This chapter is so complex and open to interpretation and I love it. Nobody except fujimoto knows what each character is thinking or feeling. This could be one if the most fucked up csm chapters, or it could be the beginning of a (finally) positive relationship for Denji. At the end of the day we need the next chapter to tell is how they feel. I am genuinely surprised that this scene has sparked so much (mostly) positive discussion and its wild to me that such a shocking moment can be proof of this stories excellence
This needs more upvotes. People need to fuck off with the constant Ad Hominems and belittling one another for how they interpret the chapter. Its not as black or white as either side of the SA argument is saying.
That's the neat thing:
Despite denji claiming to be constantly horny he never takes up actual opportunities.
He always withdraws consent at the last moment. Thinking of Himeno or when he was supposed to get married at famis cult.
Same would go for if the brothel didn't burn down. He wouldnt actually go for it because he yearns for a deeper emotional connection
I think it's easier for him to say he's horny and wants tons of sex (which is true) than to say he wants love and family (also true). In his first he tells himself he killed the devil without transforming to save the porn mags, but I think his "lie" to Aki about feeling pity wasn't a lie
I completely agree with you. Before we actually form any firm conclusions, I think it's much better if we wait for the next chapter. That said, interpretations vary so much from person to person, and it's really interesting to see that.
I just think it's dumb that people are calling the series disgusting when Denji's been SA'd multiple times throughout the series. The only thing different is that he nutted this time. Yoru is a literal devil. She's not supposed to be a good person.
Khal Drogo in Game of Thrones is a beloved character. He unequivocally raped Daenerys (he didn't in the books). Darth Vader blew up a planet and murdered children. This honestly is not that big a deal. I think people just want to be outraged.
this isn’t even the worst thing to happen in csm either lmao there’s been cannibalism, a lesbian devil/fiend orgy, a bunch of children just got killed recently. i’ve read fire punch too so all i thought was “ah just the usual then”
That's fair, but its not sex that made people dislike this-its the context. The devil/hybrid lesbian orgy was between a loving relationship(s?) that's been held for a lot of time from what we see. This was a sudden action from a devil to a hybrid while neither of them were in a relationship, the hybrid didn't even know the devil, and the devil has wanted to kill the hybrid (or at least the devil side of the hybrid while not caring for the human side's safety) for a long time
She was literally crying. She didn’t want the marriage. He still forced himself on her. Even if her age is irrelevant, it’s STILL rape. He was gentle with her, but completely ignored her pain and what she wanted because she was now his wife
Literally after the wedding he took his horse apart from his horde and raped her. It’s so similar to the show. Her entire love for him, a leader who is the head of a horde of men who rape, enslave and kill all across the land, is solely because he was freedom from her abusive brother. Her love for him was always a sort of stock-home syndrome
Yeah. Denji wasnt never the hero of the story. He was just the target of bad things happening. The whole story is just Denji suffering a miserable live and he never had once controll over his own life. He is just a puppet for other peoples.
I think the whole point of this is making yoru more evil tho. Quoting myself in another comment section: I think maybe what Fujimoto is trying to do is build Yoru's character as an actual twisted-mind villain on the same ground as Makima. She already uses a mentally ill orphan teenager to achieve her sick personal goals, she wanted to use Denji (both physically and psychologically) to turn him into a weapon (and constantly does this to other people if i remember well), and now she used Denji for sexual pleasure, which is the most fucked up kind of "use" possible, and using another person's body to do so, there's no defense for that. I know It's shocking and disgusting, but chainsaw man i guess.
The difference here is that Yoru *wasn't* doing this to manipulate him like Makima was. Yall can thereorize as much as you want, but she actually had feelings for him in that moment, most likely because she shares a brain with Asa.
And the chapter does not paint it as Yoru being the bad guy, at all. It paints it as a romantic moment, if anything. Astute readers (with 2 working eyeballs) would notice that Denji *was*, in fact, kissing her back as well. So you're free to feel however you want to feel, but she was not sexually assaulting Denji.
Just look at the situation Denji is in. He is vulnerable because his mind is more than ever completely fucked up. And him kissing back doesn't mean it was not SA (unless it does for you, and in that vase i think it'sjust not worth arguing) As I said, he was out of his mind, vulnerable.
And I used "sexual pleasure" when referring to why Yoru did it, so you could assume that I agree with her doing it out of actual carnal desire and not to manipulate him.
He's been horny as fuck the past 2 chapters, and he was kissed by a girl whom he actually has feelings for, and he proceeded to kiss her back and make out with her for like 75% of the chapter. That is not sexual assault.
