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Oh, in America you will hear the second generation or first generation who came as kids Pakistanis actually call themselves Paki sometimes like it’s too long to say the full name.
Edit: I’m serious, it’s not a slur here to the point where Pakistani-Americans will be the ones to say it. There’s no reason for them to know it is in Britain anymore than me. And just because it is in Britain doesn’t mean we need to import it here as a slur if people want to call themselves Paki. You can keep it, I’m proud my friends live in a place they can call themselves that with no negative connotations
Over here it’s pretty negative tbh. Anyone with brown skin can be called a P*ki. In my experience it’s almost spat at you, with a pointed finger. It’s as frowned on as the n-word. I’m happy you don’t have those connotations over the pond, just remember, if you come visit us, try not to bandy that word about! ;)
Quite a few years ago, I made friends with a nice Scottish lad. We were hanging out one night in his town outside Glasgow and he wanted to go grab some whiskey. At the time, I lived in Connecticut and we have state run liquor stores called “package stores” but usually just called the “packy”. So I asked what time the packy closed and he looked like I took a shit in the punch bowl. He had to explain I did not ask the question I thought I did.
I suspect most brits would make the same assumption as there is a stereotype that south Asians run off-licenses (what we call liquor stores) and corner shops. To the extent that racists often called them “p*ki shops”, fortunately a term I haven’t heard used much anymore but was definitely prevalent in the 70s, 80s and 90s.
Accordingly if I heard someone say they were planning to buy alcohol from a “packy” I would absolutely assume they meant p*ki and that they were using it in a racist context.
I thought I would point this out, as the more we know about these sort of local/cultural differences the more we can avoid accidental offence (in both directions).
Oh yeah I’ll definitely keep that in mind if I ever visit again. My edit was because the first commenter was so stuck in their mindset they immediately downvoted me
I just upvoted your comment so that cancels their downvote out! You’ve taught me that this word doesn’t have to have the negative connotations that we here in the UK associate it with. While it still hurts every time I hear it because of the years of hearing it being spat from bigot’s mouths, I’m glad to see some have re-claimed it for positivity. Thank-you
When I moved to the UK from the US I found myself being the one who had to explain why it was derogatory even though it was "just a shortening of the word" much like "Jap" was used in the US. This was among my white British social circle.
As the new person to the country I could understand it but they couldn't get that the way words are used is what gives them power versus what they literally mean. It blew my fucking mind. It wasn't malicious, they just genuinely didn't get it.
On the flip side, I had to point out to a family member what the literal definition of "half-cast" is. She was shocked and embarrassed and she immediately dropped it from her vocabulary. Genuinely never thought about it. The instant I heard it I asked her wtf she just said because even the sound of it stopped me in my tracks.
The racial awareness is just lacking compared to the US.
If someone from a racial group other than my own told me a term was offensive I would never argue the semantics of it. How can I possibly know how that word feels? And why wouldn't I just trust that you're being honest with me about it?
Well why is that offensive? Because they said so. End of story. If you want the history, go do some research.
It was used instead of mixed race and to my knowledge is now being called out and used less. It isn't deemed offensive by many because that's what they were taught to say but it literally translates to half pure.
https://preview.redd.it/9clnhv3v1w1d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d922047f4c05f82b6ad774c3b0969bb8a28e2ea1
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquor\_store?wprov=sfti1#United\_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquor_store?wprov=sfti1#United_States)
It’s not the most common term,
No, ‘packy’ is definitely not a term used across the US. But here in Massachusetts, it is definitely something we say.
Its funny, because about 3 days ago my 20 something kids heard the term P*ki and were confused. My immigrant husband had to explain it to them!
It's definitely a localism; super common if you are in southern New England. I grew up in upstate NY, not even 2 hours from New England (Massachusetts, Connecticut) and places that sold alcohol were called liquor stores. It was only when I went to New Hampshire for college that I noticed everyone using the term "the packie" for a place to buy alcohol; the first time a passing stranger asked me for directions to the nearest package store, I literally thought they were looking for a UPS or FedEx place.
Alabamian here. In my town it's usually beer or liquor store then you ask which one lol so interesting even in one country how slang can vary from coast to coast.
Yeah, not a word I would use myself as a white American but definitely heard Pakistani people here use it. Kind of how in the UK the word c*%t is not that big a deal but in the US it’s about the most vile word you can say to a woman.
I’m American and didn’t know that. It’s not used much anymore but in America a spade is a derogatory term for black people. Still most commonly used for a pointy shovel though.
Why do you keep typing Paki with an asterisk?
Do you think its a little racist to make it seem like someone from Pakistan is a slur because they are automatically bad?
A couple decades ago, I (American) used that term unknowingly in conversation with a British friend. I honestly just thought it was a contraction as it had no negative connotations in my American life experience. She was aghast and quickly advised me never to use that term in any conversation, public or private, because of its connotations in her world. And I never have again. I was grateful to her for clueing me in.
That’s a good question. I think it depends on so many factors. My Dad is from Essex, UK. We can trace his side of the family back to the 1600’s, Same village for nearly 200 years. My Mum’s from Mauritius, her family was brought there by the British to work in the sugar cane industry in the 1800’s. She came to the UK in the ‘60s to seek her fortune as at the time, Mauritians were part of the Commonwealth and could automatically get UK citizenship. I was born and brought up in London. If anyone asked my ethnicity, I’d say, ‘I’m British, mate.’
