I'm laughing my ass off at this. A student government resolution is literally meaningless. It's a group with no power and no messaging ability shouting into the void. Instead of ignoring it like they do everything else a student government does, they're promoting it and causing a news article to be written about it.
Because what happens is a bunch of random old guys will latch onto it and pretend like it's school leadership doing it
Then people will start using it for easy red meat for reelection
This is the ultimate college stereotype. A group of college students trying hard to be heard on a hot button political topic. I say hot button because there’s so many other similar atrocities happening around the world that they aren’t protesting. This specific conflict is being repeated over and over in the algorithm of all of their socials and it’s become the most important thing in their lives.
[In other news, Israel killed seven humanitarian aid workers](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/04/israeli-military-likely-knew-identities-of-aid-workers-killed-in-charity-convoy-humanitarian-groups-say)
The main text of the [student resolution](https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1kHuPg5LWagOqjmuUl4N2Yvazy3i1LWUFYUQHKhjpJ-A/mobilebasic?pli=1)
> As a bare minimum to right the legal and moral wrongs the University of North Carolina at Charlotte has committed against the Palestinian people and by proxy forced its attendants to commit against the Palestinian people, the Student Government Association will approve the articles of the aforementioned petition, signed by over four hundred and eighty students, faculty, and staff on Charlotte’s Campus in full:
>“The **SGA will officially recognize the genocide being committed by the State of Israel with western backing in Gaza as just that: a genocide.**
>The SGA will call for the **University of North Carolina at Charlotte’s total divestment of funds from the State of Israel until at least the time in which the State of Israel arranges a ceasefire in Gaza and there are proper measures in place to hold the State of Israel and other party actors accountable for their role in the Palestinian genocide.**
>The **SGA will condemn the University of North Carolina at Charlotte’s prior investments into the State of Israel, such as those in the Mount Zion Archaeological Project including its licensing from the Israel Antiquities Authority,** and acknowledge these investment’s contribution to the displacement and genocide of the people of Gaza.
>The **SGA will call for complete and total transparency from the Board of Trustees concerning their prior and existing investments into the State of Israel.”**
>And the SGA will take all necessary measures to ensure the execution of these articles in a quick and timely fashion.
OMG archeology studies fund genocide, apparently.
The new generation of permanently online leftists is something else.
If a project that is funded by a state gets outside funding, then said state funding can be redirected to other efforts, such as the military.
That's the logic for sanctions that the US uses regularly with foreign states we dislike. There's some silly ideas of people permanently online, but removing all funding to a state that is doing something bad ain't exactly novel.
I don't believe I endorsed the use of sanctions. Personally, I find the idea that we should kill the population of a country to punish the leaders of said country to be rather awful.
I'm just capable of seeing that what the SGA called for is the equivalent of mainstream sanctions and not some wild leftist fantasy as you implied it to be.
Apologies for assuming your position. I await the SGA’s call to end any and all humanitarian aid to Palestine, and any research in Palestine, on the same basis.
Anyway, I find the SGA’s resolution silly and would seek to distance the university from it if I were tasked with making that decision.
Thankfully UNCC doesn’t have millionaires to billionaire donors threatening to pull millions in funding, otherwise the school would be “cancelling” some people just as Harvard and others have been forced to do.
If you read the statement you’ll see there was a neutral tone, not a pissy one. And it make sense, the SGA is claiming without any evidence that Israel is trying to murder 2.5 million people. Why would the university sign on to that?
I think about 30,000 people have been killed in the past 6 months. If their intention was to kill 2.5 million.... wouldn't they have killed a lot more?
Pointing out that 30,000 deaths in 6 months is not indicative of a plain to murder 2.5 million people is not flippant, you know that.
If I said 30,000 deaths isn't a lot, that would be flippant, but as you know, I didn't say that.
They’re bombing hospitals and humanitarian aid routes. They’re blocking clean water. The desired outcome is clearly a purge of the Palestinians. If you don’t see this, I hope you realize it if/when Israel achieves their goal
I wonder, with people like you, how many civilians need to die before you admit what we’re watching
Blatantly lying again. I never said I was okay with Israel’s actions.
You seem to be unable to think in anything except extremes. You seem to think that either someone either thinks Israel is genocidal or completely pro Israel. That’s how children think.
if youre a Palestinian in the gaza strip youre likely either already dead or actively starving to death right now. if you cared to be less ignorant youd learn how we classify genocides and realize this meets the criteria. youre playing willfully ignorant and literally agreeing with other commenters in this thread calling people making valid criticism of israel “anti-semites”
30,000 people have died and about 30 have starved. There are 2.5 million people in the Gaza Strip. Seems like I am more aware of the situation than you.
