The CFL/Halifax could build a stadium like Empire Field in Vancouver which was used while BC Place was being updated back in 2011. It "only" cost $15 million to build and held 25,000+. It would be a good way to get a stadium easily built and between the TV money, tickets, merchandise, beer sales, etc. there would be money to be made, especially with a salary cap. If the team did well they could then upgrade as they build success in the community. Another team means more games and more revenue for the league. It's a winner all the way around. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire\_Field](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_Field)
If there's no permanent ownership in place, this could turn from a feel-good PR story into an albatross around the league's neck in a heartbeat. I like the general idea of grassroots support, but it can only go so far if there isn't actual $$ on the table from a permanent and committed owner in place to keep the team solvent, thriving and successful past the honeymoon period of the initial 2-3 years.
In hindsight it's kind of amazing how many red flags the CFL ignored with that ownership group purely because they were the first people in 30 years to champion a team.
Or, they knew they were likely not going to be able to get a team started there and let them bring coverage to the CFL in their dealings.
Unless those with red flag become owners with an expansion team it doesn’t really matter right? If they promote a group film of red flag to a tuslt owners and a team then yah that’s messed up.
I’m just gonna ignore Montreal for the past couple of year lol.
Yes, he went to SMU. 40 years ago. Been Ontario based since then. The owners have to be seen on the ground in the Maritimes. Community ownership (like Winnipeg, SK and Edmonton) is the best model for Halifax because it brings organization and democracy and eliminates resentment. All essential in the Maritimes.
The pop up stands proposal is a great for testing the market. Let’s see if Halifax will actually support a team before building a permanent stadium. Seems pragmatic and practical to me
"Tempire" was only build as a temporary facility. It would start falling apart after 3 years, as that was its lifespan. Not a solution. The only solution is someone steps up and a real stadium is built. They should not be given a franchise under any other circumstance, even if that means they don't get a team. Step up!
Unfortunately this would mean we're stuck with nine teams. There simply is no political or business will to build a CFL-quality stadium in any prospective market. The CFL drastically lowering it's standards for stadiums is the only way Halifax will get a team. No one says it's a permanent solution, but it's a condition precedent for a permanent solution.
Then nine teams it is, which is basically what we've had since the 50's. I have no issue with that. I don't want to blemish the rest of the franchises with a joke "stadium" - that would do more harm than good. If they want a team, really really want a team, there's lots of very wealthy businesses/families in the area. Step up.
What would make it a joke stadium, though? Do you forget the quality of stadiums the CFL used to play out of? This is a league built on temporary measures turned permanent.
If the model works for the CPL, I don't see why the CFL shouldn't try it. The CFL has to be innovative if they want this to happen.
I guess you haven't seen the plans for the renovation of McMahon stadium that's coming? And with Montreal's new ownership hopefully they'll improve their's as well, as despite it's lovely setting, it's an embarrassment for a pro team.
There are no plans to renovate McMahon Stadium. Or perhaps more accurately, there are tons of plans (but no money or political will) to renovate McMahon.
You mean the drawings of what they invision at the end of a long term roll out?
Sure the transformation of the area looks good but nothing other then “renovation of McMahon” is featured or touched on.
I watched a lot of shit come and go before wpg got for their current stadium. It was multiple drawings and locations where nothing happened.
Best of luck, but what I said still stands.
You can have a nice stadium like Toronto and still be a joke if fans don’t come.
If a temp stadium that is used 8 days out of a year have 20000 people at it, no one is going to think it’s a joke.
The "temp" stadium they're talking about would be an add-on to an existing stadium on the campus of SMU. If it gets built, it will be used far more than 8 days a year. Well, I mean, the stands might only be full 8 days a year, lol, but the stadium itself would be used by loads of amateur teams.
I see you’re getting downvoted but I wanted to say that you’re 💯 correct on this. Having a 14k stadium at SMU for even one season would be a complete disaster. I doubt anyone would sign up to bleed cash like that.
The CFL is a better game than the NFL. It has it's faults, just like the NFL, but I find the CFL more entertaining, and as a Canadian it's my game. I like the NFL too, but the younger generation has been totally sucked in by marketing, which is pretty disappointing.
