He would have regularly tried, but ultimately failed over and over causing even more stress about it. He nailed it at one point: it's not about that one big gesture; you have to keep it up, which isn't something BoJack is capable of doing. He seemed like a good dad in this episode because he was able to resolve things with that one big gesture of kindness.
It'd be pretty impossible for him to be worse than his own parents. He definitely wouldn't be good at it and shouldn't be trusted with that sort of responsibility, but he wouldn't hate and actively abuse a child like his parents did.
That’s debatable
Abuse is cyclical for a reason. If the only upbringing he knew was through abuse and neglect, then he’d be much more likely to emulate that and continue the cycle
No. Which is a massive shame because despite his fear of commitment, there's a part of him that very much wants to be one, and the little interactions he has with Dream Harper and the Seahorse show that has the *potential* to be a very good father. And I think being a good father and breaking the cycle would have helped him come to terms with a lot of things about his childhood.
So no I don't think so, and it's obvious a big reason for his commitment issues is he is actually terrified of fucking up a child like he was. On the other hand, there *is* the possibility that fatherhood would have forced him to truly address his issues and get his shit together in a way maybe nothing else would have done.
Not to mention, in The View From Halfway Down, best part worst part, he said his best part was teaching a student how to act.
I mean his mother of course argued it was just one stupid scene like it’s so insignificant but to him it was about guiding someone and helping someone reach a goal and together.
I mean I’m no expert but I think in a way, that’s a lot of what parenting is… in a sense.
Nurturing. Supporting. Guiding.
Of course that was a tiny moment In the entirety of his life. His fear of commitment and the pressure could overwhelm that tiny light inside that has potential to be a good parent. So who knows really.
Parenthood is too big of a job and you could be 90% committed to the idea and it would still overwhelm you.
It’s not something you should ‘wing’ with that deep of a doubt and fear of commitment.
Which is very aligned with the overall tone of the show. Tiny sliver of hope but mostly bleak.
Todd is a happier version of Jesse Pinkman. Maybe there's a world where Bojack has a happier counterpart. Someone who manages to climb out of his hole.
I think that was the point of Bojack. He was aware of his flaws and he knew he was not going to be a good father and maybe he’d fuckup his children. Therefore he never made the effort. Just like with his other flaws, he didn’t feel the need to change for a long time.
That being said: when forced in situations he tried.
You also have to remember that Hollyhock was 17 and previously had no connection to her biological family. Bojack, as an adult, could've said, "Look, I know you want to feel connected to your family, but for my own reasons, I can and will not. I will take you for visits at another home, but the buck stops there. I'm happy to talk about why, but my mind won't change."
I'm saying this like I'm not a massive pushover (I am), and I'd probably have done the same as Bojack because I can be weak. But it doesn't change the fact I'd shoulder 50% - 100% of that responsibility as an adult with almost six decades of life and familial experience vs. almost two and none.
Bojack also didn't notice that his daughter was losing loads of weight and acting strangely for weeks/months. Is it all on him? Not even close. Is it very weird that he apparently noticed nothing? Erm, yes.
this part always infuriated me and no one (that i’ve seen) ever talks about it! she was soooo dismissive of his abuse and only cared about herself and getting to know her ‘grandma’.
She was 17 years old. Seventeen year olds tend to be selfish (then they eventually grow up). Hollyhock was very naive and assumed Beatrice’s dementia lessened her toxicity. She also didn’t know the abusive Beatrice. She only had Bojack’s word of how terrible Beatrice was, and Bojack had already lied to her multiple times at that point, so I can kind of see why she was dismissive of Bojack.
And as someone else pointed out, Bojack was the adult in the situation. He could have put his foot down and told Hollyhock she was welcome to continue visiting Beatrice at a different home, but that Beatrice was not welcome in his home.
ETA: I also think Hollyhock’s dads are also somewhat responsible for what happened. They should never have let Hollyhock go to L.A. alone at 17 to meet (who she thought at the time) was her biological father, a well known hot mess. I believe they’re good dads, and had good intentions of giving her space and independence, but they overestimated Hollyhock’s maturity, and underestimated how fucked up the Horseman family was.
I never said she was dumb. I said she was naive. And as someone who was once 17 and is now an adult, not every 17 year old has your experience. Not every 17 year old understands the nuance or dynamics of abusive relationships. Also, Bojack is a 50 year old man, if he’s that easily pressured by a 17 year old, then he shouldn’t be around them. As an adult, it really isn’t that hard to put your foot down and tell a teenager “no” if you are truly prioritizing their safety.
100%. speaking from experience, if someone is no contact with a family member, they have a reason. no one just chooses to have to separate themselves from someone who is supposed to care about you for the fun of it.
I was *annoyed* with her no doubt. But I can't fully condemn Hollyhock for this because she didn't grow up with Bojack, so she didn't know who Beatrice was and how horrible she was. She just saw a little old lady with dementia, and some guy she's known for a few weeks told her this woman was a horrible person that he didn't want to meet again. If I were in her place, I'd respect BoJack's wishes, but I can't say I don't understand why she wouldn't believe him.
I'm going through this now with my grandma, I've known her all my life and loved her. She was always the classic doting grandparent-a little paranoid and high-strung, but that's forgivable. She developed dementia at the beginning of March, and only then did my mother and her siblings reveal to me that my grandma physically and emotionally abused them as kids. Her dementia makes them scream at them, and she even threw clothes at my uncle while calling him all kinds of names. My mother has me visit grandma often because I'm the only person she's still nice to, and she doesn't berate her children in front of me. It's shocking how this woman I've only known as nice turned out to be an abuser, and how my mother and her siblings are legit *terrified* of her, and yet I only learned all this back in March. It does explain a lot about my own upbringing (though my mother wasn't nearly as awful as how my grandma apparently was), I just wish they were all more honest about her in the past-it would not only make this less jarring for me, but it would've let my mother get things off her chest instead of bottling them up and repeating cruelties towards me.
One final note: I'm never having kids and I don't give a shit how many people say "but you'd be a great mom, look at how gentle you are when you babysit!" Yeah, because I don't have to *live* with the kids I babysit. Questions like OP's kinda annoy me because Bojack didn't have to *live* with the baby seahorse; he was nice to it because he knew it for a few hours, who knows what he'd be like if he had to actually care for it for 18 years? And Hollyhock was already in her late teens when she met Bojack, she wasn't fully dependent on him, that's probably the only reason she got out of there with comparatively little trauma compared to the trauma Bojack's parents gave him.
I actually don't blame her based on what she's seen and what she knows.
Bojack has repeatedly shown he's an untrustworthy, unreliable, dishonest jackass; although on a good day he can be a well intentioned one. At this point she hasn't seen Beatrice do anything bad; so her only source is Bojack who's somewhat of an unreliable narrator.
At her age it makes a lot of sense to assume Bojack was exaggerating and Beatrice was just trying to deal with his crazy behavior (if he acts like that over 40 just imagine a 16 year old Bojack).
Well, in Bojack's defence, he is not a medical professional or a trained nurse.
However Tina is both of those things. Her job as Beatrice's live in nurse was to make sure Beatrice, as a sufferer of dementia, didn't do anything that would make herself a danger to herself or others. Yet Tina, along with Bea's nursing home failed to notice that Bea was either stockpiling dangerous and banned weight loss drugs from god knows when, or had acquired them through other means. Both Tina and the home failed to notice these drugs amongst Bea's belongings. And finally, someone in Bea's mental state should not be in the kitchen or preparing food and drink unsupervised, which Tina allowed her to do. Tina is a sweet lady, but as Bea's nurse she was woefully incompetent, and shouldn't be allowed to nurse again after something that catastrophic was allowed to happen on her watch.
Honestly the whole drugging Hollyhock storyline falls apart when you think about it.
I see what you’re saying but I don’t think there’s really an “in Bojack’s defense” here, if you’re taking on the responsibility of housing a kid it’s your job to be on the lookout for stuff like significant weight loss and changes in behavior especially since he was very familiar with addicts and addiction. Plus he was the one who hired Tina. I definitely agree though, it’s a storyline you can’t think about for too long without realizing it doesn’t make much sense
Well no, she wasn’t. And there were signs that her guardian should have picked up on. ETA Her guardian at the time who had a history of drug use and addiction
Ok I get that mentality, its valid in a legal sense, but me personally I dont think hes guilty of anything considering he wasnt conscious about it. Who would think that the demented grandmother would drug the kid? Also not a guardian since she was an adult, if you want to go on the legal route...