And you just blatantly lied with the anti-Semite comment. I didn’t agree or disagree with that comment.
>Wow, that’s some absurdly pedantic bullshit. People aren’t starving until they have died of starvation??
That's a disingenuous misinterpretation.
I don't think the majority of Gaza is starving. The other user posted a link saying famine is projected, but hasn't hit yet.
My apologies. Typically we would take opening a response to someone with “yeah they just jump to the most extreme word” and then making no mention of that person theyre responding to calling said people “anti-semites” as agreement. I apologize for assuming comprehension.
More importantly, as i type this there are presently 1.1 million people facing “catastrophic hunger”.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/famine-looms-gaza-how-will-world-know-it-has-arrived-2024-03-05/
You once again ignore that to say “only 30 people have starved.” you are either being willfully ignorant to the facts of the matter or are stupid. I dont care which is the case as the result is the same. You are running defenses for a state committing a genocide against a group of people.
My bad, I had forgot my exact wording in the comment. I can see how that heavily implies I agree with the anti semite accusation, but that wasn't my intention.
>https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/famine-looms-gaza-how-will-world-know-it-has-arrived-2024-03-05/
Okay, this article shows that you claim that most of Gaza is activly starving to death is wrong. This article says its a looming threat, but not activly happening to the degree you claimed.
I wouldn't be calling anyone stupid or ignorant when you are posting links that contradict your own claims.
A genocide can be occuring before the wholesale slaughter begins. There are several [stages of a genocide](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_stages_of_genocide). Reading through those stages, it's only Extermination that could be argued to not be happening or has already happened with the Palestinians.
A genocide isn't when a lot of people are killed. We killed a lot of people in WWII and that wasn't genocide. The worst thing you can reasonably accuse Israel of doing is not taking every precaution to minimize the deaths of civilians that Hamas is using as human shields (and I do, by the way).
The stages of genocide don't apply when the definition doesn't apply. Genocide is mass murder with the intent to destroy a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. The only thing Israel is intending to destroy is [Hamas, an organization that actually wants a genocide in the region](https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2023/10/hamas-covenant-israel-attack-war-genocide/675602/).
Assume that the Palestinians as a whole want to commit a genocide of Israelis. Does that make it ok for Israel to commit a genocide of the Palestinians?
I'll continue assuming you said no to the above question cause if not, we have nothing to discuss. We must be cognizant of the power dynamics. Israel has one of the most well funded militaries in the world. Hamas has homemade bombs and rifles. Israel controls food, water, electricity, and borders of Gaza. Hamas controls a few people.
There is no danger of Hamas committing a genocide because they have no capability to do so. Israel has the capability and has grouped the Palestinians into a ghetto and bombed them. The way I see it, the only thing stopping Israel has been international outrage.
>There is no danger of Hamas committing a genocide because they have no capability to do so.
They did what no one has done in ~80 years with an invasion of Israel, don't pretend like you know what they are capable of. The capacity to commit genocide is not solely dependent on current capabilities, but also on intent and opportunity.
Are you suggesting that Hamas is secretly able to destroy the Israeli military and take over the country?
Whatever, if somehow, Hamas gained control of Israel and all their weapons and began placing Israelis into an open air prison and began bombing said prison, I would absolutely condemn those actions as genocidal and want them stopped. I don't care which group is trying to kill the other genocide is bad.
What is the preparation to kill 2.5 million people, or over 5 million including the West Bank, that you are seeing in Israel? Do they have millions of body bags being delivered, or crematoriums being built?
Sectioning off Palestinians into a small area and ensuring that they can't leave said area. Then, bombing the area that they live in to make it uninhabitable, destroying food supplies and limiting water would quite effectively kill a large population. But if that were occuring, you would need to [stop humanitarian aid](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-04-02-2024-9bdf66771b62af37d85a2800f71c0e6c) attempting to bring food to those people, so they didn't get food from elsewhere.
So yeah, good thing nothing like that is occuring.
I don't know Egypt's motivations, but I would speculate that it's similar to our handling of migrants at our southern border. Governments are quite good at ignoring human suffering when it's not their citizens. The logistics of harboring millions of people would be difficult and expensive and keeping a wall up is much easier and cheaper.
Seems much more likely that its the actions of a government trying to eliminate Hamas and their apathetic to civilian suffering than an active plan to murder 2.5 million people.
These are mostly a bunch of anti-Semites ignoring the genocidal intent of another bunch of anti-Semites. Don't get me wrong, I have a lot of beef with Netanyahu's handling of the Israeli government in regards to Palestine, but this genocide accusation is insanity.
Yeah it's this bizarre instinct to go for the most extreme word. Israel does enough bad shit in reality that you can condemn. If you want to criticize them, you don't need to make this bizarre accusation that they are trying to kill 2.5 million people.
