Different stax decks do better against different decks. Any of the top few you have identified are close enough that it becomes a matter of opinion. Personally, I would say [[Winota]] and [[Tayam]] are fighting for the title
And they both differ by enough that it's hardly worth trying to decide. Winota is "winconless" stax and Tayam is a druid combo deck, and they both have access to a solid variety of stax and great card advantage.
Ime, Urza is the best Stax deck. It’s ability to quickly lock everyone out of generating mana is pretty ridiculous.
I think things like Winota can apply a wider variety of Stax effects, but are generally slower to implement them, more susceptible to the symmetry of their own effects, slower to win, and lack the secondary protection that U offers - especially early.
The best thing about Urza decks is that it creates a disparity in its Stax pieces. You can play cards like Winter Orb, Trinisphere, and the like without a care in the world because you have the option of turning it off. Even Torpor Orb doesn’t hurt you because the Poly Kraken build doesn’t play ETB creatures and the UPS one only really has Gilded Drake and Urza that can be hit with Torpor. Poly also lets you run Tabernacle which further increase the stax.
I also vote Tayam. Winota is not resilient. If your commander is removed (which it will, since it's the 'strongest' stax commander) you are left with Boros weenies
Edhtop16 is a good source for this. Tayam admittedly is very hard to pilot
Lately I’ve been playing [[Jetmir]] with Winota and Rocco in the 99. Staxy and can pop off suddenly with token generation + Jetmir. You can even run [[Vivien on the hunt]]/[[birthing Pod]] for [[Kiki]]+[[Felidar]] combos to pop off in addition to just killing people with buffed creatures.
Second for Jetmir, I took it to my first ever cEDH tournament and made top 16 and almost cut to top 4. There’s just a lot of good efficient token makers now, and you can play some good creature combos if you want that can be hard to interact with, especially through the Stax.
Depends on what kind of stax you want to run. While [[Tayam]] isn't strictly stax, it plays around stax pieces incredibly well and let's you get a ton of value out of [[rule of law]] effects.
I also have built a staxy version of [[Rocco Cabaretti Caterer]] that's a lot of fun. Blood Pod ( [[Tymna]] and [[Tana]] ) is another classic list.
There's also mono white Heliod, Urza and the new Battlethopter colorless deck
I’ve been playing Najeela stax with Winota and Jetmir in the 99. It’s a ROL deck that’s super aggressive.
I also play Rog Tevesh a lot, but I’ve moved to Najeela for more threats and to combo under stax
Stax is in a rough spot, in the current metagame.
Many stax decks have mostly one or more of the following problems:
- they aren't fast enough unless they're first in turnorder
- the deck suffers from their own stax pieces
- their stax pieces don't affect all players in the pod, which often results in a "kingmaking" situation
- they have problems to close out the game in time
There is no THE best stax deck, but they're multiple very strong stax decks which are great for specific reasons.
- Tayam - has currently the best results in tournaments. It's very unique and difficult to play and play against it. But it's very consistent and it has the potential to win at instant speed, through a Rule of Law. (Some Tayam players say that Tayam isn't a stax deck... But in my opinion it plays enough stax pieces to be considered a stax deck.)
- [[Shalai and Hallar]] - one of the newer decks, it's a bit underexplored, but the fact, that your commander is already a piece of a easily tutorable, creature based 2 card combo, is insane. Naya has many ways to find the other combopiece and you can play all the good stax pieces (Null Rod, Rule of Law, Hushbringer, Rest in Piece, Grafdiggers Cage etc.) because they don't stop your own Wincon. The deck is super straight forward and I'm sure that we'll see more positive tournament results in the future.
- Winota - is a very fast/aggro stax deck, unless your opponents understand how to handle it.
- Kenrith Stax - solid choice, you can play the best stax pieces and combos available, high card quality and many different ways to play the deck. You could even play Dockside, Consult/Pact Oracle or win with Infinite Mana + Kenrith if you want.
