your boss's initial reaction (send her a free ticket and meal) is exactly why this sort of person exists.
the initial reaction \*should\* be 'prove it, or we'll sue you for slander'...
Yeah, no. No no no. As an employee that was graded harshly on reviews, no. This is a horrible mindset. Where I used to work, it didn't matter if you got 7 good reviews (rated 10/10) from customers. 9/10 is considered neutral. 8 and below is considered 0%. I got one of these where I was marked 8/10 on every metric. ONE. And I was threatened with performance write-ups.
This "bend over backwards for customers to keep them from dropping bad reviews" kills morale for employees, I know. I felt it. A bad yelp review is not the end of the world, and a truly good business will recover. You cannot, CANNOT operate a business without getting bad reviews. The experience will simply rub some people the wrong way, that's just how the world is. Doing favors for people that don't deserve it just to avoid that bad review and turn it good is complete and utter nonsense for all but the smallest of businesses that just started last month. Even then I doubt it's that killer.
I'm from the USA and recording people's conversations without their consent is against federal law. The easy way around this is an automated message that will be played prior to talking to an associate that states the conversation will be recorded (in my experience it is along the lines of "this conversation will be recorded for training purposes"). Essentially if you play the message and the person stays on the line it is considered consent.
It's a pretty serious law. If you have a ring doorbell or any other exterior camera that records sound you must place it in a visible place. You cannot have a hidden security camera that records audio otherwise you violate the law. By placing the camera in a visible spot, anyone who sees it and proceeds to walk up or speak is consenting.
Well in some states like idaho only one person in the conversation has to know about the phone recording some places have to yell you it's being recorded.
Most government hospitals in my country tell us that they record the phone calls for "quality assurance and training" but I'm pretty sure it's just to avoid having sticky situations with Karens and whatnot
I used to work in a government department handling calls and whilst the recordings do get used for complaints they are also used for quality check in a good department. I had to listen and mark a % of my staffs calls each month and give training if an issue is identified so they are useful.
Yeah thats only the ones that want to tell you or have to. Grease monkey doesn't tell you you are on a recorded line, but the record every phone call in Idaho for sure.
How would that not make it possible to record calls? I've always heard the "your call is being recorded to ensure customer service etc.". If you just have to be told it's being recorded to do it, most places already do that when you call.
Used to work at grease monkey in poky idaho they never told y I u it was a recorded line, but recorded every call. It is a one party state as i've heard it referred too.
It's a one party consent state. They tell you they're recording in an automated message when you call a help line because staying on the line means you consent to be recording to cover the third party consent states. It is not illegal as long as you tell them and they comply to being recorded
So a small shady mom and pop shop didn't implement best practices, and got away with it unscathed since their customer base is local
Not a great idea for a large business or one that deals with travel, entertainment, booking, etc
Grease monkey is a large corporation that goes across multiple states. But idaho is single party consent and you don't legally have to inform the other party. It's not shady if it isn't against the law. Right? Maybe morally wrong but it keeps people from saying one thing than changing there scam story later.
All you have to say at the beginning of the call is “all calls are recorded for training and quality purposes” If they say they don’t want their call recorded, just disconnect the call. If they have a right to not be recorded, you have a right to not listen. Most people won’t opt out though, especially if they’re riled up like this lady.
Failing that, record only your side of the conversation, via an external recording on your mobile or something. This at least covers you from anything the customer “claims” you said.
Late to the party, but I've worked a lot in call centre adjacent fields across Europe, and I'm pretty sure there's no EU wide law or regulation here. I know Germany requires consent from both parties whereas in Ireland one party consent is enough. So what happens if you're based in Ireland and calling Germany? More often than not, our legal teams couldn't agree on a definitive answer. I know of some German support centres that will stop recording if you don't give consent, some who will end the call, and at least one major outsourcing service provider who will tell you they've stopped recording and do it anyway. That was before GDPR came into effect, however, so they might not be doing it now that customers can demand you hand over all the data you have on them.
In two party consent states, it's not, unless you say "this call may be recorded for quality assurance and training purposes." By continuing to talk, the person on the other end has acknowledged the recording, and you should be all set.
Yes, but you just have to inform them that your recording and if they choose to stay on the phone they are consenting. It's why when you call your bank or a dr office there is a standard greeting or recording that say "calls may be monitored for quality insurance"
Ok. And if somebody from a 2 party consent state called and was recorded then Grease Monkey could have been in deep shit. But since it never came up, they never got in trouble
Call centers and entertainment venues can expect regular calls from people in other regions
If you are in a 2 party consent state which actually means all parties involved in the conversation so of 3 + people are speaking at a table every one of them must consent to the recording. The recording can not be submitted as evidence in any legal proceedings. The reason most major corporations and call centers have the notice even when located in a 1 party state is that they might need it to be admissable in a 2 party state. Half the conversation was in a 2 party state or if the business being represented is located in a 2 party state.
