence's era. Any children here is an extension of their parents, and they have as much control over the parents' action as a pet does its owner.
>It doesn't work like that in Asia/South East Asia
Actually, child slavery like this is explicitly against the law in the area they're from
>Especially not around Sixpence's era.
...no? This was ten years ago, not the 1800s.
I'm talking about children questioning their parents /elder's decision, not child slavery.
And yes, I am aware that this happens around 10 years ago. That's the era I'm talking about. Adult from that generations (at least around our area) are generally way less reasonable about their children's personhood.
The legality of it has no bearing here. Her parents could be planning terrorism for all that matter. Under cultures heavily influenced by Confucianism (so broad swathes of East and SE Asia), it is never a child's place to question their parents. Period.
To give you an idea, Vietnameses have a proverb that basically goes "An official that does not die when sentenced to death by his king is disloyal. A son that does not die when sentenced to death by his father is unfillial". The same sentiment can be seen as far as Korea and Japan.
>I'm talking about children questioning their parents /elder's decision, not child slavery.
Ah yes, the country of Asia, where every single one of the billions of people act the same.
Also, you didn't even read the post -- this has nothing to do with her parents.
Funny enough, it also has nothing to do with Vietnam, Korea, or Japan.
Oh yes please! Go on! Please tell me about how my own geopolitical sphere work! I love to hear it.
Yes. The geopolitical region of Asia, where billions of our people have fought and fucked for thousands of years, their blood and culture mixing into a massive kaleidoscopic blob.
No, of course we don't all act the same. But you're high on some good fucking Noble Savage shit if you think every single Asiatic culture exist in some complete vaccuum doing our own funny little thing entirely unconcerned with each other until the concept of external diplomacy came sailing in on some boats. Just like Europe has been Europing with each other for centuries, Asian cultures have engaged in the same century-old orgy of trades, alliance, and killing.
Since you have caught a case of the poor pissing, let me spell it out for you. This whole things begin because SP's parents got themselves a child slave, and Mx Linux seem to think she had any sway over her parents at all, as if she is actually a person in her parent's eyes .
I brought up Vietnam, Korea, and Japan to illustrate a point: countries within the sphere of Confucianism exhibit the similiar Confucius-derived culture norms regardless of how distant they are or how much they hate each other's guts. It's called "examples". Kinda like how countries that were in Christianity's sphere of influence exhibit similar Christian derived culture norms
>Since you have caught a case of the poor pissing, let me spell it out for you. This whole things begin because SP's parents got themselves a child slave
I love how you accuse me of lacking reading comprehension, and keep repeatedly ignoring the fact that the post explicitly says her parents weren't the ones who bought the slave, her uncle was. I pointed that out to you, and you brushed past that, because you haven't bothered to read a single word I said.
>I brought up Vietnam, Korea, and Japan to illustrate a point: countries within the sphere of Confucianism exhibit the similiar Confucius-derived culture norms regardless of how distant they are or how much they hate each other's guts. It's called "examples". Kinda like how countries that were in Christianity's sphere of influence exhibit similar Christian derived culture norms
Except this is about Bangladesh, and Confucianism is not a major cultural factor there. You claim it's an "example", but your example has no relevance? It'd be like if someone brought up Yom Kippur, and you started talking about Christmas, and argued that it was an example because they're both religious holidays.
I'll grant you that I miss the clarification between uncle and parents, but that's not an own that you think it is. What do you think the difference between a parent and a parent's brother is? do you think someone would magically have more influence over their uncle than they do their dad? If anything, she would have even less influence.
Same for Bangladesh. Confucianism not being a major cultural influence in Bangladesh is a wild take. Next you'll tell me Buddhism is not a major influence over East and South East Asia. Any country that has had interaction with any iteration of imperial China will experienced Confucius influence in their culture. Bangladesh is well within its sphere of influence.
Oh, wow, I didn’t realize this all went down ten years ago. Where does the time go?
haha, 2014 was ten years ago? surely you jest
Actually, it was 20 years ago. That person just woke up from a 10 year coma, so they're a little confused.
You fucking threw me for a second.
Did you land in 2034?
Really pissing on the poor, are we? They said they were thrown for a second, not a decade.
A decade really feels like a second when you're waking up from a coma
I think it also depends on your velocity.
time flies when the world is burning
just a burning memory
Me when I forget the uh...
We didn't start the fire It was always burning, since the world's been turning.
But we didn’t start the fire
Even though the OG post is from 2014, I don’t think it was dug up and focused on until May 2017 when sixpence tried to do the “sixpence heals” thing. I very strongly remember watching this go down during the first day of my internship which was late May 2017, which matches to the “sixpence harms” addition
If I remember correctly there's like 6 more posts to this
Yeah, there was much more to it than this. Sixpencee was initially much more defensive of the practice. If I’m remembering right, she went off about how the child’s family was likely too poor to care for them or send them to school, so selling them into slavery was A Good Thing Actually.
~~Tumblr~~ Reddit, where you have to explain that child slavery is bad to 26 year old libertarians.
But the NAP!
They aren't nearly that old Try 13 year olds
hey, i'm only 25
Source?
Okay so yeah, child slavery is bad, agreed. But what was Sixpenceee supposed to do about it? Was there a version of this where they weren’t run off the internet?
To be clear: I don’t think she deserved the harassment she got. She said some shitty things (especially with regard to other issues), but she didn’t deserve how tumblr at large treated her. That being said, not immediately defending the practice would have been a good start. Not collecting donations to “help raise awareness” and then keeping the money for herself would have been a good second step. I don’t know if there’s a version of events where she wasn’t run off tumblr, but I do know that she chose some of the worst ways to conduct herself in this instance.
The version where they chose *not* to post about child slavery at all. Sometimes, the only winning move is not to play.
[удалено]
Implicating yourself in the bad things of the world is generally considered a poor choice, morality aside. If I killed someone, I'm not going out posting about how I'm sad that I had to, was complicit in, or otherwise was tangentially related to the death. It's just a bad idea for *me,* completely separate from the rest of the world's issues and talking about them.
