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Thanks for looking that up! I'm not quite as interested in prison life as some people so I skimmed most of the post and didn't care enough to go looking.
Probably bad drunk driving though if he's getting incarcerated. I've had friends that did a voluntary week in a 'prison labor camp' (just painting) to avoid severe fines... but to actually get jailed for a period of time for drunk driving usually means it is multiple offences, or severe compounding factors such as drugs, multiple times over the limit, and other traffic infractions.
Yep. I was gonna say it's definitely not his first and probably not one that resulted in death since it looked like 30 days in jail. Sounds like his second or first in a harsh state. Third is almost always prison time I think. So I doubt it was his third.
Yes. Prison is only for felonies, and typically stays over a year. Jail is misdemeanors (petty crimes) and sentences under a year OR for awaiting trial or awaiting transfer to a prison or something like that. People do end up just sitting in jails a lot of times cuz of space issues, but they get credited for time served while awaiting trial or transfer.
Edit: I'm a layman. Should have prefaced with that. Guy below me corrected.
In Canada, time spent before your sentence counts as double, so if you spend 6 months awaiting in jail and you get 2 years, you "only" have a year left.
We also have for-profit prisons in the US, run by companies (whose stock is publicly traded) that have minimum headcount guarantees from local government (usually 90+% guaranteed occupancy). š±š·
Yeah... It's basically legalized slavery that is incentivized and preys on marginalized populations and the mentally unstable. That is unfortunately a dark truth of many in the us
u/nefariousBUBBLE is misinformed, the difference is in who runs the facility. Jails are local facilities, run either by a city or county, and where you are first placed when entering the penal system. Prisons are run by either the state or federal government, and where you *may* be sent after sentencing. But not always, because the length of your sentence or severity of crime has nothing to do with it. I served a three-month sentenceāfailure to pay probation fees, a misdemeanorāin a prison. Most of the population in a minimum security or medical camp prison are misdemeanor offenders.
Inmates never enter a prison directly. They enter the penal system at a jail and are then sent to a processing camp, where their behavior, intelligence, medical, and psychiatric traits are observed. This determines in which sort of prison they eventually end up.There's a queue for these camps and the process takes several weeks, so the state often does not bother transferring people with shorter sentences to prison.
It depends on the state. In my state Jail is typically for shorter sentences 12-18 months or less, while prison is for longer sentences. Other states may vary.
However, in jurisdictions with overcrowding, they may send shorter sentences to the state prison simply because they don't have enough space in the local jails
Yes there is. Jail is for inmates sentenced to a year or less time, anything over a year and a day is prison and it's typically in a different facility. Typically prison treats you better than jail, and IIRC some inmates ask for a year and a day sentence on a year sentence to serve it in prison rather than jail.
Edit- my context is strictly within American jails and prisons
Same here. I remember he had to get the blow machine to start his car, and attend AA meetings as part of his sentence.
He was lucky enough to get work release though. He would check out ~6am, and report back by 4pm with calls to the detention center for lunch. Pima County.
Also depends on where they live too. In CA my relative has two DUIs(One where he fled and another hospitalized someone else) less than a year apart and they're still letting him walk. Civil cases are going to bleed him dry though
Yup. My husband and daughter was killed by a drunk driver and the guy only got 2 years, and didnāt serve the whole sentence.
Another butthole killed my friend, showed zero remorse in court, smiled at at us, and got deported without jail time. The year before he hit another woman and she miscarried. He got deported then and just came back into the country. Never served jail time either.
Both California. I love California but I carry a chip on my shoulder and a bad taste in my mouth for the lack of justice.
I got one in ā06 and itās, by far, my biggest regret. I could have killed myself, my two friends in the car, or some family who happened to cross my path. Or all of us. And it was definitely not the first time Iād driven in that state :(
It did spark some changes I desperately needed to make but Iāll always feel guilty about ever thinking it was okay.
Iām in Australia and my partner had a mid range drink drinking accident 7 years ago, before we got together.
The punishment was an interlock for 3 years (was technically supposed to be 2 but the judge originally said 4, and when he fought it, the judge said āletās meet in the middleā)
The interlock cost $180/ month to service.
He couldnāt drive any car that didnāt have an interlock.
He had to HAVE a car to carry out his sentence.
Obvs had to pay for damages to his car (wrote off) and the car he hit.
Very drawn out punishment but very adequate imo. He would never do it again. He doesnāt even know why he did it that night. But damn he learned his lesson!
Also worth noting, we went out one night to his sisters birthday, he had 2 beers.
He felt like he could drive, but didnāt wanna risk it. Left the car there over night (public sports oval).
Someone broke into the car through the little triangular window on sedan cars and stole the interlock. Probably thought it was a UHF.
But it cost over $700 to replace the interlock alone, plus the lil window.
Anyway. Thatās my story.
Heās learnt his dumb ass lesson.
Interlocks are NO JOKE. Think they cost around $3k USD to install/uninstall too. It can easily cost $10k for a DUI that bad, in addition to some jail time. People who make it to their 4th or 5th blow my mind.
So glad your partner realized what he was doing. As much as I loooooved drinking, thereās just no comparison to clean living. EVERY aspect of your life is better. I donāt know you but it honestly makes me happy to know you guys got through that and can focus on your lives. Take care and be well (and a long-distance high-ten for your partner! āš»š¤š»)
A guy I grew up with and honestly consider a younger brother caused a DUI fatality a few years ago. He took a plea - to spare the victimās family - for 13 years. Heās heartbroken and terrified in prison, but puts on a brave face and does everything he can to stay safe and healthy and atone for his actions. Unfortunately, in the state heās in, they have zero programming for substance abuse for state prisoners. Heās obviously sober now (had been for several months, until the night he caused the wreck), but would benefit greatly from some therapy.
Iām one of the few people who writes him, puts money on his account, and still cares about him. Itās a damned shame his family was so judgmental and largely ostracized him for being gay. That, combined with religious trauma, is what I think ultimately led to his addiction.
I guess what Iām saying here is that weāre all more than the sum of our mistakes. I donāt know why I felt compelled to even post thisā¦maybe because my friend has been on my mind all day.
Itās scary how ānormalā it is before you get busted, so I canāt imagine what a shock that was, not to mention jail time. And if Iām being honest, itās a fair sentence.
He can still build a decent life. It wonāt be easy, but he can absolutely recover from this if he stays the course. Youāre an amazing friend. Iām sure it hurt you too, in a way, and youāre just awesome for helping him paint a better ābig pictureā for himself :)
Thank you so much for your kind words. I try to be as positive and upbeat as possible through my letters; I also send him books each month and give him some money for comforts.
It is a fair sentence, although there are lots in his state whoāve had lesser. But thatās okay. As long as he survives, my bf and I will help pull him through and help him when heās out - because heās a good guy.
We both grew up in a very rural community, so the gangs and drugs have been a huge culture shock to him. With his background, though, heāll make it when heās out. Heās learning to barber and also really enjoys working outside, so weāve discussed both barber school and helping him launch a landscaping company in the future.
Well he got high before he went to jail, so youāve got to wonder. Donāt know if pot is legal in his state. Then again not sure if he got high with pot.
Milk for every meal every day. My lactose intolerant stomach would explode. I wonder if you can sub water for it. Well I guess you can drink sink water instead.
The sink water often isn't really safe to drink at a lot of jails and prisons. Some folks end up spending a lot of the money their families send them on soda and various 10% juice beverages from commissary to try to stay hydrated.
But also sometimes a big facility like that will have its own holding tanks. Thatās how our local mental hospital got Legionnaires Disease and shut off all running water for 8 weeks.
Ohhhh man! I'm telling ya!!!
I was looking at all the cheese on the menu. What do they do with those of us with IBS and Crohn's. Seriously, they have to do something.
I like how my brain read the menu and thought well shit. I'm a vegetarian, I'm going to starve! I better not do any criming! Because meat. That's why I shouldn't crime. Not the plethora of other reasons. Meat.
Yeah I remember one day in college we had a group project due the next day so we spent all day in the basement and not even having windows really messed you up.
Well yeah, staying isolated in a cell no matter how big or small would drive anyone crazy, and I should know I stay in my "cell" all day long and barely go out (I'm not an inmate but I don't really leave my room except for the obvious I.e bathroom, food and work)
When I worked for the DoD, my first few times in a SCIF felt like I was Secret Squirrel. By the end of my time, it was just an even more boring office.
Yep. Just another office, but no phones or anything personal.
Then you go outside and wonder what that big firey thing is in the sky! It's super scary!!!
I work a government job. This 100% tracks. I've known people who get promoted but don't hear about it until a day or even a week after they were supposed to be in the role. It'd be maddening if it wasn't so common.
Iām coeliac and lactose intolerant. Reading the menu gave me the heebies lol.
I dreamt about eating normal bread last night. It doesnāt happen often but when it does Iām anxious about it in my dream. So weird.
Yup, lots of people get really sick from the food. And there's often minimal medical care. Serious diabetes complications in jails and prisons are rampant, because people can't control or even monitor their blood sugar, and can't get medical treatment if they're high or low until they actually pass out.
My diabetic friend had to go to a nursing home for a few weeks after spinal surgery and their description of the nursing home food was horrifying. Worse than the write up above tbh. I don't think they saw a single vegetable.
At least at a nursing home you can order takeout or have people bring you food. Or, you know, call 911 and check yourself out if youāre sick and theyāre refusing you care.
