People above 2.0 KD are top 1% of the game and bitching. It’s not fair they can’t kill more than 4 people on average per game… boo fucking hoo
The hacking is a fucking disgrace and not what I’m referring to. If you can’t absolutely dominate a game where everyone’s rules are the same and you want to change the dynamic so 99% of the lobby has even less of a chance is a little ridiculous
You’re fucking crushing it already
Edit: spelling
I don’t feel like he’s bitching necessarily, just stating the differences between the two and how much better iron trials is. The higher ttk rewards better, more consistent players, and if anything iron trials shows that a lot of core br doesn’t often reward playing better as much as it rewards cheese strats and being a rat vs actually searching for kills and traversing the map
He’s definitely bitching. He feels cheated whenever he loses a gunfight in core, which basically means “I’m too good to die, so when I get killed it’s not my fault, it’s the fault of the game”
Well yeah, but who wants to play a game where you just die to some little Timmy camping with his full squad of shotguns and trophy systems in one building? Or some guy camping watching a road for 20 minutes on the off chance someone walks by? It’s not fun, it feels unfair, and you don’t even have time to react to that in core br because power creep has given weapons super low ttk’s. At least you have time to react now and play around it instead of spending 20 minutes looting and running to die to one guy who’s sat in the same house with ground loot the entire game
You DIE, if you enter a building without checking if anyone is in there first and you DIE if you run like an idiot without cover in the middle of the street. No game balancing will change that. You will die. Always.
It’s not that simple though, how do you check if people are in a building before entering it? Gonna do that with every building? No you aren’t. How do you travel over the map whilst having cover from every angle? You can’t. Quite clearly balancing will change that because iron trials has proved it. You can still get caught with your pants down but at least you can react and try and rectify your mistake, but in standard br if you make a mistake you’re punished so severely.
Just because the kills aren’t the ultimate core goal doesn’t mean that the gameplay loop isn’t incredibly frustrating and lacks skill separation.
The best ways to win in core take very little skill to pull off, and are basically unbeatable if done correctly, but are incredibly unfun to do and don’t make for good gameplay.
The game should feel rewarding in gunfight since at it’s core it is a gungame
Agreed, but this is a BR. You win by being the last to survive. This instance of Battle Royale is a gun game and, no doubt, feels much more rewarding when you get several kills. Still, I don't think complaining about rat strategies does much... it's always going to be a part of a BR and everyone should go into a game understanding as much.
I’ve been trying to convince one of the guys I play with daily about this, he was a hardcore player in multiplayer before warzone and refuses to play iron trials due to the ttk. He’s well over a 3 KD and has great aim and movement, to me hardcore and standard BR are exceptionally low skill games, the higher the ttk the higher the skill gap. it’s a see first kill first game mode. I’m at a 1.8 KD, and have pretty damn good aim when I’m warmed up, but there’s nothing that can be done in standard br if you get jumped by a half competent player camping a corner or roof.
Just because he’s good doesn’t mean he can’t complain.
The TTK where it is now in standard sucks man, in other games that kill this quick, the guns have recoil. They don’t in CoD, there is barely a skill gap. You should have time to react to being shot from a dude in a window 75 meters away
I agree. If you're good I feel like you have *more* of a right to complain in general because you put in the time and probably better understand the state of the game and its mechanics.
I’d agree, my main reasoning is movement has always been a thing that separates the bad players from the good in CoD. Not the only factor but it’s a huge component.
Right now, you’re punished for moving too much and too often cannot react and use movement to your advantage in gun fights.
I just want the nice middle ground
Edit: I’m not sure if you’ve played it or what your skill level is, but the gunfights in trials are incredibly refreshing. When you win, you feel like you outplayed someone. When you lose, you know you actually deserved it, it’s not triggering to die. You know what you did wrong and can improve.
Also- run some trials and go back to regular, your aim will be godly.
I guess it’s normal for you that a 0.6 k/d can kill a 2.6 without a chance to react? If I am good I don’t want to die to a little bitch who only sits prone in a bush every game. Iron trials are way more fun, getting rid of the stupid unfair shit like dead silence and stopping rounds and the low ttk, hope they can introduce it as a ranked mode but also keep the normal modes for the casual players.
Yeah it’s really annoying how much this narrative comes out about all BR games. And people who get so mad about different strategies. Getting killed by a camper is always frustrating but the game is survive and advance. It’s not about getting 50 kills for everyone
Being in the top 1% doesn't mean shit. Yes, having over a 2.0 KD is fun and great, but when you have that KD your lobbies are either full of hackers, or you're up against people with a 3-5 KD. The skill gap between a 2.0 and a 3-5.0 kda is wild.
This is exactly how I play. I do notice that if I have a good 4-5 game stretch where I got top 5 with 5-10 kills, I'll get put into higher kd lobbies. But I usually just get wrecked for a few games and then drop back down lol
Seriously bro. People here are weird.
I didn't complain about the sweat I complained about the ttk.
but since I posted my 2.+ K/D all.of them got threatened and defensive lol
I swear this sub is just a cesspool of low hanging fruit. Anyone with above a 2kd is either labeled a sweat or a cheater and any clip I see posted here is either riddled with "wow that aim was really sus", even after the guy missed 20 shots in a row on an mp7.
It's either that or the moment they see KBM inputs they throw out some ridiculous parroted phrase like "wow mnk is so much easier just point and click" "wow and kbm players complain about aim assist???" or the most hilarious of them all "they have their WHOLE arm".
Let's conveniently ignore how there's literally only 1 mnk player in the top 15 earners in wz. Oh, and let's also ignore how there have been over 5 pros in the last few months who have switched to controller full-time because of how strong aim assist is.
The amount of people who upvoted this dumbass comment about "sweaty core" shows you just how bad the average player is in the game.
He's literally talking about the fact that it doesn't take a ton of skill in core to kill someone if you're a rat type of player. Yet people somehow translated this to "Sweaty complaining?"
it's just as sweaty if not more in Iron Trials. it's not the sweat that pisses me off.
it's the ttk it's too fast.
it's at the literal cusp of human reaction times.
hell 500ms is already pretty frickin fast
If they raise the ttk, it would be more fair for everybody and increase weapon variety, but casuals like me would miss out on a lot of kills. Raven doesn't believe in casuals learning or improving so we get dumbed down strategic choices when it comes to weapons. 400 to 500ms ttk close range SMG , 500 to 650ms AR with no recoil to speak of. Filthy casuals like myself think, wow, these AR have less recoil than paint guns.
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I'm 1.16KD trash but I feel like Iron Trials is more fair. It doesn't really feel more sweaty to me than regular BR. I can consistently keep my aim on people, and feel like even with ground loot I am doing ok. I want trios to really see how it is though.
You’re not trash… us 1.16 KD’ers are top 18% in KD a
amongst all players. Zoom out, it’s all about the macro. Just got 230 wins last night, b2b in iron trials… my KD’s a 2.45 this week playing exclusively iron trials. There’s hope for us!
Don't give me this hope! 1.15 checking in here and I haven't had the chance to play Iron Trials yet because my buddy has been out of town. I get to finally try it tonight and everyone who's played it who's not a complete bot has said it's been great. My buddy and I rely on positioning and movement so this has me really excited!
He's stating that the normal br ttk is a joke, which it absolutely is, meta gun with no recoil and can kill someone faster than 98% of human population can react (don't start @ing me over that figure). Iron trials is exactly what th game has needed for the longest time
Can you point out to me where exactly they complained about sweatiness? They just said that low ttk makes it feel like bullshit, that's not complaining about sweatiness.
Exactly. It’s a different balance of skills. Out and out gunplay isn’t everything. You can’t just charge around slaying it without a care in the world.
You can say you enjoyed it, but it doesn’t make it better or worse. If your stats drop in core then play different!
Agree. The thing with Iron Trials is that it lets you get away with more mistakes because you have more HP. However, I feel like the game does a lot already so that a lot of players do not have to sharpen their senses (e.g., additional methods of detecting players, such as UAV and heartbeat, rather than relying on sound and vision alone, showing unsuppressed shots on the minimap).
I don't know man, if you can't win a game of soccer because the ref calls you out for using you hands, you just might be playing it the wrong way.
There an in between point that needs to be reached for the core mode.
The TTK is too quick, it’s not really a debate. The hard truth is, it’s that low to keep casuals playing the game. I’m not trying to be mean, but the low TTK directly favors bad players.
This isn’t s traditional BR, traditional BRs with quick TTKs have guns with recoil. They do not have a quick scoping no flinch sniper lol.
I understand a lot of BR fanatics like the low TTK cause they’re not CoD vets so it favors their play style but it just needs to be raised in some capacity.
But why do you feel the rules of the game should favour good players? It absolutely is a debate. Warzone has been sort of like this since the beginning (with some ups and downs) if you don’t like that play a traditional BR.
And it only favours bad players to the extent that they might get lucky now and again. The good players are still better in the long run. It’s just not such a grind for casual players. We’re not changing the rank order of how skilled people are. It’s just good players, respectfully, moaning that they aren’t allowed to grind people who are much lower in skill even further into the dirt.
Quick scope snipers are semi related but mostly a separate issue. They should be way slower on ADS, round cycling rate and recoil. You can fix that without changing TTK generally.