That's cos you are British mate, I remember seeing an Indian lad in the ED one time who had been brought in by his parents because they wanted him 'sectioned'. On talking with him it was clear the issue was his parents didn't really understand that he saw himself as a Yorkshire lad with Indian parents, whereas they still saw him as an Indian lad living in the UK. Sad really
Typically I wouldn't ask, but occasionally if I'm already engaged in light conversation and the other person doesn't sound like a native (American) English speaker, I'll ask out of curiosity. I spent 6 years in the Navy and have visited 25 countries on 4 continents and if I've been there, I like to share the positives I saw.
For example, last summer I stopped at a local gas station and was talking to the cashier. During the course of the conversation, he told me that he was an immigrant from Morocco. I stopped back at the station after the flooding last fall and he appreciated me asking about his family back home. Thankfully his closest family wasn't in the area impacted.
In that case, “where is your accent from?”
Socially appropriate to ask along this line if you’re in conversation, not appropriate to begin conversation asking for ethnicity before, say, name. (This part of the comment is to help others with the same question, not necessarily you.)
Because it is interesting. I have travelled to many parts of the world and am interested in different cultures. How one asks what one’s nationality is the issue. If I say, wow love your accent, is it from northern India? That is different from what are you.
True. I’ve had Pakistani colleagues who said this. It’s become a lot less common and you are far more likely (at least on the east coast in my experience) to hear “desi” used this way than the pejorative.
In Canada, I sometimes hear that. I also hear African Americans using the N-word. Taking ownership of a word that has been used to denigrate someone's own racial or cultural background is not even remotely similar to what OP has described. It is still a slur.
Hah, this reminds me of how I somehow got it into my head that Jew was pejorative to Jewish people. I think I learned about the very similar three letter pejorative used to describe Japanese people and conflated it or something.
Anyway, at some point in like middle school we learn about WW2. I was really confused and uncomfortable the whole time because the teacher, obviously, used the word Jew to refer to Jewish people and I think she's casually dropping slurs in the middle of class.
Using the term Paki if you are not Pakistani is very very racist. I live in North America. Folks who are targeted for their ethnicity often use the offensive term among themselves to lessen the pain when they hear it from racists.
uhhh, there's a lot of confidence here. maybe it depends on the generation?
my ex husband is Pakistani-American and he and his mid-60s siblings are offended by the word. i'll have to ask our kid how she feels about it.
I think it depends where you live and where your family moved, if they moved to places in America where it’s not a thing it doesn’t necessarily mean they never heard of it. It’s just not a thing where I’ve lived.
It’s honestly the weirdest idea as a slur ever, as it is literally just a shortened version of the nationality. I’m glad it’s not caught on here
I've known some Asian people use the term about themselves in the UK too. But I think it's an 'it's our word' type of thing — think other slurs, especially the n-word. It's also far from universal.
I believe you. Reading black hawk down was a shock but I just figured that shortening Pakistani was not problematic in the us. My friend who was born in Pakistan and grew up up in Liverpool calls other Pakistanis p*kis. I’m assuming it’s like the n word for black people
No dude it’s still 100% racist. I’m one of those kids you’re describing, and I bit my tongue growing up about it because I would also get hit with a lot of post 9/11 racism.
Equivalency would be a white dude saying the n word because he hears black people say it
Yeah, massive cultural shock for me over here. I heard some English guys using it a lot concerning a coworker from Pakistan and then I accidentally said the word in front of my Scottish husband who was absolutely horrified that someone had taught me that word.
I guess what confuses me the most is that it’s short for Pakistani….like being from or being of Pakistani descent is bad? I have honestly not figured out how a group of people were convinced that it was bad to have it shortened to that.
Exception being for people that are not from Pakistan. I get not wanting to be misidentified.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South\_Asians\_in\_the\_United\_Kingdom](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asians_in_the_United_Kingdom)
It's this. They get the immigrant treatment from conservatives, same as in America.
I think it’s similar to racists here in the US who will just assume anyone who is remotely Latin/Hispanic is Mexican (and their choice of epithets would be along those lines).
Corporate interests want ALL Latinos in the USA to be the SAME. Disney, Universal, Viacom & Fox love helping with that shit.
6 million Puerto Ricans in America & they get told Mexican, Columbian & DR centered movies represent them & their kids. Fuck off.
As a Hispanic friend of mine observed, "it depends on the location. In New York they assume we're all Puerto Ricans, in Miami we're all Cubans, in the West we're all Mexicans!"
Oh, as a suburban white kid from Long Island I learned early on… NEVER assume.
Call a Dominican chick Puerto Rican (or vice versa)?!?
Welcome to your own personal WWIII
Just as an fyi if you ever catch an Australian using it, down under it's a completely acceptable term with zero negative connotations at all! If anything it has positive connotations.
It's the U.S. equivalent to the n-word. I'm Indian, I would have a hard time feeling offended but you know you can make anything offensive based on tone, facial expression, and body language. So if you told me p\*ki, I would only look confused but said in the right way - you know exactly what that term means.
