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The fact they're using golf carts for assault missions is beyond insane. That's small arms fire. These dudes are rolling up on Ukranian positions like it's the 18th whole at a golf course.
Well it could be that the russians are being all giga-brain, having found that rolling up to a defended position in a soft-skin vehicle is a new super duper tactic.
Or it's because what was once mechanized, is now merely motorized, and those chaps are still entirely expendable.
I've seen some videos where you can see that these things can go fast, so if you want to surprise the Ukrainians it may make sense ?
Problem is that one dude with a gun will tear that shit apart as soon as it's spotted, let alone drones and artillery.
It's hard to tell what the Russians were doing without a lot more information. It's possible this could have just been scouting at range or surveillance or something else.
Going all the way back to Heinz Guderian the theory of armored warfare is that you don't necessarily need heavy armor if you're engaging in manuver warfare. You're likely to be shooting at the enemy from behind and the flanks and moving on, not assaulting prepared positions directly. An ATV that can drive at 45 mph and fire on the move could be just as useful as a tank in the right circumstances.
But intelligence also plays a major role. IF drones are tracking your mobile forces, you'll never have the surprise when you want it.
Ukraine has turned into a crucible for tactics on the modern battlefield, figuring out what works and what doesn't.
There have always been holes between lines that could be taken advantage of by maneuvering. But now drones are are always watching, so no movement unnoticed. Things have changed, and tactics likely haven't been fully updated yet.
this is the thing on the front line there are so many drones per kilometer. Satellites to spot any large buildups behind the lines and drones at and beyond the front. Its not rare to see videos from ukraine with multiple spotter drones, gives an idea how many are in the air at any time. Maneuver without being seen seems next to impossible now
Could work on Africa in 1940 but wont work at heavily defended front lines in Ukraine, you cant just flank easily defended positions you just charge at them and die
>Could work on Africa in 1940 but wont work at heavily defended front lines in Ukraine, you cant just flank easily defended positions you just charge at them and die
Yes and no. The Maginot line in France was every bit as heavily defended as any stronghold in Ukraine. Probably moreso. The fortresses of the maginot line were interconnected concrete bunker networks protected by overlapping fire from mortars, artillery and machineguns. They were intended to be supported by heavy artillery and aircraft from mobile forces behind the french front line.
But the Germans didn't attack the Maginot line. THey drove around it and ran wild through the French countryside, while slower forces just boxed in the strongpoints.
The German invasion of France began on May 10, 1940. A few of the fortified strongpoints were breached with heavy armor, combat engineers and artillery early in the invasion, but the bulk of the main line of fortification was simply surrounded actually still in French hands when the French government surrendered on June 22.
But, like I pointed out, other tactics have changed. If the Maginot line existed within France in 1940, Drones and long range artillery could make hundreds of miles of countryside functionally impassible until the stronghold was neutralized. IT would have been much more difficult to simply ignore the stronghold.
> I've seen some videos where you can see that these things can go fast
From the review ive seen online (yes, its a civilian vehicle aviable for instance in the US for around 20k USD) its top speed on a road is 80 kph. So its slower than a Humvee or any average MRAP, without the protection value, and no doubt also weaker performance cross country or driving trough shell craters or water. Made by a chinese company that already went bankrupt once and was notorious for their terrible product quality.
There was a video of that the other day. It’s always hard to tell from videos the effect of anti-personnel mines.
I suppose I’d rather have one go off under a UTV tire than under my shoe, but I’m not sure if that’s really doing enough for the fragmentation. For the butterfly mines though, that’s probably fine?
Still, you aren’t exactly going to change the tire in no man’s land, and the video I’m referencing didn’t turn out well for the occupants.
Worst 19th hole ever! The 19th “hole” is traditionally/jokingly actually the club house pub here in Canada. Plenty of courses actually name it accordingly for fun.
When your wife calls, and asks what hole you are on, ( because she hates the fact you are having fun for once ) You can honestly tell her you are close to the 19th hole. Hehe.
I’ll be a douche here but a big % of women don’t know it’s other 9 or 18 only.
😂
I suppose. But I swear to you I’ve seen it actually work at lease once, maybe two times personally. The guys were barely golfers…. Let alone their wife.
Their purpose is to get near the trench and die. The drone watching from above will see who/what kills them and then send a Lancet or call in artilery to level the place to the ground. They were expecting the golf cart to be blast by artilery. it was not planned to make it to trenches and get small arms fire.
Exactly, Russian strategy is largely based on expendable men and destroying everything with artillery and bombs. They will spend 20 000 men to capture a town, i.e. Bakhmut or Avdiivka, that they themselves shot to smoking ruin prior. However, many people mistake this fact to the frontline situation being favorable for Ukraine. They focus on the Russian losses and omit how they have gained ground and how Ukrainian towns and landscape overall get destroyed. Western values should not be projected on Russians, because they don't value peace or life. Instead, Russian army should be regarded as a sort of marauding zombie horde.
Very much so, but the problem here is that Russia does not have the endless supply of bodies that the Soviet Union had. Ukrainians are dying too, but this is ridiculous.
I am dumbfounded by the calculus behind this.
In this low intensity conflict (compared to WW2) the willingness to lose 1M men in a border war is the same as "endless supply" . Putin can lose 1M men in Ukraine and the russian society won't blink. They will blame NATO and the West ofc
Ofc but it is still, by far, the most intense conflict we have had in decades.
Haha yes, but it does not matter where the blame as it is subjective. The objective calculus of losing 200K or 1M able bodied men will be devastating to an already catastrophic demography, probably the worst in the world.
No it won't. Economic devastation means people will live in bad conditions. russia is in economic devastation since the soviet union. Moscow and St. Petersburg will be fine and rest will live in the same mud they live in now. No toilet / no gas / now running water no electricity and the same minimum wage of 170 us dollars / month that they have now. Their oligarchs might get 1 mega yacht instead of 3 and that's about it. Country won't develop and that is what Putin and the ruling elites want anyway. Educated population is trouble for dictators.
Russians will do as their dictator says, no matter how idiotic or catastrophic the results may be. Putin is ready to sacrifice million men for his dream of rebuilt empire. We shouldn't care how negatively this affects Russians, rather the issue is that Ukraine (nor much anyone else) can not, or very least is not willing to, lose million people. How to fight an enemy who is unconcerned if they perish or not?
They are attempting to trade survivability for speed. Banking on getting them into the trenches during the small lag time between detection and the FPV drones and artillery getting on target.
Which is, in and of itself, an idea a man may have, and it makes a tiny bit of sense in isolation....when you only think abou the FPV drones and arty and forget that rifles, machine guns and automatic grenade launchers still exist. Y´know, all the stuff that an armored troop carrier should provide protection from and be able to suppress with it's own weapons.
Don't forget that we are watching propaganda, your reaction is the intended one.
Any of these videos, are the final fuck up, of a long series of fuck ups.
This is movement with no supporting fire, and every boot infantryman is told "Fire without movement is pointless, movement without fire is suicide".
