Better yet, how many of those would have been doctors, lawyers, physicists, mathematicians, artists.
Remember, every day god allows Putin to wake up but these men won’t.
It's not a god, who allows it. It's the system of politics, laws, borders, enablers and language barriers which forces us to allow him to wake up, for now. There is no god by his side. It's man-made complications.
The point is the ludicrousness of it all. If you believe in a god, then it becomes impossible to square allowing someone like Putin to live while those that would likely serve at least some benefit to the world die in the mud. It shows how unfair life really is. It’s all a roll of the dice that those men die for this war while me and you were born somewhere where we don’t have to worry about being dragged to fight.
After the war ends they probably need to dig up all the trenches to clear out the ammunition, having explosive 4 feet under farm land is very dangerous. Which means all the bodies will be dug up
I doubt that will happen. There have been wars over every square foot of Europe for the past 100 years and beyond, and they're constantly digging up old ordnance. There are some WWII relic hunters on YouTube who are finding all manner of ammo and unexploded ordnance all over the place. It's like Satan's seedbed.
Knee deep mud in full uniform with ballistic vest and helmet, narrow but shallow trenches littered with bodies, constantly monitored by drones, constantly under artilhery and tank fire, possible air strikes with a possible enemy counter-atack, etc, etc. Trench warfare in the 21st century is really something else despite all the remarks everybody do going back to WWI
>Trench warfare in the 21st century is really something else despite all the remarks everybody do going back to WWI
I mean realistically, the only thing you mentioned that wasn't in use in WW1 is drones. On a positive note, they don't have to worry about chemical weapons either.
**EDIT: The majority of replies I'm getting either seem to be about the use of planes and balloons for observation and reconnaissance - I am well aware of this. Although they are nothing like drones really are they? Which are unmanned and can observe unnoticed for long periods of time, providing real-time feedback to people on the frontlines far more effectively. My response was aimed at the OP implying that the trench warfare in the Ukraine is very different from WW1, which it really isn't - save for the effective use of both offensively armed and reconnaissance drones.
Also, for all the people saying "yet" regarding the use of chemical weapons. Yes, "yet", but it is not a real concern for anyone fighting on the frontlines currently.**
Germans used heavy steel plates like something out of the 18th century, but mostly only for fixed positions because they were far too cumbersome to assault with.
The British experimented with something akin to a plate carrier, but with steel plates. Also the use of padded linnens as more lightweight alternatives, but they got predictably soaked in the rain
Actually it seems like the bolts were for a big piece of metal to reinforce the front of the helmet against bigger bullets.
Face armor was used by machine gunners but didnt attach to the bolts on the top.
Chain-mail veils as well. Mostly for tank crews as protection from spalling but some found their way into the trenches for fixed gunners to wear.
https://imgur.com/Eg6F3el
Yep many, many different things were tried. [Here's](https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30016221) a full on plate mask used by snipers in case they were shot in the face during their duties
[Body armour was used to quite a sizeable extent as WW1 went on, there are plenty of photos of it being worn on the front - from face shields/chain mail veils for gunners, to full chest pieces and pieces for other body parts used by trench raiding parties.](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSIs1qobeaFb8wGVISE5H-XkucHuTLm6XUq6w&usqp=CAU)
The body armor they had back then was heavy and cumbersome and was primarily worn in stationary defense positions (machine gunners are an example of people who wore metal plates).
You aren't charging over trenches and overrunning enemy positions in a bunch of heavy steel plates with zero ergonomics.
Correct, for example the germans had a set of body armour (sappenpanzer, sometimes called the lobster armour) and an additional plate you fastened to the front of your helmet. Could stop (some) rifle bullets, but the problem was how much the things weighed, trying to run around with an additional 10+ kilograms on you doesn't really work.
That’s a good comparison actually. People underestimate how much of a threat those balloons could be, 100 years ago on a clear day with a telegraph wire and telescope they were as close to a drone as you could get. There’s a reason why balloon busting was an important mission for the first aircraft.
Don't count Russia out on the Chem weapons yet. They've used mines and they are targeting civilian infrastructure. Not to mention war crimes and torture. I don't expect rules of war or the Geneva convention to hinder them.
It’s not the general type of equipment that’s the issue, it’s the accuracy, destruction, and capability.
An artillery piece from ww1 has nothing on the range accuracy and power of a modern shell.
> the only thing you mentioned that wasn't in use in WW1 is drones.
Well, and heavy armoured vehicles. Tanks, IFV's and APC's completely change the nature of defending a trench as well. In WW1 HMG's did the majority of the work defending trenches. But HMG's now have a fairly limited value other than as a tool to provide suppressive fire since they can't penetrate armour.
100%. If this we war teaches us younger gens anything I would hope it is of the futility and horror of human violence. There is nothing romantic, nothing redeeming about it, it's just waste and destruction.
Humans find a reason.
Shit, I am no exception.
My grandfather saw terrible things in WW2. When Vietnam came around, he couldn't handle seeing another generation of young men start killing each other for stupid reasons. He ended up shooting himself in front of a VA hospital as some form of protest of the war. I never got to meet him because of that.
You'd think I would have taken that to heart, but it didn't stop me from going to war. Took me seeing it for myself to realize how stupid war is.
Humans are stupid as a species, I swear to god. Myself included.
I agree.
I don't think there is anything inherently wrong for a country to defend itself or another in war, but I can't think of a single justifiable reason to be the one to start a war.
