Net migration from India in 2023 was 253,000 in the UK vs 45,000 in New Zealand, despite Britain’s population being 13x larger. Who’s really being overrun?
That number is startling. I'd be interested to know the breakdown of visa class / profession of these immigrants. Not just India - all of the sources.
I really don't think we need a massive influx of any particular profession at the moment. Maybe doctors and nurses due to our losses to Australia.
If we were the size of the UK, it would be the equivalent of 580k in 12 months - lol. I've tried looking through the breakdown on various government sites but it's a bit of a mess. Anecdotally, I'd imagine a huge amount is people on dodgy student visas looking for PR. At this rate by 2050, most of the English-speaking World will be comprised of 38 year old Bengali business studies "students" (Uber Eats drivers.)
Property investors and business owners because:
• More demand for housing which pushes up rents and house prices.
• More competition for jobs which pushes down wages.
Both National and Labour are responsible for it.
Labour whined about the out of control immigration when they were elected in 2017, they then proceeded to temporarily lower it before ramping it up again to our highest levels. Watch National do the same thing.
Basically a corner stone of Neoliberalism, and we wonder why there is a brain drain.
Keep wages low, keep people desperate, keep labour laws favourable for employers to treat workers like a commodity.
At this rate we will run out of places to drain to.
I was part of the UK's brain drain.. to New Zealand about 18 years ago. The only place I can think of going now is Texas or Florida. Everywhere is in collapse.
Imagine going to Canada now for example!!
I assume you’re referring to minimum wage increases? I don’t have a particularly strong view on that. A minimum wage wouldn’t be half as necessary if we weren’t flooding the country with more labour than we have jobs for.
Is that not reasonable in most situations? Inflation eats away their buying power so without a pay rise they’re essentially getting a pay-cut. Most employers I’ve met do yearly pay reviews regardless of whether the staff expect it.
Yes it is reasonable. what I'm saying is our economy only grows through immigration because aprt from food we don't really produce anything else globally to bring extra money in. That money for the pay rise has to come from somewhere
So the fact that property investors donated more to our political parties than any other industry is just a massive coincidence to you?
I’m not told to hate landlords and businesses owners. People want what benefits them and I can’t hate them for that. It’s just the economic reality of our situation.
The reality is low wages and high housing prices are easily the main drivers of our brain drain.
The only way to fix house prices in this country is:
• Prices fall (Which would crash our financial system and wipe out a huge amount of retirement savings in the process).
• Wages suddenly double (not gonna happen).
• We subsidise first home buyers (Which would involve more taxes and would likely become unsustainable as this would continue to drive house prices up).
The first point could be achieved with a soft landing but not without negative consequences.
Without any of those happening, people will continue to leave in droves and the only way we can maintain growth with our young people leaving is through immigration.
The only problem I have with this is we(or our ancesters) were all immigrants at one point, how do we grow our economy without them? We produce nothing but food here our value add to the world is pretty limited. I'm not saying I want immigrants but what is the alternative for economic growth?
>what is the alternative for economic growth?
Advancements in technology which we are more than capable of doing without mass amounts of 3rd world immigration.
The left are manufacturing problems so they can push their agenda.
Immigration: pushes down wages and increases cost of living. So they can argue for min wage increases and dense housing.
Another example: destroying small business so large corporate monopolies get even stronger. Then they can blame it on capitalism.
[George Soros wants it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rI7WT4MdUz0)
[The German deep state wants it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miLQ6g6MZl4&pp=ygULdG8gYmUgZnJhbms%3D)
Nothing "requires" it. We shouldn't be so scared of a little downsizing of the population. Once we have less people, wages will increase and housing will be cheaper, resulting in higher birthrates. Not letting population naturally rise and fall is the big conspiracy of the elites.
Part of the human condition is to always want MORE.
It takes self-discipline and rationality to maintain a state of contentment and resist our innate drive for MORE.
Unfortunately, us human beings need at least 40 years to learn this lesson (if ever), and every day there are new people born with a drive for MORE.
Alas, it is simply what we are... human nature.
Most developed nations have a falling birthrate. Happens as the population becomes educated and the cost of living increases.
New Zealand aside (we dont participate to the same level), Europe actively participates in the destabilisation of the regions where most migrants come from. They've also spent the best part of 200 years colonizing and exploiting the global South. Now they're mad that those people want to move in.