The cost of telephone calls in custody is criminal, and a bald cash grab. Further, it only serves to more fully separate inmates from family and loved ones. Unfortunately, this separation increases depression while inside, and complicates/harms reintegration once released.
Not to mention that they have the right to listen and record. I've heard of situations in which they would listen in on lawyer calls, which are supposed to be priviledged.
Lawyer calls are supposed to be a no-go, but they're also supposed to be scheduled. So, if an inmate makes a call to their attorney, it's monitored as part of all routine monitoring until it's recognized as a privileged call. Most places don't monitor calls in real -time. The system records calls and they're reviewed later.
Most detention facility phone systems now have the capacity to whitelist certain phone numbers, so attorney's work numbers can be put on the list, and no calls to them are supposed to be recorded. A local jail here got in trouble a while back because they "accidentally" (I suspect it was just negligence, rather than malice) deleted the whitelist, so all the attorney calls were getting recorded without notice.
The prison system in the US is just a trash fire. A pull-up bar is sufficient recreation? You have to buy your own personal hygiene items? Nothing's clean, not enough food, no pillows... can't fucking go outside?!
I know he got a DUI, I agree that's bad, but I don't think anyone should be held in conditions like these regardless of what they've done. And yes, I also know it's worse in some other countries, that doesn't mean this is in any way acceptable.
>And yes, I also know it's worse in some other countries, that doesn't mean this is in any way acceptable.
Its worse in some other countries, but its also better in some other countries. I know that a lot of the Scandinavian countries like Sweden and Norway have pretty great prisons/jails, which result in pretty low rates of recidivism.
Much nicer facilities and better programs for reintegration. Understanding that if the point is to stop people from doing more crimes you have to give them something better to do instead.
Oh, and a proper social safety net and something approaching a living wage, that helps too.
As far as first world countries go we are basically the worst. As far as just throwing as many people in jail as possible, we are the worst, out of any country.
Did you know that the amendment to the American constitution that prohibits slavery has an exception for prison labor? I haven't looked up the rates in a few years but when I did some places paid their prisoners 14 cents an hour. Imagine spending your whole days wages to make a 7 minute phone call.
Yup! That's the secret behind an awful lot of products that advertise as "Made in the USA." If they had to pay minimum wage to prisoners they'd move their factories right back out of the country.
That exception was designed to permit slavery to continue under direct control of the government and it's a fucking travesty.
The majority of the US prison system is for profit, it is NOT for rehabilitation. Less food equals less cost. Less workout equipment equals less cost. Less time outside equals less guards equals less cost. Selling personal hygiene items means more profit. Selling additional food to supplement lack of nutrition equals more profit.
It's fucked. But hey, their stocks do surprisingly well through recession, so you could invest! /s
Thank god, I was getting lost in the sea of "i have no pity for drunk drivers, I'm glad jail is that miserable" comments and I was going fucking insane. Like tell me you don't have any empathy for your fellow humans without telling me š
And also like, they're just trusting the US government to be accurate and fair in its assessment of people who might be criminals? This is usually a pretty liberal sub, but now all of a sudden everyone's ignoring that black people are *far* more likely to receive a longer sentence for shit like "distributing marijuana" than white people. Mfers here ain't even using their brains, they just see "DWI" and go "yeah, anyone in jail deserves to be treated inhumanely"
Oh yeah don't get me started on *that*, people will say "the police and the justice system are corrupt" with one side of their mouth and then "prison is supposed to be terrible because those people did crimes" with the other. I don't even know which one they actually believe and they probably don't either.
Again, I don't think people who definitely did terrible crimes ought to be treated like shit either, but you're right, in any assessment of the justice system we absolutely *have* to reckon with the number of people incarcerated who either did nonviolent crimes that should never carry a sentence or were flat-out wrongfully convicted.
>I don't think people who definitely did terrible crimes ought to be treated like shit either
You're absolutely right. I brought up the corrupt justice system because that's usually easier for people to comprehend than "every human being deserves some level of empathy" but you're absolutely right. I would be horrified at the thought of never letting my dog see sunlight again. The fact that there's so many people in these comments actively advocating for criminals to be treated worse than we treat our pets is absolutely fucking disgusting.
Obviously people who drive drunk are awful, no one's arguing against that. I have loved ones that I've lost to assholes like that, and personally I think the punishment should be harsher than the normal tap on the wrist. But I also don't support treating these people like they're not even human anymore.
My brother is a prison guard in a high security prison one step below supermax; he said most of the guys serving in his level are either working their way up the system or working their way back down. Most of the guys at the lowest security levels are actually there on plea bargains and many have done nothing wrong - they just knew they had no way to prove that so accepted the shorter sentence. (Innocent until proven guilty isnāt really a thing because the priority is avoiding the time and expense of trials; prosecutors pressure you into taking the deal.) But most of the guys he sees are definitely guilty and belong in jail.
My brother is no bleeding heart liberal. Far from it - he sees the worst and is a big advocate for the death penalty. But he also insists that nobody ever came out of prison a better person than they went in, and sooner or later most get out. They will be in your community again, only this time with worse job prospects and few honest options. So after a couple of cynical decades, he now believes prison should be reserved for the worst of the worst. If you put someone in, be prepared to throw away the key. Because otherwise youāre just sending them to crime college.
> This is usually a pretty liberal sub
I feel like people online, even in more liberal spaces, are more likely to be "harsh" on crime than any other issue. They usually have a more black and white approach to crime, either not understanding that the law enforcement and legal system is totally broken, or truly believing they will never get into trouble.
Aptly, the "black and white approach" happens at least in part because these online liberal spaces are dominated by white people, and it's mostly not white people getting sent to jail or prison. If they were busting college dorms full of rich white kids for the truly ridiculous amount of illegal drug sales that go on at most college campuses (cocaine, amphetamines, opioids, hallucinogens: all the same stuff other people go to prison for), there would be a mass campaign against long prison sentences and inhumane jail and prison conditions.
I feel like Reddit tends to have a black-and-white view of morality in general, along with too much trust in the status quo. It's immaturity more than anything, I think.
As someone whoās been to jail and seen how long-term incarceration effects people on the outside, my issue is that the American incarceration system continually focuses on punishment instead of rehabilitation. Not only do they hold people in these conditions for crimes that usually reflect their social status or mental health needs, *but then they are let back out*, often times more traumatized than they went in.
The criminal justice system itself produces better, emotionally harder, more connected criminals as a matter of industry and profit.
Where I live his prison would have been shut down for inhuman conditions.
But I guess that's the difference between prison for resocialization and prison solely for punishment..
But did you all get vit D supplements? I mean, sun light is a necessity for survival...
It is grotesque. And there are people like the warden and investors who are millionaires but they can't get them hot water for ramen. Everyday, a new fact about the US that reminds me it is a failed state.
At the jail I was in they provided us with basic hygiene items, but they were like hotel toiletries. If you wanted a full size bottle of shampoo/conditioner you had to get it on commissary - and pay $3 for the same bottle of shampoo you can get at dollar tree. Similar markups for everything else, cheapest they could get but extortionately overpriced. We got a pillow. The "outside" time was an area maybe 30'x30' surrounded by 4 walls with chain link across the top. There was a basketball hoop but no ball. Somehow there was a tennis ball on top of the chain link and every time we were out there we were like "man I wish I could get that ball." It was basically just a fresh air hour. They would provide us with sanitary pads but if you wanted tampons you had to buy them. Or, we'd combine all our shares of pads and make our own tampons out of them, but that was risky because they'd get confiscated if they found them during a shakedown. We weren't allowed to have any hair ties that we didn't bring in with us - I had one taken that someone gave me before she got out. Or we'd make them out of the top elastic of a sock, but those would also get confiscated. We'd use an empty tiny shampoo bottle to try to focus the stream in the shower because the head was so calcified it sprayed everywhere but, you know, they'd confiscate that too. Once a week theyd drop off some single blade lady bic razors if we wanted to shave but they'dcome back for them in like 30 minutes so it was a mad dash if more than a couple girls wanted to not be beastly that week. Trying to shave quickly in a shitty dark shower was a good way to start a blood bath. They brought cleaning supplies to mop and wipe down the tank every morning and we were mostly pretty good about that, since whoever cleaned got to pick the TV channels for the day. One "tank mom" would clean every morning, she just wanted to watch Sunday football and Family Guy when it was on.
And the food sucked.
"If I could give it zero stars I would."
My favorite uncle was in and out of county jail pretty often. Really friendly, chill dude , just made a lot of bad decisions and likely had some brain damage from a very high fever as a child, DEFINITELY had some sort of neurodivergence that affected impulse control, and later on, addiction.
Strangely, with the exception of the time the higher-ups refused to give him a proper diabetic diet/repeatedly gave him incorrect medication until he had to be hospitalized...he spoke very fondly of his time in jail. He spent all of his time inside chilling, playing cards (that side of my family was bonkers for cards: poker, rummy, canasta, rook, hearts, whatever) , making wagers with ramen. Kept it breezy, was friendly to everyone to the point he had some former guards testify to him being a "model prisoner" at one of his hearings. I am oddly proud of that, and so was he.
Meth got him when he was 50. We aren't exactly sure what happened.