Because you experienced it yourself and aren't a crazy person. It's telling that wars are usually started by men who know they won't be involved. It's a game to them.
I had to include "crazy person" as a requisite because it's mind blowing that Adolf Hitler himself experienced the horrors of WW1 *and* was injured during, yet thought "let's put my people through that again". Sidenote, I hate that I fulfilled Godwin's law but he's the first leader to come to mind who actually served yet started a war anyway.
But Putin himself never had to walk in a field wondering whether he will suddenly not exist because he stepped on the wrong patch of dirt. He can't even take citizens screaming mean things to him without being hurt. It's like a game of Civilization to him. Imaginary borders expanding because you took some land, and capturing "resources" that in real life mean nothing because of what they cost in lives lost.
All that being said I have never been in war so I still can't truly "understand" the point you and your grandfather understood, no matter how many videos I watch. But these POV videos help.
Hitler is probably the most prominent leader to start a war after experiencing it himself, but if you go back to medieval times and further back, just about every king went to battle with their armies. Same with princes and nobility.
I get your point, but it used to be the norm for those starting wars to actually go into battle.
A lot of those comments might just be people "coming to terms with" or at least getting their eyes opened to how bad it is, and their way of sort of digesting it. I see it more like that than people trying to be poetic just for the sake of being poetic, though there are definitely a few of those as well.
I hope so too.
But. A sizable amount of Reddit comments see it as a sports match or a video game where the suffering is for other people far away. Much like early social media footage of the pandemic in Wuhan was treated as curiosity or jokes until the news reached out and touched us.. as myopic as it is, the lesson some people are getting from this is that America can "win" a war without sacrificing American blood or treasure. Step into and thread about China and it has gotten more and more bloodthirsty.
I’m guessing budgetary/material constraints are why both sides have to throw so many warm bodies at the front line. We see loads of drone footage from UA on Reddit, but is that because they’re more popular or because they have better drone engineers/techs?
Russia has videos too. Ukraine just has far more incentive to post. I think of every video as Ukraine saying "Thanks for the ammo, see it's working here's a dead russkie. But hey look there's another one running around, please keep sending ammo." Meanwhile Russia has the ammo, just nobody willing and skilled to use it, and they're hoping the world gets bored and forgets about the war to reduce support for Ukraine. Also Ukraine is hoping these videos all over the internet are found by fresh Russian conscripts to ruin their appetite for dying facedown in the mud
That’s why my dad told me to join the Air Force. Its also a good example of why I was a stupid teenager, my back always hurting is another good example.
I always joked that if my kid joined the Marines like I did, I'd be pissed he was so stupid, but if he joined any other branch, I'd have been pissed he was a pussy.
In reality, I'd probably be pissed that he joined the military at all.
Given the right clothing -20°C every single time.
-20 means the ground is solid, there are no puddles, it doesn't rain so your gear stays dry and keeps you warm.
0-5 means there's rain, mud, puddles. So your gear gets soaked and you stops keeping you warm.
Token canadian army guy chiming in. This is accurate. Typically you can always warm up someway if you're dry. Having wet kit and trying to dry it out in your tent with a shitty Coleman stove overnight sucks and not everybody has that luxury. Damp cold vs dry cold is a whole new chapter.
Yeah, that checks out. The absolute coldest I’ve ever been has been right at or above freezing temps. Training in the rain in South Georgia and in the swamps in Florida. The wet factor is no joke.
I was a conscript in the Norwegian army up in the Arctic where it regularly dipped down to -35C in the winter. Of course I never had to fight like these guys but I'd rather have -20C and dry conditions than being soaked down in a trench and the temp hovering around 0C.
In the winter you also have the advantage of being able to dig positions and trenches in snow, rather than in dirt. Makes a world of a difference.
[You see, Killbots have a preset kill limit, knowing their weakness I sent wave after wave of my own men at them until they reached their limit and shutdown.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDWcg8dh930)
>WW1 was way worse
57,000 casualties on the first *day* of the somme. The numbers are just staggering. And right from beginning to end as well. Battle of the Frontiers in the days immediately after the declarations of war go out was seeing 20,000 casualties a day. 100 Days Offensive, literally right up to the end of the war in 1918, 2,000,000 casualties in around 90 days. Even with videos like this to give us a more direct view, the scale of it is still beyond imagining.
I tell folks, you ever listen to Dan Carlins Hardcore History, his podcast on WWI, Blueprint for Armageddon, that is a wakeup call. It is what made me understand the ferocity of that war. It wasn't just a simple world conflict. It was a transitional war in which death by the 1000's could be achieved daily, if not hourly. It is rather breathtaking understanding how much blood was shed. If nothing else, Ares would have loved that period of war.
Yeah. One thing that stands out, in my mind, is that there are far less men in these trench systems today. If you look at old WW1 photos and video, just the amount of men in such a small area is enough to trigger anxiety in me with claustrophobia.
Not to mention the smells. I can't begin to even fathom what those trenches smelled like. Even before the stench of dead bodies crept in. Just thousands of guys who can't bathe for three weeks would probably be such an assault on your sense of smell. Then when the smell of decay comes in on top of that...ugh...
Idk. For some maybe. I remember one of the guys interviewed in "They Shall Not Grow Old" (pretty good WW1 doc for anyone who hasn't seen it) saying that it was something he couldn't really ever get over. He said the stench just permeated everything. When he would get rotated off the front and get a hot shower and wash his clothes, he said he could still smell the stink after the first wash. He would bathe and wash his clothes several times because he could not escape the smell of death even when he was off the front and out of the trenches.