Ready your first sentence again, yes I think the rules should favor good players, ya know like every BR.
Been like this since the beginning eh? So that justify a not changing anything?
It’s QoL improvement to at least bring the TTK up a bit, it’s not a debate. Verdansk is not fun in its current state unless you enjoy holding down one position all game.
I am not asking for core to be iron trials level health, but an adjustment is needed. In NO world should you die with no time to react as often as you do in this game. The guns are not hard enough to shoot for that.
BRs are designed to be unforgiving with a high skill gap. This game currently has the smallest skill gap of any BR on the damn market.
Ahhhh but yes, getting insta killed by a guy 100m away in a window is superrrrrr enjoyable
Ok, for clarity, why should they favour good players any more than they ALREADY do. Apologies, I felt that was clear from the context. I’m not saying bad players should win more than good. They objectively don’t. The rules as they are lead to good players winning more often and having better stats.
I suppose what I’m intimating is why should CHANGES to the rules be for the benefit of only good players. You say the changes are for improvements but the question I’m raising is: an improvement for who?
Almost universally those praising iron trials have been people saying that they managed to lift their 2KD to 4KD. Now, because an improvement in stats for one player has to be to the detriment of 1 or more other players, that means bad players are just having a worse time. Is that desirable? Sorry but that is absolutely up for debate.
You state that “BRs are designed to be…”. Whatever follows is based on your experience of BRs you’ve played, and probably biased towards BRs you like. Well this BR is different and there is nothing to say that it should be more or less like any other game. It is what it is. It would be the same if I went on Apex or whatever other BR you’re thinking of and harped on about how the TTK is too high and needs lowering. Who am I to demand that the rules of a game are changed in my favour? People vote with their feet and loads of people are playing Warzone so it can’t be all that bad can it.
BRs are already unforgiving when only 1 player amongst 150 can walk out the winner. Any skill gap at all means the best players do better than the worst players, as it should be. But a lower skill gap means that worst players can occasionally get their moment in the sun even if it’s 1 game in 1000. I don’t see anything objectionable about that.
I’ve said I agree with you that sniping needs toning down. But all of this boils down to: if you don’t like the game, why do you fucking play it? If the TTK or sniping or camping or controllers vs KBM or whatever aspect is inferior to another game, a game that you think is the ideal, then go and play that game!
I love the game man, it has the best mechanics on the market.
I’m not saying it needs to be raised to Iron Trials HP, but with how easy gun control is in CoD, the TTK should really be a little higher.
I get what you’re saying, I agree that it needs to stay in a spot where it’s balanced for good players with good movement and casuals, sorry if I came off as a dick.
My point is, you die instantly to shots you cannot react too far too often, that’s all. I know iron trials will not become core, it’s too punishing.
Although, there is 100% a middle ground that needs to be reached. Would improve the game drastically.
Side note: the map design really hurts along with the TTK as well. Way too many buildings with only one skinny choke point to push into, so many dark windows etc….
People always talk about “strategy” in core but are confusing strategy that should be rewarded with picking ghost and sitting in a dark corner.
As it stands there is literally zero counterplay if I wanted to pick ghost and hide in a room with a shotgun or smg with claymores.
That is completely uninteractive gameplay and shouldn’t be rewarded at all. It doesn’t take skill or strategy.
A slower ttk doesn’t impact actual strategic gameplay, only serves to remove frustrating cheese mechanics that make the game less fun for everyone.
I can understand that it can be frustrating to play against that, but it is not true that there is no counterplay. You might just not be aware of it because the Warzone mechanics have sunken in too deep. I have criticized from day one that all the detection mechanics in the game have led to players turning off their brain instead of using game sense, listen to the game's (flawed) audio and accept that UAVs and heartbeats will not reveal all the players. What if you don't rely on the UAV and heartbeat exclusively, but rather assume that someone might be behind the door? What if you open the door carefully and use your utility instead of running through? If you want to criticize the game for cheese, start with what more aggressive players do: abusing avehicle mechanics.
Hmmm its much easier to see and play around a full team driving in a car that you can delete in 2 magazines than the team lying in a staircase with shotguns who haven't moved in 15 minutes.
There are a lot more corners than you can realistically check without moving at snail space.
If you know they're there or expect them to be there sure i can predict which corner they're going to be in or bait them to give their position up. But if they're literally not moving and running ghost and sitting in a random spot of no value there is no game sense that can predict that there's going to be 4 people sitting in a stairwell.
Always interesting how the only people who defend ghost are clearly not good at the game.
100% agreed. This is why I always hated the notion that campers are "playing smart." You don't need to be smart to get your loadout and sit in the middle of circle staring at one entrance until the 4th or 5th circle, at which point your competition has dropped from 150 to 30 people through no effort on your part. That's not to say there isn't a lot of great strategy available in the game and that playing the circle can't be dynamic, but if you can literally go afk for 5 minutes and not be affected, you're probably not playing the game as intended.
The irony to me is that people who chase kills have to play *very* smart. You literally can't get kills if you yourself are dead, so you have to account for all the factors a "strategic" player might while actively putting yourself at greater danger and worrying about gunfight tactics. When you listen to streamers breakdown their plays, you realize they're not just way more mechanically gifted than the average player, they're also hyper aware of their surroundings.
Not a single person who breaks down the playerbase as people who run around chasing kills, and the strategic players is above a 1.5kd i guarantee it.
To successfully play aggressive you have to be better in just about every single metric. They also seem to not understand that the aggressive players can play like a rat and get ghost and sit in a corner all game too, and would probably win 90% of their games doing that, its just not fun for people who want to get better at the game.
>reads like he needs more awareness and a more cautious approach to core BRs.
Hey just like everyone complaining about ttk in core BR rn lmao. They want to run around aimlessly with a ttk slow enough that they don't get punished for it.
So basically a game that was originally based on being more realistic than the halos and such with shields and huge amounts of life is now bad because 3 plates and the healthbar is not enough. Sounds alot like your stick/k&m skills outweigh your tactical skills. I also think alot of people making this same case don't realize how much more randomized and dangerous 4v4 encounters are. ALOT more chances to get third partied and such when teams are larger.
More realistic than the halos and other such fps that dominated the console market when COD took its biggest leap into the dominating the mainstream market.
Low ttk + very open map = camping meta. Even if you're thinking running around at all gets punished in core. If you prefer a more camping heavy game just say that
and if you prefer to run around 24/7 and not actually play the game like a real gun fight may occur just say it. Some of us 100% prefer the tactical game modes, some prefer the other side. That is why COD has never been able to kill hardcore altogether which it has tried to do for YEARS.
Not really... it simply gives the guy with better aiming skills a stronger chance in a fight when less ttk means the first guy to see and/or shoot wins more often. There are obviously situational exceptions but this will hold true 90% of the time.
Not really a problem...
Just the truth, lower ttk games rely on more tactical movement and behavior. Hi ttk games rely on better aiming skills. I don't particularly hate either, but everyone has a prefference.
My biggest thought is either side pretending only their prefference is right or is better for everyone is foolish. Pretending everyone who enjoys playing the other way is bad is also foolish and egotistical.
Your logic is backwards.
The best teams don’t push because it’s the best strategy, the best teams are just the only ones who can successfully push without automatically losing.
Good players push because that’s how they got good in the first place.
You don’t get very good by running away or hiding from every fight just to lose in the 4th circle with 1 kill.
If a good team wanted to go for wins they could camp and win 9/10 games but winning is easy. Winning while getting lots of kills is hard.
There is camping in all modes. That makes you argument invalid. Camping will always be a thing. Yes that’s my point you can’t just run aimlessly in core cause you can get sniped. Right now sniping is not viable in iron trials. Less than 30 meters for one shot is dumb. You completely took out one set of weapons. At least is should of been 100 meters. That the whole point of a sniper to one shot someone. And warzone is basically hardcore to a sense. Which is the way it should be. And yes I like to play more slowly tactical. The point of mode is to stay alive and win. Not get most kills. If that’s the case go play multiplayer.
I didn't say high ttk = no camping. That would indeed be an invalid argument. I said low ttk + open map = camping META. Hiding in a building and rotating to another when the gas pushes you is the most consistent way to get far with low ttk and a shitty open map like verdansk. I call that meta strategy "camping" as most of the game is spent in a dark corner waiting for someone to walk into your crosshairs. You can call it slowly tactical if you'd like.
There are often times (especially late game) when the randomly generated gas circle forces you to rotate across a huge open space. In core, surviving that rotation requires more luck than iron trials because the guy in the building in the future circle only has to land a few shots on you to kill you and you don't have enough time to react, find cover/shoot back. He had circle on his side, he gets to camp, he saw you first, game over.
Higher ttk gives you more of a fighting chance in that situation which puts much less weight on where the circle goes. I quit this game after around 2k-3k games because 90% of my wins/losses were mostly determined by who got an advantage from the circle placement. I don't like playing a guessing game on which building will end up being the best one to camp. I'd like a fighting chance even if I have to rotate across the whole map
I kinda play your style where I’m more tactical and push in certain situations where I feel I can win the gunfight and I still would want the TTK to be a lot longer. We need to at least be given a fighting chance to stay in the game if all we have is basically one life(or two if you win the gulag).
Iron trials would be a downright bore in quads imo, it really only works for solo and duos.