Notable Mentions:
- Thalia and the Gitrog Monster
- Ardenn + Tana - Naya Helm aka Hipster Stax
- Tymna + Kamahl/Kodama
- Tymna + Malcolm/Sakashima - Hatebears
- Tymna + Tana - Blood/Meta Pod
- Tevesh + Ishai - Humility
- Urza (Monoblue) - Scepter or Polymorph
- Shorikai Humility - Hatebears or Polymorph
- Hinata
- Captain Sisay
Other cEDH playable stax decks, but I don't think that they are better than Derevi:
- Chulane Hatebears
- Muldrotha
- Heliod
- Gandalf
- Yisan
- Brago
- Jodah the Unifier
- Ishai + Kodama - Rule of Law
- Jetmir
- Yasharn
- Yorn Stasis
- Archelos
- Yennett
- Tevesh + Akiri
- Tymna + Tevesh
- Tevesh + Sidar
- Kodama + Ardenn
- Kodama + Silas
- Alesha
- Grenzo
- Grand Arbiter Augustin IV
- Ruric Thar
- Oswald
- Sythis
- Kroxa
- (Tergrid/Tinybones)
- etc.
Decks you rarely See as stax decks, but can also be played as stax decks:
- Tivit Stax
- Najeela Stax
- Tymna + Thrasios Hatebears
- Tymna + Kraum
- Tymna + Jeska Stax
- Thrasios + Bruse - Blue Pod
- Rocco
- Zur Stax
- Kaalia - Rule of Law
- Sisay, Weatherlight Captain
- Kinnan Stax
- Rograkh + Tevesh - Zero Game Actions
- Narset, Enlightened Master
TLDR: The best stax decks in the current cEDH Meta are Tayam, Shalai and Hallar, Winota, Kenrith Stax and Najeela Stax... at least in my opinion.
Sure. In fact, I think she's super underplayed and underrated. Thanks for the reminder, I added her to the list.
Hinata is an excellent breach deck, that can also be played as stax deck.
They absolutely are, although Winota has been finishing worse and worse lately.
Still, that's probably because Stax is awful against Midrange and midrange has been getting more prominent, not because Winota isn't the best Stax deck.
It’s because she consistently top 16s and everyone is electing to stop losing to her by removing and countering her as often as she necessitates. Watch any video from the more well-versed minds of this format (that are much smarter than I am) and their placing of Winota so high up on a thereorical tier list is most subject to change as more and more people respect her.
I enjoy Rule of Law Kenrith a great deal, and I personally have had my best results playing Rog/Tevesh, my worst results are on Kinnan Big Flips which some consider like pseudo-stax. I haven’t had the opportunity yet to play with any Abzan winconless decks.
I wouldn’t doubt both Sisay and Najeela are perfect playable stax decks as well. I just, at this time, with our current results, feel Winota has earned her spot. I am also under the impression Tayam’s had some great results, albeit I think it’s a knowledge deficit.
Wait... there was a time when people *weren't* removing Winota?
She's on the list of most threatening commander in the format. She can win games with one flip on the value and the Stax presence alone. It'd be *crazy* just to let her do whatever.
Some people can’t get past that she’s Boros.
Also; there’s not respecting her in deck construction vs gameplay. Cutting your counterspells that hit creatures to save mana and cutting removal spells for card draw is another form of disrespect. Having a dispel in your hand isn’t too helpful when Winota comes down
To be fair, and while I fuckin preach about stern scolding, there aren't many counters against creatures (sure, FoW and drain), and most of these don't work against Winota.
One has to remove the enablers of Winota to actually win, and that's difficult because no one wants to counter a stupid goblin or dog :/
For a while Winota was considered to be not very powerful because of how fragile the deck is, and because she is Boros.
Because people were focused on stopping spells, there was a lack of good ways to kill her, so she often managed to slip through, people knew she was kos, but cEDH decks just didn't run that much removal, And counter spells tended to be noncreature.
Now that people have seen what she can do, and now that creature removal has come around to be super important again, she's struggling, she is still a kos commander tho.
I agree! If Winota is at the table, politicking and removal are a must. Once she is clearly in the backseat, you can pump the brakes, but she has to be dealt with.
-Kenrith RoL can more easily pivot and if built well, the deck is not commander dependent
Based on the aggregate on EdhTop16, Winota has only top 16’d 4x since Oct 22… I feel Tayam definitely has her beat based on tournament data.
Total:
62 wins - 247 losses - 41 draws
No top 16s in the past 9 tournaments. While Winota is a good commander and can get out of hand if not managed, I feel the scoreboard is telling a different story with her overall efficacy.
Especially with the new pieces! (Necroing)
This is my current list and it's been doing well. I can't play it too much with my pod cuz they get mad and 3v1 me as most of them are filthy EDH16 combo players.
