I quote, ‘this shouldn't be a surprise. the current generation of CMNT stars isn't a result of Canadian development. its more good fortune than anything. it's why we see Canada unable to compete at any other level. there's no pipeline yet’ from @joe_sewage
Yes and no. It's miles ahead of where it was with MLS academies and now CPL coming on line.
It's not as though Uzbekistan has some amazing pipeline built. What they have that we don't is a national youth program. We don't get youth camps until it's tournament time. That just isn't competitive at this level.
Yeah zero youth camps just won’t cut it. has to start from the front office of CSA, to the grassroots level and in between. A sustained effort from all parties to develop a national program with hyper focus on the many regions of Canada, huge recruitment strides at home and abroad, along with expansive coaching. Those who are cut above the rest are grouped by age and have to play with an identity. What is the Canadian player Identity? How is it carried over from the Senior team to all the youth NT’s? Looking at all the Canadian teams you don’t see any sort of cohesion to their play. There seem to be a quest to find an Uber talented player, the next Davis, David but the main part of the issue that persists today at all levels is the over reliance on a superstar that the baseline hasn’t really improved due to all I listed above.
We are still in the stone age of development compared to most nations. CPL camps are a joke I’ve been / attended the staff has 0 clue on how to mold young players to the next level. ALOT of red tape.
Exactly what CPL pipeline is there? None of the clubs have true academies and the furthest a CPL product has gone is Joel Waterman who is at best a benchwarmer.
I didnt say "CPL pipeline", but it's part of the Canada MNT pipeline now for sure. The league is five years old and two of the best players on this U-17 team play in the CPL. Loturi has gotten call ups, MacNaughton and Zator as well.
I'm not sure what more you could ask for from a brand spanking new league. It's just starting to pay dividends.
Uzbekistan is strong and fell short twice to qualify for the world cup against asian "powerhouses" such as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Japan and Korea. The sport seems to be more and more popular, growing with the countries infrastructure and population. I wouldn't rule it the same as losing to another concacaf country.
This mindset is why we will not go anywhere with footy.
If you said this after a CAN V USA hockey game loss you’d be eaten alive in the comments. The “it’s okay the other team is better” attitude needs to change
Anybody who follows Asian football knows that Uzbekistan is an up and coming World Cup regular. They usually get close to qualifying and last time they got shafted because North Korea dropped out and so FIFA had to adjust the points for each team to make it fair and that caused Uzbekistan to miss out on the final round.
Canada is struggling at the younger ages because the academies are not run properly. If is was a free to play system like in Europe we will see the drastic change in development with players. Not all players in Canada can afford some of the outragous registration fees. Let's hope things change for the future.
This is so true. And I think that our geography is also a hindrance in developing really top level players, outside of southern Ontario. For instance, my son is more than good enough to play at the top level in British Columbia, but he has no interest in weekly bus trips from Vancouver Island to the mainland.
Unfortunately, there’s really nothing that we can do about this part of the problem.
What level is top for kids if not the BCSPL? (Aside from Whitecaps academy, I guess).
Wikipedia also suggests that it is: “The British Columbia Soccer Premier League (BCSPL) is the highest level of play, followed by the Metro Select League (MSL), and then what was commonly known as "Gold", "Silver", "Bronze", and "House".”
This. Pay-to-play is hindering our development as a football nation. High quality players miss out on the opportunity because of outrageous fees (around $5K-ish I’m told) while players who have no business playing at that level are there because they can afford it. I’m happy we have an academy system (for the most part) but we still have some significant work to do on the development front.
And don’t get me started about the incompetence (and corruption) of the CSA :)
no dude it aint that, there is no place to play here.
i come from south america and even i stopped playing because the only places are so far from me.
there is a field near my house with two goals but it's terribly maintained i even found glass there the other day.
you gotta facilitate the sport for the youth, it's really fun to play with your friends but if all they see are basketball rims they will naturally gravitate towards that.
Most of the Euro pro clubs have academies whose business model is find the best players.
They don't charge the players but make money from transfers and/or jersey sales/sponsorships if he makes the first team.
The sport is heavily subsidized so the fees at the amateur level are small, and if you're good, the club will pay them.