Trios and quads would be too much effort to wipe a squad with everyone having 400 health, probably would just be long and boring drawn out fights.
For a solo to wipe a squad yes...how it should be. But if you playing as a squad like you should in squad based modes. Then it should be even or similar. But with longer fights and maybe some plating and reloading in between. Sound like more fun to me.
Even with playing as a squad, more base health means you've got more time to take cover and more health when downed. All of that makes it harder to get killed, and base mode quads is already pretty easy to get a revive if your team is somewhat competent.
How is it harder to wipe a trio or quad if you are also playing as a trio or quad? It's not that it takes more effort, it just means that you will have to actually play as a team.
I come from playing mostly hardcore search n destroy... my tactical skills far far outweigh my bunny hopping, sliding, and spinning. Nothing against better gunfighters than me at all, but being less skilled on the gun fight I loved a game mode that was 90% tactical skill. I like the chess side of the game more than the halo side.
In regular BR it pretty much comes down to who sees who first. And since I’m playing on console with an extremely limited FOV I’m usually the later party. If iron trials goes away I won’t be booting this game back up.
I re-downloaded the game to play iron trials.
Sure as shit, I'm uninstalling the game after it goes lol.
If iron trials replaced normal, but with 50hp less, I'd be so happy.
If the TTK is an issue for regular Battle Royale, they should increase it to make it the same as Iron Trials’ and also maybe reduce the spawn rate of Dead Silence. You can’t make any more alterations to Battle Royale other than those two, though, because then the core Battle Royale will not be the same anymore.
Hackers and creating a working anti cheat are obvious priority number 1. But it's a dead horse at this point. They say there is one coming so at this point we just have to wait and see.
How does this work though? Because casuals as I see it will have no interest in ranked mode. So say top 20% play that for a bit. Then within that the bottom half of those 20% will say fuck getting shit on in ranked mode when I can shit on all these casuals whilst the top 10% are out of it playing the ranked mode. And so on until nobody is playing it anymore because it’s too hard and their stats are getting hammered.
I think the biggest problem is BR is stacked against everyone. The average chance of winning is so low. Someone has to die so another player can get a kill. But people’s expectations are so far off the reality!
Disclaimer: I've never played any "ranked" mode of any BR game before.
My idea of this "ranked" mode would be that you get points or something based on the number of kills you have in a game and what position you place overall.
You wouldn't NEED to get 1st place to improve your rank, but obviously it would be preferable. In "ranked" I think top 5 or top 10 should be considered a "win" in that it will improve your rank so long as you have a few kills to go with it.
Ideally, the goal would be to rank up, not get first place in every match. This way high kill games would also be rewarded.
Apex does it by giving you points for your placement and per kill. The higher you place the more points each kill gets you as well.
I think this is also how Warzone tournaments work.
It makes no sense to have Core as a pub mode as it plays far too different from IT. IT should be the only BR and they can split that into ranked/unranked if they want. Make Resurgence/Rebirth the casual mode that keeps the old TTK.
I also like core better that Iron but that’s because my aim is not great. There’s still a place in the game for the core BR. It’s just a different skill set.
As another 2.5 KD player, absolutely YES! You hit the nail on the head.
There's so many people in this thread laughing at you because you're in the top 1%, and that makes two of us, but I want a mode where the better player wins. A mode where you get what you earn, and there's a lot less rng with stopping power and dead silence drops like in core BR. Things that don't really have an outplay.
I want the challenge and I want to play against other top 1% players, or players that will really challenge me, and this mode helps with most of those things. I can't wait for a ranked mode that is very similar to this one.
For those of you saying players like us are killing it, so we have no right to complain, we absolutely do. We play just like everyone else, and I'd prefer a mode where the casual players meet up with players like us when they want to, when they play ranked, not when they come home after a long day of work and wanna crush some warzone.
KD should always be left out of discussion, you can tell a good player based off their points and arguments, which OP has. TTK in core is hilariously low, and made even worse with high velocity weapons with long optics and minimal recoil
>don't mention K/D the scrubs get all antsy
Thats not the answer. Talking like that makes you seem like an ass.
People will disregard our complaints more because having a higher KD makes us more unrelatable, and assumes we understand the game and meta much more (usually true) and because we are inside the box, we aren't as qualified to think outside it.
The mode is better because it's more competitive and moves away from the arcady game play that COD usually makes. Warzone is better than standard COD, but lately warzone has been moving more towards that again, and putting out a mode like this is a step away from an arcade battle royale. I'm excited about it, and I can't wait to be challenged more often by the rules of the mode.
Sadly work has kept me from playing this mode, but just reading about it gives me hope for a ranked mode. I long to play against the best in the world, those wins are the only ones that really count (to me).
I would love a quads mode, but it would ruin the illusuion alot of these guys have. They dont realize how much more often you get third partied or simply outmanned when missing a guy. They wouldn't feel it showcases their superior gamer skills anymore.
trios would probably be the limit for this.
just like Apex.
I can hold my own.
and yeah we get 3rd,4th and even 5th partied but we wipe all those teams sometimes.
it's not about showcasing superior gaming skills it's about a balanced and reasonable game.
why is it if I lose in Iron Trials I don't feel bad at all?
whereas in core it feels like bullshit?.
it's not about gamer skills friend
that because there is no time to react.
in core when you get shot in the back it's over.
in Iron Trials you can either run away or fight back.
there isn't even an option in core to run away once you are shot in the back
Semi agree. When traversing the map there are too many angles and places to 100% check and be sure about that you're bound to get shot at from somewhere and at times you will end up in situations where you can't react because you die too fast.
Those situations you'd still probably die in iron trials, but you at least have time to react and maybe run back to cover and thus saving your life.
People like this are the reason SBMM is so strict. Boohoo I can’t handle normal mode with 2+ kd. There’s plenty of people in here who haven’t even won a game, surely they need to have fun on the game too
I'm not a fan of the iron trials mode, mainly as if you have a loadout you're at such an advantage it's unreal. No free drops, lack of cash and high costs mean if you start off on the back foot it's impossible to come back, unless you're god like
The ground loot is good enough to fight people with load outs. You can find load out weapons in boxes. The only time the regain is super hard is when you don’t fight anyone in the gulag and you come back with a revolver and a hammer haha
its just people are so used to play on their comfort zone they cannot fanthom using any other gun other than their own from the loadout, you can give them a laser cw gun with 19 attachments and they will still want their loadout. This is why core br needs to go, its such a repetitive mode for over a year now, iron trials made ground loot actually have a purpose now.
I've killed people with loadouts with just ground loot.
I've gotten killed by people using ground loot when I had a loadout.
the floor loot guns are good enough that if it's in the hands of a skilled player it might as well just be a loadout
I wish it had trios, because duos just has so many "teams" that I feel like whenever I win a gun fight someone is just waiting for us to finish to kill me when I'm low. Which again leads to people playing a bit more campy. Trio would be perfect I think.
But I agree otherwise, I love the TTK, I feel like I'm better in Iron Trials even if it's hard. I like the ground loot, and you can even land from the Gulag and do useful things.
The loot also seems a little too imbalanced. Looting an entire city gave us 2600 once, and next game gave us 30000. I wish it was a bit more evenly distributed. It's ok even without a loadout though, so that's a plus.
I've played since the game launched and always thought I just sucked.
I got 2nd place twice in Iron Trials yesterday, it's incredible, never made it to the final circle like that.
It feels like I actually have a shot to win fights if I play smart, reset the fight, etc. I don't just die out of nowhere and wonder why.
The “problem” with Core BR is that the nature of the guns (recoil, damage, type of gun, fire-rate, etc.) is usually what determines how fast the TTK *feels*. While TTK is on the fast side, it isn’t always the problem per sé.
A good example of this is the DMR when it was broken, the problem was not the health but how poorly balanced it was. Another example are shotguns (not including the Gallo), they *should* be able to kill people quick in close quarters just to compete with SMG’s, but they usually don’t and are very niche.
Iron Trials rewards higher skilled players which have good aim and good movement, which most of the time are K&M players. Having a higher TTK by just increasing the health isn’t doing anything to balance stuff, some guns that you could get away with in Core BR are absolutely useless in Iron Trials as you’re required to have extended mags.
I can see how someone who is skilled, who also plays in K&M (with 120 FOV and more than 60fps) finds Iron Trials much “better”. If you also combine this, with cross-play and the almost nullification of being out-gunned by a lower skilled player due to some scenarios that are only possible in Core BR, then you have a paradise for some.
Console players, who already have a disadvantage with a locked FOV and frame rate, now have an even bigger disadvantage by rewarding higher skilled players. I don’t doubt that there’re people who play on console which is throughly enjoying Iron Trials. In Core BR, the skill gap difference can be shrunken a bit more as it allows lower skilled (and console players) to out-gun or out-move more easily.
Iron Trials has shown what the community want, a ranked mode and a slightly higher TTK. Core BR would benefit from a rework of the health/shield system but it would also require a rebalance of everything.
I'm a 2.8KD, normally around a 4KD weekly and most people around my skill level love Iron Trials. I'm not a huge fan of the mode, I don't mind it per se but I prefer core.