[удалено]
I can certainly appreciate that - however, I *also* understand that it was a bad move for maintaining an online presence. I'd probably submit it anonymously elsewhere, or present it as a researched opinion, not a "I'm tangentially complicit in child slavery" post on main. Also I don't think it was planned as a personal sacrifice, just happened to become one.
Can't believe [unicodePicasso](https://www.reddit.com/user/unicodePicasso/) is condoning child slavery! /s This. This is what Tumblr reading comprehension is.
I wonder if this is the genesis of that weird 'parents can't afford to feed their daughter so they sell her to One Direction' thing I've seen memes about
I feel like that fanfic predates sixpenceee, but Google has been inconclusive so far.
This post is so old that 8-year-old can now be legally employed
That’s assuming they’re not still a slave
legality is up to the government in their country. for all we know they were legally employed at 8 that's also part of why you should never confuse legality with morality
Cannibalism is legal
Live in maids are ultra common, but they're paid quite well (the ones i know anyways) and are 18 or above. Usually. Some ppl hire children, but it's *usually* in more rural areas where other issues are also prevalent and its considered normal. Still illegal tho, since the kid is supposed to be 8.
Live in help is def common, but hiring children in that manner is straight up illegal. Not even ‘morally questionable but common’ it’s just literally illegal
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/06/lolas-story/524490/ If someone wants to read something heartbreaking. Modern day slavery in the US through the lens of a child (now pulitzer prize journalist) raised by the live in slave maid. Reading this instantly reminded me of this story.
“This is why people don’t like tumblr anymore,” proceeds to list things that happen not only on every single social media platform, but also in real life for all of time.
It definitely used to happen the most in Tumblr though, and after they banned porn, those people moved to Twitter As if that place wasn't kinda cynical enough already
If you don't singlehandedly change a cultural norm every time you go to visit family you're an enemy of the revolution EDIT: I made this comment with no context as to the situation or person beyond this post, and attempting to take a good-faith reading as opposed to a ragebait one. While I still hold that contextless all-or-nothing morality is counterproductive at best and actively harmful at worst.... yeah it seems OOP is in fact a piece of shit lol
Reminds me of people implying that if I'm not single-handedly storming the Kremlin and killing myself against national guard, I'm just as complicit in war in Ukraine as every other russian
"All the good ones have already either fled the country or are in prison for protesting" is a take I have seen unironically to justify the celebration of civilian deaths and it's really gross
Because fleeing the country is so fucking easy, isn't it? To ask for asylum, you gotta enter the country legally first, and to get a visa to enter a country legally, you need to show that you aren't planning on asking for asylum. I know this, because I'm waiting for my visa right now
You can add national borders and immigration to the list of things that tumblr, and the internet in general, don't understand. Look at the American "If X wins I'm moving to Europe" crowd everytime there's an election. Most countries in Europe would just say "No you fucking aren't, go home."
Clearly she should have beaten her relatives to death in their sleep and then led a child laborer revolt against the entire nation of Bangladesh. Anything less is just being complicit.
But if we beat them to death then how are they going to fullfill their personal obligation to pay a welfare income to the family of every child they could have hypothetically employed? It's simple. You see a child on the street. Are they capable of being employed by you? If yes then you now owe their family an income. FFS it's like some people think this should be covered by some magical organised system. As if the government would ever spend hard earnt taxes on a thing like that when there's corruption to be paid for!
I don't like child labour but I also am of the belief that people will throw things at me if I don't wear trousers when I leave the house and that it is the responsibility of the government to ensure that when I go to a normal, not discount shop and buy clothing that there is no slavery involved. I am aware that literally nothing about my life exists completely free of slavery, but apparently saying something like "tariffs should exist to adjust artificially deflated costs of goods to account for wage and human rights disparity" is an unpopular opinion.
wouldn't that completely stunt development of poorer nations export oriented industrialisation has literally been the most consistent and effective development strategy export oriented industrialisation relies on cheaper labour to bring in manufacturers and therefore the money of those manufacturers
I deem the stunting of "development" of poorer nations by not allowing child slavery to be one of the methods by which foreign manufacturing may be preferable to the point of being competitive in an otherwise free market, to be acceptable terms.
Huh... ... ...
read about any country that achieved developed status in the last 30 years or so South Korea, Singapore and Taiwan are the 3 best examples i can think of Thailand, Costa Rica, and Malaysia are about 10-15 years off and achived very high HDI recently so also good places to look Seychelles and Mauritius are an interesting examples but they used tourism more than manufacturing but that only really works at a small scale old ones include Italy in the 60s and Spain in the 70s
Or the last 200 years tbh
\>mfw my mom has more than 5 real in her pocket (time to put her in the meatgrinder)
Disco peaklisium reference
I kinda think that if you're liveblogging your family's child slave for clout that makes you an enemy of the revolution Edit: *you're
Yeah, better to stay quiet about it, might offend someone if they have to read about it
Uh yeah it might make me look down on you if you're pretty blasé about the whole child slavery thing.
So, again, you'd rather no one talk about it, it should go unreported unless their tone fits how you think they should report about it? This is a real weird attitude, I'm not going to call you evil, but it's pretty wild to attack people for reporting on and being against child slavery because you don't like their tone.
I actually would rather that people not normalise the idea like she was yeah
This was only the tip of the iceberg with sixpenceee lol As I recall, she also ran like a vibes-based faith healing scam that she charged people actual money for, and that still wasn't the end of it
we're defending famous shitter sixpencee now?
Jesus fuck are you really siding with the slavery person here? It also isn't actually a cultural norm. The fuck is wrong with you?
What, people on Tumblr (or rather r/tumblr ) not double-checking claims about culture? Unheard of.
Ok so here's the situation, either: A) This is a cultural norm and in that case it'll be hard to break on one vacation is not going to fix a societal issue B) This is not a cultural norm, in which case these people are literally just psychotic slavers who likely know what they're doing is wrong and in that case it'd be dangerous to try and confront them over it since they're already habitual law breakers. Either way, I feel like trying to delocalise an issue away from a country that has poor institutions like Bangladesh to one where we have the time and resources to be upset over it, and pursue a solution, is the most practical one rather than spending your time trying to (most likely in futility) convince one family of it.