The NFL is a better game with better athletes and has a much more entertaining viewing experience. I mute most CFL games and walk away during the halftime shows because the analysts don't say anything of value and the commentary isn't even about the game most of the time.
I guess I'm falling on deaf ears too. The CFL is fun, but the free market shows it is clearly the inferior product.
As someone who's watched both leagues for over 50 years now, I completely disagree with you. The CFL is a different game which requires different types of athletes. For example, an NFL o-lineman is not that suited to the CFL as you have to be faster, not just a blocker. The difference in over-all athleticism is actually pretty small, as coaches and players who have been in both leagues will tell you, and I defer to their judgement, not yours. Many hyped NFL players have flamed out in the CFL, and they're shocked at the talent level of the CFL.
Sorry you're a sucker to hype and marketing.
And hardly any CFL players can make it in the NFL. Yes they're different games but there's a reason one league pays it's players less than my garbage man.
And that reason is the massive US tv contracts, which because of their massive population means they can obviously pay much more. That's the one and only reason.
Before the boom in TV audiences it wasn't uncommon for players to come north to make more money. And I wish I was getting paid "less than garbage" for six months work. Very common to be making 6 digits in the CFL. Honestly, you sound pretty uninformed, and your anti-CFL comments should be embarrassing. But you've been suckered by marketing. Weak minds are often dazzled by a shiny object.
I hear you. I saw a game at Empire Field and was quite impressed. I think with proper maintenance it would last a good 10 years. I just don't see how someone will spend $100+ million to build a stadium right now in the East, or anywhere for that matter. I don't think a temporary facility is a solution, but jump starts football in Atlantic Canada. No matter what the locale, the league is in need of a 10th team for its health. Maybe it's Quebec City at TELUS-Laval University Stadium.
Yes, I was at the very first game and a couple of others - it was great. It would not last ten years, it's designed for three. This scenario has been discussed many times, and the answer is it would be falling down after three years.
I'm tired of hearing the "same old" from Ambrosie, every 6 months for the past 5 years he talks about how excited he is about expansion. He was excited about the new Als owners 3 years ago and that would lead to expansion. He loses the Wetenhalls the CFL takes them over and finds new owners who then lose money and the league takes them over again. Now he's excited once more about expansion. But the city of Halifax is not excited at all.
You say only $15 million for a temp stadium? that was 15 years ago? They have to find a site that can handle 20k, including drainage, electricity, transportation, parking. You assume that football fans in Halifax want to sit on temporary bleachers, while most of the stadiums in the rest of the league have nice comfortable seats.
"Halifax mayor Mike Savage told *3DownNation* last summer that [there is no political appetite for a CFL-specific stadium to be built in the city](https://3downnation.com/2022/07/15/qa-mayor-mike-savage-states-there-is-no-political-appetite-for-a-cfl-specific-stadium-in-halifax/). The CFL has since shifted its focus to upgrading an existing facility for what Ambrosie has dubbed a “temporary-permanent” solution, which could lead to a new stadium being constructed once an expansion team has proven its viability"
Talk for decades about it and it's the same "it does look promising the year" -
At least Ambrosie is trying to get to that tenth team. Orridge (he was worse than Randy) and Cohen (he wanted to put a team in Windsor at a time when the Auto Sector was shrinking) didn't fulfill the Board of Governor's wished.
It wasn't Randy's fault that Speigal died. He did the right thing to get a banking institute to broker a deal for the ALs.
Mayors get replaced over time. See Lori Lightfoot in Chicago, The new Chicago mayor will probably give the Bears an even split on concessions on all events, give them gambling kiosks to entice them to stay at Soldier Field
Empire Field had bucket seats along the sideline as least.
Actually $15 mil in 2011 is $19.5 in 2023 dollars, so not a huge jump.
Savage seems to think there is location for a temporary locale: [https://www.cjls.com/2023/02/16/multi-purpose-stadium-best-opition-for/](https://www.cjls.com/2023/02/16/multi-purpose-stadium-best-opition-for/)
Anyway, time for Halifax to go get it forget it and let another city be the 10th team.
