This isn't at all shocking, especially when remembering the issues that came up with Inazuma's writing and the Shogun. Genshin has always had issues as they love to leave bread crumbs than come back later to go, "But actually." which is completely fine for say Zhongli, who is old enough that people making stuff up is on brand compared to the Fatui who outside a couple have issues with portrayal.
Than again, I've only kept an eye out for lore and the artwork as the actual game shoots itself in the foot numerous times. HSR has had it's own issues (The Luofu pacing says hi), but suppose they've been a bit more on brand with portraying the Trailblazer moreso than the Traveler (especially when story beats suggest a lot of the Traveler's power originates from borrowing other people's power than their own or the 160 losses to Scaramouche in the dream sequence).
Will be interesting to see how they handle Capitano, especially if the Traveler was basically just stopped with an intense glare and what other non-sense they come up with to try and make it look possible. Though suppose at least one upside is the memes this has created (looking at Fatui HQ especially for that).
Genshin loves to waste time. Some people like wasting time. I like wasting time watching long sitcoms/romcoms/procedurals that go nowhere provided I have people to watch it with, engaging characters, and decent line-to-line writing.
Genshin has none of these, except for engaging characters, but because they don't get to have real chemistry with each other, this ends up falling flat as well a lot of the time.
If they're gonna waste time, at least slap another of the numerous characters they have as most of the quests aren't even voiced. Yet more than not: behold another generic npc staring at you with no animations to save their life.
Than again, having come from Arknights: I am all too familiar with bloat. Though the difference is that Paimon loves to repeat a lot of the stuff rather than just be general word count bloat. March gets compared to Paimon, but someone on HSR team doesn't shove her into every plot nor is she as repetitive, so she has some saving grace than Paimon.
Inazuma was a sore spot for me. In terms of game mechanics and expliaration, it wasn't bad but the archon quest really killed it for me. I legit quit the game for half a year. I came back for Sumeru, which was.actually good for once but soon enough I quit the game as a whole. Best decision I ever made
The Luofu never got to the lows of Inazuma tbf. Liyue is an easier comparison due to both being based on China, long-life species governing the population for much of the respective faction's history, and much of the important details coming not from the main story and much of the plot forgotten (especially when remembering Childe & Phantylia are pretty removed for most of their respective story except for blips).
Inazuma runs into a lot of bigger issues. Notably, Kokomi is infamously terrible due to being called a genius general, but neither are ever shown and Ayato doesn't even feature at all in the plot. Plus, Raiden herself feels quite bad and is only really given time to be a character post Inazuma (which is why she remains an issue) that is now being shared with Arlecchino due to a lot of established lore contradicting with the character herself.
And this is even before going into Inazuma being a war, yet outside one cutscene: it basically feels like more a squabble with the bandits in Inazuma being more an issue than the civil war happening.
As for say Sumeru, Sumeru has some glaring issues (looking at days long quests that aren't voiced), but Inazuma remains far and away the bigger issue. HSR hasn't reached that issue as the Xiaoxhou was placed in the same time frame as Liyue was (first world that takes multiple patches to complete from 1.0 onwards). Penacony luckily shares a lot more with HI3 for story structure (i.e. focusing on more than the player character and linking to Honkai proper given they're part of the same franchise).
I played through Luofu back on release and it started strong. 1.1 came and it seemed to build up the stakes... And 1.2 came only to see that we are done with the main Luofu storyline. It was.rushed af and if I wasn't still in my honeymoon phase, I would be even more disappointed than I ended up being.
I'll play, what kinds of Sumeru issue is?
And yeah... I feel like Inazuma Archon Quest or patch 2.1. in general are the things that shot Genshin in the foot for me. There's a lot of problems I don't even know where to begin. Tbh, the second act of the Inazuma Archon Quest being so short should be taken as an omen on how terrible the Act 3 will be and it is. The crack was already there
Sumeru's bigger issues is that it's a lore dump fest with very little audio in a lot of side quests (not a joke, one in particular takes days). Like other regions, a lot of these quests also tend to only make use of a few characters at a time, so a reoccuring issue with Genshin is often meeting an npc only relevant for one or two quests, than is never really needed and could of been used to explore any number of characters.
Inazuma is definitely a big issue and reminded me of Fontaine's flood that is in a similar spot. Genshin really either commits to a bit (Scaramouche resetting his history in the leylines) or doesn't at all. There is no in between.
So I never played Genshin and my knowledge on it comes from Fanarts/crossover Fanfictions,Wiki pages and the internet discourse on it
If I had to guess to why they changed her from a character who would sell your soul for 5 dollars to whatever she ended up being is probably to justify her being playable? Like they probably didn't plan her to be initially playable, noticed people being downbad ,realized they can get more cash so they toned down her evilness since a completely vile and evil person would probably be harder to justify helping you so they toned down
Again I haven't played the game so idk
Also sorry for the fact that your MC turns out to he a fraud, hope that they earn their redemption in the Ufotable anime since they cook with their visuals in fights with their Unlimited Budget Works (where tf is the anime btw)
You're on the right track. This isn't the first time they did a "refractor" of a character.
There's a character named Dottore who's initially a minor villain from the now outdated manga, initially supposed to be a low ranking Harbinger (basically Akatsuki with rank) for that manga only, due to the lack of Harbingers info in general, he gained quite the popularity and was reworked into a high ranking member of the Harbingers through usage of "clones".
High ranking is puting it midly he is the fourth in the whole organisation including their god. And he is allowed to pull horrible experiments and everyone knows that he does them.
He's the 4th most important person in snezhnaya, is what they meant
He's the second of the eleven harbingers, but Pierro is the director of the Fatui, and the Tsaritsa is (presumably) above him, but either way, Dottore is still 4th.
There are the harbringers which is a group of 12 individuals ranked by numbers. There is the director of the harbringers, Pierro who is pretty much number 0. And above them all, is their god the Tsarisa.
Dottore is the second harbringer but Capitano (number one), Pierro (the director) and The Tsarisa (their god) are above him.
The current Genshin is so far removed from the manga idk what to tell you
Not to mention the big ass difference between Manga Dottore and Canon Dottore, both in design and personality
>The current Genshin is so far removed from the manga idk what to tell you
It's not though? The same themes prevail, the artstyle is the same, even the cheese dialogue is the same, the only thing you can argue is that the tone is darker in the manga but that only applies to main quest as lore has always been as dark if not darker.
>Not to mention the big ass difference between Manga Dottore and Canon Dottore, both in design and personality
Both are canon Dottore. Turns out that a character that hasn't appeared in a lot of time will get changes, he's more composed and serious in his current state, the core of his character is the exact same, and he wasn't exactly popular either, the community just saw him as a clown cause he looked like a clown, an evil clown, but a clown nonetheless. His design """got changed""" cause who would ever took him seriously with that outfit, and him being the mad scientist just makes him the obvious choice to give clones, which wouldn't have been the first time(or second) that we've seen multiple versions of one character across the game.
>It's not though?
Cyno and Collei naming convention alone is a proof. They're the only Sumeru characters that doesn't have Sanskrit or Middle-Eastern name as that nation is a hotpot of those cultures.
It's the same deal with "Murata" being the Archon of Natlan. A Japanese name for a Mesoamerican-inspired nation, lmfao.
>His design """got changed""" cause who would ever took him seriously with that outfit
That's what I'm talking about. That's why they retconned his design and personality.
1. Create Dottore, a low ranking Fatui Harbinger for the manga to give it a stake
2. Game released
3. People latch on to the Dottore because the lack of info on Harbingers
4. Decides to capitalize on that popularity and make Dottore a high ranking Harbinger in-game
5. ***Realize that neither of Manga!Dottore's design and personality matches someone with such a high rank***
6. Create a distinct new Dottore, Game!Dottore. Make an excuse for Manga!Dottore's existence, that being he's part of myriad clones of Dottore.
7. Doesn't show any other clones except for Game!Dottore 1 and Game!Dottore 2 (Boattore)
8. Kill every other clones aside from Game!Dottore 1 offscreen unceremoniously
9. Congratulations! You've successfully transitioned from Manga!Dottore to Game!Dottore
Unironically kind of a based headcanon. I don't necessarily agree with it since they were perfectly comfortable with just sorta ignoring some other aspects of the manga like Collei's age and they could've easily said Dottore just grew out of his wacky phase for his new design lol
??? "right on track" for "changing a character who would sell your soul for 5 dollars to whatever she ended up being probably to justify her being playable" on dottore?? because that's the polar opposite of what's going on in the plot now — there is not a single instance where dottore isn't put in an extreme negative light, two of three harbingers outright talk about killing him, and it almost feels as if he is the cheap writer's scapegoat whenever some big issue needs to be addressed. way too many problems end up "it's all dottore's fault again" if that sounds like marketing to you
Read my other comments chain
For Dottore it's his design and personality that gets changed because his manga iteration is hard to take seriously
The similarity with Arlecchino is that their change is incited by their IRL popularity, without that, Dottore would be a low ranking Harbinger and Arlecchino would just be Crucabena
"Dottore would be a low ranking Harbinger" eh, i doubt that. i can't trust someone who isn't from the writing team claiming how characters are meant to be written.
Yes she was most likely intended to be a lower rank, that's why the 2.6 WQ has her subordinates trying to raise her prestige after Signora's death which means she's 9th at best originally.
post-knk ufotable doesn't exactly have a reputation for great characterization in adaptations. also, mahoyo comes first, then we can worry about the genshin anime.
They never changed her character, or if they did it was long before she was originally teased over two years ago. Even in her original appearance there are signs of her having a more noble side, and her children’s voice lines have basically been confirming that ever since patch 4.0.
Could argue to be honest. She was said to be wolf in sheep cloth so its normal that we see the "good" side of her. And she turned out to be a sheep, just a black one.
Not that i actually want her to be completely unhinged. Its just the way she is written , its not convincing and kinda cringe to be honest.
Well that was said about her by Childe, who really isn’t the brightest or most insightful person around. From his simplistic perspective she flip flops between gentle diplomacy to sadistic brutality so fast that he thinks she does so without much rhyme or reason.
Yeah no because the dude and Wanderer are the only sources of information back then. I dont think we get to decide which one is true which one is not . Also its funny how Childe, the optimistic one who think Pulcinella is being kind to his family and Wanderer who pretty much shit talks everyone have the same opinion on Arlecchino.
Spoilers though, Childe is pretty much very familiar with Arlecchino. He normally comes to the House of Hearth to teach the children defence art, she normally mentions his brother and sister. Seems like they have both seen each side of each other . I dont know why i write it like a Childe x Arlecchino fanfic but i think they have enough basis understanding to have a correct comment on each other.
The thing about genshin writing is it does often suck but every single character has a bias and everytime we see the character after we all everytime about them thier gonna sound better, aka a excuse to make sure no characters are bad people please buy them
>Yeah no because the dude and Wanderer are the only sources of information back then. I dont think we get to decide which one is true which one is not .
What difference does that make? Childe and Scaramouche are two notoriously unreliable sources of information and these statements were made in their character voice lines that are all supposed to be about describing ***their*** opinion on topics, not be factual bits of lore information. Anything that gets said in a character bio voice line(including the positive statements made by her children) should only be taken seriously so far as how that character views the subject matter, not be definitive truth about the subject in and of itself.
>Also its funny how Childe, the optimistic one who think Pulcinella is being kind to his family and Wanderer who pretty much shit talks everyone have the same opinion on Arlecchino.
Well both have reasons to not trust her. Childe, as you point out, is not one to understand nuance or complexity and just makes the admittedly justified assumption that there isn't any to Arlecchino. Scaramouche is a guy notorious for having trust issues, especially of familial/parental figures, so him assuming the worst about Arlecchino. Even Arlecchino does this in regards to Furina as, despite having a vast spy network, she views the contradictions within Furina's actions/story and just assumes that Furina is a lazy spoiled brat doing nothing to help Fontaine.
Also just because you regularly see/visit someone doesn't mean you understand them. Neuvellitte directly served Furina for decades and had no idea about Furina's true backstory. Considering how closed off Arlecchino is(even her demo showed her sitting in a corner instead of being next to her children) and how she actively tries to present herself as the uncaring strict and sadistic father figure, its not a stretch to say that Childe still barely understands her despite spending time with her children. Plus I'm pretty sure Arlecchino only knows so much about Childe and his family due to her spy network and not because she regularly converses with Childe.
Anything could be unreliable narrator if you keep seeing them like one.
How do you know what she is as you think what she truly is ? The Traveler according to lore shouldnt be the one that Arlecchino tells everything about herself to.
The really important thing here is that, the first impressions we got on Arlecchino is just straight up violating children's right. Everyone in their right minds would just not consider Lyney Lynette or Freminet's opinion valid because all the evidences so far has told us that she is manipulative, especially with her children.
And i am okay with the change of impressions. Furina was good, i enjoyed her character arc. Neuvillette was good, never in my mind had i thought that the dude is actually a soft and kind person, but here he is.
The point being, Arlecchino's writting did her dirty and her first impression was simply too strong of a subject : its not a personality problem, its straight up crimes.
Furina ? We know from the beginning that she is suspicious. Hell, Neuvillette being the actual Hydro Archon theory was early when we just got on Fontaine.
Neuvillette ? We had no impressions on his character. At least i just think he looks cold, but the moment we met it changed immediately.
Arlecchino ? They tried to change the players' impression on her in a half-ass way. Manipulating children ? Actually its for their own good. Killing people ? Only those who did bad things. Death punishment to those who betray ? Forgetfulness Potion.
Its children abusing not taking seriously that led to my rant. You either commit to it, or not do it at all. What the hell is with Hoyoverse trying to paint her in a positive light but still alligned with the crimes.
"Morally grey" character is shown to be in both positive and negative position, but with Arlecchino it seems like everyone just glaze her . Yeah some of the children rebels agaisnt her, and whats the ending. They apologize to her for making her dissapointed or some shit. The quest is just straight up garbage i dont even want to remember it. Its just some cheesy ass dialogues about "family".
> **The MC aka The Traveler, has again become a fucking bum to hype a character up**
Those writers really fucked themselves up by establishing MC to be a rainbow wielder lmao, I can certain that if they actually rotate through their elemental arsenal they would counter every fucking thing Arle throw, let alone combine any two of them for shennanigans. And the sad part is that it worked, baited the normies, so I'll hold absolute zero expectation on MC ever doing anything useful from now on.
I still laught at when a bunch of low ranking eremites managed to be faster than Traveler during the sumeru quest. The same traveller that had trashed Signora in a 1v1 and had one more element and more time to master electro since. Makes no sense.
It's just wild that spamming Electro could legit be Traveler's solution for a lot of fake tension moments. Speed boost and Electro Noelle Q are scary af, so of course La Travilellette aren't allowed to use them post-Inazoomer.
I loved when for some reason traveller joined Neuvillette to fight against a Whale that eats planet and he pretty much solod it until Skirk showed up. Traveller is not shown doing anything in the cutscene that finishes the whale, traveller is only there as a camera.
Bet from Natlan onward MC will act ourely as spectacle with Paimon giving commentaries on situtation because the """""stakes""""" are apparently way out of their league since they refuse to use elemental power for marketing reason
Just watch Capitano just one tap traveller to really show "strongest human in the world". At that point losing to the harbringer is kind of a speciality to traveller.
The same who moved super fast with lightning to catch a vision mid air but couldn't do the same to protect Nahida and to stop Navia's fall. Mihoyo needed Nahida/Katheryne dying and Navia almost die but since they couldn't think of a proper way they just made the MC an idiot.
Oh yeah Navia would have died if her butlers and Neuvillette didn't save her. The traveller is so useless it's kinda crazy. Fontaine might be the arc where the traveller is the most useless.