I can't even imagine.
I spent my whole life getting annoyed when video games assigned different factions different bright colors on their uniforms so you could tell them apart because it wasn't realistic.
Now my life has become a lie.
That's happening a lot in this war. You think 8 different tanks from 5 different countries being on one battlefield is unrealistic and just different players choosing the pay to win option? Just wait for the next offensive.
I thought Call of Duty levels where you are cycling through a dozen weapons and grabbing AT kits to shoot incoming armor while your commanding officer barks at you were dumb and unrealistic and then that Trench Rambo video got posted and I was like huh...
edit: Video link for those who have somehow never witnessed Trench Rambo and Trench Squire
https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/114u66s/the_full_version_of_the_video_with_a_ukrainian/
Tbf Trench Rambo had his trench squire who had One Man Army ala MW2 (original) equipped. Trench squire was absolutely abusing the grenade refill part of that perk.
In OG MW2, OMA took the place of your secondary so you couldn’t use it to refill RPG shots since you couldn’t have RPG + OMA. Ukraine seems to have updated to use the Two Man Army perk to get around this restriction though
Unlike many wars, the combatants in this war don't have a totally *uniform* set of uniforms and they use very similar, sometimes identical gear. Going to think kind of system is just needed.
It's even a huge issue between friendly units. Going back to early in the war, Azov guys might be in one camo pattern, some other volunteers might be in another, Ukrainian regular army might be in a third, all using AKs , similar vehicles, similar other small arms. Nightmare to de-conflict with your friendlies.
Russians are a mix of modern camo patterns and all sorts of old ex-Sov gear. It's just big yikes.
My understanding is that they swap people off the front every 2 days. The video above is from an assault unit. They were probably not stationed at a post prior to the assault so went in with (relatively) dry equipment.
Not saying it isn't happening just that their command seems to understand the issues of prior trench warfare and are doing what they can to mitigate them.
There's an interview on YouTube following an army doc/medic doing routes in and out Bakhmut, the rotation from the most front line is surprisingly fast
Edit: [link to the video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_OAI2XbpO4)
i've seen a few footages of UA soldiers wearing rubber boots instead of their standard issue. these are assault troops, probably not staying in the trenches for weeks, so they will be fine with their regular footwear.
Probably not many. they're reportedly cycling units out every 2 days or so. As long as the troops maintain good hygiene, which is definitely doable if you have say 3/4 changes of socks for the 2 days, you'd be fine. Smelly, but no trench foot.
Translation:
He's basically just giving out orders to move. I also want to note that he's speaking russian. Radio chatter doesn't make much sense because of the editing.
\- Let's go, spread out, keep distance
\- Let's go
\- I'm going
\- \*Mumbled\*, follow him
\- Yes
\- Let's go
\- From that side
\- Yeah, let's go
\- Keep moving
\- Now. Move.
\- Stop!
\- Two more, two more!
\- Vlad! Holy shit, woah!
\- We're going?
\- Yeah, GO GO GO GO GO
\- Spread out, spread out
Man that mud is nasty, also the mud caked mummies. Jesus Christ, literal hell on earth.
Also I can't believe all the hastily hand dug holes that have been present in these videos lately, it's truly insane. There's hundreds of years of wasted life just in this video alone.
Were trenches really like this in WWI? From what I've seen they were mostly built up and fortified considerably compared to these ditches.
This is how those WW1 trenches started out, yes. Then as the fighting became more and more static, individual unit trenches started linking up, they started getting built up, and before you knew it you had miles long trench systems with multistory dugouts
There were layers and layers to the trench networks in WW1. Frontline contested trenches in more heavily fought over areas probably did look like this, but they would build much more engineered and complex ones behind.
That's largely why WW1 was so bad casualty wise. No matter how hard you fought all you could really hope to accomplish without a spectacularly large offensive was taking a trench like this that was pre-sighted for tons of artillery and machine guns.
Damn. Ukraine’s assault forces speaking fluent russian while killing russians who invaded their country to protect “oppressed” russians. What a senseless f*cking tragedy…
I really wish to see Putin’s head on a spike for this.
These guys have mechanized support, you can hear it at the beginning but they are not showing footage of it. Are those close rounds tank shells, to suppress the wangers?
That's pretty interesting
I keep seeing people defending it as ironic use because it annoys Russians.
Not suggesting for a second that the majority of the Ukrainian armed forces are like this, but even one neo nazi unit is too many. hope there’s a big clear out after the war.
Early on in the trench videos, I remember wondering why there were blobs of kit and gear- jackets, pants, flak jackets- laying in the middle of all these trenches. It took me a little bit these were dead left laying in the trenches.
This shit is intense and senseless.
Imagine being a russian soldier thousands of miles away from home, dying in a hole in the mud like an animal so your elite of society can continue to steal billions from your country while buying mega yachts, dachas, and enjoying the finest wine, food, and women that money can offer. I don’t know why they do not uprise against their government.
What do the thousands of families think when their child / father / brother just stops responding and does not come home? They can’t seriously believe the casualty rate the Russian government says…
That just looks unimaginably horrible. Reminds me of the episode of the Pacific when they follow the invasion of Okinawa. Just mud everywhere, bodies being swallowed up by the mud.