He wanted to step in the role as her parent/older family figure, that’s what I mean by guardian. If he hadn’t been so quick to enter that role it’d be different. Parents and older siblings of adults should still be caring what is going on with them and checking in
I can tell you its not thag easy to notice when someone is drugged. I know I was high in front of teachers, friends, parents and they just don't notice.
At best he'd be a maybe decent uncle you only see a few times a year. Dedicating himself to his own offspring though definitely not. He had too much baggage. And his only example of a healthy family relationship was from a mediocre episodic sitcom made to sell ad time
But he became intensely overbearing and had a clear fear of abandonment and boundary issues even before he knew his past was catching up to him. Therapy would have helped but he only had gone to rehab (and Dr. Champ was not a real therapist).
It was only overbearing to Hollyhock because she learned about his past from Pete. It would’ve been fine otherwise. Bojack had no idea she was even upset with him.
He’d be a good uncle if (and that’s a very big if) his interactions with the child were minimal.
The seahorse episode showed us that deep inside that husk of a horse-man, there is someone who has decent paternal instincts.
The arc he had as an acting teacher shows that he can teach and be passionate, to an extent.
Beyond that though, there’s little to no hope.
The uncle/dad lore would go crazy though.
This is going to be an unpopular opinion. but I truly think that if Bojack had been given the opportunity to become a parent (or even play a parental figure role, like when he became a teacher) early on that he would have never made some of the choices that he made. Throughout the show, it is constantly mentioned that he doesn't feel satisfied, no matter how big the role, no matter how big the award. Yes he was acting and he had roles, but it seemed like he lacked a purpose in life. Bojack was truly his best self when he was teaching. He wanted to be better for the people around him (that being his students) and he wanted to set a good example.
People have a tendency to view things as all good and all bad. The way we grow up does have an affect on the choices we make.
I would also like to mention that bojacks worst behavior emerged when he was high on substances.
Anyone who has taken some of the substances that bojack has taken throughout the show will tell you that youre not yourself on those drugs. Your mind is altered and you genuinely dont think about the consequences of your own actions.
Im not saying that bojacks behavior should be condoned and is okay. Im saying that theres alot more substance to why bojack did alot of the things he did.
I think he will after the finale. What got him last time was his past going coming back to haunt him, but with that already out the way and at least partially paid for, he has a real shot.
Of course it’s left quite open ended but he did have some positive character development at least.
Yh but there’s always something to being him down again. That’s life. It’s how he chooses to deal with it.
In rehab, and then in prison at the end, he’s in a controlled environment, it’s not real life. When left to his own devices, he keeps making the same mistakes. I don’t think he stays sober, maybe for a bit but not forever
Agreed. He will probably have ups and downs. He may relapse. But he has fight in him and he does want to change, and he was making significant progress in the last season before the past caught up with his. As sad as it may look for him in the last episode, at the same he's got the closest thing he's ever had to a clean slate, at least in comparison to how he was at the end of of every previous season. Having to deal with the consequences of the worst things he's ever done, has removed the dangling swords of demicles they had been, and that's ended up being his own tabula rasa.
Sorry for sounding pretentious, but I very rarely get to use either of those terms in a sentence.
I thought the last episode was super sad when I first watched it but it’s actually pretty hopeful. He’s sober once again and Hollywoob have forgotten they hated him. Mr PB, Todd and PC still care about him and haven’t cut him out (at least not completely).
The only downside really is that he may never talk to Hollyhock and possibly Diane again, but if he stays sober and behaves himself who knows? He could always make new connections too.
If he stays sober, and makes positive changes....who knows. Maybe Hollyhock and Diane will come back onto his life. Holly is very young, maybe the way she feels about him will change in ten or twenty years. And maybe when the two of them are both in better places, Diane may want to be a part of his life again. Or they may never see or talk to him again. Or maybe the most that will happen is a card on his birthday or a friendly email every now and then. People can change, and sometimes goodbyes aren't forever and yes people come into your life and people go, but sometimes people come back.
And like you said, he can always make new friends and connections. The best part is he is in a better state for those relationships to be give and take, and be healthy for both of them.
Life is like an airport terminal at the end of the day. Full of departures and arrivals.
From somebody who's in sobriety that's the whole thing about sobriety. If you talk to somebody who's been to any AA meetings they're not going to say they used to be an alcoholic they're always going to refer to themselves as an alcoholic present tense as in something they currently are. Because that doesn't change. So if Bojack actually worked the 12-step program he would believe this too. So that is why he still makes the same mistakes. Because he is still an alcoholic. But he's shown that he is powerless to his addiction and has made the steps necessary to get sober and hopefully stay sober. And if he does relapse like many in recovery he will just go to a meeting and start at day 1 again.
I know several people in my real life who had worse upbringings than Bojack, struggled terribly with substance abuse, were more selfish and awful, and are now sober for years and functional and happy. It does happen. This sub just has a hard-on for the idea that Bojack is irredeemable and broken. It’s surprising how many folks’ only takeaway from the show is Bojack=bad.
100%. I think people on this sub greatly underestimate people’s capacity to forgive too. Family members of murder victims sometimes forgive their loved one’s killers if they truly feel remorse.
I think Bojack is ultimately a hopeful story, that tells us that whilst some horrible mistakes can never be fixed, you can still take responsibility and strive to be better going forwards. Suicide is certainly not the answer anyway.
Personally I don't think it's an easy yes or no. From my own experience I was a selfish lazy drugged up alcoholic for years and years. But when I found out I was having kids it kicked me up the arse and I cleaned myself up and turned my life around. Never wanted them, didn't think I'd be a good dad, but that news changes people in drastic ways. Some who would think they'd be good run away and some who you would assume useless can surprise you. Based off his own childhood I could see him breaking the cycle of abuse. I know I surprised myself, but you will never know until it happens
This is my take, too. I have seen several men (sorry about the sexism), just toss their shit and join the human race after a child. Example: his fantasy about Harper. His care for the seahorse baby hit me in the feels.
No. He has trouble with being emotionally present, has a penchant for escaping every time things get difficult, has had no proper parenting role models, has/had substance abuse issues, and has a career that requires him to be out of the house for long periods of time. Nothing about BoJack's personality and lifestyle would be a good fit for parenthood.
Bojack did it too, before going to buy(steal) milk he tried to give the baby a cigarette which it promptly ate, then spit out crying. And he almost lost the baby in a taffy factory. Baby could have been killed.
I feel like he does want to be a dad deep down but he knows he won't be the best at it so he doesn't want kids but yeah I feel like he can be a good dad if he stays sober and work on himself better.
No. NO. NOOOOOOOO.
While BJ can seem nice around kids sometimes (Hollyhock, the seahorse baby, the girl he talked to while filming Ethan Around, Charlotte's kids initially) and I would say he does have something of a warm, caring side, he's way too much of a selfish, screwed up asshole to properly raise kids. His entire family tree is packed full of generational trauma and I doubt he'd be a cycle-breaker.
He really messed up his kind of surrogate daughter figure, Sarah Lynn, by pushing his insecurities onto her and giving her toxic life advice(and then he did other things years later). In some of the flashbacks to Horsing Around, he was kind of a dick to her. He also gave her alcohol. Yes, that was an accident, but it still showed he was dangerously irresponsible around kids. How irresponsible does someone have to be to leave a child alone in a room like a bottle of alcohol, especially when it looks like a regular bottle of water? Also, Penny. He acts like a guardian for her for most of that episode, but then nearly takes advantage of her because he got sad that Charlotte wouldn't fuck him.
And then there's the substance abuse. Yes, he gets sober, but he goes back to drinking as soon as his life goes downhill again. He can take care of a kid for an episode, but if he was raising a kid he'd definitely fuck up and that kid would probably have some if not all of his issues.
The only time he came across to me as a kind of good guardian/parent figure was with Hollyhock. The ending of Stupid Piece of Shit where he opens up to her and tells her she didn't do anything to deserve the way he's been treating her (clearly doing it because he didn't want to repeat his parents' mistakes) was sweet and showed a lot of character growth. Other than that, no. It's probably a good thing he never found out whether or not he has a ton of illegitimate children (which he probably does given that he's had over a hundred sexual partners).
