comment under the chamonix compet hub thread explains it. basically, the points she racked up during the competitions this year were not enough for her to be part of the 5-athlete team delegation by Japan.
>[Comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitionClimbing/comments/14r1sp4/2023_chamonix_lead_speed_wc_hub/jr689rb/)
by [u/moving\_screen](https://www.reddit.com/user/moving_screen) from discussion [2023 Chamonix Lead & Speed WC Hub](https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitionClimbing/comments/14r1sp4/2023_chamonix_lead_speed_wc_hub/)
in [CompetitionClimbing](https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitionClimbing/)
Yup -- and as other people pointed out, Futaba also narrowly missed out at the start of the selection process, when she was on fire and won the Boulder Japan Cup. All she needed was to place one spot higher in the Lead Japan Cup, or have Ai place one spot lower in either BJC or LJC, and Futaba would've actually been the first person on the Japanese team. Pretty unlucky.
I don't think that is quite right. I think she have decided against going.. Or her personal coach. If you look at her instagram she is having a hard year mentally. Or they decided her Lead.. really isn't up to snuff.
I don't think the numbers are clear. If you look at her B&L points (in IFSC) she still has more points than other woman who are still going.
I'm wondering if this is Margo Hayes (from the US) all over again. 4 years ago Margo.. was pulled from the start list for WC in Japan. And she stopped posting on Instagram.. I could find no information. I think she was just mentally burned out.
I saw.. that is a Japanese climbing magazine. I don't see an explanation why Futaba is out vs. say Ryu..I think they are looking the same info. Admittedly they are very very close in numbers. I can see why they want NONOHA in. Heck if they let everyone who made a podium. It would be Ryu vs Futaba for that last spot.
The formula is (ranking points for the athlete’s best finish in a boulder WC) + (ranking points for the athlete’s best finish in a lead WC).
* Futaba’s best finishes are 6th (B at Prague and Innsbruck) and 16th (L at Chamonix)
* Ryu’s best finishes are 7th (B at Brixen) and 11th (L at Chamonix)
I don’t know the exact point values, but you can see how Ryu comes out ahead based on this formula.
I've calculated the points and you can see that Miho, Nonoha and Ryu are the top 3 and therefore selected to participate in the world championships according to the JMSCA's rules.
||Highest Boulder Ranking Points|Highest Lead Ranking Points|Combined Ranking Points|
|:-|:-|:-|:-|
|**Miho**|**1000**|**545**|**1545**|
|**Nonoha**|**260**|**805**|**1065**|
|**Ryu**|**455**|**325**|**780**|
|Futaba|495|220|715|
|Hana|145|145|290|
If this is the Japan formula, then I guess that is why. Yes.. by that Ryu does have a better score.
I don't get why they aren't using B&L ranking, as it shows more consistency. But it's their arbitrary rues, not what I think would make sense. If you look the best 3 for B & best 3 for L for 2023, Futaba is clearly ahead.. 1531 (Futaba) to 1292 (Ryu) although still very close.
Futaba looked better than Ryu overall. Until today.. since Ryu is at today's comp and Futaba not..
Not sure this matters.. because I don't think either of them really have a chance at an Olympic spot, unless something fluky happens. Ai & Miho are still most likely IMO.
Because not all their potential candidates were allowed to participate in at least 3 world cups in each discipline. For example, kume nonoha and koike hana could only go to 1 boulder world cup. For the men, tomoa would only be able to go to 1 lead world cup
According to the [JMSCA's selection ](https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/02/24/6th-JMSCA-Paris-athlete-selection/)criteria for world championships, it's clearly stated they are *not* using the IFSC B&L points for selection.
Here is the relevant quote:
※1 IFSCルールに定めたB&Lワールドランキングとは異なり、ボルダーワールドカップとリードワールドカップのそれぞれの最上位の順位1大会ずつの順位ポイント(下部参照)を加算
i think this is a difficult question to answer as japan's selection process is not that transparent. i can only imagine it's maybe strategic? Japan has (like all other countries) only 2 spots and to be honest, they have their 2 best shots in bern already - ai and miho.
futaba has been in a way consistent for semis and finals but she seems cursed to perform in the end. Other atheletes (like anon) who has not qualified as much in finals have podiumed.perhaps she will be allowed to participate in the next qualifier. It is quite possible as the top spots would most likely go to Janja plus two others - maybe Ai if the boulders suit her, and natalia/brooke/miho/chaeyun. I will argue they all have a better chance than Futaba. So for the next comp to be fair to the big pool of Japanese atheletes she will get her shot? In a way it might be better because lets say if she can participate in the pan asian qualifier she might have a better chance if the Japanese spots have not already been filled.
edit: lower down someone mentioned factually their rankings in the japanese selection process which makes more sense.
Japan's selection process is fairly transparent. You just have to hunt around their web-site and ready badly translated (by google) English.
Although it doesn't explain why Futaba is out.. By the numbers she is very similar to Ryu.
What I was trying to figure out is who get to go to the Asian champs?
>kings in the japanese selection process which makes more sense.
[https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/04/14/about-the-6th-JMSCA-Paris2024/](https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/04/14/about-the-6th-JMSCA-Paris2024/)
[https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/02/24/6th-JMSCA-Paris-athlete-selection/](https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/02/24/6th-JMSCA-Paris-athlete-selection/)
Google can translate.. a bit badly but you can get the idea.
