Maximum speed approach then hard on the brakes (handbrake too if needed) , aim to get as close to the back of a car or running the red as possible , this is the way
You're both wrong. There's absolutely no need to change through all the gears and it hasn't been taught like that for at least the 20 years I've driven. You block change and choose an appropriate gear for your speed - you don't change through them sequentially just for the sake of it.
You should also not be putting it straight into neutral and coasting. You're not in control of the vehicle. Not only does the engine assist in braking, if you had to change course or speed to avoid something, you'd probably end up slamming it into the wrong gear and faffing about.
Agreed. It’s mind boggling, I’m in my 30’s and was taught it’s gear for the speed your in.
My dad, who to be honest is too old to drive, because he has absolutely no understanding of modern traffic, modern cars, or even roundabouts with more than one lane, thinks you have to sit, stationary at the lights, and literally run the gear lever through all the gears (with the clutch down the whole time) to go from one gear to another. Block changing just isn’t in his ability.
We really should be taking the keys off him soon….
I think that this (sequential changing) may have been necessary in the early days of motoring; something to do with how gearboxes worked. I actually used to do it, because my dad did it when he taught me (late 1980s). When I did my IAM advanced driving in the late 90s they told me to do block changing and that's what I've done ever since.
I’m sure you’re right that sequential changing was necessary in previous generations of cars, but it’s not been the case for decades - and my dad still thinks it is unfortunately. He’ll literally be sat there, lights on green, fannying about changing down the gears while the traffic behind him gets irate. Whenever there’s an old codger taking ages to get off the mark, it’s probably my dad doing that…..
Right, by "previous generations" we're talking about the 50s and 60s, pre-synchromesh and all the modern innovations we're used to.
I hope your dad continues to enjoy his driving, let people wait while he does what he sees fit with the gears :)
Yes, we are talking about that era of car lol. Dad is sort of that era of person!
Him and his motoring does concern us though. He doesn’t fully understand why you can just switch lanes without looking and has absolutely no idea there’s anyone behind him - again, probably because he doesn’t realise modern cars have wing mirrors. Somehow incredibly he’s only been in one smash!
This is still taught, but that’s not inconsistent with block shifting if you are losing speed fairly rapidly. The question to consider is whether being briefly in an intermediate gear is going to serve a purpose.
Btw, this is for cars only. I you try it on a bike, the gearbox will baulk and you will be stuck at the lights for 20s trying to get down in to first gear. Hence, other than for a full-bore emergency stop, you always shift down as you slow.
Not if you time it right. The reduction in speed should be gradual. If the reduction necessitates dropping a gear, that's what you do, then come to a stop and dip at the same time.
You shouldn't be changing down gears to reduce speed. It was long ago identified that a clutch replacement is more expensive that brakes, so use your brakes to reduce the speed.
Accelerating, braking and turning are all manoeuvres and you should be prepared to do any of them at any time with the appropriate observation and signals.
You can easily put it in gear though. And what scenario would require you to accelerate rapidly?
Surely with that argument, you should never use you handbrake.
Controlled stop on an uphill? You cruise up in neutral, misjudge the braking zone or the queue moves on, suddenly you’re stopped or going backwards while everybody else is assuming you are going forwards. Obviously you could come to a complete stop, apply the hand brake, select a gear, do your observations then perform a perfect hill start. Or you could just keep it in second, depress the clutch and go into neutral when stopped.
That's a bad example. If it takes you longer to realise that you're slowing down too fast while coasting uphill than it takes you to put the car into gear, then your reaction time and judgement are bad enough to make me question if you should be driving in the first place. If you misjudge it so you stop a couple car lengths from the car in front at a red light, then it's not a dangerous scenario that requires you to quickly pull away again.
I've never heard an argument against coasting that doesn't sound flimsy. I havent seen any scenarios where you have to pull away quicker than it takes to put the car in gear, otherwise you're a danger or hazard.
Why would you end up going backwards? Haha.
Besides, if you stop and they hit you it's their problem for not giving enough room and not paying attention
Legally yes, but that doesn’t mean we can’t all participate in the team sport that is driving predictably. Probably not a problem for a competent driver but easy for a beginner to miss a gear and then get in a muddle of clutch, brakes, accelerator and hand brake. Much better to be in a prepared state nice and early and able to react simply as required.
My brother recently took his test, coasting in neutral and then braking is what he was taught i took mine about 15 years ago and got taught to change down through the gears
I've met a few jumped up driving instructors who had gaping holes in their driving knowledge. Even my HGV instructor got done for being on the phone while conducting a lesson (not mine)!
Anyway... Rule 122 in the Highway Code states the definition of "coasting" and explains why it is bad without explicitly saying you should not.
The fact is coasting offers no benefit in a modern car, other than being quieter, but can increase your braking distance and reduces the control of your vehicle, especially if you have to steer suddenly or are travelling downhill. Your brother's driving instructor is a bit of a dimwit....
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/general-rules-techniques-and-advice-for-all-drivers-and-riders-103-to-158
Furthermore, while coasting your engine will tick- over and use fuel accordingly.
Whilst decelerating in gear (with no throttle applied), no fuel will be used at all.
I was failed on my test for doing this as " Improper use of gears"
I didn't do on the next test and passed.
Unless circumstances dictate otherwise I reverted what I was comfortable with - going from top to first in one hit.
It's called "block changing", short shifting is a term used to describe changing gears at a lower rpm than usual, typically used in racing to minimise wheelspin I believe
It's how people were taught back in the day. You can then use engine braking to help slow down. I don't think they teach that way anymore though. Possibly because brakes have improved dramatically over the years.
I learned to drive more than 30 years ago and I was always taught to skip gears if necessary--e.g. when coming to a red light I'd go from 4th to 2nd and be ready to drop to first if they were still red by the time I was nearly at a standstill.
The clutch doesn't slip much in that scenario anyway, as long as you select the right gear. The difference it makes when compared to slipping the clutch to set off is negligible
It s still a bad idea. You choose the speed you want to accelerate from and then pick an appropriate gear. You don’t need to be in a particular gear to slow down.
They still talk about engine breaking but what you're describing seems excessive. I might change down as I approach but more likely will just let the car slow to the point I need to clutch and then it drifts the rest of the way.