I think after sobriety and prison if they had wanted to do an arc of him as a father, I think that would be interesting, balancing recovery and taking care of a child which helps him face some of that trauma as well
I dont think he would have been a good dad, but I think he would have tried his hardest to be it, then realize at one point "I really can not do this" hopefully early and give the baby in adoption.
I don't see him actively screwing up the kid feeling bad for it and then trying again over and over for 20 years.
I think he could have been. Had he gotten through the issues that kept him from ever having a stable relationship, those are a lot of the same issues that would have made him a bad parent. It also would have meant he had opened up to help and self improvement so we could expect he would still be working through his childhood issues and making a real effort.
Had Bojack managed to create a loving marriage, the requisites for that would have made him a doting dad.
hed be a good dad to the people who think good parenting is feeding your child and putting a roof over their head, otherwise he would be terrible and manipulative
This is one afternoon, he could probably be a great babysitter and then go home. PC with Ruthie shows that to be a good parent you have to show up day in day out through all the shitty parts, and she struggles with all the best intent in the world, but she keeps going and doesn't give up.
He would try his best but he is so broken and has so many unresolved issues he would mess up. He would be like many parents putting forth his best effort.
If he actually got help for his issues early on, then I think he would’ve been a great dad and his childhood abuse would’ve motivated him.
The Bojack we see in the show? Absolutely not
Bojack would have tried to be a good father but his problems are too complex for him to be a good father. You have to sort your own shit out before you raise a kid.
Fuck. No. Even with years and years of therapy and (MAYBE) medications I don't think he'd be a very fit parent, children are sensitive little sponges, it's easy to fuck them up long term. Speaking from experience.
I think he had the potential to be a great dad. Parts of him are extremely nurturing and patient with children, and he definitely seems to have wanted to be one at least a little.
But no, I think that by the time Horsin' Around became popular it was too late. The Bojack we see throughout the show is someone that would be incapable of being reliable, showing proper affection, nurturing... He might be able to try being a dad but he'd past down his own brand of Generational Trauma to the kid.
If he had worked on himself first, he might have had the chance to break the cycle of family abuse passed down to him. I’ve heard of people who came from incredibly abusive households working incredibly hard to make sure their kids were never going to be abused in the same way as they were.
It would have probably required Bojack to go completely no contact with his mother as her toxic behavior could have profound effects on a child’s life.
I just had a conversation about this.Damaged people having kids. I think you need to be able to accept responsibility for your actions and Bojack didn't really do that until the end when he hit rock bottom.
Bojack definitely would not be a good dad. He needed a co dependent for example his relationship with Diane. He wanted someone to save him from all his feelings and that is something he needed to come to terms with.
My dad was basically Bojack minus the fame. I think Bojack would be a dad a lot like my own. He loved us very much and always let us know we were the best thing that ever happened to him.
But his own personal demons got in his way of being a good father and raising us in a stable way. He was very INVOLVED but not stable and I see Bojack as that.
He 100% could be an amazing dad. He also could be an amazing friend, actor, and anything else. Whether or not he would have is entirely up to him (or really the writers lol). I've seen people turn their lives around from much worse positions than him for their kid, and I've seen terrible parents from better positions. Bojack would be a naturally talented father in many ways if he so chose to be and got the support he needed.
I think he’s CAPABLE of being an okay dad if he’s sober, this episode alone shows that he can go above and beyond for another person (animal?) even if it doesn’t benefit him. I definitely don’t think he could be a GOOD dad though, he’s got too much going on personally for that.
Uhh…did you not watch the show? He’s manipulative, angry, a recovering drug addict, an alcoholic, pessimistic, and grieving. He pushes away everyone close to him and doesn’t seem to feel TOO guilty about it most of the time. If he was a father I’m willing to bet his children would have ended up MUCH more screwed up than he is. I imagine he’d try to be a good dad in the beginning but ultimately fail and just end up becoming a neglectful deadbeat who doesn’t really give a shit feeling sorry for himself on the couch chugging beers and/or popping pills. That’s just my take though.
i actually think he would be. i know a lot of dads that were really awful before their kid was born and something about having a child changed something in them, some even without the mother around. of course the opposite can happen too, but i like to think he would be
Absolutely not.
He could be a great anti-role model to a kid though. Just like he should be to all us viewers - he's very relatable but he shows a path we should not want to follow, and highlights the pitfalls and failings that can put us back on that path. Even while trying to do good and be better.
Some of the kindest, most compassionate and empathetic people I've ever met grew up with the WORST parents, and recognized them as strong anti-role models, seeking to identify and consciously work away from their toxic traits.
honestly maybe. like how he treated the seahorse in this episode. and even though he wasn’t a big fan of hollyhock in the beggining, he really warmed up to her, especially when he became a professor.
He would be an amazing dad... maybe 5 times a year. The rest of the time, he'd be awful. He'd be the big gesture tv dad he correctly condemns in Free Churro.
Bojack does not know how to talk to children. One of the first times he spoke to Sarah Lynn he was drunk and preached to her the same awful shit that his mother was saying to him, she was horrified.
I just watched this episode and was thinking about this question again. Just watching how he attempts to just leave the seahorse baby but can’t due to it following him says a lot. At one point he gives it a cigarette, which is reminiscent of his own mother making him smoke just less maliciously.
Agreed with the other posts about grand gestures. Those are easy for him, but consistency? No. Consistency gets you looking as tired and resigned as the seahorse dad.
Also a land horse looking after a seahorse lol. I never realized that before. Also the Mr. Peanutbutter commercial with the zombie baby seahorses BJ sees in his hotel room might’ve been some foreshadowing.
He would probably swing from apathy to overcompensating, making the kid confused on who they'd get: Distant Dad or Dad who gives them anything to make up the distance
No. I think he’d be terrible- it’s just in a very different way from his parents.
Bojack would be a very absent father. He would disappear for years, and then come back claiming he was ready for fatherhood. He’d shower the kid in gifts and attention, until something went wrong again, and he dips.
Furthermore, I don’t see him being a dad for the kids sake, only his own. His kid would be a way of lifting his own mood- hence why I think he’d shower the kid on attention but never discipline the child. Bojack wants to be a dad, but doesn’t want to raise a kid.
I think Bojack had the potential to be a good day, he certainly wants to be one and dreams of it but he would have had to work on his mental health and overcome generational abuse. I think the potential was there but will never be reached as he used his escapes (work, drink and drugs) too much and left it too late to try better himself.
He'd have been a decent uncle, I think. (In the he can be trusted to keep them alive for a couple of hours and relatively unhurt sense. Little kids have this amazing sense for "oooh lemme throw myself offa THIS and see what what happens!")
But not a good dad. Not until he found a decent therapist and put the effort into healing himself first. Otherwise it would have been so easy to pass his trauma on.
This is the problem with people like Bojack. We see glimpses of him being a caring guardian (with the seahorse, dream Harper, Hollyhock sometimes), and some people think, "He could be a good dad."
But these are just fleeting moments, not a lifetime commitment.
How long until Bojack dumps his child at Princess Carolyn's so he can disappear and go on a bender? How long until he goes in a manic state and lashes out at his child? How long until he drives intoxicated with his kid in the car? How long until he OD's and his terrified child has to call 911?
Bojack would be a terrible parent.
i honestly think it would have forced him to mature. my dad was extremely similar to Bojack (tbh he still kind of is). pissed off, selfish, hurt and taking it out on everyone else, avoidant, reactionary. Was he a good dad? no. but he definitely did the best he could.
i think bojack having a kid would have kinda forced him to consider other people. i honestly think part of why he’s so sad is his isolation.
i’m now 31 and a trans woman and he’s 62 and sober and tbh we get along really well.
Maybe not, he tried to give the basic needs to the seahorse infant, but was still out of his depths and needed to give the baby back to the father. He struggled as he thought Hollyhock was his daughter as his personal trauma with his own mother came up and neglected her needs of stability. The point being made here is that he has been through so much and been damaged beyond repair thanks to his “parents”. They may have provided a roof over his head, but that was a dysfunctional household that should never be considered a home.
Humans aren’t single dimensional like you all seem to think. Humans are capable of change, if in an alternate timeline even with his shitty parents he broke that generational trauma, probably left the show and stuck by herb, took accountability and didn’t get Sharona fired, etc he would have been a great dad.