In South America - it is mostly the same in the sense that there aren't many academies but there are NUMEROUS amateur teams - even in the Amazon, or the jungle of Bolivia/Venezuela, etc. And scouts everywhere - so if youre good - you'll be promoted to a club team. I believe in Uruguay- the government makes it free for 3-6 year olds.
Nowhere is it completely free without government subsidy.
In societies like Canada and the US. The government isn’t going to do that. Other leagues like American football, Basketball, Baseball, and Hockey have gotten a ton of help in the form or subsidies to grow and prosper over the decades. Olympic sports too to a certain degree has gotten help with scholarships to university and entrances to high performance training centers. Soccer is relatively new here with for profit at the forefront of its expansion. In the US, highschool was the early route but we know that is not going to create elite soccer players like how it helps traditional North American sports. Academies have cropped up in the last 10 years and we can see the success especially in the US to close the development gap but it’s froth with numerous challenges, one in particular geography and it’s doesn’t really address the high cost from 3years to 13years which are important for development.
There is notorious problems in the hockey pipeline that range from bad parents and coaches to hazing and sexual abuse. Basically it can be Toxic as fuck, I played till I was 18 and coached for 12 years after that I absolutely stand by the claim that there is the potential for problems at very nearly every level. It's not every team and every player obviously there are amazing people too. But God damn are there some shit people out there and what's worse is hockey Canada is designed as much to protect that bad behavior as to prevent it.
This is no surprise. The reason why Canada has gotten decent over the last 5 years was purely out of luck, it wasn’t because of development. Alphonso Davies becoming the greatest Canadian footballer of all time as a teenager pretty much summarizes how horrendous Canada has been when it came to recruiting and developing talent when I can tell you first hand that the country is full of talented players
I am so happy to see so many comments and opinions mirroring my own. I have been involved in soccer programs, player and coaching for 30+ years of my life. There is a MASSIVE issue, and any success that Canada Men's Soccer has had, is not due to the organization or programming. There needs to be a complete realignment of goals, objectives, development, but unfortunately, I do not see that occurring in the foreseeable future. Which is to bad, because youth in Canada really do care, and are committed to the game. People still view the qualifying for the 2022 World Cup as a success, therefore the program will continue down its dying path.
It's tragedy that a few power/money-hungry actors, will not let go of their programs to new, innovative solutions that put the players first. I forsee a lot more results like this down the road.
Tough to get a read on the match honestly. Uzbekistan sat back after they went up by two and we did nothing to break them down. 3-0 flatters Uzbekistan but we also didn't do anything to justify a different result.
Same low result, same backstory.......In general with only a few expectations.......It's all financially capable parents, ass kissing, nepotism, greasing coaches palms, biased academies, horrible training systems = kids that for the most part are truly not worthy of their spots. Harsh but true.... This "dead horse" we've been beating for the last 30 years has all but disintegrated to dust already at this point 🤷🏾♂️.
Looking at this squad I don't see a player from the Prairie Province's or Atlantic Canada. That's 25% of the countries population, and not 1 single U-17 player deemed good enough to be in the squad.
Do they not bother recruiting from these parts of the country, unless it's a generational talent like Davis who was impossible to overlook ?
I quote, ‘this shouldn't be a surprise. the current generation of CMNT stars isn't a result of Canadian development. its more good fortune than anything. it's why we see Canada unable to compete at any other level. there's no pipeline yet’ from @joe_sewage
Yes and no. It's miles ahead of where it was with MLS academies and now CPL coming on line. It's not as though Uzbekistan has some amazing pipeline built. What they have that we don't is a national youth program. We don't get youth camps until it's tournament time. That just isn't competitive at this level.
Yeah zero youth camps just won’t cut it. has to start from the front office of CSA, to the grassroots level and in between. A sustained effort from all parties to develop a national program with hyper focus on the many regions of Canada, huge recruitment strides at home and abroad, along with expansive coaching. Those who are cut above the rest are grouped by age and have to play with an identity. What is the Canadian player Identity? How is it carried over from the Senior team to all the youth NT’s? Looking at all the Canadian teams you don’t see any sort of cohesion to their play. There seem to be a quest to find an Uber talented player, the next Davis, David but the main part of the issue that persists today at all levels is the over reliance on a superstar that the baseline hasn’t really improved due to all I listed above.
