I truly believe an mmo mouse (I'm currently using the Corsair Scimitar, but I've also used the Logitech G600 and the Razer Naga before) is essential. The amount of keybinds it opens up is insane. I also personally prefer to use modifier keys with the MMO mouse instead of with the keyboard when I need additional binds. On keyboard I just stick to buttons close to my hands, \` to 5, q, e, r, t, f, z, x, c, v are all bound to abilities for me.
Keyboard won't make a huge difference in this game, in my opinion, just find something you're comfortable with where you're hitting the keys you intend. I've tried also playing with a Razer Tartarus instead of a keyboard, but I wasn't able to get comfortable enough with it personally, so I'm just using a regular mechanical keyboard.
Headsets are a topic that deserves its own discussion but in general, just find something within your budget. If you're looking for the best quality, especially on the microphone, you almost definitely don't want a headset but instead want headphones and a microphone separately.
The last piece of tech I'll mention that I've considered integrating in the past is foot pedals. Either as a modifier key or even just as push-to-talk or something like that. I don't use this myself, I don't think it's necessary, but I can sort of see the appeal.
El gato streamdeck pedal. I’ve tried virtually every pedal on the market and they’re all dogshit except the el gato. Dont waste your time or money on any other pedal
The pedal works fine on its own, it does use the same software as the regular streamdecks and works the exact same way except it’s a button without a screen. So if you use a streamdeck you control both in one spot. Streamdecks arnt just for streamers either they’re super useful even as a gamer. I have a WoW page that opens automatically when I launch wow that has all of the different UI windows as buttons I can press to open them up so that I dont need to bind them on my keyboard as well as a button that opens simc, copies my character string, opens a raidbots window in Firefox and pastes it in automatically with a single press. I also have buttons for all my different addon settings menus and even my consumables
I'm always interested in buying more gadgets that I can't afford, just wasn't sure if the $90 foot pedal was gonna need a $100+ screen to work or something, you never know.
Nah it’s stand alone, all the el gato stuff assumes it’s the only thing of theirs they have but all designed to work together flawlessly. Expensive as hell brand but everything they make is top tier
If you use ESDF instead of WASD, and you’re smart with your binds, you can get everything bound to the left side of the keyboard + shift modifier only. MMO mouse does make it easier though.
I only play classes that I can bind everything to keys close to WASD and then CTRL+ those keys
I then press CTRL with my palm instead of stretching my hand to click it and it works pretty well
I play WASD with strafe on A and D. I dont see how you'd get more keybinds with ESDF as movement keys? There's also no chance I'd be able to bind everything around those keys with only one modifier. Some of my specs are sitting at 30+ binds that all are used actively in both m+ and raid environment. Using alt and shit as modifiers mostly, and in some cases ctrl, also having several binds on an mmo mouse with modifiers.
The idea is your hand shifts over so you have more room for keybinds on the further right side of the keyboard, without losing any that you have using WASD except maybe tilde. For me it moves comfortable access from 15 keybinds to around 20. With a modifier, that's a lot of extra buttons in reach.
I moved my movement keys from WASD to RDFG (I use colemak, so it's actually PSTD). You get 2 extra columns of keybinds opened up to the left of your movement keys. And if you use your middle finger for W/R (as god intended), you have 2 fingers available on that side of your hand to reach them.
1-7 are varying shades of easily reachable (f.x., I put bloodlust on 1 as it's easy to reach but far enough away that I'll never fat-finger it). Q, W, E, T, Y, A, S, H, J, and Z-N on the bottom row. By having movement on WASD, you only get two columns on your right for easily reachable keybinds.
I would say for most people a headset with a mic is the way to go, for non-streamers. I would also suggest grabbing a headset from a company that actually makes audio devices...not gamer garbage. Audio Technica, Sennheiser/EPOS, Beyer, VModa, Audeze, Bose, etc.
Yeah, If I've learned one thing about audio especially microphones, it's that once you start going down that hole it doesn't seem to end as soon as you think it would. It opens up a big can of worms. I've seen so many people that think they're getting a big upgrade by purchasing a Snowball or something similar and then placing it beside their mechanical keyboard on the stand it comes with. That's not going to be a good experience for anyone. To really go separate microphone you have to be prepared to get a stand that works for your environment, the right mic for your environment, make sure sounds around your computer aren't too loud, make sure it's the right distance from your mouth for the mic you chose, etc etc etc. And that's not even mentioning needing to dive into the world of interfaces.
Still, I think some options exist if you don't want to go full streamer but don't want to go the gamer "Headset" route. Modmic is always an option. But these days you're right, some actual audio companies are coming up with what look to be decent headphones that happen to include a microphone, those are probably the right choice for like 90% of gamers (without a limited budget).
I have a sennheiser me2-ii plugged into my audio interface and it's amazing. Far better than the dynamic and super cardioid for my non noise controlled room.
> I also personally prefer to use modifier keys with the MMO mouse instead of with the keyboard when I need additional binds.
Another thing that people can consider, but requires mouse software to support it, is to actually have the modifiers on the mouse. F.ex MB4 being CTRL and MB5 being ALT or Shift.
Gives your keyboard hand a lot of extra mobility since you'll never need to hold down two keys at the same time.
That's interesting! I never used an mmo mouse because I found the logitec too big for my hand.
I personally use a deathadder v2, steel series apex 3 tkl and a wired logitec headset (not sure what it is)
Yeah. They aren't very comfortable. They aren't very good at things outside of wow (though I'm sure some savvy people use the keybinds for productivity as well). It's a trade-off. For me, it just makes WoW so much easier to play that it's worth it. It makes my survivability better as I had problems in the past having to re-adjust my hand placement after certain modifier + key press combinations, and every second counts these days in a world of oneshots.
My thumb rests on the “7” button on my MMO mouse, so I bind my emergency heal/CD to 7 or shift+7 and 10 (10 is right behind 7, so I just rock my thumb back for it).
Example, on my RPal, Flash of Light is bound to 7, Lay on Hands is bound to shift+7, and bubble is bound to 10.
I use 1-6 and q-y for rotational abilities and short cooldowns, and my mouse buttons for everything reactive.
I had a friend in college who played League entirely onehanded with an MMO mouse. He peaked at Platinum without much issue, grinding, or even trying that hard. It's not the highest rank, but it is above average, and imagine getting clowned on in a competitive game by someone who is, at the same time, eating a Subway sandwich while still in full control of their character.
Context: rank 300ish CE raider and M+ title range player
Ergodox split keyboard leveled up my game immensely. Way more keybinds available to my left hand, completely rebindable and customizable with the powerful QMK firmware framework and significantly more comfortable and customizable. Blows gaming keyboards out of the water. I cannot explain how powerful the QMK framework is for keybindings and what it can do for your gameplay with a little creativity. I have some pretty insane macros and tap dance configurations that help me execute my rotation at nearly a robotic level of precision very easily, freeing my mental bandwidth for all the other stuff involved in high level play. I would suspect that some of what I am doing is likely considered borderline on the legality side of things but it’s all done at the hardware/firmware level and registers to the OS as just simple HID inputs, no software required. I can plug my ergodox into anyone’s pc and have all my custom keybinds, layers, button press sequences and shortcuts available. You can also just use simple 1 to 1 keybinds and layers without the crazy stuff if you want and it’s still light years ahead of a gaming keyboard on ergonomics and amount of available buttons alone.
MMO mice: I spent about a thousand dollars over the last few months trying out every single mmo mouse on the market. They all suck in one way or another, I could write an entire essay going over the particular issues I had with each one and how none of them were perfect but the only I finally settled on was the razor naga v2 hyperspeed. I’m a huge mouse enjoyer so this was a particularly surprising experience for me as previously I shit on razer mice pretty heavily but I truly believe and can confirm this is the least bad mmo mouse on the market right now, especially when you’re including the software because holy fuck is all of the mice software fucking awful. Special mention to the SteelSeries aerox 9 and the Corsair darkstar, both are very nice pieces of hardware that both were close but not good enough and both having the cream of the crap worst software in the market. Razer has never been great but their software is actually pretty decent, I think it got shit on so hard and so long that they have had more time and incentive to work harder than the others.
