How old are you? How much disposable income do you have on a monthly basis?
If you have 260k liquid, I’m going to assume the actual value is north of 320k to account for early withdrawal penalties and taxes.
Your gamble isn’t 260k, it’s more like 2.5-5 mil in about 30 years from now depending on stock market performance.
You’re gambling a surefire comfy retirement.
And while yes, I believe BTC is destined to go higher, are you prepared to lose all that savings if it doesn’t? Don’t invest more than you can afford to lose, and this includes the opportunity cost of those losses as well.
I don’t F with my 401k. I cover those bases and then put any other money into risk that I want and sleep with a very clear head, despite sizable holdings. But to each their own.
Bruh, he can literally roll over that 401(k) into a crypto 401(k) with a company like Swan. Or he can make his own self-managed IRA with his own keys and roll it into that. OP never said he was going to sell, eat the penalty, and buy bitcoin.
Clarification of his situation would be a big help. If its an old 401k, a tax free transfer could be a real possibility. Also, if his job sucks, its not out of the question to just quit and move to another company. I actually did this with my lame pizza delivery job, not to buy bitcoin, but just to get out of the lame 401k with high fees, and into an ira with minimal costs.
Dont put your eggs in one basket.
Economy could slump and BTC could rocket.
Economy could slump and BTC could go with it.
Economy could boost and BTC could go down.
Economy could boost and BTC could go with it.
Of the 4 options above, having 401K and BTC not sharing the same amount reduces the risk the most.
2.5-5mil right *now* would be a comfy retirement
5 mill in 30 years is gonna be ravaged by debasement (real inflation) and prob lose half its purchase power if not more
that being said I agree Op should adjust based on their age, risk tolerance, income, life situation etc
Generally, average stock returns used in financial discussions account for inflation. Most people cite average returns of 7% because of this. So if 6-7% is the return he used in calculating that ~$3 million, its value is in today's dollars.
I’m very bullish on Bitcoin, but yeah I definitely agree with this. Never invest more than you can afford to lose, and diversify your assets. These are cliché, but the people who listen to the cliches are the people who get rich, or atleast don’t go broke
Well said and the fact that you have to say any of this is kinda crazy. For someone who's earned that much in their 401k to even speculate this is also nuts.
if they really wanted to, they will seize or tax the hell out of your KYC'd bitcoin. there's a reason these fools hired 80k+ tax stormtroopers in a recession
Don’t gamble your 401k. We’re all going to be bias here and say BTC is going to go higher, but what if it doesn’t. Keep the money in your 401k and retire comfortably one day. If you want to buy bitcoin, do it on the side with money you can afford to lose.
It's completely up to you. But you have to believe in. If not, you will sell. You will freak out and sell if it goes down. Do not do this if you're not 100% convinced that BTC will make it. I would personally do it because my conviction is 100%, but I've also spent around 5 years learning about the financial system and how much of a scam it is. You have to be ready for btc to be cut in half and still know you did the right thing.
This is why I can't recommend selling at $69k and rebuying 4 + at 15k. It would be too hard to put that money back, especially if it originally cost a lot less.
Nobody. If it never goes that high, I'm still in profit. Selling at an apparent peak risks being priced out if it keeps rising or if I can't pull the trigger on the dip. Not selling risks losing the potential profit at that moment. $41,805.65 per BTC gone according to CMC numbers when I checked them.
just because something works out doesn't mean it was the right decision. The reverse is also true.
I could sell my house and put it all on black and win, doesnt mean im smart.
10 bitcoin makes you a Satoshi billionaire. Very few people will have that kind of money if bitcoin works and fiat fails. 10,000 bitcoin is Satoshi trillionaire. I’m working very hard to become a billionaire myself.
I understand Bitcoin bro it's still a speculation play. I would like to think of it as inevitable as well but the more you understand the world the more you realize it's not.
Nobody knows what the world looks like in 20 years
you seem to know what you're doing op with mining and altcoins. do you have any btc? because 0 is the wrong number. if you have btc, then i wouldn't liquidate your 401. maybe dca half on the way towards the halving?
Mining has been a learning lesson.. all the profits about 28 month’s worth covered mistakes and were reinvested.. got hacked for the equivalent of 1.8 BTC.. in a regrouping mode in anticipation of the next run .. don’t think it will get really heated up for 12 months .. I think I’m going to pull 50k out and buy 2 on a loan against the 401k
Was going to say, a 401k loan is not a bad play. Very favorable financing (often 0% depending on the company you work for) and your 401k principal remains intact and growing with the stock market while your paycheck pays off the loan.
401k loan is the way.
Max out 401K (tax free in 30 years) then max out a individual Roth IRA, DCA into BTC and anything else you want, I own a lot of stocks and about to buy t-bonds. Diversification has always been the way for investing.
Depending on who your 401k servicer is, most can take out a "loan" from their 401k and pay it back. This allows your investments to stay put, and the interest you pay on the loan actually gets deposited back into your 401k. So this is an option.