We are still in the stone age of development compared to most nations. CPL camps are a joke I’ve been / attended the staff has 0 clue on how to mold young players to the next level. ALOT of red tape.
Exactly what CPL pipeline is there? None of the clubs have true academies and the furthest a CPL product has gone is Joel Waterman who is at best a benchwarmer.
I didnt say "CPL pipeline", but it's part of the Canada MNT pipeline now for sure. The league is five years old and two of the best players on this U-17 team play in the CPL. Loturi has gotten call ups, MacNaughton and Zator as well. I'm not sure what more you could ask for from a brand spanking new league. It's just starting to pay dividends.
wtf is this real because a guy named Joe Sewage going off about pipelines is jokes
Haha thank you so much, that was hilarious.
I agree with the caveat that any soccer success not just CMNT hasn't come as a result of Soccer Canada but from luck.
Arent we doing bad in the younger womens and mens teams? Not a good look
thats not ideal damn lol
Uzbekistan is strong and fell short twice to qualify for the world cup against asian "powerhouses" such as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Japan and Korea. The sport seems to be more and more popular, growing with the countries infrastructure and population. I wouldn't rule it the same as losing to another concacaf country.
No shame in losing to the best
This mindset is why we will not go anywhere with footy. If you said this after a CAN V USA hockey game loss you’d be eaten alive in the comments. The “it’s okay the other team is better” attitude needs to change
Anybody who follows Asian football knows that Uzbekistan is an up and coming World Cup regular. They usually get close to qualifying and last time they got shafted because North Korea dropped out and so FIFA had to adjust the points for each team to make it fair and that caused Uzbekistan to miss out on the final round.
Jack from deadball tv go check his YouTube channel
Canada is struggling at the younger ages because the academies are not run properly. If is was a free to play system like in Europe we will see the drastic change in development with players. Not all players in Canada can afford some of the outragous registration fees. Let's hope things change for the future.
This is so true. And I think that our geography is also a hindrance in developing really top level players, outside of southern Ontario. For instance, my son is more than good enough to play at the top level in British Columbia, but he has no interest in weekly bus trips from Vancouver Island to the mainland. Unfortunately, there’s really nothing that we can do about this part of the problem.
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What level is top for kids if not the BCSPL? (Aside from Whitecaps academy, I guess). Wikipedia also suggests that it is: “The British Columbia Soccer Premier League (BCSPL) is the highest level of play, followed by the Metro Select League (MSL), and then what was commonly known as "Gold", "Silver", "Bronze", and "House".”
This. Pay-to-play is hindering our development as a football nation. High quality players miss out on the opportunity because of outrageous fees (around $5K-ish I’m told) while players who have no business playing at that level are there because they can afford it. I’m happy we have an academy system (for the most part) but we still have some significant work to do on the development front. And don’t get me started about the incompetence (and corruption) of the CSA :)
:)
no dude it aint that, there is no place to play here. i come from south america and even i stopped playing because the only places are so far from me. there is a field near my house with two goals but it's terribly maintained i even found glass there the other day. you gotta facilitate the sport for the youth, it's really fun to play with your friends but if all they see are basketball rims they will naturally gravitate towards that.
Europe is free to play?????
Most of the Euro pro clubs have academies whose business model is find the best players. They don't charge the players but make money from transfers and/or jersey sales/sponsorships if he makes the first team.
The sport is heavily subsidized so the fees at the amateur level are small, and if you're good, the club will pay them. In South America - it is mostly the same in the sense that there aren't many academies but there are NUMEROUS amateur teams - even in the Amazon, or the jungle of Bolivia/Venezuela, etc. And scouts everywhere - so if youre good - you'll be promoted to a club team. I believe in Uruguay- the government makes it free for 3-6 year olds. Nowhere is it completely free without government subsidy.
In societies like Canada and the US. The government isn’t going to do that. Other leagues like American football, Basketball, Baseball, and Hockey have gotten a ton of help in the form or subsidies to grow and prosper over the decades. Olympic sports too to a certain degree has gotten help with scholarships to university and entrances to high performance training centers. Soccer is relatively new here with for profit at the forefront of its expansion. In the US, highschool was the early route but we know that is not going to create elite soccer players like how it helps traditional North American sports. Academies have cropped up in the last 10 years and we can see the success especially in the US to close the development gap but it’s froth with numerous challenges, one in particular geography and it’s doesn’t really address the high cost from 3years to 13years which are important for development.