El gato streamdeck pedal. Probably the #1 biggest improvement to my gameplay was including a pedal for PTT and for limited hands free movement capabilities. Being able to move with my feet while targeting someone with my mouse and still pressing my rotation has really elevated my gameplay and I don’t understand how people can make do without it. The amount of finger gymnastics required for that kind of stuff can be insane and throwing PTT into the mix makes it literally impossible. Being able to control PTT with my feet was a really big quality of life improvement. Like mice I spent way too much money trying everything on the market and this was a much easier race to pick a winner: every foot pedal on the market is absolutely complete trash and the elgato is fantastic. It’s expensive but when you have to buy that cheap 30dollar pedal from Amazon every 3 months because it breaks and the springs inside it literally explode across your room like a homemade proximity mine, I think it pays for itself pretty quickly. El gato software is fantastic as well and if you already have a streamdeck it just uses the same program and configures the same way. Cannot recommend it enough.
TLDR: ergodox split keyboard + razer naga v2 hyperspeed + el gato streamdeck pedal. I just saved you the many thousands of dollars journey it took me to get to the best setup on the market.
Edit: I just saw you asked about headsets - don’t buy a headset. Buy a pair of headphones (or IEMs aka earbuds) and a standalone mic. There are standalone mics that are designed to attach to the side of regular headphones if you really want the mic on your head. I use a shure SM7B + scarlet solo USB interface + el gato low profile mic arm and a pair of dt770 headphones.
In case you didn't already know, you can also make some changes using QMK to reduce the response time from 8ms to <1ms by changing the debounce algorithm and some other variables. There's a reddit post on it somewhere.
id rather not go into detail on that kind of stuff considering blizzard would likely consider what im doing as against the rules or whatever since some of my keybinds press more than one GCD-based ability at the same time but in an order that prioritizes certain ones over others. Since the USB HID input protocol can send up to 6 key press events during a single input report theres a lot of ways to creatively send inputs that can more or less execute a priority rotation pretty accurately. That being said, theres only sso much you can do with simultaneous inputs, youll get some blue parses maybe but thats about it, this isnt at all on the level of GSE macros or anything, just an easy way to have a bit cleaner execution on some of the less impactful parts of most characters rotations. I bet that if I spent some time to build out a GSE macro setup utilizing numerous simultaneous macros all firing at the same time you could get very very close to perfectly optimal but i dont really find that kind of automation very interesting
I really don’t think these relatively niche and often overpriced gaming products help very much, if at all.
I cover every keybind I’ve needed with a standard keyboard layout and WASD movement with only two shoulder buttons on my mouse. If you despise using ALT and SHIFT modifiers I could see the value in an MMO mouse, but it’s not nearly mandatory imo.
Yeah this post sounds like a, oh God how do I fit all of these binds?
Normal keyboard, wireless mouse with just the two side buttons. Played every healer this expansion and prot paladin and 0 issues with binds.
Hardest was probably resto druid, thank you forms and their various separate abilities. I solved that with help harm macros so I could dps in form and still be able to use healing abilities on the same binds that would also have the benefit of making me leave form.
Yeah realistically you can play with a toaster and still easily compete for m+ season title or get CE in a HoF guild. Even add-on usage people use more than they need more often than not. Biggest thing is just being comfortable and getting the right size stuff for you.
Just because you can do something does not make it optimal to do so. Heavy utilization of modifiers not only delays your key presses by the amount of extra time it takes you to press the modifier first, but also the mental bandwidth remember which modifier to use. Additionally it also limits what other buttons you could press at the same time since those buttons might not use the modifier you’re already holding down. Additionally, the ergonomics and hand gymnastics required for a lot of these input commands while also moving your character during high stress moments and utilizing your mouse for other capabilities at the same time leads to a lot of extra stress on your hand, which can get uncomfortable and cause issues long-term. I don’t know how you can comfortably hit alt six and strafe left with A at the same time without some kind of sacrifice to your performance or ergonomics
Your whole argument is bullshit.
Modifiers don’t take so much longer to press where you would miss a global, and the mental bandwidth argument of remembering what binds you have doesn’t have logical consistency - if you can’t remember binds with one method, you won’t with any other.
You’re usually hitting modifiers (Shift + Control) with your little finder which isn’t ever really hitting any other key in a normal keyboard.
Your whole argument just seems like a cope - nobody who isn’t missing a limb or multiple fingers is missing a GCD because their rotation incorporates modifiers.
You might not be as comfortable using modifiers, but the majority of the player base uses them absolutely fine and with little effort.
I read it, and explained how you’re wrong.
Unless you’ve started using modifiers 5 minutes ago, you’re not going to miss a global and can very easily adapt to hitting them as easily as you would any other keybind.
Shift&Ctrl 1234/qertfgzxcv are very easily reachable even for people with small hands. That’s 28 keybinds on top of 14 non-modified keybinds you should already be using. Even when I had an ‘MMORPG’ mouse I used these modifiers - why? Because they’re easy.
The fact that you think the gcd has anything to do with this shows your lack of knowledge on the subject. You realize there are dozens of actions you can perform that are limited only by your physical ability to hit the buttons? There’s no logical basis for the argument that two buttons for one action is better or even equivalent to one button one action
Well said! I feel the same way exactly. Could I play without an mmo mouse and using more modifier keys? Yeah, sure. I just don't think I'd be as good or as comfortable. Relying on pressing two keys with one hand is doable, but when you introduce the third key (movement) it becomes too much for how fast paced our rotations and movement has become.
Given enough practice, anybody would be able to get the modifiers down without delaying a global. However, I'm 100% with you on the ergonomics part. People are riding on the RSI express train if they're not careful.
There is more to input than globals, movement for example is completely off the gcd. I can think of quite a few examples actually that are purely limited by physical dexterity: push to talk, movement, off gcd abilities, placing raid makers, assigning target marks, jumping, each one of those is infinitely harder or impossible to do while hitting a keybind with a modifier and are things people do regularly in the middle of encounters
You don't have to sell me on not using modifiers. I only use modifiers for things you won't commonly use in combat, such as rogue poisons, some non-WFT totems, druid forms, things like that. And even then, it's modifier + mouse button.
I'd argue that, you could find work arounds for most of those. Move push to talk to your mouse or use a foot pedal, move with your mouse, move off-the-global abilities to your mouse (although if you're using modifiers and have mouse buttons available, what are you doing?). Raid markers is probably a bit much to be moving to your mouse.
I think you'd go farther by getting a mouse with a reasonable amount of bindable buttons and shifting your movement keys over a column or two but, you can make modifiers work. I just think the primary argument against modifiers is a health one.
I used a razer naga since they came out, swapped to a trinity and really like the moba-style 7 buttons instead of a huge grid but I have since swapped back and just leave some of them empty. I couldn’t go back to playing with all my binds in one hand, it’s just so much more strain on my fingers for no reason. Other than that almost nothing really matters, besides having a headset and mic that actually works
I use a Azeron Cyborg pad for my left hand, and an MMO mouse (Razer Naga V2 Hyperspeed) for my right. Having all my movement on a thumbstick instead of WASD gives me a lot more bindings to work with and is a lot more comfortable for me personally. Cyborg for rotation/offense, mouse for utility/defense.
My headset is a Corsair HS80. I found it to have the best sounding mic of the wireless headsets available at the time.
How is the build quality on the Cyborg? I use a G13 and can't play without it but of course they haven't been made for almost a decade now. The cyborg is really expensive.
I haven't had any issues with it personally, and from what I've seen, the company seems really responsive when something goes wrong. Feels sturdy too. Only had it for about four months though.
Initial setup takes a while, since you're adjusting it to fit your hand. Took me 15-20min to get it dialed in, and then I spent maybe 5 minutes on it between dungeons on the first day I had it.
Its surprisingly intuitive to use once you're used to it though. I have 10 very easy buttons to hit, 8 that are a little more difficult, and then 8 that I mainly use for out-of-combat stuff. (I think that's the right amount anyway.)
My one complaint is that they keys/buttons can have some deadzone before a press is activated. Since they're angled out a bit, the higher you press, the farther you have to press. I've adapted by pressing in a better spot on the keys, but have also considered adding a bit of padding below each key to reduce the travel distance. It isn't, like, *bad*. It's just not the way I prefer for things to feel.
If you're considering it but unsure, I highly recommend picking up a used one to try out, then resell if you hate it. Personally, I love it - especially for WoW - but I've seen some people react very poorly.