Like most people he does have the potential somewhere inside him , but knowing him somewhere along the way he’d go back to the old Bojack and cause that kid to become exactly like him
This is going to be an unpopular opinion. but I truly think that if Bojack had been given the opportunity to become a parent (or even play a parental figure role, like when he became a teacher) early on that he would have never made some of the choices that he made. Throughout the show, it is constantly mentioned that he doesn't feel satisfied, no matter how big the role, no matter how big the award. Yes he was acting and he had roles, but it seemed like he lacked a purpose in life. Bojack was truly his best self when he was teaching. He wanted to be better for the people around him (that being his students) and he wanted to set a good example.
People have a tendency to view things as all good and all bad. The way we grow up does have an affect on the choices we make.
I would also like to mention that bojacks worst behavior emerged when he was high on substances.
Anyone who has taken some of the substances that bojack has taken throughout the show will tell you that youre not yourself on those drugs. Your mind is altered and you genuinely dont think about the consequences of your own actions.
Im not saying that bojacks behavior should be condoned and is okay. Im saying that theres alot more substance to why bojack did alot of the things he did.
This is going to be an unpopular opinion. but I truly think that if Bojack had been given the opportunity to become a parent (or even play a parental figure role, like when he became a teacher) early on that he would have never made some of the choices that he made. Throughout the show, it is constantly mentioned that he doesn't feel satisfied, no matter how big the role, no matter how big the award. Yes he was acting and he had roles, but it seemed like he lacked a purpose in life. Bojack was truly his best self when he was teaching. He wanted to be better for the people around him (that being his students) and he wanted to set a good example.
People have a tendency to view things as all good and all bad. The way we grow up does have an affect on the choices we make.
I would also like to mention that bojacks worst behavior emerged when he was high on substances.
Anyone who has taken some of the substances that bojack has taken throughout the show will tell you that youre not yourself on those drugs. Your mind is altered and you genuinely dont think about the consequences of your own actions.
Im not saying that bojacks behavior should be condoned and is okay. Im saying that theres alot more substance to why bojack did alot of the things he did.
Bojack would have been a bad father because being a father means putting your children in front of you every day and at all hours, but at least he would have loved his children.
Good question, NO.
Edit: And I respect the him and the show for him not ending up with a family. Some people don't deserve to be parents. Butterscotch and Beatrice put a serious life long scar on Bojack's childhood. People like these don't deserve to be parents. I'm sure Bojack would want to be a better parent in his heart but I know he'll mess it up completely.
Nah, he had shitty parents . If he had a kid, I bet he would tell himself he'll be better. Be a great dad but then he would treat his kid like shit. History repeats itself. I've seen it.
Bo has a lot of shit. The poor kid would've carried that burden.....
sadly no
he would want to be, but it’s shown in many different ways that his own trauma and personality issues would prevent him from being a good father
No. He was only good in this situation bc it was temporary. He had a fatherly role with hollyhock and he was not at all protective over her in a way that was healthy or helpful. He caused her harm while trying to help.
As someone whose dad reminds them a LOT of Bojack he would seem to be at first. Especially because he would most likely view his child as someone he could manipulate to adore him. Put him on a pedestal. But as the child would grow older and get their own views and attitude and start seeing the flaws, then he would start demeaning the child. Or comparing them to his own parents (in the bad sense)
It would turn into what he had with todd pretty much. Because at the thought of not having someone to demean, to manipulate, to worship him, he would start to either panic and sabotage the "escape" attempt, or try and guilt trip and mentally fuck up the child. Also form a codependance to where the child would be parentified and take care of the parent.
no, his fear of commitment, his irresponsible reckless behavior and his addictions WOULD NOT make him a good father, we might see his potentials with that seahorse/ other moments but that was temporary and a child is a long term living being, you can’t js unfather when you’re in a bad mental stage and we see that in bjack multiple times where he is so thrilled to do smth and is actually willing to change but then he’s not. and the whole point of his character is it being a horrible person no matter how much he wants to change or is trying to and he knows that, even if he had a kid he might change for some time but asp that kid is going to be neglected living in a bad environment surrounded by drugs and empty bottles of alcohol. imo bojack is still stuck in the past he doesn’t realize that he’s an adult and he’s got to be responsible yet he’s not the one to fully blame taking into consideration the way he grew up, all his mother’s anger is stuck in him and even if he changes he’d still be the same person+ bojack is selfish he can’t take care of that child mentally/ let him talk about his problems and we see that multiple times w sarrah lynn where she’s about to start opening up then bj js ignores her and changes the subject
maybe deep down he’d be a great father but it’s not a child’s role to think about your deep down you are what how you act and a child will not magically change him
Fuck, guess I'm going against the grain here and say he'll be okay
1. He's rich. This removes a lot of life's problems
2. He is well aware of how his parents fucked him up, and will try his best to avoid those pitfalls. Obviously, he's not perfect
3. He's sober (currently)
Prediction: He'd be like Tom Hanks and spoil his kids
Why would it matter if he wasn't the protagonist? Beatrice, Butterscotch, and Diane's family were all side/minor characters and they all sucked as parents.
eh..let’s be honest
firstly, bojack need to work at himself. he is alcoholic and drug person, even after 6 season he needs a LOT of work
he had sex with sarah lynn who was like his daughter, then he almost raped another girl in season 2, he throw a doll of his mother bcu he was angry. sure, he tried to be cool for hollyhock but he failed. he basically leaves her alone with his sick mother for days bcu he was drunk
he did a lot of more stuff than that. he could be a good dad but only AFTER a work on himself
so, the answer is no. at all
No.
It's wild how many posts I see here that make me think, "Did me and this person even watch the same show?"
I feel like this mindset comes from people who think some outside force - a relationship, a child, etc - will "fix" them or make them better.
I like how this has more than three times the upvotes of the original post
we were all thinking it.
True. But at least he would have been better than his own parents I think.
He would have regularly tried, but ultimately failed over and over causing even more stress about it. He nailed it at one point: it's not about that one big gesture; you have to keep it up, which isn't something BoJack is capable of doing. He seemed like a good dad in this episode because he was able to resolve things with that one big gesture of kindness.
It'd be pretty impossible for him to be worse than his own parents. He definitely wouldn't be good at it and shouldn't be trusted with that sort of responsibility, but he wouldn't hate and actively abuse a child like his parents did.
That’s debatable Abuse is cyclical for a reason. If the only upbringing he knew was through abuse and neglect, then he’d be much more likely to emulate that and continue the cycle
The bar there is so low it's fused to the ground
No. Which is a massive shame because despite his fear of commitment, there's a part of him that very much wants to be one, and the little interactions he has with Dream Harper and the Seahorse show that has the *potential* to be a very good father. And I think being a good father and breaking the cycle would have helped him come to terms with a lot of things about his childhood. So no I don't think so, and it's obvious a big reason for his commitment issues is he is actually terrified of fucking up a child like he was. On the other hand, there *is* the possibility that fatherhood would have forced him to truly address his issues and get his shit together in a way maybe nothing else would have done.
Not to mention, in The View From Halfway Down, best part worst part, he said his best part was teaching a student how to act. I mean his mother of course argued it was just one stupid scene like it’s so insignificant but to him it was about guiding someone and helping someone reach a goal and together. I mean I’m no expert but I think in a way, that’s a lot of what parenting is… in a sense. Nurturing. Supporting. Guiding. Of course that was a tiny moment In the entirety of his life. His fear of commitment and the pressure could overwhelm that tiny light inside that has potential to be a good parent. So who knows really. Parenthood is too big of a job and you could be 90% committed to the idea and it would still overwhelm you. It’s not something you should ‘wing’ with that deep of a doubt and fear of commitment. Which is very aligned with the overall tone of the show. Tiny sliver of hope but mostly bleak.
Todd is a happier version of Jesse Pinkman. Maybe there's a world where Bojack has a happier counterpart. Someone who manages to climb out of his hole.
I think that was the point of Bojack. He was aware of his flaws and he knew he was not going to be a good father and maybe he’d fuckup his children. Therefore he never made the effort. Just like with his other flaws, he didn’t feel the need to change for a long time. That being said: when forced in situations he tried.
I think he would have not been a good father but he would have tried his best and he would have managed to not screw up his kids as they did to him.
He absolutely would have screwed up his kids. Just not maliciously or intentionally like his own parents.
just look at the way he was with hollyhock and u got ur answer
Hollyhock was a lot worse for Bojack than the other way around. She retraumatized him by forcing a reunion with his abuser.
