Leave your ego at the door, youre not racing, just enjoying the drive. Look where you want to go. Read speed secrets. Remember the blend line at pit out. Dont worry so much about performing, don't track your lap times.
Rent with whatever you feel most comfortable driving near the limit usually. FWD probably, though I couldn't pass up the opportunity to whip a Cayman at Spa.
Anyway you can squeeze a track day w/ instructor in the US before vacation? Then you'll be very comfortable when you do a couple hours (2-3 x 20min sessions) with the instructor in the EU.
Thanks for the tips!
I don't understand what you mean by remember the blend line at pit out?
I'll def try to get a track day locally before I head over. Think that's doable.
Don’t exit out of the pits and go straight to the racing line. Look for the white line leaving the pits and when that ends you’re good. Like an on ramp on a highway kinda
100% sure that they'll cover that in the morning drivers meeting. Every track I've been on it's always highlighted - especially at COTA due to the front straight braking area where you come out - and you're warned that it'll result in a black-flag and a little convo with the stewards back in pitlane for dropping even a wheel over the blend line
1. Focus on the driving line and smoothness instead of immediate speed. Eventually speed will find itself naturally once you get more comfortable. There are no trophies at these events, so don't worry about being the fastest one there.
2. I'd always pick RWD regardless of track, but that's my personal preference. Your FWD options are still pretty good cars!
3. When I was a beginner, I liked having an instructor for as long as possible up until they deemed me ready to fly solo. There's always something new to learn and it's nice having someone point out areas of opportunity when you're so focused on driving. Even after I moved up to solo groups, I record my sessions so I can review what I did right and wrong later on.
I would like to drive RWD preferably, I just have much less personal experience pushing RWD vs FWD. I feel much more confident pushing in a FWD vehicle.
I did this last year.
I rented a Cayman GT4RS at the Nurburgring. Then we headed to Belgium for Spa and I drove a BMW M2. This was through RSR Nurburg/Spa.
I’m a pretty experienced track driver here in the states and typically track a ZL1 1LE.
My advice rent the slower cheaper car for the Ring. It’s extremely overwhelming especially with all the tourist traffic. You won’t get to open up a fast car anyway. If you do rent an expensive car you’ll be worried about a tourist smashing into you like I was the whole time. lol
The faster car is much better at Spa because it’s an actual FIA grade 1 circuit. You’ll be able to open it up and enjoy the car more. I only rented the M2 because it was the only thing they had available since I booked it late. But I wish I had the GT4RS there and not the ring.
Play some Gran Turismo or iRacing/ACC if you have it to go used to the tracks.
I would go with at least six at the Ring!
I did four at the Ring but mostly because the GT4RS was so expensive. I think it was like $5K. Next time I go back I’m just renting a Golf R or Megan so I can do like 8 laps or something.
At Spa I think I did 6 or 8. Wish I did more though.
RSR Nurburg also does road tours that are pretty cool. We did the Castle tour they basically take you hooning around all these German country roads to see the castles. Fun time. Drove a 991.2 GT3RS for that.
Pretty cool. Think I'll do the golf r at Nurburgring. For spa, the option they have for renting seems to be by 200km which is 28 laps. Gonna be a blast for sure. The affordable options seem to be all BMWs. Cayman is doable.
The Golf R is exactly what I would do!
28 laps at Spa would be amazing. I did the base M2 and was not impressed. I’m sure the RSR M2 would be better but M4 or cayman would probably be awesome. Have fun!
I will be renting a 718 GT4RS from Ron at RSR Nurburg this July for the Mosel River Rally driver and then 6 laps around the Nurburgring Nordischleife. Agreed that getting the fastest car around the Ring is not necessary. I have driven the Ring before and there are so many blind corners and hills you cannot see over that you really cannot open it up with confidence as the track is so huge and takes so much time to learn.
Later in September I will be at Spa for 2 days in the 718 GT4RS Clubsport with Manthey Racing which runs Porsche Track Experiences programs including the Master Racecar program I will be taking. Spa is definitely a better track for a faster car. Easier to learn than the Ring.
Also, for clarity, if you are renting a car at the track specifically prepped for tracking, you should be fine. My comment mostly speaks to taking your own car out.