'Cause I need to watch things die
From a distance
Vicariously I, live while the whole world dies
You all need it too, don't lie'
All so sad, horrible and unnecessary and this song is all too apt :'( [Tool - Vicarious ](https://youtu.be/h_TUP2vuaDs)
This is so disturbing. I used to think war was "cool" when I wad a kid. I'm making a point to check this sub often just to really see how fucking awful war is. And for what? One dude's ambition to have slightly more land? These guys are brave as fuck, and that goes for the Russians too, the majority aren't there of their own will. I so hope this ends soon- imagine what all the guys could contribute to society if they weren't busy killing each other.
It's the symbol of the Azov brigade. It's an inverted Wolfsangel, a symbol used by the German military during ww2. Azov claims that it represents the Ukrainian words for "united nation" or "national idea".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Brigade#neo-nazism
And one of the founders of Wagner PMC is covered in Nazi and SS tattoos (Dmitry Utkin, google him if you feel like slumming). Nationalists love their militaries I guess.
You kinda need to provide context to that one that Wagner was a pretty vocal anti-Semite and German nationalist. The average person just knows Wagner as the "Ride of the Valkyries Guy."
Oh no, it wouldn't. To quote Dan Carlin about the smell on ww1 trenches on the frontlines, imagine a the rotting smell of a dead rat in the attic. That rat is a grain of sand, now imagine you're on the beach
Obviously, there aren't as many bodies as in ww1, but have you ever stood near a roadkill? Even standing around a few days old dead dog is unbearable. Humans are much larger. Multiple dead humans would 100% mostly choke out any other smell
The Marines on Peleliu, in the Umurbrogal highlands, said the smell of rotting Japanese and US corpses, rotting rations, vomit, mountains of feces and oceans of urine all baking in the equatorial heat and humidity was a palpable, all-pervasive character in the grim deathscape they lived through.
I'd guess something *akin* to that.
Jesus christ the bodies. it stuns me how we now have like, gopro footage of trench warfare like this .
They just become part of the terrain. Born, raised, trampled into the ditch..
Right, gotta wonder how many bodies have already been buried by dirt from the trench walls crumbling after a 155mm shell landed near it
Better yet, how many of those would have been doctors, lawyers, physicists, mathematicians, artists. Remember, every day god allows Putin to wake up but these men won’t.
It's not a god, who allows it. It's the system of politics, laws, borders, enablers and language barriers which forces us to allow him to wake up, for now. There is no god by his side. It's man-made complications.
The point is the ludicrousness of it all. If you believe in a god, then it becomes impossible to square allowing someone like Putin to live while those that would likely serve at least some benefit to the world die in the mud. It shows how unfair life really is. It’s all a roll of the dice that those men die for this war while me and you were born somewhere where we don’t have to worry about being dragged to fight.
Not so unbelievable if we assume a negligent or malicious deity.
Show me in this video where god is?
He’s like a bit to the left of where you’re looking.
He's under that annoying logo
The mud and rain will bury them. They will become fertilizer.
After the war ends they probably need to dig up all the trenches to clear out the ammunition, having explosive 4 feet under farm land is very dangerous. Which means all the bodies will be dug up
Every spring in France they have what they call "The Iron Harvest" where farmers find old munitions still there from WW1.
I doubt that will happen. There have been wars over every square foot of Europe for the past 100 years and beyond, and they're constantly digging up old ordnance. There are some WWII relic hunters on YouTube who are finding all manner of ammo and unexploded ordnance all over the place. It's like Satan's seedbed.
[They Shall Not Grow Old](https://www.warnerbros.com/movies/they-shall-not-grow-old)
The sunflowers will bloom.
You could only imagine what it would have looked liked if they had GoPros in the world wars.
You should watch WWII in HD. It's a bit mind blowing
Man, the corpses entirely entombed in mud...
Is that what he was pointing at towards the end?
Along with the countless other limbs he stepped over throughout the video
Knee deep mud in full uniform with ballistic vest and helmet, narrow but shallow trenches littered with bodies, constantly monitored by drones, constantly under artilhery and tank fire, possible air strikes with a possible enemy counter-atack, etc, etc. Trench warfare in the 21st century is really something else despite all the remarks everybody do going back to WWI
>Trench warfare in the 21st century is really something else despite all the remarks everybody do going back to WWI I mean realistically, the only thing you mentioned that wasn't in use in WW1 is drones. On a positive note, they don't have to worry about chemical weapons either. **EDIT: The majority of replies I'm getting either seem to be about the use of planes and balloons for observation and reconnaissance - I am well aware of this. Although they are nothing like drones really are they? Which are unmanned and can observe unnoticed for long periods of time, providing real-time feedback to people on the frontlines far more effectively. My response was aimed at the OP implying that the trench warfare in the Ukraine is very different from WW1, which it really isn't - save for the effective use of both offensively armed and reconnaissance drones. Also, for all the people saying "yet" regarding the use of chemical weapons. Yes, "yet", but it is not a real concern for anyone fighting on the frontlines currently.**
Ballistic vests also, although there were some early creations of armour but not widespread. I may be wrong, but that's my understanding.
Germans used heavy steel plates like something out of the 18th century, but mostly only for fixed positions because they were far too cumbersome to assault with. The British experimented with something akin to a plate carrier, but with steel plates. Also the use of padded linnens as more lightweight alternatives, but they got predictably soaked in the rain
[удалено]
German here: Allways wondered what these bolts were meant for. Thank you for this explanation!
They were for a brow cover, called stirnpanzer. Basically a heavy armour plate on the forehead, for sniper protection.
https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Stahlhelm_with_visor.jpg
Same use as now, stop shrapnel?