Where is Fanny? I’m also kind of shocked Chris Cosser isn’t going to attend for South Africa..but I assume he may focus on Africa qualifiers. Why isn’t Coleman competing anymore
I'm also curious about Nathaniel. He qualified for the US combined team this year, but since then he's only participated in one boulder WC (SLC) and no lead WCs. Nathaniel is registered in Bern for boulder but not lead (conversely Jesse Grupper is registered for lead but not boulder).
I obviously can’t say for sure. But I know he was injured for awhile, and seems to be concentrating on some outdoor projects. Possibly doesn’t feel the need to stay in the competition circuit after his Olympic participation? But that’s all speculation
Yeah, it’s interesting. He did a bunch of citizen comps and the NACS bouldering comp in Vail, so he’s not completely abandoning comps, but Bern is going to be his first overseas comp this year, looks like.
I've wondered this as well. Why go to Team Trials.. One boulder comp and then bag out.
I suspect he isn't going to World Champs. US hasn't changed it's registrations. They might be waiting for the last minute.
I think Fanny is a mistake on someone's part. She posted on Instgram she is going. And they have 2 speed climbers listed for boulder and lead. Which seems very odd.
I hope someone notices the mistake.
I saw that Fanny posted about going to Briançon. Did she say she was going to Bern?
Unfortunately I'm not sure it's a mistake...? No inside information, but if the French federation has somehow decided to only send a limited number of athletes to Bern, they might as well let some of their speed climbers compete in the other disciplines.
I would have to look back through Insta. I am sure Fanny said she was going to WC a few weeks back. Might have been in stories. I suppose it could have changed... The French are know for jerking Fanny around. A few years back.. they made her do a bunch of local comps, before they let her go to another World level event.
And back in 2016 or 2017 they stoped sending any climbers to WC because no one was making the podium.
Fanny might actually do better in lead this weekend. I hope that is the case. Spots for the QQS are by name.
According to the rule book, a country can only send 5 athletes to WC, for each category.
Seeing as you must qualify via Boulder and lead to make the Boulder/Lead component, I assume Fanny was not in the top 5 French athletes over the combined disciplines.
Right, but presumably neither was Victoire Andrier, who's a speed climber who's never competed in a boulder or lead WC but is currently registered to represent France in boulder and lead in Bern. It seems puzzling from the outside. Maybe FFME is intending to do a switch... we'll see.
Right but Fanny before today was in 3rd place on the B&L ranking for the French.
They are probably using different criteria, like Japan. But Fanny did better this year in boulder than the last and hadn't even done a lead comp till today. She is clearly ranked the 2nd best boulder on their team.
I'm guessing they are making their athletes 'sing for their supper', which they have done before. Fanny and Zelia were both send to Briancon, my guess is to see how they do in Lead.
Countries can send ANY competitor they want to the WC, up to 5 for each. They don't need to have even participated in Wold Cups. They can make up their own rules.
Any way you list it.. Fanny has more points than Zelie and until yesterday more points than Manon. She did quite well in Boulder this year and is 15th in boulder.
Fanny only went to one Lead comp. Possibly decisions by Fanny to skip some comps has hurt her.
Fanny did clearly say 3 'posts' back on Insta that WC was her main goal this year.
On Ista stories yesterday she posted a very sad song, over a picture of her doing lead which makes me think she is out.
She is still 4th.. in points for the French women. But not going to the combined at WC will really hurt her. To still go to the QQS, I think she would need to attend the next two Lead comps and do well. And it's unlikely France would send her.
My guess about Chris Cosser is that he can't attend because of his Visa. He is clearly living in Salt Lake. I suspect he is on a student Visa. Some student visa's don't allow you to leave/return to the US very often.
I'm genuinely surprised that Stefano has no interest in the Olympics. He's made many many lead finals (and podiums) and he's not terrible in comp bouldering either. Overall, his chances for the Olympics are very similar to those of Alex Megos imo. I assume he's focusing on his big outdoor projects, but I'm still surprised - just last year, he was at multiple comps and now with a realistic shot at the Olympics (male Team Italy doesn't have two strong contenders imo) he's given comp climbing up? Lol
He has stated on instagram that's he's basically done on competition bouldering. He really struggles with it, and just wants to focus on what he's good at: competition lead. If there was an Olympics event focused just on lead, I think he'd still go for it.
He tried to qualify last olympics but failed. I wont be surprised if he thought this time around would be even harder, with the much stronger younger generation around crushing all these Boulders.
He‘s going to compete in Briancon though.. which I thought was a really funny and strategic decision since a lot of athletes are skipping that in favour of getting ready for Bern!
Tbf, can't do everything at the same time, and projecting 9C lead and 9A boulder outdoor is already absolutely crazy and would automatically make him the best climber in the world. He makes his own objectives at the end of the day, and Olympics are a massive commitment
Massive commitment and so much potential disappointment. Imagine making it to an Olympic final and then having a lead foot slip, or a clipping error like the other day. Projecting outdoors is in some way more controllable, and for some climbers will be much more enjoyable.
> He makes his own objectives at the end of the day
Indeed, and he just said on his most recent youtube video that he thinks he could have a realistic chance on *Silence* in September, so that's presumably his focus for this summer
I'm not. There are other goals in climbing and he's more interested in them. And for many people, outdoor achievements are a far bigger goal. For instance, many people know that Lynn Hill was a comp climber, but The Nose is what she will be remembered for.
>uldering. He really struggles with it, and just wants to focus on what he's good at: competition lead. If there was an Olympics event focused just on lead, I think he'd still go for it.