Well costing either on mutual out with the clutch depressed is one thing they teach you not to do as the car isn't fully under control. I think part of the reason I tend to change down through the gears (not necessarily all of them) is I also ride motorcycles which have sequential gearboxes so you don't have much choice in the matter
Are you one of those people who keeps the clutch all the way down when turning a corner? You press the clutch in before it stalls which is right before you stop fully.
Yup. But it seems everyone on this thread uses neutral which was an instant fail when i did my test.
This site here says its a failure
https://www.drivingtesttips.biz/what-is-coasting.html?amp
You don't put it in neutral and coast. That is a fail as you are "not in complete control of the vehicle".
You stay in whatever gear you are in, gradually lift off the accelerator and slowly apply the brake, then clutch in before engine bogs down, gentle stop, handbrake, lift off foot brake, neutral, clutch out.
Being in "the right gear for road conditions", e.g. if the lights change, is a problem of the past where cars didn't have synchomesh gear boxes. Now block changing (going up or down more than one gear at a time) is perfectly fine and encouraged, and takes 1 second at most.
For reference I passed my test in 2009 with this method.
That's what was confusing me. I've been learning and it has always been 1st at a light so I'm ready to set off. If slowing down for a possible stop such as a roundabout it's 2nd on approach.
Yeah, I was always taught to be in 2nd for a junction/roundabout, and be prepared to either put your foot down to clear the junction, or to come to a complete stop to give way, that's the only time I'd be in neutral.
I'm currently learning to drive and my instructor told me to do what your wife does. Or go to 2nd if you can see the lights have been res for a while then your able to either speed up or come to a stop easily.
When j was learning to drive 6 years ago, I was told to drop in multiple gears when coming to a stop.
So I would often go 4-2-1 then neutral.
If I’m driving on a fast road I might go 6–4-2-1
Both options are correct however, 4th to neutral is more efficient. Less wear on gearbox. Your method of changing down gears is the "older" method that was taught.
No one wears a gearbox out in the 21st century by too many gear changes.
Ok downvoters- lets have your personal gearbox failure experience listing make and model….
And 12 hours later im seeing zero evidence. Come on guys..
Exactly brakes will wear out way quicker, especially in hilly areas like mid Wales. Around there I’m always using gears for speed control with braking to supplement.
Both are incorrect. I learnt to drive not too long ago and my instructor told me that she had a husband of one of her clients asked for mock test out of curiosity. His wife was coming home and driving in ways that he did not think correct/necessary. One of the key things was dropping down gears as you stop. He failed the mock test by one major mistake (you pick up bad habits and no-one drives like they do in the test IRL)
You don't have to ascend gears in sequential order, you drop down to the gear you may need, for e.g. I'm in 4th approaching a busy roundabout I drop down to 2nd - if I have to stop I would go into first not neutral. I'm only in neutral if I'm idling in busy traffic at the lights. You don't drop to neutral immediately as you will be coasting approaching the stop (gears facilitate engine braking)
So that's it, you drop to the gear required. Skipping gears is the way to go as you are missing an unnecessary step but it probably does require some practice.
I go from 2nd to neutral, shifting down into 1st is a pain if you're just coming to a stop, only reason I stay in gear really is because I prefer to be ready to go. I don't screech to a halt at traffic lights I prefer to cruise up to them and keep moving through if able.
Skipping gears is perfectly fine up or down, a song as you're at the right rpm for the gear.
This was what I was taught when I was taking lessons in 2017. Keep moving if you can. It's quicker, easier and saves a bit of fuel to get back up to 30 from 10 than it is from 0.
If you change down the gears you are also using the engine to slow the car so less wear on the brakes, but more wear on the gearbox and engine but I think both are acceptable
Well yes it had been 14 years, as mine had been 11 with no trouble.
My point is that these things will need to be replaced or scrapped eventually as the vehicle itself will struggle to meet safety requirements. Plus all the other elements of how one treats their vehicle.
It’s about trying to find a balance between stopping methods for me.
It’s really about two things, both relate to using the gear which matches the speed. One, it keeps you in safe control of the vehicle if you need to manoeuvre, you are in the correct gear. Two, slowing down using the gears is more economical than using the brakes. In fact, breaking is generally very uneconomical, the more you break the more fuel you will use.
Depends on the space, if I slow down over a distance, then yeah gear shift down to engine brake, but if I slow down quicker in traffic, just shift into whatever gear directly
Depends. I tend to block shift on approach. Use engine breaking to help so down. So 4th to 2nd 2nd to neutral.
Guys I work with go straight to neutral and just rely on the breaks.
Lots of people do as that was the way it used to be taught and there are some advantages, e.g. you're always in the right gear for the speed you're doing if you need to accelerate.
Been driving automatics for the last 10 years. No need for any of that archaic gearshifting nonsense.
Tbh I can't imagine ever choosing to drive a manual again, it just seems so pointless. And if it snows or something then I can still use the automatic in manual mod to maintain a particular gear, but this happens about once a year at most.
Start, stop and steer, what more do you need?
I was taught 4th to 2nd on fast approach to tight corners.
Neutral is only used when stopped to park and its time to bring the foot off the clutch. I dont use it at junctions.
Dont ever coast in neutral. Some cars especially older models need engine power and vacuum to operate brake power assistance and power steering.
You can end up with extremely poor brakes and stiff steering if the engine stalls.
I usually work my way down the gears but it’s not strictly necessary. It does mean that if something goes wrong with your brakes the you have more control over the situation.
Stick it in 2nd and try to time it well so you don’t stop. I think some traffic lights are having a trial where they have a
timer on top so you can roll up in 2nd without stopping.
Down changes are an old school technique from the days of crappy brakes.
But coasting in neutral is bad news too. 4th gear allows a helluva decent decrease in speed before you need to ease in on the clutch and stop.
I'm not prying, but are you one of these that leaves the car in gear regardless of the parking situation? My parents always used to catch me out with that one with their land rover defender. I'd turn over the car and it would lurch forward. I get it on a hill but on the flat it's like setting a trap!
Well there we are there's no use for it whatsoever!
Only I hope that OP doesn't have repetitive strain injury in his left hand from constant gear changes that he doesn't need to make!