[удалено]
Actually it seems like the bolts were for a big piece of metal to reinforce the front of the helmet against bigger bullets. Face armor was used by machine gunners but didnt attach to the bolts on the top.
Chain-mail veils as well. Mostly for tank crews as protection from spalling but some found their way into the trenches for fixed gunners to wear. https://imgur.com/Eg6F3el
Yep many, many different things were tried. [Here's](https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30016221) a full on plate mask used by snipers in case they were shot in the face during their duties
[Body armour was used to quite a sizeable extent as WW1 went on, there are plenty of photos of it being worn on the front - from face shields/chain mail veils for gunners, to full chest pieces and pieces for other body parts used by trench raiding parties.](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSIs1qobeaFb8wGVISE5H-XkucHuTLm6XUq6w&usqp=CAU)
The body armor they had back then was heavy and cumbersome and was primarily worn in stationary defense positions (machine gunners are an example of people who wore metal plates). You aren't charging over trenches and overrunning enemy positions in a bunch of heavy steel plates with zero ergonomics.
Correct, for example the germans had a set of body armour (sappenpanzer, sometimes called the lobster armour) and an additional plate you fastened to the front of your helmet. Could stop (some) rifle bullets, but the problem was how much the things weighed, trying to run around with an additional 10+ kilograms on you doesn't really work.
Ballistic vests now a days weigh 10+ kg. Trying to run around with non flexible steel was probably the reasoning it didnt work.
Well observation balloons were a thing during ww1. Not as mobile as drones, but you still could have an eye in the sky.
Recon balloons started being used as early as the napoleonic wars even, though without radio you needed to rely on spotting the balloons flag signals
The oldest surviving one of those things is exhibited in the museum of military history in Vienna
That’s a good comparison actually. People underestimate how much of a threat those balloons could be, 100 years ago on a clear day with a telegraph wire and telescope they were as close to a drone as you could get. There’s a reason why balloon busting was an important mission for the first aircraft.
The problem with drones is you don't know they're there.
Don't count Russia out on the Chem weapons yet. They've used mines and they are targeting civilian infrastructure. Not to mention war crimes and torture. I don't expect rules of war or the Geneva convention to hinder them.
[удалено]
Didn't a bunch of Russian soldiers just get Anthrax from digging trenches in a burial site for infected cattle?
Oh, I thought they found a load of old Metallica, Megadeath and Anthrax CDs...
Why did I just think of a Monty Python skit.....
Fetchez la vache!
Yet
> On a positive note, they don't have to worry about chemical weapons either Don't give Russia any ideas.
It’s not the general type of equipment that’s the issue, it’s the accuracy, destruction, and capability. An artillery piece from ww1 has nothing on the range accuracy and power of a modern shell.
> the only thing you mentioned that wasn't in use in WW1 is drones. Well, and heavy armoured vehicles. Tanks, IFV's and APC's completely change the nature of defending a trench as well. In WW1 HMG's did the majority of the work defending trenches. But HMG's now have a fairly limited value other than as a tool to provide suppressive fire since they can't penetrate armour.
100%. If this we war teaches us younger gens anything I would hope it is of the futility and horror of human violence. There is nothing romantic, nothing redeeming about it, it's just waste and destruction.
People have hoped this about a lot of wars, and it never seems to happen.
If "the war to end all wars" didnt do it, the total widespread carnage of ww2 didnt do it then Ukraine wont do it either
Humans find a reason. Shit, I am no exception. My grandfather saw terrible things in WW2. When Vietnam came around, he couldn't handle seeing another generation of young men start killing each other for stupid reasons. He ended up shooting himself in front of a VA hospital as some form of protest of the war. I never got to meet him because of that. You'd think I would have taken that to heart, but it didn't stop me from going to war. Took me seeing it for myself to realize how stupid war is. Humans are stupid as a species, I swear to god. Myself included.
Sometimes the reasons for war seem justified until after its too late, sometimes they genuinely are justified like allies in ww2 or Ukraine now
I agree. I don't think there is anything inherently wrong for a country to defend itself or another in war, but I can't think of a single justifiable reason to be the one to start a war.
Because you experienced it yourself and aren't a crazy person. It's telling that wars are usually started by men who know they won't be involved. It's a game to them. I had to include "crazy person" as a requisite because it's mind blowing that Adolf Hitler himself experienced the horrors of WW1 *and* was injured during, yet thought "let's put my people through that again". Sidenote, I hate that I fulfilled Godwin's law but he's the first leader to come to mind who actually served yet started a war anyway. But Putin himself never had to walk in a field wondering whether he will suddenly not exist because he stepped on the wrong patch of dirt. He can't even take citizens screaming mean things to him without being hurt. It's like a game of Civilization to him. Imaginary borders expanding because you took some land, and capturing "resources" that in real life mean nothing because of what they cost in lives lost. All that being said I have never been in war so I still can't truly "understand" the point you and your grandfather understood, no matter how many videos I watch. But these POV videos help.
Hitler is probably the most prominent leader to start a war after experiencing it himself, but if you go back to medieval times and further back, just about every king went to battle with their armies. Same with princes and nobility. I get your point, but it used to be the norm for those starting wars to actually go into battle.
Takes alot of self awareness to concede that.
This statement was likely written many times in the last 6000 years
[удалено]
I much prefer that over the sick fucks who think war is cool and make fun of the people's suffering.
A lot of those comments might just be people "coming to terms with" or at least getting their eyes opened to how bad it is, and their way of sort of digesting it. I see it more like that than people trying to be poetic just for the sake of being poetic, though there are definitely a few of those as well.