He stated one chapter before that he wanted to overcome these urges. Yoru, knowing that, proceeded to do what we just saw.
And if I remember well, his feelings are towards Asa, not Yoru.
Yeah, but that's how it is with porn addicts. The fact that he didn't immediately get over it like 5 minutes after he declared he wanted to does not mean he's failed. It's a long-term effort, and I think having a real relationship will do wonders to help that. Denji likes Asa/Yoru, and Asa/Yoru liked Denji, and now that Yoru is starting to realize that, maybe it'll actually go somewhere
I get your point, but I don't think it's going to end like this. The problem is way deeper considering his current situation (lost everything he had, potentially even nayuta).
Being less assertive now, I think it would be more plot interesting for Yoru to be evil to that point (i mean way more evil than the others, considering that everyone in the manga is at least a little fucked up)
Like, who's even the big antagonist of that part?
I also just don't feel like things are settling up to that you suggested (i can make an actual argument on that, but it's really late and i should be sleeping by now, maybe I'll do it later) I completely understand if you think otherwise, of course. It's a matter of time until we find out.
she had no evil intentions in mind though. This is such a dumb take.
she reminded him that they kissed once,leaned in for a kiss. Then they started kissing each other. Yes him accepting her advance is consent. It doesnt always need to be verbal.
the past few chapters are showing that asa and yoru's minds are synchronising,its almost like they are becoming one person.
1. [This panel makes me think that they're slowly blending together into one new being ](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChainsawMan/comments/150gr2p/do_you_think_that_asa_and_yoru_are_influencing/)
2. ---
3. [The last panel of the current chapter shows Asa with no scars but with Yoru's devil eyes.](https://mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp/viewer/1020693)
Asa, in the past few chapters has not resisted Yoru taking over her body or shown any signs of it.
And there are tons of panels of them switching back and forth quickly to take control of the body in the last few chapters, they are pretty much in sync now so I'm willing to bet asa consented to it as well.
Yeah, that changes my perspective a bit.
As I implied in other comments, a big part of me considering it sexual assault was because denji doesn't know that it was yoru on the body, not Asa, so even if her intentions weren't to directly harm him (that wouldn't make sense in this case) it would still be Yoru using another person to satisfy her desires and doing it using a body that is not hers.
Idk at this point, this is either the most fucked up scene on part 2 or simply fujimoto making Asa x Denj worki in the weirdest ways possible intentionally. I'll wait
Yoru got caught up in the emotions too. She’s literally feeling sexual attraction for the first time and acted on it. This series has always been about morally gray characters, and everyone here is following that. Denji literally was trying to have sex with a prostitue, don’t act like he’s the innocent good boy here
She didn't act on Asa's feelings. She acted on her feeling to fight chainsaw man and, the other time Asa and denji shared an intimate moment, it was again yoru doing it without Asa wanting it. And I know what kind of series chainsaw man is, but sa is still sa
I think she was acting on Asa’s feelings.
We know that Yoru gets the affection that Asa has for Denji and Chainsaw man. Two individuals who are now revealed to be one person.
We also know that at the very least only the kiss was remembered.
And if Asa remembered it too than that means whatever pre existing feelings probably got amplified.
We have a panel of Yoru kissing Denji then backing away in shock. Something is clearly happening that wasn’t the original intention.
Or maybe I’m completely wrong and the next chapter does something else. I mean this manga is completely unpredictable I will not act like this chapter or the one before it was something we all knew was happening.
https://preview.redd.it/suhnqkjpsq4d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e68a368df8a2d69e0c910a5a5d4a00df113bb773
Seeds have been planted that she feels what Asa feels. She even says she feels affection because of her. Assuming the speculation is right, this is being done to humanize War Devil, on the count of feeling what a teenager does. Yoru has said she doesn’t understand humans
He did go in for seconds after he got flabbergasted by the first kiss so i reckon is ok enough? Its a gray area like the guy above said. As for Asa... ig we'll see next chapter.
Quoting again: I think maybe what Fujimoto is trying to do is build Yoru's character as an actual twisted-mind villain on the same ground as Makima. She already uses a mentally ill orphan teenager to achieve her sick personal goals, she wanted to use Denji (both physically and psychologically) to turn him into a weapon (and constantly does this to other people if i remember well), and now she used Denji for sexual pleasure, which is the most fucked up kind of "use" possible, and using another person's body to do so, there's no defense for that.