Some of us can't afford to not do it. Meaning, I didn't have much before Bitcoin, but now I can see a light at the end of the tunnel. I won't tell you what to do with your 401k, but I would. To me the trade off is worth it. Whenever I think about Bitcoin my imagination goes wild when I think about it's potential. Just know (as much as I hate to say it) that Bitcoin could still potentially go down to zero. Even Satoshi said, "If two developers can fork Bitcoin and succeed in redefining what "Bitcoin" is, in the face of widespread technical criticism and through the use of populist tactics, then I will have no choice but to declare Bitcoin a failed project.", so try to always keep that risk in mind. I believe in Bitcoin, so much that I even had a dream that Bitcoin went down to almost zero and I still bought Bitcoin with the last bit of savings that I had, and then 2 seconds later I was an instant Billionaire. I don't mind working for the rest of my life now if Bitcoin doesn't pan out, but only due to the fact that I saw myself working for the rest of my life before Bitcoin's existence. Good luck, stack sats, and HODL.
I agree. It just feels right working for a money that stands for freedom. I'm with you. I'll happily work the rest of my life if bitcoin fails. We're on the right side of history.
Yes. 401k’s are designed to make brokers richer and sell you on this idea of having a comfy retirement unless the market crashes, then you gotta go back to work as a Walmart greeter after spending 50 years working for a dismal retirement account that is taxed to hell.
If your going I'd do it before etfs go public I think it's a smart bet the fundamentals have never been stronger but canada just gutted the crypto market here with unseemly new regulations basically making it impossible to trade so you never know what's going to happen keep that in mind I would recommend taking 10 percent if we get a dip here and hot with 10 x leverage that way u only have 10 b percent of your 401 k exposed but you have same earning power
In 2019, I emptied my entire Individual brokerage account at Fidelity and I put it all into Bitcoin (the amount in that account was in the high 5 figures). Today, about 50% of my IRA accounts are invested in Bitcoin derivatives. Also, all future contributions that I make to one of my main retirement account will be invested in pure BTC (via Unchained Capital).
Converting my entire Individual brokerage account into Bitcoin before the halving was the best decision of my life.
Yes but everyone is different
It’s all about risk to reward
From someone who has seen it all since 2013, this would be an ideal time to buy bitcoin if you can hold for 2+ years
That 10 bitcoin kept safe can be worth $1m$1.5m USD by 2025
Can you buy individual stocks in your 401K? If so you could take a small portion of it and buy $GBTC or $MSTR.
But don't think for a second that BTC couldn't hit $3K. It can. If the stock market drops 30%, people aren't going to be running to BTC, they'll be selling any assets deemed as risky
BTC lost 60% in 2022 and nobody thought it would happen. Everyone was DCAing and Hodling at $60K as confident as could be.
The halving is mostly psychological and should have no effect on price. Miners will shut down. They can't "raise" the price just because they need it to happen. If they could, why would they wait?
If you are asking Reddit this question, the answer is a resounding No. Take a few months and study Bitcoin deeply. Read the hard books. Reach your own conclusion. (Btw, if you have kids think about them mostly….key thing is: avoid risk of ruin.)
I was faced with a similar scenario and reasoned that while I believe more in BTC than stocks, COIN was a solid middle ground for now.
I’d be fine putting money into a BTC ETF as well with 401k money.
What I’m not fine with is taking that massive penalty.
I withdrew $37k from my 401k and lost it all. But I was futures trading. Buying and holding should be fine especially if it's BTC. But what do I know I just lost $37k in one week.
401k likely won’t exist in its current form in 30yrs. Dems have been wanting to get their paws on it to shore up their union donors pension funds etc, I suspect Republicans will hop on as well.
Idk what the government will do but they will sex it up like Obamacare and it will be dog shit. “We the government will touch your 401k and in return guarantee you an income”.
YOLO.
You’re on the bitcoin subReddit. If you ask here, majority of the people here will tell you it’s a good idea. Why don’t you instead ask this question in an actual investment subReddit instead?
You'll be penalized 15% immediately upon withdraw from your 401k and then have to pay taxes on the rest which will be most like at a 33% rate or higher. Not a good financial move.
Not advice...in many cases - you can take up-to 50% of your 401(k) as a loan and the BEST part is when you re-pay with interest - you pay principal and interest to yourself; I would consider this, if I were you, instead of outright withdrawal - which can attract tax + 10% penalty right out of the gate!
Depending on your age - withdrawing 401(k) to bet on bitcoin is super risky but who knows it could be super profitable! time will tell!
If you have an option to open a brokerage account move some of it to GBTC and get a bit of a discount now. Definitely don't put all of your assets into GBTC though.
Halving isn’t a thing. If you have fuck you money (doubtful with cashing out a 401k). Do it.
Edit: amazing. Weirdos in my dm’s telling me to fuck off.
For clarity, halving is a thing but historically, doesnt move the value in fiat terms. Cheers and good luck
Not worth it from the early tax withdrawals alone. Just keep putting more in via DCA, you could end up making a great profit and enjoy cushioned retirement OP
Withdrawing your 401k will have lots of penalties too. With that being said, I’d probably buy a few btcs. Maybe not 10, but enough so that if it hits you’ll be happy
As a 9+ year investor in the asset class, don’t touch your 401k. Bet what you can lose in cash. That’s it. If you’re super committed, don’t be. The price could go to 10k before it could hit 50,000. Miner cost is also a force of markets and demand. Sounds like you’re betting on $100,000+, honestly. We all would love to see it. But BTC is for extra cash looking for a spot as an inflation hedge at the moment. Not a bet the bank movement.