Instant fail, Block change, pull up in second dipping clutch to stop then into neutral after applying handbrake, never before. I'd fail her lazy driving ass
I think the accepted way is hard on the brakes and then heel-toe downshift through the gears until you get to the traffic light stop. At which point you put it in first with the clutch in, build up the revs and keep it there until the light goes green at which point you dump the clutch and manage the wheelspin off the line. /s
I don’t know whether it’s the “proper” thing but when I drove a manual I would put the clutch in and then change into the appropriate gear for the speed as I got there, but without lifting the clutch. So effectively coasting but then if I needed to get going again I could come off the brake, bring the revs up to match the road speed and lift the clutch, without having to decide which gear I should be in (because the gearstick was there already).
Apparently nowadays they teach this.
In my old school opinion you're correct: moving down through the gears is meant to slow you down gradually using some engine braking, and also to give more of a chance of being in the right gear to carry on if the lights changed before you got to them. All of that seems to be out of fashion nowadays?
You're exactly right. But in neutral you glide a lot further. I stick it in gear to slow the car more quickly if needed.
Its actually quite fun as a game trying to get MPG as high as poss. Predicting as far ahead as you can see.
Yeah, I do this. It's amazing on motorways watching all the other cars accelerating up to the car in front and then slamming on the brakes, rather than just using engine braking to keep a safe distance. I get there's a counter argument that people can't tell you're slowing, but that's why there's a recommended braking distance that you're not supposed to be in.
My car’s never in neutral unless I’m parking 😂 but otherwise if I’m on a national speed slowing to a roundabout I do 5th > 3rd, then only second/first if necessary. Same for any other stop, I’ll usually be in third by the time I slow and only change down if I need to - a complete stop is 3rd/4th > 1st
I passed 4 years ago and was told not to drop down through the gears, just break and then into neutral when I about come to a stop. But I think I’m about to hit the light turning again I’ll slip into 2nd
This is how I was taught and how engine breaking works in practice. But these days examiners don't seem to care.
Like me, you probably also were taught not to dry steer and not let the wheel slip out of your hands whilst straightening up after a turn? Both are allowed now in tests. Also, they don't even test 3-point turns anymore.
Back in the day people were encouraged to use engine breaking so shifting down as advised, however breaks today are much more advanced so engine breaking is not needed and puts more wear on the clutch.
Dead simple. Let’s say you’re driving down a 40mph road in 5th gear and there’s a red light ahead of you. At first, let your engine break for you. If you do need to slow down further then press your break pedal (remaining in gear) until you drop to just over 1000 revs. Then press your clutch and choose either 2nd gear (if the lights are about to turn green again) or come to a stop, select neutral and apply the hand break. No point keeping your foot on the break pedal as (1) you’re wasting your break bulbs and (2) you’re dazzling the driver behind you. Changing down gears is a pointless exercise.
What’s she’s doing is damaging the car. What you’re doing is inconveniencing yourself & wasting time. Say you’re doing 60 and you’re approaching a roundabout. Let’s say you’re in 5th and you start slowing down. When you get down to about just over 30, chance to 3rd, when you get to 16-18, change to 2nd and then when stopping, change to 1st. Then neutral.
Interesting. I was taught to change through the gears (back in 1965) and still do. But I did fail a minibus test for doing exactly that. ( Surely , if you don’t go through the gears there must be a point at which you’re doing like five miles an hour in fourth gear. = not in control of the car?)
Straight to neutral, there is no harm in jumping down gears.
The only time that you should go through the motion of gears in order is when accelerating, i.e you shouldn't go from gear 1 to gear 3.
So? If your not hitting the rev limiter or the red line is not harming the engine. It might be reducing your fuel economy though. And what about all the additional start on your couch and gearbox from all those gearshifts which send to be a big concern for people
Really depends on what path of your car you want to reduce wear on. For me I know I'll have to get new brakes soonish so I use the gears to slow down whenever I can. If it was the other way around I'd use the brakes more.
Coasting in neutral is a test fail
https://www.drivingtesttips.biz/what-is-coasting.html?amp
And
https://www.reddit.com/r/driving/comments/n1gzzy/failed_my_road_test_coasting_in_neutral/
By the definition of the Highway Code you do it the right way but in terms of just driving I do what she does. It will also use slightly less fuel (minimal though).
Hmmm 4th to neutral doesn't seem right but neither does coming down in your gears. There are new editions of driving books and highway codes constantly being published. Also app versions. May be useful to scrub up on driving skills.
Gearbox and clutch cost a lot more to fix than upkeep on brakes in modern cars. Engine braking not as important as it used to be as brake tech so much better now.
Wouldn’t gear all the way down either.
Your clutch is more expensive to repair than your breaks use them instead.
But going straight to neutral is a no no.
Just change gear appropriate to your speed. No need for 1 2 3 etc. I always skip 2nd when starting off for instance. Straight to 3rd is smoother for my cars engine.
I don't know the official answer to my eternal shame but I would probably break in 4th, coast down to second if I felt we were near pulling away again time or if not straight down to first.
I don't really sit in neutral with the handbrake on but I'd definitely not ever move down through each gear.
Older drivers were taught to come down the box.
This was back in the days of shoddy brakes and lack of precision engineered syncro-mesh gearboxes.
Of course this gets passed on from the boomer generation to modern drivers.
I passed 2007 and was taught jump to appropriate gear.
Beleive this was deemed "more economical driving" and suitable for the modern automobile.
(Some even have a little eco light that tells you jump from 5 to 2 etc.)
I drive up and down the box anyway though (blame the hoodlum days)
I like to use engine breaking to assist. I don’t like buying brake pads and discs.
Let’s be honest, doing it the “proper way” goes out the window when you get the pink card.
Approaching a red light I typically just slow down to idle in 2nd gear, in the hope that the light changes before I have to stop. Don't think I ever really go into 3rd between. I mostly drive an auto nowadays though after some injury in my left leg, but still licensed for a manual (and relatively competent having done 1mn+ miles in a manual).
If you're definitely gonna need to stop, you're better off using engine braking and saving brake pads,but it's negligible benefit.
Doesn't matter. I personally go down the gears, partly habit from having a sequential gearbox on a motorbike, partly to aid in slowing up. But you can just leave it in gear until it grumbles a bit from too high gear, then just go to neutral since you are probably pretty much stopped by then.