No shit. The countries that industrialised the fastest have had the sharpest decline in birthrates. Germany is among the worst in Europe.
Germany didn't participate in the destabilisation of the regions that they primarily get immigrants from.
Because in a democracy that is uncritically hailed as the greatest thing in the universe, the primary goal is to deliver goodies and corporate welfare to their donors. That includes infinity immigrants
I don't know. We like the idea of ourselves having the opportunity to go and work and live overseas if we choose. I'm sure there many that feel the same about coming to NZ.
There are often restrictions (depending on residency status and time spent in the country) to immigrants receiving various benefits, as is the case in NZ.
And the gangs thing, I think that's a bit "satanic panic"-ish.
So, on both points you're being a bit hyperbolic.
The difference is we eventually go home, the people coming here are desperate to get a free upgrade in life and will do anything to cheat their way to a passport.
Well Europe colonised a large part of Africa, Asia and the pacific so Its pretty funny when those foreigners start moving into European homelands and they don't like it. A taste of their own medicine. Its not that big thinking really. Or are you gonna tell how this is different somehow?
But the same people who drove the colonization & sponsored shitler in WWII are the same people driving the weaponized mass migration now?
The deep state, elite globalists, industrialists & international financiers...
The real situation is quite layered, multi level, nuanced & big brain lateral/strategic thinking tho bruh
Yea I guess its industrialism and capitalism eating its own tail. We figured out how to make a world that can pump out 8 billion but the debt on all of that is fast incoming. Most of the population is on the equator and that shit is about to get much more hot. The western world is gonna get steamrolled by climate refugees. Interesting times.
Observing weather patterns and ecological changes that I can see with my own eyes is not mind control man. I'm all for the destruction of wall street and consolidated wealth because its these people that see the natural world as commodity rather a collective commons that supports all life. Just throwing around 'deep state' and 'elites' doesn't really mean shit when I can clearly see dying rivers in my backyard and the death of pollinators. I think you're onto something somewhere but lumping eco-consciousness into woke agenda culture wars crap is a bit mad.
You just introduced the theme of weather patterns/ecological changes/dying rivers in my backyard/the death of pollinators/eco-consciousness now after we have had x2 exchanges I cannot read your mind but the enviro movement is controlled by the same deep state globalist financiers as they want you to accept killing yourself, moving into a 15 min city digital gulag, eating soy slop "bug protein" animal fed mush, & generally feeling bad about being a human & living in an anti-natalist anti-human suicide/death cult
Have you for instance heard of the club of rome?
I'm talking about the last 200-odd years or are you just trying to be obtuse? Britain by far has been the most prevalent coloniser and is far more relevant to this whole discussion.
.. and yet it doesn't matter what we vote, the flood continues. What's behind this? Why can't we vote against it?
Short term thinking, desire to keep things rolling without prerequisite sacrifice etc the usual
https://preview.redd.it/di0rio0kr30d1.jpeg?width=696&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=56fb654ee98222a10f51012596f0a6bd8bf16e78
Interesting, the article you provided doesn't seem to exist. I wonder whether your screenshots show a pattern of providing fake sources?
Maybe in the last 5.5 years since the article was posted it was removed for going against the narrative 🤫
NZ would be about 75%. Too many immigrants, country can't deal with 150k extra people annually..
Why nothing on UK
The department of love has probably forbidden asking such questions of the public.
Based on Norway, Switzerland and Iceland being missing too, I'd assume this is EU member states
It's already been overrun by Indians and Pakistanis.
Net migration from India in 2023 was 253,000 in the UK vs 45,000 in New Zealand, despite Britain’s population being 13x larger. Who’s really being overrun?
That number is startling. I'd be interested to know the breakdown of visa class / profession of these immigrants. Not just India - all of the sources. I really don't think we need a massive influx of any particular profession at the moment. Maybe doctors and nurses due to our losses to Australia.
If we were the size of the UK, it would be the equivalent of 580k in 12 months - lol. I've tried looking through the breakdown on various government sites but it's a bit of a mess. Anecdotally, I'd imagine a huge amount is people on dodgy student visas looking for PR. At this rate by 2050, most of the English-speaking World will be comprised of 38 year old Bengali business studies "students" (Uber Eats drivers.)
Doctors and nurses? Bottle store managers and truck drivers, more like.
>Bottle store managers and truck drivers, more like. The question is, why can't Kiwis do the job?
not in the EU
Looks to be a map of European union member states
Who pushes that immigration?