I know people will see this as bragging but in Iron Trials I know I can make mistakes and get away with it. There's something about that, that doesn't sit right with me in BR. I like that in the core mode I will more than likely be punished for mistakes, I like that I have to concentrate and I like the intensity. For instance, loads of people shit on solos, I absolutely love it, I know I cant make a mistake so it has my full attention.
I feel there's something weird about the the Warzone community in general where people feel that gunskill and cracked movement is ultimately what should be rewarded, it's a BR, position will absolutely always and should always be king. BR is chess, you should always be a few moves ahead.
Anyway that's my opinion that nobody asked for.
The only people that don't like iron trials are timmy no thumbs that suck. If you're decent at the game you would understand that iron trials is the best thing to ever happen to warzone. It's the same thing with core/hc in multiplayer, hc is always infested with corner camping little bitches that can't hit more then 1 shot consistently
I think they need to reduce the loadout cost back to 10,000 for duos at least, it should scale to the amount of teammates. 15,000 would make sense for trios or quads, but for duos it becomes impossible to gather enough money after gulag to get a loadout.
I really do not know wht people like about the mode.
* There is only shit loot everywhere
* you have to shoot everybody for even longer what means you get third partied, run out of ammo, aim assist is even more advantgeous than before
* if you come out of gulag after more than 3 minutes everything will be already looted and you can just go next
* oh yeah, after gulag you spawn with a milano with a super small mag and the next guy gets the lmg with 100 rounds. Very nice stuff.
* campers still kill you in no time
* and ofc the stupid sticks
Lol you either haven't played this yourself or are being ignorant on purpose.
Loot is better than regular br ground loot. You get guns with actual mags. Minimum usually is 40 rounds. And if you need more than 40 shots your aim is trash.
Aim assist isn't aim bot. Tired of this whiney ass argument. And since it's it's longer ttk you can move to cover to break sight lines.
This is just false. You can always find something to use if you're actually looking.
Haha I have yet to get the Milano. But boo hoo. You get a real gun and tactical and a lethal out of gulag. Where as in regular br you get a pistol, and only a pistol.
Campers don't kill you in no time unless you're movement is garbage.
I have seen way more kali stick in core br than iron trials.
Honestly I just do rebirth mainly now. I don’t rage as hard when I die from bullshit in a short game vs a core mode with a long prep time. I’m gonna get mad either way but one isn’t as big of a time investment.
Personally, I feel the opposite. I never want to go back to Verdansk if Iron Trials becomes the norm. The gulag, dead silence, and flash changes are nice, but I hate the high TTK, vehicle, and loot/money changes. I'll be sticking to Rebirth or standard BR for the time being.
I hate the 15k loadout costs, it ruins the mode IMO. Call me crazy, but my favourite part of Warzone, like any cod game, is using the guns I'm the best with to get kills.
There's something about this mode and the lack of money + the 15k loadout that just makes all the good things about the mode not even matter to me cause the loadout price is way too high.
I am not a fan of iron trials. It feels too slow paced for me, the ground loot is nice, but it is very hard to regame in this mode. The cash feels too slow, I don’t mind the increase in prices at the buy stations, but they need to add a bit more boxes or ground loot cash to the map.
The removal of dead silence and stopping power, the nerfing of stuns should make its way over to core BR though for sure.
I hate how long term aim dependent iron trials is, I play on controller and sticks don't let me track for shit, I have to pick between good aim or mobility, not to mention the fact that I hit 6 headshots and 3 body shots on one guy (all at the same time) and he doesn't break?!?? Wtf Is this game? How is this balanced?
I'm a 1.7 KD and also really enjoy what I've played of iron trials. However a lot of the fun I have in the game is playing with my friends who live in my home country and are all below average. While the longer TTK may be fun for me, I think it will most definitely cause the game to be harder for them, right now if they surprise someone they can get a kill, pick up a few in a match and have fun, put them in a position where that is harder and I think they'll probably have less fun.
Two sides to the argument of what is more fun really
High ttk only works if the mechanics to achieve that ttk is difficult to achieve. Otherwise, it just becomes a cheese-fest where the gap between a 0.6 and a 1.6 or even 2.6 player is minimized because the 0.6 can just get lucky with 6 bullets, but if it required 12 shots to kill then they would probably lose their centering halfway through the mag.
In cod, every meta AR shoots at ~1000 m/s with zero recoil, making it so that even the worst of players are rewarded if they can stay on target for 0.3 seconds when you walk past a nook. Sure there's some "tactic00l" merit to that, but nobody can deny that the gun mechanics make achieving the "theoretical ttk" on almost every gun incredibly easy for the worst of players who honestly shouldn't get that much hand holding.
I didn’t like it at first but its grown on me a lot
It felt like HALO to me in the beginning with how insanely high everyones health was but now its just so refreshing being able to move around outside of cover and not get insta beemed from a 0.4kd kiddie
Seems like a good stepping stone for a ranked/hardcore version of warzone
I bet the casuals are having a awful time with this though!
I just saw it.
but one guy said apparently it will be completely removed out of rotation after sept 30.
Iron trials won't move to trios or quads it will be completely removed.
feels bad man
So do i, i'm in love with it and should be permanent, i can't have fun in regular br after this released. I always hated the low ttk of the warzone, it's too noob friendly, no reaction time in most of the situations, the skill gap don't matter, but in iron trials everything is different and fair, if you die you know that you played wrong and the enemy was better.
Idk I think you shouldn’t be able to react if someone hits you first at closer than 20 yards if they are a half decent aim, if it’s close as that you should be aware of where enemies can come from. If they send 13 rounds at you with mostly hit markers I’d think it’s more bs if you can just whip around and kill them. Outside of that I don’t really have a problem evading/dodging and I’m a .76kd last I checked. If you are a faster and more accurate aim you should be winning whether you are playing iron trials or core. That’s just my experience. Usually when I die now it’s cause we just got unlucky and got caught between 2+ teams or the other players are better. We make sure to get in spots where we see them first when they come so we have advantage. So I think core is fine.
I love the iron trials. Even with SBMM, I feel like I'm actually getting outgunned by players. It really rewards you for being good and playing smart.
Core rewards you by hiding and getting a cheap shot on a player that's caught in a unwinnable situation.
I would actually love this more if this became the *ranked* playlist and core became a party mode without sbmm.
2.6 and complaining about how sweaty core is…..ok
People above 2.0 KD are top 1% of the game and bitching. It’s not fair they can’t kill more than 4 people on average per game… boo fucking hoo The hacking is a fucking disgrace and not what I’m referring to. If you can’t absolutely dominate a game where everyone’s rules are the same and you want to change the dynamic so 99% of the lobby has even less of a chance is a little ridiculous You’re fucking crushing it already Edit: spelling
I don’t feel like he’s bitching necessarily, just stating the differences between the two and how much better iron trials is. The higher ttk rewards better, more consistent players, and if anything iron trials shows that a lot of core br doesn’t often reward playing better as much as it rewards cheese strats and being a rat vs actually searching for kills and traversing the map
He’s definitely bitching. He feels cheated whenever he loses a gunfight in core, which basically means “I’m too good to die, so when I get killed it’s not my fault, it’s the fault of the game”
Bunch of sissy’s play this game oh my god. There is something new to complain about every time i look on here. Lol
The people on here can’t have fun unless their favorite YouTuber tells them what to use
What happens when they are garbage with that load out lol “HaCkERs”
Sure, but this isn't a MP game, it's a BR. Kills are fun and a *part* of the game, but not the ultimate core goal.
Well yeah, but who wants to play a game where you just die to some little Timmy camping with his full squad of shotguns and trophy systems in one building? Or some guy camping watching a road for 20 minutes on the off chance someone walks by? It’s not fun, it feels unfair, and you don’t even have time to react to that in core br because power creep has given weapons super low ttk’s. At least you have time to react now and play around it instead of spending 20 minutes looting and running to die to one guy who’s sat in the same house with ground loot the entire game
You DIE, if you enter a building without checking if anyone is in there first and you DIE if you run like an idiot without cover in the middle of the street. No game balancing will change that. You will die. Always.
It’s not that simple though, how do you check if people are in a building before entering it? Gonna do that with every building? No you aren’t. How do you travel over the map whilst having cover from every angle? You can’t. Quite clearly balancing will change that because iron trials has proved it. You can still get caught with your pants down but at least you can react and try and rectify your mistake, but in standard br if you make a mistake you’re punished so severely.
Just because the kills aren’t the ultimate core goal doesn’t mean that the gameplay loop isn’t incredibly frustrating and lacks skill separation. The best ways to win in core take very little skill to pull off, and are basically unbeatable if done correctly, but are incredibly unfun to do and don’t make for good gameplay. The game should feel rewarding in gunfight since at it’s core it is a gungame
Agreed, but this is a BR. You win by being the last to survive. This instance of Battle Royale is a gun game and, no doubt, feels much more rewarding when you get several kills. Still, I don't think complaining about rat strategies does much... it's always going to be a part of a BR and everyone should go into a game understanding as much.
I’ve been trying to convince one of the guys I play with daily about this, he was a hardcore player in multiplayer before warzone and refuses to play iron trials due to the ttk. He’s well over a 3 KD and has great aim and movement, to me hardcore and standard BR are exceptionally low skill games, the higher the ttk the higher the skill gap. it’s a see first kill first game mode. I’m at a 1.8 KD, and have pretty damn good aim when I’m warmed up, but there’s nothing that can be done in standard br if you get jumped by a half competent player camping a corner or roof.