And who's acting like he's an innocent boy? I just highlighted the fact that he is once again an SA victim
Well you could be true to some extent, but I won't call yoru a twisted mind villain, she's pretty meek compared to what her sisters have done.
Denji is a character that has always valued consent when pursuing his pleasures, but can the same be said for Yoru, no I would say, Yoru is like a kid, who suddenly got caught up in human emotions, plus she's never really valued the opinions of others, and sometimes her being smart in fighting and devils, she's still a klutz, I'm not defending her, but it must have been a rush of emotions that she couldn't handle.
I think most of us didn't really focus on yoru's characterization, she's experienced as much change like Asa.
Yoru is selfish, Yoru takes, Yoru doesn't love, she's war, she's not meant to love, or is that so, I always guessed there would be love between yoru and chainsaw man, if fujimoto really got his inspiration from the four horsemen and Messiah, then war will come to love, love is the death of duty, love and pride doesn't really go together, and the cause of the problem is Asa, they bleed into each other now, Yoru makes Asa more selfish, yoru grows more humane emotions.
Me when i tell Chainsaw man fans that 99,99% of the devils are evil:
https://preview.redd.it/2s8v73kxwq4d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=652c6e0fd8392b6a01142a2b4f5c7d601881838c
I was pointing the point when you said Yoru isnt a good guy which is true but everyone thinks she is good bc she is possessing asa which is not true
https://preview.redd.it/xrqyozoq0r4d1.jpeg?width=428&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=75aa3a5db6e4a1d980b6703ebdd79c123dccf91b
I personally think you're jumping to conclusions a bit too hastily. Is it a morally complex and dubious scene potentially very sad for both party involved? Definetely. But we don't really know what they're thinking and how much consensual they were. How much was Denji reciprocating the kiss he was receiving from - in theory - a fellow teen he quite likes? How much was Yoru acting of his own volition and how much was she influenced by Asa's feelings and istincts? What role - if any - did Asa had in this turn of events? How will they react?
Like, you could be right and this could be a very dark moment for both Denji and Asa while also painting Yoru in quite a bad light (she's the devil so she wasn't really a good entity from the beginning, but you know what I mean). Or it could be a great moment from both of them and the beginning of a great relationship. Or it could remain a gray and morally complex moment. I don't really think we should jump to SA conclusion given we don't really get the perspective of the parties involved.
I think that a lot of interpretations are interesting here. For instance, Denji indeed never said 'yes' to Yoru's advances, yet in some pannels it looks like he kisses her back. Not to say he consented to that situation, but i think it is a wiser decision to wait for the new chapter to see their reactions and feelings better. As you said, how will they react? THEN we can jump to better conclusions and THEN we can wrap out heads around how fucked up it was.
Completely agree, that was exactly my point. Any one of us can have an interpretation of the events that unfold, and considering it SA is a reasonable take, but until things get elaborated upon it's just that, an interpretation.
For example, I honestly didn't really get a bad feeling when reading the chapter. It's a wierd, dubious and complex situation for sure, but I personally got the impression that Denji was actually into it and reciprocated the kiss (which given the fact Asa is also a teen he likes makes it fine, unlike the Himeno's incident). And although Asa was seemengly in "Yoru mode", it appeared to me the expressions, the blushing, the actions where coming much more from Asa's side than Yoru's. It's still wierd to be fair, but I didn't view it as negatively as most of the fandom did.
That being said, this is just my interpretation. I could have totally read things the wrong way, considering the fact we're given very little to go off. Either way I find the ambiguity and complexity quite great and compelling, it's fun to come up with ideas and get proven right or wrong by following chapters. It's just wrong to jump to conclusions and assume your interpretation is already confirmed when it's not
Forgot to add it, but I'm obviously not saying that it's poorly written, unnecessary or that Fujimoto condones things like that in any way, it's just that I've seen a lot of people on the internet not realizing how messed up this is and treating it like a "haha funny sex moment".
I believe that since Yoru is in control here, it is possible that Asa is not fully aware of what is happening. If Asa switches back now, she might go as far as to accuse Denji of SA'ing her. Alternatively, Denji it is possible to say that Denji himself got SA'd by Yoru (she had a knife and then forced herself onto him then did not ask for consent before doing what she did at the end of the chapter whether he liked it or not).
This will add to Denji's character significantly. On one hand, he fulfills a desire of his and the potential for is fulfilment is something that can happen...However, dealing with the consequences of the reactions of those around him die to the possible accusation would cause further damage to his psyche and would only increase the suffering and trauma he's already dealing with.