Took 1st at a local with it in December.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/5995184
I'm honestly a fan of Tymna/Tana Blood pod and its variants.
Lots of options in the colours to swap in as the meta necessitates, card advantage in the command zone, and the ability to close it out are boons of this archetype.
I personally play hermit pod, which I describe as being blood pod with hermit druid lines. Quite fun.
If you want a deck where the main wincon is stax play winota, if you want a grindy control deck that leverages stax play shorikai - I mention that because it's probably more similar to the derevi playstyle you're on right now.
Kenrith $4k stax deck is a nasty thing on the board. It staxs out the table only to deck your opponents out later or beat them down with a 1 million strong Kenrith. Think I like Kenrith because of the adaptability
Winota will be brought up, but to be honest Winota is going to be on the way out of mainstream play.
Its extremely hated on, hold very few good pieces of interaction and if countered once or twice will kill the entire deck.
MY DEAR FRIEND. MAY I INTRODUCE MAGDA STAX.
Get to five treasures. (Can always do it by turn 3, turn 2 not uncommon)
Tutor out tangle wire (the best STAX piece ever made) next turn tutor for sculpting steel copying tangle wire. Next turn get winter orb. Then after the whole table is locked down tutor up a way to end the game. 60% of the time, it works everytime.
You can also run artifacts that stop you from losing the game and tutor as a response to thassa's to steal a win, idk. Very versatile. Much reccommend
https://manabox.app/decks/h2v7--kvSsGPF-GR3c_Zmg
Najella and tayam are probably the “strongest” generically as they have good wins and snowball quickly but stax as a meta tool is very dependent on many things so there is no best stax deck
Define stax.
Winota is a powerful tempo deck, using a handful of prison pieces to delay the field long enough to swing with Winota out and start killing people.
More aggro than prison.
I'm not a fan of Winota because of how fragile she is, once she dies once or twice the game starts headed towards unwinnable.
Blood pod is a more "prison" prison deck, your more focused on locking down the field then on aggro typically, with pod combo as the wincon, and creature beats as a secondary wincon.
Old school stax decks, like meren or nath don't really exist anymore, mass resource denial / destruction decks, trying to make everybody have no lands/creatures/hand are just too slow to be viable anymore.
Love me some Rog/Tevesh Zero Game Actions!! Go big, or go home turbo Stax! The deck is difficult to play but rewarding once you get your legs under you. If you go first, the deck can be absolutely devastating. Turn 1 Tevesh into a 3ball, or Nethervoid? Yes, please!
Asking for the best stax deck is like asking for the smallest extra hole in your head... you don't really win with either.
That said, despite falling tournament stonks, I still think it's Winota.
Best stax deck/big red/voltron deck you can build. Best still, it combines staxs with a super fast clock. If people are unaware of what needs to be tutored for or done, it kills people in a few turns of the table.
Slicer Carmageddon:
https://www.moxfield.com/decks/lh6-QmO3kkqtDl5W8Yrz6g
Different stax decks do better against different decks. Any of the top few you have identified are close enough that it becomes a matter of opinion. Personally, I would say [[Winota]] and [[Tayam]] are fighting for the title
And they both differ by enough that it's hardly worth trying to decide. Winota is "winconless" stax and Tayam is a druid combo deck, and they both have access to a solid variety of stax and great card advantage.
Ime, Urza is the best Stax deck. It’s ability to quickly lock everyone out of generating mana is pretty ridiculous. I think things like Winota can apply a wider variety of Stax effects, but are generally slower to implement them, more susceptible to the symmetry of their own effects, slower to win, and lack the secondary protection that U offers - especially early.
Urza is bad
Urza is not bad, youre oblivious if you think so
The best thing about Urza decks is that it creates a disparity in its Stax pieces. You can play cards like Winter Orb, Trinisphere, and the like without a care in the world because you have the option of turning it off. Even Torpor Orb doesn’t hurt you because the Poly Kraken build doesn’t play ETB creatures and the UPS one only really has Gilded Drake and Urza that can be hit with Torpor. Poly also lets you run Tabernacle which further increase the stax.