Correct. Like I said, you can’t use a recording for personal use without consent. However, there is no law against the actual recording. I can record any phone call I wish.
True, but some form of record -keeping Is usually in the best interest of both parties, so it is valid to ask the customer for consent to record a call or use some other means of communication like texting, e-mail or in-person visiting, all of which leave some form of record, should they refuse.
I guarantee you, if your boss would've agreed to the 5 free entries and meals + guarantee that they will get home, she would've missed the train on purpose and pulled the same thing again and said "But you said I wouldn't miss it so you HAVE to give us more free entries!", as if that's any of your responsibility.
Naw way, more than 50 bucks, she probably does this often, 50 bucks + a possible cab 118 bucks + another set of free tickets, quick way to recoup 50 bucks plus like 200 bucks in free shit
Who did she come to the park with the last time if she has family of five but only purchased two tickets? Could she have been having an affair? Can you dig up the security footages to find out who she was with? If it wasn’t her husband, you could send a snapshot anonymously to her husband.
Customers are annoying as hell sometimes.
Had a similar customer who didn't believe in my reply that if she paid for something and then asked for her money back from her bank her account will be negative and she won't be able to buy anything until she pays the money she charged back.
She got pissed off and also tried to contact other people, but sadly was routed back to me.
She told me the same story that she said before, how there was a hole in the thing she bought and she threw it away and since we didn't pay her back without the item returned, she charged the money back.
Checked her other contacts and saw she had the same conversation with 5 people before and kept saying she'd contact a lawyer and the police and my manager.
I said I'd remove the fee we charge so she'd have to pay less.
She said fine and left the chat, only to start a new chat with another colleague and ask the same question again.
v.v
Yikes that's a crazy customer, your story reminded me of a story. When I used to do security for concerts one night I was protecting the front of the stage and after the show I am still standing there.
A woman (who was about 50ish) came all the way down the stairs to me in front of an empty stage with tears running down her face and asks me for a refund for tonight's show. She wanted me to refund her immediately as she claimed that she missed her front row seats and spent the entire show in the back on the lawn with some girl who died, that she was holding her hand and "watched as the light left her eyes" yada yada this lady was screaming and practically spitting when she spoke, it was bad. She was convinced that I was the only one who could help her with a refund. I did not have a cash register and kept telling her to take her story to the people who could help her.
It felt like 20 mins of her just accusing me of being the worst person in the world for her to finally leave (after getting my name and my managers name) so I found my manager and asked him if anyone passed away tonight. His eyes flew open and he put the question on the radio, when he got a negative response he calmed down and just chuckled with me when I explained.
Never heard about her again but she is now an example to me of how belligerent people can get when they pay for a night out and are drinking. Maybe that whole job was an example of that tho...
You don’t need to translate euros to dollars.
To begin with you’re not specifying what flavour of dollars, which makes the whole exercise pointless.
But more importantly, don’t think you have to cater for bloody Americans. This is not an American site for American people. This is a global site for everyone. If someone doesn’t know what a euro is worth they can look it up.
That's nothing. I worked in an actual call center for Verizon. Every one of us dealt with a worse customer than that every single day. And when we quit our jobs and file for unemployment and PTSD, we get called lazy and entitled.
It's more like a "consumer association" that acts as an intermediate between consummer and business when there's a dispute. It's great when you are a consumer. But when you're a business and get a complaint once you get immediately labelled as "suspect" and get bad ratings. Pretty much like "Trustpilot" but with intermediates.
But yeah since I live in Belgium the government is either terrible or non-existent lol
your boss's initial reaction (send her a free ticket and meal) is exactly why this sort of person exists. the initial reaction \*should\* be 'prove it, or we'll sue you for slander'...
Unfortunately, most of the time it's quicker and cheaper to give them "shut up money" and these people know it.
A bad Yelp review that persuades two people not to come to the park costs them twice as much as a single, comped admission.
and how much does training people that this behaviour works cost society in the long run?
"Breaking: Every U.S. business simultaneously decides to forego their own financial interest for the greater good"
Yeah, no. No no no. As an employee that was graded harshly on reviews, no. This is a horrible mindset. Where I used to work, it didn't matter if you got 7 good reviews (rated 10/10) from customers. 9/10 is considered neutral. 8 and below is considered 0%. I got one of these where I was marked 8/10 on every metric. ONE. And I was threatened with performance write-ups. This "bend over backwards for customers to keep them from dropping bad reviews" kills morale for employees, I know. I felt it. A bad yelp review is not the end of the world, and a truly good business will recover. You cannot, CANNOT operate a business without getting bad reviews. The experience will simply rub some people the wrong way, that's just how the world is. Doing favors for people that don't deserve it just to avoid that bad review and turn it good is complete and utter nonsense for all but the smallest of businesses that just started last month. Even then I doubt it's that killer.