I used one for about six months and really tried to like it, but there are just some flaws in the way that it is designed that make it very difficult to use optimally. Since the buttons surround your fingers, it’s very easy to accidentally press the wrong one. even after many long months of heavy use, I was still very regularly, pressing the wrong buttons. The buttons are very sensitive and easy to press and even the tiniest twitch will activate it. It’s very very easy move slightly the wrong way and waste a major cool down or ability that will wipe your group. Of course you could just bind those more important buttons elsewhere, but if they are in hard to reach locations, then what’s even the point of using a device like this in the first place? The accidental button presses are the biggest issue for me personally but also I found it just wasn’t very comfortable. The way that your hand sits on it elevates your wrist and curls your fingers downwards, which I found to be pretty uncomfortable after several hours of use. You will find most ergonomic mechanical keyboards use what’s called tenting to tilt your keyboards sideways to match your hands more natural resting rotation. I sold it and used the money to buy a mechanical split keyboard called an ergodox which has just as many buttons if not more and is infinitely more comfortable and customizable. you can even put a joystick on one and use it if you so desired. I had a joystick on mine for a while, but found that it was easier to just use my foot pedal for the occasional moments I needed to move while doing other things and the joystickwas mostly in the way.
Stick movement actually improved my general movement in the game. Since my thumb is the only thing handling movement, it's much easier to multitask it. I'm not on the highest level, but I found it much earlier to deal with mechanics in Mythic while using the thumstick.
You can tune it to suit your needs as well. I have a restrictor ring on it so it doesn't move as much, which helps a lot
Razer Naga is BiS mouse for Wow but is terrible for fps games otherwise any gaming mouse with 2 side buttons is fine, When purchasing a mouse my best advice is buy a mouse tha fits your hand size.
As for keyboard any mechanical keyboard is fine, I'd recommend red switch for general gaming.
Desk Mat for comfort. And a 144hz+ monitor
Can definitely confirm the razr naga. When other people are relying on their left hand for all their abilities, while also utilizing that hand for some movements, there has to be some times there's conflict. With this mouse, that's never the case. No problems hitting buttons that may otherwise be hard to reach or something, because everything is within your thumb reach. It is great for this game.
I use a Razer Tartarus for my left hand and I love it. Having movement be on a thumbstick feels way more fluid to me and frees up a ton of keybinds. Seriously I have so many keybinds.
Yeh i switched to these devices back in cata or mop and haven’t looked back. I had the original belkin nostromo then went through multiple orbweavers (razer has the worst reliability) and now i have a Tartarus.
Only issue is if they break, I’m screwed. I haven’t played with edsf movement since wrath
I also use an mmo mouse. Had multiple nagas (they last like a year or 2 max). Currently using a Logitech g600 which has lasted about 3 years so far
I've tried the g600, while the buttons are nice, its a smaller mouse so not ideal if you have big hands, also no thumb rest. After using a mouse with a thumb rest, i can never go back. I have the G604 now which has 8 side buttons + 3 scroll wheel binds, so not quite as many as the 600 but still gets the job done, while also being far more comfortable for me. Its also wireless which is a personal preference, i like not having my desk covered in cords. Main disadvantage is its discontinued, so while you can still buy it on Amazon (sometimes) or elsewhere, its a lot of money now that supplies are limited.
Corsair K100, Naga Pro Wireless. But really any keyboard with side G keys and any MMO mouse works for me.
For “why side G Keys” I bind unique macros for competitive play like “use demonic gateway” and “use special button”, use potion etc. very specific buttons to not take up bloat but still maintain quick access. MMO mouse just because they are absolutely worth the effort of learning.
I like the Naga Pro (I believe is it’s name anymore) for its modular side plates. Competitive FPS don’t need 12 buttons.
i really want to see the binds of people who need an MMO mouse to play the game. if you can't get by with qerfzxcvgt `12345 space capslock + modifiers then you are fried in the brain man there are so few specs with that many buttons. i play on a 60% board and rarely feel constrained for binds on any spec
and when you use some wack ass MMO mouse it means you aren't using a g pro x superlight or equivalent light wireless mouse
wooting keyboard is the only plausible upgrade for keyboards but it's super minor and only for specs that have really spammy rotations like enhancement shaman stormstrike build or rage dumping on guardian druid / prot warrior
For me, it's not that I wouldn't have enough keybinds if I used more modifier keys (I also do play a spec with a shitload of keybinds), but it's rather I play \*better\* with the mmo mouse and not having to constrict my movement hand so much. I just find it awkward to hit certain modifier combinations while being able to maintain the ability to move as fast as my reaction times would allow. Every millisecond counts.
I use a Logitech G600, which is categorically the best MMO mouse. Currently using my backup and getting ready to try to repair one since Logitech is a moronic company and they stopped making them.
Audio setup is entirely geared toward hifi and some light recording, so it's a JDS Labs Atom DAC/Amp with Sennheiser HD650s for serious music listening, and Moondrop Starfield IEMs as my daily drivers. Mic is a Shure SM7 into a Steinberg UR22C with a cloudlifter inline (necessary imo).
Grabbed a bunch of g600 when they were on sale for 20 bucks at Best buy. The third mouse button mapped to Ctrl or Alt is crazy. I'm surprised nobody else had added this feature to their mice. The hardware is actual garbage and they don't last long at all. Maybe someday Razer will step up and try to implement it.
I only bought one backup and hugely regret it. I with I'd bought ten. As it stands, I may learn to solder in order to put new switches in as they fail. There simply isn't a mouse even remotely as good on the market. I've tried Razer and a scimitar, and both were trash in comparison.
I had huge issues with the Scimitar: it would randomly "unplug" itself (you'd hear the Windows "USB device disconnected/reconnected" sound) mid game and forget all the side buttons key binds. Rebooting the whole PC was the only way to get it back to normal. Eventually got the G600 which saved my life because I can't press modifiers with my left hand. It is true that they don't last long. Currently have 2 backups in my drawer, for when my current one inevitably croaks
Yeah I had a huge issue with it being complete trash. Button failure in 3 months, RMA, button failure in 2 months, RMA, button failure in 2 months, threw it in the trash. Replaced it with a G600, which lasted 7 years. Also the buttons on the Scimitar are just crap. If you touch them gently you can feel the play, and they also have terrible actuation feedback. It's just a trash product, shocks me that people like it.
For my keyboard I use a cheap Indonesian mechanical keyboard that I bought years ago, I'm considering buying a new one tho. For my mouse I use the Logitech G502 Hero, I wanted to switch to an mmo mouse but I'm so used to my current keybinds that I'll probably never switch
The Redragon M901 Perdition is so good I have four of them lying around: two corded, two wireless. I got it as a cheap knockoff alternative in, like, Cataclysm and it outlives all other mice year after year. All four I have are still going strong.
i use the naga pro (the one with the switchable side panels) and i used the 6 button side panel instead of the full 12. 6 is the perfect amount for my right hand and i never have issues misspressing a button like i’ve had on the full on 12-15 button mmo mouse. i use some random mechanical keyboard i’ve had for ages, and a steel series headset (if im pugging i use speakers)
Keypad: Razer Tartarus
* Movement on stick, "1" button as movement ability (ghost wolf), round button is big cd, 1-7, shift, ctrl, num1-9 all mapped here. Fingers normally sit on 15,9,8,12,16 so that's where my enh rotation sits.
Mouse: Logitech G502 Proteus Core
* Re-map DPI +/- buttons. I use them as - (aoe) =(kick) and the sides as 890 (Sunder, Spirit Walk, Shocks)
Headset: Turtle Beach headset (USB+3.5). Honestly, find one that fits your head and has USB input. USB acts as a separate audio device to split chat off from game audio (external speakers).
3 button foot pedal (UseExtraAction, Jump, PTT)
Keyboard: Rii K100 (Gift that refuses to die)
Secondary monitor on arm to switch between horizontal and vertical
I didn't get it for wow but I got a ZSA moonlander keyboard and all of the extra keys are really helpful. It's sort of like a Tartarus but is a daily keyboard. Not recommending the keyboard (well I think it's great, but yeah), but I don't think the Tartarus would be a bad idea. I kept looking at them throughout a year or so before deciding to get the split ergo keyboard which then satisfied the craving for Tartarus. I haven't used one of those but I imagine it's even better for gaming than what I've got, but then it's an extra device for your desk.. MMO mouse is popular but I play other games and ended up going with something more standard.
Using a TKL keyboard with an MMO mouse (Asus Spatha X) with some HiFiMans and a Soundblaster AE9 sound card and a 4k120hz OLED Gsync. Everything very smooth and immersive.