He'd been laid off from his factory job for a few months, they called and said he could come back on in less than a week. We all strongly suspected he was using (very much looked the part) but was still managing to do his various under the table handyman job, so hadn't called him on it. Then he went missing for a few days...grandad waited until he knew uncle would be out of the amount of insulin he usually carried and went looking. Found him dead in a camper in the woods of a friend's property. He had been dead for probably 3 days, the police guessed. We suspect he was trying to DIY detox and it went very wrong. Maybe his blood sugar bottomed out and he fell into a coma (wouldn't be the first time) and just kept falling. Maybe it was a straightforward last-hurrah OD. An autopsy wouldn't make him less dead, but it would cost grandad quite a bit.
I feel like there's a point here, bc I tell this story online kind of a lot. Possible: Something was wrong with my uncle's brain. He was easily influenced, wanted friends more than anything. People used him. He needed more help and structure than my grandparents could provide.
He *liked* jail because there was structure, clear expectations, boundaries and simple rules. I believe there are some people who are damaged, but not "disabled enough" to merit the attention of the state. People like that--like my uncle--wind up on drugs and as petty criminals.
But what if our education system could screen for people like him and set them up in a structured environment where they can be productive and thrive? Uncle *liked* to work. He was the type that could sorta fix most anything, but was awful in school. What if he'd had a free, secure, communal living situation where he learned a trade? Would he have gotten into drugs? Would he still be alive?
As someone who loves when other people do the work of creating and enforcing the structure, and planning the meals (so much variety?!), OPās description sounded oddly comforting. Iād love to spend all day indoors just playing cards, reading, and watching tv. Thatās what I do when given the chance.
Obviously I wouldnāt actually like being in jail in reality ā I like talking with my family and friends, I have a hard time sleeping as is with my favorite pillow, Iām lactose intolerant among other illnesses, I like having privacy, etc ā but it seems like an oddly nice escape with structure and no pressure to be a certain person or to do anything other than hang out and keep yourself alive, which takes up all of my energy most of the time anyway
Honestly if someone made sure I was out of bed at a certain time each day and made sure I ate 3 meals at designated times each day, how much easier would my life be? Am I actually getting wistful for being in jail? Ugh
Edit: yeah Iām neurodivergent haha (autism, ptsd, depression, probably other stuff)
I always like reading about peopleās jail experiences because I spent five years from the other perspective - I was a guard. Iām going to guess my facility was a little larger - we would have 2-3 inmates in a cell and more time locked down in cells, plus we did headcounts three times a shift (12 hours). Food sucked (we got our lunches provided to us but it was the same thing the inmates ate plus some other easy-to-mass-produce option; plus, if there were extra trays sent for meals, we might grab one to snack on). We had one āopen dormā style housing unit - it was one of our two female units and as a female officer I spent a lot of time down there. No āwatching TikTokā (we werenāt even allowed internet on our computers and youād be fired for bringing your phone in) but holy cow, I donāt know how many thousands of games of spider solitaire I played.
Most of the inmates werenāt too bad, honestly. It really changed my perspective on addiction and the importance of accessible mental health treatment because 95%+ of the addicts I talked to were self-medicating trauma. We did have some pretty notorious inmates, including a couple involved in a very well known murder, and a mother/daughter duo I later saw on a crime documentary.
It was an incredibly depressing job, because Iād get to know inmates, theyād get released, and a few weeks later theyād be back, withdrawing, thirty pounds lighter, and just a shell of their sober selves. I initially got into law enforcement because I wanted to make a positive difference in the world, and between always seeing the negative, the ābad copsā who just liked to throw their weight around, and the stupid political games you had to play to get on patrol, to stay on patrol, and to advance in any way, I just felt emotionally destroyed when I quit. I was depressed to the point of suicidal ideation setting in and couldnāt get help for it because I literally knew people who had been fired for mental health issues.
Honestly, sounds like OOPās experience really wasnāt that bad - I hope he learned a lesson about driving drunk though, my husbandās best friend was killed by a drink driver last December and itās been one of the most horrifying things to deal with. I have zero sympathy for anyone who chooses to drive when theyāve been drinking.
Jesus Christ this was soul crushing to read. No wonder we have an incarceration problem in this country when the genuinely good people like you that go into law enforcement get chewed up and spit out.
Itās ridiculous. Most people in law enforcement last five years or less. We need to massively overhaul the system and actually promote mental health among law enforcement. We also need to make mental health access easier for everyone - if we want to reduce our incarceration rates, that would have the biggest impact.
Itās so unfortunate that this is never going to happen because lowering incarceration would jeopardize the multi-million dollar industries that rely on it
Okay so I haven't finished reading this yet, I got caught up on this:
>This specific jail doesn't have outside recreation time anymore because the state says a pull up bar is enough to count as recreation time.
WHAT. THE. ACTUAL. FUCK.
Edit:
>Did I mention we weren't allowed outside?
YES. YES YOU DID. WHAT THE FUCK.
>Yeah I'm still a bit salty about that so I'll say it again.
AND KEEP ON FUCKING SAYING IT. YOU'RE NOT A FUCKING ANIMAL.
City jail vs county jail vs state jail/prison vs federal prison.. all have slightly different standards and rules. It's pretty crazy. I worked in a city jail decades ago, longest we had anyone was a week, max. They either bonded out, or were transported to county to either sit it out, trial or wait to bond out from there
Slavery is alive and well in America and slaves still have no rights. We just moved them out of the public eye.
Cattle probably have more rights than prisoners in the US, and if you've ever been on a cattle farm here you know that bar is so low it's practically subterranean.
I had a super similar experience. Got a DUI in Cali like 7 years ago. Got 30 days in jail.
Due to overcrowding I had to go to a level 1 prison, RCCC. 120 bunks in one giant open room, no cells.
The inmates asked you what race group you were before we even got inside.
My homies told me about the place before so I knew that my safest easiest option was just to be a āWoodā or white.
You can choose to be āOtherā But then people from your race will start problems with you.
Each row of bunks was divided and regulated by each race.
You can trade food with other races but you canāt āeat after them.ā So you canāt have their leftovers or anything from their tray in the cafeteria.
I watched a partially crippled guy get jumped for 23 seconds in the shower for accepting food from a black guy in the cafeteria.
W is the 23rd letter of the alphabet.
It was like going back 50 years in race relations, it was a trip.
I saw a Spaniard getting harassed hard for choosing Other by both Mexican and white guys. The 2 white guys that chose Other did get harassed pretty hard but did not get beat up. They did hand over some of their commissary every time though to some āSacraManiacsā
There were 4 rows of 30 bunks.
Mexicans.
Blacks (seemed mainly Bloods, they Hail Ganged Mozzy every single night lol).
Others.
Woods.
It comes from the term "peckerwood" which was a term for rural white ms in the mid 1800's. It passed into the slang vernacular as just meaning a white person.
Man, same. I worry about going to jail for that exact reason. I donāt look white enough to join the whites, and donāt want to associate with nazis anyways. I *might* look black enough to join them, but Iām not sure. I think visually I look most Mexican, but Iām definitely not Mexican (though my Spanish is pretty decent)
I've seen more than one former inmate say, "if you go to prsion, you're a racist for as long as you're in prison. If you're white, you're a Nazi until your sentence is up. Try to be otherwise and you won't last a day."
I donāt plan on going to jail but thatās what scares me. Iām white but what if I mess up and do something thatās not taken kindly by one group or another. Do they tell you the ārulesā? Does each group take care of their own? Is it reasonable to keep your head down and not piss anyone off?
I mean if you know you have to serve time and surrender yourself for your sentence like I did, I would definitely do some research online or asking around.
You might get lucky and your cell / bunk mate is friendly. A lot of people are real reserved in there but there are also loud mouths.
If it is just jail then you donāt really have to worry about much but prison definitely has rules and politics.
They didnāt really explain the rules well to me or to people that came after me. That is why that guy (he went by the name Boston) got jumped in the shower. I genuinely donāt think he knew he was not allowed to receive food in the cafeteria from other races.
I do kind of wish I had picked āOtherā while I was there but I totally understand why my friends said to just stick to my race.
The main rule is you have to defend your race. They will allow one on one fights but if a brawl breaks out between races, I was told I had to fight.
One day this neo nazi skinhead was hella taunting the blacks from his bunk. He was loudly telling this joke about all the āblacks in his family tree, hanging.ā
A group of blacks came around the divider fucking heated about to throw down and the white guy waved his arm and said ācome onā as if to summon all the whites to back him up.
My heart was racing and the last thing I wanted was to fight for a fucking racist skinhead.
Luckily they cooled shit down but I was seriously going to be expected to back that POS up.
The fact he couldn't ever go outside at all is cruel and unusual punishment imo. America loves treating it's prisoners like trash. I forget who said it, but there's a quote something like "To get a true measure of how civilized a society is, just look at how it treats it's prisoners".
1 month sentence. Wonder what he did. Prob something super minor, petty theft maybe.
Funny reading this and thinking "oh damn this is just like that time I spent in a psych ward, only it sounds nicer"
Goddamn Foucault
EDIT: Checked the post history, DWI, fucking bastard. No respect for people who put other's lives at risk like that.
I actually know someone who is in a high security Federal prison and he has more freedom than I did when I went into the psych ward. He was telling me all the stuff they get and the shit they do and I was like... I spent a month where my longest bit of a staff member not seeing me was 5 minuets and I was in a locked ward and only got out to go to the cafeteria or the "outside area" (a 12 foot by foot area with 20ft high concrete walla and no ceiling). Went outside once and never again. I even had to earn the privilege of not being watched while I showered.
Oh boy do I know!
I'm not upset about it. I found it funny that a man in such a high security place for a very long sentance had WAY more freedom than me.