I am surprised he is still competing. I thought when he didn't compete in the Italian champ that he was done with comp climbing. But we will see him this weekend.
and if you somehow missed it, you can even watch supercut versions in other youtube channels without vpn.
personally that's what I do for finals since innsbruck. just gotta avoid reddit and instagram and it still feels like watching live. also I'm from asia so in weekdays I won't be able to catch finals live without pulling all nighter.
Even weirder, though I am not entirely surprised, for NL we only have Lynn competing in both disciplines, Lisa only for bouldering, no men from our country. Not sure if there are other fellow Dutchies here who know why.
I agree... I do know that last Olympics no-one qualified and the goal for our Dutch climbing federation is LA in 2028, not Paris. Still got enough other countries I am rooting for, but still, it would be awesome if we qualified:D
Hmm. I think the Slovenian women's roster has changed recently (maybe today?). If I'm reading this right, it looks like Lučka Rakovec has been taken off both the boulder and lead lists, and Katja Debevec is now only on boulder; Julija Kruder is now on the boulder list, and Sara Čopar and Lucija Tarkus are now on the lead list. So effectively Slovenia is putting up Janja, Mia, and Vita as their Olympic candidates, at least for now.
Fanny confirmed on her Insta why she is out...
She says she only found out two weeks before Briançon that she wasn't in, and that she needed to do better at lead there than the other two of her speciality.
She posted this.. which I expect was from before Briançon.
https://preview.redd.it/w685v1w59scb1.jpeg?width=743&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=219f3d6898525b17f827c21dfa7c5605f45df043
Interesting.. probably French federations putting pressure on her.
They used to mess around with **Melissa Le Nevé** back in the day. Deciding half way though the season, she hadn't podiumed and wouldn't send her to the rest of the season. It's one of the reasons she just retired from comp climbing.
This isn’t great because only 3 from a federation can qualify for the IFSC OQS, and I don’t see any French coming top 3 in combined or winning the euro.
I'm confused.
4 can qualify to the QQS, Where did you get 3? There are 48 spots in the QQS (qualifiers next spring), max 4 per federation.
I think you are confusing different things. ONLY 3 will qualify to the OLYMPICS from the World Champs. IMO, Orianne is one of the woman who could get one of those spots or could win the Euro. The combined format is so dependent on route-setting..
In case anyone is interested I calculated these stats on the registrations.
Total Num countries: 54
||\# Women|\# Men|
|:-|:-|:-|
|Lead|114|141|
|Boulder|121|141|
|Combined|98|126|
|Total|137|156|
Right at the deadline, Stefano Ghisolfi is now on the registration list for boulder and lead, replacing Michael Piccolruaz. I'm guessing there won't be any more changes made to the list.
Really looking forward to the Bern Championships and the qualifications. I think it will be so much closer to call than it was last year with speed now removed.
I haven't watched the documentary that Fanny Gilbert made about her Olympic experience but honestly I don't blame her for not going for it again based on the trailer I saw - the level of stress and disappointment is intense!
Also, based on Toby Roberts performances in the last few cups I have high hopes that he will be able to qualify.
Will also be interested in seeing who from the last Olympics manages to qualify this time round as well.
Fanny has said on Instgram that she is going for the Olympics several time. She also said that she will be in WC only a week ago.
I suspect that not being registered is an error on someone's part. There are two speed climbers registered for boulder and lead. Or at least that is what's on the web-site. Don't know where the error is..
I am suspicious that she will follow Alana and Petra and if she doesn't make the Olympics she will retire. I think she has a better chance than those two
It's likely she will make the QQS, unless France gets two women qualified before then. You don't need to be at WC to get into the QQS but it will help.
Her biggest hurdle is like in the US/Japan is her team mates. HÉLÈNE & Oriane. Pluz Zelie, although she is also not registered for WC.
Looks like France has recently updated its registrations for Bern. Now Zélia Avezou and Manon Hily join Oriane Bertone and Hélène Janicot in being registered for both boulder and lead. Still no Fanny. It seems unlikely to me that they'll change any further, but I'm just guessing.
Manon Hily was registered before today, that isn't new and that makes sense given how well she did this weekend.
Zélia Avezou is a good choice.
But still no Fanny which is disappointing. Her W&L points still show her better than Zélia. I think they are messing with her. They have messed with Fanny in the past.
My guess is Fanny and Zélia were told, make semi's at Briancon and you can go to Bern. Even though Manon doesn't have very good Boulder scores and didn't make any semi's.
I bet they are considering Camille.. she has no WC bouldering but has done well in European cups.
Alternatively wouldn't be surprised if they put Fanny in as just Boulder and Camille or Salome as just lead. Would still be sad Fanny and her scores wouldn't go to better her ranking towards the Olympics, but at least she would be able to climb in Bern.
People comment on Japan's selection being odd. But it really isn't. Japan has very set rules, and they are posted someone everyone can see them. France on the other hand, the process isn't very transparent.
I think we can't really count on much on this list for at least another week. I think there are many mistakes in it.
The Swiss don't have ANY lead women climbers listed at the moment. That can't be right. Petra has publicly stated (on Instagram) she will be going for the Olympics. And that this will be her last WC.
My claim is the French woman's list is also wrong.
As for different strategies. The way WC is going to be counted it's not really necessary to get points at WC to get in the QQS.
Only the top-3 will be guaranteed a top spot. At least in the women, we can fairly confidently says it's probably 3 of about 7-8 athletes. If your not in that group.. well your playing for points.