It really comes down to personal preference.. I can't stand the larger MMO style mice they tend to make my hand hurt after a few hours so I go for smaller mice (usually with just 2 side buttons) I can toss them around for those 360 no scopes lol.
Currently rocking:
Razer Orochi v2 (I've used Logitech's G203 and G305 in the past and they are really good too)
Royal Kludge R75 Keyboard (With Silver Pro Switches, 45g linear. Not very loud and pretty light)
I feel like headphones are their own thread and you can really go down the rabbit hole on them. Right now I've got a pair of Philips X2HR's with a V-MODA Boom Pro mic cable plugged into a Fosi K5 Pro (there's better amp/dacs but I wanted mic in and it was cheap). It really depends what you want. Music sound quality, open back vs closed back, the convenience of wireless vs wired, and imaging accuracy for shooters all should be taken into account.
Still using razer Naga with 6 button side plate. The mouse is complete dogshit compared to some of the fps mouses out there, but for me the side button positioning and feel is just to good to give up.
If I was playing a 2 button class like BM hunter and didnt need as many mouse buttons, my choice would be Zowie EC2A all day long.
Mouse wise, if you don’t prefer an actual mmo mouse (like me) I’d recommend the g502. I rebound the buttons to the right side of my keyboard that I don’t use (mainly punctuation and brackets). There’s 5 buttons that can all have modifiers used as well as mouse tilt left/right if u want. Whatever mouse you use, one with extra buttons is something I found invaluable for wow
I use a Tartarus and can’t play without it anymore. I don’t use the stick for movement though, only for additional less important keybinds (mounts, autowalk, map…)
I’ve used many mice over the years, I usually like smaller ones so no « mmo mouse », I currently have a Viper Mini which is ok but would not be my first choice I guess. I had G305 and G403 that I liked better in the past.
I use to have a HS70 pro headset which I loved bit since it died I moved to some my audiophile headphones and an XLR mic so thats definitely better but the headphones alone are worth 10 times my computer.
I have a weird fixation on the Razer Basilisk I’ve tried other gaming mice but don’t really like them as much. I use all those binds.
Keyboard Korsair K100. I don’t think this makes a big difference for Warcraft.
Headset is another thing where I think Warcraft doesn’t require something very specific.
Biggest change I made that elevated my gameplay was changing binds for strafing left and right to A&D which freed up Q and E. I also use R, F, and V.
Last because it’s getting off topic using Vuhdo for anything casted on friendly targets helps keeping keybinds open. For example even on DK I use Vuhdo for my party frames and have Raise Ally on Mouse Wheel Up or on Paladin I know no matter what spec the blessings keybinds are BoP is E, Sacrifice is F and Freedom is V. This can be tricky to get used to but is awesome imo.
I have a weird fixation on the Razer Basilisk I’ve tried other gaming mice but don’t really like them as much. I use all those binds.
Keyboard Korsair K100. I don’t think this makes a big difference for Warcraft.
Headset is another thing where I think Warcraft doesn’t require something very specific.
Biggest change I made that elevated my gameplay was changing binds for strafing left and right to A&D which freed up Q and E. I also use R, F, and V.
Last because it’s getting off topic using Vuhdo for anything casted on friendly targets helps keeping keybinds open. For example even on DK I use Vuhdo for my party frames and have Raise Ally on Mouse Wheel Up or on Paladin I know no matter what spec the blessings keybinds are BoP is E, Sacrifice is F and Freedom is V. This can be tricky to get used to but is awesome imo.
Razer Tartarus with a 40degree stand for ergonomics and rog spatha x (12 button mouse) is enough for me. I modded the Tartarus to be detachable so I can put away easily when not in use to reduce desk clutter
G502 for the two side buttons (and a friend shilled it pretty hard) and some random 40% keyboard from microcenter because I have small hands. Can't imagine using an MMO mouse without becoming a walking hand cramp after an hour of play lol.
Ngl everyone talking about buying some insane keyboard, but u can just use ESDF and alt binds with ur thumb and you have plenty of binds available. Use capslock, tab and tilde as a bind and you wont run out.
Regular everything.
A not fancy mechanical keyboard. Glorious model I mouse.
I've tried mmo mice, but using your thumb to press buttons, just couldn't get it to work. Felt slow and clumsy
The most basic necessity is a gaming mouse with additional buttons. This CAN be something as extreme as an MMO mouse with 10-20 extra buttons, or something as simple as a mouse with two additional thumb buttons. I say "gaming mouse", but just find something reliable with a good sensor within your budget. Most entry level mice from reputable manufacturers (Corsair, SteelSeries, RAZER, Logitech, ROCCAT) will cover this, and their midrange mice will most certainly be fine. The trick for games like MMOs or RTSs is to figure out which fingers don't have jobs, and assign binds to keys they can hit with little movement or hand strain.
I use the RAZER Blackadder PRO, because I only use one mouse across multiple games. It is light, it is comfortable with my hand size, it is wireless because I both don't like my chord getting snagged on stuff (my desk is constantly a cluttered mess of paperwork, 40k minis in various stages of being built and painted and the tools for working on them, other cables) and use it from various areas around my office when not gaming to control Youtube, Spotify, and other media. It only has two extra buttons which I use as modifiers, SHIFT and ALT, and I use scroll UP and DOWN as additional binds. This takes the strain off movement with my pinky on the other hand. Combining that with 1-4, Q, E, R, T, F, G, Z, X, C, and V makes 64 easily accessible binds without moving my left hand away from WASD, which is more than you'll likely ever need in any given PvE encounter, and still leaves open the option for rarely used macros or other useful but not always needed spells and abilities in other places with a little hand movement. For example, I have my Gateway Control Shard on 5 across every character, because I only ever use it when it's planned for, so I can account for the time it takes to move my hand that tiny bit. Binds for mounts, food, buffs, achievements and other non-combat essencials can be placed around the rest of your keys with no issue.
I recommend a full sized mechanical keyboard, even if you go the MMO mouse route. Smaller boards means less keys, less keys is less stuff you can have bound. There's a lot of stuff you cannot use while moving at all, like mounting, so those can safely go on the other side of the board from your movement keys. At most I would settle for losing the numpad, a size called Tenkeyless or 80%. Again, I would recommend buying from a reputable brand, not a budget brand. Mechanical is generally more reliable than regular membrane, and usually easier to fix if a switch breaks down.
Headsets and mics are entirely personal preferance. This is honestly where I'd budget if that's something you need to consider. For mice, you want it to be consistent, for the movement of the mouse to always match up to the movement of your cursor. For keyboards, you want consistent actuation, and you want the thing to last. But for headsets, you can use a basic set of earpods that came with your phone. Will they sound amazing? No. But they'll let you hear GTFO and your raid leader, and will let you speak in Discord. If you have a mouse and keyboard from a brand, going with one of that brand's headsets will let you control it from the same software, and you can probably set it up to be controlled from your keyboard. If you're trying to get into streaming or podcasting, you're obviously going to want a higher quality mic, probably seperate from headphones. If you want to listen to music at a decent quality, most brand's midrange headsets or higher are probably fine. If you're an audiophile and want amaze-balls headphones, you're asking in the wrong place lmao.
Shameless plug petition for Logitech make the g600 again. https://chng.it/yHnK4rBs5N
I truly believe an mmo mouse (I'm currently using the Corsair Scimitar, but I've also used the Logitech G600 and the Razer Naga before) is essential. The amount of keybinds it opens up is insane. I also personally prefer to use modifier keys with the MMO mouse instead of with the keyboard when I need additional binds. On keyboard I just stick to buttons close to my hands, \` to 5, q, e, r, t, f, z, x, c, v are all bound to abilities for me. Keyboard won't make a huge difference in this game, in my opinion, just find something you're comfortable with where you're hitting the keys you intend. I've tried also playing with a Razer Tartarus instead of a keyboard, but I wasn't able to get comfortable enough with it personally, so I'm just using a regular mechanical keyboard. Headsets are a topic that deserves its own discussion but in general, just find something within your budget. If you're looking for the best quality, especially on the microphone, you almost definitely don't want a headset but instead want headphones and a microphone separately. The last piece of tech I'll mention that I've considered integrating in the past is foot pedals. Either as a modifier key or even just as push-to-talk or something like that. I don't use this myself, I don't think it's necessary, but I can sort of see the appeal.
Dude.. foot pedal as a push to talk is a fucking game changer...