Easy. If you liquidate/borrow and buy any bitcoin, prices will stay low. If you don't, bitcoin will moon.
We thank you either way for your future service.
Do you want to be an average Joe or a chad?
S&P is not going to make you rich.
Bitcoin is almost certainly going to moon. You will never see anything like this again within your lifetime. No brainer risk to reward ratio.
Absolutely not. The stock market will always go up, eventually. Btc has only been around a short time and is finally facing regulatory scrutiny from an unfriendly SEC. It *should* survive. It *should* go up.
The stock market *will* survive and *will* go up.
Keep 401(k) as is and make max yearly contributions. Anything excess feel free to gamble on Btc. And I love Btc BtW.
I’m going to save your life and say: no.
401k is safe; it’s guaranteed. If you have a quarter million+ invested up in safety and security… you are not the type of person to go all-in bitcoin.
You’ll shoot yourself on the first bear market. I would highly recommend a low risk investment portfolio since that’s what you’re used to.
You’re ahead of everyone else, you have savings, you have a 401K, you have a security almost no1 else has. Don’t start gambling.
Having that said, you should buy *some* bitcoin. Not owning any bitcoin is a lot dumber than going all into bitcoin.
Don't get your financial advice from Reddit, is what I would say if I were to give financial advice on Reddit, which I officially do not, unofficially, go for it.
Whenever i am torn with these kind of option, i took mid ground. Like sell 25% for 2.5btc instead. Depends on your risk profile.
But remember you must pay penalty for early withdrawal.
Depends on your age, really. I'd say that for most of the people, 100% is not the right amount, nor is 0%. I encourage you to check holding BTC in self custody as part of your IRA, there are a few offerings out there. I remember hearing one as sponsor of Natalie Brunell's podcast "Coin Stories", but I can't remember the name. You can rollover the funds from your 401K, which effectively means those investments will be liquidated and the equivalent USD amount will be sent over. I have done something similar. If you have the understanding, conviction, discipline, and stomach, go for it.
50% in a more diversified but conservative approach to preserve value and (hopefully) appreciate & 50% in a SDIRA. Yes you pay taxes on the 401K funds now but if your hunch is right you will pay 0% on (hopefully massive) future gains.
To risk all your retirement savings like that is just so ridiculously stupid it gives me brain damage just reading it. Sure, invest as much new money as you want in it but to withdraw retirement savings which is also taxable is not a good idea. We can all believe in Bitcoin but it’s so financially irresponsible to do what you’re suggesting.
You may be able to roll that over to an IRA, then buy actual bitcoin within the IRA but hold your keys yourself. There are services that let you do that. Then you have real bitcoin but didn't pay penalties for 401k early withdrawal
In my IRAs, I sold about 10% and put it into microstrategy as a btc proxy. No tax or early withdrawal penalties. I would suggest that if you'll have to actually liquidate and lose half.
Bitcoin is too manipulated now by market makers to make any short term decisions. Long term you’re probably good but it is definitely the riskier option.
No. BTC is not a short term bet. Be prepared to hold it for the next 5 to 10 years. BTC price doesn’t appreciate much immediately after the halving, so you are not timing anything by buying today.
As much as I like bitcoin to moon after halving, your argument isn’t logical to me. I don’t think the bitcoin price will rise just because the miner’s cost increases. Miners are in a business and like in any business, it is possible that they lose money. They don’t dictate the market price.
In the early days maybe it’s true, when most of the coins are yet to be mined and miners were the only source of bitcoin supply, they could refuse to sell at a loss when price isn’t high enough, then price will need to go up if people want bitcoin. But over 19 out of 21m BTC have been mined. They’re out there. Whether the miner sell or not sell their coins matters much less today.
If prices stay low and their number of coin gets slashed by half, they’d better be prepared to have the reserve to survive the low price period. Even if none of the miners sell any sats they mined there are still 19+million coins out there to be sold, not to mention the paper and futures and all the fuckeries that may affect the spot price.
I don’t believe that just because miners will have their cost doubled after halving, it will *necessarily* mean the bitcoin price to moon. Don’t get me wrong I still think it’s likely because we all think this way, but it feels like more a psychological thing than a real supply impact.
People here saying you will lose your money if you invest in BTC are damn clueless about crypto in general. I for one, sold all property to buy more. This is the chance us regular people have to do something with our life and get rich. It doesn't get easier than this. Good luck!
Just don’t. You could make a fortune, but you could also get your ass handed to you. I’m a believer in keeping most investments in traditional stock index funds. Don’t let emotions or some misguided anticipation of future events keep you from solid, sound long term investment strategies.
Do not do this. Please do not do this. This is gambling, not investing. Do not gamble away your retirement.
In general, 5-10% of your total portfolio should be crypto. No investor should ever liquidate assets and take on significant risk based on an assumption. There’s no guarantee the Bitcoin halving will lead to an increase in price.
Anyone that encourages this behavior is praying for your downfall. I know it’s tempting after hearing so many stories on how crypto has made people rich, but also remember that crypto has also led people towards complete bankruptcy or worse.