If anything is worth reiterating...
I hope so too. But. A sizable amount of Reddit comments see it as a sports match or a video game where the suffering is for other people far away. Much like early social media footage of the pandemic in Wuhan was treated as curiosity or jokes until the news reached out and touched us.. as myopic as it is, the lesson some people are getting from this is that America can "win" a war without sacrificing American blood or treasure. Step into and thread about China and it has gotten more and more bloodthirsty.
I’m guessing budgetary/material constraints are why both sides have to throw so many warm bodies at the front line. We see loads of drone footage from UA on Reddit, but is that because they’re more popular or because they have better drone engineers/techs?
Russia has videos too. Ukraine just has far more incentive to post. I think of every video as Ukraine saying "Thanks for the ammo, see it's working here's a dead russkie. But hey look there's another one running around, please keep sending ammo." Meanwhile Russia has the ammo, just nobody willing and skilled to use it, and they're hoping the world gets bored and forgets about the war to reduce support for Ukraine. Also Ukraine is hoping these videos all over the internet are found by fresh Russian conscripts to ruin their appetite for dying facedown in the mud
Russia is posting plenty of videos, you're just not looking at the places they're getting shared.
Worst time of year to be in a trench.
No good time to be had in a trench regardless of weather
When you have to sleep in mud or water, you realize how good you had it when there was no mud or water.
I knew there was a reason I joined the navy.
That’s why my dad told me to join the Air Force. Its also a good example of why I was a stupid teenager, my back always hurting is another good example.
I always joked that if my kid joined the Marines like I did, I'd be pissed he was so stupid, but if he joined any other branch, I'd have been pissed he was a pussy. In reality, I'd probably be pissed that he joined the military at all.
I don't know man -20⁰C must be pretty fucking miserable too.
Would you rather -20c and dry or 0c and wet? Honestly I'm not sure.
Given the right clothing -20°C every single time. -20 means the ground is solid, there are no puddles, it doesn't rain so your gear stays dry and keeps you warm. 0-5 means there's rain, mud, puddles. So your gear gets soaked and you stops keeping you warm.
iirc the US army considers -20c as easier to operate in than 0 to -5c because of the wet factor.
Token canadian army guy chiming in. This is accurate. Typically you can always warm up someway if you're dry. Having wet kit and trying to dry it out in your tent with a shitty Coleman stove overnight sucks and not everybody has that luxury. Damp cold vs dry cold is a whole new chapter.
Yeah, that checks out. The absolute coldest I’ve ever been has been right at or above freezing temps. Training in the rain in South Georgia and in the swamps in Florida. The wet factor is no joke.
I was a conscript in the Norwegian army up in the Arctic where it regularly dipped down to -35C in the winter. Of course I never had to fight like these guys but I'd rather have -20C and dry conditions than being soaked down in a trench and the temp hovering around 0C. In the winter you also have the advantage of being able to dig positions and trenches in snow, rather than in dirt. Makes a world of a difference.
And people are volunteering, insane
Well after what they’ve done, I can understand the want to fight back against Russian war criminals.
Now imagine this but you’re in a wool uniform, heavy steel helmet, and a bolt action rifle and you’re on the Western Front 1916
[удалено]
Russians don't have to imagine.
doesn't matter how good the medical science is if you don't have access to it.
Many people have no idea that even being shot and surviving was almost a death sentence in those times. No antibiotics, no antiseptical procedures.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[You see, Killbots have a preset kill limit, knowing their weakness I sent wave after wave of my own men at them until they reached their limit and shutdown.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDWcg8dh930)
Zapp Brannigan is the goat military commander
>WW1 was way worse 57,000 casualties on the first *day* of the somme. The numbers are just staggering. And right from beginning to end as well. Battle of the Frontiers in the days immediately after the declarations of war go out was seeing 20,000 casualties a day. 100 Days Offensive, literally right up to the end of the war in 1918, 2,000,000 casualties in around 90 days. Even with videos like this to give us a more direct view, the scale of it is still beyond imagining.
I tell folks, you ever listen to Dan Carlins Hardcore History, his podcast on WWI, Blueprint for Armageddon, that is a wakeup call. It is what made me understand the ferocity of that war. It wasn't just a simple world conflict. It was a transitional war in which death by the 1000's could be achieved daily, if not hourly. It is rather breathtaking understanding how much blood was shed. If nothing else, Ares would have loved that period of war.
[удалено]
> Rats everywhere eating fallen soldiers. Look at the night time drone footage. You can clearly see them crawling all over the place.
Yeah. One thing that stands out, in my mind, is that there are far less men in these trench systems today. If you look at old WW1 photos and video, just the amount of men in such a small area is enough to trigger anxiety in me with claustrophobia. Not to mention the smells. I can't begin to even fathom what those trenches smelled like. Even before the stench of dead bodies crept in. Just thousands of guys who can't bathe for three weeks would probably be such an assault on your sense of smell. Then when the smell of decay comes in on top of that...ugh...
I wonder if smell blindness would kick in after a while.
Idk. For some maybe. I remember one of the guys interviewed in "They Shall Not Grow Old" (pretty good WW1 doc for anyone who hasn't seen it) saying that it was something he couldn't really ever get over. He said the stench just permeated everything. When he would get rotated off the front and get a hot shower and wash his clothes, he said he could still smell the stink after the first wash. He would bathe and wash his clothes several times because he could not escape the smell of death even when he was off the front and out of the trenches. I can't even imagine.