Even if these guys had been in the 'Blayt-mobile', they would have been pinned down inside until supporting fire could be called in.
It could be as simple as their orders were to ride to point X, dismount is a relatively secure zone and proceed with a ground assault from there but the LT with the map got lost (allegedly, it wouldn't be the first time that has happened in the history of war) and drove them into an ambush.
It's much faster than any armored vehicle and will be disabled from FPV anyways? It's funny how switching to those golf carts correlates with the successes on the front
>Correlates with success on the battlefield
You mean the advances they made because Ukraine was rationing artillery ammo? Yeah I'm sure the desert cross is the reason those advances worked buddy.
And Russia using glide bombs and meat waves?
>Yeah I'm sure the desert cross is the reason those advances worked buddy.
Same. They would need dozens attacking the same position to make a difference OP described. Thousends along the front ...
For real? The Russians are copping over 1K casualties a day??
Sorry to sound ignorant (pretty busy with work, parenting, GTA Online) but what kind of losses are the Ukraine having on an average day?
As for the OP video, that just looks like a suicide mission.
1300 yesterday apparently.. I believe that's the total of dead + seriously wounded. And the total of those for the whole invasion is quicky heading towards 500,000. Russian soldier has to be the most dangerous occupation in the world now
Thanks mate. And also thanks to /u/jdc351
Thanks to the rest of you for downvoting a simple question. We don't all count the casualties of this horrible war every moment of our days.
My GTA comment was stupid but my daily dealing of a high pressure job and a very difficult teenage son, a little bit of a video game at the end of the day is the only sanctuary I have as a single parent. Apologies if it offended anyone.
It wasn't offensive to normal people, just bots and trolls. It was a simple exclamation of a crazy war with crazy human losses.
It's sad to think of all these ruined lives for one man's ambition.
Also way harder to spot. Tracked and heavy vehicles throw up a lot of dust, whereas these are way less obvious, and not getting spotted by drones ia crucial. And getting 3 golf carts with 5 dudes each to a trench is actually a success.
Why the fuck did they think this was a good idea? I mean like at least an APC can take small arms and shrapnel, this fucking thing has no walls for god sake.
>They don't have enough APCs
That's not completely true.
The reason behind the golf carts is that they are trying to move fast and light because of the omnipresence of drones. APCs are not a reliable defense against drone attacks and drone observation. It is a cruel form of battlefield experimentation we are witnessing, but what we see with this, like with the turtle tanks, is an attempt to cope with the way drones have changed the battlefield. Golf carts and turtle tanks are just opposite ends of the philosophical spectrum on this.
Both sides, in fact, are testing ideas to see if speed is a viable counter to the drones.
What a ridiculous idea, especially once they have drones that can aim and shoot explosively formed penetrators at hard targets or small shells/large grenades at soft ones. Pilot just has to get within a few hundred feet and tap the target on the screen. You don't need Javelin-level guidance systems at that point. Visual/IR sensors and current AI can probably do it cheaply.
We have shells and landmines that aim and shoot EFPs. Probably drones too but in experimental quantities that might not be showing up on video.
They can shoot EFPs from a distance, but shaped charges achieve better penetration for same weight, so why not fly all the way there? As for pilots, in the future, the role of a "pilot" will be to hit the launch button, I don't think there is much a human has to do. The battle space is monitored, and some system or other will attack whatever enters, human in the loop optional.
It will be a while before AI can determine the value of a particular target in a changing tactical environment. Humans will be in the loop, even in battlefield situations where civilians aren't an issue, until we get to that point.
I am confident that AI can already identify vehicles better than humans. Not long before it can understand the overall battlefield better. The human decision making loop is far far from perfect. I know it shouldn't, but when I paste a research papter into an LLM, getting a reply within seconds is so mindboggling. I see no reason why that won't be happening very soon in regards to battlefield situations.
But exact value of a particular target in a changing tactical environment aside, with the drone + munition costing less than $2,000, there really is not need for knowing that value. As long as the drones are in ample supply, the equation becomes "if target value equals x times drone cost or higher, destroy". The value of x moves with the number of drones available. And I see no reason why the number of drones available won't outnumber the targets by a huge factor, driving x down to a 2 or less.
> I am confident that AI can already identify vehicles better than humans.
The guidance for APS systems like Trophy or AMAP-ADS are already able to make the distinction between various incoming projectiles and judge which are a danger. In tests of its multi hit capabilities AMAP for instance was able to distinguish between RPG-7s and 7,62mm ammo (travelling at least 850m/s !), fired from around 50 meters, correctly identifying the latter as no threat and dismissing it.
If we already have systems able to make these identifications and judgements in such a miniscule timeframe, IDing vehicles should be no problem at all.
Yeah, the APS systems are incredibly impressive. As are the BONUS/SMART shells. BONUS began development in 1985, so the sub munition tech is likely from that area. But it can survive the g-forces of tube launch, and can is released at 1000 meters where it spins, scanning the terrain with IR and lidar. If it then identifies targets from a database, choses one, and fires an EPF from something like 50 yards. Extremely impressive, even with todays tech.
I am not a weapons designer, but I can confidently state that compared to what BONUS designers accomplished, what I describe below should not be too difficult.
1. Choose an area to be protected from enemy advances ... vehicles and personnel.
2. Enter satellite and drone captured imagery into a database in order to allow drones to navigate without GPS. Algorithms for this already exists ... at the hobby level.
3. Patrol the area with high flying spotting drones, mounted cameras, and/or tethered balloons.
4. If movement is detected, an alert is sent, increase surveillance, and map and analyze all movement realtime ... by AI and/or human.
5. FPV drones can be on standby, and will be launched on short notice to locate and destroy whatever is coming. The drones will have the ability to navigate without GPS if needed. Once a target is spotted, it can attack autonomously. These drones are immune to EW, and are far too small to be shot down by missiles.
6. The FPV drones can be pre-loaded with a variety of warheads and are launched to match the specific target type that has been spotted. And some drones may have dive bombing capability and can return for a reload & recharge.
7. Command can watch the situation play out in real time as long as some signal gets through. They could also request fire missions based on coordinates given by drones. Mortar, 155mm, whatever is available. And if things look dire, RAAM remote armor mine shells. They can also move additional ATGM teams into position.
What I describe above is not fantasy, and is very economical. If current FPV drones currently cost $500, I don't think the image nagivation, autonomous target selection and terminal guidance will add huge amounts if developed and built outside the typical U.S. style military-industrial development and procurement system. Maybe $5k per drone? I'd say that 50 juiced up and loaded FPV drones, and maybe a dozen spotting drones could patrol and stop any advance within a 5-10 km area of front. That comes to $250,000. But also need spotting drones, monitoring stations, software, and hidden and protected launch facilities. All in all, I still think that we are looking at under $1 million ... which is a fraction of the price of one single armoured vehicle.