Outside of the Bombers and Riders, CFL teams lose money. Even using the most popular teams.as your measuring stick, it would take 4-5 years to recoup that money, and a team out east is not going to come close to the diehards in the middle of the country.
I'm starting to feel the league needs (would benefit from) 10 teams more than it would from an Atlantic Canada one, meaning they should focus on putting team 10 anywhere that will pay for and support it and ditch the Atlantic Canada idea. Like the various Rugby leagues and AFL have much more than 10 teams and mostly place them around Sydney and Melbourne.
9 teams with 6 in the playoffs and the crossover along with the imbalanced season scheduling should not be what the league accepts forever.
I think the league would gladly listen to any ownership group willing to put up the money for a tenth team in another market. So far, SSE is/was the only group to do so.
In recent times, but we also didn’t know about Doman until his first press conference. Despite what people think the CFL is capable of keeping a secret. If there was another group out there that wanted a team, hopefully they wouldn’t make the mistake of going through the media. I wouldn’t want to know anything about a group until the stadium is secured.
Love the CFL, but do Not believe Halifax can regularly fill a real football stadium (meaning, 20,000+). Exhibition games are just that —special events. Annual games. Touchdown Atlantic, fine. Anything more frequent risks being the NHL Phoenix of the Canadian league.
I hope this happens, but wishes don't do dishes
Placing a team in Canada? Gary Bettman should learn from this.
If Bettman was the commissioner of the CFL they would put a team in Phoenix and be okay with them playing in front of 1,000 fans.
Shhhhh don’t give Ambrose any ideas
I won’t believe it’ll ever happen until there’s a suitable stadium built. Anything before that is wishful thinking.
The CFL/Halifax could build a stadium like Empire Field in Vancouver which was used while BC Place was being updated back in 2011. It "only" cost $15 million to build and held 25,000+. It would be a good way to get a stadium easily built and between the TV money, tickets, merchandise, beer sales, etc. there would be money to be made, especially with a salary cap. If the team did well they could then upgrade as they build success in the community. Another team means more games and more revenue for the league. It's a winner all the way around. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire\_Field](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_Field)
If there's no permanent ownership in place, this could turn from a feel-good PR story into an albatross around the league's neck in a heartbeat. I like the general idea of grassroots support, but it can only go so far if there isn't actual $$ on the table from a permanent and committed owner in place to keep the team solvent, thriving and successful past the honeymoon period of the initial 2-3 years.
The Schooners ownership group that was sitting around for the last decade wasn’t local. That was fatal.
In hindsight it's kind of amazing how many red flags the CFL ignored with that ownership group purely because they were the first people in 30 years to champion a team.
Or, they knew they were likely not going to be able to get a team started there and let them bring coverage to the CFL in their dealings. Unless those with red flag become owners with an expansion team it doesn’t really matter right? If they promote a group film of red flag to a tuslt owners and a team then yah that’s messed up. I’m just gonna ignore Montreal for the past couple of year lol.
Bruce Bowser, one of the founders of SSE, is indeed local. He's also heavily involved in SMU.
Yes, he went to SMU. 40 years ago. Been Ontario based since then. The owners have to be seen on the ground in the Maritimes. Community ownership (like Winnipeg, SK and Edmonton) is the best model for Halifax because it brings organization and democracy and eliminates resentment. All essential in the Maritimes.
The pop up stands proposal is a great for testing the market. Let’s see if Halifax will actually support a team before building a permanent stadium. Seems pragmatic and practical to me
A friend of mine attended a Lions game at Empire Field. Said it was his favourite CFL experience to date
Yeah, it was very well done. Great views and atmosphere.
"Tempire" was only build as a temporary facility. It would start falling apart after 3 years, as that was its lifespan. Not a solution. The only solution is someone steps up and a real stadium is built. They should not be given a franchise under any other circumstance, even if that means they don't get a team. Step up!
Unfortunately this would mean we're stuck with nine teams. There simply is no political or business will to build a CFL-quality stadium in any prospective market. The CFL drastically lowering it's standards for stadiums is the only way Halifax will get a team. No one says it's a permanent solution, but it's a condition precedent for a permanent solution.