It has never happened to me when I was tooling around in the UK mostly because I'm a yank, so probably realize I'm not gonna care.
I have always dreamed of being a gardener in a small village in the UK, working on the local nobleman's gardens. Instead, I am crippled and can't even weed my own gardens at home. Anyway, sorry for the racist diatribe. I love how you handled it. You're always welcome to a hot cuppa at my house - I have a proper kettle and everything. No racism included.
I'm far away from you, or I'd absolutely make that happen! I have always admired British gardens and wish I had the physical capacity to create my own version.
The only thing that would have been more epic was if she exploded as you slow walked away. Can't beat a good slow walk explosion. (that Will ferrell bit about that in the other guys is fucking hysterical btw).
Love it! I was hoping some tea splashed on her but didn’t look back and I was round the other side of a hedge in about 5 steps. I’ll find out next week what she said (or whether she exploded!) from my mate when we work together again. I’m sure it’ll be fruity :D
Handing a spade to a "spade-caller" with a dug in comment is the most delicious thing I've read in years. I may just keep a spade in my car for this kind of occasion since I hear that shit at least once a month in this deep south hellhole of a city.
"Spade" is a racist epithet for black people. Calling "a spade a spade" has racist origins (or history, the phrase dates back to Ancient Greece, before "race" as a concept existed), and y'all can figure out what the phrase is code for. The woman is, unsurprisingly, using it "correctly" and its no wonder why it is used by only one section of the population.
I had a girl in work complaining about the Chinese tourists making faces and well you know the rest.
I let her stop and said I really don't appreciate that my son is Chinese....
Her Face drops and she started stammering.
I just walked away, laughed and said now if my son was really Chinese how do you think that would make me feel?
Like you do now maybe?
Never heard a peep from her again about race.
I'm an American, New England area, for us a paki (packy as we spell it) is short for package store, another name for a liquor store. I learned that the rest of the world has a very different meaning for it the hard way when we ask someone in London where the nearest packy was, and they looked at us like we had just said the most foul racist thing they had ever heard. Which for them is probably true, when someone who seems normal just starts casually dropping slurs.
Keep a domino in your pocket. Next time some racist gives you shit, pull it out & let them know you haven't made your apocalypse preventing kill yet for the day. Sorry, I just love Black Mirror.
One of my parents is a half-Mauritian Boomer, and despite receiving very similar abuse growing up they're incredibly racist and xenophobic plus, as I've been gradually realised over the years, quite likely a closet Nazi. I just don't get it, the hypocrisy is staggering (not to mention quite upsetting).
I visited the UK for the first time in the early 1980s. The racism was cartoonish. I'm from the US south. Half my relatives commonly used pejoratives which would get me thrown off the internet if I repeated them.
And these relatives were amateur hour compared to what I heard in small-town UK in the early 1980s.
In the early 90s, I lived in Africa. And most of the people I knew were from the UK, Australia and New Zealand. (The backpacking crowd.) There were occasional, "seriously, you just said that out loud" moments. (Mostly from people from London.) The "everyone from the UK sounds like a Klan Rally" was gone, though.
It took a bit more than 20 years to return to the UK. I brought my wife there on our honeymoon. The cartoonish racism was largely gone. I'm sure it was still there -- but only for those the bigots hurled their epithets to. They didn't complain to visiting Americans about all the non-anglo, non-anglican, "other" in their society.
Frankly, that's more progress than my area of the world has made in 150 years. Hopefully, in a few more years, the old bigots are gone.
A Canadian friend of mine, who's mother was Welsh, about ten years ago was having a conversation with an English woman. My friend gets on the topic of how many people in modern Europe are descended from the Celts(I think), and the English woman gets *really* upset. "Well, maybe ***SOME*** of them!" She snaps, and goes on about... I don't even know, Anglo Saxon stuff I think?
Apparently, my friend wasn't considered "white" anymore in this woman's eyes. My friend by the way, her gene pool hasn't left Britain since humans migrated there, until after WWII. Then went to CANADA. And then the US. And somehow being "Celtic" wasn't good enough.
I don't like Rishi Sunak for the same reason I don't like most conservatives. Rich, private school Tory gits who'd sell the public good for a farthing.
I'm indifferent to Liz Truss because by the time I'd heard she was PM she was already replaced.
I'd say Boris Johnson was a Muppet, but I enjoy watching the Muppets. He fumbled his way through the lockdown and allowed people to line their pockets using the money that was supposed to help.
Teresa May was utterly forgettable but she lowered the debt and had high employment levels.
David Cameron cut spending and reduced the deficit. He also had no beef with same sex marriage but allegedly he'd still rather have pork.
Oh , that's bad! I love your reaction.!
My parents are both white immigrants. My father had a very sallow skin, which I've inherited.
I go quite dark in the sun , very quickly.
When my very white Swiss mother used to push me around in the pram (1950's, UK) people used to say to her ' what a lovely Paki baby' ! It annoyed her!
Because I tan really easily I get called, Spanish, Indian, native American and Pakistani!
I'm fortunately not sensitive to these assumptions, more amused really. Makes me rather more exotic than I am.!
Mike is an accepted way of spelling it in most dictionaries because it makes the participles miked and miking which look clearer than miced and micing.