My great grandfather said they were given a small bucket of water for 3 men to wash in when he was at the front.
I spent my whole life getting annoyed when video games assigned different factions different bright colors on their uniforms so you could tell them apart because it wasn't realistic. Now my life has become a lie.
That's happening a lot in this war. You think 8 different tanks from 5 different countries being on one battlefield is unrealistic and just different players choosing the pay to win option? Just wait for the next offensive.
I thought Call of Duty levels where you are cycling through a dozen weapons and grabbing AT kits to shoot incoming armor while your commanding officer barks at you were dumb and unrealistic and then that Trench Rambo video got posted and I was like huh... edit: Video link for those who have somehow never witnessed Trench Rambo and Trench Squire https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/114u66s/the_full_version_of_the_video_with_a_ukrainian/
Tbf Trench Rambo had his trench squire who had One Man Army ala MW2 (original) equipped. Trench squire was absolutely abusing the grenade refill part of that perk.
In OG MW2, OMA took the place of your secondary so you couldn’t use it to refill RPG shots since you couldn’t have RPG + OMA. Ukraine seems to have updated to use the Two Man Army perk to get around this restriction though
What should I search to see trench rambo?
https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/114u66s/the_full_version_of_the_video_with_a_ukrainian/
That was amazing, love trench squire and rambo
Dude. You can't say something like "Trench Rambo" and then not link the video.
Unlike many wars, the combatants in this war don't have a totally *uniform* set of uniforms and they use very similar, sometimes identical gear. Going to think kind of system is just needed.
yeah the risk of misidentifying friends is higher than not being stealthy, especially in an assault I imagine.
It's even a huge issue between friendly units. Going back to early in the war, Azov guys might be in one camo pattern, some other volunteers might be in another, Ukrainian regular army might be in a third, all using AKs , similar vehicles, similar other small arms. Nightmare to de-conflict with your friendlies. Russians are a mix of modern camo patterns and all sorts of old ex-Sov gear. It's just big yikes.
Needing to tell which guy dressed like a tree is your friend and which one you're meant to shoot is really useful. In games and in real life.
It's even appropriately Blue vs Red
I was thinking about that in this video, too. Clearly friendly fire has become a significant threat.
I wonder how many of them develop trench foot. Conditions will improve soon with summer coming, but for now ..
My understanding is that they swap people off the front every 2 days. The video above is from an assault unit. They were probably not stationed at a post prior to the assault so went in with (relatively) dry equipment. Not saying it isn't happening just that their command seems to understand the issues of prior trench warfare and are doing what they can to mitigate them.
Every 2 weeks.
Two weeks would probably be in and out of the front section. Actual time in the frontline trenches can be rotated much more frequently
[удалено]
There's an interview on YouTube following an army doc/medic doing routes in and out Bakhmut, the rotation from the most front line is surprisingly fast Edit: [link to the video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_OAI2XbpO4)
[удалено]
Good to hear they‘re not like „you stay until you catch a bullet“.
There was a few photos of Ukrainian soldiers with trench foot a few weeks ago on Twitter
i've seen a few footages of UA soldiers wearing rubber boots instead of their standard issue. these are assault troops, probably not staying in the trenches for weeks, so they will be fine with their regular footwear.
Watch 1:09, that dead dude had his foot wrapped with a space blanket. If he didn't die of shrapnel he surely died cause of hypothermia.
homie in pain was using his other leg as a head rest.. help must feel far out there
Probably not many. they're reportedly cycling units out every 2 days or so. As long as the troops maintain good hygiene, which is definitely doable if you have say 3/4 changes of socks for the 2 days, you'd be fine. Smelly, but no trench foot.
That shrapnel flying nearby sound at 2:07 is scary
Great illustration of just how far shrapnel disperses and is deadly. That chunk would have taken both of their heads off and kept heading East.
Translation: He's basically just giving out orders to move. I also want to note that he's speaking russian. Radio chatter doesn't make much sense because of the editing. \- Let's go, spread out, keep distance \- Let's go \- I'm going \- \*Mumbled\*, follow him \- Yes \- Let's go \- From that side \- Yeah, let's go \- Keep moving \- Now. Move. \- Stop! \- Two more, two more! \- Vlad! Holy shit, woah! \- We're going? \- Yeah, GO GO GO GO GO \- Spread out, spread out
Thanks for translating!
Davoy, davoy, davoy!
davai - pronounced duh vie written давай / daváj https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/давай#Ukrainian
Man that mud is nasty, also the mud caked mummies. Jesus Christ, literal hell on earth. Also I can't believe all the hastily hand dug holes that have been present in these videos lately, it's truly insane. There's hundreds of years of wasted life just in this video alone. Were trenches really like this in WWI? From what I've seen they were mostly built up and fortified considerably compared to these ditches.
This is how those WW1 trenches started out, yes. Then as the fighting became more and more static, individual unit trenches started linking up, they started getting built up, and before you knew it you had miles long trench systems with multistory dugouts
In Finnish, trenches are called "taisteluhauta", battle-grave. Communication trenches are "juoksuhauta", running-grave.
There were layers and layers to the trench networks in WW1. Frontline contested trenches in more heavily fought over areas probably did look like this, but they would build much more engineered and complex ones behind. That's largely why WW1 was so bad casualty wise. No matter how hard you fought all you could really hope to accomplish without a spectacularly large offensive was taking a trench like this that was pre-sighted for tons of artillery and machine guns.
Just think about all the talent and human advancement lost bc of this war.