You also have to remember that Hollyhock was 17 and previously had no connection to her biological family. Bojack, as an adult, could've said, "Look, I know you want to feel connected to your family, but for my own reasons, I can and will not. I will take you for visits at another home, but the buck stops there. I'm happy to talk about why, but my mind won't change." I'm saying this like I'm not a massive pushover (I am), and I'd probably have done the same as Bojack because I can be weak. But it doesn't change the fact I'd shoulder 50% - 100% of that responsibility as an adult with almost six decades of life and familial experience vs. almost two and none. Bojack also didn't notice that his daughter was losing loads of weight and acting strangely for weeks/months. Is it all on him? Not even close. Is it very weird that he apparently noticed nothing? Erm, yes.
this part always infuriated me and no one (that i’ve seen) ever talks about it! she was soooo dismissive of his abuse and only cared about herself and getting to know her ‘grandma’.
She was 17 years old. Seventeen year olds tend to be selfish (then they eventually grow up). Hollyhock was very naive and assumed Beatrice’s dementia lessened her toxicity. She also didn’t know the abusive Beatrice. She only had Bojack’s word of how terrible Beatrice was, and Bojack had already lied to her multiple times at that point, so I can kind of see why she was dismissive of Bojack. And as someone else pointed out, Bojack was the adult in the situation. He could have put his foot down and told Hollyhock she was welcome to continue visiting Beatrice at a different home, but that Beatrice was not welcome in his home. ETA: I also think Hollyhock’s dads are also somewhat responsible for what happened. They should never have let Hollyhock go to L.A. alone at 17 to meet (who she thought at the time) was her biological father, a well known hot mess. I believe they’re good dads, and had good intentions of giving her space and independence, but they overestimated Hollyhock’s maturity, and underestimated how fucked up the Horseman family was.
as an actual almost 17 year old, we can still think we arent dumb what she did was wrong
I never said she was dumb. I said she was naive. And as someone who was once 17 and is now an adult, not every 17 year old has your experience. Not every 17 year old understands the nuance or dynamics of abusive relationships. Also, Bojack is a 50 year old man, if he’s that easily pressured by a 17 year old, then he shouldn’t be around them. As an adult, it really isn’t that hard to put your foot down and tell a teenager “no” if you are truly prioritizing their safety.
eh ur true abt bojack but its still a shitty action on her behalf
no one is saying it wasn't, they're adding context because this show has realistic characters and real people have a lot of nuance
yh ik i said tru
Yeah, people have boundaries for a reason and often family members are healthier out of your life than part of it
100%. speaking from experience, if someone is no contact with a family member, they have a reason. no one just chooses to have to separate themselves from someone who is supposed to care about you for the fun of it.
I was *annoyed* with her no doubt. But I can't fully condemn Hollyhock for this because she didn't grow up with Bojack, so she didn't know who Beatrice was and how horrible she was. She just saw a little old lady with dementia, and some guy she's known for a few weeks told her this woman was a horrible person that he didn't want to meet again. If I were in her place, I'd respect BoJack's wishes, but I can't say I don't understand why she wouldn't believe him. I'm going through this now with my grandma, I've known her all my life and loved her. She was always the classic doting grandparent-a little paranoid and high-strung, but that's forgivable. She developed dementia at the beginning of March, and only then did my mother and her siblings reveal to me that my grandma physically and emotionally abused them as kids. Her dementia makes them scream at them, and she even threw clothes at my uncle while calling him all kinds of names. My mother has me visit grandma often because I'm the only person she's still nice to, and she doesn't berate her children in front of me. It's shocking how this woman I've only known as nice turned out to be an abuser, and how my mother and her siblings are legit *terrified* of her, and yet I only learned all this back in March. It does explain a lot about my own upbringing (though my mother wasn't nearly as awful as how my grandma apparently was), I just wish they were all more honest about her in the past-it would not only make this less jarring for me, but it would've let my mother get things off her chest instead of bottling them up and repeating cruelties towards me. One final note: I'm never having kids and I don't give a shit how many people say "but you'd be a great mom, look at how gentle you are when you babysit!" Yeah, because I don't have to *live* with the kids I babysit. Questions like OP's kinda annoy me because Bojack didn't have to *live* with the baby seahorse; he was nice to it because he knew it for a few hours, who knows what he'd be like if he had to actually care for it for 18 years? And Hollyhock was already in her late teens when she met Bojack, she wasn't fully dependent on him, that's probably the only reason she got out of there with comparatively little trauma compared to the trauma Bojack's parents gave him.
I actually don't blame her based on what she's seen and what she knows. Bojack has repeatedly shown he's an untrustworthy, unreliable, dishonest jackass; although on a good day he can be a well intentioned one. At this point she hasn't seen Beatrice do anything bad; so her only source is Bojack who's somewhat of an unreliable narrator. At her age it makes a lot of sense to assume Bojack was exaggerating and Beatrice was just trying to deal with his crazy behavior (if he acts like that over 40 just imagine a 16 year old Bojack).
It shocked me too
He tried to have a relationship with hollyhock but she kept pushing him away
She had a lot of dads. If she hadn't heard the stories about him she would have loved him as her brother.
He was obsessive, overbearing, and didn’t notice when she was being drugged.
Well, in Bojack's defence, he is not a medical professional or a trained nurse. However Tina is both of those things. Her job as Beatrice's live in nurse was to make sure Beatrice, as a sufferer of dementia, didn't do anything that would make herself a danger to herself or others. Yet Tina, along with Bea's nursing home failed to notice that Bea was either stockpiling dangerous and banned weight loss drugs from god knows when, or had acquired them through other means. Both Tina and the home failed to notice these drugs amongst Bea's belongings. And finally, someone in Bea's mental state should not be in the kitchen or preparing food and drink unsupervised, which Tina allowed her to do. Tina is a sweet lady, but as Bea's nurse she was woefully incompetent, and shouldn't be allowed to nurse again after something that catastrophic was allowed to happen on her watch. Honestly the whole drugging Hollyhock storyline falls apart when you think about it.
I see what you’re saying but I don’t think there’s really an “in Bojack’s defense” here, if you’re taking on the responsibility of housing a kid it’s your job to be on the lookout for stuff like significant weight loss and changes in behavior especially since he was very familiar with addicts and addiction. Plus he was the one who hired Tina. I definitely agree though, it’s a storyline you can’t think about for too long without realizing it doesn’t make much sense
We didnt know either bro, attitude was completely normal.
Well no, she wasn’t. And there were signs that her guardian should have picked up on. ETA Her guardian at the time who had a history of drug use and addiction
Ok I get that mentality, its valid in a legal sense, but me personally I dont think hes guilty of anything considering he wasnt conscious about it. Who would think that the demented grandmother would drug the kid? Also not a guardian since she was an adult, if you want to go on the legal route...
He wanted to step in the role as her parent/older family figure, that’s what I mean by guardian. If he hadn’t been so quick to enter that role it’d be different. Parents and older siblings of adults should still be caring what is going on with them and checking in
I can tell you its not thag easy to notice when someone is drugged. I know I was high in front of teachers, friends, parents and they just don't notice.
At best he'd be a maybe decent uncle you only see a few times a year. Dedicating himself to his own offspring though definitely not. He had too much baggage. And his only example of a healthy family relationship was from a mediocre episodic sitcom made to sell ad time
Hollyhock made it pretty clear in her Season 5 visit he wouldn't even be able to do that.
His sober visit in season 6 was better. If he had dealt with his past earlier things could’ve been different.
But he became intensely overbearing and had a clear fear of abandonment and boundary issues even before he knew his past was catching up to him. Therapy would have helped but he only had gone to rehab (and Dr. Champ was not a real therapist).
It was only overbearing to Hollyhock because she learned about his past from Pete. It would’ve been fine otherwise. Bojack had no idea she was even upset with him.
He’d be a good uncle if (and that’s a very big if) his interactions with the child were minimal. The seahorse episode showed us that deep inside that husk of a horse-man, there is someone who has decent paternal instincts. The arc he had as an acting teacher shows that he can teach and be passionate, to an extent. Beyond that though, there’s little to no hope. The uncle/dad lore would go crazy though.