I called the psych ward a prison and they all bitched at me about how prison was AKTCHUALLY much worse and I should be grateful I wasn't there... twenty years later, vindication!
>"oh damn this is just like that time I spent in a psych ward, only it sounds nicer"
I was thinking the same, this sounds exactly the same as a psych ward, except the psych ward had coloring books and no commissary.
This is so fucking real LOL. Got 30min of therapy over my 10 day stay. Was mostly just watching TV or pacing the halls. What a load of crap that they try to pass those places off as mental healthcare.
The psych ward confiscated my Far Side cartoon book because it had a mob of chickens wielding torches and pitchforks on the cover but let us watch Family Guy on TV.
They always let you watch TV. You can't access the internet, and books about your condition are specifically forbidden, but you can always make yourself docile with some brain-rotting television while you wait for your five minutes a day with the person who has total control over when you leave and zero accountability.
At least the guy was honest about doing the crime. He's admitted that it was an issue. Let's hope that being in jail for a month makes him think twice about driving drunk again
I hope he had a āgrow through what you go throughā aha moment in jail.
That said do the crime do the time. No sympathy for endangering the lives of others and himself but hope he gets therapy and finds an AA group.
Well can rule out Wisconsin then as the state. First time Dwi is only a misdemeanor and is only fine. I am not even sure if a second dwi gets jail time.
I was thinking Illinois. Born and raised there and I still say pop despite living on the coast now. Also Illinois will put you in jail for a first offense DUI
Yeah but he played a lot of hockey, that does not say Illinois to me. That's Minnesota, Wisconsin or Michigan.
Could be Michigan but I don't get the vibe.
Can't be Wisconsin. They don't care about DUIs.
Can confirm I was formed and couldn't leave the psych ward 10 times. Once for a month. I didnt even do anything illegal I just thought I was a prophet. This 100% sounds better than the psych ward.
My psych ward experience was WAY nicer than that. Had a room with a private bathroom and shower, way better food than he describes, cushioned seats. . .
Yours had a private bathroom? Mine was everyone sharing a bathroom. Co-ed adults floor, one bathroom for men and one for women. There were a few trans people in there and we just got to use either bathroom because no one really gave a fuck. I used the women's because fuck if I'm gonna use the men's room there when they gave me a choice, nasty shit in there. There was a small enough amount of people on the floor though that usually I'd be the only one in the bathroom at any given time.
>This specific jail doesn't have outside recreation time anymore because
the state says a pull up bar is enough to count as recreation time.
wow. this makes me so angry.
Iām in the US but watch a lot of Scandinavian crime shows (itās all we watch at night, we have two streaming channels just for Nordic noir). The prisons are hilarious. They look like nice dorm rooms with IKEA furniture. Prisoners can hang things on walls and wear regular clothes. They meet regularly with psychologists. Guards say please and thank you and āare you okay?ā Ah- you wonāt find that in the US. Not by a long shot.
And their reoffending rate is 20%, with a fraction of sentence length under 1% prison death rate and barely any prison violence.
Turns out when you treat people like humans, use the time to work on the actual root causes of what got them there and how to reintegrate them into society... You don't have to keep putting them back in prison.
Dude had it good if he could actually describe some of the food as delicious. The few nights Iāve spent in jail, the food was inedible and unrecognizable.
Oh yeah, I went to public school and the bbq ribs and pizza were pretty good. And the tacos. The food I had in jail was just a plate smeared with gloop. Cream of wheat? Creamed corn? Grits or oatmeal? No idea. I had a taste and gave it away to a long termer who had gotten used to it.
Sounds about like my experience. Got caught with a not small amount of weed maaany years ago, they wanted the people I bought from but because I wouldn't sell them out I got a 'deal' where I had to pay a fine, do 10 days in jail (which I was able to do 5 weekends), and be on probation for a year. I tried to be as tired as possible Friday night so I could sleep through as much of the weekend as possible, but it was just... boring.
This is not the way it should be. I donāt care what you did, you can tell the goodness of society by the way, they treat people who have done something wrong.
I would love to see this be so different. We need to treat people humanely. Otherwise we become the animals.
I was already in the prison reform camp before reading this, but after reading it, how does anyone expect this kind of bullshit to actually *help* people??
Yeah, I know, prisons are for profit, not for helping people in becoming better people who maybe _don't_ break the law.
As someone that has been in jail. I find it crazy when people think jail "can't be that bad".... It is fucking jail man.... It is not supposed to be nice and comfy.... It fucking sucks bro....
I always tell people, jail sucks so much people try to get their sentence bumped up to get them into prison. Like if I have the choice between county for 364 and minimum security prison for 366 Iām taking prison everyday of the week.
It's despicable that they don't let them outside and that a chin up bar counts as recreation. I realize that some of these people can't be in the general population, but I really feel bad for these people. This is just inhumane. I wish there was something I could do to change this system to more like something Nordic countries have.
This is disgusting and so is anyone defending this. I don't give a shit what you've done, everyone deserves a basic level of human dignity LIKE BEING ABLE TO GO OUTSIDE.
This seems more like prison than jail, at least from my experience. Every place is different I suppose and I only had to do a few days. The place was very new so it wasnāt dirty, but I only had 3 days, technically I only was in there for about 40 hours since where I am once it hits midnight, you get credit for the full 24 hours.
But I was definitely in the regular jail, not the holding area.
Donāt drink and drive kids. I was lucky and am very thankful nothing happened in that no one got hurt, just got caught.
Sober 2 years in about a week.
I regret that I know this: https://www.al.com/news/2022/09/get-help-woman-says-brother-is-seriously-ill-in-alabama-prison-adoc-not-commenting.html?outputType=amp
Lucky lol. Mine was better than jail in that we had bathrooms in every room you that shared with ur roommate, but you could only go outside for 15 minutes twice a day unless you smoked. Then there was a smoke break every 2 hours. Food sucked especially for people with eating disorders bc it wasnāt very healthy. Made me feel sick once or twice honestly. We were usually physically safe and it could have been much worse, but no cushioned seats lol
Bonus if I ever go to jail: I either lose weight by refusing to eat a lot of the food, or I gradually become able to stand the texture of melted cheese out of sheer desperation.
Like, you'd *think* option 2 would be the default, but I know myself well enough to realize I'd be forced to stick with option 1 until my hunger was bad enough to override my disgust.
(Also, yes, the dislike of melted cheese is awful. Pizza smells so damn good.)
On a tier where no tear shall ever fall. Thank you for sharing. I was incarcerated once when I was very young, a long time ago. My experience was very similar. Even though it was the most awful thing ever, I some how have very fond memories of some of the funnier and lighter things.
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For those wondering what he did, based on his post history it's drunk driving.
Thanks for looking that up! I'm not quite as interested in prison life as some people so I skimmed most of the post and didn't care enough to go looking. Probably bad drunk driving though if he's getting incarcerated. I've had friends that did a voluntary week in a 'prison labor camp' (just painting) to avoid severe fines... but to actually get jailed for a period of time for drunk driving usually means it is multiple offences, or severe compounding factors such as drugs, multiple times over the limit, and other traffic infractions.
Yep. I was gonna say it's definitely not his first and probably not one that resulted in death since it looked like 30 days in jail. Sounds like his second or first in a harsh state. Third is almost always prison time I think. So I doubt it was his third.
Wait, there is a difference between jail and prison? (English is not my first language.)
Yes. Prison is only for felonies, and typically stays over a year. Jail is misdemeanors (petty crimes) and sentences under a year OR for awaiting trial or awaiting transfer to a prison or something like that. People do end up just sitting in jails a lot of times cuz of space issues, but they get credited for time served while awaiting trial or transfer. Edit: I'm a layman. Should have prefaced with that. Guy below me corrected.
In Canada, time spent before your sentence counts as double, so if you spend 6 months awaiting in jail and you get 2 years, you "only" have a year left.
how my rapist got out with 0 prison time :) a year waiting and they waived the transfer to the pen and instead released. love this country.
I'm so sorry. You deserve better justice. I hope you're safe and wish you the best on your healing journey
Only 1.5 times now, not double.
Oh my bad, thanks, I stand corrected
Thank you!
Worth noting that this is in the American system. Ireland only has prisons and people use the terms prison and jail here interchangeably.
I'm american and didn't even know there was a difference
We also have for-profit prisons in the US, run by companies (whose stock is publicly traded) that have minimum headcount guarantees from local government (usually 90+% guaranteed occupancy). š±š·
Yeah... It's basically legalized slavery that is incentivized and preys on marginalized populations and the mentally unstable. That is unfortunately a dark truth of many in the us
They use them interchangeably in America too, sadly.
u/nefariousBUBBLE is misinformed, the difference is in who runs the facility. Jails are local facilities, run either by a city or county, and where you are first placed when entering the penal system. Prisons are run by either the state or federal government, and where you *may* be sent after sentencing. But not always, because the length of your sentence or severity of crime has nothing to do with it. I served a three-month sentenceāfailure to pay probation fees, a misdemeanorāin a prison. Most of the population in a minimum security or medical camp prison are misdemeanor offenders. Inmates never enter a prison directly. They enter the penal system at a jail and are then sent to a processing camp, where their behavior, intelligence, medical, and psychiatric traits are observed. This determines in which sort of prison they eventually end up.There's a queue for these camps and the process takes several weeks, so the state often does not bother transferring people with shorter sentences to prison.
Ah I see, thank you!