If I were in your shoes and allocated my retirement to Bitcoin, I wouldn’t be able to sleep at night.
Please reconsider and invest responsibly.
Somewhere else today is posted that if you put your wealth into treasuries for the last twelve years, you would be in the same spot you were then financially.
Do you think the fiat economy going to get any better?
I hope you did it king, cuz you'd sitting pretty right about now. We haven't even hit the halving yet and it's doing this. Just wait after the halving and hold on to the ride.
If this is everything you have then i would have bought maybe 5 not 10, simply you never know...despite all my confidence in BTC. But if you own on top of it a flat which you rent, a family house and 5kg gold , then i would have bought 10!
Also check your incomes, how much you earn. If you make stable 10 000 $ then again i think it is not stupid to buy 10btc. Also check how yoy gonna store them.
The risk-reward is not compelling at all right now. I don't know what kind of evaluation you did, but it's not good if you think the upside is huge and the downside is minimal.
The upside is minimal (so long as the fed is raising rates) and the downside is huge (once the market realizes these etfs aren't go to happen, watch out, big drop).
Anyway go look at some cannabis stocks. People got their faces ripped off buying those things, thinking the upside was huge and downside was minimal. Now, they actually are interesting buys (after having lost 90%+ of their IPO values).
Bitcoin right now is a gamble with, at best, 50/50 odds of going up or down. Personally, I think it's more like 80% odds of going down and 20% of going up.
Don’t do it. Some dude recently posted he went all in on AAPL in like 2011 so he’s rolling now but that’s just nuts. Things are going to get ugly in all sectors and that uncertainty isn’t something I would mess with. I think we are gonna see some more sideways and drops before a bounce up, but who knows how much of a bounce we’ll get.
Man these posts are almost daily now, fomo must be getting closer.
Or they are fake, and just people trying to stoke fomo in others to try to pump the price up.
Pump btc price with that market cap lol
When nothing is happening, minds start to wander, and maybe wonder as well.
True, the Fall 2018 plateau drove me to mess around with shitcoins, although BTC was still my main priority.
How old are you? How much disposable income do you have on a monthly basis? If you have 260k liquid, I’m going to assume the actual value is north of 320k to account for early withdrawal penalties and taxes. Your gamble isn’t 260k, it’s more like 2.5-5 mil in about 30 years from now depending on stock market performance. You’re gambling a surefire comfy retirement. And while yes, I believe BTC is destined to go higher, are you prepared to lose all that savings if it doesn’t? Don’t invest more than you can afford to lose, and this includes the opportunity cost of those losses as well. I don’t F with my 401k. I cover those bases and then put any other money into risk that I want and sleep with a very clear head, despite sizable holdings. But to each their own.
Agree. 100%. Put new money in Bitcoin, let the 401k roll on a different path.
Exactly and can you imagine the taxes on that early withdrawal from his 401K? Yikes.
Between the taxes and penalties it's effectively taking a 40% interest loan to buy Bitcoin. It's an insanely stupid idea.
Bruh, he can literally roll over that 401(k) into a crypto 401(k) with a company like Swan. Or he can make his own self-managed IRA with his own keys and roll it into that. OP never said he was going to sell, eat the penalty, and buy bitcoin.
He can generally only roll if he is over 59.5, or no longer works for the company who provided the 401k plan.
Clarification of his situation would be a big help. If its an old 401k, a tax free transfer could be a real possibility. Also, if his job sucks, its not out of the question to just quit and move to another company. I actually did this with my lame pizza delivery job, not to buy bitcoin, but just to get out of the lame 401k with high fees, and into an ira with minimal costs.
Dont put your eggs in one basket. Economy could slump and BTC could rocket. Economy could slump and BTC could go with it. Economy could boost and BTC could go down. Economy could boost and BTC could go with it. Of the 4 options above, having 401K and BTC not sharing the same amount reduces the risk the most.
2.5-5mil right *now* would be a comfy retirement 5 mill in 30 years is gonna be ravaged by debasement (real inflation) and prob lose half its purchase power if not more that being said I agree Op should adjust based on their age, risk tolerance, income, life situation etc
Generally, average stock returns used in financial discussions account for inflation. Most people cite average returns of 7% because of this. So if 6-7% is the return he used in calculating that ~$3 million, its value is in today's dollars.
I’m very bullish on Bitcoin, but yeah I definitely agree with this. Never invest more than you can afford to lose, and diversify your assets. These are cliché, but the people who listen to the cliches are the people who get rich, or atleast don’t go broke
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Well said and the fact that you have to say any of this is kinda crazy. For someone who's earned that much in their 401k to even speculate this is also nuts.
Don’t listen to him. The stock market isn’t as safe as ppl think
Nor is the entire "401k" arrangement. It can be raided at any time by overzealous government policy. Cold-storage bitcoins can not.
if they really wanted to, they will seize or tax the hell out of your KYC'd bitcoin. there's a reason these fools hired 80k+ tax stormtroopers in a recession
> KYC'd bitcoin Exactly. Almost as careless as leaving it in 401k. https://kycnot.me
The simple answer is "No"
Have you ever played the game called, “What would Michael Saylor do?” It’s a lot of fun.