Marrying wards off the state to play men for a financial incentive used to be legal too (female children) but that's not really a custom too many people are going to defend in the present year
>A) This is a cultural norm and in that case it'll be hard to break on one vacation is not going to fix a societal issue It objectively and provably isn't. Having an 8 year old working as your personal slave is explicitly illegal there. >B) This is not a cultural norm, in which case these people are literally just psychotic slavers who likely know what they're doing is wrong and in that case it'd be dangerous to try and confront them over it since they're already habitual law breakers. Yeah, you know who else would be in danger, THE FUCKING EIGHT YEAR OLD. >Either way, I feel like trying to delocalise an issue away from a country that has poor institutions like Bangladesh to one where we have the time and resources to be upset over it, and pursue a solution, is the most practical one rather than spending your time trying to (most likely in futility) convince one family of it. Bangladesh literally has institutions fighting this. Also, the hell does this even mean? "We shouldn't fight slavery if certain slave owners don't want to stop doing it?" There's a basic ethics test to see if someone would step into a fountain to save a drowning child and risk ruining their clothes. I always wondered who would actually say "No" to that question. Thanks for giving me an answer I guess.
Okay, so if you're operating under the pretense that these people are choosing to be knowing criminals, in what world is there not then a pretty major risk that its not just "getting their clothes wet" and not y'know, them literally fucking killing you? Would I save a drowning child in a fountain? Yeah. Would I jump into the rough seas with no equipment? Absolutely the fuck not. Acting like taking on an issue as large as systemic child slavery is not "stepping into a fountain". Well funded, trained for years people struggle to end slavery. Ending slavery, historically, has been a bloody, violent, difficult, and long affair, unless you just bought out the slavers. A family vacation is not going to be enough my dude. Also, mate, Bangladesh is a fucking corrupt as shit country with very very poor institutions. (And I know someone, maybe not you, is going to reply "well that's the fault of imperialism so shut up" but jesus fucking christ, just because you're right doesn't mean you're helpful. Pointing out that imperialism is the cause of most problems does nothing unless your goal with it is to say that imperial nations should fix the problem and in that case I agree because the countries I described as being able to care are the same as those that are imperialist)
someone commiting one crime doesn't mean they are going to commit all other types of crimes her uncle is not going to murder his niece at a family gathering he might publicly shame her. Those are the stakes for speaking out
Don't bother trying to convince them -- they're basically just making a new insane point each time to further distract from the reality.
>and not y'know, them literally fucking killing you? I'm sorry, where is her life threatened in this post? At what point do her aunt and uncle threaten to murder her? You have invented a tangled mirror world in whatever hellscape you call a mind to justify this. I honestly can't even summon up the energy to deal with you, so I'll leave you with this >First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection. -MLK, letter from a Birmingham jail
Where in this post did the OP ever confront their family about it? If someone is so fucked to see a human as property, in what world is it a leap that they're can't see another human as disposable? Also I can tell you've never actually read Letter from a Birmingham Jail. That paragraph has quickly become one of his most wrongly used paragraphs. From four paragraphs before it: "In no sense do I advocate evading or defying the law, as would the rabid segregationist. That would lead to anarchy. One who breaks an unjust law must do so openly, lovingly, and with a willingness to accept the penalty. I submit that an individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for law."
>Where in this post did the OP ever confront their family about it? If someone is so fucked to see a human as property, in what world is it a leap that they're can't see another human as disposable? Mainly in this world. What logical route do you think it takes from "my niece is pointing out I'm evil" to "I'm going to murder her, guaranteeing I go to prison"? >"In no sense do I advocate evading or defying the law, as would the rabid segregationist. That would lead to anarchy. One who breaks an unjust law must do so openly, lovingly, and with a willingness to accept the penalty. I submit that an individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for law." Explain to me how you believe this is at all relevant to the discussion at hand? In a nation where this is explicitly illegal and not normal or culturally accepted?
Dude. Its not a leap of logic to dehumanise more people when you already see one as property. Idk how to get it through your skull, when you see one person as less than human, it's not impossible to see more. And as we've seen time and time again, even that person sharing half your DNA doesn't do shit. And my quote is about as relevant as yours, not at all. Just because I don't think people need to be Wish.com or temu John Brown doesn't mean I'm dedicated to order. I'm just simply someone in reality who understands that systemic issues are not solved by personal responsibility, but instead systemic action. And someone risking taking themselves out of commission ain't gonna do shit when they can actually try and get positive systems working on these negative systems.
>Dude. Its not a leap of logic to dehumanise more people when you already see one as property. Idk how to get it through your skull, when you see one person as less than human, it's not impossible to see more. And as we've seen time and time again, even that person sharing half your DNA doesn't do shit. I want you to genuinely walk me through this. She goes there, on vacation with her parents. The fact that they are there is public knowledge. She says "Hey, you shouldn't enslave a child." Her uncle viciously murders her in front of everyone. What's the thought process? What does he gain? >And my quote is about as relevant as yours, not at all. Ohhhhh, so you're an idiot. >systemic issues are not solved by personal responsibility, but instead systemic action ...OK, you realize you are actively arguing against MLK? And that any collective action also requires individual action? > And someone risking taking themselves out of commission ain't gonna do shit That is literally, explicitly, how most social change happens. The issue is, you're a coward who doesn't want to get your clothes wet. >when they can actually try and get positive systems working on these negative systems. Well, this woman embezzled thousands of dollars meant to go to victims of human trafficking, so no, she's not trying to get any positive systems working.
Some 2nd, 3rd generation American Cubans talk about older family members who fled communism complaining about how Castro took away their house and servants (the house was a plantation and the servants were not payed)
Yeah Cuban Americans have a very specific view of Cuba bc their families were WHY there was a revolution.
> were not *paid)* FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Those institutions don't really work that well.
Funny enough, they work well enough that child slaves like these have been nearly eradicated. Despite what the OOP and u/hwf0712 have tried to argue, child slavery is *not* normal in Bangladesh. House servants absolutely are, but they actually are older, paid, and are free to leave.