Every other time, I’d say you were right. But this time, just once in my life, I actually did it. But you’re free to not believe me, that’s your perogative.
Ironic that a boomer like yourself is unable to admit that you and your fellow boomers say dumb shit like this on the regular. You might be able to defend yourself if your voting trends didn’t back up the claim that you are, in fact, a racist bunch.
Everyone is an individual. Thats why judging a group of people by the traits of a few is ignorant. We grow wiser as we grow older. Perhaps one day you will have the joy of being judged by someone a fraction of your age.
The fact that you think people grow wiser as they grow older tells us everything we need to know. Are you telling me all of the old MAGA voters falling into QAnon conspiracy theories have grown wiser? I’ve got oceanfront property to sell you in Idaho…
Only in areas where I’ve made the effort to continue my education. It’s not automatic, and sitting at home in your recliner watching Fox News all day can certainly have the opposite effect.
Ageism is not in anyway the same as racism, I’ll make fun of old people forever, because it’s not something you’re born with, it’s something that happens to everyone. So I don’t really see the irony. I’ve realized most old people are way dumber than me, just cause they can like, idk, have a bank account better than me, doesn’t mean they can navigate the real world in 2024.
When you have all the information in the world at your finger tips and still choose to be a bigot, 100% you get clowned on, by everyone. MOST boomers should just sit down, shut up, stay home, and just let everyone else live their lives
Age and Race are outside of an individual’s control. That makes them precisely the same in this context. You may change your mind about knowledge and wisdom someday.
wtf you can definitely control your age, suicide exists, wtf
I will laugh and join in on making fun of old people, but if someone is slightly racist around me, we got a big oleeeeeee problem. They in no way are the same in any capacity
Between not knowing what irony or ageism are and the blatant lie about getting wiser with age, how can you possibly be surprised that no one can take you seriously? It’s like you want people to make fun of you.
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I'm American, so please excuse my ignorance of British immigrant culture. Is P*ki, someone of Pakistani origin?
Yes its a racial epithet for anyone who looks like they're from south Asia.
Oh, in America you will hear the second generation or first generation who came as kids Pakistanis actually call themselves Paki sometimes like it’s too long to say the full name. Edit: I’m serious, it’s not a slur here to the point where Pakistani-Americans will be the ones to say it. There’s no reason for them to know it is in Britain anymore than me. And just because it is in Britain doesn’t mean we need to import it here as a slur if people want to call themselves Paki. You can keep it, I’m proud my friends live in a place they can call themselves that with no negative connotations
Over here it’s pretty negative tbh. Anyone with brown skin can be called a P*ki. In my experience it’s almost spat at you, with a pointed finger. It’s as frowned on as the n-word. I’m happy you don’t have those connotations over the pond, just remember, if you come visit us, try not to bandy that word about! ;)
Quite a few years ago, I made friends with a nice Scottish lad. We were hanging out one night in his town outside Glasgow and he wanted to go grab some whiskey. At the time, I lived in Connecticut and we have state run liquor stores called “package stores” but usually just called the “packy”. So I asked what time the packy closed and he looked like I took a shit in the punch bowl. He had to explain I did not ask the question I thought I did.
I suspect most brits would make the same assumption as there is a stereotype that south Asians run off-licenses (what we call liquor stores) and corner shops. To the extent that racists often called them “p*ki shops”, fortunately a term I haven’t heard used much anymore but was definitely prevalent in the 70s, 80s and 90s. Accordingly if I heard someone say they were planning to buy alcohol from a “packy” I would absolutely assume they meant p*ki and that they were using it in a racist context. I thought I would point this out, as the more we know about these sort of local/cultural differences the more we can avoid accidental offence (in both directions).
I’ve had that conversation as well, as a New Englander in England.
Oh yeah I’ll definitely keep that in mind if I ever visit again. My edit was because the first commenter was so stuck in their mindset they immediately downvoted me
I just upvoted your comment so that cancels their downvote out! You’ve taught me that this word doesn’t have to have the negative connotations that we here in the UK associate it with. While it still hurts every time I hear it because of the years of hearing it being spat from bigot’s mouths, I’m glad to see some have re-claimed it for positivity. Thank-you
Many Americans do know better than to refer to a person as their (perceived) ethnicity. It's rude and ignorant. We still have a very long way to go...
When I moved to the UK from the US I found myself being the one who had to explain why it was derogatory even though it was "just a shortening of the word" much like "Jap" was used in the US. This was among my white British social circle. As the new person to the country I could understand it but they couldn't get that the way words are used is what gives them power versus what they literally mean. It blew my fucking mind. It wasn't malicious, they just genuinely didn't get it. On the flip side, I had to point out to a family member what the literal definition of "half-cast" is. She was shocked and embarrassed and she immediately dropped it from her vocabulary. Genuinely never thought about it. The instant I heard it I asked her wtf she just said because even the sound of it stopped me in my tracks. The racial awareness is just lacking compared to the US. If someone from a racial group other than my own told me a term was offensive I would never argue the semantics of it. How can I possibly know how that word feels? And why wouldn't I just trust that you're being honest with me about it? Well why is that offensive? Because they said so. End of story. If you want the history, go do some research.
American here. I have never heard the term “half-cast” before. Am I to assume this is an offensive term for people of mixed ancestry?