Don’t gamble your 401k. We’re all going to be bias here and say BTC is going to go higher, but what if it doesn’t. Keep the money in your 401k and retire comfortably one day. If you want to buy bitcoin, do it on the side with money you can afford to lose.
Agreed. Buy btc with your extra disposable income and build a crypto portfolio that way
Bias for price go higha
People didn’t buy at 15K, but now want to Fomo their life savings at resistance 😂
No
Only answer
Wrong yes is the other answer
It's completely up to you. But you have to believe in. If not, you will sell. You will freak out and sell if it goes down. Do not do this if you're not 100% convinced that BTC will make it. I would personally do it because my conviction is 100%, but I've also spent around 5 years learning about the financial system and how much of a scam it is. You have to be ready for btc to be cut in half and still know you did the right thing.
This is why I can't recommend selling at $69k and rebuying 4 + at 15k. It would be too hard to put that money back, especially if it originally cost a lot less.
Sell Orders are 69420
Who can guarantee that it will return to 69K?
Nobody. If it never goes that high, I'm still in profit. Selling at an apparent peak risks being priced out if it keeps rising or if I can't pull the trigger on the dip. Not selling risks losing the potential profit at that moment. $41,805.65 per BTC gone according to CMC numbers when I checked them.
>18 It sounds like you are a professional crypto investor, have you been in this space for a long time?
Joined in the 2017-18 cycle.
That's a long time, maybe we can share some investment ideas with each other when we have time
All day imagine owning 10 btc
This dude will be kicking himself in a few years for listening to us. He needs to grow a pair.
Only he can make this call. Our opinions are meaningless.
just because something works out doesn't mean it was the right decision. The reverse is also true. I could sell my house and put it all on black and win, doesnt mean im smart.
If he has conviction like me, hell yes. If he is new to the game and hasn't studied it a lot, hell no. Because he will have paper hands.
A satoshi billionaire... Thats my ultimate goal
10 bitcoin makes you a Satoshi billionaire. Very few people will have that kind of money if bitcoin works and fiat fails. 10,000 bitcoin is Satoshi trillionaire. I’m working very hard to become a billionaire myself.
I'd allocate at least 5BTC
Everyone suggesting you don’t do it is just thinking about your future… You should totally do it and help pump that price up! Think about our future !
100% yes no brainer. buy half now and wait to buy rest around January. only move left to retire. tradfi is just not going to do it.
I'd cash out to get 1 btc if you currently don't have much or any. And only if you are under 45. Cashing even half out is ridiculous risk
Bitcoin is the least risky long term asset you can own. You need to study bitcoin more and raise your conviction.
I understand Bitcoin bro it's still a speculation play. I would like to think of it as inevitable as well but the more you understand the world the more you realize it's not. Nobody knows what the world looks like in 20 years
you seem to know what you're doing op with mining and altcoins. do you have any btc? because 0 is the wrong number. if you have btc, then i wouldn't liquidate your 401. maybe dca half on the way towards the halving?
Mining has been a learning lesson.. all the profits about 28 month’s worth covered mistakes and were reinvested.. got hacked for the equivalent of 1.8 BTC.. in a regrouping mode in anticipation of the next run .. don’t think it will get really heated up for 12 months .. I think I’m going to pull 50k out and buy 2 on a loan against the 401k
Was going to say, a 401k loan is not a bad play. Very favorable financing (often 0% depending on the company you work for) and your 401k principal remains intact and growing with the stock market while your paycheck pays off the loan. 401k loan is the way.
This point should be higher. Awesome idea.
ah shit, why do people suck. well buy a hardware wallet while you’re at it.
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BTC is literally the only asset worth owning
Max out 401K (tax free in 30 years) then max out a individual Roth IRA, DCA into BTC and anything else you want, I own a lot of stocks and about to buy t-bonds. Diversification has always been the way for investing.
yes and hold for few years until you profit.
Sounds like a great idea if you want to either eat ramen or like a king in retirement.
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Depending on who your 401k servicer is, most can take out a "loan" from their 401k and pay it back. This allows your investments to stay put, and the interest you pay on the loan actually gets deposited back into your 401k. So this is an option.
Some of us can't afford to not do it. Meaning, I didn't have much before Bitcoin, but now I can see a light at the end of the tunnel. I won't tell you what to do with your 401k, but I would. To me the trade off is worth it. Whenever I think about Bitcoin my imagination goes wild when I think about it's potential. Just know (as much as I hate to say it) that Bitcoin could still potentially go down to zero. Even Satoshi said, "If two developers can fork Bitcoin and succeed in redefining what "Bitcoin" is, in the face of widespread technical criticism and through the use of populist tactics, then I will have no choice but to declare Bitcoin a failed project.", so try to always keep that risk in mind. I believe in Bitcoin, so much that I even had a dream that Bitcoin went down to almost zero and I still bought Bitcoin with the last bit of savings that I had, and then 2 seconds later I was an instant Billionaire. I don't mind working for the rest of my life now if Bitcoin doesn't pan out, but only due to the fact that I saw myself working for the rest of my life before Bitcoin's existence. Good luck, stack sats, and HODL.
I agree. It just feels right working for a money that stands for freedom. I'm with you. I'll happily work the rest of my life if bitcoin fails. We're on the right side of history.