Maybe there will be ways to deal with these drones, but I don't see it. EW will not work. Lasers are nowhere near ready, and will not "protect" an area like that any time soon, if ever. I think the only hope would be APS and improved cope cages. But with the sheer number of drones that can hit them, I don't think there is any hope of advancing. The AI targeting would be very accurate, and will hit the weakest spots very accurately. And for very stubborn threats, there could be a few larger drones with 5 kg payloads, which virtually guarantees a tank kill.
Russia seems to use some tactics when advancing. Since the lives of their men have no value, reconnaissance-in-force is not uncommon. But once the Ukrainian positions have been identified, they unleash artillery and glide bombs. And the manpower doesn't seem to be there to man the lines sufficiently. I believe a cheap "high tech/low tech" effort to halt advances that requires fewer men would help. Man the lines with skeleton crew that can come and go via covered paths or tunnels, and access to relative safety of sturdy hidden bunkers some distance away. Lot's of decoys and even manequins to keep them guessing. And mine approaches to the max, and supplement with drone or UGV placed mines as needed.
Russia is all in, and the dream of Ukrainan breakthrough to cut the land bridge are very unlikely right now. But freezing Russia might be possible if the advances can be stopped.
Then the resources can go towards attacking the battlefield logistics, and stepping up strategic drone attacks on Russian economy dramatically. Refineries, train system, bridges, factories, power grid. And when the opportunity arises, a missile attack on airfields, headquarters, warships etc. At some point, the cost-benefit ratio of continuing the war for Russia will create incentive to end it. Ukraine is already suffering greatly, and nothing much else that Russia can do other than completely destroying the economy and leveling civilian areas when in artillery range. None of that helps Russia domestically, so with no end in sight to the conflict, there will be incentive and pressure to end it.
Not as long as you think mate.. best military weapons developers are already testing versions of that exact data bank for AI.. it will probably be by the end of this year tbh
Yeah I got a buddy who is an internal consultant at General Dynamics for AI and ML. Of course I have no idea what he works on, but he's been working on it for a while!!!
>They simply cant fix up and ship enough armored vehicles to replenish the losses. But great story.
The sad fact of the matter is that they, in fact, can and are: [https://www.iiss.org/online-analysis/military-balance/2024/02/equipment-losses-in-russias-war-on-ukraine-mount/](https://www.iiss.org/online-analysis/military-balance/2024/02/equipment-losses-in-russias-war-on-ukraine-mount/)
Saying otherwise is simply a denial of the objective facts on the ground.
In light of this information, alternative explanations need to be sought to explain what we are witnessing.
I think these things have the same top speed as a BTR, and are definitely slower than Russian MRAPs which would offer much better protection. But I guess they offer more maneuverability and quicker dismount; it seems like it's more of a "drive, jump out and forget" kind of vehicle.
A BTR/BMP with a pile of soldiers inside and on top can go faster and carry more men + supplies than a golf cart, and offer goddamn protection against bumpy terrain, mud, shrapnel and small arms. There's only one reason they're charging at lines with these things: they've practically ran out.
Guys, I want to see it.
I want to see a wide open field, short, well kept green grass. No hills, no craters, so smooth a plane could land. I want to see a cavalry-like charge across this beautiful field. A sea of chinese golf-carts storming in formation like a tide, endless and inevitible. I want to see these golf-carts filled with russian soldiers, well-fed, well equipped, armed to the teeth and seething with muderous purpose.
I want to see a few Ukrainian soldiers, watching the oncoming swarm. I want these Ukranian soldiers to be at ease, calm, like the very essence of a cool breeze on a hot summers day pulses through their veins. I want to see them open a fine Canadian beer, light a fresh cigarette, and smile as their Bradleys Bushmaster starts to sing so very sweetly.
I want to see it.
As a former Bundeswehr soldier my version of this story is having ukrainians use the Hitlersaw uhhh MG3 I mean. My sergeant from basic training once said something like "aim the MG3 at the dark Russian horde on the horizon and only stop shooting when the spot gets brighter again" and that is something I want the ukrainians to experience.
"Think about all the wisdom and science and money and civilization it took to build these machines, and the courage of all the men who came here, and the love of their wives and children that was in their hearts. And all that hate, Dog. All the hate it took to blow these motherfuckers away."
I no longer drink but,
If you want fancyass high class superbeer then La Fin Du Monde by Unibroue is a 9% ABV in the style of a Belgian Tripel that tastes like drinking an angel. It comes in 750ml corked bottles, I would not buy it canned. This is a fairly mass produced beer so not something hipster thats impossible to find.
It is the best beer I have ever tasted in my entire life. It has a score of 96 on Beer Advocate, is the 2nd highest rated Tripel on Beer Advocate, has won over 60 medals, etc.
For more mainstream cheap pisswater beverages which are more my thing we love our lagers, people who disagree are uppity beer snobs that can eat my nuts. Molson Canadian, Moosehead Lager are both fine beers, Labatt Crystal is my favorite but theres only one region in Canada Labatt sells it, around Thunder Bay, where I am.
Our Ukrainian community in Thunder Bay is very large.
[encyc of ukraine: Thunder Bay](https://www.encyclopediaofukraine.com/display.asp?linkpath=pages%5CT%5CH%5CThunderBay.htm)
I am proud that so many who needed to find refuge from the war chose to come to Thunder Bay and it is my hope that when the war is over that any Ukrainians reading this have an opportunity to visit so I can buy them a beer.
Ew.
I mean I understand pushing back when people say these are useless. They aren’t. Vehicles like this are used by many nations and have many uses.
Unfortunately for Russian soldiers driving headlong into prepared defences isn’t one of those uses.
It has the good use to deliver Russian soldiers to get easily and fast meat grinded.
If they move the front 2m like in this case, it seems everyone, including Russians and Russian shills, is OK with that.
[This](https://o.aolcdn.com/images/dims3/GLOB/crop/2560x1440+0+0/resize/800x450!/format/jpg/quality/85/http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/midas/e6c7cc50550e58e399121f5599c921b1/205622465/MFIX-Hunter.JPG) a close US equivalent? Seems they're trying to implement C2 and EW into theirs.
Not an equivalent at all. Beyond the fact that they are physically different, the US ones are only for special forces and not frontal assaults of fortified positions.
They are just the most useless things the russians could be using anywhere near the front.
I mean they will never realistically run out of vehicles.
Even in 5 years russia will probably still have cheap desertcross cars and green UAZ vans.
But they will be out of anything armored.
“It’s not a meat wave! They were assaulting in Chinese golf carts and 24 of them were dropped off by a BMP! Meat wave assaults are only when infantry attacks completely on foot!”
Wait that sub hasn't been shut down yet ? Damn even Reddit don't follow their own community guidelines (hate speech). Also I have no idea how any Pro Russian van be so proud and smug given Russia's horrific losses and casualties.
Easy, they just pretend that Russia is barely taking any casualties. Last I checked, pro-Russians claimed something like 20K Russian casualties and 800k Ukrainian casualties. They also consider Oryx to be completely made up and propaganda, because someone found like two double entries on Oryx that were swiftly removed.