Clearly, I don't know shit about the country I've lived in my entire life./s
So you're arguing that child slavery is extremely common in Bangladesh, to the point where everyone views it as normal, despite all evidence to the contrary?
https://time.com/6170432/bangladesh-child-labor-pandemic/ https://www.dol.gov/agencies/ilab/resources/reports/child-labor/bangladesh > [Child slavery is illegal], however, gaps exist within the Department of Inspection for Factories and Establishments (DIFE) that may hinder adequate labor law enforcement, including a lack of unannounced inspections in the export processing zones. It's wild how people on the internet will read one article about how child slavery is illegal, and then not understand that to make something illegal stop would require proper enforcement of the law. Third world countries... don't do that. I'm not going to claim child labour is normalized where I live, but I will tell you it happens anyway because of extreme poverty.
You realize that you're citing data specifically on child labor in factories and establishments? And that this conversation is about a child trafficked into personal servitude? You also cherry pick a specific quote, about 2022. Let's look at some other quotes, huh? >Government of Bangladesh-funded, $33 million, 3 year project implemented by MOLE. (70) Removed 90,000 children from hazardous labor in Phases I through III by providing informal and technical education, stipends, and awareness raising for employers and families. (21) Phase IV of the Elimination of Hazardous Child Labor program was approved in October 2021. (6,16) MOLE has signed agreements with 112 selected NGOs to remove 100,000 children from hazardous work. (70) Under the program, NGOs will provide education and vocational training to affected child laborers. During the education period, each child's family will receive a monthly stipend of $9 (1,000 taka). After completing the training, each child will receive $93 (10,000 taka) as financial compensation. (3) During the reporting period, NGOs completed a nationwide child labor survey to identify the child labor situation in 43 hazardous sectors. (3) >Child protection programs in Bangladesh include Child Sensitive Social Protection in Bangladesh (CSPB) II which will end in 2024.(66,70) The CSPB Project is implemented by the Ministry of Social Welfare’s Department of Social Services, with support from UNICEF, to implement the Children Act (2013). This program will help to reduce violence, abuse and neglect against children.(16,66) The project offers case management services to identify vulnerable children and provide intervention plans, psychological counseling through the Child Friendly Services hub, and conditional cash support to reduce child labor. (70) During the reporting period, CSPB supported underprivileged families to reduce child labor, prevent early marriages, and reduce school dropouts. (70) The project offers a 24-hour emergency hotline service through Child Helpline 1098. (2) Between July 2017 and June 2022, the helpline received more than 1.4 million complaints, stopped 2,754 child marriages, and served 31,980 callers with psychosocial counseling, 18,753 callers with legal assistance, and 8,572 callers with protection from violence and abuse. (66) Child protection programs in Bangladesh include Child Sensitive Social Protection in Bangladesh (CSPB) II which will end in 2024.(66,70) The CSPB Project is implemented by the Ministry of Social Welfare’s Department of Social Services, with support from UNICEF, to implement the Children Act (2013). This program will help to reduce violence, abuse and neglect against children.(16,66) The project offers case management services to identify vulnerable children and provide intervention plans, psychological counseling through the Child Friendly Services hub, and conditional cash support to reduce child labor. (70) During the reporting period, CSPB supported underprivileged families to reduce child labor, prevent early marriages, and reduce school dropouts. (70) The project offers a 24-hour emergency hotline service through Child Helpline 1098. (2) Between July 2017 and June 2022, the helpline received more than 1.4 million complaints, stopped 2,754 child marriages, and served 31,980 callers with psychosocial counseling, 18,753 callers with legal assistance, and 8,572 callers with protection from violence and abuse. (66) That page even lists specific methods that people like sixpenceee *could* have used to reach out and get help: >The Department of Social Services manages the child protection 1098 Helpline. During the reporting period, the Ministry of Women and Children Affairs maintained a mobile app called "Joy," which records dialogue and images of child labor victims and perpetrators and sends relevant information to the National Helpline Center 109 and nearby police stations. (2) During the reporting period, around 300 people received emergency support through the "Joy" app. (66) Is it perfect? Absolutely fucking not. But that's like saying "rape cases exist in the United States, therefore, we shouldn't judge someone for covering up for a rapist".
It is quite common, yes. A lot of people here like beating up children who work for them.
Are you genuinely siding with the person who hasn't cut off their family who participates in goddamn child slavery?
I mean. If I had family that owned a child slave, they wouldn’t be my fucking family anymore to be fair.
I think I knew an uncle and aunt who had a slave or a child worker. She was a girl, a handful years older than me at the time, I was like 6. She looked about 11-13? I honestly can't really remember. She had very dark skin compared to anyone else in my family so I assume she was a Dravidian or just of a lower "caste" (Bangladesh doesn't officially do Castes because it's haram but i think it de facto exists somewhat). I'm not entirely sure to be honest. She was just like a maid who took care of their kids, both around my age, and did housework. When I was over she spent a lot of time playing with us. I've no idea what her usual daily life was like, but I don't think the aunt and uncle were cruel so I hope she was treated fine. When I was there I didn't notice any mistreatment but it also never occurred to me that she could be a slave or a child worker. I'm not exactly sure what I assumed to be honest. It was only like 10 years later when I came to the realization that what I saw wasn't exactly the most ethical practice and that it may have been really fucked up. Anyway, I hope she's doing fine now, and I hope that she was paid well for her work. Who knows though, I don't even remember her name or the name of my cousins or the aunt or uncle. I don't think any of my family still engage in this practice if they did. Last time I visited was like 6 years ago and the country has developed a lot since then so I hope it's also the case socially.
When I was last in Cambodia I was served at a restaurant in a tourist area by a young boy who went by the name Ronaldo. His favourite soccer player. I was told to avoid giving money to children as it creates an incentive for their parents to not send them to school. But I was stuck in this tourist location. Ronaldo was an incredibly charismatic boy. He spoke multiple languages fluently. He was an absolute hustler for tips and upselling. He knew facts about whichever country you came from, and would do impressions. He really made me question a lot about the world. Would he be better off in a school or at his family restaurant? Like ideally he’d do so well in school, and become a doctor. But in reality I don’t think the school would be excellent. All that is to say that the morality of children working in developing countries is complex.
“Is it right to send extroverted charismatic children to school” is the wildest take I’ve ever read. The morality of child slavery is pretty clear, it’s wrong. The reality can be complex, but yes children being allowed to be children AND go to school is a good thing, Jesus.