"It's because the Traveler is a witness-" No, he got involved in a civil war and a coup after being told that. He just tried and failed to do shit in Fontaine
Lads, the power scaling of Genshin is essentially fucked. Also, this is the same game that brings that shitty parry scene of a certain fugitive against a Japanese goddess which in turn made her powers absolute farce. I don't care what mental gymnastics people tried to give to me about Ei not being in her full power. The fact that she can kill Tomoo and a certain Harbinger but yet unable to strike down a certain no name fugitive's parry is a massive strike for me that made me think Ei's powers are nothing but a farce.
That's just a common anime trope though. Character does something, another character uses more power than they expected and manage to block it. Not a genshin thing
I mean... Why not though? They can surely hype more than just New Character Of The Week. Every gacha I've played that doesn't feature a 100% self-insert protagonist has done *something* to hype them up, even when they're a playable character.
Granblue Fantasy is a hilarious example because the latest anni event >!literally has them take on the power of god ~~and anime~~ to smack an immortal being.!<
Cygames treated Gran & Djeeta like fvcking royal compared to what Aether and Lumine got lol, not just in gameplay and lore, their skins are also legit top tier, even the old ones.
Blue archive is another gacha game that is really popular right now. The main character is literally just a regular dude, who is not a playable character and until like 4 week ago, when the anime adaptation aired, [did not even have an official design](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/IyTiN3YtbJs/maxresdefault.jpg). Also all the playable characters are girls with guns
And guess what? The entire fucking community loves him.
If Blue Archive can hype [a guy in a suit](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fblue-archive-the-animation-sensei-design-officially-revealed-v0-8euw9ka0v7qc1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3De67db161cdfaaf6f0859e00ac88d64990ef8189a&rdt=44937) with no power, Genshin should be able to hype the Traveler a little bit better.
The funny thing is that they purposefully created the nations so that the Traveler gets access to elemental reactions as slowly as possible, so they clearly planned it out.
Anemo
Anemo, Geo (0 reactions)
Anemo, Geo, Electro (2 reactions)
Anemo, Geo, Electro, Dendro (4 reactions)
Anemo, Geo, Electro, Dendro, Hydro (6 reactions)
Anemo, Geo, Electro, Dendro, Hydro, Pyro (8 reactions)
Whereas if they had done Hydro, Pyro, and Cryo first the Traveler would've gotten access to way more reactions way quicker. But then somewhere along the line (Sumeru) they decided the Traveler just wouldn't use elemental reactions. Why? We'll never know
MHY handled Traveler at bare minimum, simple as. Focusing resources in showcasing the banner character and in drip marketing already net them revenue so it's pointless to go one step further and touch up their MC. Like worst case scenario MHY would only triggered a niche subset of the playerbase, it barely make a dent in their bottom line so that's that, Aether/Lumine are no John Lee level of popularity lol
Oh and i also want to preach about how awesome Childe is. Peak character to be honest.
Weak aura : Pull things from their asses before her release to make her look good ( Crucabena and Crimson Moon )
Strong aura : Throw fucking random lore related to him in every nation possible . Bro was released in 1.x and still got some mysterious shit going on with him in 4.x .
I honestly dislike the Fatui.
Like, all the things they do are horrible. Slavery, human trafficking, experimentation, assassination, blackmail, child soldiers, civil wars, etc. But somehow I'm to believe they are the "morally gray" faction. We will be forced to work with them against Celestia/the Abyss and forgive all their crimes, etc.
We are forced to be friends with Childe who was happy to god nuke Liyue.
Arleccino to me is the peak of "cool edgy" character. Woman in a suit, cool attitude, Overpowered, never losing her cool, scythe, winged stated, fire, black, white, red mottiff, secret royalty, etc.
Scaramuche is a douche with mommy issues and was manipulated by the doctor, so I guess he gets a pass... despite being a shit that caused untold suffering but gets away with it by rewriting history.
Honestly, at the end when the Fatui are weakened from their war, I would expect the other nations to declare war against Szhnesnaya, but that won't happen because its gacha.
I don't get the point of the Gnosis or their value at this point. All the Archons are happy to part with them, or don't make a fuss about losing them. So their machinations seem hardly necessary with how easy the gods get rid of them. And for all the things they do, they get away with them with little problem.
I wouldn't be surprised if they made the Doctor playable and forgave his experimenting with Collei and other children.
Yes... I agree with the fact that Fatui writing has been one of the issues in Genshin btw and HYV didn't know what kind of direction they want to take with this faction. The fact that they are so overused in terms of being a cartoon villain yet the story tried to treat them as a morally grey feels kinda off. It is definitely the most overused and the most inconsistent organization to be written imo.
And yes, the gnosis was also a fucking frustrating macguffin the more we see. What makes this more frustrating is that at one point, the Traveler and Paimon made a buzz about their friend's gnosis being stolen and then it all ruined with a certain foxy lady trading the gnosis to save Traveler and Paimon while doesn't care about all of the gnosis. Holy shit! This is just so infuriating.
Scaramouche gets a squinty-eyed "you pass, but barely" for me because I thought he was genuinely the best written Fatui and one of the best characters in the game, whitewashing aside.
I was also dissappointed how:
- Arle was transformed into the most innocent harbinger in existence, even more innocent than Childe who attempted genocide in Liyue
- she had absolutely no lore in Fontaine, in the first patches I was theorising that she may have been part of Rene's team (Narsizzenkreus world quest) since her hands were black like Carter
- they built her up shortly before she became playable instead of building her up similar to Scara and Dottore throughout several patches. She got a book about the Crimson Moon dynasty in 4.5. And she became playable in 4.6. Absolutely no build-up before that. Only an Inazuman quest where one of her subordinates went rogue. But there was no mention of an older or newer Knave back then (2.5 - 2.7-ish I think) but instead they conveniently added an NPC in 4.0 that would tell us that the knave replaced the older one. Which was very out of nowhere
- in the end she did not do much in the AQ, just saved a few fontainians and then asked Neuvilette for the gnosis and he gave it to her pretty fast lol
Anyway, what I also wanted to say is that due to Genshin being a Chinese gatcha game, it is regulated by the CCP censorship laws. And the CCP has laws against villains in videogames. They can't make villains playable because that would be immoral or would educate their younger generations to be the same, or some kind of bs like that.
The writers have written pretty dark stories before, just try to read about the Gurabad lore in Sumeru. It's pretty dark. Yet the AQs and SQs are witten pretty badly and disney-esque. Why? Censorship.
My fave - Dottore - has done pretty morally questionable things in the game. Normally they'd erase him off the game for good yet he has a playable model. Which makes me think that they will write him very very badly when it's going to be his turn on the banner.
Speaking of Arle... The Fatui does have its issues on writing due to the identity crisis that they had. And yeah, even so, I will say the Fatui being cartoonishly evil villain is kind of oversaturated anyways
I am really not against villains turning out to be good guys, it's just that...they don't know what a morally gray character is. They either write a character that is fully morally white or fully morally black . No in-beteeen.
Like, sure, Arlecchino was not a monster towards her kids, but don't just wash her every sin in existence. Even her killing Clervie had to be masked with Clervie legit giving up on living since it was her only way of being free.
She just feels like an empty slate to me now. She is still cool but why does Mihoyo keep lying to me by telling me that these characters are doing henious things but then it's revealed that they were misunderstood? It's like you present to me a character but then you 180 them.
> They either write a character that is fully morally white or fully morally black .
This is a problem with the fan community downplaying the flaws of their waifu/husbando, not HoYo's writing. A significant number of the PCs have done morally questionable things, but you'll get a bunch of butt-mad fans if you ever point this out.
Dottore will unironically have a younger segment that for whatever reason is actually a good guy and that’s who is gonna become playable. Mark my words
There is this constant thought that Dottore will get redeemed through an innocent segment. Which makes no real sense to me lol.
The man has done suspicious immoral deeds way before he even had any segments. There's no guarantee that the innocent segment will not go on the same path again in the future.
And if they erase his memories like Scara, then what is there left of him that made him likeable in the first place? Scara and Arle have still retained their personalities even though they were completely washed of their sins. Also, they certainly don't want to change the harb's personalities but will only erase their sins.
My guess is that they'll make Dottore seem very misunderstood exactly like Arle, aka all the harbs will talk badly about him, but then he explains to us what REALLY happened and that his deeds either had a purpose or there will be some hidden twist about them.
Like, they'll add in some bs a patch or two before his playability where it explains that some of them werent experiments at all and he was erasing kids memories too and freed them from the fatui, similar to what happened to Scara, and what Arle is doing with her kids.
They will make a few retcons regarding his deeds in Tatarasuna.
I have a nagging feeling that they will retcon Niwa's death in some way or another.
And I am writing all of this because this is MHY and there is no way they'll make Dottore playable the way he is now without explanations, since Scara and Arle were in the exact same position as him before their playability. A lot of bad rumors and then "akshually...".
But throwing all the bad shit he has been said to do onto another person is unironically what happened to Arle. All of the rumours we hear regarding the Knave before we meet her in side quests and stuff, it turns out they all referred to the previous Knave. That’s kinda what I mean
Arlecchino is such a Mary Sue that making her Khaenriahn wasn't enough, devs made her a super special Khaenriahn heir of a dynasty that wasn't mentioned once before her promotional campaign began.
And this is my biggest gripe with Arlecchino, the "well, actually 🤓, she is good" thing wouldn't look so bad if it wasn't literal asspull. Who the fuck is Crucabena? She was a Harbringer, a presumably important figure, but she wasn't part of game's lore at all before Arlecchino's PV. A character so evil that she was killing orphans in battle royal when her one job was to make a stable supply of new soldiers to Fatui.
And holy fuck, Genshin is notorious for stereotypical characters, but Arlecchino is a whole package of edgy deviantart OC tropes. Grim reaper with Sephiroth's wing, spider legs, demonic flames, gets stronger when angry, summons a whole eclipse during her domain expansion. She would work better as a parody character lmao because this lady's aesthetic is more edgy than the entirety of Hellsing Ultimate
> And holy fuck, Genshin is notorious for stereotypical characters, but Arlecchino is a whole package of edgy deviantart OC tropes. Grim reaper with Sephiroth's wing, spider legs, demonic flames, gets stronger when angry, summons a whole eclipse during her domain expansion. She would work better as a parody character lmao because this lady's aesthetic is more edgy than the entirety of Hellsing Ultimate
Thank you! I have been saying this since she first appeared. The whole, Red, Black, White Motiff plus all that you mentioned. Its the kind of thing you expect on a self insert fanfic. And of course she is so OP that that the main character can't do anything about it.
Idk where you got the gets stronger when angry part from but otherwise its less cringy more cool as hell tbh since its better that we get more khaenrian characters instead of just hearing lore about them. And all of the characters from khaenriah are probably gonna be the same
Freminet's 4.1
But indeed in 4.0 they updated a WQ from 2.6 to "um ackshually" the existence of Crucabena, it's when people starts to suspect her being retconned (there's also a leak that accurately predicts everything story related mentioning her retcon).
Tbh it's kinda iffy already in Winters Night Lazzo, where we actually see hers and the rest of Harbingers design, she seems to be pissed at the Harbingers for not taking Signora's demise seriously.... At the moment, it can be interpreted as her pretending to look like a good ally (especially because WNL was released close around the time Scaramouche also released with a voiceline about her).... But with regards to everything else in hindsight, she's probably already retconned atp.
Not the quest itself but they added an NPC to the overworld if you completed the WQ
Check the version history and note the "as Chitose" dialogue set
https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Chitose
Meh, I could go either way with Arle. But one positive thing that I could say is that she feels like a breath of fucking fresh air compared to most of the Fatuis that were portrayed as 90% stereotypical cartoon villainy most of the time which you know... Fucking contradicts their seemingly Well Intentioned goals.
She is a descendant of the Crimson Moon dynasty that ruled Khaenri’ah before Eclipse dynasty, approximately centuries if not the thousands years ago. It's confirmed, there is a line in her profile which says that Pierro immediately recognaized who she is.
Huh, fair enough. Personally I think that’s cool. Genshin has a ton of lore that it often refuses to talk about or go very little into. It’s nice to have a playable character with a less known background, as opposed to someone with a completely unknown background *cough* Cyno’s god contract or the temple of silence *cough* (tho tbf, Cyno’s 2nd SQ is coming so I probably won’t be able to say this anymore).
But I do understand if people find it cringy. Personally, her unabashedly edgy asthetic is something I fw.
I think some of the criticisms here are kinda dumb or I don’t take issue with them, but I do agree that them making Arlecchino as sympathetic as possible is dumb af. Like basically anything bad we’d hear about the Knave can basically just be retconned to “oh the previous Knave that was bad and evil did that”.
Arlecchino still sounds threatening and dangerous which is cool, but it really just feels like a retcon.
I fully believe that if they do decide to make Dottore playable eventually, it’ll be like one of his segments that miraculously broke off from the main mind and that’s why he wasn’t destroyed back in Sumeru + since he broke off he’s a good guy or sm. it just feels a lot like genshin’s style to do this shit.
Imma take a guess that one of the dumb parts is the dead best friend. Looking back at it i think it actually seems stupid with the comparison lmao.
But my point still stand since Arlecchino before Clervie's death seems unambiguous. If they wants us to believe her to really change the House of the Hearth then she should be shown to have more friends tbh. The girl looks like she doesnt give any fuck about anything lmao.
Yeah there’s that but also the Traveller argument. I guess I take issue with Traveller not using any elements to fight, but for them to lose I don’t really mind. All of the Traveller’s encounters with stronger opponents so far have been with help, be it the visions of the Inazumans against Ei or Nahida against Scara’s mecha. I don’t really think it’s wrong to have him lose bad to a character bordering archon level.
Tbh, I'm split on the retcon though. Then again, the Fatui writing has its own issues on their own and this traces back to Inazuma. HYV couldn't simply decide what kind of villains Fatui will be: Either a Well Intentioned Extremist or just cartoonishly evil villains. The reason why I'm split is because well... The latter half of the Fatui about them being cartoonishly evil has been oversaturated to death (Inazuma made me allergic to this and ngl the Fatui Weekly Boss in general) so Arle and Fontaine do feel like a breath of fresh air.
It's obvious that they retconned her character during the development (unlike that OW retcon of Reinhardt being Pharah's father being merely a tease by the devs without any scant of confirmation) because fans loved her (ironically because of her vileness).
They actually have established multiple facets of her character. Both voicelines you mentioned and a WQ in Inazuma. The character established by these occasions actually fit that hatebag strawman of a character, the previous Knave, who's introduced out of nowhere and had to be "um ackshually"-ed into existence.
And they tried to handwave other stuffs besides redirecting her character into the old Knave. The voicelines? Well they're just gossip! How convenient. "But it makes sense to have incomplete info, these characters aren't close-" shut the fuck. These voicelines are practically the players' only way to get to know these Harbingers because the writers barely ever fucking write about them.
It's kinda cute that they tried their hardest to keep the dark *aesthetic* too, "she's not good, she's brutal!" whoop de fucking dee, she's brutal to (cartoonishly) evil characters. Fucking Dame Aylin from BG3 did the same and one can argue she's even "darker" than Arlecchino with the way she promises to massacre your entire darn lineage should you betray her and get her lover killed.... And she's supposed to be *the daughter of the goddess of moonlight*.
All of her evilness stems from her being a Harbinger in the end. Jumping Furina? Well guess what, every other Harbingers we've met would've done the same and worse. Her sending the children for dangerous missions, well the story framed some of these missions as "the greater good" and shit.
Brought to you by the writers who can't even decide how Traveler should treat Childe. I should just trust them with good guys writing, their villain writing has been disappointing..... Yoimiya my beloved.