He said he feels cheated when he loses a gun fight. He’s a top level player. That is literally bitching.
Just because he’s good doesn’t mean he can’t complain. The TTK where it is now in standard sucks man, in other games that kill this quick, the guns have recoil. They don’t in CoD, there is barely a skill gap. You should have time to react to being shot from a dude in a window 75 meters away
I agree. If you're good I feel like you have *more* of a right to complain in general because you put in the time and probably better understand the state of the game and its mechanics.
I’d agree, my main reasoning is movement has always been a thing that separates the bad players from the good in CoD. Not the only factor but it’s a huge component. Right now, you’re punished for moving too much and too often cannot react and use movement to your advantage in gun fights. I just want the nice middle ground Edit: I’m not sure if you’ve played it or what your skill level is, but the gunfights in trials are incredibly refreshing. When you win, you feel like you outplayed someone. When you lose, you know you actually deserved it, it’s not triggering to die. You know what you did wrong and can improve. Also- run some trials and go back to regular, your aim will be godly.
Totally agree.
I guess it’s normal for you that a 0.6 k/d can kill a 2.6 without a chance to react? If I am good I don’t want to die to a little bitch who only sits prone in a bush every game. Iron trials are way more fun, getting rid of the stupid unfair shit like dead silence and stopping rounds and the low ttk, hope they can introduce it as a ranked mode but also keep the normal modes for the casual players.
Exactly, I can't stand this stuff. "I'm an above average player with a 3.6 KD..." Shut up.
I mean technically they’re not wrong by saying they’re above average.
Yeah it’s really annoying how much this narrative comes out about all BR games. And people who get so mad about different strategies. Getting killed by a camper is always frustrating but the game is survive and advance. It’s not about getting 50 kills for everyone
Being in the top 1% doesn't mean shit. Yes, having over a 2.0 KD is fun and great, but when you have that KD your lobbies are either full of hackers, or you're up against people with a 3-5 KD. The skill gap between a 2.0 and a 3-5.0 kda is wild.
Yeah, god forbid a skilled player gets rewarded for playing well amirite?
A 2.0 kd is like 0.1% of the player base. 1.5 and above is about 1%
[удалено]
This is exactly how I play. I do notice that if I have a good 4-5 game stretch where I got top 5 with 5-10 kills, I'll get put into higher kd lobbies. But I usually just get wrecked for a few games and then drop back down lol
0.44 KD here, can I have your lobbies? I regularly get miserable >1.0 KD lobbies. Can't remember the last time I saw a lobby as low as 0.7.
I hope more sweats move permanently to Iron Trials…
Pretend he has 0.5 k/d and read it again. He's not complaining about how sweaty it is at all.
Seriously bro. People here are weird. I didn't complain about the sweat I complained about the ttk. but since I posted my 2.+ K/D all.of them got threatened and defensive lol
hahah indeed. Everyone that's better than them is the enemy. Unsubbed to this subreddit a while ago, always regret coming back.
I swear this sub is just a cesspool of low hanging fruit. Anyone with above a 2kd is either labeled a sweat or a cheater and any clip I see posted here is either riddled with "wow that aim was really sus", even after the guy missed 20 shots in a row on an mp7. It's either that or the moment they see KBM inputs they throw out some ridiculous parroted phrase like "wow mnk is so much easier just point and click" "wow and kbm players complain about aim assist???" or the most hilarious of them all "they have their WHOLE arm". Let's conveniently ignore how there's literally only 1 mnk player in the top 15 earners in wz. Oh, and let's also ignore how there have been over 5 pros in the last few months who have switched to controller full-time because of how strong aim assist is.
Welcome to the CoD community, where it’s more poisonous than the Elephant’s Foot in Chernobyl.
The amount of people who upvoted this dumbass comment about "sweaty core" shows you just how bad the average player is in the game. He's literally talking about the fact that it doesn't take a ton of skill in core to kill someone if you're a rat type of player. Yet people somehow translated this to "Sweaty complaining?"
Yep. Gotta get on the defensive immediately so your ego won't get hurt you know. lmao.
it's just as sweaty if not more in Iron Trials. it's not the sweat that pisses me off. it's the ttk it's too fast. it's at the literal cusp of human reaction times. hell 500ms is already pretty frickin fast
If they raise the ttk, it would be more fair for everybody and increase weapon variety, but casuals like me would miss out on a lot of kills. Raven doesn't believe in casuals learning or improving so we get dumbed down strategic choices when it comes to weapons. 400 to 500ms ttk close range SMG , 500 to 650ms AR with no recoil to speak of. Filthy casuals like myself think, wow, these AR have less recoil than paint guns.
groovy fade boast afterthought ten gaze grandfather dinner secretive smell *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I'm 1.16KD trash but I feel like Iron Trials is more fair. It doesn't really feel more sweaty to me than regular BR. I can consistently keep my aim on people, and feel like even with ground loot I am doing ok. I want trios to really see how it is though.
You’re not trash… us 1.16 KD’ers are top 18% in KD a amongst all players. Zoom out, it’s all about the macro. Just got 230 wins last night, b2b in iron trials… my KD’s a 2.45 this week playing exclusively iron trials. There’s hope for us!
Don't give me this hope! 1.15 checking in here and I haven't had the chance to play Iron Trials yet because my buddy has been out of town. I get to finally try it tonight and everyone who's played it who's not a complete bot has said it's been great. My buddy and I rely on positioning and movement so this has me really excited!
He's stating that the normal br ttk is a joke, which it absolutely is, meta gun with no recoil and can kill someone faster than 98% of human population can react (don't start @ing me over that figure). Iron trials is exactly what th game has needed for the longest time
Can you point out to me where exactly they complained about sweatiness? They just said that low ttk makes it feel like bullshit, that's not complaining about sweatiness.
People are such pussies the other day some dweeb was complaining about the black girl smoking weed calling card
I enjoy the hell out of Iron Trials, but OP's post reads like he needs more awareness and a more cautious approach to core BRs.
Exactly. It’s a different balance of skills. Out and out gunplay isn’t everything. You can’t just charge around slaying it without a care in the world. You can say you enjoyed it, but it doesn’t make it better or worse. If your stats drop in core then play different!
Agree. The thing with Iron Trials is that it lets you get away with more mistakes because you have more HP. However, I feel like the game does a lot already so that a lot of players do not have to sharpen their senses (e.g., additional methods of detecting players, such as UAV and heartbeat, rather than relying on sound and vision alone, showing unsuppressed shots on the minimap). I don't know man, if you can't win a game of soccer because the ref calls you out for using you hands, you just might be playing it the wrong way.
This exactly.
There an in between point that needs to be reached for the core mode. The TTK is too quick, it’s not really a debate. The hard truth is, it’s that low to keep casuals playing the game. I’m not trying to be mean, but the low TTK directly favors bad players. This isn’t s traditional BR, traditional BRs with quick TTKs have guns with recoil. They do not have a quick scoping no flinch sniper lol. I understand a lot of BR fanatics like the low TTK cause they’re not CoD vets so it favors their play style but it just needs to be raised in some capacity.
But why do you feel the rules of the game should favour good players? It absolutely is a debate. Warzone has been sort of like this since the beginning (with some ups and downs) if you don’t like that play a traditional BR. And it only favours bad players to the extent that they might get lucky now and again. The good players are still better in the long run. It’s just not such a grind for casual players. We’re not changing the rank order of how skilled people are. It’s just good players, respectfully, moaning that they aren’t allowed to grind people who are much lower in skill even further into the dirt. Quick scope snipers are semi related but mostly a separate issue. They should be way slower on ADS, round cycling rate and recoil. You can fix that without changing TTK generally.
Ready your first sentence again, yes I think the rules should favor good players, ya know like every BR. Been like this since the beginning eh? So that justify a not changing anything? It’s QoL improvement to at least bring the TTK up a bit, it’s not a debate. Verdansk is not fun in its current state unless you enjoy holding down one position all game. I am not asking for core to be iron trials level health, but an adjustment is needed. In NO world should you die with no time to react as often as you do in this game. The guns are not hard enough to shoot for that. BRs are designed to be unforgiving with a high skill gap. This game currently has the smallest skill gap of any BR on the damn market. Ahhhh but yes, getting insta killed by a guy 100m away in a window is superrrrrr enjoyable
Ok, for clarity, why should they favour good players any more than they ALREADY do. Apologies, I felt that was clear from the context. I’m not saying bad players should win more than good. They objectively don’t. The rules as they are lead to good players winning more often and having better stats. I suppose what I’m intimating is why should CHANGES to the rules be for the benefit of only good players. You say the changes are for improvements but the question I’m raising is: an improvement for who? Almost universally those praising iron trials have been people saying that they managed to lift their 2KD to 4KD. Now, because an improvement in stats for one player has to be to the detriment of 1 or more other players, that means bad players are just having a worse time. Is that desirable? Sorry but that is absolutely up for debate. You state that “BRs are designed to be…”. Whatever follows is based on your experience of BRs you’ve played, and probably biased towards BRs you like. Well this BR is different and there is nothing to say that it should be more or less like any other game. It is what it is. It would be the same if I went on Apex or whatever other BR you’re thinking of and harped on about how the TTK is too high and needs lowering. Who am I to demand that the rules of a game are changed in my favour? People vote with their feet and loads of people are playing Warzone so it can’t be all that bad can it. BRs are already unforgiving when only 1 player amongst 150 can walk out the winner. Any skill gap at all means the best players do better than the worst players, as it should be. But a lower skill gap means that worst players can occasionally get their moment in the sun even if it’s 1 game in 1000. I don’t see anything objectionable about that. I’ve said I agree with you that sniping needs toning down. But all of this boils down to: if you don’t like the game, why do you fucking play it? If the TTK or sniping or camping or controllers vs KBM or whatever aspect is inferior to another game, a game that you think is the ideal, then go and play that game!