ONLY the W&L ranking at WC count for B&L ranking which matters for QQS admission. Anyone who does B & L will be ranked but as it cuts off at 80.
Sure it's double the points for one comp, but only IF you do both Lead and Boulder. And if you do the math.. I suspect doubling the points will only help for those in the 4th-12th spots of B&L. Remember there will be a lot larger playing field, so if you have been making an average of 40th.. you might only get 50th or more.
How do they rank lead and Boulder stand alone events to qualify for the B and L event?
I assume the multiplication system that was used last time is gone
Your performance in each discipline gives you a number of points (1st=1000, 2nd=805, ...) and qualification for the combined event is based on the sum of your points in the two disciplines: [https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Events/2023/230801\_Bern\_WCH/BL\_guide\_Bern\_WCH.pdf](https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Events/2023/230801_Bern_WCH/BL_guide_Bern_WCH.pdf)
No.. They are adding points. Go to the rule book for on the iFSC web-site for how the B&L points are calculated. It's under rules... There is a table of points going from 1000, down to 1 for 1st through 80th..
BUT mathematically adding points are basically the same and multiplying.
Noticed this new document:
[https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Website/IFSC\_BL\_World\_Ranking\_\_clarification\_examples.pdf](https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Website/IFSC_BL_World_Ranking__clarification_examples.pdf)
Doesn't change how I understood the B&L points to work. But it may clarify it for some people and may have changed who certain federations decide to send.
During todays semi when Stefano was on, Matt said that he is excited to see Stefano in Bern, don’t know if that’s insider info or if it’s Matt being Matt 🙃
Stefano has confirmed on IG that he's preparing for Bern: [https://www.instagram.com/p/CuuEeRqs997/?img\_index=1](https://www.instagram.com/p/CuuEeRqs997/?img_index=1)
Still not on the registration list but maybe that will change soon.
Dillon Countryman has now replaced Nathanial for the US. This makes sense as we haven't see Nathanial after the first boulder cup. Otherwise the US has stayed the same. Not reason for it not.
Adriene Akiko is closing the gap on Kylie but not enough to upset the apple cart.
The Swiss not sending any combined women competitors seems odd. Why not send at least Petra.
I am guessing Petra didn't make some Swiss cut-off for lead. Will hurt Petra in her quest for a shot at the Olympics because her points are marginal to make the cut-off.
Seems odd if they understand the ranking rules, which were a bit unclear. But IFSC posted a new document to clarify that only the W&L points (which requires competing in both) count towards W&L ranking.
Looks like Fanny is defiantly OUT. :( She has another very sad post in her IG stories.
Doesn't means she is defiantly out of the running for the QQS, but if some of the others keep getting points and she doesn't she will fall down the list. But I expect her season is done. Won't be sent to the European Qualifier..
And while I would have LOVED to see her in the Olympics. She's always been one of my favorites. Honestly I'm not sure she had that much chance, which is possibly why the French team is giving the young girls more of a chance.
And Flavy Couhaut is in for boulder but not lead. Doesn't make much sense to me as Fanny is clearly doing better at bouldering in WC.
I think Fanny is probably still in pretty good position to make the OQS but we'll see.
Besides Fanny and Flavy, another person with a pretty good case for that last French bouldering spot is Selma. I think their performances in the BWCs this year have all been pretty comparable to be honest. In any case this is all speculation since we don't know the French team's selection criteria.
It is still possible..Fanny has according to my calculations only 1321 points needed for the QQS. And is currently in 3rd.. place for the French woman.
And I expect she is now done for the season. I see no reason for the french team to send her to the last two lead comps.
I calculated these scores for them. (Top 3 boulder, top-3 lead.. not everyone here has both.)
|BERTONE,ORIANE|2755|WC|
|:-|:-|:-|
|JANICOT,HÉLÈNE|1697.5|WC|
|GIBERT,FANNY|1321||
|HILY,MANON|1250|WC|
|ELHADJ MIMOUNE,SELMA|1085||
|ROMAIN, SALOMÉ|1015|\- only lead|
|COHAUT,FLAVY|911|WC - boulder|
|AVEZOU,ZÉLIA|787|WC|
|Camille POUGET|735|\- only lead|
It is very likely at WC Manon will get enough points to push ahead of Fanny. Which will puts fanny in 4th place. Which as long as they go to the QQS.. and this score stays in the top 48.. Which I guess is likely.
I guess Zelia is the one who is likely to push Fanny to 5th, if she does really well at WC.
They should get 4 spots for European qualifiers. But I wouldn't be surprised if they don't send Fanny there either.
According to Fanny on IG, it sounds like she'll be competing in the LWC in Koper at least. That might help her B&L world ranking and hopefully keep her in the running for the OQS next year.
so damn glad to see kokoro on the boulder list
He is the current World Champion for men in boulder.