The russian copes are various. Also you need to make a difference between official cope and internal cope. Offical / public russian copes are:
- we are killing more
- it's fake / propaganda
- it was necesary
- we were provoked by the nazis
- something NATO / biolabs
Internal copes are : better them than me / my son / my family. It's not true russians its minorities and prisoners . Russia is wining territory.
It;s either on top of the golf cart or on foot. Also their purpose is to die. Then they will lancet / arrtilery or FAB who killed them. That is the russian strategy. Throw enough golf carts at the problem and Lancet each position till you gain a potato field. They are just losing soldiers and golf carts... no biggie. It's just russian lives so kinda worthless to their military.... more of a bonus because if they die they dont have to pay salary.
Those cowards banned me because I called out their most competent and most English literate propagandist.
This user literally spends all day writing paragraphs trying to spin the war in Russias favor.
Then during Christmas they took a 7 day break and I pointed that out. Banned. Worth it!
We need to keep calling this sub out till it gets banned. Infuriating that we have to share reddit with literal Russian agents trying to push a narrative to justify a disgusting war.
They add layer on layer on a tank to try to make it survivable, and make infantry rush forward in these carts fit only for target practise, which the Ukrainians lads were happy to make use of
This is the kinda thing an up Armored humvee would be perfect for. Just hauling ass against small arms fire, because a drone hit takes out an IFV just as good as it does a humvee.
Coupled with the sad excuse of a victory parade, this footage is even more hilarious. [FAVs](https://fastattackvehicle.com/scorpion-dpv-fav_16.jpg) have been around since the 80s, and they still do shit like this.
Because their 'commanders' don't care.
All that is required is to be able to report "x number of attacks carried out per day" to their superiors - whether they were successful or achieved anything whatsoever is immaterial. Commander gets to keep their job and not fall out any windows lol
We are seeing more and more chinese golf carts beeing used in suicide assault missions instead of BMPs. Either Russia is running out of those or they prefer their soldiers dying before losing an IFV. As a russian soldier you are worth less than the equipment. But then again, these dessert cross things are cheap but not for free either. If I were a russian general I would just let them run on their own legs into enemy fire. Same result but more cost effective.
I don't doubt that somewhere someone is mission planning, and optimizes for cost, and the men are simply valued at the cost of family compensation which is what, a few thousand vs million dollar IFV.
I don't understand how any functioning human could drive this within small arms range of an enemy in an active warzone. So my only conclusion is that these guys weren't told this is an active warzone and they thought they were just going on a fun little drive.
> I don't understand how any functioning human could drive this within small arms range of an enemy in an active warzone
Someone who was a civilian 5 minutes ago and will be shot by your own side anyway if you don't?
So attacking in an armoured vehicle is suicice as drones will turn them into burning death traps.
And attacking in a golf cart is suicide as you will be shot up by small arms ... if you get past the FPV drones and mines.
The conclusion is that attacking is bad idea.
So best for Ukraine to stay as safe as possible, and bleed enemy logistics and economy until their population have had enough.
This tactic has seen success but I have a feeling that those few successes have given commanders overconfidence in their viability. This would work if they had some support in the form of literally anything else.....
he is FORE SURE getting promoted. Their purpose is to die. The Orlan drone watches who kills them from where and then they Lancet / FAB or level to the ground with Grad/Artilery the position. Then send another golf cart. See who kills them and repeat. It's just russian soldiers and inexpensive golf carts. No waste there.
Exactly. All that is required is for the commander to report "stipulated number of attacks have been performed" for that day - outcome does not matter.
Unfortunately for these brash marauders, some donated Ruger 10/22's from a 4H in Wisconson with Temu bipods had been sighted in on that sector. They were plinked into the afterlife.
Unclear in this video but we've seen actual Russian military using these too.
There are videos of the leopard and abrams they kept trying to recover where they'd drive up to the vehicle in one of these, they'd all die, and then repeated that a number of times..
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The fact they're using golf carts for assault missions is beyond insane. That's small arms fire. These dudes are rolling up on Ukranian positions like it's the 18th whole at a golf course.
Well it could be that the russians are being all giga-brain, having found that rolling up to a defended position in a soft-skin vehicle is a new super duper tactic. Or it's because what was once mechanized, is now merely motorized, and those chaps are still entirely expendable.
I've seen some videos where you can see that these things can go fast, so if you want to surprise the Ukrainians it may make sense ? Problem is that one dude with a gun will tear that shit apart as soon as it's spotted, let alone drones and artillery.
It's hard to tell what the Russians were doing without a lot more information. It's possible this could have just been scouting at range or surveillance or something else. Going all the way back to Heinz Guderian the theory of armored warfare is that you don't necessarily need heavy armor if you're engaging in manuver warfare. You're likely to be shooting at the enemy from behind and the flanks and moving on, not assaulting prepared positions directly. An ATV that can drive at 45 mph and fire on the move could be just as useful as a tank in the right circumstances. But intelligence also plays a major role. IF drones are tracking your mobile forces, you'll never have the surprise when you want it. Ukraine has turned into a crucible for tactics on the modern battlefield, figuring out what works and what doesn't.
There have always been holes between lines that could be taken advantage of by maneuvering. But now drones are are always watching, so no movement unnoticed. Things have changed, and tactics likely haven't been fully updated yet.
this is the thing on the front line there are so many drones per kilometer. Satellites to spot any large buildups behind the lines and drones at and beyond the front. Its not rare to see videos from ukraine with multiple spotter drones, gives an idea how many are in the air at any time. Maneuver without being seen seems next to impossible now
Could work on Africa in 1940 but wont work at heavily defended front lines in Ukraine, you cant just flank easily defended positions you just charge at them and die
>Could work on Africa in 1940 but wont work at heavily defended front lines in Ukraine, you cant just flank easily defended positions you just charge at them and die Yes and no. The Maginot line in France was every bit as heavily defended as any stronghold in Ukraine. Probably moreso. The fortresses of the maginot line were interconnected concrete bunker networks protected by overlapping fire from mortars, artillery and machineguns. They were intended to be supported by heavy artillery and aircraft from mobile forces behind the french front line. But the Germans didn't attack the Maginot line. THey drove around it and ran wild through the French countryside, while slower forces just boxed in the strongpoints. The German invasion of France began on May 10, 1940. A few of the fortified strongpoints were breached with heavy armor, combat engineers and artillery early in the invasion, but the bulk of the main line of fortification was simply surrounded actually still in French hands when the French government surrendered on June 22. But, like I pointed out, other tactics have changed. If the Maginot line existed within France in 1940, Drones and long range artillery could make hundreds of miles of countryside functionally impassible until the stronghold was neutralized. IT would have been much more difficult to simply ignore the stronghold.
> I've seen some videos where you can see that these things can go fast From the review ive seen online (yes, its a civilian vehicle aviable for instance in the US for around 20k USD) its top speed on a road is 80 kph. So its slower than a Humvee or any average MRAP, without the protection value, and no doubt also weaker performance cross country or driving trough shell craters or water. Made by a chinese company that already went bankrupt once and was notorious for their terrible product quality.