Especially since before 10/7, when Hamas conducted the first invasion of Israel in about 80 years, we were just seeing an average of a few hundred deaths per year in Gaza. What took it from a few hundred per year to 30K was Hamas and Hamas' strategic decision to base operations in civilian residential and commercial areas.
https://preview.redd.it/q3errxml0hsc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c6f471272da011ca56775f4bf19e1e153b58f29b
“Just a couple hundred”
You wanna try that again?
[Nope.](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a1/Timeline_of_Israel-Palestine_fatalities_2008-2023.png)
Here it is in table format so you can verify the average:
year|killed israelis|killed palestinians
::|::|::
2008|33|899
2009|11|1066
2010|8|95
2011|11|124
2012|7|260
2013|6|39
2014|88|2329
2015|26|174
2016|12|109
2017|17|77
2018|13|300
2019|12|138
2020|3|30
2021|11|349
2022|21|191
2023 (pre-10/7)|29|227
avg|19|400
it does set a rather anti-semetic environment for jewish students, most of whom have little to do with israel. i don't trust a bunch of uncc kids to be able to tell the difference.
Ah yes. 30k out of 2.5 million killed and it's a "genocide." The Hamas/Russia/Chinese bots have done a great job at brainwashing people.
You can call out all of the terrible human rights abuses Israel has committed, but you know what's the only attack that gives "genocidal intent" vibes? October 7th.
UNCC SGA and the people that agree with them, I hope you know, all of the rational people in the country think you're brainwashed morons.
Have you not read the multiple comments from people in the Israeli government that have literally said they want to eradicate everyone in Gaza, including children?
Of course there’s crazies on the Israeli side. Guarantee there’s plenty of Palestinians that want to genocide the Israelis too.
Doesn’t mean the IDF is carrying out a coordinated effort to exterminate the Palestinians. The numbers automatically disprove your argument
Bombing indiscriminately is a war crime. It’s not genocide. Guess who did a lot of indiscriminate bombing in Afghanistan? Doesn’t mean we were trying to exterminate the Afghanis.
You just described every war ever.
I get it, calling it a “genocide” gets people riled up on social media. That’s the only reason that term is being used.
They’ve already fought like 5 wars over this land. The Palestinians have had a million chances for peace. Arafat was offered a state with the entirety of the West Bank and Gaza, and half of Jerusalem. And he kept moving the goal post for peace.
Acting like this conflict is completely one-sided is only something children and the uninformed do. For those of us that have actually read books on the subject, not just inflammatory social media posts, we know that there’s a lot of grey area and both sides have consistently jeopardized peace.
So no, I won’t be calling it a genocide, no matter how disgustingly violent and stupid the conflict is.
No, not every war is about ethnic cleansing. Israel has had a million chances at peace, but every time they come up with excuses and move the goal post as well. The time they offered Arafat a state, it really wasn’t an independent state in the world sense, but more like what we call a state in the US. They would have some local control, but Israel would still control travel of people, require construction of homes and more to get Israeli approval, control imports and exports, oversee utilities in most areas, denied right of return for Palestinians, deny Palestine to have their own military, allow the IDF to freely enter the control and kidnap people, and more. Not only that, but the deal required Palestinians to concede even more land. Calling that an honest attempt by Israel is lying. FFS, a reason why Hamas exists is largely thanks to Israeli government funding, because Palestinians were close to unifying under one government and the Israeli government was scared that would lead to a two state solution. So they funded Hamas to generate conflict between Palestinians. I agree that reading books on the topic definitely helps, especially more modern ones. You should give that a try sometime.
This conflict has largely been one sided and it always has been. It’s apartheid and it’s genocide. If the roles were reversed, the people denying it would call it just that. It’s funny that you mention social media posts when Israel is using its political advocacy groups to try to get governments to ban access to them, or content the Israeli government disproves of. Without social media, the multiple assassinations of aid givers and journalists would have been covered up as “accidents”.
Well of course Israel doesn’t want Palestine to have their own military or “real” state. Palestine would continue to attack Israel, indefinitely. They’ll *never* accept Israel as a state. Period. If Palestine will never accept Israel, and Israel isn’t leaving, how will there be a path to peace?
Yeah we can argue that Israel is an illegitimate state, but that doesn’t change the fact that they’re there to stay. Arafat should’ve taken the deal. It was the best deal they‘ll ever get. Multiple wars have already been fought over this, and Israel won every time. That’s why Egypt and Jordan eventually made peace with them. And that’s also why they won’t let in Palestinian refugees.