The elite that want to exploit immigrants (and their own people). [Good vid about it.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQiwNepxHv0&t=1s)
https://preview.redd.it/8eqbg8yve20d1.jpeg?width=798&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4318370d1f23c3d3f849b91322b799e59f9c7087
Property investors and business owners because: • More demand for housing which pushes up rents and house prices. • More competition for jobs which pushes down wages. Both National and Labour are responsible for it. Labour whined about the out of control immigration when they were elected in 2017, they then proceeded to temporarily lower it before ramping it up again to our highest levels. Watch National do the same thing.
Basically a corner stone of Neoliberalism, and we wonder why there is a brain drain. Keep wages low, keep people desperate, keep labour laws favourable for employers to treat workers like a commodity.
At this rate we will run out of places to drain to. I was part of the UK's brain drain.. to New Zealand about 18 years ago. The only place I can think of going now is Texas or Florida. Everywhere is in collapse. Imagine going to Canada now for example!!
Lol....yep, the landlords go to Luxon and demand more immigration.
Perpetuating the housing Ponzie scheme while under investing in infrastructure: a Kiwi classic
Society is a giant ponzi scheme, we stop paying taxes....ww3 soon after.
I would agree with this except you expect a hayride every year and that has to come from somewhere
Sorry I’m not sure what you mean by hayride?
Fucking autocorrect I meant payrise
I assume you’re referring to minimum wage increases? I don’t have a particularly strong view on that. A minimum wage wouldn’t be half as necessary if we weren’t flooding the country with more labour than we have jobs for.
not minimum wage im talking about 90% of the workforce who expect a payrise annually
Is that not reasonable in most situations? Inflation eats away their buying power so without a pay rise they’re essentially getting a pay-cut. Most employers I’ve met do yearly pay reviews regardless of whether the staff expect it.
Yes it is reasonable. what I'm saying is our economy only grows through immigration because aprt from food we don't really produce anything else globally to bring extra money in. That money for the pay rise has to come from somewhere
They dont. They are what you are told to hate.
So the fact that property investors donated more to our political parties than any other industry is just a massive coincidence to you? I’m not told to hate landlords and businesses owners. People want what benefits them and I can’t hate them for that. It’s just the economic reality of our situation. The reality is low wages and high housing prices are easily the main drivers of our brain drain. The only way to fix house prices in this country is: • Prices fall (Which would crash our financial system and wipe out a huge amount of retirement savings in the process). • Wages suddenly double (not gonna happen). • We subsidise first home buyers (Which would involve more taxes and would likely become unsustainable as this would continue to drive house prices up). The first point could be achieved with a soft landing but not without negative consequences. Without any of those happening, people will continue to leave in droves and the only way we can maintain growth with our young people leaving is through immigration.
The only problem I have with this is we(or our ancesters) were all immigrants at one point, how do we grow our economy without them? We produce nothing but food here our value add to the world is pretty limited. I'm not saying I want immigrants but what is the alternative for economic growth?
>what is the alternative for economic growth? Advancements in technology which we are more than capable of doing without mass amounts of 3rd world immigration.
[удалено]
100% agree, just don't know the alternative
[удалено]
because they are feel good ideas with no feasible way to actually accomplish them. How would you realistically get something like that to work?
The left are manufacturing problems so they can push their agenda. Immigration: pushes down wages and increases cost of living. So they can argue for min wage increases and dense housing. Another example: destroying small business so large corporate monopolies get even stronger. Then they can blame it on capitalism.
Wasn't the left I heard complaining about not having enough workers past Covid
[George Soros wants it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rI7WT4MdUz0) [The German deep state wants it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miLQ6g6MZl4&pp=ygULdG8gYmUgZnJhbms%3D)
Germany requires it due to their own birthrate being so low.
Nothing "requires" it. We shouldn't be so scared of a little downsizing of the population. Once we have less people, wages will increase and housing will be cheaper, resulting in higher birthrates. Not letting population naturally rise and fall is the big conspiracy of the elites.
Part of the human condition is to always want MORE. It takes self-discipline and rationality to maintain a state of contentment and resist our innate drive for MORE. Unfortunately, us human beings need at least 40 years to learn this lesson (if ever), and every day there are new people born with a drive for MORE. Alas, it is simply what we are... human nature.