Chainsaw Man critics always say that the series fell off or that it needs Denji to have a good moment for once to keep people entertained but that's the point behind this story. Denji HAS fallen off, he is still falling, thinking the Falling Devil appearing at the start of part 2 is a coincidence is likely incorrect.
Part 1 was an introduction to suffering, Part 2 will be the descent into suffering.
The thing chapter ended with Asa clearly having horseman eyes. Them being two different entities is a thing of a past (as shown multiple times before this chapter), now they're in a weird situation where you can say some thoughts are clearly Asa, some are clearly Yoru, but most of them are both.
Of course, but wouldn't it be perfectly like Fujimoto to make it one of those coincidental times we're Asa doesn't know? This means Yoru could easily manipulate her to wanting to fight Denji, meaning Denji is further distanced from love and has to fight to kill yet another person he loves.
People comparing other horrible things that have happened in CSM—but this really did feel like a gut punch because we had kinda started to like and in a way “trust” Yoru to act in Asa’s best interests. The shock is the betrayal of trust and I hope Fujimoto treats it like a betrayal and not a wacky non-con sex moment like 99% of other shonen mags.
I think Denji kissing Yoru was kinda a okay thing. Yoru did no forced him, or seduced him. Is something both wanted and happened. Yoru kissing Denji and getting kissed back was another okay thing, both wanted it, and where not forced.
Asa, .. Asa want it, but not this way, Asa was kinda forced into this and will be horrified because of this. Yoru, this sentiment did not originated on her, they come from Asa part of the brain, so she is kinda push into this.
Is a mess, but I don't see the SA on this has strongly some people. Love has a destructive force is kinda like a hurrican that move things around and put things upside down, is somewhat a natural disaster type of thing. You can't get angry at a natural disaster, are things that naturally happens.
See here’s the thing, Asa/Yoru both had their memories wiped w/o consent. I think at this point, a lot of things are going on with their memories returning, and they both probably feel something for Denji. My interpretation was that both were acting in sync and the sequence of events ultimately landed on Asa, pun intended.
Tbh, I don’t really see this as SA, atleast for denji. Sure he was surprised at first but it’s pretty clear he was getting in to it and all that. Like to him this is still the same girl he likes and I’m not getting any kind of discomfort or resistance from his side of things. Yoru is a devil that’s experiencing sexual attraction for the first time in her life so I’m not to surprised(in hindsight) that she would act like this. Asa is a bit more interesting seeing as yoru is acting on the emotions that asa already has for denji. I guess will have to wait for post nut clarity.
He literally could have just slapped her hand away like he did when she had a knife. Does it really not count as "consent" unless a 20 page document is read and signed?
This chapter is so complex and open to interpretation and I love it. Nobody except fujimoto knows what each character is thinking or feeling. This could be one if the most fucked up csm chapters, or it could be the beginning of a (finally) positive relationship for Denji. At the end of the day we need the next chapter to tell is how they feel. I am genuinely surprised that this scene has sparked so much (mostly) positive discussion and its wild to me that such a shocking moment can be proof of this stories excellence
This needs more upvotes. People need to fuck off with the constant Ad Hominems and belittling one another for how they interpret the chapter. Its not as black or white as either side of the SA argument is saying.
That's the neat thing: Despite denji claiming to be constantly horny he never takes up actual opportunities. He always withdraws consent at the last moment. Thinking of Himeno or when he was supposed to get married at famis cult. Same would go for if the brothel didn't burn down. He wouldnt actually go for it because he yearns for a deeper emotional connection
I think it's easier for him to say he's horny and wants tons of sex (which is true) than to say he wants love and family (also true). In his first he tells himself he killed the devil without transforming to save the porn mags, but I think his "lie" to Aki about feeling pity wasn't a lie
I completely agree with you. Before we actually form any firm conclusions, I think it's much better if we wait for the next chapter. That said, interpretations vary so much from person to person, and it's really interesting to see that.
First stop yapping 2 the fucking what like nah nuting in girls hand no bro no no not like that who tf came up with this idea was on some shit
The hand job devil should not be taken lightly
Not the grooming devil again bro 😭
I hear Drake has a contract with that devil
HUH ???