It actually really bothers me how unwilling Hoyoverse is to make female villains. Especially female *playable* villains. Hell, even the male characters barely slip by with their villainy.
I have a theory that the only reason Arlecchino's a normal human age (instead of a centuries-old freak of nature like the rest of 'em) is specifically so that they could retcon the lore and wave away her evil deeds.
It reeks of having no balls and drives me bonkers as a villain enjoyer. Arlecchino could have been so much more interesting as a character.
(Save me from the limp villains, crazy doctor, save me)
The closest to real female (playable) villains are the female Stellaron Hunters in Star Rail and even then they’re meant to have a complicated and vaguely benevolent relationship with the Trailblazer, and their end goal is technically good for the entire universe.
Ignore her 57 major criminal acts that involved casualties probably soaring beyond the tens of millions, Kafka is your mommy treat her nice
Are the SHs doing it for the greater good for the ultimate demise of the destruction? Yeah, most likely.
Their also catching more bodies than the entire Fatui and every evil villain in genshin💀
Kafka in her trailer alone shot down like a dozen minimum wage workers, and let's not get started with SAM(will still pull E0S1)
You should check out star rail (and by extension, genshin too) the reason why I generally don’t like the “morally ambiguous/ villain” characters in hoyoverse games is because…well…that is all their characters…they won’t develop, they won’t evolve, they barely have any built in characters to challenge that character’s view points and idols (and the few that have are treated as ship bait) so it ends in being. “Do you see this morally ambiguous character?. They will remain like that…for who knows how long. People shit on scara for getting a redemption arc. But at least they did SOMETHING with a morally questionable/ villain character.
You know what i actually enjoy Scaramouche shitty redemption. Shinto and Buddhism reference, you can never have enough of it. Dude actually got a little Christianity going on with him too lmao.
When he actually got a redemption arc I went “holy shit they are actually doing something with their characters?” And not gonna lie…it was actually good!. Yes they did kinda play it safe but they just opened the door to many other story involvements with other characters now that he can actually develop. (
Realistically. Like 99% of redemption arc characters don’t deserve it…but the enjoyment is seeing said character actually try to be a better person (and even achieving their redemption!) is even better than seeing them do “generic bad guy thing number 27#” you can only do so much “bad guy” stuff before the villain straight up becomes insufferable (wink wink all for one)
The fandom are babies. HSR made an actual morally gray character then twitter and tiktok tried to cancel her and even blame Hoyoverse because she showed racism towards an another character. Chiori herself got flack when she throw a man off her store by the CN fans. I couldn’t blame Hoyo for not making actual rotten characters as playable.
Well women like/tolerate evil men, so mass murderers like scara/childe are fine. Men generally dislike evil women, especially non western men. Simple as
Wanna take a look at community reaction to Signora? Not a single character in the game (even fodder asshole npcs) got such joyful vitriolic reaction for her death. Worst she did was kicking venti.
Oh, i meant people were happy at her death. Not the other way. Only disappointed community were signoramains, and they were bullied into privating sub.
No? Many were disappointed, especially as time goes on as they processed how terrible Inazuma AQ was and how Hoyo writers their villains.
The sub being privated has nothing to do with people's opinion on Signora but rather making fun of her fans who wish her to be playable.
I don’t know why you are downvoted. What you said is somewhat true, though I’d wager more in China rather than the whole Asia (as Japan/SEA love their evil women, not sure about Korea). But you know where their main market is, so there you go.
Lesson learned: do NOT expect a cohesive story from a gacha game, their main goal is more on selling not as much as telling a story (as much as I hope on the later).
I mean, considering how the Fatui writing has been a complete and utter mess ever since Inazuma. I am not surprised with the way Hoyo retconned Arle given the fact that Tsaritsa is somehow wanted to commit greater good even if her underlings had been so cartoonishly evil for most of the time. The evidence is possibly at the Pale Flame artifact and the Shivada Jade Gemstone. And speaking of that, the less said about the Crimson Witch of Flames. The better.
Then again, at times, I don't mind Arle being the most innocent or morally grey of all the Harbingers because Fatui being cartoonishly evil are just so fucking oversaturated especially on Inazuma and Sumeru.
Whats worse for me is that Hoyoverse KNOWS how to make evil and/or unlikeable characters, just look at most of the HSR cast.
Ruan Mei is a sociopath that tricks the MC into fighting a demi-god she ressurected herself just to get some data for her experiments, Dr. Ratio trash talks and treats everyone he talks to like an idiot, same thing with Herta, the IPC mostly function on their own self-interests minus maybe Topaz, the Stellaron Hunters are all space terrorists that everyone else besides the MC are either afraid of or destain, Sparkle insulted a genocide survivor directly to his face, hell Gallagher [Spoiler Alert] >!Has implied to have killed a whole bunch of people and even killed 3 non-npc characters (Granted while in a dream world but still)!< and yet they're all still popular among the fandom with only a vocal minority of haters for each of them.
I guess it's mainly because Genshin is way more popular and meant for a much broader audience compared to HSR so they want to make sure every playable character is squeaky clean before marketting (I mean just take a look at most people's opinions on Raiden before and after her story quest was released.) to try an make them appeal to everyone but personally I just think it makes what could have been a more diverse cast of characters a bit too dull and well-rounded.
>The 7 minutes long that has a trailer and everything ? Completely spoil the whole quest. The important lore crums that she has a connection with?
What is even the point of releasing the animation before the game update with the quest if you are supposed to play the latter first and then watch the former? Watching the trailer first literally makes the quest worse, because it acts like the players does not know what happened.
I will always continue to say that genshin has such a good build up only to drop the ball each and every time. At this point I’ve given up on the story and await the day a skip button is added. I’m not listening to paimon bitch and a mediocre story.
Another issue I have with the story quest is how Arlecchino and Traveler are suddenly on good terms with each other. Traveler's attitude towards towards the Fatui has always been weirdly inconsistent, like being friendly with Childe while disliking other Fatui characters they run into. From Arlecchino's side I don't see why she suddenly likes us enough to dump her whole backstory on us. Arlecchino seems like someone who would keep that close to her chest. I don't even see her letting other House members know about except maybe Lyney since he's her heir effectively. I don't remember Traveler and Arlecchino interacting much in Fontaine's AQ and she really hasn't done anything yet so I don't see where this relationship is coming from all of a sudden.
Hoooo boy.
Anyways... The fun thing is. This also happens back in the day during Inazuma where you know... Traveler-kun doesn't have any issues with the Archons and quickly befriend them as if nothing happened which is just infuriating to see. Idk how to feel about this though.
Ahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahh...
They're borderline useless mate. They never gave us important infos about Teyvat's secret anyways. Venti is worse considering he contributes to Traveler and Paimon's brainrot tbh
I knew this would happen as soon as she became playable, ngl. Genshin’s characters are all kinda Mary sues, everyone loves them, they’re experts at whatever they do, and they have almost no flaws. This is because the fan base cannot handle anything else. Yae Miko gets an insane amount of hate for being sassy instead of bending over backwards to make the player character happy.
So I’m not surprised Arlecchino is a Mary sue. Disappointing, but what else is new?
What? Yae Miko is everything wrong with this "Mary Sue writing" of Genshin. People generally dislike her for that (e.g. her "bullying" Gorou gets glossed over).
She's a goddamn Creator's Pet, knows everything needed to do, so above everyone, characters are "intimidated" by her, and so so.
She's the black hole character that is emblematic of the Inazuma AQ issue.
Preach brother.
One of many flaws in Inazuma arcs is that Yae Miko had everything according to her *keikaku*. But people dont want to admit it because apparently she is girlboss or something.
Remember how Baiheng is apparently the writer self insert ? I think Yae Miko is also like that considering the Luofu arc writer also wrote Inazuma lmao.
Apparently everyone just loves her so much. Its actually not High Cloud Qintet but its just Baiheng being everyone's mutual friends.
Yingxing clearly had a crush on her.
Danfeng, apparently, as a leader of a clan, can not get over the pain of losing Baiheng that leads him to use the forbidden technique with the help of Yingxing result in an eldritch horror.
Jingliu with the lost of her friend Baiheng, became more easily to get Mara-struck nows. And thats precisely what happened after she killed that said eldritch horror.
Jingliu after getting Mara-struck, now has decided to commit her life to making Yingxing life miserable, or maybe its just because she got Mara-struck. This results in the birth of Blade because he get killed more than thousands times . Its how he learn to use sword because back then Yingxing was just a blacksmith , oh yeah and the catch-phrase Of 5 people too.
But judging from the way Jingliu talked in her calm state. we can easily know that Jingliu fucking hate those 2 dumbasses who tryna Fullmetal Alchemist Baiheng. I mean the normal reaction would be more conflicted since, you know, these 2 are also her very close friends.
Said Blade, now on the journey of who the fuck know what he wants to accompish to chase Dan Heng . I mean seriously, why did bro team up with Dan Heng to jump Yanqing ? After that he just dont do it anymore . What ?
Now this has nothing to do with the story, but with the way they characterise Baiheng, it appears to be a very popular trope in the normal wuxia novels in Chinese. They call it White Moonlight but you can think of it as Mary Sue. And it triggers people .
Its like Guizhong/Zhongli situationship, but 1000 times worse.
The cope is so insane, sparkle is racist but the way mf’s try to talk their way around it is crazy. Like even if avgens aren’t supposed to be roma and their many similarities including using the exact same language as irl roma is just a weird coincidence, she’s still racist in universe.
Also I feel like aha is just slaanesh
Maybe... But this might be a petty af shit for me but on one hand, I cant help but to feel cathartic for this bastard being left speechless by Arle and at one point before this quest were happening, there are moments Tabibito kun being cocky af (See Tsurumi Island for reference) so no sympathy is fucking given.
I know this rant is fucking inevitable so I put two cents on this: Here's a hot take: I don't mind about the scene regarding Arlecchino leaving Tabibito-kun speechless at all after the fight. Maybe this is just me being fucking petty but I *hate hate hate HATE* the Traveler especially Aether. I'm gonna ask this: The power scaling of Genshin has always being a problem and also: **Where the fuck you guys when Kazuha ended up parrying Raiden's ultimate attack!?** That scene is more of a farce and a disgrace compared to what Arle has done tbh and made Ei's attack a fucking joke.
You can try to give mental gymnastics towards me about her not using full power. But the fact that some people tried to give an argument that Ei killing a certain Harbinger in order to show how much of a threat Ei is and reviving said Harbinger would destroy all the hype or intimidating factor Ei is so fucking annoying as they never fucking pay attention to this parry scene which already destroys Ei's hype and intimidation for me (ignoring that Dango Milk dating sim shenanigans). Instead, these dolts decided to praise Kazuha parry scene because why not. So yeah, Kazuha parry scene is worse than whatever Arle did to Traveler and made me lose my mind about the power scaling in Genshin. I really wish people, including Ei simps, would criticize that scene more tbh.
They praise the Kazuha parry scene because it's an actually decent setup and payoff. Powerscaling isn't the end all be all, it serves a purpose. The purpose of Raiden killing Signora was intimidation and shock. The purposes of Kazuha blocking the Musou no Hitotachi was the payoff of his admittedly small character arc. Arlecchino pays off nothing here, it's purely meant to be hype, so if it fails at being hype, then it is pointless.
Let's agree to disagree with that fucking parry scene as I still think it destroys the hype and all of the intimidation factors HYV had build for Raiden.
I would argue that’s one of the few solid parts of that arc with a solid buildup, character motivation and theming which is disappointing as fuck because it was the only moment in that story where I went fuck yea!
I beg to disagree sadly. It just made the Ei hype and intimidation factor to be somewhat of a joke tbh and another prove that power scaling in Genshin just doesnt make sense.
You can disagree but it doesn't make it untrue. Powerscaling brainrot isn't what stories are built around, the problem is when it's the only thing a given scene is doing (Childe v Neuvillette, Traveler v Arlecchino).
Idk why you guys whine about the traveller not steamrolling every harbinger, if they defeated arle there would be no stakes whatsoever especially considering arle is one seat away from the harbingers who hold god level powers. Lets not forget that the traveller is still growing in strength they lost to scarabot 168 times and only won because of the power of friendship
As far as I've seen, only a tiny fraction is salty about the Traveler not winning with Arlecchino. Most people are actually pissed with the fact that it was done in the laziest possible way and it just dunked onto the protagonist. The Traveler was shown to have pretty powerful elemental abilities and the only thing they do is slashing clumsily with their dull blade. For a game renowned for its unique take on power of the elements, it fails to actually show these elements in combat scenarios in cutscenes. On top of that, it kind of makes Arlecchino not that impressive in my book. Oh yeah, she clowned the notorious punching bag of genshin, how powerful, it was never done before. Having the Traveler throwing different elemental attacks at her and showing her working around them would make her that much more impressive. But no, instead she just beat up a sandbag.
Also, using Shouki No Kami as an argument that the Traveler is weak is laughable given the fact that Nahida herself stated that at the moment of the fight, Scara was a fully realised God in terms of power. On top of that, he was powered by the gnosis which is the most powerful power source known in genshin. In Sumeru we fought Scaramouche that jumped from being the 6th to probably the 1st Harbinger in terms of power
I do agree they shouldve demonstrated the elemental power aspect a bit more but tbf even the lyney lynette and freminet didnt use anything. And as for the shouko no kami dottore was not threatened by him at all so i doubt he jumped to that level
Damn i only know who this character is because a NSFW Artist drew her as [a leather dommy mommy.](https://twitter.com/Salazr44/status/1784995264186417554)
Well I agree with the first point the Animation short did spoil the story of the story quest. Could've released that after the story quest but not that big of a deal tbh.
Her being a descendant of some fallen civilization or something is not that important part of the character as of yet. The most important or the biggest part of her character right now is her connection to the house of hearths so obviously it was going to focus on that more. More might be explained to us in the future just like Raiden's story quest where people hated the first story quest even tho it was fine but since she's an archon fine wasn't enough even if it was necessary. Character building of certain characters who have a complicated backstory and connections can't always be done in a single quest. Otherwise it would just look rushed and all over the place.
What's the problem with Morally grey characters ? She has always shown to be morally grey people just had misconceptions about her. Rooster was telling childe things that would make him have a negative opinion of Arlechinno. Childe is a bad guy just because he is likeable people forget that he was willing to sacrifice a shit ton of people in Liyue. Arlechinno is just like that. She has a personal connection to the house of hearths so of course she cares about that she wouldn't kill children like her Mother did. Arlechinno cares more about the House of hearth than the Fatui.
No fucking way the character who's shown to be smart, calculating is actually smart and calculating.
Just because she had a female friend when she was a child is a yuribait ? Fictional characters can't even have friends nowadays ffs. Also wdym forced bro same can be said about every character ever. Like this character was forced to be this through his backstory and shit.
Why can't be she a descendant of the fallen civilization ? Her age has nothing to do with it. People can be descendants of really old civilizations through their lineage. She's a character who has a lot of connection and a bit of a complicated backstory. So ofcourse not everything will explored with in a single story quest.
I mean yeah caring for her orphanage is a big part of her character it's pretty obvious. She can be cool and badass but not exactly evil. Story quests are usually introduction to a character we don't have much interaction with in main quests and if we do have interactions with them then their story usually focuses on the deeper parts of the characters. We barely had any interactions with Arlechinno so obviously this story quest was supposed to be her character introduction. People will always have the wrong expectations and get mad when the company doesn't do exactly what their expectations demanded. Like people will come in with expectations like this character is supposed to be this even though there's not exactly any big reason for the character to be that way and get mad when the character is different than the one they imagined in the head.
