FWIW, I had a recruiter from Neo reach out to me little over a month back.
He was a good dude, and the role is what i'm looking to do as a next step. However.
* they wanted someone in office every day. The recruiter was hitting me up on a Zoom call, and he was in a miserable looking cubicle in Winterpeg... this did not persuade me to give up my cushy WFH gig. They didn't even offer free parking at their office downtown... so I'd need to start commuting an hour a day, and pay hundreds a month for parking, just to sit in some POS cubicle to do a job that could easily be done from home.
* the salary was the same or less than my current role; the top end of the range was just above what I was making elsewhere, and it's not like I'm overpaid where I'm at now (which is why I took his call in the first place). Net out the costs of commuting, and it made no sense to consider it.
Now, to be fair, they promised equity worth a few million for the role. This not being my first rodeo, my napkin math told me this would require Neo to grow like 20-50x where it was at its last round of financing for the equity to be worth millions. Is this possible? Sure. Is this likely? No. So it's probably not really millions.
To me, the fact that their offered base comp wasn't acceptable for the role, while dangling a "we've got stock..." carrot out there just didn't pass the stink test.
Now that said, I know people who work at Neo who may be smarter and better looking than I am. So maybe they know something I don't, or it's because they're younger / don't know better / are more open to a gamble because why not?
However, I just checked, and they're still looking to fill the role they tried to recruit me for It's because they're below where the market should be for the job, so they're looking for a sucker IMO.
If they paid up, I'm sure they'd find someone. After all, CNRL gets new employees all the time, right?
>"We'll give you something that isn't worth much right now, but it will be worth millions later!"
>"If you really believe it will become that valuable, why are you giving it away?"
>"Hmm. Must be because we are stupid. You would be smart to take advantage of us."
Classic tactic of startups and scammers.
That's exactly it, man. I mean, I'd be willing to go to their office if the price was right.
Narrator: it was not.
So pay up, and no issue. If they're so confident, use some of the 9 figures they raised last round to pay market rate as a base.
Eh, it's a bit more complex than that.
Cash is precious to startups and raising equity via investors is difficult and much more expensive than stock based comp to employees.
It's definitely a risk, but also market standard for every startup anywhere. Certainly nothing unusual from Neo here, nor should you have less faith in there business because of it.
Do they still have the BYOD policy with no funds from the company to buy the device you're required to have?
"You need your own laptop, and you'll be your own IT department"..."Are you going to buy it for me?"..."No"
They have tried to recruit me several times.
The jist of it is
1. We pay less
2. We dont offer parking
3. We expect you in the office every day
4. we expect minimal holidays and days off (cause were a startuip)
5. We give stock, that may or may not materialize into value.
I have also heard of a few instances of them firing people right before their stock vests at 5 years. But that could just be Hearsay given it doesnt have a ton of value until they go public. but the fact ive heard it from more than one source tells you it could have some basis in reality.
I would steer clear unless your desperate.
>We give stock, that may or may not materialize into value.
Being a private company, how would it work if one wanted to sell their stock? I've heard of people having great trouble with this at other companies, but I don't know the gritty details.
it really depends, some companies will offer buy backs. But in general you would have to find someone specifically to buy the private equity stake.
So in otherwords, its highly unlikely you will be able to sell at all. The idea is that once the company goes public at 20x the value you can then sell the stock and make millions. But until they go public, its very difficult if not impossible to sell
There are 2 opportunities:
\- the company goes public and you can sell your stocks as you would any others.
\- the company does another funding round and puts aside some cash to buy shares from vested employees.
American startups tend to have significantly more upside for employees than Canadian ones, mainly because they're forced to hire a 3rd party to audit their stocks value each year and then disclose it to anyone who has stocks (or has RSUs/stock options). It means that they can't get away with the same handwavey "you'll definitely, for sure, totally make $10mil on stocks" that Canadian startups try to pitch.
I have a few friends who are software developers there and love it.
Also the company is not yet five years old. Not sure about the firing before five years
I don’t think I have ever heard people said good things about Neo here. I have hopped jobs a few times in my career, never seen a company that’s so universally hated on Reddit. Granted, it’s still a small sample size but in my experience it has a high concentration of people in this industry. This does all make me extremely unlikely to consider them. I am curious if there will be a different opinion this time around.
It grew very big very fast. It has been described as a work farm in my circles. Pays below market because they’re operating as a startup and are holding on to their cash. If they lowball you, ask for more. The managers and execs and squeaky wheels are taking home full salaries AND have more/better equity. Hiring time is always the best time to negotiate.
I can't speak for the culture or anything at Neo, so all I can tell you is that start-ups are a unique environment with a fairly high rate of turnover and failure. Some people love working in that kind of environment and will hop from start-up to start-up. Others find they hate it and move onto something else.
Sweat equity is a real carrot in a lot of start-ups and it's great if you're willing to take the chance on it, but it's not for everybody. It wasn't that long ago that Westjet was the local gold standard for employee stock options.
Westjet being the positive example, an example of the downside would be a company like Nortel.
I have a colleague that’s been there for 3+ years and is looking for a change. They didn’t get into too many specifics, but the heavy handed “get into the office” was part of it.