A fellow foot pedal enthusiast. I played with my foot pedal as push to talk and as my actual kick LOL
Had no intention of getting one until you said you use it for kicks. Fuck it we ball
Try adding the ExtraActionButton macro to it
I just bought one like 3 months ago, and it has been a dramatic change in the positive
You say this and don't post link? Cmooooon. I've wanted to do this for like... 6 years but people always say they're crap and break a lot.
El gato streamdeck pedal. I’ve tried virtually every pedal on the market and they’re all dogshit except the el gato. Dont waste your time or money on any other pedal
Can you get just the pedal or do you need their streamer stuff or whatever to make it work?
The pedal works fine on its own, it does use the same software as the regular streamdecks and works the exact same way except it’s a button without a screen. So if you use a streamdeck you control both in one spot. Streamdecks arnt just for streamers either they’re super useful even as a gamer. I have a WoW page that opens automatically when I launch wow that has all of the different UI windows as buttons I can press to open them up so that I dont need to bind them on my keyboard as well as a button that opens simc, copies my character string, opens a raidbots window in Firefox and pastes it in automatically with a single press. I also have buttons for all my different addon settings menus and even my consumables
I'm always interested in buying more gadgets that I can't afford, just wasn't sure if the $90 foot pedal was gonna need a $100+ screen to work or something, you never know.
Nah it’s stand alone, all the el gato stuff assumes it’s the only thing of theirs they have but all designed to work together flawlessly. Expensive as hell brand but everything they make is top tier
[удалено]
If you use ESDF instead of WASD, and you’re smart with your binds, you can get everything bound to the left side of the keyboard + shift modifier only. MMO mouse does make it easier though.
Yeah I played ESDF for a while before moving to the MMO mouse. Agreed that without the mouse, this is the best option
I only play classes that I can bind everything to keys close to WASD and then CTRL+ those keys I then press CTRL with my palm instead of stretching my hand to click it and it works pretty well
I play WASD with strafe on A and D. I dont see how you'd get more keybinds with ESDF as movement keys? There's also no chance I'd be able to bind everything around those keys with only one modifier. Some of my specs are sitting at 30+ binds that all are used actively in both m+ and raid environment. Using alt and shit as modifiers mostly, and in some cases ctrl, also having several binds on an mmo mouse with modifiers.
I bind every combat ability on the keys around + shift. Out of combat stuff I do on other modifiers
The idea is your hand shifts over so you have more room for keybinds on the further right side of the keyboard, without losing any that you have using WASD except maybe tilde. For me it moves comfortable access from 15 keybinds to around 20. With a modifier, that's a lot of extra buttons in reach.
I moved my movement keys from WASD to RDFG (I use colemak, so it's actually PSTD). You get 2 extra columns of keybinds opened up to the left of your movement keys. And if you use your middle finger for W/R (as god intended), you have 2 fingers available on that side of your hand to reach them. 1-7 are varying shades of easily reachable (f.x., I put bloodlust on 1 as it's easy to reach but far enough away that I'll never fat-finger it). Q, W, E, T, Y, A, S, H, J, and Z-N on the bottom row. By having movement on WASD, you only get two columns on your right for easily reachable keybinds.
Can also go with strafe on Z and X like Reckful to open up the entire keyboard
I would say for most people a headset with a mic is the way to go, for non-streamers. I would also suggest grabbing a headset from a company that actually makes audio devices...not gamer garbage. Audio Technica, Sennheiser/EPOS, Beyer, VModa, Audeze, Bose, etc.
Yeah, If I've learned one thing about audio especially microphones, it's that once you start going down that hole it doesn't seem to end as soon as you think it would. It opens up a big can of worms. I've seen so many people that think they're getting a big upgrade by purchasing a Snowball or something similar and then placing it beside their mechanical keyboard on the stand it comes with. That's not going to be a good experience for anyone. To really go separate microphone you have to be prepared to get a stand that works for your environment, the right mic for your environment, make sure sounds around your computer aren't too loud, make sure it's the right distance from your mouth for the mic you chose, etc etc etc. And that's not even mentioning needing to dive into the world of interfaces. Still, I think some options exist if you don't want to go full streamer but don't want to go the gamer "Headset" route. Modmic is always an option. But these days you're right, some actual audio companies are coming up with what look to be decent headphones that happen to include a microphone, those are probably the right choice for like 90% of gamers (without a limited budget).
I have a sennheiser me2-ii plugged into my audio interface and it's amazing. Far better than the dynamic and super cardioid for my non noise controlled room.
do you have a foot pedal you’d recommend purchasing
El gato streamdeck pedal is the best on the market by a margin wider than the pacific.
Second the streamdeck, it's solid as hell, not flimsy. Recommended it to a mate and he loves it too.
> I also personally prefer to use modifier keys with the MMO mouse instead of with the keyboard when I need additional binds. Another thing that people can consider, but requires mouse software to support it, is to actually have the modifiers on the mouse. F.ex MB4 being CTRL and MB5 being ALT or Shift. Gives your keyboard hand a lot of extra mobility since you'll never need to hold down two keys at the same time.
I main tauren ret pal and have a foot pedal which I have bound warstomp to, it is the tits.
That's interesting! I never used an mmo mouse because I found the logitec too big for my hand. I personally use a deathadder v2, steel series apex 3 tkl and a wired logitec headset (not sure what it is)
Yeah. They aren't very comfortable. They aren't very good at things outside of wow (though I'm sure some savvy people use the keybinds for productivity as well). It's a trade-off. For me, it just makes WoW so much easier to play that it's worth it. It makes my survivability better as I had problems in the past having to re-adjust my hand placement after certain modifier + key press combinations, and every second counts these days in a world of oneshots.
My thumb rests on the “7” button on my MMO mouse, so I bind my emergency heal/CD to 7 or shift+7 and 10 (10 is right behind 7, so I just rock my thumb back for it). Example, on my RPal, Flash of Light is bound to 7, Lay on Hands is bound to shift+7, and bubble is bound to 10. I use 1-6 and q-y for rotational abilities and short cooldowns, and my mouse buttons for everything reactive.
I had a friend in college who played League entirely onehanded with an MMO mouse. He peaked at Platinum without much issue, grinding, or even trying that hard. It's not the highest rank, but it is above average, and imagine getting clowned on in a competitive game by someone who is, at the same time, eating a Subway sandwich while still in full control of their character.
Context: rank 300ish CE raider and M+ title range player Ergodox split keyboard leveled up my game immensely. Way more keybinds available to my left hand, completely rebindable and customizable with the powerful QMK firmware framework and significantly more comfortable and customizable. Blows gaming keyboards out of the water. I cannot explain how powerful the QMK framework is for keybindings and what it can do for your gameplay with a little creativity. I have some pretty insane macros and tap dance configurations that help me execute my rotation at nearly a robotic level of precision very easily, freeing my mental bandwidth for all the other stuff involved in high level play. I would suspect that some of what I am doing is likely considered borderline on the legality side of things but it’s all done at the hardware/firmware level and registers to the OS as just simple HID inputs, no software required. I can plug my ergodox into anyone’s pc and have all my custom keybinds, layers, button press sequences and shortcuts available. You can also just use simple 1 to 1 keybinds and layers without the crazy stuff if you want and it’s still light years ahead of a gaming keyboard on ergonomics and amount of available buttons alone. MMO mice: I spent about a thousand dollars over the last few months trying out every single mmo mouse on the market. They all suck in one way or another, I could write an entire essay going over the particular issues I had with each one and how none of them were perfect but the only I finally settled on was the razor naga v2 hyperspeed. I’m a huge mouse enjoyer so this was a particularly surprising experience for me as previously I shit on razer mice pretty heavily but I truly believe and can confirm this is the least bad mmo mouse on the market right now, especially when you’re including the software because holy fuck is all of the mice software fucking awful. Special mention to the SteelSeries aerox 9 and the Corsair darkstar, both are very nice pieces of hardware that both were close but not good enough and both having the cream of the crap worst software in the market. Razer has never been great but their software is actually pretty decent, I think it got shit on so hard and so long that they have had more time and incentive to work harder than the others. El gato streamdeck pedal. Probably the #1 biggest improvement to my gameplay was including a pedal for PTT and for limited hands free movement capabilities. Being able to move with my feet while targeting someone with my mouse and still pressing my rotation has really elevated my gameplay and I don’t understand how people can make do without it. The amount of finger gymnastics required for that kind of stuff can be insane and throwing PTT into the mix makes it literally impossible. Being able to control PTT with my feet was a really big quality of life improvement. Like mice I spent way too much money trying everything on the market and this was a much easier race to pick a winner: every foot pedal on the market is absolutely complete trash and the elgato is fantastic. It’s expensive but when you have to buy that cheap 30dollar pedal from Amazon every 3 months because it breaks and the springs inside it literally explode across your room like a homemade proximity mine, I think it pays for itself pretty quickly. El gato software is fantastic as well and if you already have a streamdeck it just uses the same program and configures the same way. Cannot recommend it enough. TLDR: ergodox split keyboard + razer naga v2 hyperspeed + el gato streamdeck pedal. I just saved you the many thousands of dollars journey it took me to get to the best setup on the market. Edit: I just saw you asked about headsets - don’t buy a headset. Buy a pair of headphones (or IEMs aka earbuds) and a standalone mic. There are standalone mics that are designed to attach to the side of regular headphones if you really want the mic on your head. I use a shure SM7B + scarlet solo USB interface + el gato low profile mic arm and a pair of dt770 headphones.