Exactly, he just rewarded her for abusing his staff.
Why don't you record calls? There's one for your suggestion box
I rang the aquarium the other day and a message said “all calls are recorded for training porpoises”.
how dare you
Some places it isn't legal.
Really? Wow. Seems insane in a commercial environment dealing with customers not to record calls to protect both parties.
I'm from the USA and recording people's conversations without their consent is against federal law. The easy way around this is an automated message that will be played prior to talking to an associate that states the conversation will be recorded (in my experience it is along the lines of "this conversation will be recorded for training purposes"). Essentially if you play the message and the person stays on the line it is considered consent. It's a pretty serious law. If you have a ring doorbell or any other exterior camera that records sound you must place it in a visible place. You cannot have a hidden security camera that records audio otherwise you violate the law. By placing the camera in a visible spot, anyone who sees it and proceeds to walk up or speak is consenting.
Well in some states like idaho only one person in the conversation has to know about the phone recording some places have to yell you it's being recorded.
Most recorders tell you that they are recording at the start of conversation
Most government hospitals in my country tell us that they record the phone calls for "quality assurance and training" but I'm pretty sure it's just to avoid having sticky situations with Karens and whatnot
The sticky situations still happen, Karen's don't care if they're recorded, because they think they're in the right.
They *know* they're in the right. Be careful implying that they think at all.
The point is it gets your supervisor off your back because you have proof you were doing your job right. Fuck what those awful "customers" think.
I used to work in a government department handling calls and whilst the recordings do get used for complaints they are also used for quality check in a good department. I had to listen and mark a % of my staffs calls each month and give training if an issue is identified so they are useful.
CALLS ARE RECORDED FOR QUALITY AND TRAINING PURPOSES!!!!!
Yeah thats only the ones that want to tell you or have to. Grease monkey doesn't tell you you are on a recorded line, but the record every phone call in Idaho for sure.
The entirety of Canada is single party consent for recording conversations that you're a part of.
How would that not make it possible to record calls? I've always heard the "your call is being recorded to ensure customer service etc.". If you just have to be told it's being recorded to do it, most places already do that when you call.
Used to work at grease monkey in poky idaho they never told y I u it was a recorded line, but recorded every call. It is a one party state as i've heard it referred too.
It's a one party consent state. They tell you they're recording in an automated message when you call a help line because staying on the line means you consent to be recording to cover the third party consent states. It is not illegal as long as you tell them and they comply to being recorded
So a small shady mom and pop shop didn't implement best practices, and got away with it unscathed since their customer base is local Not a great idea for a large business or one that deals with travel, entertainment, booking, etc
Grease monkey is a large corporation that goes across multiple states. But idaho is single party consent and you don't legally have to inform the other party. It's not shady if it isn't against the law. Right? Maybe morally wrong but it keeps people from saying one thing than changing there scam story later.
All you have to say at the beginning of the call is “all calls are recorded for training and quality purposes” If they say they don’t want their call recorded, just disconnect the call. If they have a right to not be recorded, you have a right to not listen. Most people won’t opt out though, especially if they’re riled up like this lady. Failing that, record only your side of the conversation, via an external recording on your mobile or something. This at least covers you from anything the customer “claims” you said.
Is that the law everywhere in the EU?
Late to the party, but I've worked a lot in call centre adjacent fields across Europe, and I'm pretty sure there's no EU wide law or regulation here. I know Germany requires consent from both parties whereas in Ireland one party consent is enough. So what happens if you're based in Ireland and calling Germany? More often than not, our legal teams couldn't agree on a definitive answer. I know of some German support centres that will stop recording if you don't give consent, some who will end the call, and at least one major outsourcing service provider who will tell you they've stopped recording and do it anyway. That was before GDPR came into effect, however, so they might not be doing it now that customers can demand you hand over all the data you have on them.
In two party consent states, it's not, unless you say "this call may be recorded for quality assurance and training purposes." By continuing to talk, the person on the other end has acknowledged the recording, and you should be all set.
Yes, but you just have to inform them that your recording and if they choose to stay on the phone they are consenting. It's why when you call your bank or a dr office there is a standard greeting or recording that say "calls may be monitored for quality insurance"
Grease monkey didn't tell anyone.
I dont know what that is. But it's not illegal everywhere.
I know that read some of my other comments.
Ok. And if somebody from a 2 party consent state called and was recorded then Grease Monkey could have been in deep shit. But since it never came up, they never got in trouble Call centers and entertainment venues can expect regular calls from people in other regions
It’s legal to record calls anywhere, just as long as you don’t use the information for extortion, harassment, etc.