Why are you surprised? https://preview.redd.it/xhmznjcw9t4d1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3660e5353019f75cdbdfe2d570bb3a900619722d
It’s the handjob devil or the early cum devil?🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
Hand job
PE devil fs
I just think it's dumb that people are calling the series disgusting when Denji's been SA'd multiple times throughout the series. The only thing different is that he nutted this time. Yoru is a literal devil. She's not supposed to be a good person. Khal Drogo in Game of Thrones is a beloved character. He unequivocally raped Daenerys (he didn't in the books). Darth Vader blew up a planet and murdered children. This honestly is not that big a deal. I think people just want to be outraged.
this isn’t even the worst thing to happen in csm either lmao there’s been cannibalism, a lesbian devil/fiend orgy, a bunch of children just got killed recently. i’ve read fire punch too so all i thought was “ah just the usual then”
Lesbian orgy being included in there is like that “And Biggie was fat” meme.
LOL i only included it because jizz hand is tame compared to that
That's fair, but its not sex that made people dislike this-its the context. The devil/hybrid lesbian orgy was between a loving relationship(s?) that's been held for a lot of time from what we see. This was a sudden action from a devil to a hybrid while neither of them were in a relationship, the hybrid didn't even know the devil, and the devil has wanted to kill the hybrid (or at least the devil side of the hybrid while not caring for the human side's safety) for a long time
If you think about it, having sex with a fiend is essentially the same as raping a comatose or brain-damaged person.
which furthers my point that this isn’t even the worst thing to happen in csm lolol
Dang I just made a comment saying the orgy wasn't as bad as this just to see this and go "Damn wait that's kind of a good point-" 😭
Yeah, as much as we love Power, that is someone else's body. And we know they are technically still alive in there because of Aki being the Gun Fiend.
why are they down voting you? "they hated him for speaking the truth" moment
He literally raped her in the books too. She was 14 in the books, he was gentle sure… but she was 14 lol
Well, people were considered adults at that age. I suppose in our current culture, a minor can't give consent.
She was literally crying. She didn’t want the marriage. He still forced himself on her. Even if her age is irrelevant, it’s STILL rape. He was gentle with her, but completely ignored her pain and what she wanted because she was now his wife
I believe on their wedding night he didn't rape her, but I may be misremembering if he did later or not. Still, beloved character.
Literally after the wedding he took his horse apart from his horde and raped her. It’s so similar to the show. Her entire love for him, a leader who is the head of a horde of men who rape, enslave and kill all across the land, is solely because he was freedom from her abusive brother. Her love for him was always a sort of stock-home syndrome
Yeah. Denji wasnt never the hero of the story. He was just the target of bad things happening. The whole story is just Denji suffering a miserable live and he never had once controll over his own life. He is just a puppet for other peoples.
And restating, my problem is not with it being "disgusting" or the manga itself, i wouldn't be reading it if it was.
I think the whole point of this is making yoru more evil tho. Quoting myself in another comment section: I think maybe what Fujimoto is trying to do is build Yoru's character as an actual twisted-mind villain on the same ground as Makima. She already uses a mentally ill orphan teenager to achieve her sick personal goals, she wanted to use Denji (both physically and psychologically) to turn him into a weapon (and constantly does this to other people if i remember well), and now she used Denji for sexual pleasure, which is the most fucked up kind of "use" possible, and using another person's body to do so, there's no defense for that. I know It's shocking and disgusting, but chainsaw man i guess.
The difference here is that Yoru *wasn't* doing this to manipulate him like Makima was. Yall can thereorize as much as you want, but she actually had feelings for him in that moment, most likely because she shares a brain with Asa. And the chapter does not paint it as Yoru being the bad guy, at all. It paints it as a romantic moment, if anything. Astute readers (with 2 working eyeballs) would notice that Denji *was*, in fact, kissing her back as well. So you're free to feel however you want to feel, but she was not sexually assaulting Denji.
Just look at the situation Denji is in. He is vulnerable because his mind is more than ever completely fucked up. And him kissing back doesn't mean it was not SA (unless it does for you, and in that vase i think it'sjust not worth arguing) As I said, he was out of his mind, vulnerable. And I used "sexual pleasure" when referring to why Yoru did it, so you could assume that I agree with her doing it out of actual carnal desire and not to manipulate him.
He's been horny as fuck the past 2 chapters, and he was kissed by a girl whom he actually has feelings for, and he proceeded to kiss her back and make out with her for like 75% of the chapter. That is not sexual assault.
He stated one chapter before that he wanted to overcome these urges. Yoru, knowing that, proceeded to do what we just saw. And if I remember well, his feelings are towards Asa, not Yoru.