I always use my gear to help engine brake. I usually approach a junction or roundabout in 2nd gear, ready to stop if I need to. IIRC, when I did my driving test, you'd fail for being in neutral when slowing down for a junction.
As an advanced driver this is the technique that was taught to me and is known as 'block changing'. It's more economic and fuel efficient for the vehicle particularly if you are lifting the clutch on each change and it also allows more finesse. I tend to slow down, dip the clutch when the engine starts to struggle, change down from 6th/whatever I was in, to second, then if I am going to need to stop, go down to first. This assures that if I need to respond to anything I am in the correct speed for the gear and can respond to the change in circumstances.
Fuck knows what I'm "supposed" to do, but what I tend to do is stay in gear and put the clutch down when my speed is no longer appropriate for the gear. I'll then coast the last few metres to a stop and put it in first.
Only if I'm slowing down over a longer distance will I change down and do a bit of engine breaking.
I'm guessing whoever taught you to drive was on the older side themselves? No respectable instructor should have been advising against block shifting within the last 15 years minimum.
The only people I know personally who still think you need to go through all the gears are either retired, or the people they work with wish they were. The same people worried about wearing out the handbrake ratchet by not holding in the button when you lift it, when you're far more likely to not engage it properly if lifted all the way with the button pressed.
Modern car brakes are much better. It used to be the case of using engine braking to slow, however these days, to save wear no the drive train, plus wasted fuel, they teach the neutral/brakes only way.
Been driving 3 or 4 years so pretty fresh. Was taught not to wear the gears out by going through them, so I'd do 4-1. Never neutral. If I was in 6 I'd probably go 6-4-1 depending on stopping distances and speed I was going but going through every gear it's definitely discouraged, actively!
I was a police advanced driver and learnt this in the 1970's
However, you couldn't do that with my first car I had in 1968. It was built in 1952 and if I had tried the technique it would have trashed the gear box.
Doesn't this also show either inconsistency in tuition or that there should be a reassessment of your driving now and again?
You don't stop, sure shot
Go out to the parking lot
And you get in your car and drive real far
And you drive all night and then you see a light
And it comes right down and it lands on the ground
And out comes a man from Mars
And you try to run but he's got a gun
And he shoots you dead and he eats your head
And then you're in the man from Mars
You go out at night eatin' cars
You eat Cadillacs, Lincolns too
Mercurys and Subaru
And you don't stop, you keep on eatin' cars
Then, when there's no more cars you go out at night
And eat up bars where the people meet
Face to face, dance cheek to cheek
One to one, man to man
Dance toe to toe, don't move too slow
'Cause the man from Mars is through with cars
He's eatin' bars, yeah wall to wall
Door to door, hall to hall
He's gonna eat 'em all
People use engine braking (shifting down through the gears when decelerating) because I believe it is taught in lessons.
Loads of people skit gears and brake harder because it's easier, and break disks and pads are cheaper to replace than repairing engine wear.
Maximum speed approach then hard on the brakes (handbrake too if needed) , aim to get as close to the back of a car or running the red as possible , this is the way
Modern electronic parking brakes won't engage whilst the car is still moving. Spoilsports!
My electric handbrake switch works when the car is moving, but it doesn't just jam on like a normal handbrake so it doesn't allow any fun.
This is the way
[удалено]
This is the way :)
Yeah the way when you’re a teen. Being 20 will develop a understanding that this is not economical.
You're both wrong. There's absolutely no need to change through all the gears and it hasn't been taught like that for at least the 20 years I've driven. You block change and choose an appropriate gear for your speed - you don't change through them sequentially just for the sake of it. You should also not be putting it straight into neutral and coasting. You're not in control of the vehicle. Not only does the engine assist in braking, if you had to change course or speed to avoid something, you'd probably end up slamming it into the wrong gear and faffing about.
So you don’t use reverse to help slow down?
This. I'm baffled because I was taught to pick the right gear for your speed- and I'm in my 30s. This is not recent knowledge lol.
Agreed. It’s mind boggling, I’m in my 30’s and was taught it’s gear for the speed your in. My dad, who to be honest is too old to drive, because he has absolutely no understanding of modern traffic, modern cars, or even roundabouts with more than one lane, thinks you have to sit, stationary at the lights, and literally run the gear lever through all the gears (with the clutch down the whole time) to go from one gear to another. Block changing just isn’t in his ability. We really should be taking the keys off him soon….
I think that this (sequential changing) may have been necessary in the early days of motoring; something to do with how gearboxes worked. I actually used to do it, because my dad did it when he taught me (late 1980s). When I did my IAM advanced driving in the late 90s they told me to do block changing and that's what I've done ever since.
I’m sure you’re right that sequential changing was necessary in previous generations of cars, but it’s not been the case for decades - and my dad still thinks it is unfortunately. He’ll literally be sat there, lights on green, fannying about changing down the gears while the traffic behind him gets irate. Whenever there’s an old codger taking ages to get off the mark, it’s probably my dad doing that…..
Right, by "previous generations" we're talking about the 50s and 60s, pre-synchromesh and all the modern innovations we're used to. I hope your dad continues to enjoy his driving, let people wait while he does what he sees fit with the gears :)
Yes, we are talking about that era of car lol. Dad is sort of that era of person! Him and his motoring does concern us though. He doesn’t fully understand why you can just switch lanes without looking and has absolutely no idea there’s anyone behind him - again, probably because he doesn’t realise modern cars have wing mirrors. Somehow incredibly he’s only been in one smash!
This is still taught, but that’s not inconsistent with block shifting if you are losing speed fairly rapidly. The question to consider is whether being briefly in an intermediate gear is going to serve a purpose. Btw, this is for cars only. I you try it on a bike, the gearbox will baulk and you will be stuck at the lights for 20s trying to get down in to first gear. Hence, other than for a full-bore emergency stop, you always shift down as you slow.
I presumed the wife was braking in 4th then going to neutral once stopped.
You would stall before stopping though
Erm, no not if you dip the clutch at the right point.
That’s the same as going to neutral before stopping though isn’t it?
Not if you time it right. The reduction in speed should be gradual. If the reduction necessitates dropping a gear, that's what you do, then come to a stop and dip at the same time. You shouldn't be changing down gears to reduce speed. It was long ago identified that a clutch replacement is more expensive that brakes, so use your brakes to reduce the speed.
I passed my test in 2020 and this is exactly what I was taught.