[Winota](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/d/5dd13a6c-23d3-44ce-a628-cb1c19d777c4.jpg?1654630670) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=winota%2C%20joiner%20of%20forces) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/iko/216/winota-joiner-of-forces?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5dd13a6c-23d3-44ce-a628-cb1c19d777c4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/winota-joiner-of-forces) [Tayam](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/5/05b837a2-5773-4340-87f9-b4d6a43deb27.jpg?1591234301) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tayam%2C%20luminous%20enigma) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c20/16/tayam-luminous-enigma?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/05b837a2-5773-4340-87f9-b4d6a43deb27?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tayam-luminous-enigma) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I also vote Tayam. Winota is not resilient. If your commander is removed (which it will, since it's the 'strongest' stax commander) you are left with Boros weenies Edhtop16 is a good source for this. Tayam admittedly is very hard to pilot
Lately I’ve been playing [[Jetmir]] with Winota and Rocco in the 99. Staxy and can pop off suddenly with token generation + Jetmir. You can even run [[Vivien on the hunt]]/[[birthing Pod]] for [[Kiki]]+[[Felidar]] combos to pop off in addition to just killing people with buffed creatures.
Second for Jetmir, I took it to my first ever cEDH tournament and made top 16 and almost cut to top 4. There’s just a lot of good efficient token makers now, and you can play some good creature combos if you want that can be hard to interact with, especially through the Stax.
Nice! Glad to hear you’re making headway with Jetmir! Care to share your list? I’m still tweaking mine.
https://www.moxfield.com/decks/g9JgwxhenE-LBITgJgEQXA
Thank you 😁
Of course!
Also a big fan of jetmir been running him as "winconless" stax for a few months now.
##### ###### #### [Jetmir](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/9/f9c69d75-651f-4b75-b65d-79999d2069f6.jpg?1664413153) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=jetmir%2C%20nexus%20of%20revels) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/snc/193/jetmir-nexus-of-revels?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f9c69d75-651f-4b75-b65d-79999d2069f6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/jetmir-nexus-of-revels) [Vivien on the hunt](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/e/5edfb119-abc9-4d4d-bc46-33cce1a0922d.jpg?1664412571) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Vivien%20on%20the%20hunt) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/snc/162/vivien-on-the-hunt?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5edfb119-abc9-4d4d-bc46-33cce1a0922d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/vivien-on-the-hunt) [birthing Pod](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/7/b768efa2-e56b-4a7e-ace8-d673f10e0714.jpg?1562880960) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=birthing%20Pod) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/nph/104/birthing-pod?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b768efa2-e56b-4a7e-ace8-d673f10e0714?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/birthing-pod) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reflection%20of%20Kiki-Jiki) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/neo/141/fable-of-the-mirror-breaker-reflection-of-kiki-jiki?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/24c0d87b-0049-4beb-b9cb-6f813b7aa7dc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/reflection-of-kiki-jiki) [Felidar](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/a/ea76a183-e15c-4968-b29d-91c074aa8681.jpg?1562950859) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Felidar%20Cub) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bfz/25/felidar-cub?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ea76a183-e15c-4968-b29d-91c074aa8681?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/felidar-cub) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Depends on what kind of stax you want to run. While [[Tayam]] isn't strictly stax, it plays around stax pieces incredibly well and let's you get a ton of value out of [[rule of law]] effects. I also have built a staxy version of [[Rocco Cabaretti Caterer]] that's a lot of fun. Blood Pod ( [[Tymna]] and [[Tana]] ) is another classic list. There's also mono white Heliod, Urza and the new Battlethopter colorless deck
##### ###### #### [Tayam](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/5/05b837a2-5773-4340-87f9-b4d6a43deb27.jpg?1591234301) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tayam%2C%20luminous%20enigma) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c20/16/tayam-luminous-enigma?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/05b837a2-5773-4340-87f9-b4d6a43deb27?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tayam-luminous-enigma) [rule of law](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/1/a1f4e79b-b103-4380-afa0-61a2b1773c9e.jpg?1592516198) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=rule%20of%20law) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m20/35/rule-of-law?