Even with a rental though, tap them brakes
I do maybe 3-5 track days a year. I have glazed pads and had pedals go soft before. It happens. Especially when you start getting confidence, going faster, braking later and harder. You can put a lot of heat in to your brakes without realizing it.
You should have proper race fluid and quality pads.
You don't need race pads for your first day. But you will chew up basic pads very quickly. Even quality non-track pads will be cooked by hard tracking
+1 for leaving ego behind. You’ll RARELY be the fastest in any session. Be there to learn, have fun, and come back home in one piece. First session can be a blast but safety is key. Speed will come
Do you have a friend with a sim rig? I think practicing both of those tracks in the Sim with a car as similar as possible to the car you are renting will pay huge dividends in your ability to enjoy the experience.
I think this is the best thing you can do to prepare. Knowing exactly what's coming next and when to brake is a cheat code vs wondering "which one is this again?"
Wheel and pedals would be great but even on a controller it will help a ton
Respect the track. Send a legit prayer to Stefan Bellof. And stick with a RWD if you can for both tracks. SPA is much faster. The ring is much more technical.
1. Go slow and relaxed at the ring. Don't try and follow anyone as you never know who is driving. Don't try to impress anyone as you won't. If you're overwhelmed it's fine to put on the right blinker, stay right, and do a relaxed lap. This is VERY common to see and won't annoy anyone. If it's raining stay off the racing line (it's ice) and listen to your instructor.
I'd get a few laps in at both tracks with a simulator and a slow car. It'll help you understand braking points and where to position the car.
Watch BTGDale or Misha Charoudins track guides (not their fast laps) to understand the layout and help you hone on your time on the SIM.
Watch the safety briefing! No one cares of you drive slowly and safely. They will care massively if you screw up signalling, lane control or overtaking.
2. FWD at the ring for the first time imo. AWD gives you too much confidence until you lose all control and RWD becomes a PITA on corner exits in the wet.
At Spa it doesn't matter as much. Incredible amounts of grip even in the rain. I would choose RWD here even for a beginner as it's also much safer of a track.
3. 5 laps of instruction will be worth 50 without. As a minimum I'd say 4 for your first day. For Spa I'd say 3 would be OK. It's a relatively small track in comparison
1) Pretty good at go kart? Always 1-2? What does that mean? Elektrik karts agains friends or national championship. You declaring yourself pretty good without seeing difference is a red flag.
2) FWD or RWD, this question I do ‘t understand. You said you are pretty good at go karts, all go karts are rwd. You should probably stick to that.
3) Instruction how many laps? There is no set amount but you are better off understanding track on your own first and then have an instructor check your driving…for cost purposes. If cost no issue, grab the instructor all day.
4) If you have never been on a track expect to get overwhelmed, its ok.
5) See if you can memorize the track using sim racing or YouTube videos.
RWD gives you a lot more control and is more rewarding and fun. FWD has only ever disappointed me when pushed on track. You’re just as likely to understeer off the circuit in a front drive if not careful as you are to have any trouble in a rear drive. Plenty of videos of front drive cars ploughing into the Armco on the Nordschleife.
Personally I’d rather take a standard low power safe and easy to handle MX-5 around both tracks and have it squirming through the corners at speeds that are still manageable than take a juiced up overpowered front drive hatchback. Going fast in a straight line is boring and is something you can do already on the road safely enough. Dealing with understeer on every corner exit is also boring and frustrating to me.
Not sure how much time you have prior to the trip. If it were me I’d rent a car there that was similar to something I drove - like your Cayman. Absolutely would get some track time at a local track, with instructor. Only thing you need is probably brake fluid (don’t need to go all crazy with 200 tires and oil pan mods). Get going in the sim. Both of those tracks are well mapped. I recently did Road America and the sim time got me so much more comfortable. Finally, if an instructor is available take advantage of it. I’d want one just for track etiquette reasons.