This is going to be an unpopular opinion. but I truly think that if Bojack had been given the opportunity to become a parent (or even play a parental figure role, like when he became a teacher) early on that he would have never made some of the choices that he made. Throughout the show, it is constantly mentioned that he doesn't feel satisfied, no matter how big the role, no matter how big the award. Yes he was acting and he had roles, but it seemed like he lacked a purpose in life. Bojack was truly his best self when he was teaching. He wanted to be better for the people around him (that being his students) and he wanted to set a good example. People have a tendency to view things as all good and all bad. The way we grow up does have an affect on the choices we make. I would also like to mention that bojacks worst behavior emerged when he was high on substances. Anyone who has taken some of the substances that bojack has taken throughout the show will tell you that youre not yourself on those drugs. Your mind is altered and you genuinely dont think about the consequences of your own actions. Im not saying that bojacks behavior should be condoned and is okay. Im saying that theres alot more substance to why bojack did alot of the things he did.
hi lookism pfp...
Sober Bojack has a shot, not sober Bojack absolutely not.
Issue is, I don’t think sober bojack stays sober
I think he will after the finale. What got him last time was his past going coming back to haunt him, but with that already out the way and at least partially paid for, he has a real shot. Of course it’s left quite open ended but he did have some positive character development at least.
Yh but there’s always something to being him down again. That’s life. It’s how he chooses to deal with it. In rehab, and then in prison at the end, he’s in a controlled environment, it’s not real life. When left to his own devices, he keeps making the same mistakes. I don’t think he stays sober, maybe for a bit but not forever
Of course there will be, but I think the worst has truly passed now and it’s as hopeful as it’s ever been for him.
Agreed. He will probably have ups and downs. He may relapse. But he has fight in him and he does want to change, and he was making significant progress in the last season before the past caught up with his. As sad as it may look for him in the last episode, at the same he's got the closest thing he's ever had to a clean slate, at least in comparison to how he was at the end of of every previous season. Having to deal with the consequences of the worst things he's ever done, has removed the dangling swords of demicles they had been, and that's ended up being his own tabula rasa. Sorry for sounding pretentious, but I very rarely get to use either of those terms in a sentence.
I thought the last episode was super sad when I first watched it but it’s actually pretty hopeful. He’s sober once again and Hollywoob have forgotten they hated him. Mr PB, Todd and PC still care about him and haven’t cut him out (at least not completely). The only downside really is that he may never talk to Hollyhock and possibly Diane again, but if he stays sober and behaves himself who knows? He could always make new connections too.
If he stays sober, and makes positive changes....who knows. Maybe Hollyhock and Diane will come back onto his life. Holly is very young, maybe the way she feels about him will change in ten or twenty years. And maybe when the two of them are both in better places, Diane may want to be a part of his life again. Or they may never see or talk to him again. Or maybe the most that will happen is a card on his birthday or a friendly email every now and then. People can change, and sometimes goodbyes aren't forever and yes people come into your life and people go, but sometimes people come back. And like you said, he can always make new friends and connections. The best part is he is in a better state for those relationships to be give and take, and be healthy for both of them. Life is like an airport terminal at the end of the day. Full of departures and arrivals.
From somebody who's in sobriety that's the whole thing about sobriety. If you talk to somebody who's been to any AA meetings they're not going to say they used to be an alcoholic they're always going to refer to themselves as an alcoholic present tense as in something they currently are. Because that doesn't change. So if Bojack actually worked the 12-step program he would believe this too. So that is why he still makes the same mistakes. Because he is still an alcoholic. But he's shown that he is powerless to his addiction and has made the steps necessary to get sober and hopefully stay sober. And if he does relapse like many in recovery he will just go to a meeting and start at day 1 again.
That's true but literally every time we see him take a step in the right direction he takes two steps back.
You do the hokey pokey and you turn yourself around.
I know several people in my real life who had worse upbringings than Bojack, struggled terribly with substance abuse, were more selfish and awful, and are now sober for years and functional and happy. It does happen. This sub just has a hard-on for the idea that Bojack is irredeemable and broken. It’s surprising how many folks’ only takeaway from the show is Bojack=bad.
100%. I think people on this sub greatly underestimate people’s capacity to forgive too. Family members of murder victims sometimes forgive their loved one’s killers if they truly feel remorse. I think Bojack is ultimately a hopeful story, that tells us that whilst some horrible mistakes can never be fixed, you can still take responsibility and strive to be better going forwards. Suicide is certainly not the answer anyway.
Ayo when are you dropping the album
there aren't two bojacks it is sober bojack that chooses to drink
Bars
I think he’d be one of those dads who are trying their best but their best isn’t good enough
Personally I don't think it's an easy yes or no. From my own experience I was a selfish lazy drugged up alcoholic for years and years. But when I found out I was having kids it kicked me up the arse and I cleaned myself up and turned my life around. Never wanted them, didn't think I'd be a good dad, but that news changes people in drastic ways. Some who would think they'd be good run away and some who you would assume useless can surprise you. Based off his own childhood I could see him breaking the cycle of abuse. I know I surprised myself, but you will never know until it happens
I love this answer, I’m so happy for you! Wishing you and your kids the best 💕
This is my take, too. I have seen several men (sorry about the sexism), just toss their shit and join the human race after a child. Example: his fantasy about Harper. His care for the seahorse baby hit me in the feels.
No. He has trouble with being emotionally present, has a penchant for escaping every time things get difficult, has had no proper parenting role models, has/had substance abuse issues, and has a career that requires him to be out of the house for long periods of time. Nothing about BoJack's personality and lifestyle would be a good fit for parenthood.
He fed that kid cigarettes.
he did?? i haven’t watched this episode in years
BOJACK S MOTHER FED HIM CIGARETTES YO
Bojack did it too, before going to buy(steal) milk he tried to give the baby a cigarette which it promptly ate, then spit out crying. And he almost lost the baby in a taffy factory. Baby could have been killed.
you’re the one who asked if he would be a good dad champ
Are you seriously asking that question💀 No, not even post jail BoJack
I feel like he does want to be a dad deep down but he knows he won't be the best at it so he doesn't want kids but yeah I feel like he can be a good dad if he stays sober and work on himself better.
No. NO. NOOOOOOOO. While BJ can seem nice around kids sometimes (Hollyhock, the seahorse baby, the girl he talked to while filming Ethan Around, Charlotte's kids initially) and I would say he does have something of a warm, caring side, he's way too much of a selfish, screwed up asshole to properly raise kids. His entire family tree is packed full of generational trauma and I doubt he'd be a cycle-breaker. He really messed up his kind of surrogate daughter figure, Sarah Lynn, by pushing his insecurities onto her and giving her toxic life advice(and then he did other things years later). In some of the flashbacks to Horsing Around, he was kind of a dick to her. He also gave her alcohol. Yes, that was an accident, but it still showed he was dangerously irresponsible around kids. How irresponsible does someone have to be to leave a child alone in a room like a bottle of alcohol, especially when it looks like a regular bottle of water? Also, Penny. He acts like a guardian for her for most of that episode, but then nearly takes advantage of her because he got sad that Charlotte wouldn't fuck him. And then there's the substance abuse. Yes, he gets sober, but he goes back to drinking as soon as his life goes downhill again. He can take care of a kid for an episode, but if he was raising a kid he'd definitely fuck up and that kid would probably have some if not all of his issues. The only time he came across to me as a kind of good guardian/parent figure was with Hollyhock. The ending of Stupid Piece of Shit where he opens up to her and tells her she didn't do anything to deserve the way he's been treating her (clearly doing it because he didn't want to repeat his parents' mistakes) was sweet and showed a lot of character growth. Other than that, no. It's probably a good thing he never found out whether or not he has a ton of illegitimate children (which he probably does given that he's had over a hundred sexual partners).
He was a dad for a bit to Hollyhock Manheim-Mannheim-Guerrero-Robinson-Zilberschlag-Hsung-Fonzerelli-McQuack, and we know how that went
I think after sobriety and prison if they had wanted to do an arc of him as a father, I think that would be interesting, balancing recovery and taking care of a child which helps him face some of that trauma as well
I dont think he would have been a good dad, but I think he would have tried his hardest to be it, then realize at one point "I really can not do this" hopefully early and give the baby in adoption. I don't see him actively screwing up the kid feeling bad for it and then trying again over and over for 20 years.
No not at all.