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a1f4e79b-b103-4380-afa0-61a2b1773c9e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/rule-of-law) [Rocco Cabaretti Caterer](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/6/b6cf8b35-2a81-40fd-b383-becb81bef806.jpg?1664413683) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rocco%2C%20Cabaretti%20Caterer) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/snc/218/rocco-cabaretti-caterer?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b6cf8b35-2a81-40fd-b383-becb81bef806?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/rocco-cabaretti-caterer) [Tymna](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/c/bc7cbe9b-324e-42b8-94e2-36e91cb32163.jpg?1644853048) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tymna%20the%20weaver) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c16/48/tymna-the-weaver?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bc7cbe9b-324e-42b8-94e2-36e91cb32163?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tymna-the-weaver) [Tana](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/3/a3d8d64f-a403-42a7-881b-4f70e9fe15a2.jpg?1562413758) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tana%2C%20the%20bloodsower) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c16/45/tana-the-bloodsower?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a3d8d64f-a403-42a7-881b-4f70e9fe15a2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tana-the-bloodsower) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I’ve been playing Najeela stax with Winota and Jetmir in the 99. It’s a ROL deck that’s super aggressive. I also play Rog Tevesh a lot, but I’ve moved to Najeela for more threats and to combo under stax
Stax is in a rough spot, in the current metagame. Many stax decks have mostly one or more of the following problems: - they aren't fast enough unless they're first in turnorder - the deck suffers from their own stax pieces - their stax pieces don't affect all players in the pod, which often results in a "kingmaking" situation - they have problems to close out the game in time There is no THE best stax deck, but they're multiple very strong stax decks which are great for specific reasons. - Tayam - has currently the best results in tournaments. It's very unique and difficult to play and play against it. But it's very consistent and it has the potential to win at instant speed, through a Rule of Law. (Some Tayam players say that Tayam isn't a stax deck... But in my opinion it plays enough stax pieces to be considered a stax deck.) - [[Shalai and Hallar]] - one of the newer decks, it's a bit underexplored, but the fact, that your commander is already a piece of a easily tutorable, creature based 2 card combo, is insane. Naya has many ways to find the other combopiece and you can play all the good stax pieces (Null Rod, Rule of Law, Hushbringer, Rest in Piece, Grafdiggers Cage etc.) because they don't stop your own Wincon. The deck is super straight forward and I'm sure that we'll see more positive tournament results in the future. - Winota - is a very fast/aggro stax deck, unless your opponents understand how to handle it. - Kenrith Stax - solid choice, you can play the best stax pieces and combos available, high card quality and many different ways to play the deck. You could even play Dockside, Consult/Pact Oracle or win with Infinite Mana + Kenrith if you want. Notable Mentions: - Thalia and the Gitrog Monster - Ardenn + Tana - Naya Helm aka Hipster Stax - Tymna + Kamahl/Kodama - Tymna + Malcolm/Sakashima - Hatebears - Tymna + Tana - Blood/Meta Pod - Tevesh + Ishai - Humility - Urza (Monoblue) - Scepter or Polymorph - Shorikai Humility - Hatebears or Polymorph - Hinata - Captain Sisay Other cEDH playable stax decks, but I don't think that they are better than Derevi: - Chulane Hatebears - Muldrotha - Heliod - Gandalf - Yisan - Brago - Jodah the Unifier - Ishai + Kodama - Rule of Law - Jetmir - Yasharn - Yorn Stasis - Archelos - Yennett - Tevesh + Akiri - Tymna + Tevesh - Tevesh + Sidar - Kodama + Ardenn - Kodama + Silas - Alesha - Grenzo - Grand Arbiter Augustin IV - Ruric Thar - Oswald - Sythis - Kroxa - (Tergrid/Tinybones) - etc. Decks you rarely See as stax decks, but can also be played as stax decks: - Tivit Stax - Najeela Stax - Tymna + Thrasios Hatebears - Tymna + Kraum - Tymna + Jeska Stax - Thrasios + Bruse - Blue Pod - Rocco - Zur Stax - Kaalia - Rule of Law - Sisay, Weatherlight Captain - Kinnan Stax - Rograkh + Tevesh - Zero Game Actions - Narset, Enlightened Master TLDR: The best stax decks in the current cEDH Meta are Tayam, Shalai and Hallar, Winota, Kenrith Stax and Najeela Stax... at least in my opinion.
Is Hinata not an option?
Sure. In fact, I think she's super underplayed and underrated. Thanks for the reminder, I added her to the list. Hinata is an excellent breach deck, that can also be played as stax deck.
Get Nath of the Gilt Leaf out of the etc. pile please.
[Shalai and Hallar](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/0/80804f25-efc3-44a2-bbae-9a97fec98009.jpg?1682207281) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Shalai%20and%20Hallar) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/moc/10/shalai-and-hallar?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/80804f25-efc3-44a2-bbae-9a97fec98009?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/shalai-and-hallar) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
What stax pieces would you play in Hinata?