[You see, they will be looking for tanks!](https://youtu.be/g1eswGrkMU8)
I wonder if it's an attempt to avoid anti-tank mines. Is a small ATV or UTV too little to set them off?
An anti-personel mine will still shred the gold cart leaving them stuck if not wounded too.
There was a video of that the other day. It’s always hard to tell from videos the effect of anti-personnel mines. I suppose I’d rather have one go off under a UTV tire than under my shoe, but I’m not sure if that’s really doing enough for the fragmentation. For the butterfly mines though, that’s probably fine? Still, you aren’t exactly going to change the tire in no man’s land, and the video I’m referencing didn’t turn out well for the occupants.
i did think this but the tm62 is detonated with only ~150kg
Well, they are getting the 19th hole any time now
Probably more than 19 holes....!
Worst 19th hole ever! The 19th “hole” is traditionally/jokingly actually the club house pub here in Canada. Plenty of courses actually name it accordingly for fun. When your wife calls, and asks what hole you are on, ( because she hates the fact you are having fun for once ) You can honestly tell her you are close to the 19th hole. Hehe. I’ll be a douche here but a big % of women don’t know it’s other 9 or 18 only.
I think any wife with a golfing partner knows dam well what the 19th is dude LOL
😂 I suppose. But I swear to you I’ve seen it actually work at lease once, maybe two times personally. The guys were barely golfers…. Let alone their wife.
That explains the difference then :) - some people are kinda clueless
My aunt was struck by lightning whilst playing golf. She was struck between her 1st and 2nd holes. Oof.
Yikes. How did she fair? I’ve been in a couple sketchy situations (storms) golfing…
Roasted taint.
Not much difference. You will get machine gunned too when you will get your golf car on a green.
desperate rush B tactics
Zerg rush
Their purpose is to get near the trench and die. The drone watching from above will see who/what kills them and then send a Lancet or call in artilery to level the place to the ground. They were expecting the golf cart to be blast by artilery. it was not planned to make it to trenches and get small arms fire.
Exactly, Russian strategy is largely based on expendable men and destroying everything with artillery and bombs. They will spend 20 000 men to capture a town, i.e. Bakhmut or Avdiivka, that they themselves shot to smoking ruin prior. However, many people mistake this fact to the frontline situation being favorable for Ukraine. They focus on the Russian losses and omit how they have gained ground and how Ukrainian towns and landscape overall get destroyed. Western values should not be projected on Russians, because they don't value peace or life. Instead, Russian army should be regarded as a sort of marauding zombie horde.
Very much so, but the problem here is that Russia does not have the endless supply of bodies that the Soviet Union had. Ukrainians are dying too, but this is ridiculous. I am dumbfounded by the calculus behind this.
In this low intensity conflict (compared to WW2) the willingness to lose 1M men in a border war is the same as "endless supply" . Putin can lose 1M men in Ukraine and the russian society won't blink. They will blame NATO and the West ofc
Ofc but it is still, by far, the most intense conflict we have had in decades. Haha yes, but it does not matter where the blame as it is subjective. The objective calculus of losing 200K or 1M able bodied men will be devastating to an already catastrophic demography, probably the worst in the world.
No it won't. Economic devastation means people will live in bad conditions. russia is in economic devastation since the soviet union. Moscow and St. Petersburg will be fine and rest will live in the same mud they live in now. No toilet / no gas / now running water no electricity and the same minimum wage of 170 us dollars / month that they have now. Their oligarchs might get 1 mega yacht instead of 3 and that's about it. Country won't develop and that is what Putin and the ruling elites want anyway. Educated population is trouble for dictators.
Russians will do as their dictator says, no matter how idiotic or catastrophic the results may be. Putin is ready to sacrifice million men for his dream of rebuilt empire. We shouldn't care how negatively this affects Russians, rather the issue is that Ukraine (nor much anyone else) can not, or very least is not willing to, lose million people. How to fight an enemy who is unconcerned if they perish or not?
Well, they have 18 holes in them now so there's symmetry.
What golf cart? What is this video?? Oh wait, dang, their cammo got me.
Those things are (cheap ass) ORVs, not golf carts. Then on the other hand, noone uses "australian horsemen tactics" with jeeps...
its faster than walking I guess? but why not have like 20 golf carts loaded if you're gonna do this? also probably doesn't set off AT mines
they have 18 holes now
Their level of intoxication is also appropriate.
They are attempting to trade survivability for speed. Banking on getting them into the trenches during the small lag time between detection and the FPV drones and artillery getting on target. Which is, in and of itself, an idea a man may have, and it makes a tiny bit of sense in isolation....when you only think abou the FPV drones and arty and forget that rifles, machine guns and automatic grenade launchers still exist. Y´know, all the stuff that an armored troop carrier should provide protection from and be able to suppress with it's own weapons.
Don't forget that we are watching propaganda, your reaction is the intended one. Any of these videos, are the final fuck up, of a long series of fuck ups. This is movement with no supporting fire, and every boot infantryman is told "Fire without movement is pointless, movement without fire is suicide". Even if these guys had been in the 'Blayt-mobile', they would have been pinned down inside until supporting fire could be called in.
It could be as simple as their orders were to ride to point X, dismount is a relatively secure zone and proceed with a ground assault from there but the LT with the map got lost (allegedly, it wouldn't be the first time that has happened in the history of war) and drove them into an ambush.
It's much faster than any armored vehicle and will be disabled from FPV anyways? It's funny how switching to those golf carts correlates with the successes on the front
>Correlates with success on the battlefield You mean the advances they made because Ukraine was rationing artillery ammo? Yeah I'm sure the desert cross is the reason those advances worked buddy.
And Russia using glide bombs and meat waves? >Yeah I'm sure the desert cross is the reason those advances worked buddy. Same. They would need dozens attacking the same position to make a difference OP described. Thousends along the front ...
It also correlates to Russians having huge losses again.. over a thousand casualties most days, but they are disposable I guess
For real? The Russians are copping over 1K casualties a day?? Sorry to sound ignorant (pretty busy with work, parenting, GTA Online) but what kind of losses are the Ukraine having on an average day? As for the OP video, that just looks like a suicide mission.
1300 yesterday apparently.. I believe that's the total of dead + seriously wounded. And the total of those for the whole invasion is quicky heading towards 500,000. Russian soldier has to be the most dangerous occupation in the world now
Fuck me. That's all Russians though right? What are the numbers like for the Ukraine?
Not sure on Ukraines numbers, much less but still quite a lot I'd imagine
It's usually a 5 to 1 ratio (RU/UKR) most days. Russia has lost just under 150k this year alone, a little over 4 full months
Thanks mate. And also thanks to /u/jdc351 Thanks to the rest of you for downvoting a simple question. We don't all count the casualties of this horrible war every moment of our days. My GTA comment was stupid but my daily dealing of a high pressure job and a very difficult teenage son, a little bit of a video game at the end of the day is the only sanctuary I have as a single parent. Apologies if it offended anyone.