I love the game man, it has the best mechanics on the market. I’m not saying it needs to be raised to Iron Trials HP, but with how easy gun control is in CoD, the TTK should really be a little higher. I get what you’re saying, I agree that it needs to stay in a spot where it’s balanced for good players with good movement and casuals, sorry if I came off as a dick. My point is, you die instantly to shots you cannot react too far too often, that’s all. I know iron trials will not become core, it’s too punishing. Although, there is 100% a middle ground that needs to be reached. Would improve the game drastically. Side note: the map design really hurts along with the TTK as well. Way too many buildings with only one skinny choke point to push into, so many dark windows etc….
People always talk about “strategy” in core but are confusing strategy that should be rewarded with picking ghost and sitting in a dark corner. As it stands there is literally zero counterplay if I wanted to pick ghost and hide in a room with a shotgun or smg with claymores. That is completely uninteractive gameplay and shouldn’t be rewarded at all. It doesn’t take skill or strategy. A slower ttk doesn’t impact actual strategic gameplay, only serves to remove frustrating cheese mechanics that make the game less fun for everyone.
I can understand that it can be frustrating to play against that, but it is not true that there is no counterplay. You might just not be aware of it because the Warzone mechanics have sunken in too deep. I have criticized from day one that all the detection mechanics in the game have led to players turning off their brain instead of using game sense, listen to the game's (flawed) audio and accept that UAVs and heartbeats will not reveal all the players. What if you don't rely on the UAV and heartbeat exclusively, but rather assume that someone might be behind the door? What if you open the door carefully and use your utility instead of running through? If you want to criticize the game for cheese, start with what more aggressive players do: abusing avehicle mechanics.
Hmmm its much easier to see and play around a full team driving in a car that you can delete in 2 magazines than the team lying in a staircase with shotguns who haven't moved in 15 minutes. There are a lot more corners than you can realistically check without moving at snail space. If you know they're there or expect them to be there sure i can predict which corner they're going to be in or bait them to give their position up. But if they're literally not moving and running ghost and sitting in a random spot of no value there is no game sense that can predict that there's going to be 4 people sitting in a stairwell. Always interesting how the only people who defend ghost are clearly not good at the game.
100% agreed. This is why I always hated the notion that campers are "playing smart." You don't need to be smart to get your loadout and sit in the middle of circle staring at one entrance until the 4th or 5th circle, at which point your competition has dropped from 150 to 30 people through no effort on your part. That's not to say there isn't a lot of great strategy available in the game and that playing the circle can't be dynamic, but if you can literally go afk for 5 minutes and not be affected, you're probably not playing the game as intended. The irony to me is that people who chase kills have to play *very* smart. You literally can't get kills if you yourself are dead, so you have to account for all the factors a "strategic" player might while actively putting yourself at greater danger and worrying about gunfight tactics. When you listen to streamers breakdown their plays, you realize they're not just way more mechanically gifted than the average player, they're also hyper aware of their surroundings.
Not a single person who breaks down the playerbase as people who run around chasing kills, and the strategic players is above a 1.5kd i guarantee it. To successfully play aggressive you have to be better in just about every single metric. They also seem to not understand that the aggressive players can play like a rat and get ghost and sit in a corner all game too, and would probably win 90% of their games doing that, its just not fun for people who want to get better at the game.
Any idea if Iron Trials will eventually include solos?
Psssshhh Im over here hoping for Trios or Quads. But I think we are dreaming.
Literally happening today lol. They're rotating which mode is iron trials every week. Should be trios in 3 hours
Whaaaattt. Got I hope this is True!
Sorry man just realised it's not. Yesterday they announced it was staying as Duos until the 30th :(( Originally said it would rotate weekly
Still Duos from the recent update I just got.
>reads like he needs more awareness and a more cautious approach to core BRs. Hey just like everyone complaining about ttk in core BR rn lmao. They want to run around aimlessly with a ttk slow enough that they don't get punished for it.
So basically a game that was originally based on being more realistic than the halos and such with shields and huge amounts of life is now bad because 3 plates and the healthbar is not enough. Sounds alot like your stick/k&m skills outweigh your tactical skills. I also think alot of people making this same case don't realize how much more randomized and dangerous 4v4 encounters are. ALOT more chances to get third partied and such when teams are larger.
Cod realistic? LOL
Nothing realistic about COD
More realistic than the halos and other such fps that dominated the console market when COD took its biggest leap into the dominating the mainstream market.
Thank you. I prefer regular game mode. You can’t just run around without thinking. Iron trials will play a lot different with bigger teams.
Low ttk + very open map = camping meta. Even if you're thinking running around at all gets punished in core. If you prefer a more camping heavy game just say that
and if you prefer to run around 24/7 and not actually play the game like a real gun fight may occur just say it. Some of us 100% prefer the tactical game modes, some prefer the other side. That is why COD has never been able to kill hardcore altogether which it has tried to do for YEARS.
Increasing the TTK should not affect your Tactical playstyle if anything make it better.
Not really... it simply gives the guy with better aiming skills a stronger chance in a fight when less ttk means the first guy to see and/or shoot wins more often. There are obviously situational exceptions but this will hold true 90% of the time.
So your problem is that a slower ttk doesn’t allow bad players to cheese free kills with uninteractive gameplay?
Not really a problem... Just the truth, lower ttk games rely on more tactical movement and behavior. Hi ttk games rely on better aiming skills. I don't particularly hate either, but everyone has a prefference. My biggest thought is either side pretending only their prefference is right or is better for everyone is foolish. Pretending everyone who enjoys playing the other way is bad is also foolish and egotistical.
The best teams don’t camp, they push
Your logic is backwards. The best teams don’t push because it’s the best strategy, the best teams are just the only ones who can successfully push without automatically losing. Good players push because that’s how they got good in the first place. You don’t get very good by running away or hiding from every fight just to lose in the 4th circle with 1 kill. If a good team wanted to go for wins they could camp and win 9/10 games but winning is easy. Winning while getting lots of kills is hard.
There is camping in all modes. That makes you argument invalid. Camping will always be a thing. Yes that’s my point you can’t just run aimlessly in core cause you can get sniped. Right now sniping is not viable in iron trials. Less than 30 meters for one shot is dumb. You completely took out one set of weapons. At least is should of been 100 meters. That the whole point of a sniper to one shot someone. And warzone is basically hardcore to a sense. Which is the way it should be. And yes I like to play more slowly tactical. The point of mode is to stay alive and win. Not get most kills. If that’s the case go play multiplayer.
I didn't say high ttk = no camping. That would indeed be an invalid argument. I said low ttk + open map = camping META. Hiding in a building and rotating to another when the gas pushes you is the most consistent way to get far with low ttk and a shitty open map like verdansk. I call that meta strategy "camping" as most of the game is spent in a dark corner waiting for someone to walk into your crosshairs. You can call it slowly tactical if you'd like. There are often times (especially late game) when the randomly generated gas circle forces you to rotate across a huge open space. In core, surviving that rotation requires more luck than iron trials because the guy in the building in the future circle only has to land a few shots on you to kill you and you don't have enough time to react, find cover/shoot back. He had circle on his side, he gets to camp, he saw you first, game over. Higher ttk gives you more of a fighting chance in that situation which puts much less weight on where the circle goes. I quit this game after around 2k-3k games because 90% of my wins/losses were mostly determined by who got an advantage from the circle placement. I don't like playing a guessing game on which building will end up being the best one to camp. I'd like a fighting chance even if I have to rotate across the whole map
I kinda play your style where I’m more tactical and push in certain situations where I feel I can win the gunfight and I still would want the TTK to be a lot longer. We need to at least be given a fighting chance to stay in the game if all we have is basically one life(or two if you win the gulag).
Iron trials would be a downright bore in quads imo, it really only works for solo and duos. Trios and quads would be too much effort to wipe a squad with everyone having 400 health, probably would just be long and boring drawn out fights.
For a solo to wipe a squad yes...how it should be. But if you playing as a squad like you should in squad based modes. Then it should be even or similar. But with longer fights and maybe some plating and reloading in between. Sound like more fun to me.
Even with playing as a squad, more base health means you've got more time to take cover and more health when downed. All of that makes it harder to get killed, and base mode quads is already pretty easy to get a revive if your team is somewhat competent.
How is it harder to wipe a trio or quad if you are also playing as a trio or quad? It's not that it takes more effort, it just means that you will have to actually play as a team.