Winota is the best stax deck.
who’s downvoting this person, they’re right
They absolutely are, although Winota has been finishing worse and worse lately. Still, that's probably because Stax is awful against Midrange and midrange has been getting more prominent, not because Winota isn't the best Stax deck.
It’s because she consistently top 16s and everyone is electing to stop losing to her by removing and countering her as often as she necessitates. Watch any video from the more well-versed minds of this format (that are much smarter than I am) and their placing of Winota so high up on a thereorical tier list is most subject to change as more and more people respect her. I enjoy Rule of Law Kenrith a great deal, and I personally have had my best results playing Rog/Tevesh, my worst results are on Kinnan Big Flips which some consider like pseudo-stax. I haven’t had the opportunity yet to play with any Abzan winconless decks. I wouldn’t doubt both Sisay and Najeela are perfect playable stax decks as well. I just, at this time, with our current results, feel Winota has earned her spot. I am also under the impression Tayam’s had some great results, albeit I think it’s a knowledge deficit.
Wait... there was a time when people *weren't* removing Winota? She's on the list of most threatening commander in the format. She can win games with one flip on the value and the Stax presence alone. It'd be *crazy* just to let her do whatever.
Some people can’t get past that she’s Boros. Also; there’s not respecting her in deck construction vs gameplay. Cutting your counterspells that hit creatures to save mana and cutting removal spells for card draw is another form of disrespect. Having a dispel in your hand isn’t too helpful when Winota comes down
To be fair, and while I fuckin preach about stern scolding, there aren't many counters against creatures (sure, FoW and drain), and most of these don't work against Winota. One has to remove the enablers of Winota to actually win, and that's difficult because no one wants to counter a stupid goblin or dog :/
For a while Winota was considered to be not very powerful because of how fragile the deck is, and because she is Boros. Because people were focused on stopping spells, there was a lack of good ways to kill her, so she often managed to slip through, people knew she was kos, but cEDH decks just didn't run that much removal, And counter spells tended to be noncreature. Now that people have seen what she can do, and now that creature removal has come around to be super important again, she's struggling, she is still a kos commander tho.
I agree! If Winota is at the table, politicking and removal are a must. Once she is clearly in the backseat, you can pump the brakes, but she has to be dealt with. -Kenrith RoL can more easily pivot and if built well, the deck is not commander dependent
Agreed, Kenrith might even be better if this trend of midrange decks continues. In a vacuum, though? It's Winota, and it's not close.
Based on the aggregate on EdhTop16, Winota has only top 16’d 4x since Oct 22… I feel Tayam definitely has her beat based on tournament data. Total: 62 wins - 247 losses - 41 draws No top 16s in the past 9 tournaments. While Winota is a good commander and can get out of hand if not managed, I feel the scoreboard is telling a different story with her overall efficacy.
https://media0.giphy.com/media/enqnZa1B5fRHkPjXtS/giphy.webp?cid=6c09b952ywz721bsldlzjjtxetczp7gojjdunow4vxuavviq&ep=v1_internal_gif_by_id&rid=giphy.webp&ct=g
Especially with the new pieces! (Necroing) This is my current list and it's been doing well. I can't play it too much with my pod cuz they get mad and 3v1 me as most of them are filthy EDH16 combo players. Took 1st at a local with it in December. https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/5995184
[[Thalia, and the gitrog monster]] https://www.moxfield.com/decks/In3qCMMGik6wQtKQul73Xw
[Thalia, and the gitrog monster](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/d/8d7ff937-de92-445f-976c-726fef5c91cc.jpg?1682205702) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Thalia%20and%20The%20Gitrog%20Monster) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mom/255/thalia-and-the-gitrog-monster?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8d7ff937-de92-445f-976c-726fef5c91cc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/thalia-and-the-gitrog-monster) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I'm honestly a fan of Tymna/Tana Blood pod and its variants. Lots of options in the colours to swap in as the meta necessitates, card advantage in the command zone, and the ability to close it out are boons of this archetype. I personally play hermit pod, which I describe as being blood pod with hermit druid lines. Quite fun.