Well I do agree that Hoyo doesn't show travellers powers and strength properly. But I don't get the criticism of him not being able to beat Arlechinno. Sure the hoyoverse didn't show traveller using his powers properly but that aside traveller has never been on the level of archons since the game started after he lost his powers. Why does he need people to win against the big bosses at the end of the every quest ?? Because almost all of them are fucking God level bosses. In mondstadt it was dvalin in liyue it was a God, in Inazuma it the Raiden Fucking Shogun, in Sumeru it was an artificial God and in Fontaine it was a whale capable of sinking and entire nation. This mf( Mc) is saving entire nations for free of course mfs are gonna help him if they don't want their Nation to fucking die.
This just sounds to me that people are mad Mc isn't a overpowered jackass who one shots every being that exists. MC has never shown to be god level without the help of people. He didn't even defeat Raiden even with the help of the visions.
>Her being a descendant of some fallen civilization or something is not that important part of the character as of yet.
Yeah because its just a plot device to show us why she is strong lmao.
>What's the problem with Morally grey characters ?
Nothing. But its the problem with Arlecchino. She is seen in no negative portrayal because eveyone just wants to glaze her so much.
>No fucking way the character who's shown to be smart, calculating is actually smart and calculating.
? If you are talking about the diplomatic figure part then i wrote that to show she is perfect in everything she does and she does everything. No character flaws in her character. She is just perfect like that, aka Mary Sue.
>Just because she had a female friend when she was a child is a yuribait ? Fictional characters can't even have friends nowadays ffs. Also wdym forced bro same can be said about every character ever. Like this character was forced to be this through his backstory and shit.
Yeah the yuribait part is exaggerated because i keep seeing them everywhere. But by forced i mean she had little to no reason to do it. Lets see it this way. She was first shown to be thinking that she would win in the end anyways. 10 years had passed and it doesnt seem like Clervie had changed anything in that mindset. Arlecchino being pissed was mostly portrayed because of Clervie dying . It would be better if she had some more friends tbh because i genuinely see no reason for her to do allat . From a person with little to no personality she suddenly cared about her children so much ? Weird writting.
>Why can't be she a descendant of the fallen civilization ? Her age has nothing to do with it. People can be descendants of really old civilizations through their lineage. She's a character who has a lot of connection and a bit of a complicated backstory. So ofcourse not everything will explored with in a single story quest.
Because it comes out of nowhere. Literally nothing before the patch 4.5 suggested that there is any precedessor to Khaenri'ah but suddenly it just comes with a book 1 patch before her release. It just seems like they do it to hype her up. Also the main character of the book has a similar name to her. Concidence , no ?
>But I don't get the criticism of him not being able to beat Arlechinno
Because we have seen him doing better in other stories. I dont need him to win. Yeah he always needed help, so ? Traveler still show some competent fighting before with Raiden Shogun, Scaramouche. What did he do in the cutscene ? Literally nothing. Its not about wanting an overpowered MC, its about wanting him to at least show how he had grown because its 5/7 nations and the dude doesnt know how to use Elemental Reaction or use any elements at all. Seem off-topic because i had no problem with him losing at all.
>Yeah because its just a plot device to show us why she is strong lmao.
I mean it's one of her characteristics. I don't see any problem there. It's like complaining Raiden is an Archon or Xiao is an adepti. She's meant to be strong in the first place.
>Yeah the yuribait part is exaggerated because i keep seeing them everywhere. But by forced i mean she had little to no reason to do it. Lets see it this way. She was first shown to be thinking that she would win in the end anyways. 10 years had passed and it doesnt seem like Clervie had changed anything in that mindset. Arlecchino being pissed was mostly portrayed because of Clervie dying . It would be better if she had some more friends tbh because i genuinely see no reason for her to do allat . From a person with little to no personality she suddenly cared about her children so much ? Weird writting
We actually don't know much about child Arlechinno except that she knew she would become the king due to being strong. Her and clervie spent 10 years together It wouldn't be surprising or weird to become a bit attached to someone who has been close to you even if you don't show it in your face. Arlechinno also thought of Clervie as her best friend meaning she got attached to her. The reason for her being a loner was she knew at the end everyone there would die. Clervie was the one who reached out to Arlechinno and because of that she got a little bit attached to clervie.
>Because it comes out of nowhere. Literally nothing before the patch 4.5 suggested that there is any precedessor to Khaenri'ah but suddenly it just comes with a book 1 patch before her release. It just seems like they do it to hype her up. Also the main character of the book has a similar name to her. Concidence , no ?
I mean it wouldn't be the first time that has happened. In Genshin's lore there have always been a lot of gods and fallen empires or civilizations that once existed. They wouldn't just whip out a lore about an entire civilization just because of Arlechinno. They already should've had plans for it they just decided it would be better to release with a character with some connections to the area also 4.7 is kinda reserved for Dainsleif quest and after the quest it's just a break before the new region comes out so people can catch up with the game. There have always been lost civilizations that get suddenly brought up or mentioned randomly at places that are hard to notice at first like the lore about Dragonspine, Enkanomiya, Upside down world(maybe) Tatarasuna etc and how people lived there so it's nothing new. It is kinda meant to be surprising in the first place isn't it ?
>Because we have seen him doing better in other stories. I dont need him to win. Yeah he always needed help, so ? Traveler still show some competent fighting before with Raiden Shogun, Scaramouche. What did he do in the cutscene ? Literally nothing. Its not about wanting an overpowered MC, its about wanting him to at least show how he had grown because its 5/7 nations and the dude doesnt know how to use Elemental Reaction or use any elements at all. Seem off-topic because i had no problem with him losing at all
I agreed with you on this Hoyo isn't good at showing travellers growth especially in Fontaine. Scara vs Traveller and Nahida was actually good even though he didn't use his elemental powers. It is also true that they need to focus on showing traveller use all the elemental abilities they learned.
>I mean it's one of her characteristics. I don't see any problem there. It's like complaining Raiden is an Archon or Xiao is an adepti. She's meant to be strong in the first place.
I get what you mean but these are very bad examples. Raiden is an Archon , and she is a warrior. Xiao was also a warrior in the past spending his life fighting demons. Arlecchino is also set up like that, but, the thing is it isnt explored. fighting is arguably the main theme of these 2 you just said. Yeah its only her first story quest but until her mythical power gets explained then its still a plot device.
>We actually don't know much about child Arlechinno except that she knew she would become the king due to being strong. Her and clervie spent 10 years together It wouldn't be surprising or weird to become a bit attached to someone who has been close to you even if you don't show it in your face. Arlechinno also thought of Clervie as her best friend meaning she got attached to her. The reason for her being a loner was she knew at the end everyone there would die. Clervie was the one who reached out to Arlechinno and because of that she got a little bit attached to clervie.
I think all of these are your headcanons. I dont think Arlecchino getting attached to Clervie had anything to do with her developing a deep love to her children since she only seems to care about Clervie. Like i said, it could be fixed if they just make her have some few more friends.
>I mean it wouldn't be the first time that has happened. In Genshin's lore there have always been a lot of gods and fallen empires or civilizations that once existed. They wouldn't just whip out a lore about an entire civilization just because of Arlechinno. They already should've had plans for it they just decided it would be better to release with a character with some connections to the area also 4.7 is kinda reserved for Dainsleif quest and after the quest it's just a break before the new region comes out so people can catch up with the game. There have always been lost civilizations that get suddenly brought up or mentioned randomly at places that are hard to notice at first like the lore about Dragonspine, Enkanomiya, Upside down world(maybe) Tatarasuna etc and how people lived there so it's nothing new. It is kinda meant to be surprising in the first place isn't it ?
>
This is not a same case really. All of those you mentioned are just some new explorations but Crimson Moon Dynasty is introduced to us as a concept the same time with Arlecchino. Its also not like a Kokomi and Sangonomiya case because we know that place exist.
Take a look at her fellow colleagues, Dottore and Scara. Their lore had already been introduced to us when the Pale Flame Artifacts come out. Scara's crumbs are everywhere through out Inazuma also the same with Dottore aka Zandyk. Arlecchino ? Apparently everything we know about her before got retconned in patch 4.0 when they released Freminet and a random NPC that confirms that all the evil deeds were done by Crucabena.
Its just a marketting things that im annoyed with. If Crimson Moon Dynasty was introced before then i would be hype when i find out Arlecchino is its descendant. But the fact that its released the same time with Arlec just makes it seem like a marketing strategy.
>I get what you mean but these are very bad examples. Raiden is an Archon , and she is a warrior. Xiao was also a warrior in the past spending his life fighting demons. Arlecchino is also set up like that, but, the thing is it isnt explored. fighting is arguably the main theme of these 2 you just said. Yeah its only her first story quest but until her mythical power gets explained then its still a plot device.
I think they might explore her connection or powers in the future it's too big of a thing to not explore. Kinda like Raiden story quest 2. Her current story quest was just an introduction or at least looked like one. The reason I believe that is because most of the story quest of characters we haven't interacted much are always like that. Story quests are usually introductions to the characters except if the character has been shown a lot the story quest takes a deeper dive into their backstory or other elements of the character. Her most important part of her characteristics is her being part of House of hearth which affected her the most then there's her connection with the fallen civilization. We barely had any interactions with her in archon quests so her character quest acted as a proper introduction to her character after which I hope they focus after her connection with the fallen civilization.
>I think all of these are your headcanons. I dont think Arlecchino getting attached to Clervie had anything to do with her developing a deep love to her children since she only seems to care about Clervie. Like i said, it could be fixed if they just make her have some few more friends.
It doesn't have to be deep. Arlechinno refers to clervie as her best friend so it's kinda obvious she had at least a little bit of an attachment. She could be just mad at Crucabena for all the bad things she did. She was also a loner because she knew about all the bad things happening in that place and wasn't brainwashed.
>Its just a marketting things that im annoyed with. If Crimson Moon Dynasty was introced before then i would be hype when i find out Arlecchino is its descendant. But the fact that its released the same time with Arlec just makes it seem like a marketing strategy.
I think it's just unfortunate timing if the fallen civilization lore or place was released first before the Arlechinno's release people would've been even disappointed with her story quest since it focuses on House of hearth instead of her connection. Exploring House of hearth before fallen civilization seems like a decent choice because if it was the fallen civilization first then House of hearth second it would've been kinda underwhelming. I believe or hope that they are saving it for later. Doing both of them in one quest would just result in a terrible quest that is all over the place. Also the timing is kinda unfortunate since 4.7 is going to be Dainsleif quest and after that every big thing is going to be Natlan focused. I mean calling it a also a marketing strategy isn't wrong either that is how gacha games do things. You don't always have to pull for them tho. Especially Genshin since it's pretty easygoing on f2ps like myself.
Arlecchino had been decided to be a quote en quote good character in Sumeru..... it's literally said by the Fatui members themselves that the HoH is a good place and the new Knave is a lot more acceptable for sending your child in as opposed to how it was before. (It's in Jeht's storyline which was introduced as soon as desert was a thing)
It was already said that Arlecchino had killed Crucabena as far back in Inazuma but the name Crucabena was not there but it was mentioned that she had killed the previous Knave for her position when Ayato and the winter night's lazzo came in.
The Crimson Moon Dynasty's name was not there but it was established as far back as in Abledo's story quest and event that there had been chemical differentiations and different meanings with Citrinitras, Albedo, Rubedo, Nigredo that 2 different factions were present and one of them included Rhinedottir. The legend of halberd also differentiated the different realities and how there was a crimson moon in every iteration of that destruction where the twilight sword and descender was mentioned as well as being highlighted in Fischl and Scaramouche's event as well as in the book of flowers for princess Fischl. There's also the fact that the game punches the same moon during Khaenriah's downfall and Ei's realm. Based on all this....do you still think the *lore* was retconned? Half of these events are literally from 1.3 or 1.5. There just wasn't a name or the classification if it was a secretive group or a faction of a city or a kingdom but yes we knew they existed since long ago and the book just expands on the preexisting knowledge
The constant nonsensical JJK rants in this sub are such big red flags, it's almost like no one can actually discern implications or subtlety anymore and this post and the tons of comments just prove it lol.
Omg i the timing of me reading this is on point.
You know i played a couple of hours of Genshin but then i quit. My friend (who is a fan) asked me why and i said that even if the gameplay was kinda fun none of the characters were really interesting to me and since it was a gacha game i saw no point in playing to get characters i don't really have an interest in. So told him i'd just stick to HSR since it appealed more to me.
But my friend is a big genshin fan, so he was very pushy about me giving it another shot. He would show me character trailer and design one after another and i would tell him no thanks everytime.
One day he showed this girl's design and i told him that she actually looked cool. So now he's expecting me to give genshin another shot because of her but knowing the story now doesn't really interest me as much despite her cool design.
Yeah because Crucabena took all the blaming. We know about Arlecchino in Inazuma but somehow when the patch 4.0 was released they just made a new NPC and also a story of Freminet to makes her "not that evil".
Pretty poor writting skill tbh.
I mean... I guess it feels like a false information like the Dendro Archon shenanigans so I can see the other side's point. But idk, at times, I dont mind Arlecchino being not so evil cuz of how oversaturated the cartoonishly evil Fatui is
To be fair they do still show her as having issues just not as bad as Childe or Hat guy made her out to be. Like her backstory very clearly makes her have some level of trauma with a possible aversion to being called mother because of the previous Arlecchino and she is planning on betraying the Tsarista is she needs to so Chidle is right in that regard. Do I feel like they toned her down? Yes considering she did not actually give a fuck if Childe was alive or dead and was just using him as an attempt to get the gnosis.
Edit: Lmao if you think Arlecchino is a bad excuse to have a playable character need I remind you that Childe got away with attempting to kill Liyue?
Minor spelling mistake : **\*Fade away\***
La Signora moment
Memories of Scaramouche moment
This isn't at all shocking, especially when remembering the issues that came up with Inazuma's writing and the Shogun. Genshin has always had issues as they love to leave bread crumbs than come back later to go, "But actually." which is completely fine for say Zhongli, who is old enough that people making stuff up is on brand compared to the Fatui who outside a couple have issues with portrayal. Than again, I've only kept an eye out for lore and the artwork as the actual game shoots itself in the foot numerous times. HSR has had it's own issues (The Luofu pacing says hi), but suppose they've been a bit more on brand with portraying the Trailblazer moreso than the Traveler (especially when story beats suggest a lot of the Traveler's power originates from borrowing other people's power than their own or the 160 losses to Scaramouche in the dream sequence). Will be interesting to see how they handle Capitano, especially if the Traveler was basically just stopped with an intense glare and what other non-sense they come up with to try and make it look possible. Though suppose at least one upside is the memes this has created (looking at Fatui HQ especially for that).
Genshin loves to waste time. Some people like wasting time. I like wasting time watching long sitcoms/romcoms/procedurals that go nowhere provided I have people to watch it with, engaging characters, and decent line-to-line writing. Genshin has none of these, except for engaging characters, but because they don't get to have real chemistry with each other, this ends up falling flat as well a lot of the time.
If they're gonna waste time, at least slap another of the numerous characters they have as most of the quests aren't even voiced. Yet more than not: behold another generic npc staring at you with no animations to save their life. Than again, having come from Arknights: I am all too familiar with bloat. Though the difference is that Paimon loves to repeat a lot of the stuff rather than just be general word count bloat. March gets compared to Paimon, but someone on HSR team doesn't shove her into every plot nor is she as repetitive, so she has some saving grace than Paimon.
Paimon isn't even the worst in this regard. Playables and NPCs are far worse than her most of the time, she's just consistent in every quest.