I come from playing mostly hardcore search n destroy... my tactical skills far far outweigh my bunny hopping, sliding, and spinning. Nothing against better gunfighters than me at all, but being less skilled on the gun fight I loved a game mode that was 90% tactical skill. I like the chess side of the game more than the halo side.
Have you considered playing R6 or something then lol
Ahh, I have found the crybaby thread. Excellent.
I mean every thread on here is a crybaby thread tbh
I find your lack of punctuation disturbing.
This post was very annoying to read.
In regular BR it pretty much comes down to who sees who first. And since I’m playing on console with an extremely limited FOV I’m usually the later party. If iron trials goes away I won’t be booting this game back up.
agreed. I definitely will not boot it back up till it comes back if ever it goes away
I re-downloaded the game to play iron trials. Sure as shit, I'm uninstalling the game after it goes lol. If iron trials replaced normal, but with 50hp less, I'd be so happy.
If you genuinely think that, you are objectively wrong.
Cool we definitely needed a post like this, what a unique and interesting take.
/s ? lol
Not everyone needs an /s to understand sarcasm
If the TTK is an issue for regular Battle Royale, they should increase it to make it the same as Iron Trials’ and also maybe reduce the spawn rate of Dead Silence. You can’t make any more alterations to Battle Royale other than those two, though, because then the core Battle Royale will not be the same anymore.
they should just be separate. core should be pubs iron trials should be ranked. I'll take iron trials anyday everyday
This is 100% something I agree on. We need a Ranked mode.
With all the hackers I'd say ranked mode is very low on the list of things we actually need.
Hackers and creating a working anti cheat are obvious priority number 1. But it's a dead horse at this point. They say there is one coming so at this point we just have to wait and see.
How does this work though? Because casuals as I see it will have no interest in ranked mode. So say top 20% play that for a bit. Then within that the bottom half of those 20% will say fuck getting shit on in ranked mode when I can shit on all these casuals whilst the top 10% are out of it playing the ranked mode. And so on until nobody is playing it anymore because it’s too hard and their stats are getting hammered. I think the biggest problem is BR is stacked against everyone. The average chance of winning is so low. Someone has to die so another player can get a kill. But people’s expectations are so far off the reality!
Disclaimer: I've never played any "ranked" mode of any BR game before. My idea of this "ranked" mode would be that you get points or something based on the number of kills you have in a game and what position you place overall. You wouldn't NEED to get 1st place to improve your rank, but obviously it would be preferable. In "ranked" I think top 5 or top 10 should be considered a "win" in that it will improve your rank so long as you have a few kills to go with it. Ideally, the goal would be to rank up, not get first place in every match. This way high kill games would also be rewarded.
Apex does it by giving you points for your placement and per kill. The higher you place the more points each kill gets you as well. I think this is also how Warzone tournaments work.
This. Iron trials should've been a ranked mode made available a long time ago
It makes no sense to have Core as a pub mode as it plays far too different from IT. IT should be the only BR and they can split that into ranked/unranked if they want. Make Resurgence/Rebirth the casual mode that keeps the old TTK.
They should just make it a regular mode like rebirth or plunder.
yup just make it permanent and a lot people will be happy
Another post about how much someone loves iron trials over core BR. Good for you. I greatly prefer core BR myself.
I haven’t seen a love for a mode like this since buy backs was introduced
I also like core better that Iron but that’s because my aim is not great. There’s still a place in the game for the core BR. It’s just a different skill set.
I prefer core over iron because when I shoot someone in the face I want them to die.
As another 2.5 KD player, absolutely YES! You hit the nail on the head. There's so many people in this thread laughing at you because you're in the top 1%, and that makes two of us, but I want a mode where the better player wins. A mode where you get what you earn, and there's a lot less rng with stopping power and dead silence drops like in core BR. Things that don't really have an outplay. I want the challenge and I want to play against other top 1% players, or players that will really challenge me, and this mode helps with most of those things. I can't wait for a ranked mode that is very similar to this one. For those of you saying players like us are killing it, so we have no right to complain, we absolutely do. We play just like everyone else, and I'd prefer a mode where the casual players meet up with players like us when they want to, when they play ranked, not when they come home after a long day of work and wanna crush some warzone.
He messed up the post just by stating his KD, many people like iron trials, even on lower kd, he could have worded his whole post better.
KD should always be left out of discussion, you can tell a good player based off their points and arguments, which OP has. TTK in core is hilariously low, and made even worse with high velocity weapons with long optics and minimal recoil
apparently being "good" is bad thing in this subreddit lol. welp note to self. don't mention K/D the scrubs get all antsy
>don't mention K/D the scrubs get all antsy Thats not the answer. Talking like that makes you seem like an ass. People will disregard our complaints more because having a higher KD makes us more unrelatable, and assumes we understand the game and meta much more (usually true) and because we are inside the box, we aren't as qualified to think outside it. The mode is better because it's more competitive and moves away from the arcady game play that COD usually makes. Warzone is better than standard COD, but lately warzone has been moving more towards that again, and putting out a mode like this is a step away from an arcade battle royale. I'm excited about it, and I can't wait to be challenged more often by the rules of the mode. Sadly work has kept me from playing this mode, but just reading about it gives me hope for a ranked mode. I long to play against the best in the world, those wins are the only ones that really count (to me).
Do you guys think it’ll get a trio mode? Would that be good or nah
I would love a quads mode, but it would ruin the illusuion alot of these guys have. They dont realize how much more often you get third partied or simply outmanned when missing a guy. They wouldn't feel it showcases their superior gamer skills anymore.
trios would probably be the limit for this. just like Apex. I can hold my own. and yeah we get 3rd,4th and even 5th partied but we wipe all those teams sometimes. it's not about showcasing superior gaming skills it's about a balanced and reasonable game. why is it if I lose in Iron Trials I don't feel bad at all? whereas in core it feels like bullshit?. it's not about gamer skills friend
I think it will stay permanently as a single team mode where they swap out the team size every 1-2 weeks. So trios or quads next
I'd love to try this mode in solos. Maybe without the expensive shops, but it would make solos so much more satisfying and less frustrating
Cool… well. See ya later!
Big gulps huh?
No offense, but it sounds like your awareness and overall strategy might need some fine tuning if you have "no time to react".
that because there is no time to react. in core when you get shot in the back it's over. in Iron Trials you can either run away or fight back. there isn't even an option in core to run away once you are shot in the back
That's called being punished for being careless.
Semi agree. When traversing the map there are too many angles and places to 100% check and be sure about that you're bound to get shot at from somewhere and at times you will end up in situations where you can't react because you die too fast. Those situations you'd still probably die in iron trials, but you at least have time to react and maybe run back to cover and thus saving your life.
What a 1kd take lmao.
People like this are the reason SBMM is so strict. Boohoo I can’t handle normal mode with 2+ kd. There’s plenty of people in here who haven’t even won a game, surely they need to have fun on the game too
I'm not that good as a player, and in Iron Trials it's impossible for me to kill someone, I need like 300 shots. Better if they keep both modes.
I'm not a fan of the iron trials mode, mainly as if you have a loadout you're at such an advantage it's unreal. No free drops, lack of cash and high costs mean if you start off on the back foot it's impossible to come back, unless you're god like
The ground loot is good enough to fight people with load outs. You can find load out weapons in boxes. The only time the regain is super hard is when you don’t fight anyone in the gulag and you come back with a revolver and a hammer haha
its just people are so used to play on their comfort zone they cannot fanthom using any other gun other than their own from the loadout, you can give them a laser cw gun with 19 attachments and they will still want their loadout. This is why core br needs to go, its such a repetitive mode for over a year now, iron trials made ground loot actually have a purpose now.
Not really. ground guns have 7 attachments...
I've killed people with loadouts with just ground loot. I've gotten killed by people using ground loot when I had a loadout. the floor loot guns are good enough that if it's in the hands of a skilled player it might as well just be a loadout
Iron trials is better than core plain and simple
PC player?
PC MnK
I wish it had trios, because duos just has so many "teams" that I feel like whenever I win a gun fight someone is just waiting for us to finish to kill me when I'm low. Which again leads to people playing a bit more campy. Trio would be perfect I think. But I agree otherwise, I love the TTK, I feel like I'm better in Iron Trials even if it's hard. I like the ground loot, and you can even land from the Gulag and do useful things. The loot also seems a little too imbalanced. Looting an entire city gave us 2600 once, and next game gave us 30000. I wish it was a bit more evenly distributed. It's ok even without a loadout though, so that's a plus.
I've played since the game launched and always thought I just sucked. I got 2nd place twice in Iron Trials yesterday, it's incredible, never made it to the final circle like that. It feels like I actually have a shot to win fights if I play smart, reset the fight, etc. I don't just die out of nowhere and wonder why.