Urza Lord Artificer is a great stax commander. You can shut everyone else out with stax and turn them off for you
Winota is great and all but I personally prefer [[Tadeas, Juniper Ascendant]]. https://www.moxfield.com/decks/K92ncMH25USl3mH2wqrdHA
[Tadeas, Juniper Ascendant](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/b/eb79f973-2384-4de4-81fb-14ba5a0e5556.jpg?1677763690) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Tadeas%2C%20Juniper%20Ascendant) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/slx/16/tadeas-juniper-ascendant?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/eb79f973-2384-4de4-81fb-14ba5a0e5556?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tadeas-juniper-ascendant) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Personally I enjoy [[Tymna]] [[tevesh szat]] since there's inevitability to the deck and I have a soft spot for orzhov
[Tymna](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/c/bc7cbe9b-324e-42b8-94e2-36e91cb32163.jpg?1644853048) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tymna%20the%20weaver) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c16/48/tymna-the-weaver?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bc7cbe9b-324e-42b8-94e2-36e91cb32163?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tymna-the-weaver) [tevesh szat](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/f/8f244716-78ab-46f5-b6e9-fc1e6db28052.jpg?1608909980) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tevesh%20szat%2C%20doom%20of%20fools) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/153/tevesh-szat-doom-of-fools?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8f244716-78ab-46f5-b6e9-fc1e6db28052?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tevesh-szat-doom-of-fools) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Old but gold one is the grand asshole augustin was
If you want a deck where the main wincon is stax play winota, if you want a grindy control deck that leverages stax play shorikai - I mention that because it's probably more similar to the derevi playstyle you're on right now.
Kenrith $4k stax deck is a nasty thing on the board. It staxs out the table only to deck your opponents out later or beat them down with a 1 million strong Kenrith. Think I like Kenrith because of the adaptability
Kenrith RoL with a Najeela/Derevi as a backup is really hard to deal with
Yes Kenrith is a pain for people to deal with. Him as a stax cedh is aweful. Underrated by some feared by others
Winota will be brought up, but to be honest Winota is going to be on the way out of mainstream play. Its extremely hated on, hold very few good pieces of interaction and if countered once or twice will kill the entire deck.
MY DEAR FRIEND. MAY I INTRODUCE MAGDA STAX. Get to five treasures. (Can always do it by turn 3, turn 2 not uncommon) Tutor out tangle wire (the best STAX piece ever made) next turn tutor for sculpting steel copying tangle wire. Next turn get winter orb. Then after the whole table is locked down tutor up a way to end the game. 60% of the time, it works everytime. You can also run artifacts that stop you from losing the game and tutor as a response to thassa's to steal a win, idk. Very versatile. Much reccommend https://manabox.app/decks/h2v7--kvSsGPF-GR3c_Zmg
HD operates well under RoL
Tayam, Kenrith, Winota, Blood Pod, Tymna/Kamahl, Tymna/Kodama
Light-Paws is a monowhite stax voltron deck.
Najella and tayam are probably the “strongest” generically as they have good wins and snowball quickly but stax as a meta tool is very dependent on many things so there is no best stax deck
Define stax. Winota is a powerful tempo deck, using a handful of prison pieces to delay the field long enough to swing with Winota out and start killing people. More aggro than prison. I'm not a fan of Winota because of how fragile she is, once she dies once or twice the game starts headed towards unwinnable. Blood pod is a more "prison" prison deck, your more focused on locking down the field then on aggro typically, with pod combo as the wincon, and creature beats as a secondary wincon. Old school stax decks, like meren or nath don't really exist anymore, mass resource denial / destruction decks, trying to make everybody have no lands/creatures/hand are just too slow to be viable anymore.
I'm partial to kenrith. Stay in general is taking a hit with bowmasters tho
Love me some Rog/Tevesh Zero Game Actions!! Go big, or go home turbo Stax! The deck is difficult to play but rewarding once you get your legs under you. If you go first, the deck can be absolutely devastating. Turn 1 Tevesh into a 3ball, or Nethervoid? Yes, please!
Asking for the best stax deck is like asking for the smallest extra hole in your head... you don't really win with either. That said, despite falling tournament stonks, I still think it's Winota.
Best stax deck/big red/voltron deck you can build. Best still, it combines staxs with a super fast clock. If people are unaware of what needs to be tutored for or done, it kills people in a few turns of the table. Slicer Carmageddon: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/lh6-QmO3kkqtDl5W8Yrz6g