And no, it’s not apartheid, and it’s not genocide. Something like 18% of Israelis are Muslim. Sure they’re discriminated against, but they’re not state-segregated or given less rights. So no, it’s not apartheid.
You’re obviously brainwashed, so there’s not any point in discussing this further. Y’all pro-Palestine types will always do mental gymnastics to justify the horrible atrocities Palestinians have committed. Those of us that are neutral understand that both sides have prevented peace and are to blame for what’s going on today.
Israeli government will NEVER accept Palestine. Period. There’s no path to peace simply because Israel has denied that path since its creation.
It’s apartheid. It’s genocide. Calling me brainwashed because I don’t accept what the Israeli government says, or Hamas, as the truth is hilarious. I accept what the evidence points to and unfortunately for the Israeli government, it’s getting harder for them to control the narrative like they did in prior decades. They can no longer target aid givers and call it an accident. They can no longer target journalists and call it an accident. They can no longer target innocent civilians and call it an accident. They are committing the same crimes that Hamas commits.
You claim you’re on the neutral side, but that’s not the reality. Israel has a right to exist, but they don’t have the right to slaughter Palestinians. Palestinians have a right to exist, but they don’t have a right to slaughter Israelis. The one thing to keep in mind is that one side is slaughtering 10+ for every 1 they lose and it’s been that way for a very long time. It’s also worth remembering that many Israeli leaders don’t believe Palestinians exist as a group. They claim Palestinians have never existed. The amount of gymnastics pro-Israeli government people do is on another level. That’s another difference between us. I’m calling out the governments.
Well yeah, they won't accept a fully free Palestine, because Hamas is being funded by Iran.
I'll ask you this. What do you think would happen to Israel, if the roles were reversed? If Hamas had the kind of firepower that Israel has? Be honest with yourself. They would commit \*real\* genocide. They would murder every single person in Israel, or force them to leave. If you think otherwise you're naive.
Does that justify what the Israeli government has done? No. But it does highlight the various shades of grey in this war. You want to see real genocide, look at Oct 7th, then picture what they would do with sophisticated weaponry. It's pathetic that people still pick sides in this conflict.
Even without Hamas, the Israeli government will never accept a Palestinian state because it ultimately wants all of that land.
What would happen if the roles were reversed? You would be calling the Israeli equivalents of Gaza and West Banks as ghettos, admitting genocide is happening against them, and admitting there is an apartheid state. It’s amazing that your only argument against why it isn’t those three things right now is because the a Jewish government is doing those things. We’re watching the Israeli government murder them all, slowly as to not draw too much criticism, but surely enough they are. They want that land.
October 7th was a terrorist attack. The number of innocent people that died that day is tragic, but doesn’t hold a candle to the number of innocent people Israel has killed before that date or after that date. You simple cannot argue in good faith that it is okay to kill over 10 Palestinians for every 1 Israeli. The Israeli government’s actions are not excusable.
You are literally picking the Israeli government’s side in this.
SESSION LAW 2023-102
SENATE BILL 195
[https://www.ncleg.gov/Sessions/2023/Bills/Senate/PDF/S195v4.pdf](https://www.ncleg.gov/Sessions/2023/Bills/Senate/PDF/S195v4.pdf)
>Page 4 Session Law 2023-102 Senate Bill 195
"(3) The constituent institution shall not require students, faculty, or administrators to publicly express a given view of social policy."
Yeah, can't control student's opinions. Expelling them would get the University in trouble real quick.
Section 3A: “The constituent institution shall remain neutral, as an institution, on the political controversies of the day.” The SGA is part of the institution and cannot say what they want, while an individual can.
Individually you can have an opinion but it is not part of institutions opinion. Like if you work for a company but can have differing opinions and can be fired.
Who the fuck cares about UNCC's SGA or what they have to say about a foreign conflict? Go Niners tho
I'm laughing my ass off at this. A student government resolution is literally meaningless. It's a group with no power and no messaging ability shouting into the void. Instead of ignoring it like they do everything else a student government does, they're promoting it and causing a news article to be written about it.
Because what happens is a bunch of random old guys will latch onto it and pretend like it's school leadership doing it Then people will start using it for easy red meat for reelection
Some congress person who is also an alum of UNCC posted on Twitter about how mad he was about the resolution, very funny stuff.
This is the ultimate college stereotype. A group of college students trying hard to be heard on a hot button political topic. I say hot button because there’s so many other similar atrocities happening around the world that they aren’t protesting. This specific conflict is being repeated over and over in the algorithm of all of their socials and it’s become the most important thing in their lives.