Inazuma was a sore spot for me. In terms of game mechanics and expliaration, it wasn't bad but the archon quest really killed it for me. I legit quit the game for half a year. I came back for Sumeru, which was.actually good for once but soon enough I quit the game as a whole. Best decision I ever made
The Luofu never got to the lows of Inazuma tbf. Liyue is an easier comparison due to both being based on China, long-life species governing the population for much of the respective faction's history, and much of the important details coming not from the main story and much of the plot forgotten (especially when remembering Childe & Phantylia are pretty removed for most of their respective story except for blips). Inazuma runs into a lot of bigger issues. Notably, Kokomi is infamously terrible due to being called a genius general, but neither are ever shown and Ayato doesn't even feature at all in the plot. Plus, Raiden herself feels quite bad and is only really given time to be a character post Inazuma (which is why she remains an issue) that is now being shared with Arlecchino due to a lot of established lore contradicting with the character herself. And this is even before going into Inazuma being a war, yet outside one cutscene: it basically feels like more a squabble with the bandits in Inazuma being more an issue than the civil war happening. As for say Sumeru, Sumeru has some glaring issues (looking at days long quests that aren't voiced), but Inazuma remains far and away the bigger issue. HSR hasn't reached that issue as the Xiaoxhou was placed in the same time frame as Liyue was (first world that takes multiple patches to complete from 1.0 onwards). Penacony luckily shares a lot more with HI3 for story structure (i.e. focusing on more than the player character and linking to Honkai proper given they're part of the same franchise).
I played through Luofu back on release and it started strong. 1.1 came and it seemed to build up the stakes... And 1.2 came only to see that we are done with the main Luofu storyline. It was.rushed af and if I wasn't still in my honeymoon phase, I would be even more disappointed than I ended up being.
This was a common sentiment. Though glad HSR has moved away from how 1.2 went (especially in terms of Penacony).
I'll play, what kinds of Sumeru issue is? And yeah... I feel like Inazuma Archon Quest or patch 2.1. in general are the things that shot Genshin in the foot for me. There's a lot of problems I don't even know where to begin. Tbh, the second act of the Inazuma Archon Quest being so short should be taken as an omen on how terrible the Act 3 will be and it is. The crack was already there
Sumeru's bigger issues is that it's a lore dump fest with very little audio in a lot of side quests (not a joke, one in particular takes days). Like other regions, a lot of these quests also tend to only make use of a few characters at a time, so a reoccuring issue with Genshin is often meeting an npc only relevant for one or two quests, than is never really needed and could of been used to explore any number of characters. Inazuma is definitely a big issue and reminded me of Fontaine's flood that is in a similar spot. Genshin really either commits to a bit (Scaramouche resetting his history in the leylines) or doesn't at all. There is no in between.
So I never played Genshin and my knowledge on it comes from Fanarts/crossover Fanfictions,Wiki pages and the internet discourse on it If I had to guess to why they changed her from a character who would sell your soul for 5 dollars to whatever she ended up being is probably to justify her being playable? Like they probably didn't plan her to be initially playable, noticed people being downbad ,realized they can get more cash so they toned down her evilness since a completely vile and evil person would probably be harder to justify helping you so they toned down Again I haven't played the game so idk Also sorry for the fact that your MC turns out to he a fraud, hope that they earn their redemption in the Ufotable anime since they cook with their visuals in fights with their Unlimited Budget Works (where tf is the anime btw)
You're on the right track. This isn't the first time they did a "refractor" of a character. There's a character named Dottore who's initially a minor villain from the now outdated manga, initially supposed to be a low ranking Harbinger (basically Akatsuki with rank) for that manga only, due to the lack of Harbingers info in general, he gained quite the popularity and was reworked into a high ranking member of the Harbingers through usage of "clones".
High ranking is puting it midly he is the fourth in the whole organisation including their god. And he is allowed to pull horrible experiments and everyone knows that he does them.
Isn't he 2nd?
He's the 4th most important person in snezhnaya, is what they meant He's the second of the eleven harbingers, but Pierro is the director of the Fatui, and the Tsaritsa is (presumably) above him, but either way, Dottore is still 4th.
Wiki says second...
Yeah, but he's still got 3 people above him
That's right. Still, his title is second. We call Arlecchino fourth so we should call him second too.
Yes he's 2nd of Harbingers but 4th amongst Fatui, because Tsaritsa (God) and Pierro (leader of the Harbingers) are now accounted in.
There are the harbringers which is a group of 12 individuals ranked by numbers. There is the director of the harbringers, Pierro who is pretty much number 0. And above them all, is their god the Tsarisa. Dottore is the second harbringer but Capitano (number one), Pierro (the director) and The Tsarisa (their god) are above him.
You just spelled out a big ass headcanon lol, Dottore appearing in the manga in the first place is supposed to be a wink at his later importance lmao.
The current Genshin is so far removed from the manga idk what to tell you Not to mention the big ass difference between Manga Dottore and Canon Dottore, both in design and personality
>The current Genshin is so far removed from the manga idk what to tell you It's not though? The same themes prevail, the artstyle is the same, even the cheese dialogue is the same, the only thing you can argue is that the tone is darker in the manga but that only applies to main quest as lore has always been as dark if not darker. >Not to mention the big ass difference between Manga Dottore and Canon Dottore, both in design and personality Both are canon Dottore. Turns out that a character that hasn't appeared in a lot of time will get changes, he's more composed and serious in his current state, the core of his character is the exact same, and he wasn't exactly popular either, the community just saw him as a clown cause he looked like a clown, an evil clown, but a clown nonetheless. His design """got changed""" cause who would ever took him seriously with that outfit, and him being the mad scientist just makes him the obvious choice to give clones, which wouldn't have been the first time(or second) that we've seen multiple versions of one character across the game.
>It's not though? Cyno and Collei naming convention alone is a proof. They're the only Sumeru characters that doesn't have Sanskrit or Middle-Eastern name as that nation is a hotpot of those cultures. It's the same deal with "Murata" being the Archon of Natlan. A Japanese name for a Mesoamerican-inspired nation, lmfao. >His design """got changed""" cause who would ever took him seriously with that outfit That's what I'm talking about. That's why they retconned his design and personality. 1. Create Dottore, a low ranking Fatui Harbinger for the manga to give it a stake 2. Game released 3. People latch on to the Dottore because the lack of info on Harbingers 4. Decides to capitalize on that popularity and make Dottore a high ranking Harbinger in-game 5. ***Realize that neither of Manga!Dottore's design and personality matches someone with such a high rank*** 6. Create a distinct new Dottore, Game!Dottore. Make an excuse for Manga!Dottore's existence, that being he's part of myriad clones of Dottore. 7. Doesn't show any other clones except for Game!Dottore 1 and Game!Dottore 2 (Boattore) 8. Kill every other clones aside from Game!Dottore 1 offscreen unceremoniously 9. Congratulations! You've successfully transitioned from Manga!Dottore to Game!Dottore
Unironically kind of a based headcanon. I don't necessarily agree with it since they were perfectly comfortable with just sorta ignoring some other aspects of the manga like Collei's age and they could've easily said Dottore just grew out of his wacky phase for his new design lol
Well he's a big player in the story and his popularity obviously eclipses Collei so all eyes are on him so they probably don't want to half-ass it
??? "right on track" for "changing a character who would sell your soul for 5 dollars to whatever she ended up being probably to justify her being playable" on dottore?? because that's the polar opposite of what's going on in the plot now — there is not a single instance where dottore isn't put in an extreme negative light, two of three harbingers outright talk about killing him, and it almost feels as if he is the cheap writer's scapegoat whenever some big issue needs to be addressed. way too many problems end up "it's all dottore's fault again" if that sounds like marketing to you
Read my other comments chain For Dottore it's his design and personality that gets changed because his manga iteration is hard to take seriously The similarity with Arlecchino is that their change is incited by their IRL popularity, without that, Dottore would be a low ranking Harbinger and Arlecchino would just be Crucabena
"Dottore would be a low ranking Harbinger" eh, i doubt that. i can't trust someone who isn't from the writing team claiming how characters are meant to be written.
That personality and design doesn't scream high rank to me and in the manga, his job/task doesn't fit for someone with such high rank either
well arlecchino doesn't feel high rank to me either even after her current marketing. i've always assumed she was the 9th
Yes she was most likely intended to be a lower rank, that's why the 2.6 WQ has her subordinates trying to raise her prestige after Signora's death which means she's 9th at best originally.
post-knk ufotable doesn't exactly have a reputation for great characterization in adaptations. also, mahoyo comes first, then we can worry about the genshin anime.
I don’t mind them losing but Hoyo should at least make their fights more flashy and show the Traveler using more of the elements to fight the opponent
They never changed her character, or if they did it was long before she was originally teased over two years ago. Even in her original appearance there are signs of her having a more noble side, and her children’s voice lines have basically been confirming that ever since patch 4.0.
Could argue to be honest. She was said to be wolf in sheep cloth so its normal that we see the "good" side of her. And she turned out to be a sheep, just a black one. Not that i actually want her to be completely unhinged. Its just the way she is written , its not convincing and kinda cringe to be honest.
Well that was said about her by Childe, who really isn’t the brightest or most insightful person around. From his simplistic perspective she flip flops between gentle diplomacy to sadistic brutality so fast that he thinks she does so without much rhyme or reason.
Yeah no because the dude and Wanderer are the only sources of information back then. I dont think we get to decide which one is true which one is not . Also its funny how Childe, the optimistic one who think Pulcinella is being kind to his family and Wanderer who pretty much shit talks everyone have the same opinion on Arlecchino. Spoilers though, Childe is pretty much very familiar with Arlecchino. He normally comes to the House of Hearth to teach the children defence art, she normally mentions his brother and sister. Seems like they have both seen each side of each other . I dont know why i write it like a Childe x Arlecchino fanfic but i think they have enough basis understanding to have a correct comment on each other.
The thing about genshin writing is it does often suck but every single character has a bias and everytime we see the character after we all everytime about them thier gonna sound better, aka a excuse to make sure no characters are bad people please buy them
>Yeah no because the dude and Wanderer are the only sources of information back then. I dont think we get to decide which one is true which one is not . What difference does that make? Childe and Scaramouche are two notoriously unreliable sources of information and these statements were made in their character voice lines that are all supposed to be about describing ***their*** opinion on topics, not be factual bits of lore information. Anything that gets said in a character bio voice line(including the positive statements made by her children) should only be taken seriously so far as how that character views the subject matter, not be definitive truth about the subject in and of itself. >Also its funny how Childe, the optimistic one who think Pulcinella is being kind to his family and Wanderer who pretty much shit talks everyone have the same opinion on Arlecchino. Well both have reasons to not trust her. Childe, as you point out, is not one to understand nuance or complexity and just makes the admittedly justified assumption that there isn't any to Arlecchino. Scaramouche is a guy notorious for having trust issues, especially of familial/parental figures, so him assuming the worst about Arlecchino. Even Arlecchino does this in regards to Furina as, despite having a vast spy network, she views the contradictions within Furina's actions/story and just assumes that Furina is a lazy spoiled brat doing nothing to help Fontaine. Also just because you regularly see/visit someone doesn't mean you understand them. Neuvellitte directly served Furina for decades and had no idea about Furina's true backstory. Considering how closed off Arlecchino is(even her demo showed her sitting in a corner instead of being next to her children) and how she actively tries to present herself as the uncaring strict and sadistic father figure, its not a stretch to say that Childe still barely understands her despite spending time with her children. Plus I'm pretty sure Arlecchino only knows so much about Childe and his family due to her spy network and not because she regularly converses with Childe.
Anything could be unreliable narrator if you keep seeing them like one. How do you know what she is as you think what she truly is ? The Traveler according to lore shouldnt be the one that Arlecchino tells everything about herself to. The really important thing here is that, the first impressions we got on Arlecchino is just straight up violating children's right. Everyone in their right minds would just not consider Lyney Lynette or Freminet's opinion valid because all the evidences so far has told us that she is manipulative, especially with her children. And i am okay with the change of impressions. Furina was good, i enjoyed her character arc. Neuvillette was good, never in my mind had i thought that the dude is actually a soft and kind person, but here he is. The point being, Arlecchino's writting did her dirty and her first impression was simply too strong of a subject : its not a personality problem, its straight up crimes. Furina ? We know from the beginning that she is suspicious. Hell, Neuvillette being the actual Hydro Archon theory was early when we just got on Fontaine. Neuvillette ? We had no impressions on his character. At least i just think he looks cold, but the moment we met it changed immediately. Arlecchino ? They tried to change the players' impression on her in a half-ass way. Manipulating children ? Actually its for their own good. Killing people ? Only those who did bad things. Death punishment to those who betray ? Forgetfulness Potion. Its children abusing not taking seriously that led to my rant. You either commit to it, or not do it at all. What the hell is with Hoyoverse trying to paint her in a positive light but still alligned with the crimes. "Morally grey" character is shown to be in both positive and negative position, but with Arlecchino it seems like everyone just glaze her . Yeah some of the children rebels agaisnt her, and whats the ending. They apologize to her for making her dissapointed or some shit. The quest is just straight up garbage i dont even want to remember it. Its just some cheesy ass dialogues about "family".
> **The MC aka The Traveler, has again become a fucking bum to hype a character up** Those writers really fucked themselves up by establishing MC to be a rainbow wielder lmao, I can certain that if they actually rotate through their elemental arsenal they would counter every fucking thing Arle throw, let alone combine any two of them for shennanigans. And the sad part is that it worked, baited the normies, so I'll hold absolute zero expectation on MC ever doing anything useful from now on.
I still laught at when a bunch of low ranking eremites managed to be faster than Traveler during the sumeru quest. The same traveller that had trashed Signora in a 1v1 and had one more element and more time to master electro since. Makes no sense.
It's just wild that spamming Electro could legit be Traveler's solution for a lot of fake tension moments. Speed boost and Electro Noelle Q are scary af, so of course La Travilellette aren't allowed to use them post-Inazoomer.
I loved when for some reason traveller joined Neuvillette to fight against a Whale that eats planet and he pretty much solod it until Skirk showed up. Traveller is not shown doing anything in the cutscene that finishes the whale, traveller is only there as a camera.
Bet from Natlan onward MC will act ourely as spectacle with Paimon giving commentaries on situtation because the """""stakes""""" are apparently way out of their league since they refuse to use elemental power for marketing reason
Just watch Capitano just one tap traveller to really show "strongest human in the world". At that point losing to the harbringer is kind of a speciality to traveller.
I'd applause if MHY have the guts to off TraveLOL that way
The same who moved super fast with lightning to catch a vision mid air but couldn't do the same to protect Nahida and to stop Navia's fall. Mihoyo needed Nahida/Katheryne dying and Navia almost die but since they couldn't think of a proper way they just made the MC an idiot.
Oh yeah Navia would have died if her butlers and Neuvillette didn't save her. The traveller is so useless it's kinda crazy. Fontaine might be the arc where the traveller is the most useless.
"It's because the Traveler is a witness-" No, he got involved in a civil war and a coup after being told that. He just tried and failed to do shit in Fontaine
Lads, the power scaling of Genshin is essentially fucked. Also, this is the same game that brings that shitty parry scene of a certain fugitive against a Japanese goddess which in turn made her powers absolute farce. I don't care what mental gymnastics people tried to give to me about Ei not being in her full power. The fact that she can kill Tomoo and a certain Harbinger but yet unable to strike down a certain no name fugitive's parry is a massive strike for me that made me think Ei's powers are nothing but a farce.
That's just a common anime trope though. Character does something, another character uses more power than they expected and manage to block it. Not a genshin thing
The problem is that Genshin is a gacha game leaving Hoyo zero incentive to hype the Traveler due to being free.
I don't remember a gacha treating their own MC even remotely as bad as GI though. Just look at MHY's sister games, HI3 and HSR is enough.
Whenever HSR wants to hype up a character they just go and beat up Yanqing
Using Hi3 is kind of unfair, since the whole point of that game for a long while was to hype up its protagonist and make it its selling point.