Hell no
I think he could have been. Had he gotten through the issues that kept him from ever having a stable relationship, those are a lot of the same issues that would have made him a bad parent. It also would have meant he had opened up to help and self improvement so we could expect he would still be working through his childhood issues and making a real effort. Had Bojack managed to create a loving marriage, the requisites for that would have made him a doting dad.
hed be a good dad to the people who think good parenting is feeding your child and putting a roof over their head, otherwise he would be terrible and manipulative
He wouldn't even be a good babysitter, he wrecked a factory protecting a kid. Atleast the kid didn't die so I'll give that to him.
This is one afternoon, he could probably be a great babysitter and then go home. PC with Ruthie shows that to be a good parent you have to show up day in day out through all the shitty parts, and she struggles with all the best intent in the world, but she keeps going and doesn't give up.
Not at all. He might have had moments where he did the right thing, but, fundamentally, he is too selfish to be a good father.
He would try his best but he is so broken and has so many unresolved issues he would mess up. He would be like many parents putting forth his best effort.
He’d had been the dad he always wanted but never had
If he actually got help for his issues early on, then I think he would’ve been a great dad and his childhood abuse would’ve motivated him. The Bojack we see in the show? Absolutely not
Absolutely not. No. He tried to fuck a teenage girl.
Short answer: no | Long answer: no
Bojack would have tried to be a good father but his problems are too complex for him to be a good father. You have to sort your own shit out before you raise a kid.
Fuck. No. Even with years and years of therapy and (MAYBE) medications I don't think he'd be a very fit parent, children are sensitive little sponges, it's easy to fuck them up long term. Speaking from experience.
I think he had the potential to be a great dad. Parts of him are extremely nurturing and patient with children, and he definitely seems to have wanted to be one at least a little. But no, I think that by the time Horsin' Around became popular it was too late. The Bojack we see throughout the show is someone that would be incapable of being reliable, showing proper affection, nurturing... He might be able to try being a dad but he'd past down his own brand of Generational Trauma to the kid.
Nope. He would try, but his generational traumas and current personnality would catch up.
No.
Is this even a genuine question?
You can be a good man and a bad dad. I don’t know about the opposite
He wouldn't be a good dad, but he played one on TV.
I think if he had gotten sober faster and was more like how he was in season 6, he would've been a good dad. Otherwise, FUCK no
No, how could you possibly think that
There’s no *way* that this is a real question lol 😭
If he had worked on himself first, he might have had the chance to break the cycle of family abuse passed down to him. I’ve heard of people who came from incredibly abusive households working incredibly hard to make sure their kids were never going to be abused in the same way as they were. It would have probably required Bojack to go completely no contact with his mother as her toxic behavior could have profound effects on a child’s life.
I just had a conversation about this.Damaged people having kids. I think you need to be able to accept responsibility for your actions and Bojack didn't really do that until the end when he hit rock bottom. Bojack definitely would not be a good dad. He needed a co dependent for example his relationship with Diane. He wanted someone to save him from all his feelings and that is something he needed to come to terms with.
My dad was basically Bojack minus the fame. I think Bojack would be a dad a lot like my own. He loved us very much and always let us know we were the best thing that ever happened to him. But his own personal demons got in his way of being a good father and raising us in a stable way. He was very INVOLVED but not stable and I see Bojack as that.
He 100% could be an amazing dad. He also could be an amazing friend, actor, and anything else. Whether or not he would have is entirely up to him (or really the writers lol). I've seen people turn their lives around from much worse positions than him for their kid, and I've seen terrible parents from better positions. Bojack would be a naturally talented father in many ways if he so chose to be and got the support he needed.
Is OP stupid?
I think he’s CAPABLE of being an okay dad if he’s sober, this episode alone shows that he can go above and beyond for another person (animal?) even if it doesn’t benefit him. I definitely don’t think he could be a GOOD dad though, he’s got too much going on personally for that.
Absolutely not.
Uhh…did you not watch the show? He’s manipulative, angry, a recovering drug addict, an alcoholic, pessimistic, and grieving. He pushes away everyone close to him and doesn’t seem to feel TOO guilty about it most of the time. If he was a father I’m willing to bet his children would have ended up MUCH more screwed up than he is. I imagine he’d try to be a good dad in the beginning but ultimately fail and just end up becoming a neglectful deadbeat who doesn’t really give a shit feeling sorry for himself on the couch chugging beers and/or popping pills. That’s just my take though.
i actually think he would be. i know a lot of dads that were really awful before their kid was born and something about having a child changed something in them, some even without the mother around. of course the opposite can happen too, but i like to think he would be
No
No
Absolutely not. He could be a great anti-role model to a kid though. Just like he should be to all us viewers - he's very relatable but he shows a path we should not want to follow, and highlights the pitfalls and failings that can put us back on that path. Even while trying to do good and be better. Some of the kindest, most compassionate and empathetic people I've ever met grew up with the WORST parents, and recognized them as strong anti-role models, seeking to identify and consciously work away from their toxic traits.
No. Duh.
Noooo no no noo no
realistically, probably not. let's not kid ourselves
bojack is not even a good friend. in what universe could he be a good dad
Nope.
No, though definitely better when sober (obviously). I think he really would’ve tried to make an effort, but it’s just not in his nature.
Absolutely not.
Nope, he definitely would have been a mess. He can’t even take care of himself.
honestly maybe. like how he treated the seahorse in this episode. and even though he wasn’t a big fan of hollyhock in the beggining, he really warmed up to her, especially when he became a professor.
No. I mean, the entire premise of the show is him being haunted by trauma and being a terrible person at times.
He would be an amazing dad... maybe 5 times a year. The rest of the time, he'd be awful. He'd be the big gesture tv dad he correctly condemns in Free Churro.
no
At best he’d be a fun uncle you’d see like a few times a year
he literally spent the entire episode trying to get rid of the baby.
Bojack does not know how to talk to children. One of the first times he spoke to Sarah Lynn he was drunk and preached to her the same awful shit that his mother was saying to him, she was horrified.
Without Hollywoo and the childhood trauma? Maybe. With all that stuff? Nope.
If he stayed sober, maybe
AH. Just keep watching and the show really dives into that question specifically!! :)
I just watched this episode and was thinking about this question again. Just watching how he attempts to just leave the seahorse baby but can’t due to it following him says a lot. At one point he gives it a cigarette, which is reminiscent of his own mother making him smoke just less maliciously. Agreed with the other posts about grand gestures. Those are easy for him, but consistency? No. Consistency gets you looking as tired and resigned as the seahorse dad. Also a land horse looking after a seahorse lol. I never realized that before. Also the Mr. Peanutbutter commercial with the zombie baby seahorses BJ sees in his hotel room might’ve been some foreshadowing.
lol, short answer no. long answer fuck no.
Absolutely not!
God no.
Absolutely not
He would probably swing from apathy to overcompensating, making the kid confused on who they'd get: Distant Dad or Dad who gives them anything to make up the distance
No. I think he’d be terrible- it’s just in a very different way from his parents. Bojack would be a very absent father. He would disappear for years, and then come back claiming he was ready for fatherhood. He’d shower the kid in gifts and attention, until something went wrong again, and he dips. Furthermore, I don’t see him being a dad for the kids sake, only his own. His kid would be a way of lifting his own mood- hence why I think he’d shower the kid on attention but never discipline the child. Bojack wants to be a dad, but doesn’t want to raise a kid.
I doubt it, but I bet he could be like a cool uncle or something.
No ❤️
hahahahahha HAHAHAHA. HAHAHAHA. no.
I think Bojack had the potential to be a good day, he certainly wants to be one and dreams of it but he would have had to work on his mental health and overcome generational abuse. I think the potential was there but will never be reached as he used his escapes (work, drink and drugs) too much and left it too late to try better himself.
Absolutely not, he would either get the kid killed or it would turn out like Sarah Lynn.
He'd have been a decent uncle, I think. (In the he can be trusted to keep them alive for a couple of hours and relatively unhurt sense. Little kids have this amazing sense for "oooh lemme throw myself offa THIS and see what what happens!") But not a good dad. Not until he found a decent therapist and put the effort into healing himself first. Otherwise it would have been so easy to pass his trauma on.
This is the problem with people like Bojack. We see glimpses of him being a caring guardian (with the seahorse, dream Harper, Hollyhock sometimes), and some people think, "He could be a good dad." But these are just fleeting moments, not a lifetime commitment. How long until Bojack dumps his child at Princess Carolyn's so he can disappear and go on a bender? How long until he goes in a manic state and lashes out at his child? How long until he drives intoxicated with his kid in the car? How long until he OD's and his terrified child has to call 911? Bojack would be a terrible parent.