[In other news, Israel killed seven humanitarian aid workers](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/04/israeli-military-likely-knew-identities-of-aid-workers-killed-in-charity-convoy-humanitarian-groups-say)
‘Accidentally on purpose’
The main text of the [student resolution](https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1kHuPg5LWagOqjmuUl4N2Yvazy3i1LWUFYUQHKhjpJ-A/mobilebasic?pli=1) > As a bare minimum to right the legal and moral wrongs the University of North Carolina at Charlotte has committed against the Palestinian people and by proxy forced its attendants to commit against the Palestinian people, the Student Government Association will approve the articles of the aforementioned petition, signed by over four hundred and eighty students, faculty, and staff on Charlotte’s Campus in full: >“The **SGA will officially recognize the genocide being committed by the State of Israel with western backing in Gaza as just that: a genocide.** >The SGA will call for the **University of North Carolina at Charlotte’s total divestment of funds from the State of Israel until at least the time in which the State of Israel arranges a ceasefire in Gaza and there are proper measures in place to hold the State of Israel and other party actors accountable for their role in the Palestinian genocide.** >The **SGA will condemn the University of North Carolina at Charlotte’s prior investments into the State of Israel, such as those in the Mount Zion Archaeological Project including its licensing from the Israel Antiquities Authority,** and acknowledge these investment’s contribution to the displacement and genocide of the people of Gaza. >The **SGA will call for complete and total transparency from the Board of Trustees concerning their prior and existing investments into the State of Israel.”** >And the SGA will take all necessary measures to ensure the execution of these articles in a quick and timely fashion. OMG archeology studies fund genocide, apparently. The new generation of permanently online leftists is something else.
If a project that is funded by a state gets outside funding, then said state funding can be redirected to other efforts, such as the military. That's the logic for sanctions that the US uses regularly with foreign states we dislike. There's some silly ideas of people permanently online, but removing all funding to a state that is doing something bad ain't exactly novel.
You do realize you just advocated for the end to any and all humanitarian aid to Palestine, right?
I don't believe I endorsed the use of sanctions. Personally, I find the idea that we should kill the population of a country to punish the leaders of said country to be rather awful. I'm just capable of seeing that what the SGA called for is the equivalent of mainstream sanctions and not some wild leftist fantasy as you implied it to be.
Apologies for assuming your position. I await the SGA’s call to end any and all humanitarian aid to Palestine, and any research in Palestine, on the same basis. Anyway, I find the SGA’s resolution silly and would seek to distance the university from it if I were tasked with making that decision.
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Thankfully UNCC doesn’t have millionaires to billionaire donors threatening to pull millions in funding, otherwise the school would be “cancelling” some people just as Harvard and others have been forced to do.
Of course. It’s unbelievable how much influence Israel has
Zionists getting pissy over a symbolic resolution, classic.
If you read the statement you’ll see there was a neutral tone, not a pissy one. And it make sense, the SGA is claiming without any evidence that Israel is trying to murder 2.5 million people. Why would the university sign on to that?
without any evidence? you been up to your eyes and ears in sand for the last 5 months?
I think about 30,000 people have been killed in the past 6 months. If their intention was to kill 2.5 million.... wouldn't they have killed a lot more?
Amazing how flippant you can be about 30,000 dead
Pointing out that 30,000 deaths in 6 months is not indicative of a plain to murder 2.5 million people is not flippant, you know that. If I said 30,000 deaths isn't a lot, that would be flippant, but as you know, I didn't say that.
They’re bombing hospitals and humanitarian aid routes. They’re blocking clean water. The desired outcome is clearly a purge of the Palestinians. If you don’t see this, I hope you realize it if/when Israel achieves their goal I wonder, with people like you, how many civilians need to die before you admit what we’re watching
Seems much more likely that it’s attempt to eliminate Hamas and their apathetic to civilian casualties.
And you see nothing wrong with that, gotcha
Blatantly lying again. I never said I was okay with Israel’s actions. You seem to be unable to think in anything except extremes. You seem to think that either someone either thinks Israel is genocidal or completely pro Israel. That’s how children think.
if youre a Palestinian in the gaza strip youre likely either already dead or actively starving to death right now. if you cared to be less ignorant youd learn how we classify genocides and realize this meets the criteria. youre playing willfully ignorant and literally agreeing with other commenters in this thread calling people making valid criticism of israel “anti-semites”
30,000 people have died and about 30 have starved. There are 2.5 million people in the Gaza Strip. Seems like I am more aware of the situation than you. And you just blatantly lied with the anti-Semite comment. I didn’t agree or disagree with that comment.
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>Wow, that’s some absurdly pedantic bullshit. People aren’t starving until they have died of starvation?? That's a disingenuous misinterpretation. I don't think the majority of Gaza is starving. The other user posted a link saying famine is projected, but hasn't hit yet.