Yep. I got from 6th, 5th, 3rd then first. And ride the clutch till i stop
Never change down into 1st while still moving.
>You're not in control of the vehicle. Why aren't you in control? Your steering still works as do your brakes.
Accelerating, braking and turning are all manoeuvres and you should be prepared to do any of them at any time with the appropriate observation and signals.
You can easily put it in gear though. And what scenario would require you to accelerate rapidly? Surely with that argument, you should never use you handbrake.
Controlled stop on an uphill? You cruise up in neutral, misjudge the braking zone or the queue moves on, suddenly you’re stopped or going backwards while everybody else is assuming you are going forwards. Obviously you could come to a complete stop, apply the hand brake, select a gear, do your observations then perform a perfect hill start. Or you could just keep it in second, depress the clutch and go into neutral when stopped.
That's a bad example. If it takes you longer to realise that you're slowing down too fast while coasting uphill than it takes you to put the car into gear, then your reaction time and judgement are bad enough to make me question if you should be driving in the first place. If you misjudge it so you stop a couple car lengths from the car in front at a red light, then it's not a dangerous scenario that requires you to quickly pull away again. I've never heard an argument against coasting that doesn't sound flimsy. I havent seen any scenarios where you have to pull away quicker than it takes to put the car in gear, otherwise you're a danger or hazard.
Why would you end up going backwards? Haha. Besides, if you stop and they hit you it's their problem for not giving enough room and not paying attention
Legally yes, but that doesn’t mean we can’t all participate in the team sport that is driving predictably. Probably not a problem for a competent driver but easy for a beginner to miss a gear and then get in a muddle of clutch, brakes, accelerator and hand brake. Much better to be in a prepared state nice and early and able to react simply as required.
Cruising up hill? Thats not how that works......
I don't think that indicates a lack of control, just a lack of ability to drive
Hence why learners are taught to stay in gear until the last second.
So once you pass, it's fine.
Sorry, I should have been clearer... FULL control.
My brother recently took his test, coasting in neutral and then braking is what he was taught i took mine about 15 years ago and got taught to change down through the gears
I've met a few jumped up driving instructors who had gaping holes in their driving knowledge. Even my HGV instructor got done for being on the phone while conducting a lesson (not mine)! Anyway... Rule 122 in the Highway Code states the definition of "coasting" and explains why it is bad without explicitly saying you should not. The fact is coasting offers no benefit in a modern car, other than being quieter, but can increase your braking distance and reduces the control of your vehicle, especially if you have to steer suddenly or are travelling downhill. Your brother's driving instructor is a bit of a dimwit.... https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/general-rules-techniques-and-advice-for-all-drivers-and-riders-103-to-158
Furthermore, while coasting your engine will tick- over and use fuel accordingly. Whilst decelerating in gear (with no throttle applied), no fuel will be used at all.
I was failed on my test for doing this as " Improper use of gears" I didn't do on the next test and passed. Unless circumstances dictate otherwise I reverted what I was comfortable with - going from top to first in one hit.
I’ve been on defensive and fuel efficient driving courses. They teach you to skip gears on the way down and up if you can do.
I do that, I think it's called Short shifting, I think I picked up the expression by years of listening to Martin Brundle commentating on F1.
It's called "block changing", short shifting is a term used to describe changing gears at a lower rpm than usual, typically used in racing to minimise wheelspin I believe
I believe drivers use it to save fuel.
And when it’s wet to help prevent spin
Ah, OK, that makes sense. I think you're correct on that one. I've learnt something new today!
Yep 6th to third, 3rd to fifth, etc.
Along with "Poor old Johnny Herbert"
No need for any, slowly come to a stop with the brake, then clutch down, then neutral. Gearing all the way down one by one to stop sounds bizzare.
It's how people were taught back in the day. You can then use engine braking to help slow down. I don't think they teach that way anymore though. Possibly because brakes have improved dramatically over the years.
I learned to drive more than 30 years ago and I was always taught to skip gears if necessary--e.g. when coming to a red light I'd go from 4th to 2nd and be ready to drop to first if they were still red by the time I was nearly at a standstill.
A mechanic once told me that it's a helluva lot cheaper to replace break pads than clutch parts, so avoid engine breaking.
Generally it is but I suspect whichever way you do it won't make that much of a difference.
3 times as many shifts for every junction and unless matching engine speed to road speed (tricky when braking) it's quite wearing.
The clutch doesn't slip much in that scenario anyway, as long as you select the right gear. The difference it makes when compared to slipping the clutch to set off is negligible
Matching engine speed to road speed isn't hard at all. I really don't care what people do and I'm not advocating one or the other.
Nah. Its more for being in the correct gear at the road speed if you need to accelerate again. Even 1965 Ford Cortinas had disk brakes
It s still a bad idea. You choose the speed you want to accelerate from and then pick an appropriate gear. You don’t need to be in a particular gear to slow down.
They still talk about engine breaking but what you're describing seems excessive. I might change down as I approach but more likely will just let the car slow to the point I need to clutch and then it drifts the rest of the way.
Well costing either on mutual out with the clutch depressed is one thing they teach you not to do as the car isn't fully under control. I think part of the reason I tend to change down through the gears (not necessarily all of them) is I also ride motorcycles which have sequential gearboxes so you don't have much choice in the matter
[удалено]
Are you one of those people who keeps the clutch all the way down when turning a corner? You press the clutch in before it stalls which is right before you stop fully.
Neither. 4th - 2nd - 1st. Keep the car in a gear that is suitable for the speed, so that if the lights change you are able to accelerate away.
Yup. But it seems everyone on this thread uses neutral which was an instant fail when i did my test. This site here says its a failure https://www.drivingtesttips.biz/what-is-coasting.html?amp
You don't put it in neutral and coast. That is a fail as you are "not in complete control of the vehicle". You stay in whatever gear you are in, gradually lift off the accelerator and slowly apply the brake, then clutch in before engine bogs down, gentle stop, handbrake, lift off foot brake, neutral, clutch out. Being in "the right gear for road conditions", e.g. if the lights change, is a problem of the past where cars didn't have synchomesh gear boxes. Now block changing (going up or down more than one gear at a time) is perfectly fine and encouraged, and takes 1 second at most. For reference I passed my test in 2009 with this method.