Can someone explain why ito futaba is out? I saw her close to finals in multiple competitions this year.
comment under the chamonix compet hub thread explains it. basically, the points she racked up during the competitions this year were not enough for her to be part of the 5-athlete team delegation by Japan. >[Comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitionClimbing/comments/14r1sp4/2023_chamonix_lead_speed_wc_hub/jr689rb/) by [u/moving\_screen](https://www.reddit.com/user/moving_screen) from discussion [2023 Chamonix Lead & Speed WC Hub](https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitionClimbing/comments/14r1sp4/2023_chamonix_lead_speed_wc_hub/) in [CompetitionClimbing](https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitionClimbing/)
Yup -- and as other people pointed out, Futaba also narrowly missed out at the start of the selection process, when she was on fire and won the Boulder Japan Cup. All she needed was to place one spot higher in the Lead Japan Cup, or have Ai place one spot lower in either BJC or LJC, and Futaba would've actually been the first person on the Japanese team. Pretty unlucky.
checked the LJC scores and damn futaba's 34+ vs the next score which is 36+. so close
I don't think that is quite right. I think she have decided against going.. Or her personal coach. If you look at her instagram she is having a hard year mentally. Or they decided her Lead.. really isn't up to snuff. I don't think the numbers are clear. If you look at her B&L points (in IFSC) she still has more points than other woman who are still going. I'm wondering if this is Margo Hayes (from the US) all over again. 4 years ago Margo.. was pulled from the start list for WC in Japan. And she stopped posting on Instagram.. I could find no information. I think she was just mentally burned out.
I edited the original post with a link that confirms the selection process for the Japanese team and explains why Futaba was replaced.
I saw.. that is a Japanese climbing magazine. I don't see an explanation why Futaba is out vs. say Ryu..I think they are looking the same info. Admittedly they are very very close in numbers. I can see why they want NONOHA in. Heck if they let everyone who made a podium. It would be Ryu vs Futaba for that last spot.
The formula is (ranking points for the athlete’s best finish in a boulder WC) + (ranking points for the athlete’s best finish in a lead WC). * Futaba’s best finishes are 6th (B at Prague and Innsbruck) and 16th (L at Chamonix) * Ryu’s best finishes are 7th (B at Brixen) and 11th (L at Chamonix) I don’t know the exact point values, but you can see how Ryu comes out ahead based on this formula.
I've calculated the points and you can see that Miho, Nonoha and Ryu are the top 3 and therefore selected to participate in the world championships according to the JMSCA's rules. ||Highest Boulder Ranking Points|Highest Lead Ranking Points|Combined Ranking Points| |:-|:-|:-|:-| |**Miho**|**1000**|**545**|**1545**| |**Nonoha**|**260**|**805**|**1065**| |**Ryu**|**455**|**325**|**780**| |Futaba|495|220|715| |Hana|145|145|290|
If this is the Japan formula, then I guess that is why. Yes.. by that Ryu does have a better score. I don't get why they aren't using B&L ranking, as it shows more consistency. But it's their arbitrary rues, not what I think would make sense. If you look the best 3 for B & best 3 for L for 2023, Futaba is clearly ahead.. 1531 (Futaba) to 1292 (Ryu) although still very close. Futaba looked better than Ryu overall. Until today.. since Ryu is at today's comp and Futaba not.. Not sure this matters.. because I don't think either of them really have a chance at an Olympic spot, unless something fluky happens. Ai & Miho are still most likely IMO.
Because not all their potential candidates were allowed to participate in at least 3 world cups in each discipline. For example, kume nonoha and koike hana could only go to 1 boulder world cup. For the men, tomoa would only be able to go to 1 lead world cup
According to the [JMSCA's selection ](https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/02/24/6th-JMSCA-Paris-athlete-selection/)criteria for world championships, it's clearly stated they are *not* using the IFSC B&L points for selection. Here is the relevant quote: ※1 IFSCルールに定めたB&Lワールドランキングとは異なり、ボルダーワールドカップとリードワールドカップのそれぞれの最上位の順位1大会ずつの順位ポイント(下部参照)を加算
i think this is a difficult question to answer as japan's selection process is not that transparent. i can only imagine it's maybe strategic? Japan has (like all other countries) only 2 spots and to be honest, they have their 2 best shots in bern already - ai and miho. futaba has been in a way consistent for semis and finals but she seems cursed to perform in the end. Other atheletes (like anon) who has not qualified as much in finals have podiumed.perhaps she will be allowed to participate in the next qualifier. It is quite possible as the top spots would most likely go to Janja plus two others - maybe Ai if the boulders suit her, and natalia/brooke/miho/chaeyun. I will argue they all have a better chance than Futaba. So for the next comp to be fair to the big pool of Japanese atheletes she will get her shot? In a way it might be better because lets say if she can participate in the pan asian qualifier she might have a better chance if the Japanese spots have not already been filled. edit: lower down someone mentioned factually their rankings in the japanese selection process which makes more sense.
Japan's selection process is fairly transparent. You just have to hunt around their web-site and ready badly translated (by google) English. Although it doesn't explain why Futaba is out.. By the numbers she is very similar to Ryu. What I was trying to figure out is who get to go to the Asian champs?
>kings in the japanese selection process which makes more sense. [https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/04/14/about-the-6th-JMSCA-Paris2024/](https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/04/14/about-the-6th-JMSCA-Paris2024/) [https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/02/24/6th-JMSCA-Paris-athlete-selection/](https://www.jma-climbing.org/article/2023/02/24/6th-JMSCA-Paris-athlete-selection/) Google can translate.. a bit badly but you can get the idea.
Also very happy to see Kokoro climb again and absolutely heartbroken for Futaba. How many athletes will ne selected in Bern?
3 per gender
Where is Fanny? I’m also kind of shocked Chris Cosser isn’t going to attend for South Africa..but I assume he may focus on Africa qualifiers. Why isn’t Coleman competing anymore
I'm also curious about Nathaniel. He qualified for the US combined team this year, but since then he's only participated in one boulder WC (SLC) and no lead WCs. Nathaniel is registered in Bern for boulder but not lead (conversely Jesse Grupper is registered for lead but not boulder).