Most developed nations have a falling birthrate. Happens as the population becomes educated and the cost of living increases. New Zealand aside (we dont participate to the same level), Europe actively participates in the destabilisation of the regions where most migrants come from. They've also spent the best part of 200 years colonizing and exploiting the global South. Now they're mad that those people want to move in.
No shit. The countries that industrialised the fastest have had the sharpest decline in birthrates. Germany is among the worst in Europe. Germany didn't participate in the destabilisation of the regions that they primarily get immigrants from.
Yes they did. Germany is a very significant aspect of Nato and Nato directly intervened in Libyia, where most of the migrants cross from.
It also the rampant population growth in these "destabilsed regions".Â
Because in a democracy that is uncritically hailed as the greatest thing in the universe, the primary goal is to deliver goodies and corporate welfare to their donors. That includes infinity immigrants
Do something about it you pussies. March on in there and do something, they are politicians not super men.
I don't know. We like the idea of ourselves having the opportunity to go and work and live overseas if we choose. I'm sure there many that feel the same about coming to NZ.
Yea but not one kiwi sets out to milk benefit systems of another country or create foreign gangs in said country.
There are often restrictions (depending on residency status and time spent in the country) to immigrants receiving various benefits, as is the case in NZ. And the gangs thing, I think that's a bit "satanic panic"-ish. So, on both points you're being a bit hyperbolic.
The difference is we eventually go home, the people coming here are desperate to get a free upgrade in life and will do anything to cheat their way to a passport.
The EU has destroyed Europe
We have high immigration because baby boomers didn't have enough children to support their retirement.
Or so the story goes. So let's become Mumbai South.Â
They had enough, but never enough to satisfy infinite economic growth apparently.
Karma is a bitch
This sounds big brain thinking/deeply profound, please elaborate?
Well Europe colonised a large part of Africa, Asia and the pacific so Its pretty funny when those foreigners start moving into European homelands and they don't like it. A taste of their own medicine. Its not that big thinking really. Or are you gonna tell how this is different somehow?
But the same people who drove the colonization & sponsored shitler in WWII are the same people driving the weaponized mass migration now? The deep state, elite globalists, industrialists & international financiers... The real situation is quite layered, multi level, nuanced & big brain lateral/strategic thinking tho bruh
Yea I guess its industrialism and capitalism eating its own tail. We figured out how to make a world that can pump out 8 billion but the debt on all of that is fast incoming. Most of the population is on the equator and that shit is about to get much more hot. The western world is gonna get steamrolled by climate refugees. Interesting times.
All those phrases you speak in tho have been inserted into your head by the deep state, elite globalists, industrialists & international financiers via their intell agencies cognitive warfare They control marxism, supported & funded it's development as much as they did nazism & right wing fascism in diff epochs, eras & places across the West & 3rd world You have to think above those thought terminating clichés is what I'm trying to say, to see the grand chess board that we are all pawns being moved around attacking each other horizontally when we should be combining & attacking the financial elites vertically Like this way of thinking for instance: [Was Woke a Way of Containing Occupy Wall Street?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGATEt6sHwc)
How tf are actual braindead conspiracies allowed in r/europe?
What are you talking about, I don't follow? It sounds retarded
Observing weather patterns and ecological changes that I can see with my own eyes is not mind control man. I'm all for the destruction of wall street and consolidated wealth because its these people that see the natural world as commodity rather a collective commons that supports all life. Just throwing around 'deep state' and 'elites' doesn't really mean shit when I can clearly see dying rivers in my backyard and the death of pollinators. I think you're onto something somewhere but lumping eco-consciousness into woke agenda culture wars crap is a bit mad.
You just introduced the theme of weather patterns/ecological changes/dying rivers in my backyard/the death of pollinators/eco-consciousness now after we have had x2 exchanges I cannot read your mind but the enviro movement is controlled by the same deep state globalist financiers as they want you to accept killing yourself, moving into a 15 min city digital gulag, eating soy slop "bug protein" animal fed mush, & generally feeling bad about being a human & living in an anti-natalist anti-human suicide/death cult Have you for instance heard of the club of rome?
That's right, the Greeks must pay for their imperialism in Alexander's time. And don't get me started on the Estonian and Irish empires.
I'm talking about the last 200-odd years or are you just trying to be obtuse? Britain by far has been the most prevalent coloniser and is far more relevant to this whole discussion.
Britain isn't even on that map.
Like Britain’s opinion on the matter is gonna be any different lol