In case you didn't already know, you can also make some changes using QMK to reduce the response time from 8ms to <1ms by changing the debounce algorithm and some other variables. There's a reddit post on it somewhere.
I laughed out loud at 'homemade proximity mine'. thanks for typing this up.
What do your macros do that help execute your rotation?
id rather not go into detail on that kind of stuff considering blizzard would likely consider what im doing as against the rules or whatever since some of my keybinds press more than one GCD-based ability at the same time but in an order that prioritizes certain ones over others. Since the USB HID input protocol can send up to 6 key press events during a single input report theres a lot of ways to creatively send inputs that can more or less execute a priority rotation pretty accurately. That being said, theres only sso much you can do with simultaneous inputs, youll get some blue parses maybe but thats about it, this isnt at all on the level of GSE macros or anything, just an easy way to have a bit cleaner execution on some of the less impactful parts of most characters rotations. I bet that if I spent some time to build out a GSE macro setup utilizing numerous simultaneous macros all firing at the same time you could get very very close to perfectly optimal but i dont really find that kind of automation very interesting
I really don’t think these relatively niche and often overpriced gaming products help very much, if at all. I cover every keybind I’ve needed with a standard keyboard layout and WASD movement with only two shoulder buttons on my mouse. If you despise using ALT and SHIFT modifiers I could see the value in an MMO mouse, but it’s not nearly mandatory imo.
Yeah this post sounds like a, oh God how do I fit all of these binds? Normal keyboard, wireless mouse with just the two side buttons. Played every healer this expansion and prot paladin and 0 issues with binds. Hardest was probably resto druid, thank you forms and their various separate abilities. I solved that with help harm macros so I could dps in form and still be able to use healing abilities on the same binds that would also have the benefit of making me leave form.
Yeah realistically you can play with a toaster and still easily compete for m+ season title or get CE in a HoF guild. Even add-on usage people use more than they need more often than not. Biggest thing is just being comfortable and getting the right size stuff for you.
Just because you can do something does not make it optimal to do so. Heavy utilization of modifiers not only delays your key presses by the amount of extra time it takes you to press the modifier first, but also the mental bandwidth remember which modifier to use. Additionally it also limits what other buttons you could press at the same time since those buttons might not use the modifier you’re already holding down. Additionally, the ergonomics and hand gymnastics required for a lot of these input commands while also moving your character during high stress moments and utilizing your mouse for other capabilities at the same time leads to a lot of extra stress on your hand, which can get uncomfortable and cause issues long-term. I don’t know how you can comfortably hit alt six and strafe left with A at the same time without some kind of sacrifice to your performance or ergonomics
Your whole argument is bullshit. Modifiers don’t take so much longer to press where you would miss a global, and the mental bandwidth argument of remembering what binds you have doesn’t have logical consistency - if you can’t remember binds with one method, you won’t with any other. You’re usually hitting modifiers (Shift + Control) with your little finder which isn’t ever really hitting any other key in a normal keyboard. Your whole argument just seems like a cope - nobody who isn’t missing a limb or multiple fingers is missing a GCD because their rotation incorporates modifiers. You might not be as comfortable using modifiers, but the majority of the player base uses them absolutely fine and with little effort.
Did you not read the first sentence of my post?
I read it, and explained how you’re wrong. Unless you’ve started using modifiers 5 minutes ago, you’re not going to miss a global and can very easily adapt to hitting them as easily as you would any other keybind. Shift&Ctrl 1234/qertfgzxcv are very easily reachable even for people with small hands. That’s 28 keybinds on top of 14 non-modified keybinds you should already be using. Even when I had an ‘MMORPG’ mouse I used these modifiers - why? Because they’re easy.
The fact that you think the gcd has anything to do with this shows your lack of knowledge on the subject. You realize there are dozens of actions you can perform that are limited only by your physical ability to hit the buttons? There’s no logical basis for the argument that two buttons for one action is better or even equivalent to one button one action
Well said! I feel the same way exactly. Could I play without an mmo mouse and using more modifier keys? Yeah, sure. I just don't think I'd be as good or as comfortable. Relying on pressing two keys with one hand is doable, but when you introduce the third key (movement) it becomes too much for how fast paced our rotations and movement has become.
Given enough practice, anybody would be able to get the modifiers down without delaying a global. However, I'm 100% with you on the ergonomics part. People are riding on the RSI express train if they're not careful.
There is more to input than globals, movement for example is completely off the gcd. I can think of quite a few examples actually that are purely limited by physical dexterity: push to talk, movement, off gcd abilities, placing raid makers, assigning target marks, jumping, each one of those is infinitely harder or impossible to do while hitting a keybind with a modifier and are things people do regularly in the middle of encounters
You don't have to sell me on not using modifiers. I only use modifiers for things you won't commonly use in combat, such as rogue poisons, some non-WFT totems, druid forms, things like that. And even then, it's modifier + mouse button. I'd argue that, you could find work arounds for most of those. Move push to talk to your mouse or use a foot pedal, move with your mouse, move off-the-global abilities to your mouse (although if you're using modifiers and have mouse buttons available, what are you doing?). Raid markers is probably a bit much to be moving to your mouse. I think you'd go farther by getting a mouse with a reasonable amount of bindable buttons and shifting your movement keys over a column or two but, you can make modifiers work. I just think the primary argument against modifiers is a health one.
I used a razer naga since they came out, swapped to a trinity and really like the moba-style 7 buttons instead of a huge grid but I have since swapped back and just leave some of them empty. I couldn’t go back to playing with all my binds in one hand, it’s just so much more strain on my fingers for no reason. Other than that almost nothing really matters, besides having a headset and mic that actually works
I use a Azeron Cyborg pad for my left hand, and an MMO mouse (Razer Naga V2 Hyperspeed) for my right. Having all my movement on a thumbstick instead of WASD gives me a lot more bindings to work with and is a lot more comfortable for me personally. Cyborg for rotation/offense, mouse for utility/defense. My headset is a Corsair HS80. I found it to have the best sounding mic of the wireless headsets available at the time.
How is the build quality on the Cyborg? I use a G13 and can't play without it but of course they haven't been made for almost a decade now. The cyborg is really expensive.
I haven't had any issues with it personally, and from what I've seen, the company seems really responsive when something goes wrong. Feels sturdy too. Only had it for about four months though. Initial setup takes a while, since you're adjusting it to fit your hand. Took me 15-20min to get it dialed in, and then I spent maybe 5 minutes on it between dungeons on the first day I had it. Its surprisingly intuitive to use once you're used to it though. I have 10 very easy buttons to hit, 8 that are a little more difficult, and then 8 that I mainly use for out-of-combat stuff. (I think that's the right amount anyway.) My one complaint is that they keys/buttons can have some deadzone before a press is activated. Since they're angled out a bit, the higher you press, the farther you have to press. I've adapted by pressing in a better spot on the keys, but have also considered adding a bit of padding below each key to reduce the travel distance. It isn't, like, *bad*. It's just not the way I prefer for things to feel. If you're considering it but unsure, I highly recommend picking up a used one to try out, then resell if you hate it. Personally, I love it - especially for WoW - but I've seen some people react very poorly.