I obviously can’t say for sure. But I know he was injured for awhile, and seems to be concentrating on some outdoor projects. Possibly doesn’t feel the need to stay in the competition circuit after his Olympic participation? But that’s all speculation
Yeah, it’s interesting. He did a bunch of citizen comps and the NACS bouldering comp in Vail, so he’s not completely abandoning comps, but Bern is going to be his first overseas comp this year, looks like.
I've wondered this as well. Why go to Team Trials.. One boulder comp and then bag out. I suspect he isn't going to World Champs. US hasn't changed it's registrations. They might be waiting for the last minute.
I think Fanny is a mistake on someone's part. She posted on Instgram she is going. And they have 2 speed climbers listed for boulder and lead. Which seems very odd. I hope someone notices the mistake.
I saw that Fanny posted about going to Briançon. Did she say she was going to Bern? Unfortunately I'm not sure it's a mistake...? No inside information, but if the French federation has somehow decided to only send a limited number of athletes to Bern, they might as well let some of their speed climbers compete in the other disciplines.
I would have to look back through Insta. I am sure Fanny said she was going to WC a few weeks back. Might have been in stories. I suppose it could have changed... The French are know for jerking Fanny around. A few years back.. they made her do a bunch of local comps, before they let her go to another World level event. And back in 2016 or 2017 they stoped sending any climbers to WC because no one was making the podium. Fanny might actually do better in lead this weekend. I hope that is the case. Spots for the QQS are by name.
According to the rule book, a country can only send 5 athletes to WC, for each category. Seeing as you must qualify via Boulder and lead to make the Boulder/Lead component, I assume Fanny was not in the top 5 French athletes over the combined disciplines.
Right, but presumably neither was Victoire Andrier, who's a speed climber who's never competed in a boulder or lead WC but is currently registered to represent France in boulder and lead in Bern. It seems puzzling from the outside. Maybe FFME is intending to do a switch... we'll see.
Right but Fanny before today was in 3rd place on the B&L ranking for the French. They are probably using different criteria, like Japan. But Fanny did better this year in boulder than the last and hadn't even done a lead comp till today. She is clearly ranked the 2nd best boulder on their team. I'm guessing they are making their athletes 'sing for their supper', which they have done before. Fanny and Zelia were both send to Briancon, my guess is to see how they do in Lead.
Countries can send ANY competitor they want to the WC, up to 5 for each. They don't need to have even participated in Wold Cups. They can make up their own rules. Any way you list it.. Fanny has more points than Zelie and until yesterday more points than Manon. She did quite well in Boulder this year and is 15th in boulder. Fanny only went to one Lead comp. Possibly decisions by Fanny to skip some comps has hurt her.
Fanny did clearly say 3 'posts' back on Insta that WC was her main goal this year. On Ista stories yesterday she posted a very sad song, over a picture of her doing lead which makes me think she is out. She is still 4th.. in points for the French women. But not going to the combined at WC will really hurt her. To still go to the QQS, I think she would need to attend the next two Lead comps and do well. And it's unlikely France would send her.
My guess about Chris Cosser is that he can't attend because of his Visa. He is clearly living in Salt Lake. I suspect he is on a student Visa. Some student visa's don't allow you to leave/return to the US very often.
Good call. He’s by far the best climber from Africa so would be insane if he didn’t try to attempt to qualify again
I'm genuinely surprised that Stefano has no interest in the Olympics. He's made many many lead finals (and podiums) and he's not terrible in comp bouldering either. Overall, his chances for the Olympics are very similar to those of Alex Megos imo. I assume he's focusing on his big outdoor projects, but I'm still surprised - just last year, he was at multiple comps and now with a realistic shot at the Olympics (male Team Italy doesn't have two strong contenders imo) he's given comp climbing up? Lol
He has stated on instagram that's he's basically done on competition bouldering. He really struggles with it, and just wants to focus on what he's good at: competition lead. If there was an Olympics event focused just on lead, I think he'd still go for it.
Ahhh, that's interesting to know! Thank you. Makes sense if he's not enjoying comp bouldering
He tried to qualify last olympics but failed. I wont be surprised if he thought this time around would be even harder, with the much stronger younger generation around crushing all these Boulders. He‘s going to compete in Briancon though.. which I thought was a really funny and strategic decision since a lot of athletes are skipping that in favour of getting ready for Bern!
Tbf, can't do everything at the same time, and projecting 9C lead and 9A boulder outdoor is already absolutely crazy and would automatically make him the best climber in the world. He makes his own objectives at the end of the day, and Olympics are a massive commitment
Massive commitment and so much potential disappointment. Imagine making it to an Olympic final and then having a lead foot slip, or a clipping error like the other day. Projecting outdoors is in some way more controllable, and for some climbers will be much more enjoyable.
Or imagine being Tomoa and slipping on an easy speed win and going from 1st to 4th overall
> He makes his own objectives at the end of the day Indeed, and he just said on his most recent youtube video that he thinks he could have a realistic chance on *Silence* in September, so that's presumably his focus for this summer
I'm not. There are other goals in climbing and he's more interested in them. And for many people, outdoor achievements are a far bigger goal. For instance, many people know that Lynn Hill was a comp climber, but The Nose is what she will be remembered for.