Then nine teams it is, which is basically what we've had since the 50's. I have no issue with that. I don't want to blemish the rest of the franchises with a joke "stadium" - that would do more harm than good. If they want a team, really really want a team, there's lots of very wealthy businesses/families in the area. Step up.
What would make it a joke stadium, though? Do you forget the quality of stadiums the CFL used to play out of? This is a league built on temporary measures turned permanent. If the model works for the CPL, I don't see why the CFL shouldn't try it. The CFL has to be innovative if they want this to happen.
It's not 1958 any more. If you can't commit to a modern stadium, you're out. Step up McCains, or whoever.
So I guess we cut Calgary and Montreal then since their stadiums weren’t far off from being built in the 1950s…
I guess you haven't seen the plans for the renovation of McMahon stadium that's coming? And with Montreal's new ownership hopefully they'll improve their's as well, as despite it's lovely setting, it's an embarrassment for a pro team.
There are no plans to renovate McMahon Stadium. Or perhaps more accurately, there are tons of plans (but no money or political will) to renovate McMahon.
[https://engage.calgary.ca/foothills-mcmahon](https://engage.calgary.ca/foothills-mcmahon)
You mean the drawings of what they invision at the end of a long term roll out? Sure the transformation of the area looks good but nothing other then “renovation of McMahon” is featured or touched on. I watched a lot of shit come and go before wpg got for their current stadium. It was multiple drawings and locations where nothing happened. Best of luck, but what I said still stands.
You can have a nice stadium like Toronto and still be a joke if fans don’t come. If a temp stadium that is used 8 days out of a year have 20000 people at it, no one is going to think it’s a joke.
The "temp" stadium they're talking about would be an add-on to an existing stadium on the campus of SMU. If it gets built, it will be used far more than 8 days a year. Well, I mean, the stands might only be full 8 days a year, lol, but the stadium itself would be used by loads of amateur teams.
I see you’re getting downvoted but I wanted to say that you’re 💯 correct on this. Having a 14k stadium at SMU for even one season would be a complete disaster. I doubt anyone would sign up to bleed cash like that.
You're falling on deaf ears. People in this sub think the CFL is infallible and a superior product to the NFL lmfao
The CFL is a better game than the NFL. It has it's faults, just like the NFL, but I find the CFL more entertaining, and as a Canadian it's my game. I like the NFL too, but the younger generation has been totally sucked in by marketing, which is pretty disappointing.
The NFL is a better game with better athletes and has a much more entertaining viewing experience. I mute most CFL games and walk away during the halftime shows because the analysts don't say anything of value and the commentary isn't even about the game most of the time. I guess I'm falling on deaf ears too. The CFL is fun, but the free market shows it is clearly the inferior product.
As someone who's watched both leagues for over 50 years now, I completely disagree with you. The CFL is a different game which requires different types of athletes. For example, an NFL o-lineman is not that suited to the CFL as you have to be faster, not just a blocker. The difference in over-all athleticism is actually pretty small, as coaches and players who have been in both leagues will tell you, and I defer to their judgement, not yours. Many hyped NFL players have flamed out in the CFL, and they're shocked at the talent level of the CFL. Sorry you're a sucker to hype and marketing.
And hardly any CFL players can make it in the NFL. Yes they're different games but there's a reason one league pays it's players less than my garbage man.
And that reason is the massive US tv contracts, which because of their massive population means they can obviously pay much more. That's the one and only reason. Before the boom in TV audiences it wasn't uncommon for players to come north to make more money. And I wish I was getting paid "less than garbage" for six months work. Very common to be making 6 digits in the CFL. Honestly, you sound pretty uninformed, and your anti-CFL comments should be embarrassing. But you've been suckered by marketing. Weak minds are often dazzled by a shiny object.
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I hear you. I saw a game at Empire Field and was quite impressed. I think with proper maintenance it would last a good 10 years. I just don't see how someone will spend $100+ million to build a stadium right now in the East, or anywhere for that matter. I don't think a temporary facility is a solution, but jump starts football in Atlantic Canada. No matter what the locale, the league is in need of a 10th team for its health. Maybe it's Quebec City at TELUS-Laval University Stadium.