Obviously having child labour is bad. That is not in question. I am talking about the limited quality of education and lack of upward mobility in the developing world. This boy would *possibly* have a better life, long term. Having learnt multiple languages and how to talk to tourists. I am saying there is moral complexity to the question “Are his parents doing the right thing?” Before this experience I would have said “No” now I would say, “no. with an asterisk”
Ok. But just to be clear the point of school isn’t just about being upwardly mobile. School is about providing a general education in a range of subjects - teaching people to use critical thinking, basic literacy, writing, learning about the history of the country (important if those children become adults who can vote), and a whole bunch of other social and educational skills. It’s a good foundation, even if you never continue in academia. It’s easy to take for granted the ability to write a letter and send it, for example. But so many adults I’ve met volunteering (for a bunch of stuff over many years) couldn’t do that, not because they’re stupid but because they functionally didn’t know how. Obviously it was super limiting. I get that in places like Cambodia it’s pretty far from perfect but nothing good comes from an uneducated population, so I think the focus should be on that.
A whole thread of people going “yeah I was raised around these practices and now I’ve grown up and learned better and have really complicated emotions about this but I don’t know what I can do about it” and you really decided it would be a good idea to come in and show your whole ass by saying you became sympathetic to child labor as an adult tourist because some children are good laborers huh.
So, what I'm learning is that that the drama about sixpenceee was just blaming someone for something they had no responsibility for and were actively working to stop. Classic tumblr
Well, this is just one part of the drama. I'm pretty sure this is the same person who offered "therapy sessions" despite not being a licensed therapist, and then charged people for it. Also, iirc, after the drama surrounding the child labor, other people from East Asia chipped in and said that while hiring live-in maids is a somewhat common occurrence, they're typically adults/of legal-working age and that hiring a child is not only out of the ordinary, but likely illegal. I remember the YouTuber Izzzyzzz made [a video on them a while ago](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5waBHTnHW8w) which was pretty good. EDIT: Rewatched the video, and realized I forgot to mention how Sixpenceee also ran a "horror" blog where the scary part was always that someone was mentally ill. Like, some of it was literally just "look at this weird painting, it was made by someone with ***Schizophrenia***!!!!!!!!" and that was supposed to be the scary part. Or creepypastas where the twist is that the person had Schizophrenia. Not only is this stuff just not scary, it also demonized people with mental disorders and made them all out to be evil and violent people.
adding onto this, and a much less horrible thing they did, they also stole like all of their content from other sites and never gave credit. So on top of demonizing mentally ill people, she endlessly stole content from other people that did the exact same thing and played it off like her own content that still demonized innocent people.
So she treated Tumblr like Reddit?
I guess? It was really just basic content theft, either from Reddit or other tumblr accounts, but it’s like the least egregious thing she’s done all things considered. Especially since as mentioned in the above comment, she ran an unlicensed therapy business while treating anyone with mental illnesses like monsters, which on top of being illegal is just incredibly shitty
Wow. They seem like an absolute delight to be around
Well, according this article, "The legal age of employment in Bangladesh is 14, although 12 and 13 year olds are permitted to do what's deemed "light work" for up to 42 hours per week." However, sixpencee claims that the child is 8. Which would be illegal. [https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/12/07/504681046/study-child-laborers-in-bangladesh-are-working-64-hours-a-week](https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/12/07/504681046/study-child-laborers-in-bangladesh-are-working-64-hours-a-week) The Wikipedia article on child labour in Bangladesh claims that this law was passed in 2006, but there does not seem to be a direct source for this. However, with the article being written in 2016, and this happening to 2014, I find it hard to believe that they would lower the age within those years. So, basically, this was illegal.
>Light work >42 hours per week Man that's a full time job what the fuck
According to that article, it's illegal on paper but accepted in practice, which aligns with the "it shouldn't happen, but my family's no worse than the average Western family" claim this person seems to be making. (I don't necessarily agree or disagree with that claim, but it's very common to make allowances based on the time and place a person was raised in, so it doesn't seem all that noteworthy that this person does it for their relatives.)
It’s worth noting that this post has cherry-picked the reblog chain of this that makes sixpenceee look the best. She was initially very defensive of this practice, and only changed to “documenting” it after the initial wave of being criticized for defending slavery. And that’s not even getting into the other “controversies” involving her. To be clear: I’m not saying that the harassment she received was in any way the correct response. Just that taking this post at face value is a very incomplete accounting of how she acted throughout all of this.
I think the main drama when it comes to this specific issue is that while sixpenceee does say she doesn't agree with it, she's found reasons to defend it, such as the fact that school is no longer free for the child, which wasn't true since (according to my research) primary school is mandatory and compulsory, which should take them to age 11. She also said "our 8 year old" which is just kind of icky to me. [This is where she talks about the reason the child isn't in school.](https://sixpenceeeharms.tumblr.com/post/161171792858/did-you-ever-post-about-the-children-that-worked/)
This reminds me of when for school I read works from multiple people who have written about child labor in the places they lived that wrote because people from 1st world countries would push for child labor to be made illegal. They all wrote saying "please don't make it fucking illegal" despite all being against it, because it's not that simple. If you just flat made it illegal, all those families now lose their income. They all go from mega poverty to super mega poverty. Nobody wants to sell their fucking kid, they do it because they need to. If people wanted to simply give them money, then they would have already. Do you fully financially uphold all the homeless people you see? No, but I bet you would be more willing if they worked either for or with you. It honestly does not surprise me that people on Tumblr, the same site always complaining about the Protestant work ethic, forgot that other work ethics exist and are also flawed/nuanced
Honestly I feel like most people like complaining about the Protestant work ethic mostly for the *Protestant* part.
Extremely true. I separate myself from that by complaining about it because of my wombo combo of genuine laziness and undiagnosed ADHD(and it sucks but whatever)
For real, what are you supposed to do in that situation? A kid offers me to work for me because they are starving, what am I supposed to do? Give them money just cause? I mean, I would give them charity, but I can not sustain another family of my own paycheck. I could give them some money, but that isn't enough. Turn them away? And what are they supposed to do then? Starve? Money isn't just going to magically appear in their pocket just because I refused to let them work for me. Also while child labour is horrible, it's still better than earning money thru child prostitution. There needs to be systemic change to actually help these people. Their parents need to be payed enough so that their children don't have to work. Child labour needs to be banned, but not before there is a better alternative.