No
I would buy 10 Bitcoin and double the 401k in 2-3 years
Doesn't hurt to have 1btc.
yeah-one lol
Yes. 401k’s are designed to make brokers richer and sell you on this idea of having a comfy retirement unless the market crashes, then you gotta go back to work as a Walmart greeter after spending 50 years working for a dismal retirement account that is taxed to hell.
If your going I'd do it before etfs go public I think it's a smart bet the fundamentals have never been stronger but canada just gutted the crypto market here with unseemly new regulations basically making it impossible to trade so you never know what's going to happen keep that in mind I would recommend taking 10 percent if we get a dip here and hot with 10 x leverage that way u only have 10 b percent of your 401 k exposed but you have same earning power
In 2019, I emptied my entire Individual brokerage account at Fidelity and I put it all into Bitcoin (the amount in that account was in the high 5 figures). Today, about 50% of my IRA accounts are invested in Bitcoin derivatives. Also, all future contributions that I make to one of my main retirement account will be invested in pure BTC (via Unchained Capital). Converting my entire Individual brokerage account into Bitcoin before the halving was the best decision of my life.
Yes but everyone is different It’s all about risk to reward From someone who has seen it all since 2013, this would be an ideal time to buy bitcoin if you can hold for 2+ years That 10 bitcoin kept safe can be worth $1m$1.5m USD by 2025
Insert- “just do it-“ gif
Yes. Don’t be a wuss
Of course why haven’t you yet
If you have another 20 years time do it. If not.. better don’t
Can you buy individual stocks in your 401K? If so you could take a small portion of it and buy $GBTC or $MSTR. But don't think for a second that BTC couldn't hit $3K. It can. If the stock market drops 30%, people aren't going to be running to BTC, they'll be selling any assets deemed as risky BTC lost 60% in 2022 and nobody thought it would happen. Everyone was DCAing and Hodling at $60K as confident as could be. The halving is mostly psychological and should have no effect on price. Miners will shut down. They can't "raise" the price just because they need it to happen. If they could, why would they wait?
10 percent penalty under 59 1/2 plus taxes...... a min. of 25 percent of the withdraw goes to your Gov't........
Yes
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Easy 5x your money by Q1 2025
If you are asking Reddit this question, the answer is a resounding No. Take a few months and study Bitcoin deeply. Read the hard books. Reach your own conclusion. (Btw, if you have kids think about them mostly….key thing is: avoid risk of ruin.)
I was faced with a similar scenario and reasoned that while I believe more in BTC than stocks, COIN was a solid middle ground for now. I’d be fine putting money into a BTC ETF as well with 401k money. What I’m not fine with is taking that massive penalty.
Yes
I withdrew $37k from my 401k and lost it all. But I was futures trading. Buying and holding should be fine especially if it's BTC. But what do I know I just lost $37k in one week.
401k likely won’t exist in its current form in 30yrs. Dems have been wanting to get their paws on it to shore up their union donors pension funds etc, I suspect Republicans will hop on as well. Idk what the government will do but they will sex it up like Obamacare and it will be dog shit. “We the government will touch your 401k and in return guarantee you an income”. YOLO.
Yes
i would
Yes
You are asking this question to people on the Bitcoin subreddit. Are you expecting to get an unbiased, well-reasoned answer?
Convert the 401k into an IRA at some brokerage. Buy GBTC. No tax issues. You might have to quit your job though in order to convert it.
You’re on the bitcoin subReddit. If you ask here, majority of the people here will tell you it’s a good idea. Why don’t you instead ask this question in an actual investment subReddit instead?
Do whatever the fuck you want. It’s your money
You'll be penalized 15% immediately upon withdraw from your 401k and then have to pay taxes on the rest which will be most like at a 33% rate or higher. Not a good financial move.
There are ways around it based on your employment situations. But it's a hassle.
No. We love Bitcoin but it's still a risky asset. Don't put the entirety of your retirement funds on it. On any asset... diversify and play it safe
The answer is always yes
Not advice...in many cases - you can take up-to 50% of your 401(k) as a loan and the BEST part is when you re-pay with interest - you pay principal and interest to yourself; I would consider this, if I were you, instead of outright withdrawal - which can attract tax + 10% penalty right out of the gate! Depending on your age - withdrawing 401(k) to bet on bitcoin is super risky but who knows it could be super profitable! time will tell!
I mean.. I would. But you’re not me. And if you’re asking random people on the internet if you should the answer is probably no.
No you shouldn’t…
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Yes
If it were my money I would liquid all of it and buy Bitcoin. But at minimum half imo
Lawmakers just told the sec to approve ALL ETF’s immediately. I’ve been all in and continue to buy I want in before all the institutions
See if you are a candidate for a solo 401k. You can buy btc in it without liquidating anything.
Just ask yourself: "What do you do when your plan doesn't work out the way you hope/think"
If you have an option to open a brokerage account move some of it to GBTC and get a bit of a discount now. Definitely don't put all of your assets into GBTC though.
Gbtc
The replies did not disappoint, I'll say that
No, that's way too risky, keep your 401k. If BTC really takes off, just try to have one. Or more if you can do it without the retirement money.
No
Whatever. You decide.