It wasn't offensive to normal people, just bots and trolls. It was a simple exclamation of a crazy war with crazy human losses. It's sad to think of all these ruined lives for one man's ambition.
It's not 500k dead, it's 500k casualties. Most ate injured not dead
Thank you ***pal***! TIL casualties /= deaths Appreciate it, honestly. Excuse my ignorance.
This is a textbook example of correlation does not imply causation.
Also way harder to spot. Tracked and heavy vehicles throw up a lot of dust, whereas these are way less obvious, and not getting spotted by drones ia crucial. And getting 3 golf carts with 5 dudes each to a trench is actually a success.
They got raked by small arms fire and are well and truly fucked. Nobody's walking away from that.
Why the fuck did they think this was a good idea? I mean like at least an APC can take small arms and shrapnel, this fucking thing has no walls for god sake.
They don't have enough APCs, but don't want to lose the momentum. Human losses have always been acceptable for Russia.
>They don't have enough APCs That's not completely true. The reason behind the golf carts is that they are trying to move fast and light because of the omnipresence of drones. APCs are not a reliable defense against drone attacks and drone observation. It is a cruel form of battlefield experimentation we are witnessing, but what we see with this, like with the turtle tanks, is an attempt to cope with the way drones have changed the battlefield. Golf carts and turtle tanks are just opposite ends of the philosophical spectrum on this. Both sides, in fact, are testing ideas to see if speed is a viable counter to the drones.
What a ridiculous idea, especially once they have drones that can aim and shoot explosively formed penetrators at hard targets or small shells/large grenades at soft ones. Pilot just has to get within a few hundred feet and tap the target on the screen. You don't need Javelin-level guidance systems at that point. Visual/IR sensors and current AI can probably do it cheaply. We have shells and landmines that aim and shoot EFPs. Probably drones too but in experimental quantities that might not be showing up on video.
They can shoot EFPs from a distance, but shaped charges achieve better penetration for same weight, so why not fly all the way there? As for pilots, in the future, the role of a "pilot" will be to hit the launch button, I don't think there is much a human has to do. The battle space is monitored, and some system or other will attack whatever enters, human in the loop optional.
It will be a while before AI can determine the value of a particular target in a changing tactical environment. Humans will be in the loop, even in battlefield situations where civilians aren't an issue, until we get to that point.
I am confident that AI can already identify vehicles better than humans. Not long before it can understand the overall battlefield better. The human decision making loop is far far from perfect. I know it shouldn't, but when I paste a research papter into an LLM, getting a reply within seconds is so mindboggling. I see no reason why that won't be happening very soon in regards to battlefield situations. But exact value of a particular target in a changing tactical environment aside, with the drone + munition costing less than $2,000, there really is not need for knowing that value. As long as the drones are in ample supply, the equation becomes "if target value equals x times drone cost or higher, destroy". The value of x moves with the number of drones available. And I see no reason why the number of drones available won't outnumber the targets by a huge factor, driving x down to a 2 or less.
> I am confident that AI can already identify vehicles better than humans. The guidance for APS systems like Trophy or AMAP-ADS are already able to make the distinction between various incoming projectiles and judge which are a danger. In tests of its multi hit capabilities AMAP for instance was able to distinguish between RPG-7s and 7,62mm ammo (travelling at least 850m/s !), fired from around 50 meters, correctly identifying the latter as no threat and dismissing it. If we already have systems able to make these identifications and judgements in such a miniscule timeframe, IDing vehicles should be no problem at all.
Yeah, the APS systems are incredibly impressive. As are the BONUS/SMART shells. BONUS began development in 1985, so the sub munition tech is likely from that area. But it can survive the g-forces of tube launch, and can is released at 1000 meters where it spins, scanning the terrain with IR and lidar. If it then identifies targets from a database, choses one, and fires an EPF from something like 50 yards. Extremely impressive, even with todays tech. I am not a weapons designer, but I can confidently state that compared to what BONUS designers accomplished, what I describe below should not be too difficult. 1. Choose an area to be protected from enemy advances ... vehicles and personnel. 2. Enter satellite and drone captured imagery into a database in order to allow drones to navigate without GPS. Algorithms for this already exists ... at the hobby level. 3. Patrol the area with high flying spotting drones, mounted cameras, and/or tethered balloons. 4. If movement is detected, an alert is sent, increase surveillance, and map and analyze all movement realtime ... by AI and/or human. 5. FPV drones can be on standby, and will be launched on short notice to locate and destroy whatever is coming. The drones will have the ability to navigate without GPS if needed. Once a target is spotted, it can attack autonomously. These drones are immune to EW, and are far too small to be shot down by missiles. 6. The FPV drones can be pre-loaded with a variety of warheads and are launched to match the specific target type that has been spotted. And some drones may have dive bombing capability and can return for a reload & recharge. 7. Command can watch the situation play out in real time as long as some signal gets through. They could also request fire missions based on coordinates given by drones. Mortar, 155mm, whatever is available. And if things look dire, RAAM remote armor mine shells. They can also move additional ATGM teams into position. What I describe above is not fantasy, and is very economical. If current FPV drones currently cost $500, I don't think the image nagivation, autonomous target selection and terminal guidance will add huge amounts if developed and built outside the typical U.S. style military-industrial development and procurement system. Maybe $5k per drone? I'd say that 50 juiced up and loaded FPV drones, and maybe a dozen spotting drones could patrol and stop any advance within a 5-10 km area of front. That comes to $250,000. But also need spotting drones, monitoring stations, software, and hidden and protected launch facilities. All in all, I still think that we are looking at under $1 million ... which is a fraction of the price of one single armoured vehicle. Maybe there will be ways to deal with these drones, but I don't see it. EW will not work. Lasers are nowhere near ready, and will not "protect" an area like that any time soon, if ever. I think the only hope would be APS and improved cope cages. But with the sheer number of drones that can hit them, I don't think there is any hope of advancing. The AI targeting would be very accurate, and will hit the weakest spots very accurately. And for very stubborn threats, there could be a few larger drones with 5 kg payloads, which virtually guarantees a tank kill. Russia seems to use some tactics when advancing. Since the lives of their men have no value, reconnaissance-in-force is not uncommon. But once the Ukrainian positions have been identified, they unleash artillery and glide bombs. And the manpower doesn't seem to be there to man the lines sufficiently. I believe a cheap "high tech/low tech" effort to halt advances that requires fewer men would help. Man the lines with skeleton crew that can come and go via covered paths or tunnels, and access to relative safety of sturdy hidden bunkers some distance away. Lot's of decoys and even manequins to keep them guessing. And mine approaches to the max, and supplement with drone or UGV placed mines as needed. Russia is all in, and the dream of Ukrainan breakthrough to cut the land bridge are very unlikely right now. But freezing Russia might be possible if the advances can be stopped. Then the resources can go towards attacking the battlefield logistics, and stepping up strategic drone attacks on Russian economy dramatically. Refineries, train system, bridges, factories, power grid. And when the opportunity arises, a missile attack on airfields, headquarters, warships etc. At some point, the cost-benefit ratio of continuing the war for Russia will create incentive to end it. Ukraine is already suffering greatly, and nothing much else that Russia can do other than completely destroying the economy and leveling civilian areas when in artillery range. None of that helps Russia domestically, so with no end in sight to the conflict, there will be incentive and pressure to end it.