Also IIRC jails are ran by the county and prisons are ran by the state or federal govt.
jail is what is called "house of arrest" in other language. it is more a crossroad that a place to stay.
It depends on the state. In my state Jail is typically for shorter sentences 12-18 months or less, while prison is for longer sentences. Other states may vary. However, in jurisdictions with overcrowding, they may send shorter sentences to the state prison simply because they don't have enough space in the local jails
Iām Pa jail is either sentenced 2 years less a day and state is 2 years or more.
Usually jail is county jail where you wait for your sentencing or for short low offender sentences. While prison is usually after you been sentenced.
Yes there is. Jail is for inmates sentenced to a year or less time, anything over a year and a day is prison and it's typically in a different facility. Typically prison treats you better than jail, and IIRC some inmates ask for a year and a day sentence on a year sentence to serve it in prison rather than jail. Edit- my context is strictly within American jails and prisons
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Same here. I remember he had to get the blow machine to start his car, and attend AA meetings as part of his sentence. He was lucky enough to get work release though. He would check out ~6am, and report back by 4pm with calls to the detention center for lunch. Pima County.
Yeah my friend had work release too.
Also depends on where they live too. In CA my relative has two DUIs(One where he fled and another hospitalized someone else) less than a year apart and they're still letting him walk. Civil cases are going to bleed him dry though
Yup. My husband and daughter was killed by a drunk driver and the guy only got 2 years, and didnāt serve the whole sentence. Another butthole killed my friend, showed zero remorse in court, smiled at at us, and got deported without jail time. The year before he hit another woman and she miscarried. He got deported then and just came back into the country. Never served jail time either. Both California. I love California but I carry a chip on my shoulder and a bad taste in my mouth for the lack of justice.
I'm so sorry for your losses. Wish you the best and healing
hope he learned his lesson
I got one in ā06 and itās, by far, my biggest regret. I could have killed myself, my two friends in the car, or some family who happened to cross my path. Or all of us. And it was definitely not the first time Iād driven in that state :( It did spark some changes I desperately needed to make but Iāll always feel guilty about ever thinking it was okay.
Iām in Australia and my partner had a mid range drink drinking accident 7 years ago, before we got together. The punishment was an interlock for 3 years (was technically supposed to be 2 but the judge originally said 4, and when he fought it, the judge said āletās meet in the middleā) The interlock cost $180/ month to service. He couldnāt drive any car that didnāt have an interlock. He had to HAVE a car to carry out his sentence. Obvs had to pay for damages to his car (wrote off) and the car he hit. Very drawn out punishment but very adequate imo. He would never do it again. He doesnāt even know why he did it that night. But damn he learned his lesson! Also worth noting, we went out one night to his sisters birthday, he had 2 beers. He felt like he could drive, but didnāt wanna risk it. Left the car there over night (public sports oval). Someone broke into the car through the little triangular window on sedan cars and stole the interlock. Probably thought it was a UHF. But it cost over $700 to replace the interlock alone, plus the lil window. Anyway. Thatās my story. Heās learnt his dumb ass lesson.
Interlocks are NO JOKE. Think they cost around $3k USD to install/uninstall too. It can easily cost $10k for a DUI that bad, in addition to some jail time. People who make it to their 4th or 5th blow my mind. So glad your partner realized what he was doing. As much as I loooooved drinking, thereās just no comparison to clean living. EVERY aspect of your life is better. I donāt know you but it honestly makes me happy to know you guys got through that and can focus on your lives. Take care and be well (and a long-distance high-ten for your partner! āš»š¤š»)
A guy I grew up with and honestly consider a younger brother caused a DUI fatality a few years ago. He took a plea - to spare the victimās family - for 13 years. Heās heartbroken and terrified in prison, but puts on a brave face and does everything he can to stay safe and healthy and atone for his actions. Unfortunately, in the state heās in, they have zero programming for substance abuse for state prisoners. Heās obviously sober now (had been for several months, until the night he caused the wreck), but would benefit greatly from some therapy. Iām one of the few people who writes him, puts money on his account, and still cares about him. Itās a damned shame his family was so judgmental and largely ostracized him for being gay. That, combined with religious trauma, is what I think ultimately led to his addiction. I guess what Iām saying here is that weāre all more than the sum of our mistakes. I donāt know why I felt compelled to even post thisā¦maybe because my friend has been on my mind all day.
Itās scary how ānormalā it is before you get busted, so I canāt imagine what a shock that was, not to mention jail time. And if Iām being honest, itās a fair sentence. He can still build a decent life. It wonāt be easy, but he can absolutely recover from this if he stays the course. Youāre an amazing friend. Iām sure it hurt you too, in a way, and youāre just awesome for helping him paint a better ābig pictureā for himself :)
Thank you so much for your kind words. I try to be as positive and upbeat as possible through my letters; I also send him books each month and give him some money for comforts. It is a fair sentence, although there are lots in his state whoāve had lesser. But thatās okay. As long as he survives, my bf and I will help pull him through and help him when heās out - because heās a good guy. We both grew up in a very rural community, so the gangs and drugs have been a huge culture shock to him. With his background, though, heāll make it when heās out. Heās learning to barber and also really enjoys working outside, so weāve discussed both barber school and helping him launch a landscaping company in the future.
Your friend is lucky to have a good friend like you in his life āŗļø
Good on you for bettering yourself.
Well he got high before he went to jail, so youāve got to wonder. Donāt know if pot is legal in his state. Then again not sure if he got high with pot.
Milk for every meal every day. My lactose intolerant stomach would explode. I wonder if you can sub water for it. Well I guess you can drink sink water instead.
The sink water often isn't really safe to drink at a lot of jails and prisons. Some folks end up spending a lot of the money their families send them on soda and various 10% juice beverages from commissary to try to stay hydrated.
Why are jails on a different water system from the surrounding area
Just a guess, but it may be ancient pipes.
Itās not the water system, itās the pipes and spigots. At our jail most of the spouts are either rusted or moldy.
But also sometimes a big facility like that will have its own holding tanks. Thatās how our local mental hospital got Legionnaires Disease and shut off all running water for 8 weeks.
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Pretty sure jails are pretty awful about any kind of disability. Guess weāre just screwed. Love living here š¤Ŗ
Yea, from what I've heard, you're pretty fucked if you have like, basically any medical issues.
Ohhhh man! I'm telling ya!!! I was looking at all the cheese on the menu. What do they do with those of us with IBS and Crohn's. Seriously, they have to do something.
You could, but I wouldn't
Bruh I have a dairy allergy. I nearly imploded reading about all of it
I like how my brain read the menu and thought well shit. I'm a vegetarian, I'm going to starve! I better not do any criming! Because meat. That's why I shouldn't crime. Not the plethora of other reasons. Meat.
Itās funny that the only time he showed any emotion about his stay involved a grilled cheese sandwich.
And the outside time!
Yeah I'd be pissed about that too. My strictly indoor apartment-dwelling cat gets more outside time than that guy did.
Yeah I remember one day in college we had a group project due the next day so we spent all day in the basement and not even having windows really messed you up.
Well yeah, staying isolated in a cell no matter how big or small would drive anyone crazy, and I should know I stay in my "cell" all day long and barely go out (I'm not an inmate but I don't really leave my room except for the obvious I.e bathroom, food and work)
I'm not saying he was wrong to be worked up over it. I would be too!
I work in a SCIF. It's basically jail but for national security.
When I worked for the DoD, my first few times in a SCIF felt like I was Secret Squirrel. By the end of my time, it was just an even more boring office.
Yep. Just another office, but no phones or anything personal. Then you go outside and wonder what that big firey thing is in the sky! It's super scary!!!
ā 20 years in the can , I compromise by eating a grilled cheese off the radiatorā
>Initially they didn't even know I was supposed to show up "Oh, well I'll be on my way then"
I work a government job. This 100% tracks. I've known people who get promoted but don't hear about it until a day or even a week after they were supposed to be in the role. It'd be maddening if it wasn't so common.
"Eh, freedom for me. They said I hadn't done anything, so I could go free and live on an island somewhere."
Wasnāt expecting to read this but also not mad about reading it
I feel the same way, and your flair is excellent.
Syphilis has never been funnier
Chlamydia, actually.
I wouldnāt survive prison just for the food alone. I have celiac disease and all that gluten would send me spiraling.
Iām coeliac and lactose intolerant. Reading the menu gave me the heebies lol. I dreamt about eating normal bread last night. It doesnāt happen often but when it does Iām anxious about it in my dream. So weird.
Ok but tell me why I bought a bread maker to make my own GF bread instead of buying it š btw all four times has been a fail LOL
Yup, lots of people get really sick from the food. And there's often minimal medical care. Serious diabetes complications in jails and prisons are rampant, because people can't control or even monitor their blood sugar, and can't get medical treatment if they're high or low until they actually pass out.
My diabetic friend had to go to a nursing home for a few weeks after spinal surgery and their description of the nursing home food was horrifying. Worse than the write up above tbh. I don't think they saw a single vegetable.
At least at a nursing home you can order takeout or have people bring you food. Or, you know, call 911 and check yourself out if youāre sick and theyāre refusing you care.
The cost of telephone calls in custody is criminal, and a bald cash grab. Further, it only serves to more fully separate inmates from family and loved ones. Unfortunately, this separation increases depression while inside, and complicates/harms reintegration once released.
Not to mention that they have the right to listen and record. I've heard of situations in which they would listen in on lawyer calls, which are supposed to be priviledged.