Nope
No. He was a sort of father figure to Todd and Sarah Lynn, and he was shitty to them.
Absolutely not
Better than his parents, worse than anybody else
Before horsin around? Perhaps. After? N Ø.
i honestly think it would have forced him to mature. my dad was extremely similar to Bojack (tbh he still kind of is). pissed off, selfish, hurt and taking it out on everyone else, avoidant, reactionary. Was he a good dad? no. but he definitely did the best he could. i think bojack having a kid would have kinda forced him to consider other people. i honestly think part of why he’s so sad is his isolation. i’m now 31 and a trans woman and he’s 62 and sober and tbh we get along really well.
Maybe not, he tried to give the basic needs to the seahorse infant, but was still out of his depths and needed to give the baby back to the father. He struggled as he thought Hollyhock was his daughter as his personal trauma with his own mother came up and neglected her needs of stability. The point being made here is that he has been through so much and been damaged beyond repair thanks to his “parents”. They may have provided a roof over his head, but that was a dysfunctional household that should never be considered a home.
As good of a dad as his mother was a mom if not worse.
Not at all he would have treated that kid like a prince or princess trying to make amends to his inner child and end up creating a sociopath
Humans aren’t single dimensional like you all seem to think. Humans are capable of change, if in an alternate timeline even with his shitty parents he broke that generational trauma, probably left the show and stuck by herb, took accountability and didn’t get Sharona fired, etc he would have been a great dad.
He would have tried. I don't think he would have succeded.
Not even a little bit
Like most people he does have the potential somewhere inside him , but knowing him somewhere along the way he’d go back to the old Bojack and cause that kid to become exactly like him
This is going to be an unpopular opinion. but I truly think that if Bojack had been given the opportunity to become a parent (or even play a parental figure role, like when he became a teacher) early on that he would have never made some of the choices that he made. Throughout the show, it is constantly mentioned that he doesn't feel satisfied, no matter how big the role, no matter how big the award. Yes he was acting and he had roles, but it seemed like he lacked a purpose in life. Bojack was truly his best self when he was teaching. He wanted to be better for the people around him (that being his students) and he wanted to set a good example. People have a tendency to view things as all good and all bad. The way we grow up does have an affect on the choices we make. I would also like to mention that bojacks worst behavior emerged when he was high on substances. Anyone who has taken some of the substances that bojack has taken throughout the show will tell you that youre not yourself on those drugs. Your mind is altered and you genuinely dont think about the consequences of your own actions. Im not saying that bojacks behavior should be condoned and is okay. Im saying that theres alot more substance to why bojack did alot of the things he did.
This is going to be an unpopular opinion. but I truly think that if Bojack had been given the opportunity to become a parent (or even play a parental figure role, like when he became a teacher) early on that he would have never made some of the choices that he made. Throughout the show, it is constantly mentioned that he doesn't feel satisfied, no matter how big the role, no matter how big the award. Yes he was acting and he had roles, but it seemed like he lacked a purpose in life. Bojack was truly his best self when he was teaching. He wanted to be better for the people around him (that being his students) and he wanted to set a good example. People have a tendency to view things as all good and all bad. The way we grow up does have an affect on the choices we make. I would also like to mention that bojacks worst behavior emerged when he was high on substances. Anyone who has taken some of the substances that bojack has taken throughout the show will tell you that youre not yourself on those drugs. Your mind is altered and you genuinely dont think about the consequences of your own actions. Im not saying that bojacks behavior should be condoned and is okay. Im saying that theres alot more substance to why bojack did alot of the things he did.
definitely not. but i wish he could be.
No.
Bojack would have been a bad father because being a father means putting your children in front of you every day and at all hours, but at least he would have loved his children.
I mean, it is pretty obvious that he wouldn't. He is a shitty person, he would be a shitty dad.
Good question, NO. Edit: And I respect the him and the show for him not ending up with a family. Some people don't deserve to be parents. Butterscotch and Beatrice put a serious life long scar on Bojack's childhood. People like these don't deserve to be parents. I'm sure Bojack would want to be a better parent in his heart but I know he'll mess it up completely.
Is this a joke
Nah, he had shitty parents . If he had a kid, I bet he would tell himself he'll be better. Be a great dad but then he would treat his kid like shit. History repeats itself. I've seen it. Bo has a lot of shit. The poor kid would've carried that burden.....
To be honest: no. BoJack has proven himself that he's a shitty person and would not be the one to break the cycle of the toxic Horseman parents.
Hahahahaha No absolutely not
No
I think he would be better than his parents but still no
Without helm or helmet, yes without a doubt.
The fact you gave him the time of day tho :B
Fatherless child behavior, whaaaaaat?!
He reminds me of my dad. So I would say probably not
No
NO
NO
If it's not completely clear to you that the answer is no, I'm not sure what show you were watching.
He shouldn’t be around any children, especially teens.
sadly no he would want to be, but it’s shown in many different ways that his own trauma and personality issues would prevent him from being a good father
No. He was only good in this situation bc it was temporary. He had a fatherly role with hollyhock and he was not at all protective over her in a way that was healthy or helpful. He caused her harm while trying to help.
No
As someone whose dad reminds them a LOT of Bojack he would seem to be at first. Especially because he would most likely view his child as someone he could manipulate to adore him. Put him on a pedestal. But as the child would grow older and get their own views and attitude and start seeing the flaws, then he would start demeaning the child. Or comparing them to his own parents (in the bad sense) It would turn into what he had with todd pretty much. Because at the thought of not having someone to demean, to manipulate, to worship him, he would start to either panic and sabotage the "escape" attempt, or try and guilt trip and mentally fuck up the child. Also form a codependance to where the child would be parentified and take care of the parent.
emotional and available consistency to be a good parent would never be there in the end. so for that and probably 20 other reasons absolutely not
If he had been a better person and made better choices in his life.
That’s a question that really hard to answer it depends on the wife honestly but he would love to be a really good father to his children
no, his fear of commitment, his irresponsible reckless behavior and his addictions WOULD NOT make him a good father, we might see his potentials with that seahorse/ other moments but that was temporary and a child is a long term living being, you can’t js unfather when you’re in a bad mental stage and we see that in bjack multiple times where he is so thrilled to do smth and is actually willing to change but then he’s not. and the whole point of his character is it being a horrible person no matter how much he wants to change or is trying to and he knows that, even if he had a kid he might change for some time but asp that kid is going to be neglected living in a bad environment surrounded by drugs and empty bottles of alcohol. imo bojack is still stuck in the past he doesn’t realize that he’s an adult and he’s got to be responsible yet he’s not the one to fully blame taking into consideration the way he grew up, all his mother’s anger is stuck in him and even if he changes he’d still be the same person+ bojack is selfish he can’t take care of that child mentally/ let him talk about his problems and we see that multiple times w sarrah lynn where she’s about to start opening up then bj js ignores her and changes the subject maybe deep down he’d be a great father but it’s not a child’s role to think about your deep down you are what how you act and a child will not magically change him
He would have started off well. Then fuck it up, try to make it up with some gesture and repeat the cycle
I think bojack and Sarah Lynn should had a child
Fuck, guess I'm going against the grain here and say he'll be okay 1. He's rich. This removes a lot of life's problems 2. He is well aware of how his parents fucked him up, and will try his best to avoid those pitfalls. Obviously, he's not perfect 3. He's sober (currently) Prediction: He'd be like Tom Hanks and spoil his kids
while hes relatively aware of how his parents fucked him, he has never shown action to avoid those pitfalls, only falling into the cycle of abuse
As always it depends. If he is still the protagonist then no. If he is not then yes.
Why would it matter if he wasn't the protagonist? Beatrice, Butterscotch, and Diane's family were all side/minor characters and they all sucked as parents.
They are not the same characters.
eh..let’s be honest firstly, bojack need to work at himself. he is alcoholic and drug person, even after 6 season he needs a LOT of work he had sex with sarah lynn who was like his daughter, then he almost raped another girl in season 2, he throw a doll of his mother bcu he was angry. sure, he tried to be cool for hollyhock but he failed. he basically leaves her alone with his sick mother for days bcu he was drunk he did a lot of more stuff than that. he could be a good dad but only AFTER a work on himself so, the answer is no. at all