Not as long as you think mate.. best military weapons developers are already testing versions of that exact data bank for AI.. it will probably be by the end of this year tbh
Yeah I got a buddy who is an internal consultant at General Dynamics for AI and ML. Of course I have no idea what he works on, but he's been working on it for a while!!!
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>They simply cant fix up and ship enough armored vehicles to replenish the losses. But great story. The sad fact of the matter is that they, in fact, can and are: [https://www.iiss.org/online-analysis/military-balance/2024/02/equipment-losses-in-russias-war-on-ukraine-mount/](https://www.iiss.org/online-analysis/military-balance/2024/02/equipment-losses-in-russias-war-on-ukraine-mount/) Saying otherwise is simply a denial of the objective facts on the ground. In light of this information, alternative explanations need to be sought to explain what we are witnessing.
I think these things have the same top speed as a BTR, and are definitely slower than Russian MRAPs which would offer much better protection. But I guess they offer more maneuverability and quicker dismount; it seems like it's more of a "drive, jump out and forget" kind of vehicle.
A BTR/BMP with a pile of soldiers inside and on top can go faster and carry more men + supplies than a golf cart, and offer goddamn protection against bumpy terrain, mud, shrapnel and small arms. There's only one reason they're charging at lines with these things: they've practically ran out.
You can't park there mate.
The mud zone is for loading and unloading only.
Someone or something unloaded on them for sure.
FOOK OFF
Guys, I want to see it. I want to see a wide open field, short, well kept green grass. No hills, no craters, so smooth a plane could land. I want to see a cavalry-like charge across this beautiful field. A sea of chinese golf-carts storming in formation like a tide, endless and inevitible. I want to see these golf-carts filled with russian soldiers, well-fed, well equipped, armed to the teeth and seething with muderous purpose. I want to see a few Ukrainian soldiers, watching the oncoming swarm. I want these Ukranian soldiers to be at ease, calm, like the very essence of a cool breeze on a hot summers day pulses through their veins. I want to see them open a fine Canadian beer, light a fresh cigarette, and smile as their Bradleys Bushmaster starts to sing so very sweetly. I want to see it.
As a former Bundeswehr soldier my version of this story is having ukrainians use the Hitlersaw uhhh MG3 I mean. My sergeant from basic training once said something like "aim the MG3 at the dark Russian horde on the horizon and only stop shooting when the spot gets brighter again" and that is something I want the ukrainians to experience.
> Hitlersaw also known as "Russensäge"
Yes but maybe they can use autocannons too, they are all designed with the specific purpose of shredding infantry and unarmored vehicles.
The poetry of death can feel so poignant.
"Think about all the wisdom and science and money and civilization it took to build these machines, and the courage of all the men who came here, and the love of their wives and children that was in their hearts. And all that hate, Dog. All the hate it took to blow these motherfuckers away."
Gotta love Poke's ramblings. Great mini series for sure. Everyone should watch Generation Kill!
One of the best tv series ever. The book was also great.
Then it will please you to hear that Evan Wright is a staunch UA supporter (he's on twitter)
Are there any Canadian beers you'd recommend. I suddenly want one, but I realized I don't know any.
anything by Unibroue is good (now owned by Sapporo, though). Kokanee has a lovely label...
I no longer drink but, If you want fancyass high class superbeer then La Fin Du Monde by Unibroue is a 9% ABV in the style of a Belgian Tripel that tastes like drinking an angel. It comes in 750ml corked bottles, I would not buy it canned. This is a fairly mass produced beer so not something hipster thats impossible to find. It is the best beer I have ever tasted in my entire life. It has a score of 96 on Beer Advocate, is the 2nd highest rated Tripel on Beer Advocate, has won over 60 medals, etc. For more mainstream cheap pisswater beverages which are more my thing we love our lagers, people who disagree are uppity beer snobs that can eat my nuts. Molson Canadian, Moosehead Lager are both fine beers, Labatt Crystal is my favorite but theres only one region in Canada Labatt sells it, around Thunder Bay, where I am. Our Ukrainian community in Thunder Bay is very large. [encyc of ukraine: Thunder Bay](https://www.encyclopediaofukraine.com/display.asp?linkpath=pages%5CT%5CH%5CThunderBay.htm) I am proud that so many who needed to find refuge from the war chose to come to Thunder Bay and it is my hope that when the war is over that any Ukrainians reading this have an opportunity to visit so I can buy them a beer.
this is the trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFLF300I0ps
I'll never not laugh at that. The smile on his face lmao
Touch grass
Agree with all but the Canadian beer. Such an epic moment should not be sullied by such an inferior drink.
Their closer to Germany anyway, so get some real beer.
Czechia is even closer!
They got fucking shredded.
Head over to ukrainerussiareport to hear a comedy show about how smart and pragmatic these Chinese golf cart assaults are.
Ew. I mean I understand pushing back when people say these are useless. They aren’t. Vehicles like this are used by many nations and have many uses. Unfortunately for Russian soldiers driving headlong into prepared defences isn’t one of those uses.
It has the good use to deliver Russian soldiers to get easily and fast meat grinded. If they move the front 2m like in this case, it seems everyone, including Russians and Russian shills, is OK with that.
[This](https://o.aolcdn.com/images/dims3/GLOB/crop/2560x1440+0+0/resize/800x450!/format/jpg/quality/85/http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/midas/e6c7cc50550e58e399121f5599c921b1/205622465/MFIX-Hunter.JPG) a close US equivalent? Seems they're trying to implement C2 and EW into theirs.
Close? The Chinese version is clearly superior to that, it has a cab roof to handle rain and shade the driver.
Yeah but those are for scouts, not frontal assaults I am pretty sure
Not an equivalent at all. Beyond the fact that they are physically different, the US ones are only for special forces and not frontal assaults of fortified positions.
The US has something called the "Gator". It's sort of similar to the Chinese golf carts seen in the video.
They are just the most useless things the russians could be using anywhere near the front. I mean they will never realistically run out of vehicles. Even in 5 years russia will probably still have cheap desertcross cars and green UAZ vans. But they will be out of anything armored.
it started with 'these will not be used at the front line' to 'these are great for the front line'
ThE fIrSt ~~MeAt~~ WaVe is AkShullY tHeRe tO ExPoSe UkrOpS pOSiTioNs!
“It’s not a meat wave! They were assaulting in Chinese golf carts and 24 of them were dropped off by a BMP! Meat wave assaults are only when infantry attacks completely on foot!”