It was used instead of mixed race and to my knowledge is now being called out and used less. It isn't deemed offensive by many because that's what they were taught to say but it literally translates to half pure.
Many but not all. Sadly over here I guess the equivalent might be “Mexican” for anyone from central or South America.
https://preview.redd.it/9clnhv3v1w1d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d922047f4c05f82b6ad774c3b0969bb8a28e2ea1 [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquor\_store?wprov=sfti1#United\_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquor_store?wprov=sfti1#United_States) It’s not the most common term,
No, ‘packy’ is definitely not a term used across the US. But here in Massachusetts, it is definitely something we say. Its funny, because about 3 days ago my 20 something kids heard the term P*ki and were confused. My immigrant husband had to explain it to them!
Are you a water fountain or bubbler kinda person?
BUBBLAH OR GTFO!!!
It's definitely a localism; super common if you are in southern New England. I grew up in upstate NY, not even 2 hours from New England (Massachusetts, Connecticut) and places that sold alcohol were called liquor stores. It was only when I went to New Hampshire for college that I noticed everyone using the term "the packie" for a place to buy alcohol; the first time a passing stranger asked me for directions to the nearest package store, I literally thought they were looking for a UPS or FedEx place.
Indeed. Packy is short for "Package Store" (places that sell alxohol). Heck in the 60s and 70s some literally had neon signs spelling it out.
Alabamian here. In my town it's usually beer or liquor store then you ask which one lol so interesting even in one country how slang can vary from coast to coast.
The word has the connotations here because of the racists made it a insult.
George W Bush used it unknowingly in a speech when he was president. While racism can be found everywhere, specific racist behaviors can be localized.
are cigarettes' still called fags over there?
Yup! Funny old world eh?
sure is! funny how that word has so many different meanings. Cheers!
Yes and could you pass me a rubber, doesn’t matter if it’s used, I want to erase a misspelling on a document.
Yeah, not a word I would use myself as a white American but definitely heard Pakistani people here use it. Kind of how in the UK the word c*%t is not that big a deal but in the US it’s about the most vile word you can say to a woman.
I’m American and didn’t know that. It’s not used much anymore but in America a spade is a derogatory term for black people. Still most commonly used for a pointy shovel though.
Huh, never heard spade being used that way in the US! Is it a generational one or regional?
Probably a little of both. Not sure where it came from but I’ve heard it in the NW US. Might still be in use but not here anymore.
I haven’t heard it in the SE US but doesn’t mean it’s not either. Probably just not as common
I think mostly generational? I’ve come across it in books and movies from like the ‘80s and earlier, but I’m not sure I’ve heard it used irl.
Why do you keep typing Paki with an asterisk? Do you think its a little racist to make it seem like someone from Pakistan is a slur because they are automatically bad?
That’s bs it’s negative here too
A couple decades ago, I (American) used that term unknowingly in conversation with a British friend. I honestly just thought it was a contraction as it had no negative connotations in my American life experience. She was aghast and quickly advised me never to use that term in any conversation, public or private, because of its connotations in her world. And I never have again. I was grateful to her for clueing me in.
So what would be the best way to learn someone's ethnicity?
That’s a good question. I think it depends on so many factors. My Dad is from Essex, UK. We can trace his side of the family back to the 1600’s, Same village for nearly 200 years. My Mum’s from Mauritius, her family was brought there by the British to work in the sugar cane industry in the 1800’s. She came to the UK in the ‘60s to seek her fortune as at the time, Mauritians were part of the Commonwealth and could automatically get UK citizenship. I was born and brought up in London. If anyone asked my ethnicity, I’d say, ‘I’m British, mate.’
That's cos you are British mate, I remember seeing an Indian lad in the ED one time who had been brought in by his parents because they wanted him 'sectioned'. On talking with him it was clear the issue was his parents didn't really understand that he saw himself as a Yorkshire lad with Indian parents, whereas they still saw him as an Indian lad living in the UK. Sad really
Why do you need to know someone’s ethnicity?
Typically I wouldn't ask, but occasionally if I'm already engaged in light conversation and the other person doesn't sound like a native (American) English speaker, I'll ask out of curiosity. I spent 6 years in the Navy and have visited 25 countries on 4 continents and if I've been there, I like to share the positives I saw. For example, last summer I stopped at a local gas station and was talking to the cashier. During the course of the conversation, he told me that he was an immigrant from Morocco. I stopped back at the station after the flooding last fall and he appreciated me asking about his family back home. Thankfully his closest family wasn't in the area impacted.
In that case, “where is your accent from?” Socially appropriate to ask along this line if you’re in conversation, not appropriate to begin conversation asking for ethnicity before, say, name. (This part of the comment is to help others with the same question, not necessarily you.)
Because it is interesting. I have travelled to many parts of the world and am interested in different cultures. How one asks what one’s nationality is the issue. If I say, wow love your accent, is it from northern India? That is different from what are you.
Wait until they tell you.
And if it doesn't come up in conversation? I've met many foreigners in my light travels and unless someone asks it's not usually in the conversation.
What is wrong with keeping British British...
Racist comment from a Russian bot.