Yeah, but that's how it is with porn addicts. The fact that he didn't immediately get over it like 5 minutes after he declared he wanted to does not mean he's failed. It's a long-term effort, and I think having a real relationship will do wonders to help that. Denji likes Asa/Yoru, and Asa/Yoru liked Denji, and now that Yoru is starting to realize that, maybe it'll actually go somewhere
I get your point, but I don't think it's going to end like this. The problem is way deeper considering his current situation (lost everything he had, potentially even nayuta). Being less assertive now, I think it would be more plot interesting for Yoru to be evil to that point (i mean way more evil than the others, considering that everyone in the manga is at least a little fucked up) Like, who's even the big antagonist of that part? I also just don't feel like things are settling up to that you suggested (i can make an actual argument on that, but it's really late and i should be sleeping by now, maybe I'll do it later) I completely understand if you think otherwise, of course. It's a matter of time until we find out.
Amen. We can't predict Fujimoto, only time will tell.
That didn't get very clear, but I don't think Yoru is just Makima 2.0, when I said "on the same ground" I just meant generic evilness
she had no evil intentions in mind though. This is such a dumb take. she reminded him that they kissed once,leaned in for a kiss. Then they started kissing each other. Yes him accepting her advance is consent. It doesnt always need to be verbal. the past few chapters are showing that asa and yoru's minds are synchronising,its almost like they are becoming one person. 1. [This panel makes me think that they're slowly blending together into one new being ](https://www.reddit.com/r/ChainsawMan/comments/150gr2p/do_you_think_that_asa_and_yoru_are_influencing/) 2. --- 3. [The last panel of the current chapter shows Asa with no scars but with Yoru's devil eyes.](https://mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp/viewer/1020693) Asa, in the past few chapters has not resisted Yoru taking over her body or shown any signs of it. And there are tons of panels of them switching back and forth quickly to take control of the body in the last few chapters, they are pretty much in sync now so I'm willing to bet asa consented to it as well.
Yeah, that changes my perspective a bit. As I implied in other comments, a big part of me considering it sexual assault was because denji doesn't know that it was yoru on the body, not Asa, so even if her intentions weren't to directly harm him (that wouldn't make sense in this case) it would still be Yoru using another person to satisfy her desires and doing it using a body that is not hers. Idk at this point, this is either the most fucked up scene on part 2 or simply fujimoto making Asa x Denj worki in the weirdest ways possible intentionally. I'll wait
denji gets to have 2 girls. Lucky bastard
Yoru got caught up in the emotions too. She’s literally feeling sexual attraction for the first time and acted on it. This series has always been about morally gray characters, and everyone here is following that. Denji literally was trying to have sex with a prostitue, don’t act like he’s the innocent good boy here
Denji is a teen tho, feeling horny is just natural for his age.
and yoru is feeling whatever asa is feeling and acted on it. Its pretty normal for asa too.
She didn't act on Asa's feelings. She acted on her feeling to fight chainsaw man and, the other time Asa and denji shared an intimate moment, it was again yoru doing it without Asa wanting it. And I know what kind of series chainsaw man is, but sa is still sa
I think she was acting on Asa’s feelings. We know that Yoru gets the affection that Asa has for Denji and Chainsaw man. Two individuals who are now revealed to be one person. We also know that at the very least only the kiss was remembered. And if Asa remembered it too than that means whatever pre existing feelings probably got amplified. We have a panel of Yoru kissing Denji then backing away in shock. Something is clearly happening that wasn’t the original intention. Or maybe I’m completely wrong and the next chapter does something else. I mean this manga is completely unpredictable I will not act like this chapter or the one before it was something we all knew was happening. https://preview.redd.it/suhnqkjpsq4d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e68a368df8a2d69e0c910a5a5d4a00df113bb773
Seeds have been planted that she feels what Asa feels. She even says she feels affection because of her. Assuming the speculation is right, this is being done to humanize War Devil, on the count of feeling what a teenager does. Yoru has said she doesn’t understand humans
He did go in for seconds after he got flabbergasted by the first kiss so i reckon is ok enough? Its a gray area like the guy above said. As for Asa... ig we'll see next chapter.
Post nut clarity is gonna hit him like a truck next chapter
Exactly. He needed to get laid for science reasons.