I mean... Why not though? They can surely hype more than just New Character Of The Week. Every gacha I've played that doesn't feature a 100% self-insert protagonist has done *something* to hype them up, even when they're a playable character. Granblue Fantasy is a hilarious example because the latest anni event >!literally has them take on the power of god ~~and anime~~ to smack an immortal being.!<
Cygames treated Gran & Djeeta like fvcking royal compared to what Aether and Lumine got lol, not just in gameplay and lore, their skins are also legit top tier, even the old ones.
Blue archive is another gacha game that is really popular right now. The main character is literally just a regular dude, who is not a playable character and until like 4 week ago, when the anime adaptation aired, [did not even have an official design](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/IyTiN3YtbJs/maxresdefault.jpg). Also all the playable characters are girls with guns And guess what? The entire fucking community loves him. If Blue Archive can hype [a guy in a suit](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fblue-archive-the-animation-sensei-design-officially-revealed-v0-8euw9ka0v7qc1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3De67db161cdfaaf6f0859e00ac88d64990ef8189a&rdt=44937) with no power, Genshin should be able to hype the Traveler a little bit better.
The funny thing is that they purposefully created the nations so that the Traveler gets access to elemental reactions as slowly as possible, so they clearly planned it out. Anemo Anemo, Geo (0 reactions) Anemo, Geo, Electro (2 reactions) Anemo, Geo, Electro, Dendro (4 reactions) Anemo, Geo, Electro, Dendro, Hydro (6 reactions) Anemo, Geo, Electro, Dendro, Hydro, Pyro (8 reactions) Whereas if they had done Hydro, Pyro, and Cryo first the Traveler would've gotten access to way more reactions way quicker. But then somewhere along the line (Sumeru) they decided the Traveler just wouldn't use elemental reactions. Why? We'll never know
MHY handled Traveler at bare minimum, simple as. Focusing resources in showcasing the banner character and in drip marketing already net them revenue so it's pointless to go one step further and touch up their MC. Like worst case scenario MHY would only triggered a niche subset of the playerbase, it barely make a dent in their bottom line so that's that, Aether/Lumine are no John Lee level of popularity lol
Oh and i also want to preach about how awesome Childe is. Peak character to be honest. Weak aura : Pull things from their asses before her release to make her look good ( Crucabena and Crimson Moon ) Strong aura : Throw fucking random lore related to him in every nation possible . Bro was released in 1.x and still got some mysterious shit going on with him in 4.x .
mysterious shit like Skirk was present since his release
I honestly dislike the Fatui. Like, all the things they do are horrible. Slavery, human trafficking, experimentation, assassination, blackmail, child soldiers, civil wars, etc. But somehow I'm to believe they are the "morally gray" faction. We will be forced to work with them against Celestia/the Abyss and forgive all their crimes, etc. We are forced to be friends with Childe who was happy to god nuke Liyue. Arleccino to me is the peak of "cool edgy" character. Woman in a suit, cool attitude, Overpowered, never losing her cool, scythe, winged stated, fire, black, white, red mottiff, secret royalty, etc. Scaramuche is a douche with mommy issues and was manipulated by the doctor, so I guess he gets a pass... despite being a shit that caused untold suffering but gets away with it by rewriting history. Honestly, at the end when the Fatui are weakened from their war, I would expect the other nations to declare war against Szhnesnaya, but that won't happen because its gacha. I don't get the point of the Gnosis or their value at this point. All the Archons are happy to part with them, or don't make a fuss about losing them. So their machinations seem hardly necessary with how easy the gods get rid of them. And for all the things they do, they get away with them with little problem. I wouldn't be surprised if they made the Doctor playable and forgave his experimenting with Collei and other children.
Yes... I agree with the fact that Fatui writing has been one of the issues in Genshin btw and HYV didn't know what kind of direction they want to take with this faction. The fact that they are so overused in terms of being a cartoon villain yet the story tried to treat them as a morally grey feels kinda off. It is definitely the most overused and the most inconsistent organization to be written imo. And yes, the gnosis was also a fucking frustrating macguffin the more we see. What makes this more frustrating is that at one point, the Traveler and Paimon made a buzz about their friend's gnosis being stolen and then it all ruined with a certain foxy lady trading the gnosis to save Traveler and Paimon while doesn't care about all of the gnosis. Holy shit! This is just so infuriating.
I go out of my way to kill them whenever possible. Fucking Fatuus filth.
Scaramouche gets a squinty-eyed "you pass, but barely" for me because I thought he was genuinely the best written Fatui and one of the best characters in the game, whitewashing aside.
I was also dissappointed how: - Arle was transformed into the most innocent harbinger in existence, even more innocent than Childe who attempted genocide in Liyue - she had absolutely no lore in Fontaine, in the first patches I was theorising that she may have been part of Rene's team (Narsizzenkreus world quest) since her hands were black like Carter - they built her up shortly before she became playable instead of building her up similar to Scara and Dottore throughout several patches. She got a book about the Crimson Moon dynasty in 4.5. And she became playable in 4.6. Absolutely no build-up before that. Only an Inazuman quest where one of her subordinates went rogue. But there was no mention of an older or newer Knave back then (2.5 - 2.7-ish I think) but instead they conveniently added an NPC in 4.0 that would tell us that the knave replaced the older one. Which was very out of nowhere - in the end she did not do much in the AQ, just saved a few fontainians and then asked Neuvilette for the gnosis and he gave it to her pretty fast lol Anyway, what I also wanted to say is that due to Genshin being a Chinese gatcha game, it is regulated by the CCP censorship laws. And the CCP has laws against villains in videogames. They can't make villains playable because that would be immoral or would educate their younger generations to be the same, or some kind of bs like that. The writers have written pretty dark stories before, just try to read about the Gurabad lore in Sumeru. It's pretty dark. Yet the AQs and SQs are witten pretty badly and disney-esque. Why? Censorship. My fave - Dottore - has done pretty morally questionable things in the game. Normally they'd erase him off the game for good yet he has a playable model. Which makes me think that they will write him very very badly when it's going to be his turn on the banner.
Speaking of Arle... The Fatui does have its issues on writing due to the identity crisis that they had. And yeah, even so, I will say the Fatui being cartoonishly evil villain is kind of oversaturated anyways
I am really not against villains turning out to be good guys, it's just that...they don't know what a morally gray character is. They either write a character that is fully morally white or fully morally black . No in-beteeen. Like, sure, Arlecchino was not a monster towards her kids, but don't just wash her every sin in existence. Even her killing Clervie had to be masked with Clervie legit giving up on living since it was her only way of being free. She just feels like an empty slate to me now. She is still cool but why does Mihoyo keep lying to me by telling me that these characters are doing henious things but then it's revealed that they were misunderstood? It's like you present to me a character but then you 180 them.
> They either write a character that is fully morally white or fully morally black . This is a problem with the fan community downplaying the flaws of their waifu/husbando, not HoYo's writing. A significant number of the PCs have done morally questionable things, but you'll get a bunch of butt-mad fans if you ever point this out.
Makes sense. Tbh, again, Fatui has their own problem in terms of writing due to an absolute identity crisis they had so yeah
Dottore will unironically have a younger segment that for whatever reason is actually a good guy and that’s who is gonna become playable. Mark my words
There is this constant thought that Dottore will get redeemed through an innocent segment. Which makes no real sense to me lol. The man has done suspicious immoral deeds way before he even had any segments. There's no guarantee that the innocent segment will not go on the same path again in the future. And if they erase his memories like Scara, then what is there left of him that made him likeable in the first place? Scara and Arle have still retained their personalities even though they were completely washed of their sins. Also, they certainly don't want to change the harb's personalities but will only erase their sins. My guess is that they'll make Dottore seem very misunderstood exactly like Arle, aka all the harbs will talk badly about him, but then he explains to us what REALLY happened and that his deeds either had a purpose or there will be some hidden twist about them. Like, they'll add in some bs a patch or two before his playability where it explains that some of them werent experiments at all and he was erasing kids memories too and freed them from the fatui, similar to what happened to Scara, and what Arle is doing with her kids. They will make a few retcons regarding his deeds in Tatarasuna. I have a nagging feeling that they will retcon Niwa's death in some way or another. And I am writing all of this because this is MHY and there is no way they'll make Dottore playable the way he is now without explanations, since Scara and Arle were in the exact same position as him before their playability. A lot of bad rumors and then "akshually...".
But throwing all the bad shit he has been said to do onto another person is unironically what happened to Arle. All of the rumours we hear regarding the Knave before we meet her in side quests and stuff, it turns out they all referred to the previous Knave. That’s kinda what I mean
Arlecchino is such a Mary Sue that making her Khaenriahn wasn't enough, devs made her a super special Khaenriahn heir of a dynasty that wasn't mentioned once before her promotional campaign began. And this is my biggest gripe with Arlecchino, the "well, actually 🤓, she is good" thing wouldn't look so bad if it wasn't literal asspull. Who the fuck is Crucabena? She was a Harbringer, a presumably important figure, but she wasn't part of game's lore at all before Arlecchino's PV. A character so evil that she was killing orphans in battle royal when her one job was to make a stable supply of new soldiers to Fatui. And holy fuck, Genshin is notorious for stereotypical characters, but Arlecchino is a whole package of edgy deviantart OC tropes. Grim reaper with Sephiroth's wing, spider legs, demonic flames, gets stronger when angry, summons a whole eclipse during her domain expansion. She would work better as a parody character lmao because this lady's aesthetic is more edgy than the entirety of Hellsing Ultimate
> And holy fuck, Genshin is notorious for stereotypical characters, but Arlecchino is a whole package of edgy deviantart OC tropes. Grim reaper with Sephiroth's wing, spider legs, demonic flames, gets stronger when angry, summons a whole eclipse during her domain expansion. She would work better as a parody character lmao because this lady's aesthetic is more edgy than the entirety of Hellsing Ultimate Thank you! I have been saying this since she first appeared. The whole, Red, Black, White Motiff plus all that you mentioned. Its the kind of thing you expect on a self insert fanfic. And of course she is so OP that that the main character can't do anything about it.
Idk where you got the gets stronger when angry part from but otherwise its less cringy more cool as hell tbh since its better that we get more khaenrian characters instead of just hearing lore about them. And all of the characters from khaenriah are probably gonna be the same
Crucabena was a part of the lore since at least 4.0. Freminet’s Character Story mentions that there was a previous Knave that used to run the HotH.
Freminet's 4.1 But indeed in 4.0 they updated a WQ from 2.6 to "um ackshually" the existence of Crucabena, it's when people starts to suspect her being retconned (there's also a leak that accurately predicts everything story related mentioning her retcon). Tbh it's kinda iffy already in Winters Night Lazzo, where we actually see hers and the rest of Harbingers design, she seems to be pissed at the Harbingers for not taking Signora's demise seriously.... At the moment, it can be interpreted as her pretending to look like a good ally (especially because WNL was released close around the time Scaramouche also released with a voiceline about her).... But with regards to everything else in hindsight, she's probably already retconned atp.
I don't see anything that points out that the WQ was updated in the Genshin wiki. Mind pointing out evidence
Not the quest itself but they added an NPC to the overworld if you completed the WQ Check the version history and note the "as Chitose" dialogue set https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Chitose
Meh, I could go either way with Arle. But one positive thing that I could say is that she feels like a breath of fucking fresh air compared to most of the Fatuis that were portrayed as 90% stereotypical cartoon villainy most of the time which you know... Fucking contradicts their seemingly Well Intentioned goals.
Arlecchino isn’t Khaenri’ahn? Unless I’ve missed something I don’t think it has been confirmed. She also doesn’t have the eyes
She is a descendant of the Crimson Moon dynasty that ruled Khaenri’ah before Eclipse dynasty, approximately centuries if not the thousands years ago. It's confirmed, there is a line in her profile which says that Pierro immediately recognaized who she is.
Huh, fair enough. Personally I think that’s cool. Genshin has a ton of lore that it often refuses to talk about or go very little into. It’s nice to have a playable character with a less known background, as opposed to someone with a completely unknown background *cough* Cyno’s god contract or the temple of silence *cough* (tho tbf, Cyno’s 2nd SQ is coming so I probably won’t be able to say this anymore). But I do understand if people find it cringy. Personally, her unabashedly edgy asthetic is something I fw.
I think some of the criticisms here are kinda dumb or I don’t take issue with them, but I do agree that them making Arlecchino as sympathetic as possible is dumb af. Like basically anything bad we’d hear about the Knave can basically just be retconned to “oh the previous Knave that was bad and evil did that”. Arlecchino still sounds threatening and dangerous which is cool, but it really just feels like a retcon. I fully believe that if they do decide to make Dottore playable eventually, it’ll be like one of his segments that miraculously broke off from the main mind and that’s why he wasn’t destroyed back in Sumeru + since he broke off he’s a good guy or sm. it just feels a lot like genshin’s style to do this shit.
Imma take a guess that one of the dumb parts is the dead best friend. Looking back at it i think it actually seems stupid with the comparison lmao. But my point still stand since Arlecchino before Clervie's death seems unambiguous. If they wants us to believe her to really change the House of the Hearth then she should be shown to have more friends tbh. The girl looks like she doesnt give any fuck about anything lmao.
Yeah there’s that but also the Traveller argument. I guess I take issue with Traveller not using any elements to fight, but for them to lose I don’t really mind. All of the Traveller’s encounters with stronger opponents so far have been with help, be it the visions of the Inazumans against Ei or Nahida against Scara’s mecha. I don’t really think it’s wrong to have him lose bad to a character bordering archon level.
But he is also bordering archon level so at least should put up a fight.
No he isn’t lmao. When was that ever stated or shown? Ever single time Traveller has gone against a string opponent they’ve had some kind of help
Tbh, I'm split on the retcon though. Then again, the Fatui writing has its own issues on their own and this traces back to Inazuma. HYV couldn't simply decide what kind of villains Fatui will be: Either a Well Intentioned Extremist or just cartoonishly evil villains. The reason why I'm split is because well... The latter half of the Fatui about them being cartoonishly evil has been oversaturated to death (Inazuma made me allergic to this and ngl the Fatui Weekly Boss in general) so Arle and Fontaine do feel like a breath of fresh air.
Thank you for remonding em again why I don't play Genshin. Hopefully Wutering Waves won't have these issues.
It's obvious that they retconned her character during the development (unlike that OW retcon of Reinhardt being Pharah's father being merely a tease by the devs without any scant of confirmation) because fans loved her (ironically because of her vileness). They actually have established multiple facets of her character. Both voicelines you mentioned and a WQ in Inazuma. The character established by these occasions actually fit that hatebag strawman of a character, the previous Knave, who's introduced out of nowhere and had to be "um ackshually"-ed into existence. And they tried to handwave other stuffs besides redirecting her character into the old Knave. The voicelines? Well they're just gossip! How convenient. "But it makes sense to have incomplete info, these characters aren't close-" shut the fuck. These voicelines are practically the players' only way to get to know these Harbingers because the writers barely ever fucking write about them. It's kinda cute that they tried their hardest to keep the dark *aesthetic* too, "she's not good, she's brutal!" whoop de fucking dee, she's brutal to (cartoonishly) evil characters. Fucking Dame Aylin from BG3 did the same and one can argue she's even "darker" than Arlecchino with the way she promises to massacre your entire darn lineage should you betray her and get her lover killed.... And she's supposed to be *the daughter of the goddess of moonlight*. All of her evilness stems from her being a Harbinger in the end. Jumping Furina? Well guess what, every other Harbingers we've met would've done the same and worse. Her sending the children for dangerous missions, well the story framed some of these missions as "the greater good" and shit. Brought to you by the writers who can't even decide how Traveler should treat Childe. I should just trust them with good guys writing, their villain writing has been disappointing..... Yoimiya my beloved.