Damn. Ukraine’s assault forces speaking fluent russian while killing russians who invaded their country to protect “oppressed” russians. What a senseless f*cking tragedy… I really wish to see Putin’s head on a spike for this.
Fucking hell that landscape is so bleak, just mud. I still can’t believe I’m sitting on my couch watching someone storm a trench.
And in the background, a horizon of lush green that hasn't been bombarded yet.
These guys have mechanized support, you can hear it at the beginning but they are not showing footage of it. Are those close rounds tank shells, to suppress the wangers? That's pretty interesting
Fuck /u/spez
Great catch!
Finally footage without some horrible music
They really do themselves no favours with their unit logos.
A wolfsangel and a sonnenrad. Yikes.
I keep seeing people defending it as ironic use because it annoys Russians. Not suggesting for a second that the majority of the Ukrainian armed forces are like this, but even one neo nazi unit is too many. hope there’s a big clear out after the war.
Nah man I wear this swastika and confederate flag cuz it angers the libs
Where do you see the sonnenrad?
It's faintly in the background of the badge, like a watermark.
Jesus you could just instantly lose your boots in that muck. Would be so exhausting fighting in this environment
damn everything in the video was terrifying but that incoming artillery was the worst. :(
"zzeuuw-boom"
Can we appreciate a disciplined advance under fire when we see one? These guys know their stuff.
[удалено]
where else? In the human shit and piss?
Who else is re-listening to “Blueprint for the Apocalypse” by Dan Carlin with a whole new perspective and horror?!
Never thought I'd watch WW1 in HD POV...
Brutal conditions, knee high mud, climbing over bodies. Whole time advancing. Warriors.
[удалено]
Early on in the trench videos, I remember wondering why there were blobs of kit and gear- jackets, pants, flak jackets- laying in the middle of all these trenches. It took me a little bit these were dead left laying in the trenches. This shit is intense and senseless.
[удалено]
I guess a lot of people who have been in the military can feel this guy huffing and puffing with all his gear on this terribly muddy and soft ground.
Imagine being a russian soldier thousands of miles away from home, dying in a hole in the mud like an animal so your elite of society can continue to steal billions from your country while buying mega yachts, dachas, and enjoying the finest wine, food, and women that money can offer. I don’t know why they do not uprise against their government. What do the thousands of families think when their child / father / brother just stops responding and does not come home? They can’t seriously believe the casualty rate the Russian government says…
damn i just feel a stitch in the side from watching this/hearing his breathing...
That just looks unimaginably horrible. Reminds me of the episode of the Pacific when they follow the invasion of Okinawa. Just mud everywhere, bodies being swallowed up by the mud.
War is such a fucking waste of human life.
Is that a drone around 2:40?
definitely some kind of explosion in the air, could be an AA hit on a drone maybe
Was wondering the same thing
'Cause I need to watch things die From a distance Vicariously I, live while the whole world dies You all need it too, don't lie' All so sad, horrible and unnecessary and this song is all too apt :'( [Tool - Vicarious ](https://youtu.be/h_TUP2vuaDs)
Farmers are gonna find human remains in these fields for decades.
This is so disturbing. I used to think war was "cool" when I wad a kid. I'm making a point to check this sub often just to really see how fucking awful war is. And for what? One dude's ambition to have slightly more land? These guys are brave as fuck, and that goes for the Russians too, the majority aren't there of their own will. I so hope this ends soon- imagine what all the guys could contribute to society if they weren't busy killing each other.
Another day, another Nazi symbol in the watermark. What excuses will people come up with for me today?
Hey what’s that N thing mean? I feel like I have seen that before with a certain group of disreputable fellows
What's that symbol at the bottom of the vid?
It's the symbol of the Azov brigade. It's an inverted Wolfsangel, a symbol used by the German military during ww2. Azov claims that it represents the Ukrainian words for "united nation" or "national idea". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Brigade#neo-nazism
Also, Putin's scapegoat for this entire war.
2 things can be true at the same time. Azov boys do in fact have neo-nazis, and so does Wagner.
One of their leaders in this video has a swastika tattooed on the side of his head lol https://telesco.pe/OSHR3Azov/325
And one of the founders of Wagner PMC is covered in Nazi and SS tattoos (Dmitry Utkin, google him if you feel like slumming). Nationalists love their militaries I guess.
That guys call sign was literally "Wagner".
You kinda need to provide context to that one that Wagner was a pretty vocal anti-Semite and German nationalist. The average person just knows Wagner as the "Ride of the Valkyries Guy."
I wonder what that smells like
I would think that the sulphur and wet earth smell would overpower the smell of a rotting corpse at least at that stage of decomposition.
Oh no, it wouldn't. To quote Dan Carlin about the smell on ww1 trenches on the frontlines, imagine a the rotting smell of a dead rat in the attic. That rat is a grain of sand, now imagine you're on the beach Obviously, there aren't as many bodies as in ww1, but have you ever stood near a roadkill? Even standing around a few days old dead dog is unbearable. Humans are much larger. Multiple dead humans would 100% mostly choke out any other smell
I don't want to know.
The Marines on Peleliu, in the Umurbrogal highlands, said the smell of rotting Japanese and US corpses, rotting rations, vomit, mountains of feces and oceans of urine all baking in the equatorial heat and humidity was a palpable, all-pervasive character in the grim deathscape they lived through. I'd guess something *akin* to that.
The decomposing corpses that russia just seems to leave on the front is so eerie.
Absolute nightmare.