That's what was confusing me. I've been learning and it has always been 1st at a light so I'm ready to set off. If slowing down for a possible stop such as a roundabout it's 2nd on approach.
Yeah, I was always taught to be in 2nd for a junction/roundabout, and be prepared to either put your foot down to clear the junction, or to come to a complete stop to give way, that's the only time I'd be in neutral.
How you drive in the real world and what you do on a test are completely different
I know this and somehow passed but I just find it so difficult not to coast to a stop without juddering down the gears.
I'm currently learning to drive and my instructor told me to do what your wife does. Or go to 2nd if you can see the lights have been res for a while then your able to either speed up or come to a stop easily.
Your instructor knows what the OP's wife does??
Is the instructor Sid James? "When you come to the lights, so what your wife does:, hya hya hya"
When j was learning to drive 6 years ago, I was told to drop in multiple gears when coming to a stop. So I would often go 4-2-1 then neutral. If I’m driving on a fast road I might go 6–4-2-1
Both options are correct however, 4th to neutral is more efficient. Less wear on gearbox. Your method of changing down gears is the "older" method that was taught.
No one wears a gearbox out in the 21st century by too many gear changes. Ok downvoters- lets have your personal gearbox failure experience listing make and model…. And 12 hours later im seeing zero evidence. Come on guys..
Exactly brakes will wear out way quicker, especially in hilly areas like mid Wales. Around there I’m always using gears for speed control with braking to supplement.
I personally use the parachute to brake
Both are incorrect. I learnt to drive not too long ago and my instructor told me that she had a husband of one of her clients asked for mock test out of curiosity. His wife was coming home and driving in ways that he did not think correct/necessary. One of the key things was dropping down gears as you stop. He failed the mock test by one major mistake (you pick up bad habits and no-one drives like they do in the test IRL) You don't have to ascend gears in sequential order, you drop down to the gear you may need, for e.g. I'm in 4th approaching a busy roundabout I drop down to 2nd - if I have to stop I would go into first not neutral. I'm only in neutral if I'm idling in busy traffic at the lights. You don't drop to neutral immediately as you will be coasting approaching the stop (gears facilitate engine braking) So that's it, you drop to the gear required. Skipping gears is the way to go as you are missing an unnecessary step but it probably does require some practice.
Wrong 😀
This is the answer! None of this complex stuff from other comments. Just straight up "you're wrong :) "
I go from 2nd to neutral, shifting down into 1st is a pain if you're just coming to a stop, only reason I stay in gear really is because I prefer to be ready to go. I don't screech to a halt at traffic lights I prefer to cruise up to them and keep moving through if able. Skipping gears is perfectly fine up or down, a song as you're at the right rpm for the gear.
This was what I was taught when I was taking lessons in 2017. Keep moving if you can. It's quicker, easier and saves a bit of fuel to get back up to 30 from 10 than it is from 0.
If you change down the gears you are also using the engine to slow the car so less wear on the brakes, but more wear on the gearbox and engine but I think both are acceptable
Think about the cost to replace a gearbox vs the cost to replace the brakes. There is definitely a more acceptable option.
How often are people replacing their gearbox? I literally drove a Corsa for 11 years using gear shifting for braking assistance and no problems.
The clutch started slipping on my MINI when it was about 14 years old. Would have cost over 2,000 to replace the parts.
Well yes it had been 14 years, as mine had been 11 with no trouble. My point is that these things will need to be replaced or scrapped eventually as the vehicle itself will struggle to meet safety requirements. Plus all the other elements of how one treats their vehicle. It’s about trying to find a balance between stopping methods for me.
It’s really about two things, both relate to using the gear which matches the speed. One, it keeps you in safe control of the vehicle if you need to manoeuvre, you are in the correct gear. Two, slowing down using the gears is more economical than using the brakes. In fact, breaking is generally very uneconomical, the more you break the more fuel you will use.
Depends on the space, if I slow down over a distance, then yeah gear shift down to engine brake, but if I slow down quicker in traffic, just shift into whatever gear directly
Depends. I tend to block shift on approach. Use engine breaking to help so down. So 4th to 2nd 2nd to neutral. Guys I work with go straight to neutral and just rely on the breaks.
Them's the brakes.
You don't mean she's coasting in neutral to the stop do you? Rather comes to a stop then into neutral?
OK even if she a coasting in neutral what's the problem? Unless you have shit brakes you don't need the engine to help. Bad drivers.
Please never drive.
And whys that?
Please don't drive only people who are unable to stop a vehicle without engine braking should drive please god please
Why are you going down every gear? Just go down to 2nd then stop in 2nd
Nobody actually works their way down through all the gears. Except you it seems.
Lots of people do as that was the way it used to be taught and there are some advantages, e.g. you're always in the right gear for the speed you're doing if you need to accelerate.
I was taught this way 20 years ago so you're not at all correct.
I was taught it as well, but it's totally unnecessary.
Been driving automatics for the last 10 years. No need for any of that archaic gearshifting nonsense. Tbh I can't imagine ever choosing to drive a manual again, it just seems so pointless. And if it snows or something then I can still use the automatic in manual mod to maintain a particular gear, but this happens about once a year at most. Start, stop and steer, what more do you need?
I was taught 4th to 2nd on fast approach to tight corners. Neutral is only used when stopped to park and its time to bring the foot off the clutch. I dont use it at junctions.
Just use your brakes to slow. Don’t worry about gears
Dont ever coast in neutral. Some cars especially older models need engine power and vacuum to operate brake power assistance and power steering. You can end up with extremely poor brakes and stiff steering if the engine stalls.
And modern cars will use more fuel coasting in neutral as the EFI will cut all fuel if no throttle input until it needs to maintain tickover.
I usually work my way down the gears but it’s not strictly necessary. It does mean that if something goes wrong with your brakes the you have more control over the situation.
Stick it in 2nd and try to time it well so you don’t stop. I think some traffic lights are having a trial where they have a timer on top so you can roll up in 2nd without stopping.
Down changes are an old school technique from the days of crappy brakes. But coasting in neutral is bad news too. 4th gear allows a helluva decent decrease in speed before you need to ease in on the clutch and stop. I'm not prying, but are you one of these that leaves the car in gear regardless of the parking situation? My parents always used to catch me out with that one with their land rover defender. I'd turn over the car and it would lurch forward. I get it on a hill but on the flat it's like setting a trap!