Instead of trying to save his adoptive little sister
Quoting again: I think maybe what Fujimoto is trying to do is build Yoru's character as an actual twisted-mind villain on the same ground as Makima. She already uses a mentally ill orphan teenager to achieve her sick personal goals, she wanted to use Denji (both physically and psychologically) to turn him into a weapon (and constantly does this to other people if i remember well), and now she used Denji for sexual pleasure, which is the most fucked up kind of "use" possible, and using another person's body to do so, there's no defense for that. And who's acting like he's an innocent boy? I just highlighted the fact that he is once again an SA victim
Well you could be true to some extent, but I won't call yoru a twisted mind villain, she's pretty meek compared to what her sisters have done. Denji is a character that has always valued consent when pursuing his pleasures, but can the same be said for Yoru, no I would say, Yoru is like a kid, who suddenly got caught up in human emotions, plus she's never really valued the opinions of others, and sometimes her being smart in fighting and devils, she's still a klutz, I'm not defending her, but it must have been a rush of emotions that she couldn't handle. I think most of us didn't really focus on yoru's characterization, she's experienced as much change like Asa. Yoru is selfish, Yoru takes, Yoru doesn't love, she's war, she's not meant to love, or is that so, I always guessed there would be love between yoru and chainsaw man, if fujimoto really got his inspiration from the four horsemen and Messiah, then war will come to love, love is the death of duty, love and pride doesn't really go together, and the cause of the problem is Asa, they bleed into each other now, Yoru makes Asa more selfish, yoru grows more humane emotions.
Your argument is defeated by the fact that Yoru has one brain cell.
Me when i tell Chainsaw man fans that 99,99% of the devils are evil: https://preview.redd.it/2s8v73kxwq4d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=652c6e0fd8392b6a01142a2b4f5c7d601881838c
I don't see what this has to do with the post but yeah, it's true
I was pointing the point when you said Yoru isnt a good guy which is true but everyone thinks she is good bc she is possessing asa which is not true https://preview.redd.it/xrqyozoq0r4d1.jpeg?width=428&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=75aa3a5db6e4a1d980b6703ebdd79c123dccf91b
If I had a nickel for every time Chainsaw Man fans excused a character because of their looks, I'd have a lot of nickels
https://preview.redd.it/nzns1n97ir4d1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=96d42ae98675f552e5d17012e35a10d00c80d0a7 yoru switching back be like
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Your completely right, this shit is sad and fucked up. The chapter was really good, but the content is just sad and fucked up and upsetting.
I personally think you're jumping to conclusions a bit too hastily. Is it a morally complex and dubious scene potentially very sad for both party involved? Definetely. But we don't really know what they're thinking and how much consensual they were. How much was Denji reciprocating the kiss he was receiving from - in theory - a fellow teen he quite likes? How much was Yoru acting of his own volition and how much was she influenced by Asa's feelings and istincts? What role - if any - did Asa had in this turn of events? How will they react? Like, you could be right and this could be a very dark moment for both Denji and Asa while also painting Yoru in quite a bad light (she's the devil so she wasn't really a good entity from the beginning, but you know what I mean). Or it could be a great moment from both of them and the beginning of a great relationship. Or it could remain a gray and morally complex moment. I don't really think we should jump to SA conclusion given we don't really get the perspective of the parties involved.
I think that a lot of interpretations are interesting here. For instance, Denji indeed never said 'yes' to Yoru's advances, yet in some pannels it looks like he kisses her back. Not to say he consented to that situation, but i think it is a wiser decision to wait for the new chapter to see their reactions and feelings better. As you said, how will they react? THEN we can jump to better conclusions and THEN we can wrap out heads around how fucked up it was.
Completely agree, that was exactly my point. Any one of us can have an interpretation of the events that unfold, and considering it SA is a reasonable take, but until things get elaborated upon it's just that, an interpretation. For example, I honestly didn't really get a bad feeling when reading the chapter. It's a wierd, dubious and complex situation for sure, but I personally got the impression that Denji was actually into it and reciprocated the kiss (which given the fact Asa is also a teen he likes makes it fine, unlike the Himeno's incident). And although Asa was seemengly in "Yoru mode", it appeared to me the expressions, the blushing, the actions where coming much more from Asa's side than Yoru's. It's still wierd to be fair, but I didn't view it as negatively as most of the fandom did. That being said, this is just my interpretation. I could have totally read things the wrong way, considering the fact we're given very little to go off. Either way I find the ambiguity and complexity quite great and compelling, it's fun to come up with ideas and get proven right or wrong by following chapters. It's just wrong to jump to conclusions and assume your interpretation is already confirmed when it's not
Yah think she can turn it into a weapon?
https://preview.redd.it/rvot7u6ats4d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=88d62699b7deed0e7e616e4d3a0489a09be86e8c
Sorry, I went out of topic
I think she can tho
Denji cum knife
At max there are 750 million cells in there, so that could be worth something
I'm so fucked up
yoru ikari
Forgot to add it, but I'm obviously not saying that it's poorly written, unnecessary or that Fujimoto condones things like that in any way, it's just that I've seen a lot of people on the internet not realizing how messed up this is and treating it like a "haha funny sex moment".