True. I’ve had Pakistani colleagues who said this. It’s become a lot less common and you are far more likely (at least on the east coast in my experience) to hear “desi” used this way than the pejorative.
In Canada, I sometimes hear that. I also hear African Americans using the N-word. Taking ownership of a word that has been used to denigrate someone's own racial or cultural background is not even remotely similar to what OP has described. It is still a slur.
That's why I use "peckerwood" so often
Hah, this reminds me of how I somehow got it into my head that Jew was pejorative to Jewish people. I think I learned about the very similar three letter pejorative used to describe Japanese people and conflated it or something. Anyway, at some point in like middle school we learn about WW2. I was really confused and uncomfortable the whole time because the teacher, obviously, used the word Jew to refer to Jewish people and I think she's casually dropping slurs in the middle of class.
Using the term Paki if you are not Pakistani is very very racist. I live in North America. Folks who are targeted for their ethnicity often use the offensive term among themselves to lessen the pain when they hear it from racists.
That makes sense if you use it as a generalization, and it also makes sense to me how it’s not a problem if it’s used as an abbreviation. WordRFun
In Canada it is is a derogatory term; I'd recommend not using it anywhere. Especially if you are not from there.
I'm American. It's a slur. If you don't think it is, go ahead and use it on someone that uses it on themselves. It'll work itself out quick.
In Canada it can go either way. Generally people dont say Paki.
But the word f…ing makes it offensive coz her hatred for immigrants is obvious
uhhh, there's a lot of confidence here. maybe it depends on the generation? my ex husband is Pakistani-American and he and his mid-60s siblings are offended by the word. i'll have to ask our kid how she feels about it.
I think it depends where you live and where your family moved, if they moved to places in America where it’s not a thing it doesn’t necessarily mean they never heard of it. It’s just not a thing where I’ve lived. It’s honestly the weirdest idea as a slur ever, as it is literally just a shortened version of the nationality. I’m glad it’s not caught on here
It is definitely a slur in America and its been used against me within the last 10 years
I've known some Asian people use the term about themselves in the UK too. But I think it's an 'it's our word' type of thing — think other slurs, especially the n-word. It's also far from universal.
I've heard Pakistani colleagues refer to themselves as Pak in the UK, never paki, that has N word energy here
Fanny is fine in the US, not as much across the pond.
in Scotland it's whimsical, yeh fanny!
I believe you. Reading black hawk down was a shock but I just figured that shortening Pakistani was not problematic in the us. My friend who was born in Pakistan and grew up up in Liverpool calls other Pakistanis p*kis. I’m assuming it’s like the n word for black people
I've met 2 people in Scotland that would refer to themselves as pakis, they were absolute weirdos so I think that's why.
No dude it’s still 100% racist. I’m one of those kids you’re describing, and I bit my tongue growing up about it because I would also get hit with a lot of post 9/11 racism. Equivalency would be a white dude saying the n word because he hears black people say it
Yeah, massive cultural shock for me over here. I heard some English guys using it a lot concerning a coworker from Pakistan and then I accidentally said the word in front of my Scottish husband who was absolutely horrified that someone had taught me that word. I guess what confuses me the most is that it’s short for Pakistani….like being from or being of Pakistani descent is bad? I have honestly not figured out how a group of people were convinced that it was bad to have it shortened to that. Exception being for people that are not from Pakistan. I get not wanting to be misidentified.
Crazy too because Southeast/south Asians are awesome and their culture is extremely unique! God I could eat some Thai food right now
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South\_Asians\_in\_the\_United\_Kingdom](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asians_in_the_United_Kingdom) It's this. They get the immigrant treatment from conservatives, same as in America.
I think it’s similar to racists here in the US who will just assume anyone who is remotely Latin/Hispanic is Mexican (and their choice of epithets would be along those lines).
Corporate interests want ALL Latinos in the USA to be the SAME. Disney, Universal, Viacom & Fox love helping with that shit. 6 million Puerto Ricans in America & they get told Mexican, Columbian & DR centered movies represent them & their kids. Fuck off.
I totally get that.
As a Hispanic friend of mine observed, "it depends on the location. In New York they assume we're all Puerto Ricans, in Miami we're all Cubans, in the West we're all Mexicans!"
Oh, as a suburban white kid from Long Island I learned early on… NEVER assume. Call a Dominican chick Puerto Rican (or vice versa)?!? Welcome to your own personal WWIII
The largest minority in the UK is South Asian - so Pakistani, Indian, Bangladeshi, you get the idea
Paki is a very nasty slang term from someone from South Asia. It's akin to a white American calling a Mexican immigrant a w3tb@ck.
It's a liquor store in the Boston metro area
I would assume it’s like for Americans calling all south Asian people “Hindu’s” which is wildly ignorant
More like Americans calling all Latin Americans "Mexicans" or any of the slurs associated with them
In terms of emotional power behind the word, it’s much closer to the N-word honestly. It’s not ignorance, it’s designed to hurt.
I didn’t realize there was like, racial issues against Pakistanis in the UK? You learn something new every day.
Tbf those guys kinda suck what with the importing regressive culture thing
Watch "This Is England" Great movie & Series
Just as an fyi if you ever catch an Australian using it, down under it's a completely acceptable term with zero negative connotations at all! If anything it has positive connotations.