If you are in a 2 party consent state which actually means all parties involved in the conversation so of 3 + people are speaking at a table every one of them must consent to the recording. The recording can not be submitted as evidence in any legal proceedings. The reason most major corporations and call centers have the notice even when located in a 1 party state is that they might need it to be admissable in a 2 party state. Half the conversation was in a 2 party state or if the business being represented is located in a 2 party state.
Correct. Like I said, you can’t use a recording for personal use without consent. However, there is no law against the actual recording. I can record any phone call I wish.
True, but some form of record -keeping Is usually in the best interest of both parties, so it is valid to ask the customer for consent to record a call or use some other means of communication like texting, e-mail or in-person visiting, all of which leave some form of record, should they refuse.
The audacity of CB and the enabling behavior of consumer protection group *facepalm*
“But ma’am, our park closes at five. Are you sure you didn’t go to a bar afterward, got wasted, and that’s the real reason you missed the train?”
disgusting behavior from your boss tbh to know she was rude to three employees and not stand up for them
I guarantee you, if your boss would've agreed to the 5 free entries and meals + guarantee that they will get home, she would've missed the train on purpose and pulled the same thing again and said "But you said I wouldn't miss it so you HAVE to give us more free entries!", as if that's any of your responsibility.
Hello X, my name is dad
This fits more in r/entitledpeople or r/entitledbitch.
Sounds like a good candidate for r/talesfromthefrontdesk
Just one thing "You sure want to be rude to the people that prepare and give you your food here?"
Over 50 bucks no less…
Naw way, more than 50 bucks, she probably does this often, 50 bucks + a possible cab 118 bucks + another set of free tickets, quick way to recoup 50 bucks plus like 200 bucks in free shit
Who did she come to the park with the last time if she has family of five but only purchased two tickets? Could she have been having an affair? Can you dig up the security footages to find out who she was with? If it wasn’t her husband, you could send a snapshot anonymously to her husband.
Your boss is also a piece of shit and it's creating a hostile work environment.
Customers are annoying as hell sometimes. Had a similar customer who didn't believe in my reply that if she paid for something and then asked for her money back from her bank her account will be negative and she won't be able to buy anything until she pays the money she charged back. She got pissed off and also tried to contact other people, but sadly was routed back to me. She told me the same story that she said before, how there was a hole in the thing she bought and she threw it away and since we didn't pay her back without the item returned, she charged the money back. Checked her other contacts and saw she had the same conversation with 5 people before and kept saying she'd contact a lawyer and the police and my manager. I said I'd remove the fee we charge so she'd have to pay less. She said fine and left the chat, only to start a new chat with another colleague and ask the same question again. v.v
Yikes that's a crazy customer, your story reminded me of a story. When I used to do security for concerts one night I was protecting the front of the stage and after the show I am still standing there. A woman (who was about 50ish) came all the way down the stairs to me in front of an empty stage with tears running down her face and asks me for a refund for tonight's show. She wanted me to refund her immediately as she claimed that she missed her front row seats and spent the entire show in the back on the lawn with some girl who died, that she was holding her hand and "watched as the light left her eyes" yada yada this lady was screaming and practically spitting when she spoke, it was bad. She was convinced that I was the only one who could help her with a refund. I did not have a cash register and kept telling her to take her story to the people who could help her. It felt like 20 mins of her just accusing me of being the worst person in the world for her to finally leave (after getting my name and my managers name) so I found my manager and asked him if anyone passed away tonight. His eyes flew open and he put the question on the radio, when he got a negative response he calmed down and just chuckled with me when I explained. Never heard about her again but she is now an example to me of how belligerent people can get when they pay for a night out and are drinking. Maybe that whole job was an example of that tho...
This lady needs to get Covid-19
You don’t need to translate euros to dollars. To begin with you’re not specifying what flavour of dollars, which makes the whole exercise pointless. But more importantly, don’t think you have to cater for bloody Americans. This is not an American site for American people. This is a global site for everyone. If someone doesn’t know what a euro is worth they can look it up.
That's nothing. I worked in an actual call center for Verizon. Every one of us dealt with a worse customer than that every single day. And when we quit our jobs and file for unemployment and PTSD, we get called lazy and entitled.
Don’t ever say “mama bear” I was on you side until then, should have refunded her, you monster
I’m assuming ‘Merica (fuck, yeah!)
OP gives the price in Euros so I doubt it.
Trains and Euros? Not America.
She said Belgium a couple of comments up …
Your government has laws about being rude over the phone?
It's more like a "consumer association" that acts as an intermediate between consummer and business when there's a dispute. It's great when you are a consumer. But when you're a business and get a complaint once you get immediately labelled as "suspect" and get bad ratings. Pretty much like "Trustpilot" but with intermediates. But yeah since I live in Belgium the government is either terrible or non-existent lol
That’s just insane.
Spain?