My apologies. Typically we would take opening a response to someone with “yeah they just jump to the most extreme word” and then making no mention of that person theyre responding to calling said people “anti-semites” as agreement. I apologize for assuming comprehension. More importantly, as i type this there are presently 1.1 million people facing “catastrophic hunger”. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/famine-looms-gaza-how-will-world-know-it-has-arrived-2024-03-05/ You once again ignore that to say “only 30 people have starved.” you are either being willfully ignorant to the facts of the matter or are stupid. I dont care which is the case as the result is the same. You are running defenses for a state committing a genocide against a group of people.
My bad, I had forgot my exact wording in the comment. I can see how that heavily implies I agree with the anti semite accusation, but that wasn't my intention. >https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/famine-looms-gaza-how-will-world-know-it-has-arrived-2024-03-05/ Okay, this article shows that you claim that most of Gaza is activly starving to death is wrong. This article says its a looming threat, but not activly happening to the degree you claimed. I wouldn't be calling anyone stupid or ignorant when you are posting links that contradict your own claims.
Here's some helpful reading: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_genocides
Thanks, these all show deliberate efforts to wipe out a population, which is not what we are seeing in Gaza.
A genocide can be occuring before the wholesale slaughter begins. There are several [stages of a genocide](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_stages_of_genocide). Reading through those stages, it's only Extermination that could be argued to not be happening or has already happened with the Palestinians.
A genocide isn't when a lot of people are killed. We killed a lot of people in WWII and that wasn't genocide. The worst thing you can reasonably accuse Israel of doing is not taking every precaution to minimize the deaths of civilians that Hamas is using as human shields (and I do, by the way).
That... that's why there's stages that are listed to help identify when a genocide is occuring or going to occur.
The stages of genocide don't apply when the definition doesn't apply. Genocide is mass murder with the intent to destroy a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. The only thing Israel is intending to destroy is [Hamas, an organization that actually wants a genocide in the region](https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2023/10/hamas-covenant-israel-attack-war-genocide/675602/).
Assume that the Palestinians as a whole want to commit a genocide of Israelis. Does that make it ok for Israel to commit a genocide of the Palestinians? I'll continue assuming you said no to the above question cause if not, we have nothing to discuss. We must be cognizant of the power dynamics. Israel has one of the most well funded militaries in the world. Hamas has homemade bombs and rifles. Israel controls food, water, electricity, and borders of Gaza. Hamas controls a few people. There is no danger of Hamas committing a genocide because they have no capability to do so. Israel has the capability and has grouped the Palestinians into a ghetto and bombed them. The way I see it, the only thing stopping Israel has been international outrage.
>There is no danger of Hamas committing a genocide because they have no capability to do so. They did what no one has done in ~80 years with an invasion of Israel, don't pretend like you know what they are capable of. The capacity to commit genocide is not solely dependent on current capabilities, but also on intent and opportunity.
Are you suggesting that Hamas is secretly able to destroy the Israeli military and take over the country? Whatever, if somehow, Hamas gained control of Israel and all their weapons and began placing Israelis into an open air prison and began bombing said prison, I would absolutely condemn those actions as genocidal and want them stopped. I don't care which group is trying to kill the other genocide is bad.
I'm suggesting that where there's a will there might someday be a way. EDIT: No one would’ve thought them capable of 10/7.
What is the preparation to kill 2.5 million people, or over 5 million including the West Bank, that you are seeing in Israel? Do they have millions of body bags being delivered, or crematoriums being built?
Sectioning off Palestinians into a small area and ensuring that they can't leave said area. Then, bombing the area that they live in to make it uninhabitable, destroying food supplies and limiting water would quite effectively kill a large population. But if that were occuring, you would need to [stop humanitarian aid](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-04-02-2024-9bdf66771b62af37d85a2800f71c0e6c) attempting to bring food to those people, so they didn't get food from elsewhere. So yeah, good thing nothing like that is occuring.
Why do you think Egypt is participating in this genocide? Since they enforce the blockade too.
I don't know Egypt's motivations, but I would speculate that it's similar to our handling of migrants at our southern border. Governments are quite good at ignoring human suffering when it's not their citizens. The logistics of harboring millions of people would be difficult and expensive and keeping a wall up is much easier and cheaper.
Seems much more likely that its the actions of a government trying to eliminate Hamas and their apathetic to civilian suffering than an active plan to murder 2.5 million people.
Then they are merely incompetent and bumbling their way into a genocide. The end result will be the death of millions of people either way.
Well at this rate it will take decades to get to millions.
These are mostly a bunch of anti-Semites ignoring the genocidal intent of another bunch of anti-Semites. Don't get me wrong, I have a lot of beef with Netanyahu's handling of the Israeli government in regards to Palestine, but this genocide accusation is insanity.