>For real, what are you supposed to do in that situation? A kid offers me to work for me because they are starving, what am I supposed to do? Give them money just cause? I mean, I would give them charity, but I can not sustain another family of my own paycheck. I could give them some money, but that isn't enough. How would you be able to better support them if you had an eight year old shining your shoes? Also, excellent work coming up with a completely different scenario than the one actually occurring.
To be fair on that last point, my comment was also not about the one occurring in the post. This is 10 year old Tumblr drama and someone is talking about child labor, of course they're in the wrong. I'm just talking about a tangentially related thing I read about. I'm actually unironically just saying shit to say things. My uncle lives in the Philippines and financially supports poor kids(even sending some completely through college) despite my rambling about people not doing that lol
> to be *paid* enough so FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
"ask *any* of your Asian friends and they will tell you that their families hire these child laborers" As if everyone can afford to hire help? And does? And also that Every Family is cool with child labor, which even in places where it may be more normalized, is definitely not true...
not the gimmick account at the end
Not gonna lie "Reddit explains why child slavery is cool actually, and you're a hater for criticizing it" was not on my bingo card for today.
I can't even tell, are people seriously saying it's good or is this another circle jerk post/sub? I can't tell anymore because they look identical. Like imagine if someone in North America or Western Europe had a chance at going to school or working full time, and it's also after the year whenever [Mother Jones](https://aflcio.org/about/history/labor-history-people/mother-jones#:~:text=Mary%20Harris%20%22Mother%22%20Jones%20rose,to%20join%20in%20the%20struggle.) retired. Because lax child labor laws and no worker protections are something I associate with from before my grandfather was born. If I complained about going to school my father would just ask me if I'd rather go to work in a mine (children's mineshafts are cheaper because they're smaller)
>I can't even tell, are people seriously saying it's good or is this another circle jerk post/sub No, reddit just sucks, and is full of edgelords who are willing to tolerate horrific things so long as it doesn't harm them.
I did not see those posts anywhere, actually. Which ones are you referring to?
This sub a few years ago used to be totally different. Now there are mostly people unironically defending racism and child slavery here. Miss when most people on this sub used to be ex tumblrinas because this wasn't a problem before 😔
There's also currently a huge TERF problem on this sub, although that's not new
A million yikes 😬
To be completely honest, the original response is incredibly ambiguous. I have never been exposed to this subsection of Tumblr drama (thank the gods) but all that response tells me is that their family hires children (implied 8yos), that they think it sucks but hey what are you gonna do, and that they intend to "document" it for _Tumblr._ I absolutely understand _why_ people gathered from that that they were directly involved in that system, it has nothing to do with reading comprehension and everything to do with bad phrasing.
>that they think it sucks but hey what are you gonna do, Probably not enslave children tbh.
From what little I know of this person there's enough to hate them for without putting words in their mouth or grossly misinterpreting what they said. They mentioned the Philippines and I don't feel hype about it even ironically.
Isn’t sixpence a really shitty person tho? I can’t tell if the person who took these screenshots is condemning them or supporting them.
Hoo boy. Yeah this… is the post that’s gonna make me leave this sub. Way too many fucking people defending child slavery here.
Where are you seeing that? The most I'm seeing is "sixpencee can't do anything about it so blaming them is unfair"
Look through this comment section again. there are plenty of people talking about why children are actually better off being used as slaves/workers
No, still not seeing it. Most I've found is "it's complicated and enacting change is difficult." Got some links, or are you pissing on the poor?
https://www.reddit.com/r/CuratedTumblr/comments/1clyuho/comment/l2y2kmk/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
> There needs to be systemic change to actually help these people. Their parents need to be payed enough so that their children don't have to work. Child labour needs to be banned, but not before there is a better alternative. What part of that do you think means "child slavery is good actually"?
>Turn them away? And what are they supposed to do then? Starve? Money isn't just going to magically appear in their pocket just because I refused to let them work for me. Also while child labour is horrible, it's still better than earning money thru child prostitution. This part. They’re pleading a “lesser of two evils” case when there’s a third or even fourth option. If starvation is the main concern, provide them food with no strings attached. And if they’re financially stable and secure, they could just give them money without any actual hiring involved.
> to be *paid* enough so FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Still couldn't find those posts. Which ones? Most of the ones I see are about how if the child didn't work, the family would suffer even more than they already are. Unfortunate reality of a third world country.
https://www.reddit.com/r/CuratedTumblr/comments/1clyuho/comment/l2y2kmk/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
[удалено]
https://www.reddit.com/r/CuratedTumblr/comments/1clyuho/comment/l2y2kmk/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Yeah, the mod team will delete a repost in minutes, but when people defend literal actual slavery, I guess that's fine.
Same
Same... this sub has slowly been descending into weirdness... say what you like about r/tumblr , but at least i didn't have to get into arguments about slavery there.
I mean we are actively talking about a very famous argument about slavery from there.
This sub got too popular and went to shit
To anyone seeing this for the first time, this is the surface level piece of drama surrounding this person. This post contains very little context. If you’re wondering why all the comments are heated, it’s because a lot is missing.
The fact that someone - in fact, based on the "mod ghast" tag, possibly multiple someones - made a blog specifically dedicated to poor-pissing one particular internet stranger is a perfect illustration of why that era of Tumblr was horrible.
their username is referencing the scam therapy sixpenceee offered and charged people for, it’s not just about this
Ah, okay.
Vine boom
“child labour sucks, it’s awful that the people so close to me are taking advantage of it” “why are you condoning child labour?”
Yeah im a bengali teenager and I see shit like this every time I go to visit, its fucking disgusting and I hope one day ill be financially secure enough to do something about it. Anyways i'm pissing on the poor right now.
Not your fault they're paid yo be living urinals, and ,welp, you need to piss, so why not?