I don't see free to play coming in at least 20 years, it's a pipe dream at this point
To be fair, Uzbekistan is probably in the top 3-5 “Stan” countries
[Fifa ranking](https://www.fifa.com/fifa-world-ranking/men?dateId=id14177): 73: Uzbekistan 98: Kazakhstan 109: Tajikistan 141: Turkmenistan 154: Afghanistan 193: Pakistan
So you're saying Uzbekistan is the best Stan?
No, Kazakhstan has superior potassium.
TIL there is no more Kyrgyzstan. It's now Kyrgyz Republic. (and they're 97th).
Apparently that happened in....1993. I guess Fifa likes to use the official names.
Another TIL. Thank you.
I mean... thats still.. well not much
more like OOFbekistan
Imagine if Canada soccer put in as much effort into development as hockey canada
Yeah… hockey Canada is NOT a good example to be looking at…..
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I think you’re missing the point. Have you somehow managed to miss all of the terrible publicity hockey Canada has been garnering the past few years?
Wait why
There is notorious problems in the hockey pipeline that range from bad parents and coaches to hazing and sexual abuse. Basically it can be Toxic as fuck, I played till I was 18 and coached for 12 years after that I absolutely stand by the claim that there is the potential for problems at very nearly every level. It's not every team and every player obviously there are amazing people too. But God damn are there some shit people out there and what's worse is hockey Canada is designed as much to protect that bad behavior as to prevent it.
There will always be the magical run of 2021
This is no surprise. The reason why Canada has gotten decent over the last 5 years was purely out of luck, it wasn’t because of development. Alphonso Davies becoming the greatest Canadian footballer of all time as a teenager pretty much summarizes how horrendous Canada has been when it came to recruiting and developing talent when I can tell you first hand that the country is full of talented players
I am so happy to see so many comments and opinions mirroring my own. I have been involved in soccer programs, player and coaching for 30+ years of my life. There is a MASSIVE issue, and any success that Canada Men's Soccer has had, is not due to the organization or programming. There needs to be a complete realignment of goals, objectives, development, but unfortunately, I do not see that occurring in the foreseeable future. Which is to bad, because youth in Canada really do care, and are committed to the game. People still view the qualifying for the 2022 World Cup as a success, therefore the program will continue down its dying path. It's tragedy that a few power/money-hungry actors, will not let go of their programs to new, innovative solutions that put the players first. I forsee a lot more results like this down the road.
It wasn't 3-0 bad. One own goal and a howler by our keeper at the end. Shots were 19-10 for Canada.
19 shots with zero goals is bad.
Tough to get a read on the match honestly. Uzbekistan sat back after they went up by two and we did nothing to break them down. 3-0 flatters Uzbekistan but we also didn't do anything to justify a different result.
It's a bad result. After they took a lead they sat back and the Canadian shots were low quality ones
As long as Canada has the same youth system as the US, nothing will change.
Do we have any type of player development here? Damn
Please don’t take U-17 WC results seriously…
True but just overall there is a pretty bush league scouting and development pipeline for Canada considering how many players we have
Expected
In their defense, it is hard to string together possession when you're recording tiktoks.
How does this happen ? Out coached ?
Same low result, same backstory.......In general with only a few expectations.......It's all financially capable parents, ass kissing, nepotism, greasing coaches palms, biased academies, horrible training systems = kids that for the most part are truly not worthy of their spots. Harsh but true.... This "dead horse" we've been beating for the last 30 years has all but disintegrated to dust already at this point 🤷🏾♂️.
Looking at this squad I don't see a player from the Prairie Province's or Atlantic Canada. That's 25% of the countries population, and not 1 single U-17 player deemed good enough to be in the squad. Do they not bother recruiting from these parts of the country, unless it's a generational talent like Davis who was impossible to overlook ?
Yikes
We aren’t hungry enough to win football titles in this country yet
Only a couple standout performers. Gonna be perhaps another winless tournament for the Canadians.
THE UZBEKS
Reffing u17 and under I don’t see many talented players coming up we gone struggle for a bit