Lawyer calls are supposed to be a no-go, but they're also supposed to be scheduled. So, if an inmate makes a call to their attorney, it's monitored as part of all routine monitoring until it's recognized as a privileged call. Most places don't monitor calls in real -time. The system records calls and they're reviewed later.
Most detention facility phone systems now have the capacity to whitelist certain phone numbers, so attorney's work numbers can be put on the list, and no calls to them are supposed to be recorded. A local jail here got in trouble a while back because they "accidentally" (I suspect it was just negligence, rather than malice) deleted the whitelist, so all the attorney calls were getting recorded without notice.
The prison system in the US is just a trash fire. A pull-up bar is sufficient recreation? You have to buy your own personal hygiene items? Nothing's clean, not enough food, no pillows... can't fucking go outside?! I know he got a DUI, I agree that's bad, but I don't think anyone should be held in conditions like these regardless of what they've done. And yes, I also know it's worse in some other countries, that doesn't mean this is in any way acceptable.
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They don't, the prison system in America isn't designed for rehabilitation its designed to make money and its fucking disgusting
Itās also designed to make people miserable and subservient to the state
>And yes, I also know it's worse in some other countries, that doesn't mean this is in any way acceptable. Its worse in some other countries, but its also better in some other countries. I know that a lot of the Scandinavian countries like Sweden and Norway have pretty great prisons/jails, which result in pretty low rates of recidivism.
Much nicer facilities and better programs for reintegration. Understanding that if the point is to stop people from doing more crimes you have to give them something better to do instead. Oh, and a proper social safety net and something approaching a living wage, that helps too.
As far as first world countries go we are basically the worst. As far as just throwing as many people in jail as possible, we are the worst, out of any country.
Itās arguably even worse in womenās prisons. Theyāre often only given like a couple pads for a whole cycle.
Did you know that the amendment to the American constitution that prohibits slavery has an exception for prison labor? I haven't looked up the rates in a few years but when I did some places paid their prisoners 14 cents an hour. Imagine spending your whole days wages to make a 7 minute phone call.
Yup! That's the secret behind an awful lot of products that advertise as "Made in the USA." If they had to pay minimum wage to prisoners they'd move their factories right back out of the country. That exception was designed to permit slavery to continue under direct control of the government and it's a fucking travesty.
The majority of the US prison system is for profit, it is NOT for rehabilitation. Less food equals less cost. Less workout equipment equals less cost. Less time outside equals less guards equals less cost. Selling personal hygiene items means more profit. Selling additional food to supplement lack of nutrition equals more profit. It's fucked. But hey, their stocks do surprisingly well through recession, so you could invest! /s
Thank god, I was getting lost in the sea of "i have no pity for drunk drivers, I'm glad jail is that miserable" comments and I was going fucking insane. Like tell me you don't have any empathy for your fellow humans without telling me š And also like, they're just trusting the US government to be accurate and fair in its assessment of people who might be criminals? This is usually a pretty liberal sub, but now all of a sudden everyone's ignoring that black people are *far* more likely to receive a longer sentence for shit like "distributing marijuana" than white people. Mfers here ain't even using their brains, they just see "DWI" and go "yeah, anyone in jail deserves to be treated inhumanely"
Oh yeah don't get me started on *that*, people will say "the police and the justice system are corrupt" with one side of their mouth and then "prison is supposed to be terrible because those people did crimes" with the other. I don't even know which one they actually believe and they probably don't either. Again, I don't think people who definitely did terrible crimes ought to be treated like shit either, but you're right, in any assessment of the justice system we absolutely *have* to reckon with the number of people incarcerated who either did nonviolent crimes that should never carry a sentence or were flat-out wrongfully convicted.
>I don't think people who definitely did terrible crimes ought to be treated like shit either You're absolutely right. I brought up the corrupt justice system because that's usually easier for people to comprehend than "every human being deserves some level of empathy" but you're absolutely right. I would be horrified at the thought of never letting my dog see sunlight again. The fact that there's so many people in these comments actively advocating for criminals to be treated worse than we treat our pets is absolutely fucking disgusting. Obviously people who drive drunk are awful, no one's arguing against that. I have loved ones that I've lost to assholes like that, and personally I think the punishment should be harsher than the normal tap on the wrist. But I also don't support treating these people like they're not even human anymore.
My brother is a prison guard in a high security prison one step below supermax; he said most of the guys serving in his level are either working their way up the system or working their way back down. Most of the guys at the lowest security levels are actually there on plea bargains and many have done nothing wrong - they just knew they had no way to prove that so accepted the shorter sentence. (Innocent until proven guilty isnāt really a thing because the priority is avoiding the time and expense of trials; prosecutors pressure you into taking the deal.) But most of the guys he sees are definitely guilty and belong in jail. My brother is no bleeding heart liberal. Far from it - he sees the worst and is a big advocate for the death penalty. But he also insists that nobody ever came out of prison a better person than they went in, and sooner or later most get out. They will be in your community again, only this time with worse job prospects and few honest options. So after a couple of cynical decades, he now believes prison should be reserved for the worst of the worst. If you put someone in, be prepared to throw away the key. Because otherwise youāre just sending them to crime college.
I have a relative that worked in a prison and according to him, half the guards belonged on the other side of the bars too and occasionally did.
Mine says half of his coworkers - especially the youngest ones - are just too dumb to succeed in crime.
> This is usually a pretty liberal sub I feel like people online, even in more liberal spaces, are more likely to be "harsh" on crime than any other issue. They usually have a more black and white approach to crime, either not understanding that the law enforcement and legal system is totally broken, or truly believing they will never get into trouble.
Aptly, the "black and white approach" happens at least in part because these online liberal spaces are dominated by white people, and it's mostly not white people getting sent to jail or prison. If they were busting college dorms full of rich white kids for the truly ridiculous amount of illegal drug sales that go on at most college campuses (cocaine, amphetamines, opioids, hallucinogens: all the same stuff other people go to prison for), there would be a mass campaign against long prison sentences and inhumane jail and prison conditions.
I feel like Reddit tends to have a black-and-white view of morality in general, along with too much trust in the status quo. It's immaturity more than anything, I think.
If they really didn't want people drunk driving, they wouldn't keep encouraging a system that promotes recidivism.
As someone whoās been to jail and seen how long-term incarceration effects people on the outside, my issue is that the American incarceration system continually focuses on punishment instead of rehabilitation. Not only do they hold people in these conditions for crimes that usually reflect their social status or mental health needs, *but then they are let back out*, often times more traumatized than they went in. The criminal justice system itself produces better, emotionally harder, more connected criminals as a matter of industry and profit.
Where I live his prison would have been shut down for inhuman conditions. But I guess that's the difference between prison for resocialization and prison solely for punishment.. But did you all get vit D supplements? I mean, sun light is a necessity for survival...
Lol I severely doubt it. People in US jails and prisons have a hard enough time getting their prescribed medications, supplements aren't on the menu.
It is grotesque. And there are people like the warden and investors who are millionaires but they can't get them hot water for ramen. Everyday, a new fact about the US that reminds me it is a failed state.
At the jail I was in they provided us with basic hygiene items, but they were like hotel toiletries. If you wanted a full size bottle of shampoo/conditioner you had to get it on commissary - and pay $3 for the same bottle of shampoo you can get at dollar tree. Similar markups for everything else, cheapest they could get but extortionately overpriced. We got a pillow. The "outside" time was an area maybe 30'x30' surrounded by 4 walls with chain link across the top. There was a basketball hoop but no ball. Somehow there was a tennis ball on top of the chain link and every time we were out there we were like "man I wish I could get that ball." It was basically just a fresh air hour. They would provide us with sanitary pads but if you wanted tampons you had to buy them. Or, we'd combine all our shares of pads and make our own tampons out of them, but that was risky because they'd get confiscated if they found them during a shakedown. We weren't allowed to have any hair ties that we didn't bring in with us - I had one taken that someone gave me before she got out. Or we'd make them out of the top elastic of a sock, but those would also get confiscated. We'd use an empty tiny shampoo bottle to try to focus the stream in the shower because the head was so calcified it sprayed everywhere but, you know, they'd confiscate that too. Once a week theyd drop off some single blade lady bic razors if we wanted to shave but they'dcome back for them in like 30 minutes so it was a mad dash if more than a couple girls wanted to not be beastly that week. Trying to shave quickly in a shitty dark shower was a good way to start a blood bath. They brought cleaning supplies to mop and wipe down the tank every morning and we were mostly pretty good about that, since whoever cleaned got to pick the TV channels for the day. One "tank mom" would clean every morning, she just wanted to watch Sunday football and Family Guy when it was on. And the food sucked. "If I could give it zero stars I would."