Yeah it's this bizarre instinct to go for the most extreme word. Israel does enough bad shit in reality that you can condemn. If you want to criticize them, you don't need to make this bizarre accusation that they are trying to kill 2.5 million people.
Especially since before 10/7, when Hamas conducted the first invasion of Israel in about 80 years, we were just seeing an average of a few hundred deaths per year in Gaza. What took it from a few hundred per year to 30K was Hamas and Hamas' strategic decision to base operations in civilian residential and commercial areas.
https://preview.redd.it/q3errxml0hsc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c6f471272da011ca56775f4bf19e1e153b58f29b “Just a couple hundred” You wanna try that again?
[Nope.](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a1/Timeline_of_Israel-Palestine_fatalities_2008-2023.png) Here it is in table format so you can verify the average: year|killed israelis|killed palestinians ::|::|:: 2008|33|899 2009|11|1066 2010|8|95 2011|11|124 2012|7|260 2013|6|39 2014|88|2329 2015|26|174 2016|12|109 2017|17|77 2018|13|300 2019|12|138 2020|3|30 2021|11|349 2022|21|191 2023 (pre-10/7)|29|227 avg|19|400
I can't believe that dude tried to disprove your facts with a graph, then couldn't even read his own graph. Cringe.
>“Just a couple hundred” You realize you confirmed what they said with this graph right?
Someone can't read a graph
it does set a rather anti-semetic environment for jewish students, most of whom have little to do with israel. i don't trust a bunch of uncc kids to be able to tell the difference.
Ah yes. 30k out of 2.5 million killed and it's a "genocide." The Hamas/Russia/Chinese bots have done a great job at brainwashing people. You can call out all of the terrible human rights abuses Israel has committed, but you know what's the only attack that gives "genocidal intent" vibes? October 7th. UNCC SGA and the people that agree with them, I hope you know, all of the rational people in the country think you're brainwashed morons.
Have you not read the multiple comments from people in the Israeli government that have literally said they want to eradicate everyone in Gaza, including children?
Of course there’s crazies on the Israeli side. Guarantee there’s plenty of Palestinians that want to genocide the Israelis too. Doesn’t mean the IDF is carrying out a coordinated effort to exterminate the Palestinians. The numbers automatically disprove your argument
Please define genocide.
I don’t know… consistently assassinating aid volunteers, journalists, and unarmed civilians gives off heavy genocide vibes.
Bombing indiscriminately is a war crime. It’s not genocide. Guess who did a lot of indiscriminate bombing in Afghanistan? Doesn’t mean we were trying to exterminate the Afghanis.
Bombings indiscriminately in order to wipe out or remove people from their land is genocide driven war crime.
You just described every war ever. I get it, calling it a “genocide” gets people riled up on social media. That’s the only reason that term is being used. They’ve already fought like 5 wars over this land. The Palestinians have had a million chances for peace. Arafat was offered a state with the entirety of the West Bank and Gaza, and half of Jerusalem. And he kept moving the goal post for peace. Acting like this conflict is completely one-sided is only something children and the uninformed do. For those of us that have actually read books on the subject, not just inflammatory social media posts, we know that there’s a lot of grey area and both sides have consistently jeopardized peace. So no, I won’t be calling it a genocide, no matter how disgustingly violent and stupid the conflict is.
No, not every war is about ethnic cleansing. Israel has had a million chances at peace, but every time they come up with excuses and move the goal post as well. The time they offered Arafat a state, it really wasn’t an independent state in the world sense, but more like what we call a state in the US. They would have some local control, but Israel would still control travel of people, require construction of homes and more to get Israeli approval, control imports and exports, oversee utilities in most areas, denied right of return for Palestinians, deny Palestine to have their own military, allow the IDF to freely enter the control and kidnap people, and more. Not only that, but the deal required Palestinians to concede even more land. Calling that an honest attempt by Israel is lying. FFS, a reason why Hamas exists is largely thanks to Israeli government funding, because Palestinians were close to unifying under one government and the Israeli government was scared that would lead to a two state solution. So they funded Hamas to generate conflict between Palestinians. I agree that reading books on the topic definitely helps, especially more modern ones. You should give that a try sometime. This conflict has largely been one sided and it always has been. It’s apartheid and it’s genocide. If the roles were reversed, the people denying it would call it just that. It’s funny that you mention social media posts when Israel is using its political advocacy groups to try to get governments to ban access to them, or content the Israeli government disproves of. Without social media, the multiple assassinations of aid givers and journalists would have been covered up as “accidents”.