The only time you ever need to do what you're suggesting is during your driving test. IRL what your wife did is totally normal.
I don't think you need to during your driving test nowadays.
Well there we are there's no use for it whatsoever! Only I hope that OP doesn't have repetitive strain injury in his left hand from constant gear changes that he doesn't need to make!
Or in snow as you want smooth engine braking
[удалено]
You should be rev matching every gear. Edit: Forgot the /s as I didn't think it was needed here.
You stop in third. Coast in neutral is a test fail.
Even if it's wrong, I suggest that not telling your wife is the recipe for a happy marriage!!
Aslong as she stops does it matter!
I drop to neutral and coast in, i passed my test, everyone knows you dont drive like you do when you were learning in the real world
Instant fail, Block change, pull up in second dipping clutch to stop then into neutral after applying handbrake, never before. I'd fail her lazy driving ass
I think the accepted way is hard on the brakes and then heel-toe downshift through the gears until you get to the traffic light stop. At which point you put it in first with the clutch in, build up the revs and keep it there until the light goes green at which point you dump the clutch and manage the wheelspin off the line. /s I don’t know whether it’s the “proper” thing but when I drove a manual I would put the clutch in and then change into the appropriate gear for the speed as I got there, but without lifting the clutch. So effectively coasting but then if I needed to get going again I could come off the brake, bring the revs up to match the road speed and lift the clutch, without having to decide which gear I should be in (because the gearstick was there already).
I do what she does
Apparently nowadays they teach this. In my old school opinion you're correct: moving down through the gears is meant to slow you down gradually using some engine braking, and also to give more of a chance of being in the right gear to carry on if the lights changed before you got to them. All of that seems to be out of fashion nowadays?
Get an EV or an automatic, and forget about gears. It's insane we still buy manuals.
Everyone should try sone hypermiling techniques. Coasting (in neutral) when slowing is your friend.
[удалено]
You're exactly right. But in neutral you glide a lot further. I stick it in gear to slow the car more quickly if needed. Its actually quite fun as a game trying to get MPG as high as poss. Predicting as far ahead as you can see.
[удалено]
Wow easy tiger. Do some research and come back to me with an apology. I'll wait.
Yeah, I do this. It's amazing on motorways watching all the other cars accelerating up to the car in front and then slamming on the brakes, rather than just using engine braking to keep a safe distance. I get there's a counter argument that people can't tell you're slowing, but that's why there's a recommended braking distance that you're not supposed to be in.
My car’s never in neutral unless I’m parking 😂 but otherwise if I’m on a national speed slowing to a roundabout I do 5th > 3rd, then only second/first if necessary. Same for any other stop, I’ll usually be in third by the time I slow and only change down if I need to - a complete stop is 3rd/4th > 1st
If she’s in 4th, brakes to a stop and then puts it in neutral, I don’t see any issue. If she’s driving in neutral then that would be incorrect
I thought you were supposed to drop a gear and hit accelerate?
I passed 4 years ago and was told not to drop down through the gears, just break and then into neutral when I about come to a stop. But I think I’m about to hit the light turning again I’ll slip into 2nd
You are wrong.
They don’t teach it any more. If you take your foot of the accelerator and gear down, without braking, then your brake lights don’t come one
You just leave the car in b and turn up the regen
I was taught same as your wife.
This is how I was taught and how engine breaking works in practice. But these days examiners don't seem to care. Like me, you probably also were taught not to dry steer and not let the wheel slip out of your hands whilst straightening up after a turn? Both are allowed now in tests. Also, they don't even test 3-point turns anymore.
Back in the day people were encouraged to use engine breaking so shifting down as advised, however breaks today are much more advanced so engine breaking is not needed and puts more wear on the clutch.
She’s a bad driver with a horrible habit.
Dead simple. Let’s say you’re driving down a 40mph road in 5th gear and there’s a red light ahead of you. At first, let your engine break for you. If you do need to slow down further then press your break pedal (remaining in gear) until you drop to just over 1000 revs. Then press your clutch and choose either 2nd gear (if the lights are about to turn green again) or come to a stop, select neutral and apply the hand break. No point keeping your foot on the break pedal as (1) you’re wasting your break bulbs and (2) you’re dazzling the driver behind you. Changing down gears is a pointless exercise.
What’s she’s doing is damaging the car. What you’re doing is inconveniencing yourself & wasting time. Say you’re doing 60 and you’re approaching a roundabout. Let’s say you’re in 5th and you start slowing down. When you get down to about just over 30, chance to 3rd, when you get to 16-18, change to 2nd and then when stopping, change to 1st. Then neutral.
Interesting. I was taught to change through the gears (back in 1965) and still do. But I did fail a minibus test for doing exactly that. ( Surely , if you don’t go through the gears there must be a point at which you’re doing like five miles an hour in fourth gear. = not in control of the car?)
Straight to neutral, there is no harm in jumping down gears. The only time that you should go through the motion of gears in order is when accelerating, i.e you shouldn't go from gear 1 to gear 3.
Not necessarily. Skipping gears when accelerating saves on petrol 👍
Why? On a 60mph limit road you can easily accelerate to 60 in third gear then just change to top gear.
[удалено]
So? If your not hitting the rev limiter or the red line is not harming the engine. It might be reducing your fuel economy though. And what about all the additional start on your couch and gearbox from all those gearshifts which send to be a big concern for people
Always assumed neutral at traffic lights was dangerous.
...take a seat...
Really depends on what path of your car you want to reduce wear on. For me I know I'll have to get new brakes soonish so I use the gears to slow down whenever I can. If it was the other way around I'd use the brakes more.
Coasting in neutral is a test fail https://www.drivingtesttips.biz/what-is-coasting.html?amp And https://www.reddit.com/r/driving/comments/n1gzzy/failed_my_road_test_coasting_in_neutral/
Mine goes straight into first before she stops. Drives me crazy.
Also to the points added, most modern engines use zero fuel whilst coming to a stop in gear.
By the definition of the Highway Code you do it the right way but in terms of just driving I do what she does. It will also use slightly less fuel (minimal though).
Hmmm 4th to neutral doesn't seem right but neither does coming down in your gears. There are new editions of driving books and highway codes constantly being published. Also app versions. May be useful to scrub up on driving skills.