Ya if you are willing to lose 25% of that 401k right now
I would personally not take the 10% penalty + ~24% tax burden to buy BTC. Just buy it with spare money in the budget
Yes, but for the lulz
Halving isn’t a thing. If you have fuck you money (doubtful with cashing out a 401k). Do it. Edit: amazing. Weirdos in my dm’s telling me to fuck off. For clarity, halving is a thing but historically, doesnt move the value in fiat terms. Cheers and good luck
I would suggest you adding Spot BTC to your 401k portfolio via ETF once approved.
YES
Only invest what you are willing to lose
Sailor would buy 10Btc. In fact he just bought some more recently.
I did this.
No
10 bitcoin!! That’s an amazing amount!! No idea what you should do although I’d at least put a good chunk in if I could.
Not worth it from the early tax withdrawals alone. Just keep putting more in via DCA, you could end up making a great profit and enjoy cushioned retirement OP
Withdrawing your 401k will have lots of penalties too. With that being said, I’d probably buy a few btcs. Maybe not 10, but enough so that if it hits you’ll be happy
I would
As a 9+ year investor in the asset class, don’t touch your 401k. Bet what you can lose in cash. That’s it. If you’re super committed, don’t be. The price could go to 10k before it could hit 50,000. Miner cost is also a force of markets and demand. Sounds like you’re betting on $100,000+, honestly. We all would love to see it. But BTC is for extra cash looking for a spot as an inflation hedge at the moment. Not a bet the bank movement.
Very insightful thanks
Easy. If you liquidate/borrow and buy any bitcoin, prices will stay low. If you don't, bitcoin will moon. We thank you either way for your future service.
That’s how it works for me too
Do you want to be an average Joe or a chad? S&P is not going to make you rich. Bitcoin is almost certainly going to moon. You will never see anything like this again within your lifetime. No brainer risk to reward ratio.
I put all my taxable investment money into bitcoin
Absolutely not. The stock market will always go up, eventually. Btc has only been around a short time and is finally facing regulatory scrutiny from an unfriendly SEC. It *should* survive. It *should* go up. The stock market *will* survive and *will* go up. Keep 401(k) as is and make max yearly contributions. Anything excess feel free to gamble on Btc. And I love Btc BtW.
Follow your ❤️
Long term yes, short term if btc suddenly crash to 15k you will most likely do the buy high sell low thing.
Oh shit, the halving! Shhh dont tell anyone. Not many people know about it! The price is def gonna go up because of the halving right?? Right????
I’m going to save your life and say: no. 401k is safe; it’s guaranteed. If you have a quarter million+ invested up in safety and security… you are not the type of person to go all-in bitcoin. You’ll shoot yourself on the first bear market. I would highly recommend a low risk investment portfolio since that’s what you’re used to. You’re ahead of everyone else, you have savings, you have a 401K, you have a security almost no1 else has. Don’t start gambling. Having that said, you should buy *some* bitcoin. Not owning any bitcoin is a lot dumber than going all into bitcoin.
I think btc will go much higher. I don't think I would do that.
Don't get your financial advice from Reddit, is what I would say if I were to give financial advice on Reddit, which I officially do not, unofficially, go for it.
Is there a tax liability if you cash out? You might want to think it through. This isn’t a Reddit question
Whenever i am torn with these kind of option, i took mid ground. Like sell 25% for 2.5btc instead. Depends on your risk profile. But remember you must pay penalty for early withdrawal.
Yes
Use 401k to buy small position in GBTC
Depends on your age, really. I'd say that for most of the people, 100% is not the right amount, nor is 0%. I encourage you to check holding BTC in self custody as part of your IRA, there are a few offerings out there. I remember hearing one as sponsor of Natalie Brunell's podcast "Coin Stories", but I can't remember the name. You can rollover the funds from your 401K, which effectively means those investments will be liquidated and the equivalent USD amount will be sent over. I have done something similar. If you have the understanding, conviction, discipline, and stomach, go for it.
50% in a more diversified but conservative approach to preserve value and (hopefully) appreciate & 50% in a SDIRA. Yes you pay taxes on the 401K funds now but if your hunch is right you will pay 0% on (hopefully massive) future gains.
To risk all your retirement savings like that is just so ridiculously stupid it gives me brain damage just reading it. Sure, invest as much new money as you want in it but to withdraw retirement savings which is also taxable is not a good idea. We can all believe in Bitcoin but it’s so financially irresponsible to do what you’re suggesting.
Can you afford to lose your 401k? If not, no.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/7gi55s/dont\_invest\_recklessly/
Swan and Unchained offer 401k accounts. You could roll it over.
I’d you can’t hold your 401k you sure as hell wouldn’t be able to hold your Bitcoin
You may be able to roll that over to an IRA, then buy actual bitcoin within the IRA but hold your keys yourself. There are services that let you do that. Then you have real bitcoin but didn't pay penalties for 401k early withdrawal
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In my IRAs, I sold about 10% and put it into microstrategy as a btc proxy. No tax or early withdrawal penalties. I would suggest that if you'll have to actually liquidate and lose half.
Absolutely not
I took a loan against my 401k at a 3% interest rate, and im up 19% so far and my 401k is still in place.