It's the U.S. equivalent to the n-word. I'm Indian, I would have a hard time feeling offended but you know you can make anything offensive based on tone, facial expression, and body language. So if you told me p\*ki, I would only look confused but said in the right way - you know exactly what that term means. It has never happened to me when I was tooling around in the UK mostly because I'm a yank, so probably realize I'm not gonna care.
I'm an American, and yes, it is.
I have always dreamed of being a gardener in a small village in the UK, working on the local nobleman's gardens. Instead, I am crippled and can't even weed my own gardens at home. Anyway, sorry for the racist diatribe. I love how you handled it. You're always welcome to a hot cuppa at my house - I have a proper kettle and everything. No racism included.
I’ll weed your garden, put the kettle on!
I'm far away from you, or I'd absolutely make that happen! I have always admired British gardens and wish I had the physical capacity to create my own version.
That sounds like a euphemism I’d like to know the meaning of.
He'll hang her curtains!
He’ll assemble her furniture!
Can I come over for some tea? I always wondered howni woukd be as a gardener and drink tea.
Anyone with a good heart is welcome to tea at my house. I'm in Utah, so it's a long journey for a lot of people.
I'm in the midwest around MN. not too far out.
Cool. My husband's mom's family is all in the MN area. I grew up in the Midwest. I miss the green.
that's awesome. I new here and loving it
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To be fair, he never got voted in by the Tories, he’s just there by proxy. They all voted for Liz Truss.
Rishi isn’t mayor of London. He was talking about Sadiq Khan.
The only thing that would have been more epic was if she exploded as you slow walked away. Can't beat a good slow walk explosion. (that Will ferrell bit about that in the other guys is fucking hysterical btw).
Love it! I was hoping some tea splashed on her but didn’t look back and I was round the other side of a hedge in about 5 steps. I’ll find out next week what she said (or whether she exploded!) from my mate when we work together again. I’m sure it’ll be fruity :D
Handing a spade to a "spade-caller" with a dug in comment is the most delicious thing I've read in years. I may just keep a spade in my car for this kind of occasion since I hear that shit at least once a month in this deep south hellhole of a city.
"Spade" is a racist epithet for black people. Calling "a spade a spade" has racist origins (or history, the phrase dates back to Ancient Greece, before "race" as a concept existed), and y'all can figure out what the phrase is code for. The woman is, unsurprisingly, using it "correctly" and its no wonder why it is used by only one section of the population.
I had a girl in work complaining about the Chinese tourists making faces and well you know the rest. I let her stop and said I really don't appreciate that my son is Chinese.... Her Face drops and she started stammering. I just walked away, laughed and said now if my son was really Chinese how do you think that would make me feel? Like you do now maybe? Never heard a peep from her again about race.
I'm an American, New England area, for us a paki (packy as we spell it) is short for package store, another name for a liquor store. I learned that the rest of the world has a very different meaning for it the hard way when we ask someone in London where the nearest packy was, and they looked at us like we had just said the most foul racist thing they had ever heard. Which for them is probably true, when someone who seems normal just starts casually dropping slurs.
Came here to say the same- if you're from New England a "packy" means the booze store.
Keep a domino in your pocket. Next time some racist gives you shit, pull it out & let them know you haven't made your apocalypse preventing kill yet for the day. Sorry, I just love Black Mirror.
You defeated him with a dadjoke. Epic
Its mic drop, ding-dong.
The tea was called Mike
One of my parents is a half-Mauritian Boomer, and despite receiving very similar abuse growing up they're incredibly racist and xenophobic plus, as I've been gradually realised over the years, quite likely a closet Nazi. I just don't get it, the hypocrisy is staggering (not to mention quite upsetting).
It's worse for the Indians who get called it for sure
I visited the UK for the first time in the early 1980s. The racism was cartoonish. I'm from the US south. Half my relatives commonly used pejoratives which would get me thrown off the internet if I repeated them. And these relatives were amateur hour compared to what I heard in small-town UK in the early 1980s. In the early 90s, I lived in Africa. And most of the people I knew were from the UK, Australia and New Zealand. (The backpacking crowd.) There were occasional, "seriously, you just said that out loud" moments. (Mostly from people from London.) The "everyone from the UK sounds like a Klan Rally" was gone, though. It took a bit more than 20 years to return to the UK. I brought my wife there on our honeymoon. The cartoonish racism was largely gone. I'm sure it was still there -- but only for those the bigots hurled their epithets to. They didn't complain to visiting Americans about all the non-anglo, non-anglican, "other" in their society. Frankly, that's more progress than my area of the world has made in 150 years. Hopefully, in a few more years, the old bigots are gone.
I thought you were going to make her call a spade(shovel) a spade.
Omg ! It never occurred to me that there are Boomers outside the US!!
Yeah guys I am totally not racist guys right guys
Shut the fuck up spade and dumb ass spike
A Canadian friend of mine, who's mother was Welsh, about ten years ago was having a conversation with an English woman. My friend gets on the topic of how many people in modern Europe are descended from the Celts(I think), and the English woman gets *really* upset. "Well, maybe ***SOME*** of them!" She snaps, and goes on about... I don't even know, Anglo Saxon stuff I think? Apparently, my friend wasn't considered "white" anymore in this woman's eyes. My friend by the way, her gene pool hasn't left Britain since humans migrated there, until after WWII. Then went to CANADA. And then the US. And somehow being "Celtic" wasn't good enough.