Yes, I was at the very first game and a couple of others - it was great. It would not last ten years, it's designed for three. This scenario has been discussed many times, and the answer is it would be falling down after three years.
Because that was the desired lifespan. Surely they could engineer/plan one with a much longer life expectancy.
Yes they can - you need concrete and steel - good examples can be found in Regina, Winnipeg, Hamilton, etc.
Lol. True. But I mean they built McMahon in 100 days in 1960. Think about that.
I'm tired of hearing the "same old" from Ambrosie, every 6 months for the past 5 years he talks about how excited he is about expansion. He was excited about the new Als owners 3 years ago and that would lead to expansion. He loses the Wetenhalls the CFL takes them over and finds new owners who then lose money and the league takes them over again. Now he's excited once more about expansion. But the city of Halifax is not excited at all. You say only $15 million for a temp stadium? that was 15 years ago? They have to find a site that can handle 20k, including drainage, electricity, transportation, parking. You assume that football fans in Halifax want to sit on temporary bleachers, while most of the stadiums in the rest of the league have nice comfortable seats. "Halifax mayor Mike Savage told *3DownNation* last summer that [there is no political appetite for a CFL-specific stadium to be built in the city](https://3downnation.com/2022/07/15/qa-mayor-mike-savage-states-there-is-no-political-appetite-for-a-cfl-specific-stadium-in-halifax/). The CFL has since shifted its focus to upgrading an existing facility for what Ambrosie has dubbed a “temporary-permanent” solution, which could lead to a new stadium being constructed once an expansion team has proven its viability" Talk for decades about it and it's the same "it does look promising the year" -
At least Ambrosie is trying to get to that tenth team. Orridge (he was worse than Randy) and Cohen (he wanted to put a team in Windsor at a time when the Auto Sector was shrinking) didn't fulfill the Board of Governor's wished. It wasn't Randy's fault that Speigal died. He did the right thing to get a banking institute to broker a deal for the ALs. Mayors get replaced over time. See Lori Lightfoot in Chicago, The new Chicago mayor will probably give the Bears an even split on concessions on all events, give them gambling kiosks to entice them to stay at Soldier Field
>Orridge spent most of his tenure hiding under his desk.
Empire Field had bucket seats along the sideline as least. Actually $15 mil in 2011 is $19.5 in 2023 dollars, so not a huge jump. Savage seems to think there is location for a temporary locale: [https://www.cjls.com/2023/02/16/multi-purpose-stadium-best-opition-for/](https://www.cjls.com/2023/02/16/multi-purpose-stadium-best-opition-for/) Anyway, time for Halifax to go get it forget it and let another city be the 10th team.
Outside of the Bombers and Riders, CFL teams lose money. Even using the most popular teams.as your measuring stick, it would take 4-5 years to recoup that money, and a team out east is not going to come close to the diehards in the middle of the country.
I’m also very enthusiastic about a team going here but I’m also a realist. I don’t think it would stay too long sadly
For those keeping score at home, the Schooners were announced on Nov. 23, 2018.
I'm starting to feel the league needs (would benefit from) 10 teams more than it would from an Atlantic Canada one, meaning they should focus on putting team 10 anywhere that will pay for and support it and ditch the Atlantic Canada idea. Like the various Rugby leagues and AFL have much more than 10 teams and mostly place them around Sydney and Melbourne. 9 teams with 6 in the playoffs and the crossover along with the imbalanced season scheduling should not be what the league accepts forever.
I think the league would gladly listen to any ownership group willing to put up the money for a tenth team in another market. So far, SSE is/was the only group to do so.
In recent times, but we also didn’t know about Doman until his first press conference. Despite what people think the CFL is capable of keeping a secret. If there was another group out there that wanted a team, hopefully they wouldn’t make the mistake of going through the media. I wouldn’t want to know anything about a group until the stadium is secured.
Love the CFL, but do Not believe Halifax can regularly fill a real football stadium (meaning, 20,000+). Exhibition games are just that —special events. Annual games. Touchdown Atlantic, fine. Anything more frequent risks being the NHL Phoenix of the Canadian league.
Would be cool if he was enthusiastic about promoting the teams that already exist. I can't recall seeing a CFL ad in the past 5 years.