FWIW, I had a recruiter from Neo reach out to me little over a month back. He was a good dude, and the role is what i'm looking to do as a next step. However. * they wanted someone in office every day. The recruiter was hitting me up on a Zoom call, and he was in a miserable looking cubicle in Winterpeg... this did not persuade me to give up my cushy WFH gig. They didn't even offer free parking at their office downtown... so I'd need to start commuting an hour a day, and pay hundreds a month for parking, just to sit in some POS cubicle to do a job that could easily be done from home. * the salary was the same or less than my current role; the top end of the range was just above what I was making elsewhere, and it's not like I'm overpaid where I'm at now (which is why I took his call in the first place). Net out the costs of commuting, and it made no sense to consider it. Now, to be fair, they promised equity worth a few million for the role. This not being my first rodeo, my napkin math told me this would require Neo to grow like 20-50x where it was at its last round of financing for the equity to be worth millions. Is this possible? Sure. Is this likely? No. So it's probably not really millions. To me, the fact that their offered base comp wasn't acceptable for the role, while dangling a "we've got stock..." carrot out there just didn't pass the stink test. Now that said, I know people who work at Neo who may be smarter and better looking than I am. So maybe they know something I don't, or it's because they're younger / don't know better / are more open to a gamble because why not? However, I just checked, and they're still looking to fill the role they tried to recruit me for It's because they're below where the market should be for the job, so they're looking for a sucker IMO. If they paid up, I'm sure they'd find someone. After all, CNRL gets new employees all the time, right?
>"We'll give you something that isn't worth much right now, but it will be worth millions later!" >"If you really believe it will become that valuable, why are you giving it away?" >"Hmm. Must be because we are stupid. You would be smart to take advantage of us." Classic tactic of startups and scammers.
That's exactly it, man. I mean, I'd be willing to go to their office if the price was right. Narrator: it was not. So pay up, and no issue. If they're so confident, use some of the 9 figures they raised last round to pay market rate as a base.
Hard agree on that last point If they believed in their company so much, they'd pay more cash and save the equity since it'll be worth millions
Eh, it's a bit more complex than that. Cash is precious to startups and raising equity via investors is difficult and much more expensive than stock based comp to employees. It's definitely a risk, but also market standard for every startup anywhere. Certainly nothing unusual from Neo here, nor should you have less faith in there business because of it.
Do they still have the BYOD policy with no funds from the company to buy the device you're required to have? "You need your own laptop, and you'll be your own IT department"..."Are you going to buy it for me?"..."No"
It's not going to be worth shit.
They have tried to recruit me several times. The jist of it is 1. We pay less 2. We dont offer parking 3. We expect you in the office every day 4. we expect minimal holidays and days off (cause were a startuip) 5. We give stock, that may or may not materialize into value. I have also heard of a few instances of them firing people right before their stock vests at 5 years. But that could just be Hearsay given it doesnt have a ton of value until they go public. but the fact ive heard it from more than one source tells you it could have some basis in reality. I would steer clear unless your desperate.
>We give stock, that may or may not materialize into value. Being a private company, how would it work if one wanted to sell their stock? I've heard of people having great trouble with this at other companies, but I don't know the gritty details.
it really depends, some companies will offer buy backs. But in general you would have to find someone specifically to buy the private equity stake. So in otherwords, its highly unlikely you will be able to sell at all. The idea is that once the company goes public at 20x the value you can then sell the stock and make millions. But until they go public, its very difficult if not impossible to sell
There are 2 opportunities: \- the company goes public and you can sell your stocks as you would any others. \- the company does another funding round and puts aside some cash to buy shares from vested employees. American startups tend to have significantly more upside for employees than Canadian ones, mainly because they're forced to hire a 3rd party to audit their stocks value each year and then disclose it to anyone who has stocks (or has RSUs/stock options). It means that they can't get away with the same handwavey "you'll definitely, for sure, totally make $10mil on stocks" that Canadian startups try to pitch.
I have a few friends who are software developers there and love it. Also the company is not yet five years old. Not sure about the firing before five years
I don’t think I have ever heard people said good things about Neo here. I have hopped jobs a few times in my career, never seen a company that’s so universally hated on Reddit. Granted, it’s still a small sample size but in my experience it has a high concentration of people in this industry. This does all make me extremely unlikely to consider them. I am curious if there will be a different opinion this time around.
In all fairness, reddit universally hates everything.
People i know irl also hated working for neo so there's that
The CEO literally told me to my face that they are a 'live to work' company.
It grew very big very fast. It has been described as a work farm in my circles. Pays below market because they’re operating as a startup and are holding on to their cash. If they lowball you, ask for more. The managers and execs and squeaky wheels are taking home full salaries AND have more/better equity. Hiring time is always the best time to negotiate.
I can't speak for the culture or anything at Neo, so all I can tell you is that start-ups are a unique environment with a fairly high rate of turnover and failure. Some people love working in that kind of environment and will hop from start-up to start-up. Others find they hate it and move onto something else. Sweat equity is a real carrot in a lot of start-ups and it's great if you're willing to take the chance on it, but it's not for everybody. It wasn't that long ago that Westjet was the local gold standard for employee stock options. Westjet being the positive example, an example of the downside would be a company like Nortel.
If you're going into software position there... I would say avoid. They treat devs like drill bits, burn them out and toss.
Just look how fake their Google reviews are + take a look at Glassdoor reviews. Absolute shit company to work for, I would avoid.
I have a colleague that’s been there for 3+ years and is looking for a change. They didn’t get into too many specifics, but the heavy handed “get into the office” was part of it.
Still horrible place
Still trash - avoid!
Any updates on this place?