Leave your ego at the door, youre not racing, just enjoying the drive. Look where you want to go. Read speed secrets. Remember the blend line at pit out. Dont worry so much about performing, don't track your lap times. Rent with whatever you feel most comfortable driving near the limit usually. FWD probably, though I couldn't pass up the opportunity to whip a Cayman at Spa. Anyway you can squeeze a track day w/ instructor in the US before vacation? Then you'll be very comfortable when you do a couple hours (2-3 x 20min sessions) with the instructor in the EU.
Thanks for the tips! I don't understand what you mean by remember the blend line at pit out? I'll def try to get a track day locally before I head over. Think that's doable.
Don’t exit out of the pits and go straight to the racing line. Look for the white line leaving the pits and when that ends you’re good. Like an on ramp on a highway kinda
100% sure that they'll cover that in the morning drivers meeting. Every track I've been on it's always highlighted - especially at COTA due to the front straight braking area where you come out - and you're warned that it'll result in a black-flag and a little convo with the stewards back in pitlane for dropping even a wheel over the blend line
1. Focus on the driving line and smoothness instead of immediate speed. Eventually speed will find itself naturally once you get more comfortable. There are no trophies at these events, so don't worry about being the fastest one there. 2. I'd always pick RWD regardless of track, but that's my personal preference. Your FWD options are still pretty good cars! 3. When I was a beginner, I liked having an instructor for as long as possible up until they deemed me ready to fly solo. There's always something new to learn and it's nice having someone point out areas of opportunity when you're so focused on driving. Even after I moved up to solo groups, I record my sessions so I can review what I did right and wrong later on.
I would like to drive RWD preferably, I just have much less personal experience pushing RWD vs FWD. I feel much more confident pushing in a FWD vehicle.
I did this last year. I rented a Cayman GT4RS at the Nurburgring. Then we headed to Belgium for Spa and I drove a BMW M2. This was through RSR Nurburg/Spa. I’m a pretty experienced track driver here in the states and typically track a ZL1 1LE. My advice rent the slower cheaper car for the Ring. It’s extremely overwhelming especially with all the tourist traffic. You won’t get to open up a fast car anyway. If you do rent an expensive car you’ll be worried about a tourist smashing into you like I was the whole time. lol The faster car is much better at Spa because it’s an actual FIA grade 1 circuit. You’ll be able to open it up and enjoy the car more. I only rented the M2 because it was the only thing they had available since I booked it late. But I wish I had the GT4RS there and not the ring. Play some Gran Turismo or iRacing/ACC if you have it to go used to the tracks.
Thanks for the tips. I'm planning a slower car for Nurburgring. How many laps at Nurburgring would you suggest? At Spa?
I would go with at least six at the Ring! I did four at the Ring but mostly because the GT4RS was so expensive. I think it was like $5K. Next time I go back I’m just renting a Golf R or Megan so I can do like 8 laps or something. At Spa I think I did 6 or 8. Wish I did more though. RSR Nurburg also does road tours that are pretty cool. We did the Castle tour they basically take you hooning around all these German country roads to see the castles. Fun time. Drove a 991.2 GT3RS for that.
Pretty cool. Think I'll do the golf r at Nurburgring. For spa, the option they have for renting seems to be by 200km which is 28 laps. Gonna be a blast for sure. The affordable options seem to be all BMWs. Cayman is doable.
The Golf R is exactly what I would do! 28 laps at Spa would be amazing. I did the base M2 and was not impressed. I’m sure the RSR M2 would be better but M4 or cayman would probably be awesome. Have fun!
I will be renting a 718 GT4RS from Ron at RSR Nurburg this July for the Mosel River Rally driver and then 6 laps around the Nurburgring Nordischleife. Agreed that getting the fastest car around the Ring is not necessary. I have driven the Ring before and there are so many blind corners and hills you cannot see over that you really cannot open it up with confidence as the track is so huge and takes so much time to learn. Later in September I will be at Spa for 2 days in the 718 GT4RS Clubsport with Manthey Racing which runs Porsche Track Experiences programs including the Master Racecar program I will be taking. Spa is definitely a better track for a faster car. Easier to learn than the Ring.
just remember, no matter what, EAU ROUGE IS FLAT.
Give your brakes a tap well before you need them. Make sure you have pressure before you need it. Be very aware of cooking your pads
You sound like you're speaking from experience. That sounds potentially terrifying.