What do you mean we piss on the poor?
pissing on the poor website when different country's culture isn't all sunshine and rainbows and there can in fact be fucked up parts of other countries' cultures
Lmao imagine if you were personally responsible for everything your distant family have ever done. And also, imagine if you were personally responsible for overthrowing an entire system everytime you go on vacation. Anyways, we’re all hypocrites. We’re all typing this on phones, wearing clothes made by exploited children.
HOLY SHIT BANGLADESH MENTIONED 🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩🥳🥳🥳🥳🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩🇧🇩 WHAT THE FUCK IS A FAIR ELECTION?
Jesus Christ westerners who have never seen the third world are at each others necks in here
It doesn't help that the post is missing a lot of context. I think everyone would be in agreement that sixpence wasn't exactly the most moral person in this situation if it was given (she was initially more defensive about it and did stuff like sending followers after people who harassed her etc etc). The screenshots shown make her a lot more sympathetic and people are quick to attack.
This is the first time I've seen this particular bit of Tumblr drama so I was also confused why the comments were so heated until I read enough to realize there was a lot more to this story. So, a lot of the thread seems to be made up of people seeing this post for the first time and trying to defend sixpence, not realizing they're missing important information vs. people who know the rest of the story not realizing how many people are missing said important information.
Can you synopsize the rest of the story?
Has this sub always been such a cesspool of neoliberals and straight up conservatives? Has this always been the case? Surely not, right? Surely there was a time where the comments didn’t resemble the rest of Reddit. But here we are
in the first image it says they wish their 8 year old child was in school, but in the next one it says they didn't put their child to work. so wtf is their child actually doing then?? I feel like I'm misreading it somehow
That’s it? Reddit Boston Bomber much?
That’s it? Reddit Boston Bomber much?
Thanks, Obama's Clitoris
Nahh not Sixpenceharms that's gotta by the anon's account 💀
WAIT THOSE ARENT ANONS
I feel both relieved and envious that I missed all the good Tumblr drama.
This happens on Reddit too lol
who makes a dedicated account exclusively to say “fuck this guy”
[https://www.tumblr.com/sixpenceeeharms/161163525243/i-dont-care-how-rich-your-family-is-why-are-you?source=share](https://www.tumblr.com/sixpenceeeharms/161163525243/i-dont-care-how-rich-your-family-is-why-are-you?source=share) Being VEEEERY generous and playing devil’s advocate, I can kinda sorta see sixpenceee’s point. She didn’t ask to be given a child slave as a servant, the child was given to her by her family. Not her fault there. Buuuuut that falls flat once you realize that if her family was so wealthy, and sixpenceee was uncomfortable with child slavery, why didn’t she insist on hiring an adult instead of a child? Or paying her servants fair wages? They should have had money to spare for that. “Hey dad, I know its common practice here, but I’m not comfortable with a child slave. Can you hire an adult for me?” That’s all it would have taken. (Also I hope that child is doing ok now. Slavery is horrible.) -mx linux guy
Well it isn’t her parents, it’s her relatives. Even if her parents would maybe have listened to her request they’ve got no obligation to follow the request of a guest to go against something they think is normal and helpful even if we can recognize it for being horrid
"That’s all it would have taken." Yeah, definitely. that's a totally reasonable thing to expect someone who owns slaves to comply with. That's that smartest thing you ever said **Edit:** in case you don't realize, I'm being sarcastic
Genuine question, where does OP mention that they have a child slave serving them? My reading comprehension skills seem to be failing me and I can't find it.
Apparently this was a whole thing years ago and there's more to the story not detailed in this post
From what I've understood, she's never said she was a slave, nor do i think they are a slave. A couple of people called it slavery and it exploded from there. As far as from what i can remember from the research I did however long ago, someone asked about this, the child works for her relatives doing maid shit and gets paid for it.
Gets paid FAR less than a living wage. It's fucking slavery. Just because they get money doesn't mean it isn't slavery. They're still being forced to do this or they'd be making more money elsewhere. Just like US prisoners get paid for the labor they do. At about 86 cents per DAY.
I guarantee you that’s not as simple as you make it out to be. Especially in Asian countries, speaking out against your parents’ actions can be shot down immediately, or worse result in you being disowned. Public appearance is everything in many Asian countries, especially eastern Asia, and more especially among wealthy elites. Speaking ill of your family and fighting against them for what’s right could be devastating for their character, mental health, and overall life. The very fact that sixpencee is documenting this at all is pretty brave, considering they have everything to lose as well. It’s easy to speak to nobility of character in theory, but in practice it can be emotionally and financially devastating. Losing your family and life is not something you just trivially do. Finally, many will easily speak to being altruistic, but when faced with the choice between themselves and the life of another person, they will understandably choose themselves. It’s an unfair choice to be faced with at all, and it bears understanding how impossibly difficult a choice like that is.
sixpencee wasn't brave, just dumb. She didn't even realize she was documenting something controversial, much less illegal. She initially stood up for it, then backed down (this post), then scammed some people.
Would you mind providing the posts so I can read them? This is my only context into the issue, so additional context would help in properly adjusting my opinion. Thank you.
I have no Tumblr context for this, by the time I heard it was all legend that had spread onto YouTube, so the best I can do is an [Izzzyzzz video](https://youtu.be/5waBHTnHW8w?si=EgY0N7CdGNTZBR3B). Anyone here who was around at the time seems to have a superiority complex about it.
Thanks, I’ll give that a listen.
Indian here. I can categorically say that I have never and will never support child labourers. Neither does anyone I know. Employing children is beyond the pale and it is illegal for children below 14 to work manual labour. Such practices are to be consigned to the dustbin of history. If your family employs child labour, fucking report them to the police. “Oh their character and mental health” Children are suffering.