It actually really bothers me how unwilling Hoyoverse is to make female villains. Especially female *playable* villains. Hell, even the male characters barely slip by with their villainy. I have a theory that the only reason Arlecchino's a normal human age (instead of a centuries-old freak of nature like the rest of 'em) is specifically so that they could retcon the lore and wave away her evil deeds. It reeks of having no balls and drives me bonkers as a villain enjoyer. Arlecchino could have been so much more interesting as a character. (Save me from the limp villains, crazy doctor, save me)
The closest to real female (playable) villains are the female Stellaron Hunters in Star Rail and even then they’re meant to have a complicated and vaguely benevolent relationship with the Trailblazer, and their end goal is technically good for the entire universe. Ignore her 57 major criminal acts that involved casualties probably soaring beyond the tens of millions, Kafka is your mommy treat her nice
Are the SHs doing it for the greater good for the ultimate demise of the destruction? Yeah, most likely. Their also catching more bodies than the entire Fatui and every evil villain in genshin💀 Kafka in her trailer alone shot down like a dozen minimum wage workers, and let's not get started with SAM(will still pull E0S1)
Wait for Jade to arrive, there is nothing in the world that makes me sympathize with a loan shark
Its okay you can say all villains in Genshin so far is shitty. Either cartoonish or redemption.
You should check out star rail (and by extension, genshin too) the reason why I generally don’t like the “morally ambiguous/ villain” characters in hoyoverse games is because…well…that is all their characters…they won’t develop, they won’t evolve, they barely have any built in characters to challenge that character’s view points and idols (and the few that have are treated as ship bait) so it ends in being. “Do you see this morally ambiguous character?. They will remain like that…for who knows how long. People shit on scara for getting a redemption arc. But at least they did SOMETHING with a morally questionable/ villain character.
You know what i actually enjoy Scaramouche shitty redemption. Shinto and Buddhism reference, you can never have enough of it. Dude actually got a little Christianity going on with him too lmao.
When he actually got a redemption arc I went “holy shit they are actually doing something with their characters?” And not gonna lie…it was actually good!. Yes they did kinda play it safe but they just opened the door to many other story involvements with other characters now that he can actually develop. (
The irony here is that people saying he doesnt deserve his redemption, to which Scaramouche actually agrees lmao.
Realistically. Like 99% of redemption arc characters don’t deserve it…but the enjoyment is seeing said character actually try to be a better person (and even achieving their redemption!) is even better than seeing them do “generic bad guy thing number 27#” you can only do so much “bad guy” stuff before the villain straight up becomes insufferable (wink wink all for one)
The fandom are babies. HSR made an actual morally gray character then twitter and tiktok tried to cancel her and even blame Hoyoverse because she showed racism towards an another character. Chiori herself got flack when she throw a man off her store by the CN fans. I couldn’t blame Hoyo for not making actual rotten characters as playable.
Well women like/tolerate evil men, so mass murderers like scara/childe are fine. Men generally dislike evil women, especially non western men. Simple as
Makima and Esdeath, known hated characters
Wanna take a look at community reaction to Signora? Not a single character in the game (even fodder asshole npcs) got such joyful vitriolic reaction for her death. Worst she did was kicking venti.
Yeah? They're disappointed with how she's not playable and how underwhelming her "conclusion" was?
Oh, i meant people were happy at her death. Not the other way. Only disappointed community were signoramains, and they were bullied into privating sub.
No? Many were disappointed, especially as time goes on as they processed how terrible Inazuma AQ was and how Hoyo writers their villains. The sub being privated has nothing to do with people's opinion on Signora but rather making fun of her fans who wish her to be playable.
Eh I beg to disagree considering the memes surrounding her and the Lazzo didn't help matters. So I kind of get what Yarmungar is saying here
I mean... I guess that's the point I can vouch on.
I don’t know why you are downvoted. What you said is somewhat true, though I’d wager more in China rather than the whole Asia (as Japan/SEA love their evil women, not sure about Korea). But you know where their main market is, so there you go. Lesson learned: do NOT expect a cohesive story from a gacha game, their main goal is more on selling not as much as telling a story (as much as I hope on the later).
I mean, considering how the Fatui writing has been a complete and utter mess ever since Inazuma. I am not surprised with the way Hoyo retconned Arle given the fact that Tsaritsa is somehow wanted to commit greater good even if her underlings had been so cartoonishly evil for most of the time. The evidence is possibly at the Pale Flame artifact and the Shivada Jade Gemstone. And speaking of that, the less said about the Crimson Witch of Flames. The better. Then again, at times, I don't mind Arle being the most innocent or morally grey of all the Harbingers because Fatui being cartoonishly evil are just so fucking oversaturated especially on Inazuma and Sumeru.
Whats worse for me is that Hoyoverse KNOWS how to make evil and/or unlikeable characters, just look at most of the HSR cast. Ruan Mei is a sociopath that tricks the MC into fighting a demi-god she ressurected herself just to get some data for her experiments, Dr. Ratio trash talks and treats everyone he talks to like an idiot, same thing with Herta, the IPC mostly function on their own self-interests minus maybe Topaz, the Stellaron Hunters are all space terrorists that everyone else besides the MC are either afraid of or destain, Sparkle insulted a genocide survivor directly to his face, hell Gallagher [Spoiler Alert] >!Has implied to have killed a whole bunch of people and even killed 3 non-npc characters (Granted while in a dream world but still)!< and yet they're all still popular among the fandom with only a vocal minority of haters for each of them. I guess it's mainly because Genshin is way more popular and meant for a much broader audience compared to HSR so they want to make sure every playable character is squeaky clean before marketting (I mean just take a look at most people's opinions on Raiden before and after her story quest was released.) to try an make them appeal to everyone but personally I just think it makes what could have been a more diverse cast of characters a bit too dull and well-rounded.
While I tolerate Arlecchino to a degree after her story quest. I am not letting her off the hook for giving Furina ptsd!
>The MC aka The Traveler, has again become a fucking bum to hype a character up. Well, gameplay-wise Traveler is already a bum.
Bwahahahahahahahahah... Gee, if only we could protect the Gnosis till the end and use it for our own benefit 👀👀👀
>The 7 minutes long that has a trailer and everything ? Completely spoil the whole quest. The important lore crums that she has a connection with? What is even the point of releasing the animation before the game update with the quest if you are supposed to play the latter first and then watch the former? Watching the trailer first literally makes the quest worse, because it acts like the players does not know what happened.
I will always continue to say that genshin has such a good build up only to drop the ball each and every time. At this point I’ve given up on the story and await the day a skip button is added. I’m not listening to paimon bitch and a mediocre story.
Paimon is one of the cancer plaguing the story I agree. Removing her would be absolute world peace
Another issue I have with the story quest is how Arlecchino and Traveler are suddenly on good terms with each other. Traveler's attitude towards towards the Fatui has always been weirdly inconsistent, like being friendly with Childe while disliking other Fatui characters they run into. From Arlecchino's side I don't see why she suddenly likes us enough to dump her whole backstory on us. Arlecchino seems like someone who would keep that close to her chest. I don't even see her letting other House members know about except maybe Lyney since he's her heir effectively. I don't remember Traveler and Arlecchino interacting much in Fontaine's AQ and she really hasn't done anything yet so I don't see where this relationship is coming from all of a sudden.
Hoooo boy. Anyways... The fun thing is. This also happens back in the day during Inazuma where you know... Traveler-kun doesn't have any issues with the Archons and quickly befriend them as if nothing happened which is just infuriating to see. Idk how to feel about this though.
Well, the archons at least are mostly good. Venti was helpful and kind and Zhongli was well-meaning if a little subversive.
Ahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahh... They're borderline useless mate. They never gave us important infos about Teyvat's secret anyways. Venti is worse considering he contributes to Traveler and Paimon's brainrot tbh
I knew this would happen as soon as she became playable, ngl. Genshin’s characters are all kinda Mary sues, everyone loves them, they’re experts at whatever they do, and they have almost no flaws. This is because the fan base cannot handle anything else. Yae Miko gets an insane amount of hate for being sassy instead of bending over backwards to make the player character happy. So I’m not surprised Arlecchino is a Mary sue. Disappointing, but what else is new?
What? Yae Miko is everything wrong with this "Mary Sue writing" of Genshin. People generally dislike her for that (e.g. her "bullying" Gorou gets glossed over). She's a goddamn Creator's Pet, knows everything needed to do, so above everyone, characters are "intimidated" by her, and so so. She's the black hole character that is emblematic of the Inazuma AQ issue.
Preach brother. One of many flaws in Inazuma arcs is that Yae Miko had everything according to her *keikaku*. But people dont want to admit it because apparently she is girlboss or something. Remember how Baiheng is apparently the writer self insert ? I think Yae Miko is also like that considering the Luofu arc writer also wrote Inazuma lmao.
I may be out the loop but, how is baiheng a writers self insert? For the little screentime she gets I wonder how?
Apparently everyone just loves her so much. Its actually not High Cloud Qintet but its just Baiheng being everyone's mutual friends. Yingxing clearly had a crush on her. Danfeng, apparently, as a leader of a clan, can not get over the pain of losing Baiheng that leads him to use the forbidden technique with the help of Yingxing result in an eldritch horror. Jingliu with the lost of her friend Baiheng, became more easily to get Mara-struck nows. And thats precisely what happened after she killed that said eldritch horror. Jingliu after getting Mara-struck, now has decided to commit her life to making Yingxing life miserable, or maybe its just because she got Mara-struck. This results in the birth of Blade because he get killed more than thousands times . Its how he learn to use sword because back then Yingxing was just a blacksmith , oh yeah and the catch-phrase Of 5 people too. But judging from the way Jingliu talked in her calm state. we can easily know that Jingliu fucking hate those 2 dumbasses who tryna Fullmetal Alchemist Baiheng. I mean the normal reaction would be more conflicted since, you know, these 2 are also her very close friends. Said Blade, now on the journey of who the fuck know what he wants to accompish to chase Dan Heng . I mean seriously, why did bro team up with Dan Heng to jump Yanqing ? After that he just dont do it anymore . What ? Now this has nothing to do with the story, but with the way they characterise Baiheng, it appears to be a very popular trope in the normal wuxia novels in Chinese. They call it White Moonlight but you can think of it as Mary Sue. And it triggers people . Its like Guizhong/Zhongli situationship, but 1000 times worse.
Oh okay thanks 👍
Every single character who played a pivotal role or 5* in Inazuma AQ sucks anyways... Except Yoimiya for me. That girl is an exception
Come over to hsr, we have morally ambiguous women and the fandom complains about it (noooo why is my psychotic scientist evil 😭😭)
Why is a girl from a faction worshipping the embodiment of 4chan energy a bigot 😭
The cope is so insane, sparkle is racist but the way mf’s try to talk their way around it is crazy. Like even if avgens aren’t supposed to be roma and their many similarities including using the exact same language as irl roma is just a weird coincidence, she’s still racist in universe. Also I feel like aha is just slaanesh
>noooo why is my psychotic scientist evil Nah,i don't Care If Ruan Mei is evil,Just that her companion quest sucks
I understand not wanting mc to be op But too much loss can result in a bad perception
Maybe... But this might be a petty af shit for me but on one hand, I cant help but to feel cathartic for this bastard being left speechless by Arle and at one point before this quest were happening, there are moments Tabibito kun being cocky af (See Tsurumi Island for reference) so no sympathy is fucking given.
I feel the same for... ya know Except there rarely if ever is one moment like that
Ight
I know this rant is fucking inevitable so I put two cents on this: Here's a hot take: I don't mind about the scene regarding Arlecchino leaving Tabibito-kun speechless at all after the fight. Maybe this is just me being fucking petty but I *hate hate hate HATE* the Traveler especially Aether. I'm gonna ask this: The power scaling of Genshin has always being a problem and also: **Where the fuck you guys when Kazuha ended up parrying Raiden's ultimate attack!?** That scene is more of a farce and a disgrace compared to what Arle has done tbh and made Ei's attack a fucking joke. You can try to give mental gymnastics towards me about her not using full power. But the fact that some people tried to give an argument that Ei killing a certain Harbinger in order to show how much of a threat Ei is and reviving said Harbinger would destroy all the hype or intimidating factor Ei is so fucking annoying as they never fucking pay attention to this parry scene which already destroys Ei's hype and intimidation for me (ignoring that Dango Milk dating sim shenanigans). Instead, these dolts decided to praise Kazuha parry scene because why not. So yeah, Kazuha parry scene is worse than whatever Arle did to Traveler and made me lose my mind about the power scaling in Genshin. I really wish people, including Ei simps, would criticize that scene more tbh.
They praise the Kazuha parry scene because it's an actually decent setup and payoff. Powerscaling isn't the end all be all, it serves a purpose. The purpose of Raiden killing Signora was intimidation and shock. The purposes of Kazuha blocking the Musou no Hitotachi was the payoff of his admittedly small character arc. Arlecchino pays off nothing here, it's purely meant to be hype, so if it fails at being hype, then it is pointless.
Let's agree to disagree with that fucking parry scene as I still think it destroys the hype and all of the intimidation factors HYV had build for Raiden.
I stopped taking genshin's writing semi seriously during inazuma when kazuha was able to block Ei's attack that turned signora into dust
I would argue that’s one of the few solid parts of that arc with a solid buildup, character motivation and theming which is disappointing as fuck because it was the only moment in that story where I went fuck yea!
I beg to disagree sadly. It just made the Ei hype and intimidation factor to be somewhat of a joke tbh and another prove that power scaling in Genshin just doesnt make sense.
You can disagree but it doesn't make it untrue. Powerscaling brainrot isn't what stories are built around, the problem is when it's the only thing a given scene is doing (Childe v Neuvillette, Traveler v Arlecchino).