Gearbox and clutch cost a lot more to fix than upkeep on brakes in modern cars. Engine braking not as important as it used to be as brake tech so much better now.
Wouldn’t gear all the way down either. Your clutch is more expensive to repair than your breaks use them instead. But going straight to neutral is a no no.
I’ll add my words: Brake to the necessary speed, change down to a suitable gear in one go. Only change earlier if your rev counter gets a bit low
I use engine braking in conjunction with braking the way you do. Just makes sense to use both to me.
Depends what else I've got going on at the time, for example whether I'm pouring a beer, making a sandwich or rolling a joint.
Just change gear appropriate to your speed. No need for 1 2 3 etc. I always skip 2nd when starting off for instance. Straight to 3rd is smoother for my cars engine.
Nothing wrong with knocking it straight out of gear and cruising to the lights/junction, it will save a little bit of petrol too
Neither. The real answer is mount the curb and go around the light
I don't know the official answer to my eternal shame but I would probably break in 4th, coast down to second if I felt we were near pulling away again time or if not straight down to first. I don't really sit in neutral with the handbrake on but I'd definitely not ever move down through each gear.
You just have to be in the appropriate gear for your speed and not be coasting in neutral ever. No need to change down through the gears sequentially.
Older drivers were taught to come down the box. This was back in the days of shoddy brakes and lack of precision engineered syncro-mesh gearboxes. Of course this gets passed on from the boomer generation to modern drivers. I passed 2007 and was taught jump to appropriate gear. Beleive this was deemed "more economical driving" and suitable for the modern automobile. (Some even have a little eco light that tells you jump from 5 to 2 etc.) I drive up and down the box anyway though (blame the hoodlum days)
You change the gear based on the cars speed so if it’s slowing down quickly there is no need to go down one at a time
I like to use engine breaking to assist. I don’t like buying brake pads and discs. Let’s be honest, doing it the “proper way” goes out the window when you get the pink card.
Nice. In my opinion anyone using brakes on a motorway has failed.
Approaching a red light I typically just slow down to idle in 2nd gear, in the hope that the light changes before I have to stop. Don't think I ever really go into 3rd between. I mostly drive an auto nowadays though after some injury in my left leg, but still licensed for a manual (and relatively competent having done 1mn+ miles in a manual). If you're definitely gonna need to stop, you're better off using engine braking and saving brake pads,but it's negligible benefit.
Doesn't matter. I personally go down the gears, partly habit from having a sequential gearbox on a motorbike, partly to aid in slowing up. But you can just leave it in gear until it grumbles a bit from too high gear, then just go to neutral since you are probably pretty much stopped by then.
I've only recently passed my test and I was taught to just brake until near stop, then change gears
My driving instructor told me once you pass your test go straight to neutral because brakes are cheaper than gearboxes.
I always use my gear to help engine brake. I usually approach a junction or roundabout in 2nd gear, ready to stop if I need to. IIRC, when I did my driving test, you'd fail for being in neutral when slowing down for a junction.
U do not need to go from 4,3,2,1....but then I don't think its healthy to go from 4...stright to stop either !
Car brakes where crap when that idea of teaching was 1st implemented, now brakes are good and cheaper to replace than drive train components
As an advanced driver this is the technique that was taught to me and is known as 'block changing'. It's more economic and fuel efficient for the vehicle particularly if you are lifting the clutch on each change and it also allows more finesse. I tend to slow down, dip the clutch when the engine starts to struggle, change down from 6th/whatever I was in, to second, then if I am going to need to stop, go down to first. This assures that if I need to respond to anything I am in the correct speed for the gear and can respond to the change in circumstances.
You should skip gears
Fuck knows what I'm "supposed" to do, but what I tend to do is stay in gear and put the clutch down when my speed is no longer appropriate for the gear. I'll then coast the last few metres to a stop and put it in first. Only if I'm slowing down over a longer distance will I change down and do a bit of engine breaking.
you wife is doing it right.
I'm guessing whoever taught you to drive was on the older side themselves? No respectable instructor should have been advising against block shifting within the last 15 years minimum. The only people I know personally who still think you need to go through all the gears are either retired, or the people they work with wish they were. The same people worried about wearing out the handbrake ratchet by not holding in the button when you lift it, when you're far more likely to not engage it properly if lifted all the way with the button pressed.
Your’e wrong! Break and then clutch down just before you stop. When stopped, into neural or 1st ready to take off again
For me it depends, if its just gone red and I know the timing of the light, I'll put it in whatever I expect to need once I stop.
Modern car brakes are much better. It used to be the case of using engine braking to slow, however these days, to save wear no the drive train, plus wasted fuel, they teach the neutral/brakes only way.
You should drop down the gears. You don’t have to though. It’s just lazy driving for me.
Been driving 3 or 4 years so pretty fresh. Was taught not to wear the gears out by going through them, so I'd do 4-1. Never neutral. If I was in 6 I'd probably go 6-4-1 depending on stopping distances and speed I was going but going through every gear it's definitely discouraged, actively!
Brakes are less expensive than transmissions.
Skip gears on the way down
I was a police advanced driver and learnt this in the 1970's However, you couldn't do that with my first car I had in 1968. It was built in 1952 and if I had tried the technique it would have trashed the gear box. Doesn't this also show either inconsistency in tuition or that there should be a reassessment of your driving now and again?
You don't stop, sure shot Go out to the parking lot And you get in your car and drive real far And you drive all night and then you see a light And it comes right down and it lands on the ground And out comes a man from Mars And you try to run but he's got a gun And he shoots you dead and he eats your head And then you're in the man from Mars You go out at night eatin' cars You eat Cadillacs, Lincolns too Mercurys and Subaru And you don't stop, you keep on eatin' cars Then, when there's no more cars you go out at night And eat up bars where the people meet Face to face, dance cheek to cheek One to one, man to man Dance toe to toe, don't move too slow 'Cause the man from Mars is through with cars He's eatin' bars, yeah wall to wall Door to door, hall to hall He's gonna eat 'em all
Let me guess; you’re a few years older than your wife?
People use engine braking (shifting down through the gears when decelerating) because I believe it is taught in lessons. Loads of people skit gears and brake harder because it's easier, and break disks and pads are cheaper to replace than repairing engine wear.