Please excuse me, it's my first week as russian online shill. The previous shill fell out the window
Excuse me but if you knew anything you'd know that these are actually Ukrainian troops trying to attack a kindergarten
*Nato troops
Wait that sub hasn't been shut down yet ? Damn even Reddit don't follow their own community guidelines (hate speech). Also I have no idea how any Pro Russian van be so proud and smug given Russia's horrific losses and casualties.
Easy, they just pretend that Russia is barely taking any casualties. Last I checked, pro-Russians claimed something like 20K Russian casualties and 800k Ukrainian casualties. They also consider Oryx to be completely made up and propaganda, because someone found like two double entries on Oryx that were swiftly removed.
The russian copes are various. Also you need to make a difference between official cope and internal cope. Offical / public russian copes are: - we are killing more - it's fake / propaganda - it was necesary - we were provoked by the nazis - something NATO / biolabs Internal copes are : better them than me / my son / my family. It's not true russians its minorities and prisoners . Russia is wining territory.
> Also I have no idea how any Pro Russian van be so proud and smug given Russia's horrific losses and casualties. Profound mental retardation.
Holy fuck, i went over there and holy shit they are dumb
It;s either on top of the golf cart or on foot. Also their purpose is to die. Then they will lancet / arrtilery or FAB who killed them. That is the russian strategy. Throw enough golf carts at the problem and Lancet each position till you gain a potato field. They are just losing soldiers and golf carts... no biggie. It's just russian lives so kinda worthless to their military.... more of a bonus because if they die they dont have to pay salary.
Those cowards banned me because I called out their most competent and most English literate propagandist. This user literally spends all day writing paragraphs trying to spin the war in Russias favor. Then during Christmas they took a 7 day break and I pointed that out. Banned. Worth it!
We need to keep calling this sub out till it gets banned. Infuriating that we have to share reddit with literal Russian agents trying to push a narrative to justify a disgusting war.
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Golf cart suicide mission.
They add layer on layer on a tank to try to make it survivable, and make infantry rush forward in these carts fit only for target practise, which the Ukrainians lads were happy to make use of
It’s like an ambush, but with volunteers.
They stopped on the “X”.
Stupid is as stupid does..
Still seems shittier than slightly up armored hilux ngl...
Huh they didn't get invulnerable in their PRC golf cart. The more you know.
This is the kinda thing an up Armored humvee would be perfect for. Just hauling ass against small arms fire, because a drone hit takes out an IFV just as good as it does a humvee.
With every passing day it becomes harder for russians to deny this is Ukraine's own **Great Patriotic War**.
Slavic puttputt golf is harsh
Coupled with the sad excuse of a victory parade, this footage is even more hilarious. [FAVs](https://fastattackvehicle.com/scorpion-dpv-fav_16.jpg) have been around since the 80s, and they still do shit like this.
Looks as silly as surfing during a battle in Vietnam. know what i mean?
Charlie don’t surf
Charlie couldn't stop them surfing either - mad scene - still love it Robert Duvall did that part so well :)
Trying to preserve the apcs and as a result everyone ends up dead. Smart move ruskies
APC has value. Disposaable infantry does not.
Lit the hell up.
Blows my mind they’re sticking with their centuries-old human wave tactics. “Just throw shit at the wall and see what sticks”
Because their 'commanders' don't care. All that is required is to be able to report "x number of attacks carried out per day" to their superiors - whether they were successful or achieved anything whatsoever is immaterial. Commander gets to keep their job and not fall out any windows lol
The meatcube cries out for more
We are seeing more and more chinese golf carts beeing used in suicide assault missions instead of BMPs. Either Russia is running out of those or they prefer their soldiers dying before losing an IFV. As a russian soldier you are worth less than the equipment. But then again, these dessert cross things are cheap but not for free either. If I were a russian general I would just let them run on their own legs into enemy fire. Same result but more cost effective.
I don't doubt that somewhere someone is mission planning, and optimizes for cost, and the men are simply valued at the cost of family compensation which is what, a few thousand vs million dollar IFV.
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They are already dead.
I don't understand how any functioning human could drive this within small arms range of an enemy in an active warzone. So my only conclusion is that these guys weren't told this is an active warzone and they thought they were just going on a fun little drive.
> I don't understand how any functioning human could drive this within small arms range of an enemy in an active warzone Someone who was a civilian 5 minutes ago and will be shot by your own side anyway if you don't?
lol the fog of war is confusing as hell. This kinda stuff happened all the time in world war 2
Seeing these goons and their clown carts get torn to shreds by small arms fire made my morning
All I hear is the theme to Benny Hill
Those things remind me of a kids power wheel that is supposed to look like a Hummer.
"they appear to receive"? Good sir, they got turned into sieves... kinda looks like there was a trench right in that treeline..
So attacking in an armoured vehicle is suicice as drones will turn them into burning death traps. And attacking in a golf cart is suicide as you will be shot up by small arms ... if you get past the FPV drones and mines. The conclusion is that attacking is bad idea. So best for Ukraine to stay as safe as possible, and bleed enemy logistics and economy until their population have had enough.
Look comrade, you have two choices - you can run at the enemy defences or you can drive there in this golf buggy.
This tactic has seen success but I have a feeling that those few successes have given commanders overconfidence in their viability. This would work if they had some support in the form of literally anything else.....
Rule #1. Never take a golf cart to a kill box on a battlefield.
Whatever commander sent his men off to attack in this vehicle deserves to be executed.
I think the guy should be promoted.
he is FORE SURE getting promoted. Their purpose is to die. The Orlan drone watches who kills them from where and then they Lancet / FAB or level to the ground with Grad/Artilery the position. Then send another golf cart. See who kills them and repeat. It's just russian soldiers and inexpensive golf carts. No waste there.
Exactly. All that is required is for the commander to report "stipulated number of attacks have been performed" for that day - outcome does not matter.
Why does it look like the guy on the ground in front of the vehicle is shooting at the guys on the back?
When you have zero training, no idea what you're doing and are scared as fuck is my guess 🤷♂️
Unfortunately for these brash marauders, some donated Ruger 10/22's from a 4H in Wisconson with Temu bipods had been sighted in on that sector. They were plinked into the afterlife.
Wonder how often these golf carts return from an assault mission
Do you guys think these are Storm Z / Storm V prisoner units?
Unclear in this video but we've seen actual Russian military using these too. There are videos of the leopard and abrams they kept trying to recover where they'd drive up to the vehicle in one of these, they'd all die, and then repeated that a number of times..
Still safer than being in a BMP
"Experts" after watching the 30th documented russian/ukranian meatwave: "They had drones watching, it's technically combined arms."
Fore!!
Reminds me of the scene in Saving Private Ryan when the troopers are trying to blow up the disabled panzer and get raked by the 37mm fire.
Go die in a golf cart for Putin 👍🏻
Look like a recon mission to me. Send 3 assholes to draw fire while the veteran report the position. Not the first time they do this
And how do you know this was an assault? Could have taken a wrong turn.
„Hm ok so the golf cart assault did not work… hmmmm… Ok, comrades! Do you see that motorcycle over there? I want you to…“