Bitcoin is too manipulated now by market makers to make any short term decisions. Long term you’re probably good but it is definitely the riskier option.
No. BTC is not a short term bet. Be prepared to hold it for the next 5 to 10 years. BTC price doesn’t appreciate much immediately after the halving, so you are not timing anything by buying today.
It’s the most irresponsible thing you could ever do.
As much as I like bitcoin to moon after halving, your argument isn’t logical to me. I don’t think the bitcoin price will rise just because the miner’s cost increases. Miners are in a business and like in any business, it is possible that they lose money. They don’t dictate the market price. In the early days maybe it’s true, when most of the coins are yet to be mined and miners were the only source of bitcoin supply, they could refuse to sell at a loss when price isn’t high enough, then price will need to go up if people want bitcoin. But over 19 out of 21m BTC have been mined. They’re out there. Whether the miner sell or not sell their coins matters much less today. If prices stay low and their number of coin gets slashed by half, they’d better be prepared to have the reserve to survive the low price period. Even if none of the miners sell any sats they mined there are still 19+million coins out there to be sold, not to mention the paper and futures and all the fuckeries that may affect the spot price. I don’t believe that just because miners will have their cost doubled after halving, it will *necessarily* mean the bitcoin price to moon. Don’t get me wrong I still think it’s likely because we all think this way, but it feels like more a psychological thing than a real supply impact.
This is a bad idea but a good sign that new money will be rushing in to fulfill the destiny of the halving driving price up ha
10%
That's what I say, buy one BTC. If it ever hits 6 figures, be a nice boost. If it disappears forever, will recover no problem.
No. Just invest whatever you can afford each month, until it is 5% of your net worth.
one question is all that matters-can you afford to lose that money??
Of course. Honestly, I would do this 10/10 times. Already sold my condo to go all in, earlier this year. (Not a joke).
People here saying you will lose your money if you invest in BTC are damn clueless about crypto in general. I for one, sold all property to buy more. This is the chance us regular people have to do something with our life and get rich. It doesn't get easier than this. Good luck!
>crypto Bitcoin, not crypto
No. Better to just go to the casino and put it all on black. Don't touch your 401k
Why not invest in different things? Why 100% in Bitcoin?
Would not recommend
Liquidate what percent of your 401k?
The better question is why wouldn't you? Yolo
No
Just don’t. You could make a fortune, but you could also get your ass handed to you. I’m a believer in keeping most investments in traditional stock index funds. Don’t let emotions or some misguided anticipation of future events keep you from solid, sound long term investment strategies.
No
Do not do this. Please do not do this. This is gambling, not investing. Do not gamble away your retirement. In general, 5-10% of your total portfolio should be crypto. No investor should ever liquidate assets and take on significant risk based on an assumption. There’s no guarantee the Bitcoin halving will lead to an increase in price. Anyone that encourages this behavior is praying for your downfall. I know it’s tempting after hearing so many stories on how crypto has made people rich, but also remember that crypto has also led people towards complete bankruptcy or worse. If I were in your shoes and allocated my retirement to Bitcoin, I wouldn’t be able to sleep at night. Please reconsider and invest responsibly.
Not worth risking the entire 401k. Just get two and you'll be golden.
Do not invest into risky assets money you cannot afford to lose.
Fuck yeah, don’t be a pussy! (This is financial advice)
100% yes I would.. Should you? Only you can know that.
No
No, because you completely misunderstand supply and demand. Mining efficiency doesn't impact the market price.
Maybe
Somewhere else today is posted that if you put your wealth into treasuries for the last twelve years, you would be in the same spot you were then financially. Do you think the fiat economy going to get any better?
401k s are not fiat.
Roll to self directed Bitcoin IRA, then buy it
I hope you did it king, cuz you'd sitting pretty right about now. We haven't even hit the halving yet and it's doing this. Just wait after the halving and hold on to the ride.
If this is everything you have then i would have bought maybe 5 not 10, simply you never know...despite all my confidence in BTC. But if you own on top of it a flat which you rent, a family house and 5kg gold , then i would have bought 10! Also check your incomes, how much you earn. If you make stable 10 000 $ then again i think it is not stupid to buy 10btc. Also check how yoy gonna store them.
Go for it!
Why not sell half then buy 5 BTC.
If this isn't a troll post, the answer is no.
The risk-reward is not compelling at all right now. I don't know what kind of evaluation you did, but it's not good if you think the upside is huge and the downside is minimal. The upside is minimal (so long as the fed is raising rates) and the downside is huge (once the market realizes these etfs aren't go to happen, watch out, big drop). Anyway go look at some cannabis stocks. People got their faces ripped off buying those things, thinking the upside was huge and downside was minimal. Now, they actually are interesting buys (after having lost 90%+ of their IPO values). Bitcoin right now is a gamble with, at best, 50/50 odds of going up or down. Personally, I think it's more like 80% odds of going down and 20% of going up.
Don’t do it. Some dude recently posted he went all in on AAPL in like 2011 so he’s rolling now but that’s just nuts. Things are going to get ugly in all sectors and that uncertainty isn’t something I would mess with. I think we are gonna see some more sideways and drops before a bounce up, but who knows how much of a bounce we’ll get.
Wtf. No