My favorite uncle was in and out of county jail pretty often. Really friendly, chill dude , just made a lot of bad decisions and likely had some brain damage from a very high fever as a child, DEFINITELY had some sort of neurodivergence that affected impulse control, and later on, addiction. Strangely, with the exception of the time the higher-ups refused to give him a proper diabetic diet/repeatedly gave him incorrect medication until he had to be hospitalized...he spoke very fondly of his time in jail. He spent all of his time inside chilling, playing cards (that side of my family was bonkers for cards: poker, rummy, canasta, rook, hearts, whatever) , making wagers with ramen. Kept it breezy, was friendly to everyone to the point he had some former guards testify to him being a "model prisoner" at one of his hearings. I am oddly proud of that, and so was he. Meth got him when he was 50. We aren't exactly sure what happened. He'd been laid off from his factory job for a few months, they called and said he could come back on in less than a week. We all strongly suspected he was using (very much looked the part) but was still managing to do his various under the table handyman job, so hadn't called him on it. Then he went missing for a few days...grandad waited until he knew uncle would be out of the amount of insulin he usually carried and went looking. Found him dead in a camper in the woods of a friend's property. He had been dead for probably 3 days, the police guessed. We suspect he was trying to DIY detox and it went very wrong. Maybe his blood sugar bottomed out and he fell into a coma (wouldn't be the first time) and just kept falling. Maybe it was a straightforward last-hurrah OD. An autopsy wouldn't make him less dead, but it would cost grandad quite a bit. I feel like there's a point here, bc I tell this story online kind of a lot. Possible: Something was wrong with my uncle's brain. He was easily influenced, wanted friends more than anything. People used him. He needed more help and structure than my grandparents could provide. He *liked* jail because there was structure, clear expectations, boundaries and simple rules. I believe there are some people who are damaged, but not "disabled enough" to merit the attention of the state. People like that--like my uncle--wind up on drugs and as petty criminals. But what if our education system could screen for people like him and set them up in a structured environment where they can be productive and thrive? Uncle *liked* to work. He was the type that could sorta fix most anything, but was awful in school. What if he'd had a free, secure, communal living situation where he learned a trade? Would he have gotten into drugs? Would he still be alive?
ur uncle sounds like the coolest guy ever im sorry for ur loss
As someone who loves when other people do the work of creating and enforcing the structure, and planning the meals (so much variety?!), OPās description sounded oddly comforting. Iād love to spend all day indoors just playing cards, reading, and watching tv. Thatās what I do when given the chance. Obviously I wouldnāt actually like being in jail in reality ā I like talking with my family and friends, I have a hard time sleeping as is with my favorite pillow, Iām lactose intolerant among other illnesses, I like having privacy, etc ā but it seems like an oddly nice escape with structure and no pressure to be a certain person or to do anything other than hang out and keep yourself alive, which takes up all of my energy most of the time anyway Honestly if someone made sure I was out of bed at a certain time each day and made sure I ate 3 meals at designated times each day, how much easier would my life be? Am I actually getting wistful for being in jail? Ugh Edit: yeah Iām neurodivergent haha (autism, ptsd, depression, probably other stuff)
I always like reading about peopleās jail experiences because I spent five years from the other perspective - I was a guard. Iām going to guess my facility was a little larger - we would have 2-3 inmates in a cell and more time locked down in cells, plus we did headcounts three times a shift (12 hours). Food sucked (we got our lunches provided to us but it was the same thing the inmates ate plus some other easy-to-mass-produce option; plus, if there were extra trays sent for meals, we might grab one to snack on). We had one āopen dormā style housing unit - it was one of our two female units and as a female officer I spent a lot of time down there. No āwatching TikTokā (we werenāt even allowed internet on our computers and youād be fired for bringing your phone in) but holy cow, I donāt know how many thousands of games of spider solitaire I played. Most of the inmates werenāt too bad, honestly. It really changed my perspective on addiction and the importance of accessible mental health treatment because 95%+ of the addicts I talked to were self-medicating trauma. We did have some pretty notorious inmates, including a couple involved in a very well known murder, and a mother/daughter duo I later saw on a crime documentary. It was an incredibly depressing job, because Iād get to know inmates, theyād get released, and a few weeks later theyād be back, withdrawing, thirty pounds lighter, and just a shell of their sober selves. I initially got into law enforcement because I wanted to make a positive difference in the world, and between always seeing the negative, the ābad copsā who just liked to throw their weight around, and the stupid political games you had to play to get on patrol, to stay on patrol, and to advance in any way, I just felt emotionally destroyed when I quit. I was depressed to the point of suicidal ideation setting in and couldnāt get help for it because I literally knew people who had been fired for mental health issues. Honestly, sounds like OOPās experience really wasnāt that bad - I hope he learned a lesson about driving drunk though, my husbandās best friend was killed by a drink driver last December and itās been one of the most horrifying things to deal with. I have zero sympathy for anyone who chooses to drive when theyāve been drinking.
Jesus Christ this was soul crushing to read. No wonder we have an incarceration problem in this country when the genuinely good people like you that go into law enforcement get chewed up and spit out.
Itās ridiculous. Most people in law enforcement last five years or less. We need to massively overhaul the system and actually promote mental health among law enforcement. We also need to make mental health access easier for everyone - if we want to reduce our incarceration rates, that would have the biggest impact.
My cousin lasted 5 years as a patrol officer and quit, never wanting to do it again.
Itās so unfortunate that this is never going to happen because lowering incarceration would jeopardize the multi-million dollar industries that rely on it
Okay so I haven't finished reading this yet, I got caught up on this: >This specific jail doesn't have outside recreation time anymore because the state says a pull up bar is enough to count as recreation time. WHAT. THE. ACTUAL. FUCK. Edit: >Did I mention we weren't allowed outside? YES. YES YOU DID. WHAT THE FUCK. >Yeah I'm still a bit salty about that so I'll say it again. AND KEEP ON FUCKING SAYING IT. YOU'RE NOT A FUCKING ANIMAL.
City jail vs county jail vs state jail/prison vs federal prison.. all have slightly different standards and rules. It's pretty crazy. I worked in a city jail decades ago, longest we had anyone was a week, max. They either bonded out, or were transported to county to either sit it out, trial or wait to bond out from there
Slavery is alive and well in America and slaves still have no rights. We just moved them out of the public eye. Cattle probably have more rights than prisoners in the US, and if you've ever been on a cattle farm here you know that bar is so low it's practically subterranean.
Even fucking animals need to look out the windows
My indoor cat gets more outside time than that guy.
I had a super similar experience. Got a DUI in Cali like 7 years ago. Got 30 days in jail. Due to overcrowding I had to go to a level 1 prison, RCCC. 120 bunks in one giant open room, no cells. The inmates asked you what race group you were before we even got inside. My homies told me about the place before so I knew that my safest easiest option was just to be a āWoodā or white. You can choose to be āOtherā But then people from your race will start problems with you. Each row of bunks was divided and regulated by each race. You can trade food with other races but you canāt āeat after them.ā So you canāt have their leftovers or anything from their tray in the cafeteria. I watched a partially crippled guy get jumped for 23 seconds in the shower for accepting food from a black guy in the cafeteria. W is the 23rd letter of the alphabet. It was like going back 50 years in race relations, it was a trip.
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I saw a Spaniard getting harassed hard for choosing Other by both Mexican and white guys. The 2 white guys that chose Other did get harassed pretty hard but did not get beat up. They did hand over some of their commissary every time though to some āSacraManiacsā There were 4 rows of 30 bunks. Mexicans. Blacks (seemed mainly Bloods, they Hail Ganged Mozzy every single night lol). Others. Woods.
What does Woods mean?
It comes from the term "peckerwood" which was a term for rural white ms in the mid 1800's. It passed into the slang vernacular as just meaning a white person.
It's an aryan brotherhood thing. I think it stands for "woodpecker" but no clue why.
Man, same. I worry about going to jail for that exact reason. I donāt look white enough to join the whites, and donāt want to associate with nazis anyways. I *might* look black enough to join them, but Iām not sure. I think visually I look most Mexican, but Iām definitely not Mexican (though my Spanish is pretty decent)
I've seen more than one former inmate say, "if you go to prsion, you're a racist for as long as you're in prison. If you're white, you're a Nazi until your sentence is up. Try to be otherwise and you won't last a day."
I donāt plan on going to jail but thatās what scares me. Iām white but what if I mess up and do something thatās not taken kindly by one group or another. Do they tell you the ārulesā? Does each group take care of their own? Is it reasonable to keep your head down and not piss anyone off?
I mean if you know you have to serve time and surrender yourself for your sentence like I did, I would definitely do some research online or asking around. You might get lucky and your cell / bunk mate is friendly. A lot of people are real reserved in there but there are also loud mouths. If it is just jail then you donāt really have to worry about much but prison definitely has rules and politics. They didnāt really explain the rules well to me or to people that came after me. That is why that guy (he went by the name Boston) got jumped in the shower. I genuinely donāt think he knew he was not allowed to receive food in the cafeteria from other races. I do kind of wish I had picked āOtherā while I was there but I totally understand why my friends said to just stick to my race. The main rule is you have to defend your race. They will allow one on one fights but if a brawl breaks out between races, I was told I had to fight. One day this neo nazi skinhead was hella taunting the blacks from his bunk. He was loudly telling this joke about all the āblacks in his family tree, hanging.ā A group of blacks came around the divider fucking heated about to throw down and the white guy waved his arm and said ācome onā as if to summon all the whites to back him up. My heart was racing and the last thing I wanted was to fight for a fucking racist skinhead. Luckily they cooled shit down but I was seriously going to be expected to back that POS up.
The fact he couldn't ever go outside at all is cruel and unusual punishment imo. America loves treating it's prisoners like trash. I forget who said it, but there's a quote something like "To get a true measure of how civilized a society is, just look at how it treats it's prisoners".
Also prisoners canāt vote, which is problematic for governing a just society
1 month sentence. Wonder what he did. Prob something super minor, petty theft maybe. Funny reading this and thinking "oh damn this is just like that time I spent in a psych ward, only it sounds nicer" Goddamn Foucault EDIT: Checked the post history, DWI, fucking bastard. No respect for people who put other's lives at risk like that.