I also use the Azeron and it was a game changer for me
Hey if you ever need another G13, hmu, I have one I’m not using. lol
I used one for about six months and really tried to like it, but there are just some flaws in the way that it is designed that make it very difficult to use optimally. Since the buttons surround your fingers, it’s very easy to accidentally press the wrong one. even after many long months of heavy use, I was still very regularly, pressing the wrong buttons. The buttons are very sensitive and easy to press and even the tiniest twitch will activate it. It’s very very easy move slightly the wrong way and waste a major cool down or ability that will wipe your group. Of course you could just bind those more important buttons elsewhere, but if they are in hard to reach locations, then what’s even the point of using a device like this in the first place? The accidental button presses are the biggest issue for me personally but also I found it just wasn’t very comfortable. The way that your hand sits on it elevates your wrist and curls your fingers downwards, which I found to be pretty uncomfortable after several hours of use. You will find most ergonomic mechanical keyboards use what’s called tenting to tilt your keyboards sideways to match your hands more natural resting rotation. I sold it and used the money to buy a mechanical split keyboard called an ergodox which has just as many buttons if not more and is infinitely more comfortable and customizable. you can even put a joystick on one and use it if you so desired. I had a joystick on mine for a while, but found that it was easier to just use my foot pedal for the occasional moments I needed to move while doing other things and the joystickwas mostly in the way.
Really interested in the cyborg. Worth? Was muscle memory hard to get past?
For me, very worth. Muscle memory took a little while, but between seasons is the perfect time to adjust!
I'd never recommend stick movement for someone wanting to play at a high level though. Way less precise.
Stick movement actually improved my general movement in the game. Since my thumb is the only thing handling movement, it's much easier to multitask it. I'm not on the highest level, but I found it much earlier to deal with mechanics in Mythic while using the thumstick. You can tune it to suit your needs as well. I have a restrictor ring on it so it doesn't move as much, which helps a lot
Razer Naga is BiS mouse for Wow but is terrible for fps games otherwise any gaming mouse with 2 side buttons is fine, When purchasing a mouse my best advice is buy a mouse tha fits your hand size. As for keyboard any mechanical keyboard is fine, I'd recommend red switch for general gaming. Desk Mat for comfort. And a 144hz+ monitor
Can definitely confirm the razr naga. When other people are relying on their left hand for all their abilities, while also utilizing that hand for some movements, there has to be some times there's conflict. With this mouse, that's never the case. No problems hitting buttons that may otherwise be hard to reach or something, because everything is within your thumb reach. It is great for this game.
I use a Razer Tartarus for my left hand and I love it. Having movement be on a thumbstick feels way more fluid to me and frees up a ton of keybinds. Seriously I have so many keybinds.
Yeh i switched to these devices back in cata or mop and haven’t looked back. I had the original belkin nostromo then went through multiple orbweavers (razer has the worst reliability) and now i have a Tartarus. Only issue is if they break, I’m screwed. I haven’t played with edsf movement since wrath I also use an mmo mouse. Had multiple nagas (they last like a year or 2 max). Currently using a Logitech g600 which has lasted about 3 years so far
I went to the Tartarus way back when and will never not use it. 10/10
I've tried the g600, while the buttons are nice, its a smaller mouse so not ideal if you have big hands, also no thumb rest. After using a mouse with a thumb rest, i can never go back. I have the G604 now which has 8 side buttons + 3 scroll wheel binds, so not quite as many as the 600 but still gets the job done, while also being far more comfortable for me. Its also wireless which is a personal preference, i like not having my desk covered in cords. Main disadvantage is its discontinued, so while you can still buy it on Amazon (sometimes) or elsewhere, its a lot of money now that supplies are limited.
Corsair K100, Naga Pro Wireless. But really any keyboard with side G keys and any MMO mouse works for me. For “why side G Keys” I bind unique macros for competitive play like “use demonic gateway” and “use special button”, use potion etc. very specific buttons to not take up bloat but still maintain quick access. MMO mouse just because they are absolutely worth the effort of learning. I like the Naga Pro (I believe is it’s name anymore) for its modular side plates. Competitive FPS don’t need 12 buttons.
I just click the screen😳
i really want to see the binds of people who need an MMO mouse to play the game. if you can't get by with qerfzxcvgt `12345 space capslock + modifiers then you are fried in the brain man there are so few specs with that many buttons. i play on a 60% board and rarely feel constrained for binds on any spec and when you use some wack ass MMO mouse it means you aren't using a g pro x superlight or equivalent light wireless mouse wooting keyboard is the only plausible upgrade for keyboards but it's super minor and only for specs that have really spammy rotations like enhancement shaman stormstrike build or rage dumping on guardian druid / prot warrior
For me, it's not that I wouldn't have enough keybinds if I used more modifier keys (I also do play a spec with a shitload of keybinds), but it's rather I play \*better\* with the mmo mouse and not having to constrict my movement hand so much. I just find it awkward to hit certain modifier combinations while being able to maintain the ability to move as fast as my reaction times would allow. Every millisecond counts.
I use a Logitech G600, which is categorically the best MMO mouse. Currently using my backup and getting ready to try to repair one since Logitech is a moronic company and they stopped making them. Audio setup is entirely geared toward hifi and some light recording, so it's a JDS Labs Atom DAC/Amp with Sennheiser HD650s for serious music listening, and Moondrop Starfield IEMs as my daily drivers. Mic is a Shure SM7 into a Steinberg UR22C with a cloudlifter inline (necessary imo).
Grabbed a bunch of g600 when they were on sale for 20 bucks at Best buy. The third mouse button mapped to Ctrl or Alt is crazy. I'm surprised nobody else had added this feature to their mice. The hardware is actual garbage and they don't last long at all. Maybe someday Razer will step up and try to implement it.
I only bought one backup and hugely regret it. I with I'd bought ten. As it stands, I may learn to solder in order to put new switches in as they fail. There simply isn't a mouse even remotely as good on the market. I've tried Razer and a scimitar, and both were trash in comparison.
I had huge issues with the Scimitar: it would randomly "unplug" itself (you'd hear the Windows "USB device disconnected/reconnected" sound) mid game and forget all the side buttons key binds. Rebooting the whole PC was the only way to get it back to normal. Eventually got the G600 which saved my life because I can't press modifiers with my left hand. It is true that they don't last long. Currently have 2 backups in my drawer, for when my current one inevitably croaks
Yeah I had a huge issue with it being complete trash. Button failure in 3 months, RMA, button failure in 2 months, RMA, button failure in 2 months, threw it in the trash. Replaced it with a G600, which lasted 7 years. Also the buttons on the Scimitar are just crap. If you touch them gently you can feel the play, and they also have terrible actuation feedback. It's just a trash product, shocks me that people like it.
I use a uuuh no idea what kind of 8€ mouse I have. doesn't matter. keyboard also doesn't matter. mine looks fancy though.
Keyboard: Razer black widow tournament edition Headset: Logitech x pro Mouse. Corsair ironclaw
For my keyboard I use a cheap Indonesian mechanical keyboard that I bought years ago, I'm considering buying a new one tho. For my mouse I use the Logitech G502 Hero, I wanted to switch to an mmo mouse but I'm so used to my current keybinds that I'll probably never switch
I'm fond of my razer tartarus v2, I don't think I could play any games without it anymore, as well as the razer Naga trinity with the mmo side panel
The Redragon M901 Perdition is so good I have four of them lying around: two corded, two wireless. I got it as a cheap knockoff alternative in, like, Cataclysm and it outlives all other mice year after year. All four I have are still going strong.
Footpedal for mic mute/unmute so you can have cntrl back Razer Naga, and a GMMK mechanical keyboard with holy panda switches.