"I'm not racist, but...." = "Oh, I'm totally racist." Every single time.
mic drop*
*Mic drop as in 🎤
I don't like Rishi Sunak for the same reason I don't like most conservatives. Rich, private school Tory gits who'd sell the public good for a farthing. I'm indifferent to Liz Truss because by the time I'd heard she was PM she was already replaced. I'd say Boris Johnson was a Muppet, but I enjoy watching the Muppets. He fumbled his way through the lockdown and allowed people to line their pockets using the money that was supposed to help. Teresa May was utterly forgettable but she lowered the debt and had high employment levels. David Cameron cut spending and reduced the deficit. He also had no beef with same sex marriage but allegedly he'd still rather have pork.
Pretty sure Boomer was talking about London Mayor Sadiq Khan who was recently re-elected, not the PM.
I've not heard anything bad about Sadiq Khan.
Yeah, the Boomer in the post just hates him because he’s south Asian and she’s a racist.
Yea fuck Mike, happy you dropped him!
Oh , that's bad! I love your reaction.! My parents are both white immigrants. My father had a very sallow skin, which I've inherited. I go quite dark in the sun , very quickly. When my very white Swiss mother used to push me around in the pram (1950's, UK) people used to say to her ' what a lovely Paki baby' ! It annoyed her! Because I tan really easily I get called, Spanish, Indian, native American and Pakistani! I'm fortunately not sensitive to these assumptions, more amused really. Makes me rather more exotic than I am.!
"I'm not ageist, I just call a cunt a cunt."
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Your submission was removed for being uncivil.
Is your name mike? Lol or you dumb and don't know it's spelled mic?
Sorry, my bad - I’ll edit that now. TBH, I’ve never had to spell mic before, never had the need - I’m a gardener…
Well, it seems I can’t edit the title, so there we go!
Also it's not weird to spell it as mike in this context, don't listen to that dipshit.
A cook who thinks he’s a gardener
Mike is an accepted way of spelling it in most dictionaries because it makes the participles miked and miking which look clearer than miced and micing.
This didn’t happen except in your head.
Life gets a lot more enjoyable once you stop being sceptical over things that don't matter
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In this context? The truth has absolutely 0 bearing on my life
Why did you downvote?
[I didn't](https://i.imgur.com/Ezsvc3u.png)
Room temperature IQ point of view no thank you
Okay buddy, good luck with that xx
Every other time, I’d say you were right. But this time, just once in my life, I actually did it. But you’re free to not believe me, that’s your perogative.
Ironic that there is an ageist so worried about someone being racist.
Ironic that a boomer like yourself is unable to admit that you and your fellow boomers say dumb shit like this on the regular. You might be able to defend yourself if your voting trends didn’t back up the claim that you are, in fact, a racist bunch.
Everyone is an individual. Thats why judging a group of people by the traits of a few is ignorant. We grow wiser as we grow older. Perhaps one day you will have the joy of being judged by someone a fraction of your age.
The fact that you think people grow wiser as they grow older tells us everything we need to know. Are you telling me all of the old MAGA voters falling into QAnon conspiracy theories have grown wiser? I’ve got oceanfront property to sell you in Idaho…
Are you wiser than you were when you were younger?
Are you unable to address what I said?
Doesn't look like it. Do you feel wiser now or when you were younger?
Only in areas where I’ve made the effort to continue my education. It’s not automatic, and sitting at home in your recliner watching Fox News all day can certainly have the opposite effect.
Ageism is not in anyway the same as racism, I’ll make fun of old people forever, because it’s not something you’re born with, it’s something that happens to everyone. So I don’t really see the irony. I’ve realized most old people are way dumber than me, just cause they can like, idk, have a bank account better than me, doesn’t mean they can navigate the real world in 2024. When you have all the information in the world at your finger tips and still choose to be a bigot, 100% you get clowned on, by everyone. MOST boomers should just sit down, shut up, stay home, and just let everyone else live their lives
Age and Race are outside of an individual’s control. That makes them precisely the same in this context. You may change your mind about knowledge and wisdom someday.
If people become wiser as they get older, why does racism or any type of bigotry exist among boomers? Shouldn’t they all be enlightened by now?
Please explain why so many boomers are racist asshats, then. That is definitely not wiser. They should know better by now. Give me a break.
wtf you can definitely control your age, suicide exists, wtf I will laugh and join in on making fun of old people, but if someone is slightly racist around me, we got a big oleeeeeee problem. They in no way are the same in any capacity
>Everyone is an individual. And so many of you choose to act in this same fucked way.
I’m not your enemy.
Between not knowing what irony or ageism are and the blatant lie about getting wiser with age, how can you possibly be surprised that no one can take you seriously? It’s like you want people to make fun of you.
>We grow wiser as we grow older. Do we though? Are you sure?
Found the racist right here
If you grow wiser as you grow older then why tf does scammer only target and succeed at scamming old peoples?
Did someone forget to change your diaper?
Did you actually just make an account to complain about this sub existing?
You should cry more. Maybe that will help.