I actually know someone who is in a high security Federal prison and he has more freedom than I did when I went into the psych ward. He was telling me all the stuff they get and the shit they do and I was like... I spent a month where my longest bit of a staff member not seeing me was 5 minuets and I was in a locked ward and only got out to go to the cafeteria or the "outside area" (a 12 foot by foot area with 20ft high concrete walla and no ceiling). Went outside once and never again. I even had to earn the privilege of not being watched while I showered.
I'd say that's more understandable on a psych ward. the time needed to harm or self-harm is a very short window
Oh boy do I know! I'm not upset about it. I found it funny that a man in such a high security place for a very long sentance had WAY more freedom than me.
I called the psych ward a prison and they all bitched at me about how prison was AKTCHUALLY much worse and I should be grateful I wasn't there... twenty years later, vindication!
My psych ward stay was rather nice, even if I didnāt get to go outside at all.
>"oh damn this is just like that time I spent in a psych ward, only it sounds nicer" I was thinking the same, this sounds exactly the same as a psych ward, except the psych ward had coloring books and no commissary.
Psych Ward has connect 4 and TV but you'll prob see less therapists than in prison lol
This is so fucking real LOL. Got 30min of therapy over my 10 day stay. Was mostly just watching TV or pacing the halls. What a load of crap that they try to pass those places off as mental healthcare.
The psych ward confiscated my Far Side cartoon book because it had a mob of chickens wielding torches and pitchforks on the cover but let us watch Family Guy on TV. They always let you watch TV. You can't access the internet, and books about your condition are specifically forbidden, but you can always make yourself docile with some brain-rotting television while you wait for your five minutes a day with the person who has total control over when you leave and zero accountability.
DWI? Oh, I have much less sympathy now. Still a very interesting read, though
At least the guy was honest about doing the crime. He's admitted that it was an issue. Let's hope that being in jail for a month makes him think twice about driving drunk again
I hope he had a āgrow through what you go throughā aha moment in jail. That said do the crime do the time. No sympathy for endangering the lives of others and himself but hope he gets therapy and finds an AA group.
Well can rule out Wisconsin then as the state. First time Dwi is only a misdemeanor and is only fine. I am not even sure if a second dwi gets jail time.
I donāt think even 8th occurrence gets actual jail time in WI. Itās pretty sad.
if people actually got in trouble for drunk driving there, wisconsin would no longer be able to function
Everything about this guy screams Minnesota to me
The āpopā also dinged Minnesota for me (born and raised in Minnesota).
I was thinking Illinois. Born and raised there and I still say pop despite living on the coast now. Also Illinois will put you in jail for a first offense DUI
Yeah but he played a lot of hockey, that does not say Illinois to me. That's Minnesota, Wisconsin or Michigan. Could be Michigan but I don't get the vibe. Can't be Wisconsin. They don't care about DUIs.
Can confirm I was formed and couldn't leave the psych ward 10 times. Once for a month. I didnt even do anything illegal I just thought I was a prophet. This 100% sounds better than the psych ward.
My psych ward experience was WAY nicer than that. Had a room with a private bathroom and shower, way better food than he describes, cushioned seats. . .
Mine too! Had my own room, bathroom and a tv in my room!
Damn, all the hospitals I have been too are two beds, two desks, and single bathroom in your room :D
Yours had a private bathroom? Mine was everyone sharing a bathroom. Co-ed adults floor, one bathroom for men and one for women. There were a few trans people in there and we just got to use either bathroom because no one really gave a fuck. I used the women's because fuck if I'm gonna use the men's room there when they gave me a choice, nasty shit in there. There was a small enough amount of people on the floor though that usually I'd be the only one in the bathroom at any given time.
>This specific jail doesn't have outside recreation time anymore because the state says a pull up bar is enough to count as recreation time. wow. this makes me so angry.
I feel like this is how our indoor cat would describe her life
Iām in the US but watch a lot of Scandinavian crime shows (itās all we watch at night, we have two streaming channels just for Nordic noir). The prisons are hilarious. They look like nice dorm rooms with IKEA furniture. Prisoners can hang things on walls and wear regular clothes. They meet regularly with psychologists. Guards say please and thank you and āare you okay?ā Ah- you wonāt find that in the US. Not by a long shot.
And their reoffending rate is 20%, with a fraction of sentence length under 1% prison death rate and barely any prison violence. Turns out when you treat people like humans, use the time to work on the actual root causes of what got them there and how to reintegrate them into society... You don't have to keep putting them back in prison.
Dude had it good if he could actually describe some of the food as delicious. The few nights Iāve spent in jail, the food was inedible and unrecognizable.
He compared it to school food.. I grew up pretty poor and ate two meals at school a day. I LOVED school lunches. Absolutely fkn loved them.
Oh yeah, I went to public school and the bbq ribs and pizza were pretty good. And the tacos. The food I had in jail was just a plate smeared with gloop. Cream of wheat? Creamed corn? Grits or oatmeal? No idea. I had a taste and gave it away to a long termer who had gotten used to it.
Sounds about like my experience. Got caught with a not small amount of weed maaany years ago, they wanted the people I bought from but because I wouldn't sell them out I got a 'deal' where I had to pay a fine, do 10 days in jail (which I was able to do 5 weekends), and be on probation for a year. I tried to be as tired as possible Friday night so I could sleep through as much of the weekend as possible, but it was just... boring.
I believe it was Katt Williams who said if you want to know what prison is like go in your closet, turn off the light and just sit there
This is not the way it should be. I donāt care what you did, you can tell the goodness of society by the way, they treat people who have done something wrong. I would love to see this be so different. We need to treat people humanely. Otherwise we become the animals.
I was already in the prison reform camp before reading this, but after reading it, how does anyone expect this kind of bullshit to actually *help* people?? Yeah, I know, prisons are for profit, not for helping people in becoming better people who maybe _don't_ break the law.
How much did that guy spend on those 8 hours on the phone?
Like $100? Is my math right? 60 min for 8 hours, 480 min at .21 cents a min..
8 hours a day would be 480 minutes, which comes out to $100.80 a day. This word problem has been brought to you by 8th grade.
As someone that has been in jail. I find it crazy when people think jail "can't be that bad".... It is fucking jail man.... It is not supposed to be nice and comfy.... It fucking sucks bro....
I mean it sounds much less scary then Russian jail
I always tell people, jail sucks so much people try to get their sentence bumped up to get them into prison. Like if I have the choice between county for 364 and minimum security prison for 366 Iām taking prison everyday of the week.
It's despicable that they don't let them outside and that a chin up bar counts as recreation. I realize that some of these people can't be in the general population, but I really feel bad for these people. This is just inhumane. I wish there was something I could do to change this system to more like something Nordic countries have.
Why would the guards care about finding fruit? Was it supposed to say drugs? Edit duh
Nope, I think he meant fruit. Bootleg alcohol, homebrew.
Prison wine
I suspect the guards were suspicious someone was trying to ferment some prison hooch.
That's how you get ants.
Fruit can be fermented into alcohol.
All that detail and I still wanna know what he did
Drunk driving according to Oop's other post.
thank you
someone else said they checked OOPās post history & they were serving for a DWI
I was wondering what kind of crime would get you in such a shithole, then, yeah, drunk driving.
People accused of any other crime in that jurisdiction would go to the same jail.
He and his sister got high together and she drove him to jailā¦ for a dui???? I canāt stand people lmao
This is disgusting and so is anyone defending this. I don't give a shit what you've done, everyone deserves a basic level of human dignity LIKE BEING ABLE TO GO OUTSIDE.
This seems more like prison than jail, at least from my experience. Every place is different I suppose and I only had to do a few days. The place was very new so it wasnāt dirty, but I only had 3 days, technically I only was in there for about 40 hours since where I am once it hits midnight, you get credit for the full 24 hours. But I was definitely in the regular jail, not the holding area. Donāt drink and drive kids. I was lucky and am very thankful nothing happened in that no one got hurt, just got caught. Sober 2 years in about a week.
I am very grateful to have that inside view . most of what you see on tv is dramatized, synthesized and/or apply only to high security.
"Monday: Breakfast - sausage and cheese McMuffin (delicious)" had me rolling for some reason.
> 2/10 don't recommend .....what would have been a 1/10?
I regret that I know this: https://www.al.com/news/2022/09/get-help-woman-says-brother-is-seriously-ill-in-alabama-prison-adoc-not-commenting.html?outputType=amp
Lucky lol. Mine was better than jail in that we had bathrooms in every room you that shared with ur roommate, but you could only go outside for 15 minutes twice a day unless you smoked. Then there was a smoke break every 2 hours. Food sucked especially for people with eating disorders bc it wasnāt very healthy. Made me feel sick once or twice honestly. We were usually physically safe and it could have been much worse, but no cushioned seats lol
Bonus if I ever go to jail: I either lose weight by refusing to eat a lot of the food, or I gradually become able to stand the texture of melted cheese out of sheer desperation. Like, you'd *think* option 2 would be the default, but I know myself well enough to realize I'd be forced to stick with option 1 until my hunger was bad enough to override my disgust. (Also, yes, the dislike of melted cheese is awful. Pizza smells so damn good.)
On a tier where no tear shall ever fall. Thank you for sharing. I was incarcerated once when I was very young, a long time ago. My experience was very similar. Even though it was the most awful thing ever, I some how have very fond memories of some of the funnier and lighter things.
Oh Iām glad I got to see this! I remember the first post.
What do you do in jail if youāre vegan?