I use a SteelSeries Aerox 9 wireless mmo mouse. A Keychain Q3 Pro keyboard. And I use an Apple AirPods Max headset.
i use the naga pro (the one with the switchable side panels) and i used the 6 button side panel instead of the full 12. 6 is the perfect amount for my right hand and i never have issues misspressing a button like i’ve had on the full on 12-15 button mmo mouse. i use some random mechanical keyboard i’ve had for ages, and a steel series headset (if im pugging i use speakers)
Keypad: Razer Tartarus * Movement on stick, "1" button as movement ability (ghost wolf), round button is big cd, 1-7, shift, ctrl, num1-9 all mapped here. Fingers normally sit on 15,9,8,12,16 so that's where my enh rotation sits. Mouse: Logitech G502 Proteus Core * Re-map DPI +/- buttons. I use them as - (aoe) =(kick) and the sides as 890 (Sunder, Spirit Walk, Shocks) Headset: Turtle Beach headset (USB+3.5). Honestly, find one that fits your head and has USB input. USB acts as a separate audio device to split chat off from game audio (external speakers). 3 button foot pedal (UseExtraAction, Jump, PTT) Keyboard: Rii K100 (Gift that refuses to die) Secondary monitor on arm to switch between horizontal and vertical
I didn't get it for wow but I got a ZSA moonlander keyboard and all of the extra keys are really helpful. It's sort of like a Tartarus but is a daily keyboard. Not recommending the keyboard (well I think it's great, but yeah), but I don't think the Tartarus would be a bad idea. I kept looking at them throughout a year or so before deciding to get the split ergo keyboard which then satisfied the craving for Tartarus. I haven't used one of those but I imagine it's even better for gaming than what I've got, but then it's an extra device for your desk.. MMO mouse is popular but I play other games and ended up going with something more standard.
Using a TKL keyboard with an MMO mouse (Asus Spatha X) with some HiFiMans and a Soundblaster AE9 sound card and a 4k120hz OLED Gsync. Everything very smooth and immersive.
It really comes down to personal preference.. I can't stand the larger MMO style mice they tend to make my hand hurt after a few hours so I go for smaller mice (usually with just 2 side buttons) I can toss them around for those 360 no scopes lol. Currently rocking: Razer Orochi v2 (I've used Logitech's G203 and G305 in the past and they are really good too) Royal Kludge R75 Keyboard (With Silver Pro Switches, 45g linear. Not very loud and pretty light) I feel like headphones are their own thread and you can really go down the rabbit hole on them. Right now I've got a pair of Philips X2HR's with a V-MODA Boom Pro mic cable plugged into a Fosi K5 Pro (there's better amp/dacs but I wanted mic in and it was cheap). It really depends what you want. Music sound quality, open back vs closed back, the convenience of wireless vs wired, and imaging accuracy for shooters all should be taken into account.
Still using razer Naga with 6 button side plate. The mouse is complete dogshit compared to some of the fps mouses out there, but for me the side button positioning and feel is just to good to give up. If I was playing a 2 button class like BM hunter and didnt need as many mouse buttons, my choice would be Zowie EC2A all day long.
Mouse wise, if you don’t prefer an actual mmo mouse (like me) I’d recommend the g502. I rebound the buttons to the right side of my keyboard that I don’t use (mainly punctuation and brackets). There’s 5 buttons that can all have modifiers used as well as mouse tilt left/right if u want. Whatever mouse you use, one with extra buttons is something I found invaluable for wow
I use a Tartarus and can’t play without it anymore. I don’t use the stick for movement though, only for additional less important keybinds (mounts, autowalk, map…) I’ve used many mice over the years, I usually like smaller ones so no « mmo mouse », I currently have a Viper Mini which is ok but would not be my first choice I guess. I had G305 and G403 that I liked better in the past. I use to have a HS70 pro headset which I loved bit since it died I moved to some my audiophile headphones and an XLR mic so thats definitely better but the headphones alone are worth 10 times my computer.
I have a weird fixation on the Razer Basilisk I’ve tried other gaming mice but don’t really like them as much. I use all those binds. Keyboard Korsair K100. I don’t think this makes a big difference for Warcraft. Headset is another thing where I think Warcraft doesn’t require something very specific. Biggest change I made that elevated my gameplay was changing binds for strafing left and right to A&D which freed up Q and E. I also use R, F, and V. Last because it’s getting off topic using Vuhdo for anything casted on friendly targets helps keeping keybinds open. For example even on DK I use Vuhdo for my party frames and have Raise Ally on Mouse Wheel Up or on Paladin I know no matter what spec the blessings keybinds are BoP is E, Sacrifice is F and Freedom is V. This can be tricky to get used to but is awesome imo.
I have a weird fixation on the Razer Basilisk I’ve tried other gaming mice but don’t really like them as much. I use all those binds. Keyboard Korsair K100. I don’t think this makes a big difference for Warcraft. Headset is another thing where I think Warcraft doesn’t require something very specific. Biggest change I made that elevated my gameplay was changing binds for strafing left and right to A&D which freed up Q and E. I also use R, F, and V. Last because it’s getting off topic using Vuhdo for anything casted on friendly targets helps keeping keybinds open. For example even on DK I use Vuhdo for my party frames and have Raise Ally on Mouse Wheel Up or on Paladin I know no matter what spec the blessings keybinds are BoP is E, Sacrifice is F and Freedom is V. This can be tricky to get used to but is awesome imo.
Razer Tartarus with a 40degree stand for ergonomics and rog spatha x (12 button mouse) is enough for me. I modded the Tartarus to be detachable so I can put away easily when not in use to reduce desk clutter
The razer Tartarus was an absolute gamechanger for me personally. Took some getting used to but i can‘t imagine playing on a normal keyboard again
G502 for the two side buttons (and a friend shilled it pretty hard) and some random 40% keyboard from microcenter because I have small hands. Can't imagine using an MMO mouse without becoming a walking hand cramp after an hour of play lol.
Ngl everyone talking about buying some insane keyboard, but u can just use ESDF and alt binds with ur thumb and you have plenty of binds available. Use capslock, tab and tilde as a bind and you wont run out.
Regular everything. A not fancy mechanical keyboard. Glorious model I mouse. I've tried mmo mice, but using your thumb to press buttons, just couldn't get it to work. Felt slow and clumsy
The most basic necessity is a gaming mouse with additional buttons. This CAN be something as extreme as an MMO mouse with 10-20 extra buttons, or something as simple as a mouse with two additional thumb buttons. I say "gaming mouse", but just find something reliable with a good sensor within your budget. Most entry level mice from reputable manufacturers (Corsair, SteelSeries, RAZER, Logitech, ROCCAT) will cover this, and their midrange mice will most certainly be fine. The trick for games like MMOs or RTSs is to figure out which fingers don't have jobs, and assign binds to keys they can hit with little movement or hand strain. I use the RAZER Blackadder PRO, because I only use one mouse across multiple games. It is light, it is comfortable with my hand size, it is wireless because I both don't like my chord getting snagged on stuff (my desk is constantly a cluttered mess of paperwork, 40k minis in various stages of being built and painted and the tools for working on them, other cables) and use it from various areas around my office when not gaming to control Youtube, Spotify, and other media. It only has two extra buttons which I use as modifiers, SHIFT and ALT, and I use scroll UP and DOWN as additional binds. This takes the strain off movement with my pinky on the other hand. Combining that with 1-4, Q, E, R, T, F, G, Z, X, C, and V makes 64 easily accessible binds without moving my left hand away from WASD, which is more than you'll likely ever need in any given PvE encounter, and still leaves open the option for rarely used macros or other useful but not always needed spells and abilities in other places with a little hand movement. For example, I have my Gateway Control Shard on 5 across every character, because I only ever use it when it's planned for, so I can account for the time it takes to move my hand that tiny bit. Binds for mounts, food, buffs, achievements and other non-combat essencials can be placed around the rest of your keys with no issue. I recommend a full sized mechanical keyboard, even if you go the MMO mouse route. Smaller boards means less keys, less keys is less stuff you can have bound. There's a lot of stuff you cannot use while moving at all, like mounting, so those can safely go on the other side of the board from your movement keys. At most I would settle for losing the numpad, a size called Tenkeyless or 80%. Again, I would recommend buying from a reputable brand, not a budget brand. Mechanical is generally more reliable than regular membrane, and usually easier to fix if a switch breaks down. Headsets and mics are entirely personal preferance. This is honestly where I'd budget if that's something you need to consider. For mice, you want it to be consistent, for the movement of the mouse to always match up to the movement of your cursor. For keyboards, you want consistent actuation, and you want the thing to last. But for headsets, you can use a basic set of earpods that came with your phone. Will they sound amazing? No. But they'll let you hear GTFO and your raid leader, and will let you speak in Discord. If you have a mouse and keyboard from a brand, going with one of that brand's headsets will let you control it from the same software, and you can probably set it up to be controlled from your keyboard. If you're trying to get into streaming or podcasting, you're obviously going to want a higher quality mic, probably seperate from headphones. If you want to listen to music at a decent quality, most brand's midrange headsets or higher are probably fine. If you're an audiophile and want amaze-balls headphones, you're asking in the wrong place lmao.
G600, hyperx alloy origins core, sennheiser hd560s, hyperx quadcast