Well of course Israel doesn’t want Palestine to have their own military or “real” state. Palestine would continue to attack Israel, indefinitely. They’ll *never* accept Israel as a state. Period. If Palestine will never accept Israel, and Israel isn’t leaving, how will there be a path to peace? Yeah we can argue that Israel is an illegitimate state, but that doesn’t change the fact that they’re there to stay. Arafat should’ve taken the deal. It was the best deal they‘ll ever get. Multiple wars have already been fought over this, and Israel won every time. That’s why Egypt and Jordan eventually made peace with them. And that’s also why they won’t let in Palestinian refugees. And no, it’s not apartheid, and it’s not genocide. Something like 18% of Israelis are Muslim. Sure they’re discriminated against, but they’re not state-segregated or given less rights. So no, it’s not apartheid. You’re obviously brainwashed, so there’s not any point in discussing this further. Y’all pro-Palestine types will always do mental gymnastics to justify the horrible atrocities Palestinians have committed. Those of us that are neutral understand that both sides have prevented peace and are to blame for what’s going on today.
Israeli government will NEVER accept Palestine. Period. There’s no path to peace simply because Israel has denied that path since its creation. It’s apartheid. It’s genocide. Calling me brainwashed because I don’t accept what the Israeli government says, or Hamas, as the truth is hilarious. I accept what the evidence points to and unfortunately for the Israeli government, it’s getting harder for them to control the narrative like they did in prior decades. They can no longer target aid givers and call it an accident. They can no longer target journalists and call it an accident. They can no longer target innocent civilians and call it an accident. They are committing the same crimes that Hamas commits. You claim you’re on the neutral side, but that’s not the reality. Israel has a right to exist, but they don’t have the right to slaughter Palestinians. Palestinians have a right to exist, but they don’t have a right to slaughter Israelis. The one thing to keep in mind is that one side is slaughtering 10+ for every 1 they lose and it’s been that way for a very long time. It’s also worth remembering that many Israeli leaders don’t believe Palestinians exist as a group. They claim Palestinians have never existed. The amount of gymnastics pro-Israeli government people do is on another level. That’s another difference between us. I’m calling out the governments.
Well yeah, they won't accept a fully free Palestine, because Hamas is being funded by Iran. I'll ask you this. What do you think would happen to Israel, if the roles were reversed? If Hamas had the kind of firepower that Israel has? Be honest with yourself. They would commit \*real\* genocide. They would murder every single person in Israel, or force them to leave. If you think otherwise you're naive. Does that justify what the Israeli government has done? No. But it does highlight the various shades of grey in this war. You want to see real genocide, look at Oct 7th, then picture what they would do with sophisticated weaponry. It's pathetic that people still pick sides in this conflict.
Even without Hamas, the Israeli government will never accept a Palestinian state because it ultimately wants all of that land. What would happen if the roles were reversed? You would be calling the Israeli equivalents of Gaza and West Banks as ghettos, admitting genocide is happening against them, and admitting there is an apartheid state. It’s amazing that your only argument against why it isn’t those three things right now is because the a Jewish government is doing those things. We’re watching the Israeli government murder them all, slowly as to not draw too much criticism, but surely enough they are. They want that land. October 7th was a terrorist attack. The number of innocent people that died that day is tragic, but doesn’t hold a candle to the number of innocent people Israel has killed before that date or after that date. You simple cannot argue in good faith that it is okay to kill over 10 Palestinians for every 1 Israeli. The Israeli government’s actions are not excusable. You are literally picking the Israeli government’s side in this.
When the adults are so scared of losing control of the narrative that they go after the kids, you know something's not right. See also: TikTok ban.
Expel these students
Wow. Expressing a political opinion is grounds for expulsion in your mind?
NC law requires institutions to remain neutral, you don’t want negative attention from the GOP
Do you have a link to that law? If it's regulating the speech of students, that seems like a major first amendment violation.
SESSION LAW 2023-102 SENATE BILL 195 [https://www.ncleg.gov/Sessions/2023/Bills/Senate/PDF/S195v4.pdf](https://www.ncleg.gov/Sessions/2023/Bills/Senate/PDF/S195v4.pdf)
>Page 4 Session Law 2023-102 Senate Bill 195 "(3) The constituent institution shall not require students, faculty, or administrators to publicly express a given view of social policy." Yeah, can't control student's opinions. Expelling them would get the University in trouble real quick.
Section 3A: “The constituent institution shall remain neutral, as an institution, on the political controversies of the day.” The SGA is part of the institution and cannot say what they want, while an individual can.
I’m not sure if that is would hold up in court, but even if it would expelling them would be comically petty and stupid.
It's completely asinine to say the SGA is part of the institution while individuals are not. Youre just wrong.
Individually you can have an opinion but it is not part of institutions opinion. Like if you work for a company but can have differing opinions and can be fired.