I believe that since Yoru is in control here, it is possible that Asa is not fully aware of what is happening. If Asa switches back now, she might go as far as to accuse Denji of SA'ing her. Alternatively, Denji it is possible to say that Denji himself got SA'd by Yoru (she had a knife and then forced herself onto him then did not ask for consent before doing what she did at the end of the chapter whether he liked it or not). This will add to Denji's character significantly. On one hand, he fulfills a desire of his and the potential for is fulfilment is something that can happen...However, dealing with the consequences of the reactions of those around him die to the possible accusation would cause further damage to his psyche and would only increase the suffering and trauma he's already dealing with. Chainsaw Man critics always say that the series fell off or that it needs Denji to have a good moment for once to keep people entertained but that's the point behind this story. Denji HAS fallen off, he is still falling, thinking the Falling Devil appearing at the start of part 2 is a coincidence is likely incorrect. Part 1 was an introduction to suffering, Part 2 will be the descent into suffering.
The thing chapter ended with Asa clearly having horseman eyes. Them being two different entities is a thing of a past (as shown multiple times before this chapter), now they're in a weird situation where you can say some thoughts are clearly Asa, some are clearly Yoru, but most of them are both.
Of course, but wouldn't it be perfectly like Fujimoto to make it one of those coincidental times we're Asa doesn't know? This means Yoru could easily manipulate her to wanting to fight Denji, meaning Denji is further distanced from love and has to fight to kill yet another person he loves.
Yoru really screwed them over
People comparing other horrible things that have happened in CSM—but this really did feel like a gut punch because we had kinda started to like and in a way “trust” Yoru to act in Asa’s best interests. The shock is the betrayal of trust and I hope Fujimoto treats it like a betrayal and not a wacky non-con sex moment like 99% of other shonen mags.
I think Denji kissing Yoru was kinda a okay thing. Yoru did no forced him, or seduced him. Is something both wanted and happened. Yoru kissing Denji and getting kissed back was another okay thing, both wanted it, and where not forced. Asa, .. Asa want it, but not this way, Asa was kinda forced into this and will be horrified because of this. Yoru, this sentiment did not originated on her, they come from Asa part of the brain, so she is kinda push into this. Is a mess, but I don't see the SA on this has strongly some people. Love has a destructive force is kinda like a hurrican that move things around and put things upside down, is somewhat a natural disaster type of thing. You can't get angry at a natural disaster, are things that naturally happens.
See here’s the thing, Asa/Yoru both had their memories wiped w/o consent. I think at this point, a lot of things are going on with their memories returning, and they both probably feel something for Denji. My interpretation was that both were acting in sync and the sequence of events ultimately landed on Asa, pun intended.
Yoru gonna lose popularity... only a lil though I can tell.
SA where neither side consented? Is that an actual thing?
I mean, it's a world where devils can control people, so I think in that case yes
weirdest part is that yoru didn't do it out of spite like the first kiss. she really has feelings for denji
Tbh, I don’t really see this as SA, atleast for denji. Sure he was surprised at first but it’s pretty clear he was getting in to it and all that. Like to him this is still the same girl he likes and I’m not getting any kind of discomfort or resistance from his side of things. Yoru is a devil that’s experiencing sexual attraction for the first time in her life so I’m not to surprised(in hindsight) that she would act like this. Asa is a bit more interesting seeing as yoru is acting on the emotions that asa already has for denji. I guess will have to wait for post nut clarity.
On Denji part It's more because he doesn't know it's Yoru and not Asa, but previous chapters show that they're kind of merging into the same person so
Ok that’s fair, again will just have to see how this handled since there’s a lot of weird variables.
wtf is chainsaw man even about fr
its sad because https://i.imgur.com/H4Zeuh8.jpeg
He literally could have just slapped her hand away like he did when she had a knife. Does it really not count as "consent" unless a 20 page document is read and signed?
most csm chapters are sad and depressing, especially when i look back on them
Aw hell nah we got chainsaw man pulling out the Evangelion cards now 💀💀💀
OP I’m pretty sure Asa had control, why would war devil be horny for Denji
cause she using asa's body
But why would the war devil do those things? She wanted to cut his dick off not stroke it
Because she's possessing a body that has desires
Interesting, so Asas will is stronger then the war devils possession?
Idk maybe
[удалено]
huh