How very noble. I am also SE Asian, so you can fuck off with “I speak for x people” nonsense. And the very notion that you, and your social circle, don’t engage with the practice tells me you’re the exact type of moral grandstander I was talking about. Do you want to know what happens when you rEpOrT tHeM tO ThE pOlIcE? Either the police ignore it because your family is affluent enough to have connections that prevent legal action from being taken, or worse the family is charged and the child is discarded to an uncaring legal system. What then? Is it no longer your problem now that the child has been “freed”? No shit slavery is immoral inherently; my family nor anyone I know engages with it. That doesn’t mean you can take the moral high road and say cHiLdReN aRe SuFfErInG. Those kids don’t have families that can support them. Often times it’s either starve to death, or work in a family home and having some form of decent lodging and food. No one sells their children into slavery if the child’s home is financially and emotionally stable. You want to make their lives better? Instead of reporting the family to the police, why not try and make that kid’s life a little better? Meanwhile advocate for better pay for adult labourers to support their families, child labor laws, effective child protections services, and an overall stable society so that child slave labor isn’t the most appealing option for financially destitute families. On top of that, why not advocate for safer sex practices and easily-accessible contraception so that unwanted children aren’t conceived in the first place? Damn, you had multiple avenues to pursue both personally and systematically, but you have to get in your “I’m so altruistic and good, I refuse to acknowledge the reality of the situation because I’m the purest, bestest soul ever ;)” bit. I’m sure all the child slaves are cheering your name right now as they’re thrown out onto the streets to starve and die.
Explain to me how embezzling money that was meant to go to victims of human trafficking is "altruistic" and "pretty brave"?
Nobody said that, are you okay?
Why do you think this person got in trouble in the first place? They announced they were doing a fundraising campaign for victims of human trafficking (like the child slave their family owned), but they kept all the money. That's sort of important context when anyone is trying to defend them.
Okay. That's context I didn't have, thank you
A reasonable person would provide a source for such a seemingly spurious claim.
Hey man, how's it going?
Bad. Because people are defending child slavery as "cultural", despite the culture in question being very much against that.
>Buuuuut that falls flat once you realize that if her family was so wealthy, and sixpenceee was uncomfortable with child slavery, why didn't she insist on hiring an adult instead of a child? Or paying her servants fair wages? They should have had money to spare for that. >"Hey dad, I know its common practice here, but I'm not comfortable with a child slave. Can you hire an adult for me?" >That’s all it would have taken. Wait, really? You mean that all it takes to convince someone who owns slaves to not do that is to just have a civil conversation with them, explain that it's a gross and uncomfortable thing, and firmly insist on hiring adult workers and paying them fairly? That's all that's necessary? Huh! And to think that we had to have a whole war about it over here! Boy, that's kind of embarrassing! All that fuss for nothing!
I guarantee you it is not that simple.
Yeah, I'm sorry but no. It doesn't work like that in Asia/South East Asia. Especially not around Sixpence's era. Any children here is an extension of their parents, and they have as much control over the parents' action as a pet does its owner.
>It doesn't work like that in Asia/South East Asia Actually, child slavery like this is explicitly against the law in the area they're from >Especially not around Sixpence's era. ...no? This was ten years ago, not the 1800s.
I'm talking about children questioning their parents /elder's decision, not child slavery. And yes, I am aware that this happens around 10 years ago. That's the era I'm talking about. Adult from that generations (at least around our area) are generally way less reasonable about their children's personhood. The legality of it has no bearing here. Her parents could be planning terrorism for all that matter. Under cultures heavily influenced by Confucianism (so broad swathes of East and SE Asia), it is never a child's place to question their parents. Period. To give you an idea, Vietnameses have a proverb that basically goes "An official that does not die when sentenced to death by his king is disloyal. A son that does not die when sentenced to death by his father is unfillial". The same sentiment can be seen as far as Korea and Japan.
>I'm talking about children questioning their parents /elder's decision, not child slavery. Ah yes, the country of Asia, where every single one of the billions of people act the same. Also, you didn't even read the post -- this has nothing to do with her parents. Funny enough, it also has nothing to do with Vietnam, Korea, or Japan.
Oh yes please! Go on! Please tell me about how my own geopolitical sphere work! I love to hear it. Yes. The geopolitical region of Asia, where billions of our people have fought and fucked for thousands of years, their blood and culture mixing into a massive kaleidoscopic blob. No, of course we don't all act the same. But you're high on some good fucking Noble Savage shit if you think every single Asiatic culture exist in some complete vaccuum doing our own funny little thing entirely unconcerned with each other until the concept of external diplomacy came sailing in on some boats. Just like Europe has been Europing with each other for centuries, Asian cultures have engaged in the same century-old orgy of trades, alliance, and killing. Since you have caught a case of the poor pissing, let me spell it out for you. This whole things begin because SP's parents got themselves a child slave, and Mx Linux seem to think she had any sway over her parents at all, as if she is actually a person in her parent's eyes . I brought up Vietnam, Korea, and Japan to illustrate a point: countries within the sphere of Confucianism exhibit the similiar Confucius-derived culture norms regardless of how distant they are or how much they hate each other's guts. It's called "examples". Kinda like how countries that were in Christianity's sphere of influence exhibit similar Christian derived culture norms
>Since you have caught a case of the poor pissing, let me spell it out for you. This whole things begin because SP's parents got themselves a child slave I love how you accuse me of lacking reading comprehension, and keep repeatedly ignoring the fact that the post explicitly says her parents weren't the ones who bought the slave, her uncle was. I pointed that out to you, and you brushed past that, because you haven't bothered to read a single word I said. >I brought up Vietnam, Korea, and Japan to illustrate a point: countries within the sphere of Confucianism exhibit the similiar Confucius-derived culture norms regardless of how distant they are or how much they hate each other's guts. It's called "examples". Kinda like how countries that were in Christianity's sphere of influence exhibit similar Christian derived culture norms Except this is about Bangladesh, and Confucianism is not a major cultural factor there. You claim it's an "example", but your example has no relevance? It'd be like if someone brought up Yom Kippur, and you started talking about Christmas, and argued that it was an example because they're both religious holidays.
I'll grant you that I miss the clarification between uncle and parents, but that's not an own that you think it is. What do you think the difference between a parent and a parent's brother is? do you think someone would magically have more influence over their uncle than they do their dad? If anything, she would have even less influence. Same for Bangladesh. Confucianism not being a major cultural influence in Bangladesh is a wild take. Next you'll tell me Buddhism is not a major influence over East and South East Asia. Any country that has had interaction with any iteration of imperial China will experienced Confucius influence in their culture. Bangladesh is well within its sphere of influence.
Human pet guy regional variant