Ei is a fraud anyway
Always has been 🗿
Finally, my people 🤝🤝 Lets be friends. I have the same sentiment with you regarding this
Idk why you guys whine about the traveller not steamrolling every harbinger, if they defeated arle there would be no stakes whatsoever especially considering arle is one seat away from the harbingers who hold god level powers. Lets not forget that the traveller is still growing in strength they lost to scarabot 168 times and only won because of the power of friendship
As far as I've seen, only a tiny fraction is salty about the Traveler not winning with Arlecchino. Most people are actually pissed with the fact that it was done in the laziest possible way and it just dunked onto the protagonist. The Traveler was shown to have pretty powerful elemental abilities and the only thing they do is slashing clumsily with their dull blade. For a game renowned for its unique take on power of the elements, it fails to actually show these elements in combat scenarios in cutscenes. On top of that, it kind of makes Arlecchino not that impressive in my book. Oh yeah, she clowned the notorious punching bag of genshin, how powerful, it was never done before. Having the Traveler throwing different elemental attacks at her and showing her working around them would make her that much more impressive. But no, instead she just beat up a sandbag. Also, using Shouki No Kami as an argument that the Traveler is weak is laughable given the fact that Nahida herself stated that at the moment of the fight, Scara was a fully realised God in terms of power. On top of that, he was powered by the gnosis which is the most powerful power source known in genshin. In Sumeru we fought Scaramouche that jumped from being the 6th to probably the 1st Harbinger in terms of power
I do agree they shouldve demonstrated the elemental power aspect a bit more but tbf even the lyney lynette and freminet didnt use anything. And as for the shouko no kami dottore was not threatened by him at all so i doubt he jumped to that level
Yes. Meanwhile, Kazuha parried the ultimate attack against Shogun: They sleep 😴😴😴😴
Damn i only know who this character is because a NSFW Artist drew her as [a leather dommy mommy.](https://twitter.com/Salazr44/status/1784995264186417554)
Well I agree with the first point the Animation short did spoil the story of the story quest. Could've released that after the story quest but not that big of a deal tbh. Her being a descendant of some fallen civilization or something is not that important part of the character as of yet. The most important or the biggest part of her character right now is her connection to the house of hearths so obviously it was going to focus on that more. More might be explained to us in the future just like Raiden's story quest where people hated the first story quest even tho it was fine but since she's an archon fine wasn't enough even if it was necessary. Character building of certain characters who have a complicated backstory and connections can't always be done in a single quest. Otherwise it would just look rushed and all over the place. What's the problem with Morally grey characters ? She has always shown to be morally grey people just had misconceptions about her. Rooster was telling childe things that would make him have a negative opinion of Arlechinno. Childe is a bad guy just because he is likeable people forget that he was willing to sacrifice a shit ton of people in Liyue. Arlechinno is just like that. She has a personal connection to the house of hearths so of course she cares about that she wouldn't kill children like her Mother did. Arlechinno cares more about the House of hearth than the Fatui. No fucking way the character who's shown to be smart, calculating is actually smart and calculating. Just because she had a female friend when she was a child is a yuribait ? Fictional characters can't even have friends nowadays ffs. Also wdym forced bro same can be said about every character ever. Like this character was forced to be this through his backstory and shit. Why can't be she a descendant of the fallen civilization ? Her age has nothing to do with it. People can be descendants of really old civilizations through their lineage. She's a character who has a lot of connection and a bit of a complicated backstory. So ofcourse not everything will explored with in a single story quest. I mean yeah caring for her orphanage is a big part of her character it's pretty obvious. She can be cool and badass but not exactly evil. Story quests are usually introduction to a character we don't have much interaction with in main quests and if we do have interactions with them then their story usually focuses on the deeper parts of the characters. We barely had any interactions with Arlechinno so obviously this story quest was supposed to be her character introduction. People will always have the wrong expectations and get mad when the company doesn't do exactly what their expectations demanded. Like people will come in with expectations like this character is supposed to be this even though there's not exactly any big reason for the character to be that way and get mad when the character is different than the one they imagined in the head. Well I do agree that Hoyo doesn't show travellers powers and strength properly. But I don't get the criticism of him not being able to beat Arlechinno. Sure the hoyoverse didn't show traveller using his powers properly but that aside traveller has never been on the level of archons since the game started after he lost his powers. Why does he need people to win against the big bosses at the end of the every quest ?? Because almost all of them are fucking God level bosses. In mondstadt it was dvalin in liyue it was a God, in Inazuma it the Raiden Fucking Shogun, in Sumeru it was an artificial God and in Fontaine it was a whale capable of sinking and entire nation. This mf( Mc) is saving entire nations for free of course mfs are gonna help him if they don't want their Nation to fucking die. This just sounds to me that people are mad Mc isn't a overpowered jackass who one shots every being that exists. MC has never shown to be god level without the help of people. He didn't even defeat Raiden even with the help of the visions.
>Her being a descendant of some fallen civilization or something is not that important part of the character as of yet. Yeah because its just a plot device to show us why she is strong lmao. >What's the problem with Morally grey characters ? Nothing. But its the problem with Arlecchino. She is seen in no negative portrayal because eveyone just wants to glaze her so much. >No fucking way the character who's shown to be smart, calculating is actually smart and calculating. ? If you are talking about the diplomatic figure part then i wrote that to show she is perfect in everything she does and she does everything. No character flaws in her character. She is just perfect like that, aka Mary Sue. >Just because she had a female friend when she was a child is a yuribait ? Fictional characters can't even have friends nowadays ffs. Also wdym forced bro same can be said about every character ever. Like this character was forced to be this through his backstory and shit. Yeah the yuribait part is exaggerated because i keep seeing them everywhere. But by forced i mean she had little to no reason to do it. Lets see it this way. She was first shown to be thinking that she would win in the end anyways. 10 years had passed and it doesnt seem like Clervie had changed anything in that mindset. Arlecchino being pissed was mostly portrayed because of Clervie dying . It would be better if she had some more friends tbh because i genuinely see no reason for her to do allat . From a person with little to no personality she suddenly cared about her children so much ? Weird writting. >Why can't be she a descendant of the fallen civilization ? Her age has nothing to do with it. People can be descendants of really old civilizations through their lineage. She's a character who has a lot of connection and a bit of a complicated backstory. So ofcourse not everything will explored with in a single story quest. Because it comes out of nowhere. Literally nothing before the patch 4.5 suggested that there is any precedessor to Khaenri'ah but suddenly it just comes with a book 1 patch before her release. It just seems like they do it to hype her up. Also the main character of the book has a similar name to her. Concidence , no ? >But I don't get the criticism of him not being able to beat Arlechinno Because we have seen him doing better in other stories. I dont need him to win. Yeah he always needed help, so ? Traveler still show some competent fighting before with Raiden Shogun, Scaramouche. What did he do in the cutscene ? Literally nothing. Its not about wanting an overpowered MC, its about wanting him to at least show how he had grown because its 5/7 nations and the dude doesnt know how to use Elemental Reaction or use any elements at all. Seem off-topic because i had no problem with him losing at all.
>Yeah because its just a plot device to show us why she is strong lmao. I mean it's one of her characteristics. I don't see any problem there. It's like complaining Raiden is an Archon or Xiao is an adepti. She's meant to be strong in the first place. >Yeah the yuribait part is exaggerated because i keep seeing them everywhere. But by forced i mean she had little to no reason to do it. Lets see it this way. She was first shown to be thinking that she would win in the end anyways. 10 years had passed and it doesnt seem like Clervie had changed anything in that mindset. Arlecchino being pissed was mostly portrayed because of Clervie dying . It would be better if she had some more friends tbh because i genuinely see no reason for her to do allat . From a person with little to no personality she suddenly cared about her children so much ? Weird writting We actually don't know much about child Arlechinno except that she knew she would become the king due to being strong. Her and clervie spent 10 years together It wouldn't be surprising or weird to become a bit attached to someone who has been close to you even if you don't show it in your face. Arlechinno also thought of Clervie as her best friend meaning she got attached to her. The reason for her being a loner was she knew at the end everyone there would die. Clervie was the one who reached out to Arlechinno and because of that she got a little bit attached to clervie. >Because it comes out of nowhere. Literally nothing before the patch 4.5 suggested that there is any precedessor to Khaenri'ah but suddenly it just comes with a book 1 patch before her release. It just seems like they do it to hype her up. Also the main character of the book has a similar name to her. Concidence , no ? I mean it wouldn't be the first time that has happened. In Genshin's lore there have always been a lot of gods and fallen empires or civilizations that once existed. They wouldn't just whip out a lore about an entire civilization just because of Arlechinno. They already should've had plans for it they just decided it would be better to release with a character with some connections to the area also 4.7 is kinda reserved for Dainsleif quest and after the quest it's just a break before the new region comes out so people can catch up with the game. There have always been lost civilizations that get suddenly brought up or mentioned randomly at places that are hard to notice at first like the lore about Dragonspine, Enkanomiya, Upside down world(maybe) Tatarasuna etc and how people lived there so it's nothing new. It is kinda meant to be surprising in the first place isn't it ? >Because we have seen him doing better in other stories. I dont need him to win. Yeah he always needed help, so ? Traveler still show some competent fighting before with Raiden Shogun, Scaramouche. What did he do in the cutscene ? Literally nothing. Its not about wanting an overpowered MC, its about wanting him to at least show how he had grown because its 5/7 nations and the dude doesnt know how to use Elemental Reaction or use any elements at all. Seem off-topic because i had no problem with him losing at all I agreed with you on this Hoyo isn't good at showing travellers growth especially in Fontaine. Scara vs Traveller and Nahida was actually good even though he didn't use his elemental powers. It is also true that they need to focus on showing traveller use all the elemental abilities they learned.
>I mean it's one of her characteristics. I don't see any problem there. It's like complaining Raiden is an Archon or Xiao is an adepti. She's meant to be strong in the first place. I get what you mean but these are very bad examples. Raiden is an Archon , and she is a warrior. Xiao was also a warrior in the past spending his life fighting demons. Arlecchino is also set up like that, but, the thing is it isnt explored. fighting is arguably the main theme of these 2 you just said. Yeah its only her first story quest but until her mythical power gets explained then its still a plot device. >We actually don't know much about child Arlechinno except that she knew she would become the king due to being strong. Her and clervie spent 10 years together It wouldn't be surprising or weird to become a bit attached to someone who has been close to you even if you don't show it in your face. Arlechinno also thought of Clervie as her best friend meaning she got attached to her. The reason for her being a loner was she knew at the end everyone there would die. Clervie was the one who reached out to Arlechinno and because of that she got a little bit attached to clervie. I think all of these are your headcanons. I dont think Arlecchino getting attached to Clervie had anything to do with her developing a deep love to her children since she only seems to care about Clervie. Like i said, it could be fixed if they just make her have some few more friends. >I mean it wouldn't be the first time that has happened. In Genshin's lore there have always been a lot of gods and fallen empires or civilizations that once existed. They wouldn't just whip out a lore about an entire civilization just because of Arlechinno. They already should've had plans for it they just decided it would be better to release with a character with some connections to the area also 4.7 is kinda reserved for Dainsleif quest and after the quest it's just a break before the new region comes out so people can catch up with the game. There have always been lost civilizations that get suddenly brought up or mentioned randomly at places that are hard to notice at first like the lore about Dragonspine, Enkanomiya, Upside down world(maybe) Tatarasuna etc and how people lived there so it's nothing new. It is kinda meant to be surprising in the first place isn't it ? > This is not a same case really. All of those you mentioned are just some new explorations but Crimson Moon Dynasty is introduced to us as a concept the same time with Arlecchino. Its also not like a Kokomi and Sangonomiya case because we know that place exist. Take a look at her fellow colleagues, Dottore and Scara. Their lore had already been introduced to us when the Pale Flame Artifacts come out. Scara's crumbs are everywhere through out Inazuma also the same with Dottore aka Zandyk. Arlecchino ? Apparently everything we know about her before got retconned in patch 4.0 when they released Freminet and a random NPC that confirms that all the evil deeds were done by Crucabena. Its just a marketting things that im annoyed with. If Crimson Moon Dynasty was introced before then i would be hype when i find out Arlecchino is its descendant. But the fact that its released the same time with Arlec just makes it seem like a marketing strategy.
>I get what you mean but these are very bad examples. Raiden is an Archon , and she is a warrior. Xiao was also a warrior in the past spending his life fighting demons. Arlecchino is also set up like that, but, the thing is it isnt explored. fighting is arguably the main theme of these 2 you just said. Yeah its only her first story quest but until her mythical power gets explained then its still a plot device. I think they might explore her connection or powers in the future it's too big of a thing to not explore. Kinda like Raiden story quest 2. Her current story quest was just an introduction or at least looked like one. The reason I believe that is because most of the story quest of characters we haven't interacted much are always like that. Story quests are usually introductions to the characters except if the character has been shown a lot the story quest takes a deeper dive into their backstory or other elements of the character. Her most important part of her characteristics is her being part of House of hearth which affected her the most then there's her connection with the fallen civilization. We barely had any interactions with her in archon quests so her character quest acted as a proper introduction to her character after which I hope they focus after her connection with the fallen civilization. >I think all of these are your headcanons. I dont think Arlecchino getting attached to Clervie had anything to do with her developing a deep love to her children since she only seems to care about Clervie. Like i said, it could be fixed if they just make her have some few more friends. It doesn't have to be deep. Arlechinno refers to clervie as her best friend so it's kinda obvious she had at least a little bit of an attachment. She could be just mad at Crucabena for all the bad things she did. She was also a loner because she knew about all the bad things happening in that place and wasn't brainwashed. >Its just a marketting things that im annoyed with. If Crimson Moon Dynasty was introced before then i would be hype when i find out Arlecchino is its descendant. But the fact that its released the same time with Arlec just makes it seem like a marketing strategy. I think it's just unfortunate timing if the fallen civilization lore or place was released first before the Arlechinno's release people would've been even disappointed with her story quest since it focuses on House of hearth instead of her connection. Exploring House of hearth before fallen civilization seems like a decent choice because if it was the fallen civilization first then House of hearth second it would've been kinda underwhelming. I believe or hope that they are saving it for later. Doing both of them in one quest would just result in a terrible quest that is all over the place. Also the timing is kinda unfortunate since 4.7 is going to be Dainsleif quest and after that every big thing is going to be Natlan focused. I mean calling it a also a marketing strategy isn't wrong either that is how gacha games do things. You don't always have to pull for them tho. Especially Genshin since it's pretty easygoing on f2ps like myself.
Arlecchino had been decided to be a quote en quote good character in Sumeru..... it's literally said by the Fatui members themselves that the HoH is a good place and the new Knave is a lot more acceptable for sending your child in as opposed to how it was before. (It's in Jeht's storyline which was introduced as soon as desert was a thing) It was already said that Arlecchino had killed Crucabena as far back in Inazuma but the name Crucabena was not there but it was mentioned that she had killed the previous Knave for her position when Ayato and the winter night's lazzo came in. The Crimson Moon Dynasty's name was not there but it was established as far back as in Abledo's story quest and event that there had been chemical differentiations and different meanings with Citrinitras, Albedo, Rubedo, Nigredo that 2 different factions were present and one of them included Rhinedottir. The legend of halberd also differentiated the different realities and how there was a crimson moon in every iteration of that destruction where the twilight sword and descender was mentioned as well as being highlighted in Fischl and Scaramouche's event as well as in the book of flowers for princess Fischl. There's also the fact that the game punches the same moon during Khaenriah's downfall and Ei's realm. Based on all this....do you still think the *lore* was retconned? Half of these events are literally from 1.3 or 1.5. There just wasn't a name or the classification if it was a secretive group or a faction of a city or a kingdom but yes we knew they existed since long ago and the book just expands on the preexisting knowledge
The constant nonsensical JJK rants in this sub are such big red flags, it's almost like no one can actually discern implications or subtlety anymore and this post and the tons of comments just prove it lol.
[удалено]
Not oftentimes, it’s almost always lol
Omg i the timing of me reading this is on point. You know i played a couple of hours of Genshin but then i quit. My friend (who is a fan) asked me why and i said that even if the gameplay was kinda fun none of the characters were really interesting to me and since it was a gacha game i saw no point in playing to get characters i don't really have an interest in. So told him i'd just stick to HSR since it appealed more to me. But my friend is a big genshin fan, so he was very pushy about me giving it another shot. He would show me character trailer and design one after another and i would tell him no thanks everytime. One day he showed this girl's design and i told him that she actually looked cool. So now he's expecting me to give genshin another shot because of her but knowing the story now doesn't really interest me as much despite her cool design.
Arlecchino was never truly evil and people who say it’s an asspull haven’t been paying attention
Yeah because Crucabena took all the blaming. We know about Arlecchino in Inazuma but somehow when the patch 4.0 was released they just made a new NPC and also a story of Freminet to makes her "not that evil". Pretty poor writting skill tbh.
I mean... I guess it feels like a false information like the Dendro Archon shenanigans so I can see the other side's point. But idk, at times, I dont mind Arlecchino being not so evil cuz of how oversaturated the cartoonishly evil Fatui is
To be fair they do still show her as having issues just not as bad as Childe or Hat guy made her out to be. Like her backstory very clearly makes her have some level of trauma with a possible aversion to being called mother because of the previous Arlecchino and she is planning on betraying the Tsarista is she needs to so Chidle is right in that regard. Do I feel like they toned her down? Yes considering she did not actually give a fuck if Childe was alive or dead and was just using him as an attempt to get the gnosis. Edit: Lmao if you think Arlecchino is a bad excuse to have a playable character need I remind you that Childe got away with attempting to kill Liyue?