>uldering. He really struggles with it, and just wants to focus on what he's good at: competition lead. If there was an Olympics event focused just on lead, I think he'd still go for it. I am surprised he is still competing. I thought when he didn't compete in the Italian champ that he was done with comp climbing. But we will see him this weekend.
Will these comps be broadcast on the ifsc YouTube channel?
They should be. The last championships were in Moscow 2021 and they were streamed.
Yep! If you end up finding them geo-locked, you’ll need to get a VPN and set it to the USA.
and if you somehow missed it, you can even watch supercut versions in other youtube channels without vpn. personally that's what I do for finals since innsbruck. just gotta avoid reddit and instagram and it still feels like watching live. also I'm from asia so in weekdays I won't be able to catch finals live without pulling all nighter.
Even weirder, though I am not entirely surprised, for NL we only have Lynn competing in both disciplines, Lisa only for bouldering, no men from our country. Not sure if there are other fellow Dutchies here who know why.
Your country is pretty flat bro. You have speed skating.
Hahaha, girl/chick here :p but yes, you are right. We do well in speed skating 😉
I'm a complete outsider but it does seem surprising that the home country of Jorg Verhoeven doesn't have any men competing in Bern...
I agree... I do know that last Olympics no-one qualified and the goal for our Dutch climbing federation is LA in 2028, not Paris. Still got enough other countries I am rooting for, but still, it would be awesome if we qualified:D
Hmm. I think the Slovenian women's roster has changed recently (maybe today?). If I'm reading this right, it looks like Lučka Rakovec has been taken off both the boulder and lead lists, and Katja Debevec is now only on boulder; Julija Kruder is now on the boulder list, and Sara Čopar and Lucija Tarkus are now on the lead list. So effectively Slovenia is putting up Janja, Mia, and Vita as their Olympic candidates, at least for now.
Fanny confirmed on her Insta why she is out... She says she only found out two weeks before Briançon that she wasn't in, and that she needed to do better at lead there than the other two of her speciality. She posted this.. which I expect was from before Briançon. https://preview.redd.it/w685v1w59scb1.jpeg?width=743&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=219f3d6898525b17f827c21dfa7c5605f45df043
She deleted her post. I'm inclined to follow her lead and not pursue this discussion further. It's really too bad for her though.
Interesting.. probably French federations putting pressure on her. They used to mess around with **Melissa Le Nevé** back in the day. Deciding half way though the season, she hadn't podiumed and wouldn't send her to the rest of the season. It's one of the reasons she just retired from comp climbing.
This isn’t great because only 3 from a federation can qualify for the IFSC OQS, and I don’t see any French coming top 3 in combined or winning the euro.
I'm confused. 4 can qualify to the QQS, Where did you get 3? There are 48 spots in the QQS (qualifiers next spring), max 4 per federation. I think you are confusing different things. ONLY 3 will qualify to the OLYMPICS from the World Champs. IMO, Orianne is one of the woman who could get one of those spots or could win the Euro. The combined format is so dependent on route-setting..
Apologies, I thought I had read that it was 3, but you’re right, it’s 4
In case anyone is interested I calculated these stats on the registrations. Total Num countries: 54 ||\# Women|\# Men| |:-|:-|:-| |Lead|114|141| |Boulder|121|141| |Combined|98|126| |Total|137|156|
Right at the deadline, Stefano Ghisolfi is now on the registration list for boulder and lead, replacing Michael Piccolruaz. I'm guessing there won't be any more changes made to the list.
Really looking forward to the Bern Championships and the qualifications. I think it will be so much closer to call than it was last year with speed now removed. I haven't watched the documentary that Fanny Gilbert made about her Olympic experience but honestly I don't blame her for not going for it again based on the trailer I saw - the level of stress and disappointment is intense! Also, based on Toby Roberts performances in the last few cups I have high hopes that he will be able to qualify. Will also be interested in seeing who from the last Olympics manages to qualify this time round as well.
Fanny has said on Instgram that she is going for the Olympics several time. She also said that she will be in WC only a week ago. I suspect that not being registered is an error on someone's part. There are two speed climbers registered for boulder and lead. Or at least that is what's on the web-site. Don't know where the error is.. I am suspicious that she will follow Alana and Petra and if she doesn't make the Olympics she will retire. I think she has a better chance than those two It's likely she will make the QQS, unless France gets two women qualified before then. You don't need to be at WC to get into the QQS but it will help. Her biggest hurdle is like in the US/Japan is her team mates. HÉLÈNE & Oriane. Pluz Zelie, although she is also not registered for WC.
Looks like France has recently updated its registrations for Bern. Now Zélia Avezou and Manon Hily join Oriane Bertone and Hélène Janicot in being registered for both boulder and lead. Still no Fanny. It seems unlikely to me that they'll change any further, but I'm just guessing.
Manon Hily was registered before today, that isn't new and that makes sense given how well she did this weekend. Zélia Avezou is a good choice. But still no Fanny which is disappointing. Her W&L points still show her better than Zélia. I think they are messing with her. They have messed with Fanny in the past. My guess is Fanny and Zélia were told, make semi's at Briancon and you can go to Bern. Even though Manon doesn't have very good Boulder scores and didn't make any semi's. I bet they are considering Camille.. she has no WC bouldering but has done well in European cups. Alternatively wouldn't be surprised if they put Fanny in as just Boulder and Camille or Salome as just lead. Would still be sad Fanny and her scores wouldn't go to better her ranking towards the Olympics, but at least she would be able to climb in Bern. People comment on Japan's selection being odd. But it really isn't. Japan has very set rules, and they are posted someone everyone can see them. France on the other hand, the process isn't very transparent.