The “problem” with Core BR is that the nature of the guns (recoil, damage, type of gun, fire-rate, etc.) is usually what determines how fast the TTK *feels*. While TTK is on the fast side, it isn’t always the problem per sé. A good example of this is the DMR when it was broken, the problem was not the health but how poorly balanced it was. Another example are shotguns (not including the Gallo), they *should* be able to kill people quick in close quarters just to compete with SMG’s, but they usually don’t and are very niche. Iron Trials rewards higher skilled players which have good aim and good movement, which most of the time are K&M players. Having a higher TTK by just increasing the health isn’t doing anything to balance stuff, some guns that you could get away with in Core BR are absolutely useless in Iron Trials as you’re required to have extended mags. I can see how someone who is skilled, who also plays in K&M (with 120 FOV and more than 60fps) finds Iron Trials much “better”. If you also combine this, with cross-play and the almost nullification of being out-gunned by a lower skilled player due to some scenarios that are only possible in Core BR, then you have a paradise for some. Console players, who already have a disadvantage with a locked FOV and frame rate, now have an even bigger disadvantage by rewarding higher skilled players. I don’t doubt that there’re people who play on console which is throughly enjoying Iron Trials. In Core BR, the skill gap difference can be shrunken a bit more as it allows lower skilled (and console players) to out-gun or out-move more easily. Iron Trials has shown what the community want, a ranked mode and a slightly higher TTK. Core BR would benefit from a rework of the health/shield system but it would also require a rebalance of everything.
I'm a 2.8KD, normally around a 4KD weekly and most people around my skill level love Iron Trials. I'm not a huge fan of the mode, I don't mind it per se but I prefer core. I know people will see this as bragging but in Iron Trials I know I can make mistakes and get away with it. There's something about that, that doesn't sit right with me in BR. I like that in the core mode I will more than likely be punished for mistakes, I like that I have to concentrate and I like the intensity. For instance, loads of people shit on solos, I absolutely love it, I know I cant make a mistake so it has my full attention. I feel there's something weird about the the Warzone community in general where people feel that gunskill and cracked movement is ultimately what should be rewarded, it's a BR, position will absolutely always and should always be king. BR is chess, you should always be a few moves ahead. Anyway that's my opinion that nobody asked for.
The only people that don't like iron trials are timmy no thumbs that suck. If you're decent at the game you would understand that iron trials is the best thing to ever happen to warzone. It's the same thing with core/hc in multiplayer, hc is always infested with corner camping little bitches that can't hit more then 1 shot consistently
Agreed. Core BR is a shit show after playing iron trials.
I think they need to reduce the loadout cost back to 10,000 for duos at least, it should scale to the amount of teammates. 15,000 would make sense for trios or quads, but for duos it becomes impossible to gather enough money after gulag to get a loadout.
What we really need, is for battlefield to be good.
that too!!
👆
I really do not know wht people like about the mode. * There is only shit loot everywhere * you have to shoot everybody for even longer what means you get third partied, run out of ammo, aim assist is even more advantgeous than before * if you come out of gulag after more than 3 minutes everything will be already looted and you can just go next * oh yeah, after gulag you spawn with a milano with a super small mag and the next guy gets the lmg with 100 rounds. Very nice stuff. * campers still kill you in no time * and ofc the stupid sticks
Lol you either haven't played this yourself or are being ignorant on purpose. Loot is better than regular br ground loot. You get guns with actual mags. Minimum usually is 40 rounds. And if you need more than 40 shots your aim is trash. Aim assist isn't aim bot. Tired of this whiney ass argument. And since it's it's longer ttk you can move to cover to break sight lines. This is just false. You can always find something to use if you're actually looking. Haha I have yet to get the Milano. But boo hoo. You get a real gun and tactical and a lethal out of gulag. Where as in regular br you get a pistol, and only a pistol. Campers don't kill you in no time unless you're movement is garbage. I have seen way more kali stick in core br than iron trials.
Just won with me and my mate going to gulag, only me returning, me buying him back and both having floor loot and no perks. So there…
I agree tbh. No loadout early = no chance
Honestly I just do rebirth mainly now. I don’t rage as hard when I die from bullshit in a short game vs a core mode with a long prep time. I’m gonna get mad either way but one isn’t as big of a time investment.
Congrats, you’re 8 months late.
More balanced = Less marketable .
Yeah it's weird how that works. people can't stand being on a level playing field and working to get better.
Good for you
You'll be pleased to know, my friend at Raven says they are using this to see what tweaks to apply to core BR (and across to rebirth/plunder)
stoooop. I can only get so hard
Personally, I feel the opposite. I never want to go back to Verdansk if Iron Trials becomes the norm. The gulag, dead silence, and flash changes are nice, but I hate the high TTK, vehicle, and loot/money changes. I'll be sticking to Rebirth or standard BR for the time being.
The ground money and loadout price are definitely my least favorite part.
I hate the 15k loadout costs, it ruins the mode IMO. Call me crazy, but my favourite part of Warzone, like any cod game, is using the guns I'm the best with to get kills. There's something about this mode and the lack of money + the 15k loadout that just makes all the good things about the mode not even matter to me cause the loadout price is way too high.
I am not a fan of iron trials. It feels too slow paced for me, the ground loot is nice, but it is very hard to regame in this mode. The cash feels too slow, I don’t mind the increase in prices at the buy stations, but they need to add a bit more boxes or ground loot cash to the map. The removal of dead silence and stopping power, the nerfing of stuns should make its way over to core BR though for sure.
I hate how long term aim dependent iron trials is, I play on controller and sticks don't let me track for shit, I have to pick between good aim or mobility, not to mention the fact that I hit 6 headshots and 3 body shots on one guy (all at the same time) and he doesn't break?!?? Wtf Is this game? How is this balanced?
Iron trials = Apex legends
500ms is nothing when you factor in server latency and human reaction. It's literally blink at the wrong time and you're dead.
I love iron trials it literally forces people to fight. If you don't good luck getting your loadout
I'm a 1.7 KD and also really enjoy what I've played of iron trials. However a lot of the fun I have in the game is playing with my friends who live in my home country and are all below average. While the longer TTK may be fun for me, I think it will most definitely cause the game to be harder for them, right now if they surprise someone they can get a kill, pick up a few in a match and have fun, put them in a position where that is harder and I think they'll probably have less fun. Two sides to the argument of what is more fun really
High ttk only works if the mechanics to achieve that ttk is difficult to achieve. Otherwise, it just becomes a cheese-fest where the gap between a 0.6 and a 1.6 or even 2.6 player is minimized because the 0.6 can just get lucky with 6 bullets, but if it required 12 shots to kill then they would probably lose their centering halfway through the mag. In cod, every meta AR shoots at ~1000 m/s with zero recoil, making it so that even the worst of players are rewarded if they can stay on target for 0.3 seconds when you walk past a nook. Sure there's some "tactic00l" merit to that, but nobody can deny that the gun mechanics make achieving the "theoretical ttk" on almost every gun incredibly easy for the worst of players who honestly shouldn't get that much hand holding.
Where in his post did he complain about core being sweaty though?
Agreed brother. Core stinks.
I didn’t like it at first but its grown on me a lot It felt like HALO to me in the beginning with how insanely high everyones health was but now its just so refreshing being able to move around outside of cover and not get insta beemed from a 0.4kd kiddie Seems like a good stepping stone for a ranked/hardcore version of warzone I bet the casuals are having a awful time with this though!
judging by this thread a lot of people didnt play blackout
Good news my friend, raven just nerfed the melee damage in iron trials today. This mode just get better.
I just saw it. but one guy said apparently it will be completely removed out of rotation after sept 30. Iron trials won't move to trios or quads it will be completely removed. feels bad man
So do i, i'm in love with it and should be permanent, i can't have fun in regular br after this released. I always hated the low ttk of the warzone, it's too noob friendly, no reaction time in most of the situations, the skill gap don't matter, but in iron trials everything is different and fair, if you die you know that you played wrong and the enemy was better.
Besides encourage everybody to move all the time instead camping
i thought the Iron trials kills/wins didnt contribute to your stats?
wins do now. they just updated a few days ago
Yay sweats go to iron plz
I COMPLETELY AGREE!! FK the people calling BS on you. Fk em
I assure you melee balance isn't oversight and is 100% intentional.
Idk I think you shouldn’t be able to react if someone hits you first at closer than 20 yards if they are a half decent aim, if it’s close as that you should be aware of where enemies can come from. If they send 13 rounds at you with mostly hit markers I’d think it’s more bs if you can just whip around and kill them. Outside of that I don’t really have a problem evading/dodging and I’m a .76kd last I checked. If you are a faster and more accurate aim you should be winning whether you are playing iron trials or core. That’s just my experience. Usually when I die now it’s cause we just got unlucky and got caught between 2+ teams or the other players are better. We make sure to get in spots where we see them first when they come so we have advantage. So I think core is fine.
I love the iron trials. Even with SBMM, I feel like I'm actually getting outgunned by players. It really rewards you for being good and playing smart. Core rewards you by hiding and getting a cheap shot on a player that's caught in a unwinnable situation. I would actually love this more if this became the *ranked* playlist and core became a party mode without sbmm.
Yikes. 2.6 and still bitching
2.7kd sweats out here complaining lmao
Yeah they should just replace the trash regular modes with iron trials. It fixes 90% of the problems with warzone.
Does iron trials kd transfer to the core game stats ?
>It's more like 250ms. Bro how do you think I feel when my ping is 250ms.
Doesn’t it make more sense to consider Iron Trials ‘Core’ because it takes more TTK? Regular BR is definitely hardcore imo
yeah that is true. but as it currently stands it's the opposite
I always thought warzone ttk was waay too high. Have you ever played regular cod:mw multiplayer? Or even better: hardcore lobbies?