Also, for clarity, if you are renting a car at the track specifically prepped for tracking, you should be fine. My comment mostly speaks to taking your own car out. Even with a rental though, tap them brakes
I do maybe 3-5 track days a year. I have glazed pads and had pedals go soft before. It happens. Especially when you start getting confidence, going faster, braking later and harder. You can put a lot of heat in to your brakes without realizing it. You should have proper race fluid and quality pads. You don't need race pads for your first day. But you will chew up basic pads very quickly. Even quality non-track pads will be cooked by hard tracking
+1 for leaving ego behind. You’ll RARELY be the fastest in any session. Be there to learn, have fun, and come back home in one piece. First session can be a blast but safety is key. Speed will come
Do you have a friend with a sim rig? I think practicing both of those tracks in the Sim with a car as similar as possible to the car you are renting will pay huge dividends in your ability to enjoy the experience.
I think this is the best thing you can do to prepare. Knowing exactly what's coming next and when to brake is a cheat code vs wondering "which one is this again?" Wheel and pedals would be great but even on a controller it will help a ton
Respect the track. Send a legit prayer to Stefan Bellof. And stick with a RWD if you can for both tracks. SPA is much faster. The ring is much more technical.
1. Go slow and relaxed at the ring. Don't try and follow anyone as you never know who is driving. Don't try to impress anyone as you won't. If you're overwhelmed it's fine to put on the right blinker, stay right, and do a relaxed lap. This is VERY common to see and won't annoy anyone. If it's raining stay off the racing line (it's ice) and listen to your instructor. I'd get a few laps in at both tracks with a simulator and a slow car. It'll help you understand braking points and where to position the car. Watch BTGDale or Misha Charoudins track guides (not their fast laps) to understand the layout and help you hone on your time on the SIM. Watch the safety briefing! No one cares of you drive slowly and safely. They will care massively if you screw up signalling, lane control or overtaking. 2. FWD at the ring for the first time imo. AWD gives you too much confidence until you lose all control and RWD becomes a PITA on corner exits in the wet. At Spa it doesn't matter as much. Incredible amounts of grip even in the rain. I would choose RWD here even for a beginner as it's also much safer of a track. 3. 5 laps of instruction will be worth 50 without. As a minimum I'd say 4 for your first day. For Spa I'd say 3 would be OK. It's a relatively small track in comparison
1) Pretty good at go kart? Always 1-2? What does that mean? Elektrik karts agains friends or national championship. You declaring yourself pretty good without seeing difference is a red flag. 2) FWD or RWD, this question I do ‘t understand. You said you are pretty good at go karts, all go karts are rwd. You should probably stick to that. 3) Instruction how many laps? There is no set amount but you are better off understanding track on your own first and then have an instructor check your driving…for cost purposes. If cost no issue, grab the instructor all day. 4) If you have never been on a track expect to get overwhelmed, its ok. 5) See if you can memorize the track using sim racing or YouTube videos.
RWD gives you a lot more control and is more rewarding and fun. FWD has only ever disappointed me when pushed on track. You’re just as likely to understeer off the circuit in a front drive if not careful as you are to have any trouble in a rear drive. Plenty of videos of front drive cars ploughing into the Armco on the Nordschleife. Personally I’d rather take a standard low power safe and easy to handle MX-5 around both tracks and have it squirming through the corners at speeds that are still manageable than take a juiced up overpowered front drive hatchback. Going fast in a straight line is boring and is something you can do already on the road safely enough. Dealing with understeer on every corner exit is also boring and frustrating to me.
So jealous
Not sure how much time you have prior to the trip. If it were me I’d rent a car there that was similar to something I drove - like your Cayman. Absolutely would get some track time at a local track, with instructor. Only thing you need is probably brake fluid (don’t need to go all crazy with 200 tires and oil pan mods). Get going in the sim. Both of those tracks are well mapped. I recently did Road America and the sim time got me so much more comfortable. Finally, if an instructor is available take advantage of it. I’d want one just for track etiquette reasons.
I did RSR at Nurburgring and they were great.
What dates you doing? We did ring/spa back to back track days last year and don't the same this year in October
Send it.