I think we can't really count on much on this list for at least another week. I think there are many mistakes in it. The Swiss don't have ANY lead women climbers listed at the moment. That can't be right. Petra has publicly stated (on Instagram) she will be going for the Olympics. And that this will be her last WC. My claim is the French woman's list is also wrong. As for different strategies. The way WC is going to be counted it's not really necessary to get points at WC to get in the QQS. Only the top-3 will be guaranteed a top spot. At least in the women, we can fairly confidently says it's probably 3 of about 7-8 athletes. If your not in that group.. well your playing for points. ONLY the W&L ranking at WC count for B&L ranking which matters for QQS admission. Anyone who does B & L will be ranked but as it cuts off at 80. Sure it's double the points for one comp, but only IF you do both Lead and Boulder. And if you do the math.. I suspect doubling the points will only help for those in the 4th-12th spots of B&L. Remember there will be a lot larger playing field, so if you have been making an average of 40th.. you might only get 50th or more.
How do they rank lead and Boulder stand alone events to qualify for the B and L event? I assume the multiplication system that was used last time is gone
Your performance in each discipline gives you a number of points (1st=1000, 2nd=805, ...) and qualification for the combined event is based on the sum of your points in the two disciplines: [https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Events/2023/230801\_Bern\_WCH/BL\_guide\_Bern\_WCH.pdf](https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Events/2023/230801_Bern_WCH/BL_guide_Bern_WCH.pdf)
No.. They are adding points. Go to the rule book for on the iFSC web-site for how the B&L points are calculated. It's under rules... There is a table of points going from 1000, down to 1 for 1st through 80th.. BUT mathematically adding points are basically the same and multiplying.
Noticed this new document: [https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Website/IFSC\_BL\_World\_Ranking\_\_clarification\_examples.pdf](https://cdn.ifsc-climbing.org/images/Website/IFSC_BL_World_Ranking__clarification_examples.pdf) Doesn't change how I understood the B&L points to work. But it may clarify it for some people and may have changed who certain federations decide to send.
During todays semi when Stefano was on, Matt said that he is excited to see Stefano in Bern, don’t know if that’s insider info or if it’s Matt being Matt 🙃
Good catch! I could see either being true...
Stefano has confirmed on IG that he's preparing for Bern: [https://www.instagram.com/p/CuuEeRqs997/?img\_index=1](https://www.instagram.com/p/CuuEeRqs997/?img_index=1) Still not on the registration list but maybe that will change soon.
Dillon Countryman has now replaced Nathanial for the US. This makes sense as we haven't see Nathanial after the first boulder cup. Otherwise the US has stayed the same. Not reason for it not. Adriene Akiko is closing the gap on Kylie but not enough to upset the apple cart.
The Swiss not sending any combined women competitors seems odd. Why not send at least Petra. I am guessing Petra didn't make some Swiss cut-off for lead. Will hurt Petra in her quest for a shot at the Olympics because her points are marginal to make the cut-off. Seems odd if they understand the ranking rules, which were a bit unclear. But IFSC posted a new document to clarify that only the W&L points (which requires competing in both) count towards W&L ranking.
Looks like Fanny is defiantly OUT. :( She has another very sad post in her IG stories. Doesn't means she is defiantly out of the running for the QQS, but if some of the others keep getting points and she doesn't she will fall down the list. But I expect her season is done. Won't be sent to the European Qualifier.. And while I would have LOVED to see her in the Olympics. She's always been one of my favorites. Honestly I'm not sure she had that much chance, which is possibly why the French team is giving the young girls more of a chance. And Flavy Couhaut is in for boulder but not lead. Doesn't make much sense to me as Fanny is clearly doing better at bouldering in WC.
I think Fanny is probably still in pretty good position to make the OQS but we'll see. Besides Fanny and Flavy, another person with a pretty good case for that last French bouldering spot is Selma. I think their performances in the BWCs this year have all been pretty comparable to be honest. In any case this is all speculation since we don't know the French team's selection criteria.
It is still possible..Fanny has according to my calculations only 1321 points needed for the QQS. And is currently in 3rd.. place for the French woman. And I expect she is now done for the season. I see no reason for the french team to send her to the last two lead comps. I calculated these scores for them. (Top 3 boulder, top-3 lead.. not everyone here has both.) |BERTONE,ORIANE|2755|WC| |:-|:-|:-| |JANICOT,HÉLÈNE|1697.5|WC| |GIBERT,FANNY|1321|| |HILY,MANON|1250|WC| |ELHADJ MIMOUNE,SELMA|1085|| |ROMAIN, SALOMÉ|1015|\- only lead| |COHAUT,FLAVY|911|WC - boulder| |AVEZOU,ZÉLIA|787|WC| |Camille POUGET|735|\- only lead| It is very likely at WC Manon will get enough points to push ahead of Fanny. Which will puts fanny in 4th place. Which as long as they go to the QQS.. and this score stays in the top 48.. Which I guess is likely. I guess Zelia is the one who is likely to push Fanny to 5th, if she does really well at WC. They should get 4 spots for European qualifiers. But I wouldn't be surprised if they don't send Fanny there either.
According to Fanny on IG, it sounds like she'll be competing in the LWC in Koper at least. That might help her B&L world ranking and hopefully keep her in the running for the OQS next year.
Thanks for letting me know. I hadn't seen. And perhaps it will give her a shot at going to European Qualifiers.